alcohol is a drug. And I think it's a ridiculous thing that we just kind of put out in the world that it's normal. It's okay. You should accept my drinking, you should accept the fact that I want to be effed up and on drugs. It is a drug, I'm going to call it a drug as it is all the time. That is not normal behavior. And you shouldn't feel like you're crazy for telling someone. It's not okay to be on drugs all the time.
Welcome back. Welcome back to another episode until the wheels fall off. I'm Paige. And
I'm Matt. And your cadence was just a little bit off there. But we can work on it. I'll show you. Okay, thanks. I think it's still pretty solid. Like if I'm given gymnastic score here. I'm saying that's like that that one's like a 716 6.9 6.8 6.8.
Okay, well, you usually do the intro. And this time I wanted to change it.
She goes, Can I do the intro? I'm like chat.
Okay. I know, it's not nearly as good as your so you have it's not true.
It's just that what people hear over and over and it's just becomes like, a comfort bias.
Okay, well, this is a different episode. So that's why I wanted to do it. This is in between episodes, we're doing a special one based on tick tock questions.
Yeah, this is cool. So we reached out to we have got an audience that's big enough now where we can say what questions you guys have, because it's weird being like a content creator, a podcast or any kind of content creator, I guess. But you're talking to an audience and you're not 100% sure if you're even talking about things that are relevant to them. So for a lot of times, it feels like you're just walking around with your eyes closed in the dark. And you're like, can you
guys hear me? Is this is this helping? Yeah, yeah, no, it's been but it's really cool when you get an audience big enough where they can reach out so we took just a handful of the the questions that we gotten from that from that post and the TIC TOCs actually been really lit and I wasn't so sure about tick
tock and to me and you're not supposed to say lit with your over 35 years old dear
man, I come from I come from the streets. I can say what I want.
So true. Yes, tick tock has been lit.
It's been great for us though. It's it's been a place where you get actually more feedback and interaction than anywhere else, like Instagram is a place where people go to pretend that there's someone there not. Facebook is a place where old people go to put inappropriate things on the internet. And Tik Tok has been a place where people will actually reach out and ask like, sincere questions, and I never I never thought that would be the case. Right?
Yeah, we were kind of on the we weren't going to get on tick tock like we were not. What is the word I'm looking for? Dammit.
I don't know. I don't know what you're looking for there.
Nevermind. All right. Let's
just keep going. resistant, hesitant we were
Yeah, we were hesitant. Thank you. Okay. Got it. Thanks. Got
it. Told you. I can read your mind. True. It's true.
All right. So we're gonna go through some questions that people wanted us to answer. If you don't, if you're not on our tick tock. It is mainly me discussing certain things of what it's like being with an addict or an alcoholic. It kind of turned into something different than we had our podcast.
Yeah. And you cover some other stuff there as well. Like you have a relationship stuff. Yeah, some some good stuff. Life stuff in general, like you cover life stuff. Yeah. But how about I read the questions, and then you take the answers, especially the ones that are mostly
around like, some of them are some of her for you. But if you want to go ahead and excuse me, I
clear my throat there.
I don't know what's going on me clear my throat.
I forgot that. That's a good one. All right. No, question one. All right. How do I cope when he has actually started making progress after many years of trying? Can you rekindle hope and passion after years of resentment?
Yes, as long as he is still trying and making living amends, as you'd like to say, right? Uh huh. So it there is hope, that passion and that you can get over the resentment, but it is going to take a long time. Give yourself some grace, have some patience. And if you want to hear more on forgiveness, we actually did an episode on forgiveness that can help you dig into this a little bit deeper.
Yeah. So if you're hearing this on a Friday, like when this drops live, it would have been Wednesday, the previous episode, and if you've never heard us before, and just happened to land on this episode, just go the one right before this. Yeah, to get context. Yeah. Um, so yeah,
give yourself grace and patience. Yeah, it is possible because it happened with us. I don't hold resentment anymore.
I was gonna say I think that this question like my heart goes out to this person because I'm, I'm imagining when this question is being asked, it could be off base here, but that this person is in a relationship with someone who's fresh out of rehab, or they're just starting their recovery journey. And, man, that is a weird time in life. Hell, yeah. And I know how you feel and God bless you Hanging on and hanging in there. It does get better. As long as they keep working toward it and
you keep working toward it. Yes. And it does get better. And like if I had to get you to write down what you wanted out of life today, and you both continue this journey, five years from now, you would look back at that list and you would be like, wow, I've gotten 10 times that stuff, right? There's no limit the sky is the limit to how great things can get when you're both working toward growth. So yeah, it gets better. The passion comes back.
