Note: We use AI transcription so there may be some inaccuracies
Danielle Cobo: Are you seeking an inspired, purposeful life? When we're in alignment with their dreams and aspirations, creating lasting motivation is within reach. In today's episode, hear how aligning yourself with the right values and taking action can help create a future of deep satisfaction and business and life.
Today's guest is Jen Ze. Co-creator and leadership coach of mountains and marathons.
Danielle Cobo: Jen, I'm excited to have you on the podcast today. You are an inspiration with so much knowledge on leadership and especially with your company, with, Mountains and Marathons and in your organization. You talk about alignment, but I'd love for you to share what alignment means to you.
Jen Ziegner: Alignment for us means living in congruence with our truth. Now that for some people might also be okay, but what does that mean? we'll get a little bit more specific incongruence without truth, which means that first we get clear on what actually is my vision in detail in every single area of my life.
Jen Ziegner: That's some of the work we do inside of the Line Leadership program, really supporting leaders to go in every area of my. life What is my highest vision? What do I really desire? What do I really want? And what's interesting is that you might think that's the easy part, writing down what I really want.
Jen Ziegner: It's not most of the time. This is one of the most challenging things we can speak more about the reasons why, but we get really clear on like what's my highest visions, my highest commitments, and what am I declar? What I stand for Who am I inspired to be and what I'm out to create in this lifetime?
Jen Ziegner: alignment is living in congruence with that in every moment. And so then moment by moment, what it also means is that what we are thinking, what we are saying, our words, what our emotions are, and what our actions are, are in sync. many times people. we might, find ourselves in situations where we have a thought, but we say something else to please that person.
Jen Ziegner: Or we are feeling a certain way about something, but we're not acting on that feeling because of a whole bunch of reasons. we think we can't be in alignment there. causes misalignment. That causes inner resentment or just a whole bunch in a turmoil or whatever it looks like for every person.
Jen Ziegner: And so alignment moment by moment is, it's a place like where we are in sync in every single one of those facilities.
Danielle Cobo: Being in alignment is, so important because when you're in alignment. There is the residual effect of having a sense of purpose and there's a direct correlation to happiness fulfillment and impact.
Danielle Cobo: it's easy to go sometimes in a place where we believe that we are in alignment, but as our life changes, our goals might change. The companies that we're working for might change our roles and responsibilities might change, and that might kind of kilter us off of alignment. know if you're off of alignment and how can we get back onto alignment?
Jen Ziegner: Great question. you just said is so true. It's when we talk about our truth and living in a truth, our truth is really only ever. True in this moment, . some people actually struggle so much with visioning and with saying this is where I'm going because there's a sense of, if I say this now I'm locking myself into something for the rest of my life.
Jen Ziegner: Which is not what this is about. even like if you think back, years, did any of us imagine that this was gonna be exactly where we were gonna be and what be doing? No. there's a couple of things. One is, way we envision in the first place is are we actually, sometimes we say, this is exactly how I want it to be and, the role I want to have or the kind of house I want to have.
Jen Ziegner: But what we really encourage is to connect more with the deeper feeling. Here's how I want the place where I live to feel, here's how I wanna, feel about my life in general about my work. Here's the kinds of people I wanna be working with. I might be a CEO here, or a CEO there, It can look different ways, but I wanna have a certain life experience and really focusing on that.
Jen Ziegner: when people out of alignment, what often shows up is, sense of darkness, resentment, or often a resignation. When it's been there for a long time, it can be a sense of, yeah, but I don't even know, I feel so disconnected from my truth that I don't even know How to get back, especially when it shows up, a range of different areas of life when it's like, oh, my relationship's kind of misaligned and health is, and my job is as well. it can feel overwhelming. And this is where we come back to alignment, being a moment by moment choice. What can happen is that we actually lose this connection.
Jen Ziegner: We don't lose it, but it's kind of our intuition and our inner knowing moves into the background a little bit if we continuously don't listen to might have gotten certain messages around like what, we actually want, what's actually good for us? And for some reason we've made different choices because that's what either our mom or society or whoever expects of us.
