You've got to start getting okay talking about it like a lot and you have to have your website looking like your Insta, your Insta looking like your TikTok. All the things need to look and feel similar in your communication when you start your new brand. I'm Becca Poutney, wedding business marketing expert, speaker and blogger and you're listening to the Wedding Pros who Are Ready to Grow podcast.
I'm here to share with you actionable tips, strategies and real life examples to help you take your wedding business to the next level. If you are an ambitious wedding wedding business owner that wants to take your passion and use it to build a profitable, sustainable business doing what you love, then you're in the right place. Let's get going with today's episode. Today I'm chatting to Jen Sulak, also known as Pink Hair Jen.
She's a wedding photographer and artist that welcomes the weird, celebrates imagination and creates opportunities for others to be themselves. Owner of Pink Light Images and more recently, her super niche brand, Weirdo Weddings. Jen has been in business over 17 years, having spoken on panels together at online summits and not managing to meet up in Vegas. Jen suggested we do a virtual coffee and I said let's just turn it into a podcast episode. So here we are. Jen, welcome to the podcast.
Oh, I love it when these kinds of things happen because we kept missing each other at this last convention. I know. I don't know how we managed to go through the week. I mean, I was here, there and everywhere showing up. You were here, there and everywhere showing up. And somehow our paths just didn't quite cross at the right time. Yeah, it was so funny because I know that you were having some kind of, Was it like a launching party or some kind of gathering that you had set together?
And I was literally waiting for a friend I had never met in person. And so that was the first crisscross. And then that same person that I met that night, we jumped the Stratosphere Hotel the very next day. Yeah. Which is crazy, by the way, because that is a really tall hotel and I've seen, seen the rides at the top of there. When I went up the top of there and I'm like, I'm not going on those. And I am a thrill seeker, but that is too much for me.
You know, and it's so funny, I talked to some people that were skydivers and I said, if you're a skydiver, then this is nothing. Like just go, go do the thing, whatever. You will feel like you need to do. But, oh, my God, it was so fun. So how was wedding MBA for you? How many times have you been previously? This was only my third, so. And I previously was speaking about niching I had previously basically ignored and stayed away from the wedding because it is very intimidating.
And I met these amazing people on clubhouse, and they're, like, really awesome and great business owners and connections, and they just kind of, like, helped me get out of my shell a little bit. And I started going to wedding mba, and this year was so different for me because I decided to approach it differently. I decided to do a little bit of work and attend as an, you know, just kind of, like, enjoy the classes.
So. And if for those of y'all that don't know, I am a photographer, so it's like, it's different when you put your work hat on and then you have your other hat where you're, like, circulating and enjoying yourself. But as soon as I put that workout on, I feel like I'm invisible, and I know that I'm not. But it's like I put the work hat on, and I get in the zone, and everybody else fades away. It could be thousands of people in the room, and it's just like working a wedding.
Like, everybody else fades away, and I'm just watching, waiting for the moments, capturing all the things. So that's what kind of made it interesting for me this year was. Well, first of all, meeting a friend in person I'd never met in over the last three and a half years, but also just taking initiative to satisfy my soul. Like, anything creative that I wanted to be a part of, I just kind of, like, said, let me put it out there and see who would like to work with me this year.
And I think it worked really, really well. So, yeah, it was good. I love that. I love going to mba. I also split my week, but in a different way. I was like, I'm going to do 50% working and 50% having fun. So don't tell my husband, because I told him it was 100% a work trip. But we had a lot of fun this year. I did the Grand Canyon. I met up with friends. Like, we just had a blast. Because I'm like, well, in Vegas.
Kind of got to enjoy ourselves as well as working hard, because it's all content, right? Well, first of all, you got to live your life, too. Like, I know everything is content. Everything is content. But also, at what point do you actually get to enjoy the life that you are making for yourself? And I Think that's a big thing I've learned over the last three and a half to four years.
Now that my newest friend is four years old, is if I'm not enjoying my work or enjoying my life, then I kept asking myself, what is the point of all of this if I am not enjoying it? So that is so true. Now, what interested me in that beginning part there is when you said that you think the world of weddings is intimidating or you weren't sure about stepping into wedding MBA because you found it intimidating.
And I always like to think in my little bubble that the wedding industry is one of the friendliest communities out there. So talk to me about that. Why did you find it so intimidating and how have you kind of overcome that feeling? Well, and I think this goes into my niching, I always felt like I was sort of on the outskirts anyway, because you all have to understand, as I'm not just a wedding pro, I'm a photographer. The photography has an industry.
I'm also an artist, so the artists have an industry. So I think I took a lot of hurt from all the other industries and carried it into the wedding industry because there's a lot of not nice people out there and there's a lot of people and God bless them anyway, they expect a certain standard to other pros, which doesn't always apply to some of us on the outsides. Right.
What I do for my business isn't necessarily like grandiose or considered a luxury model, but I always felt looked down upon by most people because of how I chose to do business. So it could be true, it could be not true, but it was easier to avoid it. How many of us avoid doing things that are hard because we have a set way of looking at things? Case in point, jumping the stratosphere on the outside looks very intimidating.
And. But when you start doing the research and like inching your way into learning more about it, you realize it's not as intimidating as you initially thought. But some of it has to do with your own personal perceptions. And in my case, I had a lot of inner healing to do on the way I received people into my life. And I know that you talk a lot about connection, so you understand that some people are open for connection and some people are simply not.
