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The first 100 days, bills are passed, executive orders are signed, and presidencies are defined. And for Donald Trump's first 100 days, Rachel Maddow is on MSNBC five nights a week. Now is the time, so we're going to do it. Providing her unique insight and analysis during this critical time. How do we strategically align ourselves to this moment of information, this moment of transition in our country? The Rachel Maddow Show, weeknights at 9 p.m. Eastern on MSN.
Hi, Mark. How was the White House? Another what-a-day day. Yeah, I wonder when we tell the story of Donald Trump, I wonder if that will define him more than any other. as a politician and as a man. If he is a man of his word, it could well define much more than just him. I'm James Matthews. I'm Mark Stone. And on day 17 of Trump 100, Donald Trump says the US should take ownership.
of the Gaza Strip. And all the Palestinians who live there should be resettled somewhere else permanently. It's just gone 8.30 on Tuesday evening here in DC. What a day. Let's get going. Mark, I can see you're at the Bureau. I'm in my home podcast studio for the first time, but you're just back from the White House.
Tell me about it. Yeah, look, James, I'm not looking for any sympathy, but I am exhausted mentally and physically because of another whirlwind day. And one story which is now at the very end of that day has dominated this news conference between Prime Minister. Benjamin Netanyahu.
And President Donald Trump, Netanyahu, the first world leader to come here to Washington to meet the new US president. A coup indeed for Bibi, as he's known. He swept into the White House. I hadn't seen so much pomp there. as I did today. Outside the White House, there was US military, a guard of honor along Pebble Beach, as it's known. And then his motorcade drove in around the little circle by the West Wing, and Donald Trump was there to greet.
the Israeli Prime Minister. And at that stage, James, we didn't quite know what to expect, but we certainly didn't expect what was to come. Yeah, we already had a story. Netanyahu was in town. That was the headline. First foreign leader to be invited to the White House since Trump became president. It became a far bigger story once they started talking.
In fact, even before then, Steve Witkoff, who is Trump's man in the Middle East, the man who managed to broker with such remarkable success the ceasefire just a few weeks ago, he made some comments outside the White House earlier on in the day, which we would.
have been talking about a lot more in this episode, in which he sort of doubled down on what Donald Trump had said about the Gaza Strip, that people there had to be relocated, but you resettled somewhere else. He didn't say that it would be permanent. That was left to Donald Trump in the Oval Office. I feel very differently about Gaza than a lot of people. I think they should get a good, fresh, beautiful piece of land and we get some people to put up the money to.
Build it and make it nice and make it habitable and enjoyable and make it a whole I don't know how they could want to stay. It's it's a demolition site It's a pure demolition. The Oval Office moment was in and of itself huge because, you know, Donald Trump has a habit of saying the quiet stuff out loud. And so he did in the Oval Office by announcing.
in what was at that point the breathtaking announcement of the day that all Palestinians in Gaza should be permanently resettled elsewhere. My reflections are that critics would have seen that announcement at the point that it was made as being him either...
ignoring history, being indifferent to it or ignorant of it, because he was kind of framing what he was saying, that Gazans should leave for good, as common sense, because Gaza's uninhabitable. They can't possibly live there. Why would they want to live there? And that someone... he didn't say who it would be, should build them a beautiful place somewhere else. He hasn't said where it should be. And when he was asked again, because there were...
questions being fired at him in the Oval Office. You know, what if they don't want to leave their homeland? He would repeat his argument. Well, why would they want to live there? And of course, the answer why they want to live there is history. And there are echoes of history that are really very stark. You know, Palestinian...
many of them only live in Gaza because they've already been pushed into that tiny strip of land over many, many decades. The formation of the State of Israel in 1948 created what's known as the Nakba, the catastrophe, where... so many were displaced, many of them internally displaced, refugees in their own land, many of them went abroad. So the fact that Donald Trump was now effectively asking for history to be repeated and saying they should go and live somewhere else, that was remarkable.
Then came the East Room moment, which was altogether wholly different. The U.S. will take over the Gaza Strip and we will do a job with it too. We'll own it, do a real job. do something different, just can't go back. If you go back, it's going to end up the same way it has for 100 years. That was a sitting president of the United States saying he wanted...
to own the Gaza Strip. Nothing less than that. Tell me about the reaction in the room. Well, I was sitting next to a colleague in the news conference, and as he said it, we looked at each other instinctively, just looked at each other, and we're just like... Did he mean to say that? You know, there's a chance everyone does it that he misspoke. But no, he didn't. He repeated it again and again and again that America would take ownership of the Gaza Strip. It was truly a moment I'll remember.
