Note: We use AI transcription so there may be some inaccuracies
Danielle Cobo: Are you ready to unleash the potential of yourself and others? In this episode, we reveal this secret ingredient that sets effective leaders apart. Fear, learn how embracing your fears can be a powerful tool to becoming an exceptional lean, one who unlocks immense possibilities for transformation. Our guest today is Adrian Keer, a leadership engagement expert in senior partner at the executive coaching firm, take new ground.
Danielle Cobo: He coaches, executives, and entrepreneurs in the art and science of leadership for the. Their teams and clients to create new, unprecedented results and experience fulfillment in their work.
Danielle Cobo: Well, Adrian, I am excited to have you on the podcast today. Before we jumped off, we talked a little bit about your background, which is very diverse, share with our listeners where did you start and what led you to do you're doing now, speaking on leadership.
Adrian Koehler: first off, thanks for having me, Danielle.
Adrian Koehler: You're awesome. Excited to connect with this community I think we all. are always for some kind of dream job. And It's great to strive. So I assume my first answer to the question was I've always been a bothered person. And if people looking for a dream job, there must be something that's bothering them about the one they got right now.
Adrian Koehler: And I say fuel that because probably like a small frustration is the to manage frustrated in life is usually where there's some latent vision,unspoken vision, and I'd say fuel it and listen to the frustration and exacerbate it so you can really get that, there's something worth pursuing.
Adrian Koehler: So anyway, I'm excited to be on this Dream Job podcast and thanks for having me. got me to this, I have always been a bothered person. I didn't like take a vote on that. When I woke up in life as a kid, I wanted things to be great. always very involved and came from good stock, My parents were both school teachers, small town kid out of Illinois, they were always leading. it was baked into me to like be a part of the solution, not a part of the problem. I heard my mother say that a thousand times a day probably, it was always a challenge in that way, and my mind was always that way.
Adrian Koehler: Like, what's supposed to be happening now? Who's in charge here? What are we my mind's always been racing about the potential in any kind of moment in. time And I don't take credit for this, but I always like noticed people, I found human beings to be the most fascinating thing in the.
Adrian Koehler: world And even myself, like I didn't know how all this machinery worked between my ears. I know it had thoughts and feelings. I didn't know where they came from, didn't know how to generate them, didn't know what to do with them necessarily. in my family, I was like the deep one Ade They call me Ade when I was growing up. Ade you're always so deep or you're always so philosophical or always so psychological. I got that like at the age of eight or something. I've just been that guy. And quick on the background. Yes, diverse is a nice way of saying it kind of all over the place is also another way of saying it.
Adrian Koehler: I always just followed my passions. I was good at science, loved science. And loved people. I went to college to play football and picked up a, was like a pre-med guy. I didn't know what I wanted to be, didn't think I even wanted to be a doctor necessarily. But I was in that track. And then finally, after fully investigating it, I'm like, I don't wanna do another seven years of school.
Adrian Koehler: what are we talking about? and I wasn't that data driven. I mean, I'm interested in that, but that's not what got me up in the morning. It was like studying things from afar. I liked being in the trenches and being close to them. So I serendipitously, or whatever you wanna say. I had a room. In college.
Adrian Koehler: He was a nursing major, which I'd never thought about before at all. But he was a nursing major and his dad was a nurse, an ER nurse in Gary, Indiana. And I thought, that's interesting. This guy like sees real deal stuff all day long. could maybe get into that. So when I picked up a nursing degree in college and thought I'd go travel the world and eventually did, But I, worked in a children's hospital in Chicago after undergrad and loved it.
Adrian Koehler: Worked with families in the worst of situations, Living out their biggest nightmare and got the privilege of being a person in the space to help them find themselves, help them find reality. Help them find hope, help them find the next effective step. Help them hopefully find a miracle in the context of chaos.
Adrian Koehler: And I loved that. It was great, and I did that for a couple years. I came from a faith background, growing up and that became more vitalized for me over time. That kind of ditched all the religious stuff and really connected to the spirituality of it. Anyway, long story short, moved out to Los Angeles where I live now, 17 plus years ago.