Jen Ziegner: with that voice slowly like gets a little bit quieter would recommend, I mean, you are in this place where they really feel totally disconnected from it right now, start connecting with it when like you're choosing your clothes in the morning. What does your actually want to wear when you're choosing lounge?
Jen Ziegner: how do you actually choose your lounge isn't really what you want? Is it really what you desire? Starting with these very small, seemingly insignificant little choices in the day start reconnecting with, oh, I get to choose, I get to choose fully. I get to choose what I really desire.
Jen Ziegner: gets us to a place where it's gonna be a little bit easier when we have a conversation with a colleague or with a boss to actually say, yes, we wanna say yes and no. We wanna say no. It's reestablishing that connection with what's true and voicing that and being confident with that.
Danielle Cobo: Those small little, decisions that we make each day can have a ripple effect into the big decisions that we make in life.
Danielle Cobo: it's interesting that you brought up even the clothes that we choose, I will often say, do I want to feel today? And that is gonna sometimes determine. What I'm gonna wear that day. If I'm gonna be going up on stage and I'm gonna be, facilitating a, program or a keynote, I'm gonna be dressed to the night, I'm gonna be wearing heels, even though majority of the time they're extremely uncomfortable.
Danielle Cobo: I'm gonna be wearing Form fitting dress that I feel confident and comfortable in. But then other days where I'm Gosh I just really wanna feel really relaxed and just kind of at ease today, I'm probably gonna be throwing on some shorts, some flip flops, and like a loose fitting t-shirt, hairs up.
Danielle Cobo: But it's those little moments of. How do I want to feel today? as you said, that goes into the food choices we make. Do I wanna feel clean, healthy, and lean? I may grab for that green juice if I wanna feel stuffed, kind ofjust want a lounge on the couch and , just, be in that lounge mode.
Danielle Cobo: It might go for a cheese pizza, whatever that is But those, small moments and, as you were saying, in life. , our life changes moment by moment. think about you may be our work environment, we may be in one position and we're in complete alignment. The role that we're in, the company that we work for, we're a complete alignment with the people that we work for.
Danielle Cobo: And then one shift could happen. Maybe that one shift is you have a new manager where maybe your values don't align. Maybe the company's gone in a different direction the products that they're focusing their time and energy on is not in alignment with what you believe in or maybe the way that the culture of the organization is changing.
Danielle Cobo: Or maybe there's things going on in your personal life that are changing. I love what you mentioned, which. Continuously looking at what is your truth and checking in and ensuring that you are in alignment every day. In every moment. some questions that we can ask ourselves to kind of do that check in with ourselves on a consistent basis?
Danielle Cobo: Am I in alignment or not?
Jen Ziegner: When we dive a little bit deeper beyond the. and clothing choices. A lot those live in, conversations and relationships with other people. in communication, whether with ourselves or with other people, we ask what's my truth? Just like, what's my truth?
Jen Ziegner: We are establishing that, what do I really want? there's another one. I see this, especially in that, often confuse themselves with, I don't. know I know what I want. I don't even know what's true for me. There's all these different options. Now, I'm not even sure, often confusing ourselves is a form of self sabotage because if I remain in the place of confusion, I don't have to make a choice.
Jen Ziegner: when I let of confusion, actually tap into the clarity and the truth that's there, then well now am I gonna back it up with actual action, actual moving? And be scary. tuning into is confusion being like, am I subconsciously using confusion as a we are in a place of, I don't know, start with what do I.
Jen Ziegner: know Most people tell me I don't know what's next in career choice that I want. I don't even know what I'm looking for in a relationship. I say bs. there are things we know. start with things like, what do I know? And there's always going to be pieces there about how we want to about non-negotiables, about we truly desire.
Jen Ziegner: opening it up with that question, what do I know when we feel like we.
