Just to let you know, in today's episode we do cover subjects including living with someone with addiction, narcissistic traits, and also being in a difficult relationship. If this is something you find hard, perhaps this episode is one for you to skip. I'm Becca Poutney, wedding business marketing expert, speaker and blogger, and you're listening to the Wedding Pros who Are Ready to Grow podcast.
I'm here to share with you actionable tips, strategies and real life examples to help you take your wedding business to the next level. If you are an ambitious wedding business owner that wants to take your passion and use it to build a profitable, sustainable business doing what you love, then you're in the right place. Let's get going with today's episode. Today I'm chatting with Denise Whelan, celebrant and destination wedding planner based in Spain.
I first met Denise in 2023 when she attended my wedding business retreat and I've loved watching her business evolve ever since. Denise is also a member of my Wedding Pro members lounge and I'm looking forward to hearing more about her business journey today. Denise, welcome to the podcast. Hi Becca, it's so fun to have you. I know you're out in Spain right now as we record, so we are recording from opposite sides of the world, but it's great to have you here.
So let's get started today with your journey into weddings in the first place. So take us back into your career. How did you end up in the wide world of weddings? I ended up in the wide world of weddings quite indirectly. It's something I never actually looked at. I was in a very, very difficult relationship. I lived with. Well, my husband was somebody who was not very nice. He was an addict.
His addiction lost him his business and it was during lockdown and I took that time to develop my other skills for my other business because I've been a 40 year career in the health and fitness industry and I was working online on a yoga course and we'd had a difficult morning and I was just scrolling through what I'd been learning and this thing came up about train to be a celebrant.
And then at that point my late husband came in and had a go at me and I just said, well for goodness sake, why don't you train to be a celebrant if you want to do something, you always say you're very good at standing up in public, you're quite happy organizing people. You say you've got good skills, da da da da. It went on and on and he sang the door and off he went. And that I just thought, that's great. And then about two weeks later he said, I've been thinking about what you said.
I'll do that celebrate thing. It sounds a good idea. I've looked into it. Seems right for me. I thought, oh, phew, good, but only if you do it as well. So I was stuck between a rock and a hard place because I didn't want to do it, because I just wanted him to have something of his own. But if I didn't do it and he failed, then it's not just him having a goat me, it would be a family thing as well. So I just thought I'd just say yes. So under sufferance, I did the course.
Unfortunately, I did better than he did. And when you live with a narcissist, it's not a good thing to do. So that created other problems as well. But that's another hour. And so I did it and I just left it. And then various things happened. I had him arrested and he went away and he never came back to the house. But I found myself in a situation where I needed to have another income stream, but not on a regular basis. I just every now and again probably need a little extra influx of cash.
But I didn't know how to go about being a celebrant. So I did a little bit more research that, well, I've got this qualification, I might as well use it. And that's what I did. And quite quickly I started to get to get customers. That's really how I got into doing the celibate work. But it didn't bother me because all my working career has been about people and organizing.
I've always worked with lots and lots of people from working in a college, a university, running a health club, running my own classes, training people. So they've always been at the core of what I do, what motivates them, what they like, what they don't like. So all those skills seem to fit in to do the celebrant work. And I get to wear a nice frock. Well, that's a bonus. So you didn't really ever want to become a celebrant. That kind of happened. But actually you found that you enjoyed it.
How did you get those first weddings or first funerals? Because I think quite often people do the training in any area of the wedding industry and then they get stuck and they think, well, how do I find my first people? So how did you do it? How did you go about finding your first client. My first clients, I found really just. I did some research about really what's the best way to market a wedding business.
I knew how to market a fitness business, but I did not know how to market a wedding business. And I found this site called Hitched. And I suppose that most people, it was the only. It was the first one that came up. I know the road is out there, but that was the only one that came up and sort of made contact with them and had a look at other people on their. On their site, how they put their pictures up. And I made lots of mistakes with what I did initially, as we all do, but that's where.