And we've spoken about Jared Kushner, you know, his son-in-law, former Middle East envoy, speaking about the Gaza Strip. We've heard him talking about the very valuable potential as a waterfront property. It's almost as if this was Donald Trump fleshing out that. thought. He spoke about it as a Riviera of the Middle East. And I don't want to be cute, I don't want to be a wise guy, but the Riviera of the Middle East, this could be something that could be so magnificent.
I mean, it would be one thing if he was talking about it being a Riviera of the Middle East, which could be rebuilt by Palestinians for Palestinians with American help. Maybe USAID could get involved if they hadn't been closed down. But it's one thing him saying that, but he...
He was then asked, so who do you think is going to live there? Because remember, in the Oval Office an hour earlier, he said quite clearly that Palestinians would not live there because they would be relocated permanently elsewhere. So have a listen to what he said when asked who should live there. People living there, the world's people.
I think you'll make that into an international, unbelievable place. I think the potential in the Gaza Strip is unbelievable. And I think the entire world, representatives from all over the world, will be there and they'll... And they'll live there. Palestinians also. Palestinians will live there. Many people will live there. Donald Trump, remember, is the man who declared himself peacemaker, unifier. That news conference can hardly be further from...
Both. There's a reason that the Middle East has experienced decades of conflict, the shifting of whole populations from a place they call home, shifted by Western powers. That's at the very heart of it. And the notion that this will take us down the path towards peace seems facile, I think.
Well, I heard one person, I don't know who they were in the news conference afterwards. Everyone was chattering because it was one of those ones that the leaders left and then everyone was like, well, what do you make of that? It was extraordinary. And I overheard one person, she seemed pretty angry. She was like, what does he want to do? build trump golf courses in gaza yeah but look i mean
Stephen Chung is Trump's communications director. He tweeted shortly afterwards, President Trump is 100% correct. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing, expecting a different result. Peace, true lasting peace is... the ultimate goal, and it can only happen with this president. Yeah, insanity, a relative term, I suppose, in this discussion. And, you know, he spoke about agreement that he had had, how people thought it was a lovely idea. It seemed to float the notion that...
There was support in Arab countries. I do wonder about that. What is important is what Saudi Arabia thinks. And he actually said Saudi Arabia is going to be very helpful. They want peace in the Middle East. I think that sentence rather contradicts itself. The Saudis do indeed want peace in the Middle East, but they want regional stability. And that's not best served by relocating populations into Egypt.
And Jordan, that's got instability written all over it. It does. I mean, the Saudi position has always been that there should be a two-state solution. That is, Israelis, Jewish Israelis, and Palestinians living side by side, two states. one land that has always been their position now the israelis
Netanyahu would dearly like to do a normalization deal, as it's known. That's normalizing diplomatic relations with the Arab world. And the jewel in the crown there is Saudi Arabia. So of so many different questions I'm left with as we record this. is how is Saudi Arabia going to react to that?
They surely will be wholly against this idea, both ideas. The idea of permanently relocating Gazans will be deeply insulting because they see Palestinians as their brethren. And the idea that America should somehow occupy Gaza. also a non-starter, which then renders the normalization deal between Israel and Saudi completely, you know, it's gone. So maybe...
And I know what you think of this, but maybe this is one of his arts of the deal. Maybe he is proposing something that he doesn't actually mean, and he's actually going to then offer it as a concession down the line. Maybe he's talking about ownership. in inverted commas, we'll own the problem. You know, it'll, it'll be our problem. We're going to own this. I mean, he's certainly, there is no question that his language tonight was not like that, but maybe over time.
in a way that he does so brilliantly, he can mould his views to something slightly different. Yeah, that art of the deal. Listen, if he pulls this off, then fair play to him. And actually, hang on here, we've just got a statement that's come through from the Saudis within the last...
Last few minutes, which, as expected, it says the foreign ministry affirms that Saudi Arabia's position on the establishment of a Palestinian state is firm and unwavering. It's quite lengthy, but the essence of it is. Absolutely not. They do not agree one bit with Donald Trump. What I'm interested in, James, is how other countries, other Western nations will react.
to Trump's announcements because we have seen over the course of the two weeks that this presidency has been going that they are so reluctant to criticize him because they need him. They need him because they don't want tariffs. They need him to like them.