And for me, for years, because of that belief system in the arts world, the photography world, I literally felt like I had nothing to give the world zero because of various factors. It wasn't just my belief system. It was because, you know, you're told you're never good enough. If you don't measure up to this, this and this, then you're still not good enough. So at what point are we ever good enough? So I had a nice shift during 2020. When everything is stripped away from you, what is left you.
So you better get right with you so you can start learning and to love and appreciate who you are. And I think that's why this journey has been so satisfying is because I am okay with who I am now. I don't re. I don't think being awkward is a negative thing. I don't think being on the outskirts is a negative thing.
I honestly think there's a lot of people that are just like me that are very intimidated by a lot of different things and just are looking for a place to have friends, to have coworkers because so many of us are solopreneurs, right? Like, I don't have a giant team and I don't want one. I, I kind of want to stay as, as I am right now. And so I consider all of y'all my coworkers.
And if you've ever worked a 9 to 5 job, which I did for a lot of my life, you kind of miss having that co worker relationship where you see each other every single day, right? Like a Monday through Friday, Friday type of job. Well, for me, I'm still struggling with how do I meet with my coworkers on a consistent basis and connect with them because it is really difficult sometimes to keep up with everything and all these new relationships and the relationships you already have.
And so it's kind of interesting how things have shifted for me over these last few years now and how I felt about certain people. But like I was telling you earlier, like meeting the clubhouse people was such a great way for me to overcome anything that was holding me back from those connections in the wedding industry as a, as a whole. And what I have learned over the last four years is that there's a lot of people just like me.
And I also learn a lot about people and how they work their own professions. Like, I may never work with a whole bunch of different planners, but I love, adore and respect planners because of the things that I put myself through, planning these things, planning little escapade escapades and adventures. It's really difficult to just plan to get together with your friends. Quite honestly, it's difficult for me as a person.
All my planners are like, haha, it's easy for us, but, but I learned so much from them and I'm actually Friends with more planners than I expected to be. Like, this is so interesting to look back on how many people I've connected with that are planners. So interesting it is. And I, for one, I'm really glad you just leaned into being you and realizing that you have got a lot to give and you are worth showing up and you have got stuff to teach people.
This is audio only, but right behind me I have a print and it just says, you are enough. And I feel like every one of my listeners needs to hear that sometimes, because sometimes we feel like we're not enough. And we look online at other people and we think, oh, they have it all together. And I don't. But, you know, some of the most successful people, the people at that high end of the luxury market, sometimes I meet them and I think actually you're still, like, insecure inside.
You're still struggling. You still think you're not enough. Like, and we all do it to each other. So I'm glad that you had that revelation and you showed up as you because you do have so much to give. Now let's go back a little bit into your background because you have been a photographer a long time. How did you end up in photography and particularly in the wedding industry in the first place?
Okay, so this is a fun one because as all photographers, at least back in the day, this is probably 19 years ago that I was getting married and I had a. My first digital camera. I know you're not on video listening to this, but I still have my little 5 megapixel little camera over here in a drawer. First camera ever in the digital world. But I was always taking pictures my entire life. I was always a creative my entire life. So whatever the medium was, I would just kind of play with it.
But I never knew that you could do photography as a career. I just, it was never on my radar. It was never presented to me. Like there was a whole bunch of people out there, very successful, that I did not even know this was their profession. So what I ended up doing was grabbing my little 5 megapixel camera and I was like playing around at my friend's wedding and she really liked the handful of photos that I did at the time.
She's like, I really liked your perspective and I really liked yours better than my professional photographer. And I was like, but it's. I don't get it. Like, you know, it's just me being creative or whatever. And so from that, I just kind of like domino effect into classes here in the dfw. Area. And I took as many as I could because I already knew I did not want to go to, say, a professional college course. I'm more of the continuing education course kind of person.
I want to be six to eight weeks and done. I don't want to live in the dark room. I don't want to do all this other stuff. And at the time, like, film was starting to really kind of fade out a little bit and not as many people were pursuing it as much. Right. And so I started pursuing this world of digital photography and how to capture things and your subjects and. And I still feel like I'm learning, like, as. As much as I can.
Every single wedding day teaches me something else or reminds me of something. But, yeah, I just kind of, like, walked into it. And I think a good portion of what I did in the beginning was say yes to everything. This is not new. There's nothing wrong with saying yes to everything for a season of your life if you need to. I just didn't know what I wanted to do in photography. So as the years went on, I realized I was like, this thing just is not doing it for me.
Newborns and all the vignettes and things that people do together, all these family sessions, professional headshot kind of sessions that were very in studio and felt to me very boring. I just started, like, starting to, like, cut things off that didn't bring me that joy. And I think it took me a little too long, in my opinion. But I made it to the point where now that I've zeroed into what I really love, it's just I didn't skip anything in the process, is what I'm trying to say.
Like, I walked through it. I didn't skip it. I didn't try to go too fast. I didn't try to go too slow. I'm kind of one of those people that, like, let me figure it out on my own timing, because my pace is my pace. And so being around other photographers at that time was helpful because I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do in the photography industry in general. Like, do I make art? Do I do this? Do I do now? I've come to this place after being.
