Carsales’ CEO Cameron McIntyre on how to remember names and influence people

It's a Sunday morning and you're going for a walk down the street and you run into your neighbor. They've only recently moved into the area, but straight away they remember your name, and you're quite taken aback, and you know, really quite impressed. Then all of a sudden, you have a connection based off the simple fact that they made

When you meet someone for the first time. The easiest way for you to make a great impression on someone is to remember their name. And it's such an easy thing to do theoretically, but for many of us it's not that easy. But I guess what I've enjoyed about the pandemic that we've endured is, at least on a zoom call, you've got someone's name published at the bottom of the bottom of the box.

That's been super easy to remember people's names.

But I guess in a normal environment, I think there's probably I reckon I'd probably have about half a dozen

I'll start making a list of all of my neighbors' names, and I'll have a list of neighbors names so that by the next time I see them, I've got a pretty good chance of remembering their name. And I think, if all else fails and someone tapped you on the shoulder, going down the street and addressed you by your name

I like what you said about meetings in terms of putting the business cards in front of you in the order that people are seated around the table. And I want to know what's your philosophy of running a good meeting, because I imagine a lot of your week would be spent in meetings.

Yeah, I think a short meeting is a really good meeting. I don't have them, but I wish I did. It was just stand up, so literally stand up and not sit down, because I tend.

To be faster that way. I think.

The other thing, and I'm not saying I do this, but i'd like to is in a meeting, at the start of the meeting, set out what the expectation is for the meeting. In the first ten to fifteen seconds, well, this is what we want to get out of this meeting. And then at the conclusion of the meeting, actually talk about what you got out of the meeting.

I think that's really important.

And sometimes we'll have meetings here and you'll have to repeat what you got out of the meeting three or four times before it really sinks in. I like to do that just to make sure we all walk away or on the same page. I think the other thing I don't like slides. I think slides don't encourage conversation. It just means there's someone presenting. I think the few of the slides the better because it's more conversational. And if it's more conversational, it's more engaging and you're more

But it can be a challenge.

That's interesting because when I was doing my research for this interview. I spoke to someone that works with you, and she was really impressed that. She said she's never been in a meeting with you where she thought you were distracted, and you just mentioned then turning your phone over, closing your laptop. Is it as simple as that or is there more that you're doing to really be present in meetings?

There isn't any more than that.

I think I'm trying to be respectful to others, but I'm wanting to get something out of it as well. So time is precious for all of us. And if you've made time to meet with someone, a lease that you can do is stay on points, stay focused, and try and get something out of that conversation, which is going to be value. Are creative, not just for you but for them as well, because otherwise all these meetings get super expensive.

Right absolutely, How do you, I guess, place value on your time in terms of accepting meetings to attend? Are there almost like limits or barriers that you would put in the way to protect your time but also be available to customers and shareholders and staff.

That's an evolution, not a revolution, because you want to give your time to everyone but I think the thing that I appreci is just having a little bit of thinking time as well during the course of the day and just resetting from one meeting to the next. One of the frustrations I have is, you know, if I've got a, say, a meeting with our business partners in Korea, and they've taken the time to prepare material for that, it's making sure that you've got the time to invest in that pre read.

And if you're back to back to back, it's super.

Hard, and to try and read and be present in a meeting at the same time is really hard.

So I think what I'm.

Trying to do a little bit more of now is create a little bit of space between meetings. I'm trying to look at my diary now to one to two days ahead of time and just figure out where my pre work is and just making sure I'm set up in a good place when those meetings come around that I've done the work.

And that takes quite a bit of effort.

So in terms of building in time for pre reading and feeling like you're going into the meetings, is that something that happens because you just say to your assistant, just make sure that this is booked in, or what are the strategies that you're doing to make sure that you do have enough thinking time and reading time in amongst all these meetings.

My EA will create that space, otherwise I'll do it.

So I'll build in some time just to get on top of things and just block it out in my diary, I think. And again I'm not good at this, so don't use me as the example. But this is a state of where I want to be as opposed to where I am. But potentially using time off site where there is peace and quiet to actually get ahead on things like pre work and so on are pretty useful

And I guess on that, like in terms of working from home versus working from the office, I'm assuming that you are currently hybrid in your approach. Is that correct?

What we've done is we've evolved into a hybrid type model. So we're saying to the business we'd like everyone to be together on a Tuesday, Wednesday, and a Thursday every week, and then on a Monday and a Friday. You're happy to be flexible for people work remotely and based on their requirements.

So we have moved to a hybrid model and we're one week.

In and literally I just got off a conference call to the whole company and we're talking about the fact that it's worked well.

I think that's probably going to be here to stay.

How do you think about it in your own working life in terms of days where you're working from home versus the office, do you almost have a different mindset or a different focus depending on where you're working.