That's where I got my first couples from. And from a wedding celebrate point of view. And I got a funeral not long after that. But that was through word of mouth because that was more localized. It's much easier to market yourself locally, I think, because you've got the confidence to go into somewhere. Whereas a wedding, it's quite different. But that's how I did it. And I knew nothing about. I mean, I was really green when it came to getting in touch with venues.
And it never occurred to me that a venue might want to always use me. I just. I'd always got to go to a couple and I really did make. Well, I'm glad I made the mistakes I made because it's actually made me more focused on now how to market my business. I'm glad it's been a learning process and a long, long. A long slow one. But it has been a learning process. But that's how I first got my first. Lots of couples.
But that led me, that couple whose wedding I did led me to add something else to what I do. Because when I did the wedding, I was packing my car afterwards because I take all sorts of things with me. And there was a couple of guys stood outside the venue and he. One of them said. He said, oh, you're the celebrant. I said, yeah. He said, I'm stuck now. He said, I just don't know what to do. He said, you've stole my thunder. I said, what do you mean? He said, well, I'm the best man.
He said, your speech, what you said about them and how they got together and their life together, it's far better than what I'm going to say. And so I went away and thought, actually, there's an idea there. So I now add best man speech and room speech to the services that I offer. So it was a benefit to Me. And all that came from just that first wedding. I love that. So you now help them write the speech. Do you work with them to write it or do you write it for them?
Both. If they haven't got a clue what to say. I almost treat it like a wedding questionnaire. I just asked them the same questions I probably asked my bride and groom, but added on some more personal things with the relationship to those they have to the couple. And then I started there, or they may have started their speech and they go, I need some help with this. So they send it to me. I look through it, I play with it, you know, and finalize it for them.
I did a group speech not that long ago and he said, I just don't know what to do. And he didn't know how to say it either. So that added me another service on is that I will help them. I'll coach them on how to deliver their speech. So it's sort of just one little thing. It's snowballed and developed into something bigger, which is really quite nice. I've done quite a few now and I really enjoy it. And that's true entrepreneurship as well.
It's seeing a gap in the market, seeing somewhere where someone's struggling and realizing there's an area that we can help them with as well. Now, you talked a little bit in that about some of the mistakes you made along the way, and you said that you're glad you made some of the mistakes, but you did make mistakes. Are you happy to share any of those mistakes? So I think sometimes we can learn a lot from the mistakes other people have made before us.
So when you look back over your wedding business so far, what are some of the key things you think I shouldn't have done, that. I shouldn't have gone with one provider of advertising or marketing, which was hitched because I should have explored more.
But that was a confidence and be my ignorance and I should have had the confidence to go around to local wedding venues more regularly and then research more on how to or what kind of things people look for who are getting married on when they go on social media. Because social media to me was just. Well, it was just. It was a different platform for me, for the fitness industry, because they're looking for more active things. And it was just. It was just different. And I've.
I advertised in various magazines locally and the counties that I was advertising in hd. And I wish I hadn't done that because it brought me absolutely nothing back that cost me. So that cost Me quite a bit of wedding fairs. I did a couple of wedding fairs. Whilst I'm pretty good in front of people, I just didn't really have the right format to get their information and then know how to deal with what I got back.
So I was getting names and addresses and emailing them, but then I was like, well, what do I do now? So that was a massive mistake. I wish I done far more, which had waited a long period, longer period of time, done more research on how to get it right, I would have still made mistakes, but I wouldn't have made as many mistakes. And at the end of the mistake is money. So, you know, you do lose out. So. But it was a massive. It was a massive learning curve.
Yeah, and it is a big learning curve because we start this business in the wedding industry and we're just trying to make it up as we go along. Essentially, most people I meet, they think, oh, yeah, I could make a cake or I could do a celebrancy. And they don't realize that there's such this other huge part of the business, not just delivering the service.
And actually, I think a lot of people fall into these traps and don't think about, well, who am I marketing to, where am I marketing to, how much it's going to cost me, what's the return on investment, and all of those good things as well. But we learn as we go and we educate ourselves and then we don't make the same mistakes next time and we grow and we do better for it. Okay, so what has worked for you? We talked about some of the mistakes.
