Episode 169: 9w8 or 9w1: Enneagram 9 Wings Explained Pt.1

Hey everyone. This is Beth. And I'm Jeff. And this is Your Enneagram Coach, the podcast, and we're here to help you to understand yourself with astonishing clarity so that you can break free from self condemnation, fear, and shame by knowing and experiencing the unconditional love, forgiveness, and freedom in Christ. Well, we're on YouTube, so hopefully you're gonna head over there, watch this podcast and make sure if you're there, hit like and subscribe so you don't miss any of our new

content. I mean, you guys gotta check out YouTube because you're missing out on my beautiful melon. I mean, it's gonna. It

will, it will change your name. Of course. I thought you were gonna say my beautiful wife, but No. Well, she's great.

I mean, but everybody loves Beth Beautiful Melon. I'm Beth's husband. Uh, do people even know my name? Like, I don't even know anymore. Um, my kids make a joke that I'm, uh, Mike from Wasowski I don't, is there a somewhere?

But you'd love little extra twist in there.

I do. I do. That's just how I roll. Adding people. we're gonna be talking about type nine and they're wings, uh, which are type eight and type one. The concept of wings is new to you. Check out episode one 60 where we explain in what enneagram wings are, uh, particularly in detail. And essentially the wings are just simply the two types that are directly next to your main type. So a nine is not gonna have a two wing, they're not gonna have a six wing. Uh, and it's just the two next to it.

get to dive into my wings today, which is gonna be awesome. And we have two special guests. But before we go there, let's talk about the main type, because we still remain our main type. You're still a nine no matter what. Exactly. So, and that comes with our core motivations, which is the driving force behind your thoughts, feelings, and behaviors. And your core motivations are the core fear.

because we have such a significant relationship with these various connecting types, especially the wings, uh, we're gonna be referring to wings as part of us, and we talk a lot about this in our new book more than your number. So be sure to go check that out because it, it's gonna really open your understanding to the various parts of your heart. Maybe that's new to you even thinking about that.

unhealthy ways. Yeah. So before we introduce our guests, let me just paint a picture of us. Type nine s. We are called the peaceful

That is one of the easiest indicators for me that you're struggling. Is it when you start getting pessimistic, like, okay, hold on, hold on. That's not Bethy

yeah, that's true. Yeah. Cuz then we will, and we're not getting into it this episode, but when I moved to that space Sure. You're like, you can't

handle you handle the truth. And all my anxieties get outta my neighborhood. Yeah.

So I'm like, yeah, that's okay. I'll, I'll, I, I don't need to go to that. Flywheel of a mind for sure. Yes. Um, but nines also, what happens is in order to go along, to get along to create peace and harmony mm-hmm. We tend to merge with others, but by merging with others' thoughts, feelings, and agendas, we lose ourselves in the process. So a lot don't even know.

or a attention. No, we, we had a fun conversation. Um, so we're recording this the day after Valentine's. So, yeah. Uh, Beth and I came home and we had a very meaningful full conversation where it was prompted by the movie and it, how did I phrase it again? Who do you think believes that they, out of the two of us, out of the two of us, is the least lovable, right? I

think is how I phrased it. Do I think I'm the least lovable or do you think you are the least lovable? And it became

a fight? Like, no, no, no, you cl you clearly love me less.

Yeah, because I was like, no, I know I love you, but as a nine, my thought process is, the core lies are, I'm not special. I don't matter. My voice doesn't matter. I'm,

you are only loved to the degree that you make me happy. Yeah.

Yeah. That's what I think. Like, oh, if you are ha, if Jeff's happy, then I've done a great job. That's the thought pattern of the nine, and so I'm convinced, well, Does that ever happen? And so then I'm convinced, no, I'm the least level rule cuz and and we, we are laughing. Yes. Because we know that these are all just head trash limiting beliefs. False messages. Yes. That plague us. But it, but it's a part of the mind does have an impact on our relationship. It does for sure.

Well, our guests today are Brandon and Laura. Uh, guys, I thank you so much for being on, uh, the podcast with us. Laura, why don't you tell us a little about yourself.

you for having me here today. Um, my name is Laura, uh, NIC Booth and I am a licensed marriage and family therapist and certified enneagram coach. Um, I have been a therapist for over 15 years and it really kinda. Came out, um, in kind of utilizing the Enneagram in that work.