From I'm probably not the best example of someone who works well at home and comes into work and can manage across both. I like to be at work because work is work and home is home for me, so mentally I like that separation of environment.

But clearly I can do both if I'm working at home.

The way I try to operate is I'll try and keep my day is consistent with an in office day, is what it would normally be. So it'll be an early start, let's work all the way through to lunchtime. I'll take a quick break for lunch, and then I'll get straight back into it, and I'll try and finish on a time frame that's sort of normal to what i'd finish if I was inside the office. I try and keep some consistency, but it's just the setting is

Okay, how do you use the commute time? Because I imagine that that must be quite novel after working from home for so long and now being enjoying being back in the office, What does that commute time look like for you.

I don't spend a lot of time in commute because I'm not alive way away from the office. But I guess the thing I like about commute time and we all have spaces or places where we get to do some strategic or sort of creative, big picture type thinking. And for me, one of those places is the shower, and I think that's probably a.

Lot of people would feel the same way.

Or if I'm not it's not that space, I'm doing some exercise. Or if it's not that space, it's when I'm actually driving to work and driving home, I'm often listening to podcasts like yours. I'm reading a book while I'm coming into the office, but I'm not physically reading it. It's obviously an audio.

Book good to hear, but.

Yeah, I use that space and that time to think more laterally or to think more creatively and think about what the day has ahead of it.

So it's productive time for me, not downtime with podcasts.

What are your go to podcasts?

Well? Yours?

Now that is the correct answer.

Yeah, yeah, and doesn't matter about any others.

I mean not really, No, are there other podcasts?

It's only yours?

What else are you taking inspiration from?

I still like Ted Talks and I'll even listen to the same Ted Talk a couple of times, so for me, that's a go to podcast.

I've heard that you are a big reader, though, and I want to know what books, business books or leadership books have had the biggest impact on you and how you lead.

That's a really good question. So for me, one of the more recent books that I've read that I've really really liked, and it was written by a guy who was a coach, right, I mean this guy he was the coach that helped Sergey Brin develop Google. He was a Silicon Valley coach and his name was Bill Handball and a trillion dollar coach was the name of the book.

And what was Bill's last name? You put me on the spot.

But anyway, this I'll describe what this book was about, and hopefully the author's name will come to me in a second.

But the book was actually about a colony of penguins.

It's not called Iceberg is melting?

It is? It is?

Okay, great, I've just been doing.

I've been in front of a computer screen.

That's right. I don't normally get on and search for books, but I was like, gosh, I have to know, but that's all right because we'll link to that in the show.

Note And who wrote it?

Not a Bill Holger Wrath Gebber and John Cotter, who has a change of management legend.

There you go, Yeah it was.

It wasn't Bill. You're right, it was John Cotter. And John Cotter is an amazing guy. I mean, this is totally off topic, but John Cotter. I had the honor of actually meeting John Cotter. This is a while ago, and this is a really good piece of advice for your listeners. And so said to John Cotter, John, if you look back on your career, and John's an old guy, he's been around, fantastic operator. What's one piece of advice that you would give any of us that have listened

And he's so right.

I mean, life is not a dress rehearsal, right, I mean our careers start and finish, and where in our jobs and our careers for a limited time, make sure it counts. Make sure you do something cool. It's not a dress rehearsal. And for me, that was super valuable advice. That's actually helped me in my career evive over time, so that book was super important to me.

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Look.

I think, in terms of career advice, my experience is you've got to be passionate about what you do. You've got to know you spend so much time doing what you do, you've really got to enjoy it, and you've got to be passionate about it. So whether it's passionate about about the tasks or the technical career that you have, whether it's passionate about the business that you're in or the people that you work with, you've got to have passion.

You've got to really enjoy it. That's the first and the most important thing for me.

You've got to be able to grow. You've got to put yourself into a position where you can grow and evolve. And I've always tried to surround myself with people that could either be mentors or sponsors of me, so people that would help me evolve. But I've also tried to have around me people I've enjoyed working with, people that are better than me, people that are smarter than me. I've always tried to surround myself with people like that. I guess other advice would be, yes, stay away from

It's like footy.

Don't don't play the man, play the ball and always play the ball, would be my advice. And to get that promotion, you've really got to commit yourself and work hard. And I think there's no substitute for that. There's intelligence, but everyone has intelligence, and intelligence the ticket to the ball game it's hard work, and EQ I think that separate people from getting jobs to being successful in jobs, and that it probably might die tribe of advice that I've had over the years.

Something I wonder as the CEO of a publicly listed company, And I think Carsale's market cap is about three billion dollars? Is that about right?

No, it's probably and I don't, to be honest, I don't look at it every day, but I think it's probably about four and a half maybe or four and a half.