Adrian Koehler: And, came to be a part of a church out here. heard a guy named Irwin speak and thought, oh, this guy has the music. I want to get connected to this guy in my twenties. And I always knew I liked leaders. I liked leaders that could articulate vision, that could help him describe reality in a way that's approachable.
Adrian Koehler: And Irwin is world class at that. And so I came out to be a part of that. And I was always, activism is what faith was about for me. So mobilizing myself to go make a difference in the community. And I really enjoyed. Opportunity to mobilize other people into meaning. And so I'd build teams that's fancy code, word for I'd, build leadership teams and then send them out into the nonprofit world.
Adrian Koehler: We had about 3000 people in the church, so about 2000 people a year would go out and do something that made a difference for them, made difference for others. That was usually the pitch, but I knew that the ROI would be for them as well. I'd say to anybody, give me an hour of your week and I will, give you what you're talking about at the next dinner party.
Adrian Koehler: It's gonna be the biggest highlight of your week. So anyway, we did lots of great stuff and fast forward, I took teams overseas to do philanthropic type work and disaster relief type stuff. When Haiti was happened, I took a team of doctors down there When Pakistan was underwater, our doctor and I went to go set up health clinics and anyway, long story.
Adrian Koehler: through that met a guy who wanted to give a lot of money away. He had his own kind of spiritual process and epiphany, and I was just his friend and the guy that was a guide and a friend to him during that process. he wanted to give a lot of his money away. He asked me to leave the church and set up a foundation for him, which I did.
Adrian Koehler: Took him around the world. He ended up caring for, or caring about giving people a second chance who had really blown it. So we worked in the prison long story short, we worked with lifers. These were all people that had done really heinous crimes when they were younger, and they were probably 40, 45 by the time I met them.
Adrian Koehler: And I met a guy s. Who had been a leadership consultant by day and on the weekends he did interventions with kids coming outta the juvenile justice. And I hired him immediately cuz he was very captivating. He's my business partner now. His name's Dan Tini. He's like, if Yoda and Mother Theresa and Tony Soprano had a baby, that's Dan Tini.
Adrian Koehler: He's a unique individual. And I just learned from him, I loved it. And I could see how he could, move a person in a second, he could move a room intensely. And I thought that's, the type of influence I want to be able to help people in that way, in a very expedited way. So that was like moving into the transformational leadership.
Adrian Koehler: did that for a couple years and loved it. And then what I wanna do next, cuz I love variety. could have done ministry type work, could have done philanthropy type work, could have done lots of different things. through that process, I'd gone through coaching work and trainings and academies and all that just to get better at being a leader.
Adrian Koehler: And I thought, oh, I'll just start coaching people. So that was about, 12, years ago when I just started coaching. And feeling very underqualified to do it. and as it is when you get started, you have all that I'm a fraud story. anyway, it's worked. So I've been in this work for that many years and end up coaching a lot of people and big companies and, now we focus on coaching founders of companies and training their teams.
Adrian Koehler: And, that's how I got into.
Danielle Cobo: I can see how in each area within your career, it's led to this next step into where you're at today working with people in the hospital. And that's exactly what you said, cuz I had shared with you my babies were NICU babies. And it's that hope that's all you want is that there's gonna be hope that they're gonna make it through.
Danielle Cobo: That's right. And then going into philanthropy work. And there's nothing more fulfilling than helping other people in need. . and then as you're saying, going into transformational leadership, from your experience in working with CEOs, business owners and individuals, what do you find to be the secret to transformational leadership?
Danielle Cobo: Exceptional leadership? What are those key qualities that you see?
Adrian Koehler: were to connect to an essential first one really is honesty. And I don't mean like do they tell the truth, but are they committed to being truthful, which is, the truth, a component of being truthful.
Adrian Koehler: exceptional leaders, of course, they gotta be smart. Of course they gotta be skilled. if they have some people skills. if you're gonna lead other people, Especially in this day and age and where we're headed. I mean, it's been that way for the last 10 years.