Danielle Cobo: What do I know is a great I think that sometimes we, push it. aside of, I don't know, I don't know, but are we also creating this space to ask ourselves what we do know? Are we creating that space to sit down without the distractions, without the society expectations, friends expectations, family members expectations, or the expectations we think we should be putting on ourselves and creating this quiet space for us to ask ourselves.
Danielle Cobo: What do I know? And what stories am I creating in my head and what I think I should be doing based off of other people's perceptions or their expectations or what I'm observing in society. not only what do I know, but also what do I really want? And it's not always what do I want in the sense of material stuff.
Danielle Cobo: I think of that question a step further and saying, Who do I wanna be? How do I wanna feel? What type of mom, wife, coworker, leader, spouse do I wanna be? What kind of impact do I wanna make? And then working it back from there is gonna help us get in alignment.
Jen Ziegner: A hundred percent.
Jen Ziegner: Who we wanna be is of all the work we do. I mean, this is the material things on top of that, they're nice, they're in cherry on top. honestly, we have all the material things, but you are not in alignment with who you actually want to be. It's not gonna matter. Versus if we can be who we wanna be moment by moment, the material things are gonna be okay.
Jen Ziegner: That's, beautiful. We get to enjoy that, as a bonus. But it's not what, it's about. we're, always starting with.
Danielle Cobo: Said that beautifully. So for, I think of those people out there that are, whether it's a spiritual, religious spaces, whatever the foundation that we, rely on, focus more on the, I wanna make money or I wanna have success, we get out of alignment with ourselves and we're doing it from a place of Sometimes when it doesn't go well, go into a scarcity mindset, go into, self-sabotaging, mindset where we're, hard on ourselves versus if we're in alignment and we're coming from.
Danielle Cobo: How do I wanna be? How do I wanna feel? And we put action steps that are going to get us towards that direction. Then we're going to be in alignment. And when we're in alignment, our energy, our purpose, align with each other. Then that success comes often. It just naturally from it. Because it's where you're putting your focus on.
Jen Ziegner: exactly And that's we bring a very different approach to goal setting. than what we often see in the world in our society right now, where it's often okay, let's just come back to, leadership and organization as an example because I believe a lot of people can relate to that.
Jen Ziegner: a lot of people said, I'll be happy when goals now in the hope that when I get. Let's just say the CEO title, I will feel a certain way about myself, confident, accomplished, rich, once I get there, I'll feel a certain way. There's two big problems with that one. we don't actually feel that way.
Jen Ziegner: It's a complete assumption, , and it's often actually not what this role or the shiny thing, the new car or whatever comes with. That's number one. The second many people sacrifice their alignment on the way there. order to get the position, I'm going to sacrifice my health, I'm going to sacrifice my romantic relationship because I think it's gonna pay off somewhere when I somewhere.
Jen Ziegner: And then we get to that place. We're actually not being our best selves. We're actually not who we are inspired to be. the way that we teach goal setting is, okay, let's get clear on who you wanna be and then what is a goal? That will call you into being don't run the marathon because of the finish line also that you can put on your resume that you run a run the marathon because of what the training and the pursuing of that calls us into being and who we become, in the process and then the. thing Itself just a, cherry on top. that's just bonus. whether it actually works out or not doesn't really as much.
Jen Ziegner: it's great, but it doesn't matter as much because single step along the way was worth it and was in alignment. And so who we're becoming is actually what we're focusing.
Danielle Cobo: brought up such a great point about that. I want to get to a certain level, and I see this in corporate so much because I just had a conversation with a client and she calls me and we've been working on her resume and her LinkedIn and preparing her for interviews.
Danielle Cobo: And she's in this position where she's been offered a position She Asked me, and said I just don't know what to do. She's in a role where she's in a leadership role. She's higher up within the organization, and she would be still high in a leadership role, but maybe, I guess if you look at the corporate ladder, a step down in pay grade levels.
Danielle Cobo: she's I, want to do sales, but I just feel like it is a step down. And I said, okay, take that Where do you feel valued, fulfilled? happy. you compare the two roles Right now, she's not feeling fulfilled. She is feeling undervalued at the current company.