The hope comes back. The world has color again, there's light in life, like it's beautiful. It gets incredible. It gets so much better, exponentially better. Doesn't mean you won't have ups and downs still, but it gets so much better. Yep. Okay, question two, is actually a question for both of us. Do you both suffer from high anxiety stem from childhood?
No,
no, we don't
know. I do write. Matt has no anxiety. I think the only time he ever had anxiety was when you took mushrooms. That one
time was really bad. But honestly like, Okay, you answer then. Then I'll go I'll I'll kind of provide some some color here. But yeah, go ahead.
Oh, no, I had I had anxiety. As a child, I used to have these crazy stomach aches. And I realized as an adult that those were really it was really anxiety. I don't know necessarily where it came from. But yes, I have been an anxious person since I was a young child. But I know for Matt, this is not the case.
No, like anxiety. Like, I think I've said it in an episode before. Like, I did have an anxiety attack one time when I took too many mushrooms. And it was awful. It was horrible. It was actually the first time that I was able to talk to Paige about anxiety, because like, with experience, do you remember that? And I was like, I'm so sorry that I've ever felt that. Yeah. But I live with like a constant hum of anxiety now. And it usually revolves around career stuff like work stuff,
which is so silly. Think about like anxieties.
Anxiety is a normal emotion. Everybody has anxiety. Totally. I didn't have anxiety. No,
no. I had no problem like, public speaking. I had no problem getting on a stage. I had no problem like
trying new thing. No getting out of your comfort zone. No, he actually helped me with my anxiety once he understood what I was going through. Yeah, no, neither. We didn't both.
Now I've been very fortunate. We are complete opposites. complete opposites. So she's anxious. Just pretty much bet that I'm not. Yeah, it's true. Yeah. Wow. Okay. Question three. My husband has been in recovery for a little less than a year. Congrats to him. But I feel like I'm definitely codependent because of how controlling I am. It's suffocating him now that he's good. And I'm still super nagging and control finances and don't give him breathing room. How do I let it go?
Felt that
talk about that.
Um, basically, this is I want to say kudos to you for having awareness that you know that you have a part in something and that you feel like you are codependent and you're still nagging and you feel like there is still a problem, within whatever's going on in your relationship or within yourself, I would definitely encourage you to really look within you to focus on you find out what it is that's holding you back, you
know, why are you nagging? Why do you feel like you still need to suffocate him because you there's something going on within you do something for yourself, not focusing on him?
I would imagine. And I know, professionals will agree that some of this is habitual, because you've been doing it for so long. It's sort of like a learned habit to learn behavior where you've had to watch someone for so long feeling like you're responsible for their actions or what they will do and won't do. And then when they recover, it's sort of like, Wait, that just stops all of a sudden, this doesn't work that way. That's a process and it
plays out over time. And I think the fact that you have awareness this early on, put you pretty far ahead of the game, be proud of yourself and pat yourself on the back for that. And yeah, as Paige said, you know, there's we've got episodes on codependency, we've got guides on codependency, more tick tock videos, and I can count on codependency and tons of tips and tricks and, and okay, it's
complex. It's not like it's not a quick fix. It's not something that I can tell you specifically how to let go. It's a process.
Yeah, you don't just let it go. You don't just make the decision. Alright, I'm done. It
takes your awareness. That's the first step. Yes. The willingness to actually look within you to make the changes necessary for you.
Right. It's been a learned behavior over quite some time. And so getting them be be gentle with yourself and understand that and he shouldn't be upset about it either, because you wouldn't have this behaviors if he hadn't earned it. Right. So it's an earned behavior on his part, to some degree, some of it was there was always there, right? But some of it is also learned. Yeah, earned. Okay. Question number four,
my favorite number.
This isn't fair to my minds three bodily opposites. Will the addict eventually see the boundary not as a punishment? Hobby struggling with my boundary of not living with us until on the path of recovery. Now you take that one. Okay? Well, the addict eventually see this boundary, which is the boundary is not living with us until they're in recovery. And I think that that
is a fair boundary. from your standpoint, I think that is not too much to ask of a partner, someone who's living under your roof, to not be using drugs and alcohol to access I don't think that that's, it's not a wild ask, it's really not. And if this is what you need to do to protect yourself, I think that that's valid. And I think that that's fair. Will this addict eventually see this not as a
punishment. So here's the thing about addiction in general, when you're in it, like when you're really in it, and you're using actively. You don't really process things rationally, right? You're going to look outward. And you're going to look at why is this someone else's fault before you look at your own part in these things. And it's really, really difficult, I know, as an addict
for to take responsibility. So they will probably for quite some time blame you for this tell you that you're evil and that you're cold and that you're ruthless. And who knows what else, you know, price has some really ugly things. But I would stand firm that this isn't, this is not a huge ask. Right? So will they ever see it as not a punishment? You know? Yes. Most likely, I can't say for sure.