Adrian Koehler: Least gonna be that way at an exponential level is do people wanna follow you? no longer in this top down culture, which we know for sure now. people question leaders more than ever, and that's not gonna go away. I think is great because it's actually gonna require integrity and leadership.
Adrian Koehler: most of the time when people talk about integrity, they actually mean perfect. are honorable all the time and you have this impeccable record? I hope that as a species, as a culture, we get over the idea that everybody's got their head together because we don't, and we, might want to be angels, but we're just a mix.
Adrian Koehler: We're an angelic and demonic simultaneously, at least. I've known that for myself. mixed bag and we judge other people by a standard we'd hate to be judged by. that might be just human, it might be just be normal for us to do that, and maybe we do it so we can aspire or whatever.
Adrian Koehler: Are they committed to living a truthful life? they both, really honest about where they're headed and are they clear as a bell about the future? Great. Exceptional leaders better be. that are they willing to be rigorously honest with current reality about what's happening and what's working, what's not working, and what's wanted and needed.
Adrian Koehler: That's how we think about it. also Leaders are really great at paying attention to the people around the anecdotal condition is that will, build a team, but then use the team. And treat them like tools I'm paying you to get this thing done instead for exceptional leaders.
Adrian Koehler: results for salary or results for commission. We are doing That's true. But exceptional leaders get the fact it's always a volunteer if somebody works for me, they'll can go work for somebody else immediately. And what's it take to keep somebody, especially keep somebody that's, great They better believe that I become the person I want to become while working here.
Adrian Koehler: exceptional leaders can set that vision for them and really align personal interests the, employee or of their team with corporate interests. they do that methodically and continuously. And so they know what's going on for someone. They know what their background of concerns are, both in the workplace and at home.
Adrian Koehler: thank God we're moving much more towards like an integrated view of work and life instead. We went from not talking about it at all to talking about this work-life balance thing, which is a zero-sum game and a fool's errand. It's a work-life integration that's necessary. if you do it really well, where it's like I do have a home life that I about and I'm unapologetic about my commitments to my wife and my kids, and real for me.
Adrian Koehler: And also, I'm really committed to work. And this is how this looks like. I'm committed to my teammates. I'm committed to these results. I'm committed to this industry or these clients or whatever. And all those are a concert that.
Adrian Koehler: overlaps I gotta train both sides of that aisle to honor what's needed on both sides. great leaders get that and they actually want humans to work with them, and they are vulnerable about their own process and share what's really going on for them. can inspire beyond the challenges, which I'd probably say maybe is the third point, is that they want to see the challenges.
Adrian Koehler: They want to see them early, they want to know about them in hyper color detail. And they've got this grid about. them They wanna take on a challenge, like bring it on is how they come into the world.
Danielle Cobo: There's an example of exactly what you're saying. I was working with an organization recently and they took some of their top performers, some of their newer performers or the newer employees that they brought into the organization and they brought them into this.
Danielle Cobo: Mastermind group and they said, we want to know everything, the good, the bad, the ugly. What are the resources that are working? What's not working? What resources do you need? And they sat them in this room for several hours and just let them have at it. There was sticky notes all over the walls. And then what they did is,the next day.
Danielle Cobo: that evening, the executive leadership team came together, wrote down all of the notes, and then the next day presented to them and said, okay, we've heard you we're listening. We acknowledge the pitfalls and this is what we're gonna do about it. they even said, they took three different kind of whiteboards on the stage and they said, are the challenges that we hear from you that are not working right now.
Danielle Cobo: Here's what we're going to do about it, exactly what we're going to do. Here's our plan of action. Here's the resources that you guys say that you need. This is what we're going to create and this is how we're going to prioritize each of them. I thought that that was such a powerful exercise of truly listening to What was needed and, honestly saying, we agree with you. There are things that are not working. Here's what we see is not working. But we wanna hear from your perspective what's not working. And that goes down to honesty, integrity, and being crystal clear of what that future action's gonna look
Adrian Koehler: like.