Danielle Cobo: this particular company that she's, received an offer for. She's talking about the leader and how amazing she is and how she really pours into the development of their team, and it's somebody she's always wanted to work for. I'm like, okay, so. , you now know that the person that you'd be working for is in alignment with what you want, the culture that you're looking for, with this new particular role that you would have more time with your family, which is something that you've been wanting.
Danielle Cobo: You know that there's potentially a long-term financial benefit, which is something that you've been talking about, being able to provide for your family. I said, so it sounds like you know the answer, but what's holding you back is this. perception that you're taking a step down when in reality it sounds like you're taking a step forward in being in alignment with what is most important to you in life.
Danielle Cobo: And it's not that title,
Jen Ziegner: it's who you get to be. So a beautiful, yes. What a beautiful example of how these like perceptions like step down, step up, how it can mess with. us if we make it about that, It would be so easy to choose what can't a step down, My ego and my whatever, and the perception of the company and whatever is involved in Well, what you've brought in for that client is look at all the steps up you're doing then there's this one, Does it even matter? That is Such a great example. give you another one. Like one of. My clients I mean, she comes from very high level leadership, position in corporates and then left those roles and was in a space of kind of like redefining what do I want? And got this job offer. and Had an international consulting firm, half a million dollar wanna provide for my family, I need to provide for my family. I'm a single mom and don't know what I'm doing, so this sounds like a good idea for a year or so. And I was sitting there and I know her well and I was like, okay, let's see how this goes.
Jen Ziegner: I knew she had no interest in I knew she actually hated the prospect of the job so many reasons, but she was like, no, I'll think I'll do this. And I'm like, okay. Let's see. It was a couple of months before she actually had to officially accept the offer and start the she's like, I'm not taking the job. like, tell me more. She's like, I just can't. And I had had this conversation with her and I said to her, except for the fact that I will provide you the safety that you're looking for right now, is anything about this job is exciting to you? And she's said no, nothing .
Jen Ziegner: And I knew that because of all work that we had done together, that she would get to that point herself. But it took her to get to that point. a week before, she tells me I'm not taking the job, and I'm like, assume about three or four weeks later, she had started her own. company dream something that she had been planning to do and had ideas for four months after getting caught and she says, you know I turned on the $500,000 job, but I just said someone invest 600,000 into my company. And this is so beautiful for me to see the power of alignment and often, this is one of the big, pieces that holds people back from actually stepping into what's aligned. It often requires us to let go of the thing that is not.
Jen Ziegner: Whether that's the relationship or whether that's a job, or whether that's whatever. often we are like, yes, but over here at least I know what I have. It's not that great. It's not exactly what I want, but it's got some good things. I can justify it. I can holding onto this. It's like I can make this work.
Jen Ziegner: if we could just go from to the thing that we really desire, would be great. But often it's not how it works. Now, I'm not saying that you necessarily have to leave your job and put yourself into financial insecurity or anything of that. I don't encourage that yet to get a new job, but even a relationship, like can I really find a relationship that I truly desire while I'm still in the one that I don't?
Jen Ziegner: Just kind of to stay safe over here and jumpis often really scary for people because we can't see the other side and we don't when it's come, if it's gonna come, what it's gonna look like. And then we are afraid that if we let this thing go, we are feel like a failure and look stupid because now it feels like we have nothing even though that's not true.
Jen Ziegner: Even though we're just in this. alignment transition period. And so that is a big one. if any of you are in this place of, I know it is something else that I want, but I know there's something I also have to let go of, we always say that alignment is simple. It's simple. The truth is simple, the heart is simple.
Jen Ziegner: Alignment is simple. Not always easy, always worth.
Danielle Cobo: your story of being in alignment, it makes me think of with, that woman, it makes me think of that entrepreneurial journey of when I first left corporate and I was waffling back so much back and forth of going, well, if I know, if I go back to corporate, I will have a six figure income, six figure bonus checks, company, car 401K benefits, stock options.