But most likely, because we all have moments of clarity, even in addiction and use like you're not, you're not high 24/7 Like there are times when you will be sitting with your own feelings sober for a period of time. And I had these I mean, else I was high most of the time or drunk most of the time. I mean, really, honestly, maybe like, an hour a day or something that I wasn't didn't have like something actively in my system.
If that. If that is in those moments, life gets really tough because you don't have your, your substance to numb everything. And you have to kind of sit with all this. And so I'd like to think that at some moment, he's going to be sitting in a traffic light and thinking about where he's at right now in life and thinking about the fact that he can't drive home to his family. And the reason why is because he can't control this
problem. And that's a really sombering and sobering feeling where you're like, Oh, crap, in that moment, I think that they'll, they're more than likely to see it for what it really is. Whether or not they ever give you the validation of that. I don't know only time can tell is waiting for that. Time can tell. But
and honestly, it doesn't matter if they feel like it's a boundary or punishment. It What matters is that you're doing it to protect yourself.
And that was a perfect cherry on top. That's yeah, that's exactly it. That's the perfect way to end that one, I think. Okay, question five is choosing not to live under the same roof too harsh of a boundary? Is it me giving up? Or am I right? That's, it's for the best. So similar, but it's really about the severity of boundaries. And so I'd like for you to take this one page. Well, I thought
this is the one that you were gonna go off on? Or is that the next one?
I think this is the one I was gonna go off on. It is yeah, so you go ahead, and then I'll go off.
Okay. Because I did. Okay, yeah. So it's hard to tell people how to set boundaries up. And that's kind of where a lot of us spouses struggle with this, because they're like, is it too harsh? Is it not look at your values, y'all, you got to look at your values, if everything if all of your values are being, you know, Val, oh, my gosh, I cannot talk today.
Try it again. Start over.
If your values are being violated, thank you, because I was gonna say validate it. And it's like, that doesn't make sense.
I got you. The other half of your brand. Five, Baby Go.
Yes. If your values are being violated over and over again, you feel like this boundary is like, too harsh. It's probably not too harsh. Honestly, like, I don't think
no, it's not too much to ask once again, like, it's not too much to ask, like,
depending on how it is in your home, like, what is it? What's going on? Is it I'm looking at this question as you saying, Is it me giving up? No, I don't think it's you given up I think it's you protecting yourself.
So I, I've always looked at life and like the way that things are traditionally done, and I've always kind of like shot my middle fingers at that. And so I think probably what you're feeling here about like, is it me giving up is that like this thought that a husband and wife or partners have to live under the same roof? Okay, why
who made that rule? Show me where in the rulebook that that's that show me what rule number that is because that's the Let's there's there's no rule that says that this giving up is equated with not living together, absolutely not, your relationship can look however you need it to look, it's your relationship, it doesn't need to look like Hollywood's version of it, or your friend's version of it, or anyone else's version of
it. But once again, like it's not asking too much, and like this is where I was going to go off on is that I think that the way that alcohol culturally is presented to us is that this is something that you should be doing. This is a drug that everyone should take it is the only drug in existence that I'm aware of, or you are criticized or questioned for not doing it, I have been sober for longer than I ever used. So I've had a lot of time to reflect on this. And I'm not anti alcohol by any
means. Like, I don't mind it, I have friends that love it. And I will hang out with them while they drink, I will meet at bars for meetings like I will be right, it doesn't bother me smell that doesn't bother me, it is not triggering for me. I don't care. I don't. But when I think about what it really is, it's an escape, it's a release. And for most adults, it's just about conviviality. And enjoying the moment, most adults can do that. But I have lost my privilege to chemical peace of
mind. And I accepted that and I have no problem with it. What I do have a problem with is people that thinking that they are entitled to take drugs all the time, because alcohol is a drug. And I think it's a ridiculous thing that we just kind of put out in the world that it's normal, it's okay, you should accept my drinking, you should accept the fact that I want to be effed up and on drugs, it is a drug, I'm going to call it a drug as it is all the time. That
is not normal behavior. And you shouldn't feel like you're crazy for telling someone, it's not okay to be on drugs all the time. And if that means that you don't want them under your roof, then great. That's fine. I think that's fair. At what point do we as a society, we become so weak, that we have to put something in our bodies all the time to get by day to day, and that's coming from a drug addict that's coming from someone who did this for 10
years of my life. Third of my life I spent doing this well, actually a quarter now I'm at 40. So or close to
that passion. Either way, this
is my opinion on this, this is where I'm at with it, I think that you should just stand firm and that this is your relationship, it can look however you want it to look. And I think that you are entitled to live life with a partner that values and has the mental capacity and bandwidth and sobriety to value you for what you are. And if they can't do that says all you need to know about them. And a fucking story was I would drop this mic but it was kind of pricey.