Adrian Koehler: in scenario, I'd be working with the senior leadership team and I'd say, I wonder why you chose not to notice it up until now. was more important than asking this?
Adrian Koehler: I mean, how long have you known? Because here's the, fun part about it. people asked me to come in and work with them is that I asked the pain type questions. challenge them I'll say, well, okay. You learned all these things. How long have you actually known about it and been avoiding it That's what's curious because that type of thinking, first off, I applaud the effort, that's for sure. but will be another one a year later where I'm curious about mindset in which as a leadership team, how do we set ourselves up to not have to wait and have these, long drinks of water in the desert?
Adrian Koehler: How do we actually flourish the road between now and the next time we do a big check-in? And what weren't we paying attention to? That created such a breakdown between leadership and employees. wanna have something sustainable, it's like, what was the thinking behind how out of touch we've been.
Danielle Cobo: you said it exactly it. It's not gonna happen once a year. It's continuously having these conversations on a consistent basis. was just talking with somebody the other day because they're gonna be taking on VP role and they were talking about some of the challenges and we were saying, well, Would it be beneficial to put together these advisory teams?
Danielle Cobo: on a consistent basis, they meet, they talk about what are the challenges that are going on? They're saying exactly the leadership team, our solutions that we're proposing. Here's the resources that we need. then that team is spearheading that project.
Danielle Cobo: because a lot of times it is. Some organizations will see leadership as here's a leadership, this is what we do, and kind of a dictatorship on, you're gonna follow these steps, But reversing it and saying the people that are on the ground level, the ones that are interacting with the customers on most consistent basis, the ones that are doing in the day out day, in of.
Danielle Cobo: What the roles are within there. They know exactly what's needed. They know what resources they want. They know what some of those challenges are, and it's for executive leadership to really be in tune with that and having that constant communication and as you said, challenge, challenge those questions.
Danielle Cobo: In a very good, healthy way because it's solution
Adrian Koehler: like we've both noticed the same thing too. is that, takeaway from it was, here's what we're gonna do as a leadership team. I think the beauty of it is this, what a great opportunity for those that are like the lower ranking folks to actually solve things and lead up.
Adrian Koehler: And People who makes the loudest noise ought to be a part of the solution to it. Those Passionate about.
Danielle Cobo: also talk a lot about fear and leadership. And stepping into leadership role, there can be a lot of fear, especially when you're imposter syndrome and I'm gonna be challenging the status quo in particular situations.
Danielle Cobo: what advice would you give to somebody who is, you're encouraging to push through that fear?
Adrian Koehler: Well, first off, fear isn't the problem. usually fear is an indicator that you're headed in the right direction. need to change your definition of the, it I mean, we naturally, well, let me do a little bit on the front fear is wired into us. It's not an accident. we've been around for a long time as a species and been developing and, fear is meant for a specific purpose. It's meant to protect. us that's what it's meant for. thank God, that's why we don't step into it in front of a bus.
Adrian Koehler: That's why we don't jump off a cliff. Because we've got fear. And fear tells us that's dangerous now. we need to like put fear in the right context. It's a gift to us. It's gotten us to where we are now. doesn't do the trick. it actually is an anchor if you want to go somewhere faster, If you wanna take on. risk And this is volitional risk, deciding that there's something in the future I want beyond what's safe, I'm gonna leave the known territory and go venture out into the wilderness and here's what I want to go do. I'm gonna be at stake, I'm gonna be vulnerable because I'm leaving the known territory. Things I think, and things I know, and where I'm an expert in the people I know and whatever. If you're doing that, if you're taking a venture like that, you're fear is coming with you. let's stop being surprised that I'm scared.
Adrian Koehler: course I'm gonna be scared. Now what am I scared of is an important question and for us to get clear about. Because can be scared of the dangers out there, like other people or situations or whatever, but, That's not usually where the fear really is. The fear is in more of what I think about myself and my view of myself.
Adrian Koehler: Like we've got these four major survival needs that we don't get a vote on. This is gravity. We wanna look good and we wanna feel good and we wanna be right and we wanna be in control. These are the four major survival needs. At least we talk about it that way. And fear comes up when one of those things is threaten.