Danielle Cobo: I mean, I had a great. job A highly successful career and there was a lot of safety in there, but there was always something missing and it was a huge risk to start a business. And in the beginning stages there would be times where people would just come up to me and, you know, I had this job, would you be interested?
Danielle Cobo: And I would ponder on it for a week and. I would Ask myself, I don't know, but that's just, it seems like a great opportunity, but I wanna do my business, but there's more safety. it consume me for a good week of going back and forth. And it's interesting you truly understand what alignment means to you.
Danielle Cobo: You go back and forth internally. And this happened, a week ago. I was speaking with a gentleman and he and I had worked together many, many years ago, over 10 years ago. He's Starting a business and he's like, would you be interested in coming to corporate? He offered me a, role within the organization, stock Options Equity in the organization.
Danielle Cobo: It took me about 10 minutes to say thank you for considering me. I appreciate it, but I am so happy in what I do. Let me go ahead and refer you to two people. And I actually helped them get two employees, are in true alignment, you know your truth, you know what you want, it becomes crystal clear and it makes your decision making process faster, more efficient, more clear, concise, and in your truth at all times.
Jen Ziegner: to see how from you and I love that you mentioned these time periods, how it went from a week to 10 minutes, . And this is often how it's at the beginning. I mean, it can get really hard and we get more in alignment and we actually practice and start noticing like you have, really scary to move from corporate to running your own business.
Jen Ziegner: And also now, it's like I'm. okay. Being in alignment actually always gives me, the better results in life and what I really want and the fulfillment. now it becomes much easier to go like, no, I know, like I'm tuned into this, I'm tuned into my truth and I don't need a week anymore to make this decision because I don't have all this back and forth anymore.
Jen Ziegner: It's like, this is what it is. No, thank you. So beautiful.
Danielle Cobo: sometimes we forget too about. you had mentioned something about maybe walking too or walking away from, we forget sometimes that yes, there is a big risk in taking a leap forward in a different directions, whether it's starting a business, going for a going for a different job.
Danielle Cobo: Any of those directions, whether it's in the story that I shared or the story of your client, we also get to remember. That we still have that expertise that we are leaving behind. we can always go back if we want to. It's not like I only have either or, to go back to where I was.
Danielle Cobo: Now obviously you always wanna stay forward minding and thinking, but we always have that to go back to. Don't discredit or lose sight on all the expertise that you've gained to what that's gotten you to where you're at today. any other advice you wanna leave for people just in being in alignment that they can just take away from all the nuggets that you've shared during our conversation?
Jen Ziegner: Someone, podcast asked me a couple days ago, you had a billboard to write one message on, what would that be? And what came to me was live life fully. I do believe that the capacity to live life fully and feel all of the emotions and feel all of the rollercoaster that life can be sometimes without shying away from that.
Jen Ziegner: And creating ourselves to be a person who can hold that all and has the capacity to be with that all is at the core of living aligned. if we can do that and we don't shy away from the possibility of sadness, of disappointment, but simply can see that this is another delicious part of our human experience and what we've come here to do, where we don't need chase bliss and joy every day, but really like acknowledge.
Jen Ziegner: that The human experience in our capacity to more of the beautiful, comfortable emotions comes at the same time as opening ourselves up to more of the other side that might be more difficult to deal with. They come together and so really like creating that capacity and that okayness with everything that life offers us such a deeper access to living in alignment because then it's like nothing can go.
Jen Ziegner: wrong as long as I live in alignment, long as my truth, nothing can go wrong because I can handle it all.
Danielle Cobo: Valuable words of wisdom, living in alignment to being in our truth. Well, thank you so much, Jen, for joining the podcast. Really appreciate it. I know our listeners will take a lot from our conversation. for those of you listening, share this episodes with your friends, your family, your colleagues, all of us have an opportunity to live our truth and live in our alignment so that we have a life filled with purpose and passion.
Danielle Cobo: Thank you,
Jen Ziegner: Danielle.