What has worked for you in terms of growing your business, particularly when you were here in the uk? What things do you think? Yeah, that was a really good choice. I'm really glad I did that. Working with people like yourself and tnl, just finding those groups of people who are in the wedding industry and have a good background, lots of experience and are happy to help and support people like myself who are really completely ignorant.
That has been the biggest benefit, the greatest benefit to me. I can't tell you how much I'm grateful for that. And I work here in Spain with somebody in the wedding industry too. So it just provided me with a totally different outlook because nobody gets up on Monday and says on Friday to get married on Friday. So what do you do in that period of time? How do you keep them motivated with you? And, you know, what do I have to keep sending them? How do I keep it fresh, how do I keep it exciting?
And that's been the greatest benefit to me is joining tnr, getting online with yourself, joining Laura Charles. It's just been awesome. Yeah. So education basically has been one of the biggest benefits and I think it's true because we, we don't know this stuff ourselves. And again, I see people, they'll go and do celebrant training or they'll go and do cake baking training. And so again, you're training yourself on the service.
But actually that business part is really important and it's actually one of the reasons that I wrote my book was that I wanted something that was cost effective, that people could have in their hand that walked them through the start of the journey. So at least they could stop making some of those mistakes, get going a little bit and bring in some money to then be able to afford to actually pay for some more in depth training as well.
So I'm really glad to hear that education has helped you so, so much. Now, you talked about at the beginning being in a difficult situation, obviously how you first came across celebrancy was not ideal at all. But now, as I speak to you in 2024, things look very, very different. You're now living in Spain, so talk us through the gap. The bit that we've missed in our story. How did you go from being a wedding celebrant in the UK to living in Spain?
I bought a man off Amazon and he just happened to live here and I wasn't in, so they put it in my safe place. Which was the shed? No, I met somebody online and he lives here. I have no family commitments in the uk. I've got a sister and she's got her life with her kids, but I have no, I have no. It's only me and my dog and I needed a complete change and he and I got on really, really well. He's lived here for 26 years, he's English.
I came over here regularly and we suddenly decided, well, why don't we make a go of it? And we have. And while I was here, while I kept coming over, I just kept going around to venues and having a look at how different the wedding venues are here. But also talking to people who run these venues, how they market them and they don't. And it was just being like, we haven't got a website, you haven't got a Facebook page, you don't do Instagram, why would you get your customers and they don't.
It's from that point of view, it's just different. But I also met a few People here who are English, who run their own wedding businesses. And that's got me into networking because I'm a great network. I massively believe in networking and from that I've just started to grow what I do. And very quickly I got clients, celebrant stuff I've done in the uk. One of the things I was always doing was finding people, suppliers, liaising with those suppliers for them, helping them with ideas.
And I thought, and I wasn't charging any extra for it. I'm thinking I'm planning your wedding for you and you're not paying for it. I found somebody, a venue, I thought, why are you going out to this venue? They're not paying you. It's because they're. So I just thought, right, another opportunity, take that and become a wedding planner. And here in Spain there is a need for wedding planners.
They want English speaking wedding planners to deal with the English speaking market, not necessarily the British, because there's other European countries where England is. English is, that is their second language. So that's why I decided to set up wedding planning.
Add that on because in a previous job I worked for JCB and Roald Dalton years ago I worked in PR and marketing and one of the things I did there was organize exhibitions and at trade shows, non organized events within those companies. So I got those skills. I knew how to do it. It was a long time ago but I'd already experienced it and you had to plan the stuff.
I do have timelines and all that things that ghost goes with it and to be there on the day and make sure it's in the right place at the right time, do what they're supposed to do. And I just thought, well, you've got the skill, there's a need, develop it. And so that's what I'm doing. And as I say, when I came here, literally within probably about a month, I got one wedding to plan and a few months later I've got another. And it was the best thing I've done and I really enjoy it. Amazing.
And I love that now because now on your website I was looking at it just now, you are wedding celebrant and destination wedding planner in Spain. It all works together seamlessly because it is a very different market. But you make it sound so easy, Denise. So we're going to break it down a little bit because I know that people, when they pack up their wedding business in one, even one part of the UK and have to move it to another part of the uk, let alone move it to Spain.