All right, So three billion, give or take a billion, let's say a bit. I want to know, like, how does the share price affect you day to day? How many times a day are you checking this? If indeed you are looking at it daily?

So your question that the way you framed that, that was a trick question to see if I actually actually knew what my market cap was right at this moment.

That's right. It's like, oh, I was hoping to get you out there, checked it in a month or something?

Yeah, Now, look, I or we don't spend a lot of time looking at the share price, and you can't.

I mean, if you run your business based on what the share price.

Is doing, you're going to get yourself in all sorts of knots.

So you know what I do is I focus.

On where am I adding value? Where's the business adding value? How do we build profitability? How do we build a sustainable business model and grow that business over time? And if that's where we're thinking, then the share price should take care of itself. So focus on running the business, focus on doing a great job of it, and the share price should hopefully follow that.

And I guess that works well. I think in both theory and practice.

Sometimes though, you can get disconnections between thinking and reality, and that's happened on the old occasion. So you know, share price might disconnect with where you might think value is, and the companies will, from time to time look at correcting that. And if I think of one example of that, back in twenty eleven, we did think our share price was undervalued, and so we invested in our own script

Really, but how do you personally disconnect from that? Almost because it sounds like that's what you're psychologically trying to do. But I mean, it's publicly listed company, it's in your face, and it's moving every day. Like, how do you actually practically disconnect from that?

The practicality is you just have to And yeah, you'll get asked on the occasion you're walking down the street and you'll see a friend and like a GESUS share price is doing really well at the moment, or maybe you share price is not and GESU share price not doing really well at the moment, and you know there'll be reasons behind that, but you can't take it personally unless there's something structurally wrong or cyclically wrong with the

But day to day, I mean you've just.

Got to You've just got to stay focused on running the business and tuning out from all that.

I can imagine your role would be very stressful, like there'd be so much pressure given your role, given the size of the company. And something I've heard about you is that you never seem to get flustered. I guess from an outsider's point of view, And I want to know, how does that ring true to you? When I say that, do you go, yeah, I feel like that is how I operate in this world. I don't get flustered.

I've got to figure out who you've been talking to.

I'll reveal my sources after the interview. Yeah, dilect Does that ring true to you? Or do you feel like you're sometimes flastered on the inside but just remaining composed on the outside.

That's absolutely true, right, I mean.

You call it composure, right, And I guess as a leader, I mean there's just no excuse. You have to stay composed, even when you might be feeling a little bit irritated. It's super important that you do stay composed, because if you don't, it's a poor reflection on leadership, and that sort of thing is contagious in an organization. So composure is mission critical. I guess, for me, when I feel a little bit irritated, what are my strategies in terms

I guess if all that fails.

There'd be maybe one or two people inside the organization where you can vent to making sure that you've got your people around you that you trust, or might be an external person who you trust, who understands your business, understands you and what you're going through.

Just having that.

External perspective as well to one help you vent, but also two to help you rationalize decision making that you've

Does that make sense?

It does, and that's an interesting example with the email. Also probably means that it's a good way of avoiding making news headlines as well. Do you use that approach? I guess like the sleep on it test, as I sometimes hear it referred to in relation to big decisions that you make at work.

Yeah, all the time.

Although yeah, I like how people say I'm going to sleep on it, But if it's a big enough issue, then I'll get any sleep anyway. So it's more like

Are there are other ways that you're getting that perspective with some of the bigger decisions that you have to make.

The other perspectives are having the right people around you that you trust, and you know, I'm in a very fortunate position. I've got lots and lots of great people around me, and so you having great counsel is super important. Inside the organization is super important, but also having great counsel outside the organization is super important too. So you're having a network of peers in similar organizations, in similar

A particular issue.

You think you're unique, you think you're the only one that's had to deal with it, and you'll bounce it off three friends and they've all had to deal with it in the past twelve months. And having that network is really important to me, particularly if I get myself in a position where I do need that third party advice. I'm lucky, I've got you. I've got a great board too, and a fantastic chairman. So I think the strategy for me is old internalized first, figure things out. If I

Now, Cam, we're almost out of time, and I imagine you've probably got a meeting starting on the hour. So my final question for you is for listeners that want to connect with you in some way or connect with car sales, what is the best way for people to do that.

Well, there's the car sales website, so I mean, if someone wants to connect with me, I'm on most forms of social media, so feel free to reach out through those social media networks or my email.

Address is pretty straightforward.

It's Cameron dot McIntyre at carsales dot com dot I use so I'm pretty reachable.

So yeah, that probably the best ways.

Or just go to the bottom the car sales website and you'll find plenty of ways to reach out.

Fantastic cav. I've loved chatting to you and getting an insight into how you work and how you lead, so thank you so much for your time.

No, I mean it was a lot of fun.

It was great, actually, I enjoyed it, So thanks for the chat.

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