Meeting so many people and of all different walks of life and all different ways of expression and community, that I just simply love wedding photography. And there's a reason why. It's not because it is a great income or it's a great portion of income. It is because you get at least four to five different types of photography on a wedding day. So it's not boring. It is not boring at all.
So you're consistently like, okay, I've got to have a still life over here, I've got to have photojournalistic over here, I've got to have posed over here. I've got to have architecture because you got to, you know, have the signage and all the things of the architecture that their venue is. So it's like so many different things. And you have macro photography too. So you're like trying to do the rings and you're doing all this, all these little tiny things that need to be in a giant photograph.
So weddings to me, gave me everything I loved about photography and I wasn't bored doing it. And I think that's really why I niched down into wedding photography. And then on the other side of it, I have the expressive photography, which I call the conceptual work that is literally just me connecting with me and then connecting with other people. Because the ideas that I have, my clients may not want to do those.
But if I call up a friend and I say, hey, I have this really cool idea, can you go model for me? Or. I don't. I don't do self portraits. I'm not a self portrait artist. But if I have to, I will. But it's not my most fun. But like, so all these different worlds of photography started coming together to make sense and where I was going with my career. So I niched everything down into wedding photography.
Four years ago, in the wedding photography business, I niched it down again, which it's intimidating to think about that because you do have to let some things go if you're going to niche a little bit. And by that I mean you gotta let go of your expectations of certain things happening in your business, like the phone ringing off the hook as soon as you niche down. People still probably don't know who you are and what you're doing. You still have to talk about who you are and what you're doing.
And I tell people this all the time. Like, if you're wanting to go do this thing, whatever it is, whatever industry you're in, whatever things you are doing, if you don't talk about it, nobody's going to know. So I found when I found Clubhouse, I started talking a lot and I was unashamed of it. I was like, I'm owning it, I am living it, I am breathing it. This is the best thing I've ever done. And the thing that took me in the photography industry was, you know, you start to look all the same.
Anyway, your photography all starts to look the same, all the people start to look the same. And there's nothing wrong with that because I feel like everybody's got a way to get jobs and clients. But when you're really trying to niche in and you really trying to make a statement and you're really trying to be expressive about who you are, you've got to get specific and you've got to get internal about it. Because if you're just making stuff up for the algorithms, then that's not you anymore.
That's the algorithm talking, that's not you. But when you mix in who you are and the things that you love, it really does make this awesome portrait. Let's call it a portrait of your business and your life because they're all intertwined. Like you can't get away from all of it. Like if your business is your life, your life is your business and sometimes you have family and you have other things that you do. We're talking about doing fun things versus business things and all of the above.
Like it's all you. So how. Why would you deny yourself all the facets of you? Yeah, absolutely. And what's interesting about niching down, I think and when people, people niche down is it actually makes you become more memorable. And so your niche now, or has been over the last few years is you've gone for this weirdo weddings photography, which I absolutely love. But what's interesting about it is it's really memorable.
So when I saw something posted before about you taking photos @wedding MBA and it was under your actual business name, which was pink light images, I didn't actually register for ages that they were talking about you because in my head I've seen you posting about weird Barbie. That resonates with me. I've seen your pink hair. The weirdo weddings, like your brand really stands out to me. And it's really memorable because you've gone down that niche route. So tell me about widow wedding.
Where did that idea come from? And like, where are you going with it? Absolutely. So this is what's beautiful about this process. And just for anybody else listening, that if you find it intimidating, for me, this was already waiting for me. This was something that I was already living it. I just didn't have a name for it. So I have two ways that I came to this weirdo weddings aspect of my life. The first one is my art community, my art community, my fine art community.
We all call ourselves weirdos anyway, so it, it just Made sense to embrace that as a term that a lot of people would shy away from. The second thing is that I was already working in a niche industry for over 13 years and I didn't realize it like I did. But you, it's like you, it's something that seems normal to you. Like, everyday things that just, it's no big deal are actually like a big thing from somebody looking into your life.
So for me, I was already working with super niche weird people that are very creative, against the grain, very offbeat, and if you want to say UK rock and roll bride. Right, Like a rock and roll bride. Offbeat. Offbeat. Wed. All these folks, these are people that I was already kind of working with. And it just made sense when I married my art world and my wedding world.
Weirdo weddings came out of this thing of like, well, nobody else is doing this in the industry and why can't it be me to step up to do this? I said, all I'm going to do is represent myself and all of my weirdos. So it's. To me, it wasn't a big deal. It was already waiting on me. But at the same time, when I stepped into it, I was like, oh my God, this is so much bigger than me now. Like, you know how people tell you when they say dream big and you know, if it's not.
If it's, if it's not scaring you, it's not big enough. And I'm like, this is probably the biggest thing I've ever done so far. And so it's like weirdo weddings was like one of the biggest changes in my life that I have, minus me having a kid. Right? Like, that's just totally different. But it's like in the wedding industry and the photography industry and the arts industry, this is the biggest thing I've ever done so far.
So I know that one of the things that people are scared about when it comes to niching down is they think, well, if I go like hard into a niche like you have, that I'll probably get less work or maybe less people want to book me, or maybe people will think I'm weird. Like, I'm guessing you had some of those same thoughts. Has that been the case? Or do you feel like it was absolutely the best decision you'd ever made? Okay, there's an answer to both of those.