And Laura,

helped me grow on that

what do, what do you think has been just the top two or three things that the enneagram has helped in the therapeutic process with the clients that you work with?

I think honestly the, um, the biggest thing is helping us see all these different parts to ourself and how that makes us a whole person. I think we can oftentimes cut ourselves off, um, from various parts of ourselves that are trying to protect us, um, in various ways. So I think the Enneagram really gives a good visual and a good descriptor of. Who we are and why we do what we do.

Oh, that's fantastic. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for sharing that. So Brandon, thanks so much for joining the podcast. Tell us a little bit about yourself.

Absolutely. I'm super glad to be here. This is, uh, number two for me on the podcast. I'm very glad to

you know what? Thank you. is like being a host on Saturday Night Live. Yeah. Where now we have a,

how many times can you be on,

Oh, you guys gonna start handing out

Ooh, maybe, oh, now I've gotta

give you stuff. Or, or YEC Yeti mugs.

You know, that's why we bought those mugs in the first place was to give away to guests we just hoarded them for ourselves and then we decided, no, let's just put 'em in a storage unit and keep there and paid it for it. Right?

So,

Well, I'll, I'll watch the mail to get

yes. Yes. Cuz that's why you're here. You want the merch, I mean,

why

enneagram symbol

is

such a great icon to puon your clothing, right? Right.T.

Absolutely.

So tell us about you,

Well, um, yeah, I'm, uh, also type ninex and, uh, I live up in the northwest just outside of Seattle, Washington, and I've been a coach for going on six years now, but I've known about the Enneagram for, for many, many years. It's been a fun thing to, uh, to learn and, and to be able to

Mm. That's great. I mean, having, uh, studied and been interested in the Enneagram for so long, how have you seen the conversation and community around the Enneagram change over time?

Well, I think, um, When I started to first hear about it, it was much more underground, I

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

And then obviously that big bubble that kind of bursts, especially in

Right.

I mean I, as far as I know, I heard it was just absolutely

Yes.

Um, But, um, the, the conversation has begun to change for me, at least with my clients as like, they're, they're coming to me. They used to come to me with like, what is this thing? And now they're coming to me as like a, I know that this has been helpful and I've seen this be helpful for friends or family or coworkers, whatever. And I'd like that to be a part of, you know, my world.

Yeah. Yeah.

amazing.

is interesting you talk about it. It was a little underground. So for years, Beth and I, for over a decade, we're reading about the Enneagram and we were, I was a pastor. Mm-hmm. At a local church, and so we, well,

we were, it, there just wasn't any gospel centered approach to the Enneagram. So we took all that time to really assess and also bring language to it that would help those that. Want to see it and want to use it from that Gospel Center perspective, an actual way to do that. But I,

I remember like many of the authors were not Christians, so they weren't writing books from a biblical worldview. Right. And so we would kind of sneakily go through borders, uh, back into the new age and personalities. Right. But now they're to get a Rizzo in Hudson book or a Helen Palmer. How like our books are in the Christian section. Oh, that's right. We brought, yes, we have, that's right. Bingo. Go.

How far they've

How far it is. Funny to think about how cautious we were and as the Lord provided opportunities and for us to, I remember distinctly making decisions along the way. Yeah. Um, to. Change. Yeah. When

we were reading about, it's been awesome seeing the ripple effect.

That's right. Well, we're super thankful that you're both here. Uh, it's common for people to talk about their dominant wing, which is the wing that they notice the most are showing up in this particular season in life. And many out there believe that they may only have one wing, but that's actually not the case. Uh, just as a bird has both wings, uh, has two wings, so do, uh, all the Enneagram types. Mm-hmm.

of him. Yeah. So let's dive into, uh, type one. The wing that we have as type one

So I, um, my staff, so I've a, a company I, I run out here in Northwest and, um, My it, like, I, I see that come to life in when I have to communicate hard things to staff. So, um, when, when things are done incorrectly or poorly and they need to be corrected, there is a, a way to, like, there's a, tact is a word. The word I love is tact. Like to have tact. And I feel like that is like for me, a really great, uh, melding of the

Hmm.