They feel very scared about that. They feel very daunted. They're maybe leaving some of their contacts behind. So how have you practically done that? How have you managed to move to a different location and keep your business. Going with a lot of sweat, tears and stress? No, you're quite right, it is daunting. I didn't look at it like that, I just looked it as an opportunity. Like I said earlier, you know, I've always been a networker.
I do enjoy networking and when I used to come out every couple of weeks, every sort of six to eight weeks, and I always find out where the local networking and just by going to network events, I managed to make contact with people who got venues. I've now got. I got a contact girl who's a florist. And that really is how I did it. The hardest thing was keeping the marketing going. And my marketing did drop massively, but I knew that.
But I should say, as long as I've got the contacts and as long as I keep that communication line open, I keep communicating with the couples I've got. When I know that I have a permanent base, which we now have because we've been living our boxes, as I said earlier, I'll be up and running again and that's exactly what I'm doing. And I'm literally, I'm rollercoastering it now. I mean, I've took that time as well to learn about Pinterest.
So I'm blogging and linking into Pinterest and putting that back and link it back to my website. So I've been doing stuff behind the scenes. I've just not perhaps been as proactive as I. As I could be because it is time, especially when you. You rebuilding a property, what you can see behind me, it was not like this 12 months ago. This was a brick shell. We have built it. So that alone has been. Has been another challenge that's been thrown into the equation.
So, you know, it's just been hard, but I've done it and it's just. It was literally just about momentum. Yeah, absolutely. And I love what you said, actually, because it is a big mindset shift is seeing it not as something scary, but seeing it as a new opportunity, something new and exciting and then going out there and making the effort basically to go out and meet people and to build those connections. I mean, that's how my entire business started myself.
I don't know if you know this, but I moved from Bristol with my wedding videography business to Bedfordshire where I Live Now. And I left all my contacts behind, got to Bedfordshire. I don't know anyone in the wedding industry. How on earth am I going to run my wedding videography business? I know, I'll just see if anyone wants to get together for a drink and a network.
And that was basically what catapulted me to where I am today, because I went from knowing nobody in Bedfordshire to knowing 30 people in Bedfordshire to 100 people. And now I work with people across the world. And so I love that you talk about it being an opportunity and that you really value those contacts because going out there and meeting the right people really can transform your business. And it has, because you've now added destination wedding planning into the mix.
So talk to me about that, then. What's that looking like? Are you looking to attract couples who are from the UK or from other countries getting married in Spain? Are you looking to work with couples in Spain? Are you championing the area of Spain where you live right now as a place to go for weddings? Where do you see that taking you? Well, starting with the last one, yes, I am championing the area that I live in for weddings. It's very, very unspoiled. It's not a holiday destination as such.
And there were some beautiful, beautiful venues here and they seem to be lost and forgotten. I've got two site visits this week. Well, one this week, one early next week, because I want to work with those people, one for a style shoot. And the couples I'm trying to attract here are the British market because they. There are a lot of British couples that come here and they get here and they go, God, this is lovely. It's just. It's just like I remember holidays when I was a kid, you know, it's.
There's no commercialization here, and so it's ideal for, you know, for coastal weddings. I'm not saying beach weddings because again, something else I've had to do is learn about the rules and the laws about getting married on a beach. And there are some strict rules, but, you know, you can get married close to the beach. You know, there are venues overlooking the beach. So that appeals to a very wide market in terms of, you know, British couples. Because it's the.
It's the ideal thing, isn't it? I'd love to get married on a beach. Oh, my dress will get tea in the sand. Okay, well, you get married in this restaurant here and it overlooks the beach and your feet will be nice and clean and you won't have to pay much. Better idea. And so what are the differences? Because I think sometimes when we look at weddings in different cultures, we realize that actually the Spanish do weddings differently to how we do them.
So typically, are you seeing that couples from the UK are wanting to come over and have an English wedding in Spain or are they embracing more of the Spanish traditions? What is different out in Spain? The first thing that's different is when couples come here to get married, it's a much more relaxed approach from them because as soon as they go off the plane, the sunshine and then they're on holiday, so they have that holiday feeling.