Because you will have less phone calls than you think you will. Now, it doesn't mean that maybe your niche is different than what I'm doing. If you think about it, your Your niche is your niche. You gotta figure out how that looks for you. For me, I had to be okay with stepping forward and talking about this. Second of all, I'm sitting here thinking to myself, we were talking about insecurity earlier. I had so much confidence and insecurity, depending on the day.
Like, I felt like it was wavering between the two, because how intimidating is it to walk into a wedding industry anything and be like, these people are not going to take me seriously. There is no way they're going to take me seriously. And so I came into it with the knowing about 50% we're going to immediately rejoice, celebrate, and really be excited. And then the other 50% are just going to either walk away or have nothing to do with me. And I think that's the world in general.
I have pink hair, y'all. I'm used to not getting hired because I have pink hair. I know it. Nobody says it, but I know that they have. It's happened. It's happened. You're not taken seriously if you look a certain way sometimes. And so I felt like it wasn't. Like, I didn't know it was there, but I didn't let it become a factor to them not hiring me. My point was, is how do we get to our dream clients? Your dream clients are after you. They're not after a look.
So I had already walked through the pink hair aspect, so now I had to add on the weirdo weddings, knowing that I was more concerned about the wedding industry than my clients. My clients already freaking love me, okay? They already know who I am. They love the name, they love me. But the wedding industry, like, how in the world does that look for me walking into this? It's very intimidating, and it still kind of is some days. But you know what? Just like, jumping off the stratosphere hotel.
I'm here for it. I'm going to keep jumping off in my own way. Not always doing the stratosphere, but I feel like this. What this journey is, is that I'm consistently leaping into these places where I'm standing up for myself, my business, my clients, because I could care less if anybody in the industry really liked me. They just might be. Want to tolerate me, that's fine. But I had. I know a lot of people that really, genuinely love me. Like, and I love them.
And I think that's where I'm going with this, is that I want to continue to make connections with people that really want to do something in their life and their business that is more Purpose driven than ever before. Because we can always just try to do the status quo. But if you're. If you're not doing something that really challenges you and pushes you out of your personal comfort zones, I mean, what are we here for?
What are we here for if we're not making a difference in our communities and our connections? Because it really, it boils down to community, honestly, if it's not with our clients. And that's when our fellow vendors and wedding pros and other people of our little literal community, our neighborhoods. Right. So at all. Yeah. The thing is though, as well, I think, so sometimes it's so big in our head because we think, well, I've got pink hair, so half the people in this room won't like me. Right?
But you could walk in with my blonde hair, and half of the people in the room won't like you either. Like, so much of it's in our own head. And, you know, we could reach out to five people for a coffee, in a chat, and four of them might ignore us, and one of them comes back to us. It just, it just helps us to filter the people out that aren't our people. And when you do it in a strong niche, like, way like you have, then it just does that faster.
And actually, we don't need to waste our time on the people that don't want to be seen with us because they don't like how we look or how we dress or how we are, because the people that do will really like us. Like, I'm not for everyone. I stand on stage and I tell people I love musical theater and I love Disney. And some people are probably like, who is this child? But the people who are my people come straight up to me and they're like, I love musical theater. I'm a Disney nerd, too.
Like, I love it. And so I just find my people quicker. And one of the biggest breakthroughs I've had in my business, Jen, is that I went to a talk with this lady called Carrie Wilkerson, and she said this sentence in the talk, and it's resonated me. She said, most of us are worried about what they think. But ask yourself, who is this imaginary they, after all? Because actually, it's so true. Because we're like, oh, I don't want to post. Exactly.
I don't want to post that on Instagram, because what will they think? I don't want to put this out on my business because what will they think? Think? But actually, when it boils down to it no one cares that much and they doesn't exist. And like she said in this talk, she's like, if they're not paying your bills, why do we care so much about what they think? And so when you fun. That is so fun to think of it that way. Because, you know, I say this all the time too.
I'm like, who are they and what are they thinking? What are they doing? And it's like, especially in the photography industry, you're just like, okay, so they say that this makes a good photo. They say, I'm just like, you know what, I just want to make a photo. Just leave me alone. I don't care what they say. Yeah, exactly, exactly that. Now there'll be people listening to this and thinking, okay, Jen, you've clearly found your niche, you're really happy in it.
But I'm struggling to find my niche and where I fit in. Have you got any advice to people in how they should go about really drilling that down and thinking about where they should go with their business niche? You know, not all of us can have another pandemic hit that strips us of everything.
And I think, think wherever you are right now, if you were affected anyway by that year or two, three years now for some of us, if you were affected by that and you didn't make changes, I would say take yourself back to that stripped down place of I'm a human being, I want to do something in this world. I need to find out what it is. And I'm telling you, you cannot skip the process. Though, unfortunately, there are no 10 steps steps programs, there are no set recipes.
You have to go out and seek what's going on inside of you that is not satisfying, that is sucking the life out of you. You need to sit down and do the hard work. And that can look like you locking yourself in a room for a certain time amount per day to, until you get to it, until you uncover it. And I tell a lot of people, maybe you've been sitting on this idea and you think it's stupid or in my case, a little too weird.