Adrian Koehler: they're important to integrate. They're just not worth following, like looking good, feeling good, being right and being in control. So if you're a control freak, that doesn't work. If you're dogmatist, that doesn't work. If you're like committed to comfort, that doesn't work. And looking good, like having a self flatter and view of yourself, that also doesn't work in the context of striving and creating something if you feel like we've become really fascinated with this imposter language And the way I get through that is I realize, yeah, I'm an imposter. That's it. I'm striving to do something new and I've never done it before, of course I'm gonna feel like an imposter. I'm actually writing checks.
Adrian Koehler: I don't know if I can cash. I'm throwing myself at it and I'm believing that I can. I can learn whatever I need to learn. I can resource how I need to resource. I can ask for help. I can Courageously take action. I don't know if it's gonna work or not. I'm naturally gonna feel like an imposter, so just own it.
Adrian Koehler: It's okay. There's a distinction between feeling like an imposter and being a fraud. That's different when I know I'm running a con on myself or other people. That's being a fraud. I'm striving, I'm gonna feel like an imposter. an indicator light on your dashboard. It doesn't mean there's trouble It just means you're right where you ought to be. I think if you feel like an imposter, that means you're striving towards something and good for you your question, what to do about that first is to see it rightfully, I mean, to see it in the right way, then to embrace it, alot of those indicators that, I don't know what I'm talking about. never done this before. those are for most hard people. Our problem is, is that we always need more help than we want. We'd rather do it on our own and be able to have credit for it and look good and all those types of things.
Adrian Koehler: realize that the quicker I ask for help, which can be, asking a mentor. Finding a mentor, somebody that's in the organization that's been there before to help give you information. Obviously Google things, YouTube things all day long, read 10 books.
Adrian Koehler: There's like lots of things I need to do to really prepare myself for the next venture. that's part of embracing it. And it's just like, we call it hugging the cactus. we're gonna be insecure all the time. At least I I'm, a pretty gregarious guy. I'm a pretty ambitious guy. I'm a pretty gutsy guy, but I'm insecure all the time.
Adrian Koehler: I wonder if I'm making an impact or not. To people that are listening, I'm wondering if I'm being of service or not, and I think that's a good indication. I'm, self-inquiry around results.
Adrian Koehler: Am I generating results or not? think we, just tend to treat ourselves so preciously. if I'm, fear that means something's wrong, it might mean something's. .
Adrian Koehler: right
Danielle Cobo: What I'm hearing whenever there is fear, it's because we're willing to take the risks and understanding that risk comes a lot of uncertainty.
Danielle Cobo: comes sometimes a lot of doubt in insecurity. And it's also when we grow the most, is in those moments where we step into this discomfort and we really push ourselves into the fear and embrace it is when we grow the most. And those times where we question, are we doing the right thing, as you just said, am I making an impact or are people listening to this?
Danielle Cobo: Are they taking something away with it? That is a source of caring. that is a source of wanting to make a difference. if we went into this situation and we were just very flippant, we're gonna have a conversation and hopefully it goes well, but we wouldn't care as much. But kind of questioning that we have deep within our soul is because we want to make a difference.
Adrian Koehler: think about it, especially anytime I'm about to walk into a training. a lot of one-on-one coaching with founders and special people on their leadership teams.
Adrian Koehler: And then we'll come in and do these two day trainings. And I'm always really nervous or if I'm about to walk on stage, I'm always really nervous and I'm always shocked about how nervous I am initially. And I think that like my nerves a, are a sense because they show up. nervousness is like fear, The, didactic for this is this. nervous-am I nervous because anxious about what could go wrong? am I nervous because I'm in anticipation what might go right?
Adrian Koehler: And I know that because every time it happens, I'm really nervous. And then I get in the room and I see the people. And I realized, oh, these are humans here. I'm not here to be on the stage. I'm not here to like, whatever. I might be paid to be on stage, but I'm actually not here for me. once I'm not here for me and I'm here for them, my own self goes away, goes into the background, and my ego starts to not be my chief goal.