So it's quite nice working with them because they are in this nice relaxed situation. The other thing is they come, they have the, they want the English wedding because they want the white wedding and all that goes with that, but they want to embrace the Spanish gastronomic culture. A lot of people, they want, they don't want the sit down meal, they want either a barbecue or a buffet. And if it's a buffet, it's paella and tapas and there's some lovely things that people can do.
And again, because it's got that holiday feel to it, it makes it a much more relaxed event, you know, event. They're not even bothered. The two weddings I'm doing, both of them are not even bothered about, you know, having place settings. So sit where you want. You're here to enjoy yourself as well. So I think that's the biggest difference here, is that the, there's no. You're highly unlikely to step off the plane and become bridezilla. Nice, I like that. I like that.
Much more relaxed, nice couples for you to work with. You're living the life, Denise. You're living out in Spain in this beautiful weather, working with these amazing couples. I'm only a little bit jealous now, if people want a taste of that, perhaps there's people here in the UK who think, actually I'd quite like to do more destination weddings, I'd like to get involved.
Do you think there's opportunities for UK suppliers who are based in the UK to come out and be part of the industry, as in Spain, or do you think that most couples are looking to use local suppliers in the area? Most couples are looking to use local suppliers. And my advice to British suppliers who want to supply two weddings in Spain is to be highly cautious because you need to know and understand the government regulations about bringing things in because there's high taxes.
And so somebody who, let's for argument, say they come into the UK to Spain from the uk to get married. But they want this particular thing, their seat covers from this company in the United Kingdom. And it cost. I don't 100 quid for one of just plucking a number out the sky. Because it costs, really. Then they're going to have to pay an extra 20% on top of that for each one. So there is a cost.
So I would advise anybody who is in the UK and looking at getting into destination wedding market, look at the government rules and regulations on importing and transportation and then maybe set yourself up a base in Spain and source your product from Spain. Yeah, that's really helpful advice. Really, really helpful. I'm looking forward to seeing your style shoots that you're doing out in Spain. Are you using local supplies for those? I am. I've.
I mean, the photographers are quite easy to find here because they're not only photograph photographers for. For weddings, they. They're obviously photographers for. For property and there's loads of them. It's just finding the right one. And I found a couple who. It took me a while, but I found a couple who I really trust and I like what they do. It goes with my idea, the two. I've got a florist who is. She's just great.
She's just started off a business, so she's keen to get herself noticed and she's keen to get in the wedding industry. The venue that I'm going to see next week, it's a. Is a vineyard. They did one wedding last year and they thoroughly enjoyed doing it and want to get into the wedding industry, so they're keen against somebody new. So I'm just looking as new suppliers who are, you know, who are hungry to get themselves known and it's the best way.
I just need a bride and groom now and I think I found them. I'm sure you've got. You'll find some willing volunteers. If not, I'm sure someone listening to this might like to fly out to Spain and have their photo taken as well. Now, we joke about how great things are, but we know that business is full of highs and lows as well. So I want to go into that a little bit now. So talk to me about.
As you look back over your business journey so far, particularly in the wedding industry, as a celebrant, as a planner, what are some of the biggest highs? What are the things you look back on and you think, yeah, I'm really proud of that. Well, because I know your views. I'm proud of the fact that I won Wedding Celebrants of the Year in England because in my first year, because that helped me with my marketing, because people want to work with the best, don't they?
So that really, really helped me. It also helped us. It was an opportunity to network as well. So I got to know a few other people and that was great. And another high is really the testimonials that I've had back from couples when we've worked, as you know, you work for a long time with them, it's a big day for them, a lot of stress and pressure and last thing they want to be doing is giving you a testimonial fairly soon after their wedding.
But it's really nice when you really get one really quickly and then you make friendships. So they're the highs, the lows. I've had loads and loads of inquiries this year. I can't believe how many inquiries I've had. And I have a nurture sequence that we all do and I've just not had anybody bite. And I've looked at my nursery sequence, I've had people look at it, I've changed it, I've taken all the advice and I'm still not getting them.