Of being able to say like, you've done this incorrectly. Here's the way to correct it, but also, what are you bringing into work this week or today that's taken you off your game, because I know you've done it before, the correct way. Those kinds of things. Instead of coming in with just such a hard lined, like, oh, this is wrong. Change it

Brandon, do you have, uh, any reluctance for that? Towards that part to, for it to show up.

Oh, absolutely. Yeah,

I, I, I mean, I, I, what come, well, the way I experience it, it's almost as if, uh, it's like, you know, don't, don't make me have to bring out my one wing. Exactly. I really don't want to do this.

Yes. Like, ah,

Perfectly said. I, because I

Yeah. I mean, Beth's that way. And, and what's interesting is a, as I've told her, like. Even if you have to confront one of the team members mm-hmm. Or address an issue, we'll, we'll only use con confrontational language. Right. Don't do that. We just need to have a conversation, an intentional conversation conversation. Like Bethy, you have nothing to worry about, because even if it was out of perfectionism or anger, it still won't come

across that way. Right. It's kind of like, it feels like it's gonna be this brick I'm throwing at someone. And it's been bubble wrapped most, like 10 times. Most a teddy bear, you know, it's been bubble wrapped and it has like, let's say, fur on the outside of that. So it's like,

It's the softest brick that's ever been

yes, but, but even, even when that still comes, I'm like, I'm so sorry. You know, like, oh gosh.

Yes. Absolutely. Yeah. Well, Laura, how about you? How does the one part of your heart show up in healthy ways?

um, for me, I see it, uh, in healthy ways, more so in, um, I used to struggle a lot with like setting boundaries and being able to like set healthy boundaries and I think the one has been very helpful for me when I'm really health healthy to discern like. Making it okay to like speak up or say something that's right for me, even though it might not be okay for someone else. Um, and know that that's okay, um, to, to do that.

It's interesting to think that if the ones wanting to merge, if the nine is wanting to merge both wings of the nine, both eight and one, have a much clearer view of what boundaries are. Oh, yeah.

Mm-hmm.

it's like God has equipped you with, uh, some help to establish some

boundaries if we're willing to take the home,

Yes.

which can lead us into the unhealthy space of the type one. So, yeah. I'm just,

uh, outta curiosity, um, Brandon, which wing do you lean towards more?

Eight

Yeah. And Laura, what about you?

I've leaned.

I will lean more towards the one wing.

I mean, you can feel it. I do. Wait, that's what I was gonna say's. Looking at you both. Yeah. You can feel the vibe of

I totally.

What I'm, this is why you've gotta watch this stuff on YouTube. Yeah. Because you literally, you can see it. We interviewed some fives and. They're kind of tucked away in their little space. I mean, it, yeah. It's just, it, it's so fascinating. It's so, I mean, it's worth watching real people and not just their

voices. So Well, and I tend to almost merge with every Enneagram type that we interview. Uh, it's amazing. My energy is like right there. The way she

describes the types. It, it's, yeah. With five and four, you got a little softer with eight and with nines you're showing up a little brighter. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. How funny. Yeah, because they get me. They get me. That's right.

one? Here's where the unhealthy part of one can show up, uh, in a life of a nine. As we talk about the wing one, unhealthy characteristic. Cause it's important to keep in mind this. That it has positive intent. It has good intent. It is trying its best to resolve the, uh, heartache of the type nine. So the one wing can make you quick to judge, maybe condemn others while justifying yourself based on your high standards, principles and morals. Uh, which can be tough for the nine.

I think, um, one of the things, um, that I see most it, and even, you know, when I reflect I like I was that kid growing up that could not stand anyone being mad at me and. If, and a lot of it had to do with feeling like I did something wrong. Like you know that right versus wrong. And even if I didn't necessarily do anything wrong, like I would immediately wanna apologize for that. So I think the unhealthy one wing.

and I think,

where I see it really

and that's the point I wanna get across and I'd love to hear Brandon, if you feel this as well, is that. Though the one wing is definitely looking at morals and and ethics and procedures. For me as a nine, it's really about am I making you happy? So if someone's upset, therefore I've done something wrong. Now, of course, ethics and morals, that's important too, but it lands on me more.

yeah. Brandon, tell us first, cuz I wanna come back to something about, uh, absorbing or remembering rules. Okay. Okay. But Brennan, how, how does your, the one wing show up for you in less healthy ways?