Adrian Koehler: It's like, protecting my own view of myself, my ego and somebody else making a difference in your language or making an impact or seeing them and seeing some breakthrough for them that rises up in the priority scale once, that's my aim. I'm good. I'm alive, I'm reality.
Danielle Cobo: I had a conversation recently with somebody who has been speaking for 20 years. She's a highly respected speaker within the National Speaker Association, and I was having this very candid conversation with her and I said, you know, I still get nervous. I get nervous before I get on stage, and when will I ever break that?
Danielle Cobo: And she says, You never will. Yeah, because I've been doing this for 20 years and I still get nervous. again, it goes back to because we care if we went on stage and we had no nerves, then I would question if somebody was going in with the right intentions. And also flipping this script in our mind too, is when you're asking yourself, am I nervous Because maybe I didn't prepare enough.
Danielle Cobo: That could be one reason. Am I nervous because I am. scared of what people think of me if I do a good job. That's flipping the script to that aspect is making it less about us and saying, why I'm here is to make a difference. It's not about me. It's not about how others view me. It's about what can I do to serve the people that are here listening who have taken the time out of their day to sit in this seat and to hear me speak it is about how can I serve them?
Danielle Cobo: So when we shift that mindset from me to them, It also does help relieve a lot of those nerves, cuz you're going in with a different intention.
Adrian Koehler: Well said.
Danielle Cobo: talked a little bit about this fear about pushing through our fears.
Danielle Cobo: How can we also fire our egos? Because sometimes, That's also an element of when we're leading teams, we're getting on stage. Sometimes we have this ego associated to it, And that can get in the way in a roadblock when we're wanting to be an, exceptional leader.
Adrian Koehler: an important conversation.
Adrian Koehler: think most people walking around, as we're all just kind of in the midst of life, we're not that connected to what part of my perspective is, clouded by Commonly called ego today. really there to preserve and what's there to, protect or what's there to generate?
Adrian Koehler: preservation or protection is usually, it's an ego function. I call it all the time and point out when I'm meeting people or working with a leader, it's pointing out where they're playing not to lose. And most of their complaints are about where in their life they're playing not to lose.
Adrian Koehler: it's don't know it's their aim, they're just trying to make sure they just hit their quota, make sure they don't get fired, make sure they preserve the politics, Okiger had this quote that's troubling.
Adrian Koehler: He says, people find a level of despair that's tolerable and call that happiness. if we're living preserve ourselves, we're just living this ego-based lifestyle might be one looking to preserve our reputation, for example. we hold back, extra 10% of what we want to say, and we say it because it's too risky or we don't know how they're gonna react or it might jeopardize the relationship or all that.
Adrian Koehler: we might even do it very kind fake altruistically and say, oh, he couldn't handle that. She couldn't handle that. So I'm gonna hold back that feedback, which is actually for me, instead of for them. it's so condescending to say like, oh, she's having a tough day, so I can't be honest.
Adrian Koehler: Or he's, going through whatever. And not that that stuff's not true, and there's certain moments in time where we're not conscious of that, but on a regular basis, if we don't think people can handle it, it's our own superiority complex. Firing my ego is actually, first off, I can need to identify it? What about the way I'm looking at a situation about me and my own self-preservation, the way I want people to see me, or the way really I wanna see myself and what's about preservation versus being willing to be used for something. I wanna be fully, the word I'd really use is like utilized.
Adrian Koehler: I want my skills and my talents to be fully utilized. we have this natural fear of. death As humans, we naturally want to preserve ourselves from that, but we, that into our daily life where it's like anything that feels like failure, seems like death to us.
Adrian Koehler: Not to get too more, but on this conversation, but it's like it really happens like that. I think like, I don't want to risk it. I don't want to fail. I don't want to be that vulnerable because I'm going to die to myself. I don't know if I can pull myself back together. And people that have suffered really well in life and have really blown it are the ones I think are textured, human beings and like can integrate their failures in such a way that it's like, least I think about it that way.