I say explore that because that it could be the thing that is launching you into another phase. And it may come in a package that you just don't understand right now. Or maybe you're, you just think it's too small. You know what? No step is too small. No step is too small. Right now the world actually needs you to step up and that means that you've got to do the work to get there. And I think that's why I'm here is because I sat down and I did the work.
I stripped everything away and asked myself the hard questions about what do I need to do with my life right now and how can I get there to do it? Because there's so many different ways you can do it, but I guarantee you, it's just waiting on you. So you need to step up and go do it. And I know that sounds easier, easier said than done, but once you get out of your own way and stop writing the reasons why you can't do it, you'll find yourself. We do this in the art world.
We give ourselves permission to create. Because if you do not, you're going to wither away and you're not going to get the things out that need to come out.
But if you are dedicating the time and energy to actually seeking what is inside of you and uncovering it instead of covering right back up, you're going to find that fulfillment and you're going to find less stress and you're going to find more happiness, honestly, when you're actually setting out to do the things that are inside of you versus ignoring them. In my case, I hid it for really long time. I was like, I don't. I don't feel like I'm good enough.
I don't feel like I have this, this and this. Once you start moving past that and realize that your voice matters, that's when you're going to end up on platforms like this. You're going to end up, like, on platforms in your community talking to people more about what you're doing because you genuinely love it and you're ready for it. You're ready for it now.
One of the things I see people making mistakes on in this area, I'd love your insight on this, is that they say to me, becca, I've decided I'm going to niche down and I'm going to go after this niche. And then they're so scared of doing it that they just do a tiny, tiny little bit of it. And so it just gets lost in their wider brand. So they say, I'm going to be the weirdo weddings person. And then I go on their website and their website looks like every other photographer I've ever seen.
And I'm like, well, you're not showing it. So how have you tried to kind of throw your niche, throw your brand at everything you do, rather than just do that tiny little bit which just gets lost? Okay, so this is. This is one of my signature talks and I'm going to give you all a little bit of insight on the practical side. Okay, so. So you decided to start a niche. Okay, great. What if you're not a high volume anything? What if you're a person who only takes 12 to 15 weddings a year?
Weddings and events. You're not doing 40 plus. Okay. Guess what I had to do. I felt like I had to do styled shoots. Not only did I do styled shoots, but I did 19 in one year. And I just, I did the math on that and I was like, oh my God, like, this is nuts. But you know what it did? It opened up a whole world of potential. So when you're trying to communicate who your client is, you can set up your ideas that are not under the constrictions of your clients and let yourself dream things.
And when you get together with a team of wedding pros that are ready to do that with you, especially for those who do the same thing over and over and over again and they want to do a new idea, those are your people. Get with a floral designer who is so tired of just doing the same thing for 20 years, let them go explore a couple of floral ideas they've never done before. And then all of a sudden it's like another Domin effect with you and your fellow pros.
You're just sitting here like, what can we do next? What can we do that makes sense for all of us to dip into this next thing? And so if you're not putting it forward in your imagery or the way you talk, then that you're not really committed to it yet. But what I did is I had to go all in. I had to have as much content as possible to start talking to my people right away. And this doesn't always need to be for everybody else. So don't necessarily follow my recipe.
But if you have content and you don't, if you don't have enough content, you have to do something about that. If you do not have enough showing on your website. My friend Mark got onto me for at least two years about not having enough of a weirdo wedding couple on my website. Do you know why I was afraid to let go and thinking I was abandoning my original brand. And I think I mentioned earlier that when you niche down, you have to be okay with letting something go.
It's. It's like you said, pink light images is still there. It's just not on the forefront of my mind when I'm talking about things. Weirdo weddings becomes forefront because it's my, my Baby, it's my newest thing. It's the thing that is reaching the world right now.
So when you are just tiptoeing into this brand or whatever things you're going to start doing, you've got to start getting okay, talking about it like a lot and you have to have your website looking like your Insta, your Insta looking like your TikTok. All the things need to look and feel similar in your communication when you start your new brand. Some of the easiest things you'll figure out when you start to expand or niche down.
I say expand your brand, AKA niching down is you're going to find that it's so much easier to talk about it because it's so much more you, your brand that's already going, it's probably self sustainable and you don't even realize it. Like maybe you've already had this brand for 15 years. Oops, sorry. Already had this brand for 15 years and you're worried about losing clients you already have when you're already, you're. That brand's already going, it's already a machine.
So why wouldn't you just let it be what it is? Go explore, set aside some time, set a time, set aside some time for even new content if you need it. Especially for me being weird at weddings, I needed content right away for various reasons. I needed to speak to my clients right away and I needed to let the wedding industry know that I wasn't some kind of, I don't know, weirdo trying to come in. I wanted to be taken seriously, right?
I wanted to be taken seriously that this was not a joke and I feel like I've done really well proving that I'm not a joke and that I'm, I'm a serious business person. I'm serious about my craft, I'm serious about connection. And I think when you take those steps to put the effort into that expansion of what you're trying to do, then you're not hiding again. You don't, don't try to hide again because you're. Your first inclination is to just do what you were always doing.
But with this new niche or whatever you're trying to go into, you can't always just do the same thing over and over again. You've got to open yourself up for the new things that are coming, open yourself up a little bit more. And actually when I talk to people about content creation, go into these things that you haven't shared with the world and start sharing that love it so.