So I'm not doing something right and I'm quite sure what it is, but I'm not getting hung up on it because the celibate work is not my prime role here in Spain, my wedding planning is. So I've had this little switch. So it will come, I will work it again. But let me work on building this planning side. And if I get a few weddings along the way, it's just an icing on the cake, but it has to be. I just banging my head against a brick wall sometimes with this, like, what am I doing wrong?
So we'll see. It can be so frustrating and sometimes it's actually not what we're doing wrong, it's just the people who are inquiring are maybe the wrong people, or maybe actually everything happens for a reason. And although you've had lots of inquiries, you've also been building a house and being very busy in Spain. Maybe actually now wasn't the time to have lots and lots of new bookings and maybe 20, 25 is going to look different. Who knows? I'm sure that we'll work together and work out why.
Now, you talked earlier about the importance of education and being part of communities. You're in my membership community. You mentioned Kelly Mortimer's membership community as well earlier on, and I know you're working with someone in Spain. Why do you think that people should prioritize education and being in communities just like that? It's the lifeblood of learning. Education is the lifeblood of learning. I learned that years ago as a trainer and I've just always believed in it.
I've been on the other side, I've delivered the courses. I've seen people grow and blossom from learning. And if they only take away one thing from what they do, what they've been on a training course for, then you've done your job because that one thing will just, it will just allow them to blossom. And it's just me culturally. First job was in a college. The people I worked with were in what's called the Workers Education Authority.
And we should, I mean after work we always went to night school. I've just grown up with just learning, learning, learning and take every opportunity to do that, whether it's free or paid for. You know, it's so important. Important. Nobody knows everything and you can always learn something. Yeah, that's so true. Everyone can always learn something.
And sometimes it's just that one little thing that you hear that can transform everything in your business or change something or change your direction and I think as well the community aspect of it. I don't know about you, but I find, you know, business can be quite lonely.
It's hard doing this on our own and actually finding like minded people who understand some of the highs and lows of being in this wedding industry and who have walked the path before or maybe have other ideas can be so beneficial. Have you found that to be the case? Absolutely. Well, you talked earlier on in the introduction about the wedding retreat. That was brilliant because we all had similar stories to tell.
We all had the same problems and we just discussed with other just how we'd overcome them. And you then don't feel so isolated, you don't think, well, it's only me, you know, it allows you to find your tribe and it was just, it's just great. And every opportunity I get to come on to either a group thing which for the past 12 months I've not really had because I've been doing other things. But that will change now. A problem shared is a problem halved. And I know it's corny, but it's true.
And feeling isolated and I know that from my personal experience of other things is a lonely place and it demotivates you. So therefore you're on the road to a downward spiral. So I've never gonna be there again. Personally, business Wise talking to others is just. It's just the best thing ever. It really is. And the retreat is very special.
I've done three of them now, and every single time I just love watching the relationships in the room and the people spending that real quality time together and understanding each other, who they are, where they come from, and just building each other up and encouraging it. And I think those relationships can continue to flourish even long after the retreats. Even when you don't necessarily see someone for a long time.
I see people like, recently I was out in Vegas with two people that had been on a retreat together and they hadn't seen each other since. And yet the moment they got back together, it was like nothing had changed. And they went on from there because they had that shared life experience. So what is next? Oh, sorry, go. Sorry to interrupt. And the other thing about meeting people and talking is that we didn't leave school, college, university and go, I want to go into the wedding industry.
We went into something else. And by going into something else, we developed other skills. And so when you come to meet these people at something like the wedding retreat, you suddenly find they've got skills that you. You haven't got and they can help you. Rachel Parker is a prime example of that. You know, she's. That the fact that she knows how to do what she does from previous experience has helped me in my experience here.
So it is that they have a past experience that they can bring to the party, which I always find quite helpful as well. Yeah, that is so true. I see that in my membership all of the time. People who've got website knowledge, people who understand techie things that even I don't always understand. And they can help each other. Right. I always say a rising tide raises all ships. When we help each other, we all get better.