Adrian Koehler: I don't want to look for safety. That's why I think the whole psychological safety thing is dangerous. if the world is a certain way, then I can be a certain way is really the read through. if you're at a company and psychological safety is the goal, it means, oh, if this, then I can, which is, that's a three hour conversation about the dangers of that.
Adrian Koehler: But want to generate security in myself. Like I can look like a fool and I'm gonna be. And actually me looking like a fool in front of anybody might endear them to me, we're real, blow it all the time and just like this answer I go on for a really long time and I'm like, hold on Adrian, what's your point?
Adrian Koehler: But that's okay. this is in real time. We're just, ego wants to preserve and I'm about. life So we can either avoid death or we can pursue life. I'd just rather pursue life and death is a part of that, that's why I think I like that term, like firing the because my ego is going to try to talk me into pursuing, satisfying mediocrity.
Adrian Koehler: And this
Danielle Cobo: is where I see it play out in the workforce, because you had said, it's that ego that prevents, this holds us back from stepping into our greatness. And I see this play out in the workplace. There's been so many times where I am working with an individual and we're talking about these great ideas that they have for an organization.
Danielle Cobo: And they say, yeah, and don't know, ask them, have you talked to the executive leadership team about this? Have you brought this idea? This is such a phenomenal idea. Well, I don't know. And you just kind of hear this hesitation that they have, and if they took that step and fired the ego and said, well, what's the worst that could possibly happen?
Danielle Cobo: The executive leadership team says, no, that could possibly happen, but what. Greatness could happen. You bring this idea, you step into your greatness, you step into this leadership role, you present this idea, they embrace it, and then you become the spearhead person to take this idea on And then that can open the doors to so many career opportunities, outside of the organization.
Danielle Cobo: But it's that willingness to. Fire the ego to take risk, to push through that fear. That's what makes an exceptional leader.
Adrian Koehler: listening and think about, oh wow, that sounds like a big leap. just start by becoming, proficient atd hearing what you don't want to hear.
Adrian Koehler: I'm thinking like somebody were to take a leap and do what you're saying to do, which I is a, wonderful step to take, there's vulnerability baked in that, Because I feedback that, oh, I don't think you're up for it. I'm more apt to take a leap if I am unattached to outcomes, unattached to somebody's perception of me in the.
Adrian Koehler: moment How do I get unattached then I gotta get really used to hearing bad stuff. if you haven't done this, it's a great exercise to do, which is to go around to people you're working with right now and get some feedback about, Hey, what am I doing that's working? What's not working? how could I be better?
Adrian Koehler: what's wanted and needed is how we'd say it, but what could be better And get used to like hearing. critical feedback. It's only critical if I'm wearing it, like shame, like there's something wrong with me. I don't think there's anything wrong with anybody.
Adrian Koehler: but get used to hearing critical feedback and seeing it as fuel, then I'm more apt to go take bigger leaps down the road when talking to senior leadership team and stuff. But if I can talk to my employees or talk to my peers in that way, than I'm much more, apt to leading up in a powerful.
Adrian Koehler: way
Danielle Cobo: I agree a hundred percent with exactly what you're saying. When we're able to take into that, say it's almost when leaders do great job at Feed Forward coaching, it's that possibility of saying, that's a great idea. Possibly let's work on X, Y, Z to help get to that next step. it's not so much that, shift from that feedback of, oh, well, I don't know if you're ready for this.
Danielle Cobo: Now let's also work on X, y, Z to get you to where you want to be or to where the idea
Adrian Koehler: is. That's great. And you call that feed forward. That's great. I do
Danielle Cobo: feed forward coaching. Mm-hmm. . That's Well, thank you so much for joining on the podcast today. so many valuable lessons to be learned about what the secret is to being an exceptional leader, how to push through those fears and fire those egos.
Danielle Cobo: Mm-hmm. . thank you so much for joining today,
Adrian Koehler: Danielle. So great to be here. And for all those listening, I wish you the best. Go take some big. Life's short. We don't know how long we have. We really don't know how long we have, so might as well get after it. Absolutely. Awesome. Good to be with you.