And so they've been unwilling to criticize him about anything he's done so far. So many countries believe in the two-state solution, which appears now in Trump's mind to be dead. So what will they say? Politics of the Middle East are what they are because... diplomacy is labyrinthine there's a reason that we haven't seen peace in the Middle East and you know I just wonder how much further actually this takes us from peace because
We've all been talking about the ceasefire deal, which has held. The talk going into this meeting was about phase two and making slow, steady progress. What price that ceasefire deal now, I wonder. What do Hamas think? of what they have heard it's a great point i think they may well take the view that the rules of engagement have changed therefore they're out and what are the implications of that and you know hamas
put them to one side, just the ordinary Palestinian people. And all the talk by critics of Israel saying, this is ethnic cleansing that's going on here. And yet now you have the leader of the free world. saying, do you know what, all the people here, they should be moved out to somewhere else permanently. We should take ownership of this land and then we will rebuild it for the people of the world. Not Palestinians, maybe some Palestinians, but for the people of the world.
It was truly staggering stuff. Yeah. I was watching the news conference on TV, Mark. Benjamin Netanyahu, he looked to me like the cat who had got the cream. I just wondered, how did you find his... kind of body language you know you being in the same room well i i thought i detected some element of surprise in netanyahu's body language maybe i'm reading more more to it than that but there is you know there are certainly some people israel watchers middle east watchers who i trust
know who are saying tonight that they believe Trump was making all this up on the hoof. No one, literally no one has been talking about America owning Gaza, which makes me wonder whether this was either the tightest knit. group of people who knew about it, or whether it was just Trump's idea. But you know, James, after leaving the news conference, I bumped into one Israeli official who I know, and he told me,
sort of on background, so I'm not going to name him or anything like that. But let's just say he was very, very surprised by what he heard Trump say. Interesting. Let's leave it at that. For all the talk about Donald Trump proving that he can solve problems, I wonder tonight... how much we've heard Donald Trump proving he can't. All I would say against that is that the Abraham Accords, the thing we talked about, normalization with Gulf Arab countries, from his first presidency,
was a genuine game changer, was a material success. It was a Trump brokered deal. It was amazing in what it did. Of course, the issue with it and the reason it didn't go any further was the Palestinian. problem. And that Palestinian problem in the years since the Abraham Accords were signed has got a whole lot worse. For me, Netanyahu, he came here to carve a path as much for himself as his country. You know, he's politically...
vulnerable at home. You know, he's got right-wingers in his coalition. They're not happy with a ceasefire deal. Not happy with him. I think he and they will be happy certainly with this. And, you know, just listen to what he had to say. I've said this before, I'll say it again. You are the greatest friend Israel has ever had in the White House. And the other thing is that even if Netanyahu doesn't believe
relocate Palestinians permanently thing is actually workable. And even if he doesn't believe that the America owning Gaza thing will actually happen, just dangling those two ideas in front of the... much more hardline elements of his own government is really helpful politically for him. So in a sense, what Trump has done tonight is give Netanyahu one heck of a lifeline.
Jordan's King Abdullah, he's set to visit next Tuesday, Mark. Yeah, that'll be interesting. Oh, goodness me. It will be fascinating. I mean, again, even before Trump's announcement, I was wondering how he would be received. Would there be a military guard of honor? Would it be the same pomp that we saw with Netanyahu? But now all I want to know is what on earth King Abdullah of Jordan makes of Trump's plan to own Gaza. Yeah.
Yeah. I just wonder, of all the challenges that America has had over recent years, the two biggest challenges, foreign policy that I can think of, involved America occupying parts of the Middle East, Iraq and Afghanistan. And the last thing I expected Donald Trump to do would be to announce a new occupation of a part of the Middle East. It just was not on my bingo card. Yeah, see how they went. I think a history lesson might be the order of the day in the White House. Thank you.
Anyway, James, I want to know how your new studio is. No, yeah, well, I'm in my basement, actually. The cross-train are just gathering dust just out of shop. I'm slightly alarmed that we've got these studios at home because we both know why that is, don't we? Yeah, there is no escape.
Exactly. For these late night recordings. Wouldn't have it any other way. Okay, that's it for today. But before we go, you seem to enjoy the Q&A episode that Martha and I did last Sunday so much that we're going to do it again.
this sunday i don't know if that's me martha and you mark what are you well i don't know maybe maybe it was doing well because i wasn't part of it who knows send a good question we'll find out i will be part of it this sunday so send us great all those questions you need to know and we will do our best to answer them on Sunday. Trump100 at sky.uk. And if you don't already, follow Trump 100 wherever you're listening so you don't miss that episode or any others.
Thanks for joining us on day 17 of Trump 100. See you tomorrow for day 18. All the best. Bye bye. The first 100 days, bills are passed, executive orders are signed, and presidencies are defined. And for Donald Trump's first 100 days, Rachel Maddow is on MSNBC five nights a week. Now is the time, so we're going to do it.
providing her unique insight and analysis during this critical time. How do we strategically align ourselves to this moment of information, this moment of transition in our country? The Rachel Maddow Show, weeknights at 9 p.m. Eastern on MSNBC. See you then.