And I love what people bring to the table and I love all of the variety of people's backgrounds and previous careers and all of the things they did to get them to that point, which makes them the super special human that they are and the great wedding business owner that they are as well. So, Denise, what is next for you? Now you're in Spain, you're settled, you've had this quite the journey. Where do you see your business going over the next couple of years? And what?
Well, over the next couple of years, my business, I see that I will be more of a wedding planner. I don't particularly want to do wedding planner and celebrant for one couple. It's either one or the other. It's impossible to do the two. And I see that I will be linked to specific venues and that's my aim, is to get myself just with specific venues rather than generalization. It's just easier, isn't it?
Just, you know what they like, you know what, you get to know the staff, you get to know the culture, you get to know what makes them tick, what things to avoid to do, things to avoid talking about, things to avoid bringing in. And so that's what I would like to just to build up those relationships with the local people, with the local venues and just get more information out there about them because there are just some fantastic places here. I want to be known as Mrs. Marara. Yeah, absolutely.
I absolutely believe you can. And you can shine a light on that beautiful area of Spain and I'm sure we will start to see more couples coming out and being in that region to get married as well. And I can't wait to see more of the photos and the style shoots and to start seeing you pushing your beautiful area of Spain. And hopefully I have actually been there before, but hopefully we can find a reason for me to come back and do some wedding business stuff where you are.
I can find you a villa for your. I can find you a villa for retreat. It's perfect. I'll send you the pictures. It's great. Yes, I definitely want to talk more about that, Denise, and if you are listening to this and you think, yeah, Becca, I'd like to come to Spain with you on a retreat, drop me a message and maybe we can make it happen. It's been so fun talking with you, Denise.
I love hearing all about your journey to see where you've come from and where you are now and how you're thriving out in Spain. It's an absolute pleasure. I always end my podcast with the same question, though. So I'm going to pose that to you now. And it's. What's one thing you wish you'd known sooner in your business?
I wished I'd known more about security on social media and I had my social media account hacked on my Instagram account and then I got asked to pay a fee just to get it back, a ransom of £8,000.
And obviously I refused and I just coming up to get just under a thousand followers and they took my whole account down and I just aligned all my social media to be known as the same name and it really knocked my confidence and it was only because I wasn't that savvy with the security system on basic how to protect my account. And I wish I'd known that a couple of years ago because I wouldn't be in the situation that I was in had I known that. So whilst it seems like a bit of a negative, it.
It's a positive. I've been off it for a while because it has not my confidence, but because I'm doing more Pinterest, I'm creating pins. Those pins can become my social media and they're more focused on where I am here. And so whilst it was a down, it's actually going to turn into something positive because there is a good outcome from it. My pot's always half full, it's never empty. Yeah, absolutely. And it is devastating when stuff like that happens.
I see people lose their account, all of the. And so a reminder to anyone listening, if you haven't locked down your accounts, make sure you've got your two factor authentication on. Make sure it's linked to your phone number. You know, sometimes we can't do anything about it. Sometimes they get around the systems, but you've got to give yourself a fighting chance. And if you don't know how to do that, please drop me a message on Instagram.
I'm more than happy to help you because I absolutely hate it when I see people lose their accounts. It breaks my heart. And I think the other lesson is that we can't build our business on borrowed land and we talk about it all of the time. Because actually, although we can protect our accounts from the hackers at any time, Instagram, Facebook, Pinterest, any of them can say to us now we don't want you anymore and shut your account down for you.
Or they could shut themselves and decide not to be in business anymore, which is why it's so important that we're in a variety of places, that we have our website, that we have our email list, so that if all our social media accounts shut down tomorrow, we can continue on in business. And I know that you're going to create something amazing on Instagram. Don't let it knock your confidence. Start again.
Become the lady in Spain who's planning these beautiful weddings on your Instagram and we'll all want to give you a follow. Deniz, it's been so fun talking to you. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you, Becca, for having me. It's been a pleasure. Such a great conversation with Denise. I just love hearing people's journeys from where she was in such a dark place to where she is now thriving out in Spain. It's such a joy.
And I think there's so many lessons we can learn from that about moving forward, about taking the leap and doing different things, and about seeing things as an opportunity. I'll see you next time.