Much as a marketer this makes my heart sing because I'm always saying to people, I'm like, people can't buy what they can't see. So if you want to do more weirdo weddings, or if you want to do more destination weddings, or if you want to do some crazy floral display, you need to show it to them first so that they can buy it. And worrying about what they think again. You know, you hear sometimes people saying, don't do styled shoots. Styled shoots aren't very good marketing.
I say, if you want to be creative, do a style shoot. Don't worry about what anyone thinks, what anyone says. That is the best way for you to. To get content. Don't wait for someone to pay you to do that work, because they probably never will. And enjoy it and lean into it, and you don't even have to pretend, oh, this was a real wedding. You can say, I was getting creative, but what you will be doing is creating content. So, yes, I'm on board with it.
Not only that, styled shoots and things like that. You have to remember you're trying to help your clients get inspired, too. Like, it's not even just about you. You have to realize your clients actually want inspiration. They want you to help them, whether or not whatever you're doing in the wedding piece. I find myself talking to my clients about their theme. Like, if you're having a theme, then let's talk about it. Let's get creative with it.
And if I've done, say, a Wizard of Oz or an Alice in Wonderland photo shoot to help them refine what they want for their Alice in Wonderland wedding, then I've done my job, too, as a photographer, as a visual artist. I've helped my client find more ideas, not just on Pinterest, but like me doing something tangible to help other people. Believe it or not, I think. I really think the styled shoots do help others get inspiration. Just not just people, but the wedding pros themselves.
Like I said, it's. It's something about stepping out of your normal, everyday thing that helps you get inspired and rejuvenate in your craft, whatever it is. So, so true. Now, the other thing that I talk about a lot is being unapologetically yourself, being authentically you. And you definitely lean into this, but I know it's something people feel frightened about. So how have you shown up as yourself more? You've put yourself as the front and center of your brand.
Now how have you done that more? And how have you overcome again that fear of showing up? Okay, people, let me get really real with y'all. The fear will always be there. Okay? Just get over it now. The fear is always going to be there. And a friend of mine once said, and I love this analogy, is that she's like, fear and doubt wakes me up almost every single day. I just don't let them drive the car, right? Like, you get in the car, you don't have them driving the car.
They're just in the backseat. And if you've had kids, then, you know, screaming kids and toddlers, they'll make noises and do all things in the car. So I, like, think of it like that. Like, you can't ever get past it. Every single time I go to a big event or something as big as wedding, MBA is like, the biggest event I'll ever go to. Well, no, I take that back. I went to the Renaissance festival that had 50,000 people, but you know what I mean? It's like fear will always be there.
So you can't let that be dictating your every single life decision. So if you're always basing it in fear and doubt, then you'll never get to the place you're going. But when you wake up every day knowing that you have this purpose, that you know that somebody can't ever take it away from you and that it calls you at night, it's bigger and louder than the fears and the doubts, then that is the stuff. That's how you get up every day and you remind yourself that, I'm here for this thing.
I have signed up for it, and I own it. A lot of people say you'll see that a lot these days, that people owning who they are, owning their brand, owning whatever. It's not just about ownership. It's like you are walking in it. It is. You are solid. And actually, this goes into a good tattoo story, so because for some of us who like getting tattoos, sometimes they're visual representations of things that we need to remind ourselves of.
And if you like notes all over your office, if you've got sticky notes, you've got stuff in your bathroom mirrors, a tattoo will remind you about you if you've designed it the way that you've designed it. So I designed a tattoo specifically that I can look at to remind me how grounded I am and who I am. But this wasn't always the case. I wasn't always as open. I was probably the shyest kid in school. I was probably the quietest out of all of them. I was just like, let me just get my work done.
I don't need to connect with people, it's fine. I'm just whatever. But I think once you kind of like figure out first of all how you grew up, how you connected with people then, and knowing that deep down we all need connection, we all need love, we all need to be seen. And I think as I've uncovered who I am and let the world see who I am, I've definitely been a happier person. Like, covering yourself up and hiding under masks is a really hard life to live.
Nobody will probably admit that, but it is. It's really, really difficult. You can easily go to darker places, too, if you feel like you have nothing to give the world. And I say look for the light in that because there's always a way out. If you haven't seen a way out yet into who you are.
And knowing that everything that has brought you up to, to this point, including how you were raised, including your home life, including the jobs you used to have, I started embracing all of that about myself because, yeah, I had a corporate job. Yeah, I was good. I was going to aviation camp. I mean, I was that little nerd that was going to like, watching space camp. Like, could I be an astronaut? You know, I realized, no, I couldn't. But I still. The dreaming aspect, right?
The dreaming aspect and the creativity that I've walked through my, my entire life matters to who I am now. And I think embracing all of who you are is the key to getting up every single day and being authentic. And you don't have to. You don't have to yell at people to get to see you. You just need to be. You don't worry about being seen all the time. Just worry about being who you are and communicating it the best way you can. If it is through art.
For all the love of everything, greatness, please make your art. If that's something you do on the side and you have your side insta, I have that. Like, I have a way to express myself that is beyond any industry. And I think that's what's beautiful about us as human beings is that we have the opportunities to do that. So get up every day and do it, whatever it looks like. Today I have a few things I'm going to work on today. I have a. I have this.