Um, well a couple ways, but I mean, to kind of go off at the same point from what Laura was saying, was I find, um, my indicator is I start to ask a lot of questions. Uh, like internal questions of like, what kind of person does this or what kind of person says that, or

Well, I mean, that's really contemptuous.

right? Like, it, it's, it's very, uh, It's just a comparison game internally of going like, this is not the right way to operate in the world. And so I, those are the kinds of questions. And so when I catch myself in that storyline loop of going, a good person doesn't say these things, or a good person doesn't react this way, or a good person doesn't care that much when. The dishes were supposed to be done and now they're not.

Yeah, well, being married to Beth for a few years now, you, what are we at? 28? Seven. Seven? Yeah,

this is, we're

going into 28. Going into 28 7. Yeah. Um, Beth remembers. The rules. Particularly the rules that were handed down by parents or me, society. The church. Church.

Basically, when he says rules, it's if someone was unhappy or displeased or frustrated. I mean, or someone

says that they're displeased with someone else because of

what they did. Right. It's not even at at me. I'm like writing it down in my head. Oh, I'm not gonna do that. I'm not gonna make that mistake. I'm not gonna say it that way. That will make other people upset. Do the two of you resonate

with this?

A

Absolutely.

Like those are the rules. And, and, and the ones, you know, of course they have a nine wing, so they might, they might resonate with that somewhat, but for them it's really about ethics and morals. It's about the inner critic and making the inner critic happy. But what's amazing, making people

happy to me and, and, and for those who are, have friendships. Or in marriages have, just have friendships and relationships with type nine s. One thing you have to remember is that those rules are not there to come after you. It's, they're to, they're applied to themselves. Mm-hmm. So if you make a mistake, I, it, there's, in some sense, there's a sensitivity that I have to be aware of. And at times, because it, you know, as nines, they, they want to.

a rule. Everything is observing people and you know, like, am, how am I showing up? And it's not showing up to get admiration. Maybe like a three wood shape shifting. It is. How am I showing up to make sure everyone else is happy?

And that's what Laura said earlier is if you think of this one part of you as a very young part of you and it with Laura, like when your friends were unhappy, it was the part that motivated you to try to make it right. You wanted to be the good

girl. Yeah. To figure out the rules. What are the rules in this friend group that we can get it back on track? Yes.

Exactly.

It's exhausting. Oh, and we were doing a type, the Type five podcast yesterday. It was fascinating though, of course I knew this, but it, one of the guests said, you know, I really don't care what other people think and I'm just like, I even said like, oh, dare say that. Some of that to me. Can you throw it over here please? That's

a possibility in life. To functionality. Oh. Oh, I wish. I wish. It's funny about the rule thing though is that I spend my life assuming I am the problem. Yeah. You're taking the responsibility. Yeah. And when for you to have the audacity to think that you are the problem. I'm

sorry sweetie. So here's another, we're gonna battle about who's really the problem, who's really raw. Okay, well let's head into type eight wing. And this is more my dog. Those are are two strong

wings. Like I have five and seven, seven big showing up. Happy, fun. Five more. Which one? What? But one and eight, man, there's some energy there.

Exactly. So let's talk about the eight. So this is the one I. I mean, I use both of them quite a bit. Um, whereas like your dad uses them, both of them hardly. I'm not even sure he has wings.

Exactly. He's more like a pin one tiny, like a T-Rex. He has 'em, he just doesn't use them. Well, Laura, how can people find out more about your coaching and, uh, what you are able to offer in leadership?

Uh, they can find me@infiniteclaritycc.com or at Infinite Clarity on Facebook and Instagram and LinkedIn.

fantastic. Thank you Laura and Brandon, what about you?

I'm over at aim and anchor coaching.com and you can also find me Instagram TikTok. Uh, same name.

Ayman anchor. That's awesome.

And you both are on our network, right?

That's

So go to myenneagramcoach.com and you can put in Brandon and Laura's name and you can find them there

as well. That would be awesome. So thank you so much. If you really wanna learn more about, uh, wings and all of the things associated with the Enneagram, head on over to yourenneagramcoach.com.

the same. Yep. And that's at yourenneagramcoach.com/bec but as always, the enneagram reveals your need for Jesus, not your need to work harder. It is the gospel that transforms us. Thanks for tuning in. We'll see you next time.