Everybody who knows me knows I wear some kind of blue man blue. I'm a huge blue man group flu man group fan. And unfortunately, as we're on this recording, they're about to close their New York City and Chicago venues. And it's very devastating. As a fan. But what I'm doing right now, and this goes into what I'm doing with weirdo weddings, is that this niche over here that I love and adore, I'm putting and giving attention to it. I have the time to do that. Right?
We have the time to sit with our community and love on each other because we have this thing that's happening in our lives, and we're creative and we're loving, and we're just embracing all of who we are as fans of, like you said earlier, earlier, Disney and theater. Right? Okay. Blue Man Group is my. One of my biggest passions for 28 years, and I'm about to lose a piece of my heart. And so I'm making art out of that.
And I really hope that all of you out there, when you are going through this life knowing that every part of you matters, no matter how nerdy it sounds, there's somebody else out there that connect that connects with you on it. I guarantee it. I have found more Blue Man Group fans just by sharing about it than I have in the last 28 years. It's so true, though, because then people, again, people don't know what you're into if you don't tell people that you're into it.
And then you find connection. One of the things I think about showing up as yourself authentically online is I think actually when we don't do it, sometimes we're actually doing a disservice to others because, you know, all those years you didn't show up as you compared to now, you do it. Like, think how many people have learned from you or are inspired by you or see you being you and realize they can be them.
And so I think when we take the light off of ourselves and realize we're not doing this content creation to say, look, hi, I'm Becca and I'm amazing. Like, that's not what we're about, right?
But when you realize, actually, if I don't show up with this marketing advice, if I don't show up and say it's okay to, like, have a crazy life because you've got kids doing this and you're trying to run a business, and it's not always plain sailing, and, you know, I'm just flying in economy, I'm not flying in business class, if I don't show up as me, then that's having a negative impact on other people.
And I think when we take the spotlight off ourselves, it releases some of that pressure of, I can't do this. And it Makes you realize. Realize I have to do this. That is very important, what you just said. Yeah, I have to do this. It's no longer about hiding. It's about being everything. Everything that you were created to be and do. And I just. I really love that because the more. And the more you get into it, the more you can't stop. You're like, what else can I uncover today?
What else can I. What else can I talk about today? It's so true. So true. Now, the last part of this conversation I want to have with you, Jen, kind of goes back to something you talked about right at the beginning, and it's about finding your people. Because for me, I think in this world of the wedding industry, it is important for us to find the right people, to find our communities.
And recently, I've had a bit of a revelation that I'm not going to go into too much, that actually there are parts of the wedding industry that maybe aren't for me. Right. Because I think I love everyone. I love connection. I love chatting with people. But there's been rooms I've been in or places I've been in where I realized these people aren't authentic because they're pretending to be something they're not or they're.
You know, I hate going into a room and asking people how business is, and they say everything's wonderful. Right. That's not the room I want to be in. I want to be in the rooms where people are like, actually, it's kind of tough right now, and I'm tearing my hair out. So how have you gone about finding your people and what freedom has it given to you now? You know who your people are, you. Know, and this is going to be another ongoing journey for everybody listening.
This is always ongoing because like I said, I feel like I'm only four years old. Old. Four years old, Right. Like, I've literally opened myself up over the last four years. So I find that I'm with you there, Becca. I. I don't want to go in there and have surfacey conversation, and that's really difficult because so many people are hiding behind everything. And so when I do find these people, I'm going to mention this again.
My clubhouse people, we were so honest, open, and real with each other that I immediately know I can sit and have a conversation with them and it's going to be real. When I go into rooms that I don't know, I've gotten to the point where I can figure out how and where I need to go. Like there's so many. You don't need to connect with 50 people necessarily. Sometimes it's just the one or the two that for various personalities, there's extroverts, there's introverts, I'm in between.
So some days I don't want to talk to anybody. So I just listened, listen. And if I genuinely have a connection, then I start a conversation, right. It's like it's one of those things where you're always seeking your people. But sometimes you just need to just have that being okay to just be listening for a while and see who is genuine and who's not. Because eventually who's not so genuine it'll show in the fruit of their lives, no matter what. And the facade is only.
You can only keep that up for so long. But when you're finding the genuine people sometimes, and I hate to say it, but no, I don't hate to say it, I love to say it, that you'll just know when you know, when you're around them, you'll feel it. And especially if you're sensitive to it and you're open to like. Yeah, sometimes you have to walk in open. You have to realize you can't be closed off in certain areas. I did a whole talk about this too, about how you can have just be open and open.
I called it open handed about the connections that you want to make. And, and also you're also simultaneously navigating your headspace of say everybody doesn't like me or everybody. You know, that's a, that's a headspace that you have to kind of like navigate as well when you go into these places.
So I, I'd like to say that I'm still on the journey of finding my people because I feel like I have been so guarded for so long that it has been harder to make friends and it's harder to let people in. And there's nothing wrong with that. So that's another thing that you have to own. Like if that's who you are right now and you've been hurt and you've had a lot of things happen to you in any industry, it's definitely harder to let your guard down.
But what I can tell you on the other side of it is that a lot of times it's very worth it because that one person could be completely life changing. And I think that's important to think about that, is that no matter how much you've been hurt, there's always a way to be healed. And also walk into new Relationships that give you the most, most satisfying relationship you've ever had in your whole life. Like, people that genuinely love you. And that's hard for some of us who've been hurt.
And I know that's really deep, but I don't. I don't. I don't play. I don't really play. Like, it's really hard. It's. You have to own that it's really hard and give yourself just a little bit of grace. Every time you go to an event and you didn't think you did as well as you thought you did, right? I have some events coming up that I'm already in my head about it, right? I'm like, what am I doing? I don't know what I'm doing, but I'm like, but, Jen, talk to yourself, right?
Like, just remember, stay open for opportunity and then just see where the connections lead you. Going in with little to no expectation to an event is always a good idea. And to that point, I think what you're talking about, yes, it is deep, but it's important that we talk about these things is if there's people listening. I want to encourage you.
If you are in a space, even within the wedding industry, that makes you feel unhappy, makes you feel uncomfortable, makes you feel unworthy, know there are other places, there are other people, because, you know, sometimes someone will join my community and they'll say, oh, like, I spent three years in a community that just made me feel bad about myself. I didn't realize there was other places.
So if that's you, if you're in a place and you think, these aren't my people, this is not feeling good. I feel like I'm just feeling bad about myself or I feel like they're putting me down all the time. There is freedom. You have autonomy to go and find a different space, go hang out in a different place. Because the wedding industry isn't one dimensional. It's not all the same kind of people.
Even though from the outside it may look like that there's a whole lot of different people and there's a whole lot of lovely people in the industry that you can find. It's very true. Like I said, where would I be without my clubhouse fam? Because they genuinely gave me something they didn't think I. You know, they probably don't even still understand how greatly they impacted my life. To let me know there were nice people in the wedding industry. And I was like, it's genuine connections.
It wasn't somebody trying to get something from somebody Else it wasn't so and so trying to use, use you for leverage and just use for all this stuff or be really nice to your face and talk behind your back. Like, these are genuine people that I really have connected with and I just, I love them and I look forward to meeting more. Like for you, for meeting. I wanted to meet you, Becca, in person. But I was like, you know what, we'll have our chance again. We will. I'm sure we will.
Maybe back in Vegas next year. If we're both there, we'll definitely do it or another time, I'm sure. So Jen, what is next for you? You've done so much over the last few years. What are your big dreams for next year and beyond? So I am continuing with my wonderful Weirdo Weddings brand, but I'm also, you're going to see me out here as Pink Hair Jen speaking. So it is one thing that I've been telling you on this talk is using your voice is important.
So whatever you're representing, it could be on a stage, it could be a one to one, it could be in a clubhouse room. There's so many different ways that I wanted to show up for my people and that is on a couple of stages this next year. So I will be doing that as well as continuing to find and work with all of my wonderful weirdo people. So yeah, you know, exploring the speaking industry is a whole other another industry in itself.
And I'm just really enjoying the opportunities to continue to share pieces of my story, which really intertwines with my business and my life and how I see the world. And then also this is a little sneak peek for some of y'all out there. But some of y'all don't know how crazy of an artist I really am. So you haven't seen my artistic work, but I'm going to tell you now that I'm going to start infusing that into some of my talks because I think it's important to not hide any aspects of myself.
I'm going to start embracing all of it. Even if nobody likes it or cares. I just, I don't care. I'm going to show you. And people are really starting to resonate with my art. So I'm very excited to share pieces of myself that next year. So I love that and I can't wait to see some of that as well. Jen, I always end my podcast interviews with the same question. So we're going to do that one now, which is what's one thing you wish you'd known sooner in your own business.
I think this conversation, if I wished I had known there were more genuinely nice, authentic people out there, I probably would have been out of my shell a little sooner. So I think that that's something I really wish I would have had a little sooner. That revelation of how amazing people are and how genuine some of us are out there loving on each other. So that's def.
Because I think that transcends beyond all things like all your business, all your life, all your communities is just connecting with genuine people who they are and in turn it kind of infects you to do the same. So kind of wish I had that one a little sooner, but it's just, it's awesome. You've got it now and you're not enough for it. I totally am. Totally. Jen, if people want to find out more about you, about your work, about your art, where's the best places for them to find you?
Well, you can always go to my website. You know, it's you can go to weirdo weddings.com and kind of like explore everything about my website. But also my instas. I have every time you go to any of my instas they are all cross connected with each other. So if you go to Weirdo Weddings or Pink Hair Jen, you'll see my Pink Light Images art page as well as my initial Instagram page that I don't even use that much.
But you'll still see a lot of my past work or current work or things that I'm starting to talk about in all of my industries. So yeah, fantastic. And I'm sure that there'll be some of my clients as well that want to reach out to you because they are definitely in the similar kind of niche and I'm sure they'll love to connect and find out more about how you're leaning to it. Jen, it's been such a pleasure. I'm sad it wasn't in person, but it will be soon. Thank you so much for your time.
Time. Absolutely. What a fantastic conversation with Jen. I just love talking about being authentically yourself and leaning into that. If you are hiding behind a mask, let me encourage you to lean into yourself and if you're wearing a mask to take it off, be unapologetically you. I'm so thankful to Jen for being so gracious to allow us to record our catch up post Wedding mba and I'm sure that you guys have enjoyed it as well. I'll see you next time.