Oh my gosh, okay. Yeah, that was awesome. I'm gonna go to the next one. The next one. I can add to that. Number six. So what are some boundaries that you had with Matt while he was an active addiction? Um, well, I didn't have anything that was a second part though.
Right. The second part, so we have to go back to Matt, what
boundaries did you find most impactful for you two part question. Yeah,
yeah, so y'all go ahead. I just wanted to make sure because otherwise, it'd be like another question. Their minds by me being nitpicky. Go ahead answer you were just
trying to control mom trying to control it. That was messed up. Anyway, no. Um, so I didn't like verbalize my boundaries. Technically. I got to a point where I basically stopped nagging and I stopped really giving a shit and I guess what the first boundary that I set was me deciding to live my life and make choices without him. So I would go to my mom's I would go enjoy other people's company without him and I would leave him at home and to suffer and do whatever he wanted to do.
And I got very indifferent with his actions and I would just kind of sit back and just keep to myself unless it came to money. And I said, I'm I started putting up boundaries with my ATM, your ATM withdrawals. So I read financial boundaries, for sure. Yeah, I would start putting alerts on and stuff like that. But I didn't have I didn't know about boundaries, when he was actively using. These are just things that I started to do
naturally. And I'm going to let him tell y'all what he found most impactful.
Yeah, like as she kind of described just now, I think that you nailed it. Like at that point in our lives. There weren't a whole lot of like, verbalize boundaries. And that's partly due, I think, to be the fact that I was hiding my addiction and you weren't 100% sure how much I was doing or if I was really doing it all the time. Like it was.
Like I said, I thought I was just married to a relative asshole. Yeah.
And the other part of is the fact that I was I was 26 years old when I got sober and at 26 years old. You can kind of hide some like, party behavior, you know, like,
yeah, cuz it was normal for us to party with a 35 year old,
right? So, like 26 It's still my opinion, probably a little late to be party.
I was ready for it. You agree four years earlier,
I think the girls grow up faster than boys anyway. But you grew up like, way faster than me. Yeah. But for me, what I found the most impactful was when she started to detach from me and what I wanted to do, and how I wanted to kind of keep her around, and have her in my misery and like, drink with me and smoke with me and do all those things. And she would look at me like, do like, That's pathetic, like, I'm ready to grow up, and I'm ready to kind of like live life and do things.
And she didn't make any apologies for it. Either. She, she started to look at me with indifference. And that's like, the scariest thing in the world is like when your partner looks at you, and they're just like, sort of disappointed, but at the same time, they're like, Man, I'm just kind of done with you that and then you would just go do your own thing. Like you would tell me for instance, hey, we're going to my mom's on Sunday for dinner, and complain
and bitch and moan. And a lot of times, I could get you to cancel and stay at home with me and do what I wanted to do. And then you started just doing it on your own, you would start packing the bag, you wouldn't even say anything, you wouldn't be like arguing with me, you would just pack the stuff. And then at five o'clock, you're just like, alright, well, I'm leaving, I'll see you and go. And I'd have to sit there and my filth and misery and sit with that. And over time, it really
started to eat away at me. It was her way of saying, I will be fine with or without you. I will take care of myself if I have to. I will do whatever I have to do. But this is these are the things that we both at one time agreed to do in life. And now in her own way, she was kind of saying like, whatever it is, whatever it is going on with you. This is not what we talked about. And I'm going to do me
and you do you? Yep. That was the most effective was like living living well is the best revenge they say, you know, yeah, like living well, sometimes the best boundary as well. Right. Okay, last one. How do you live with a functioning alcoholic with children? Dang, yeah.
This one's kind of hard because we haven't. Sydney, our oldest daughter was nine months old. When Matt went to rehab, so we only had nine months of functioning.
alcoholic. Yeah, quote, unquote. Yeah.
And I have to say there were a lot of red flags whenever he would take Sydney to do something or stay up late with her being around like, I was not fully comfortable with him being with her. But I don't think that we can talk too much on this. I mean, Matt can based on Yeah, so um, thing, but like for us? We don't I don't really know how to touch that one.
Yeah, so like personal experiences. I wasn't a functioning alcoholic or drug addict for a very long time with kids. Thank God. I wasn't, I was just unlucky. Lucky that I happen to figure it out then. But I've got a really, really close friend who grew up in a home with functioning alcoholism, and addiction. And I can think back like, so super close, we've talked about this a ton and process a lot of issues about it. And being raised with an alcoholic parent and an
alcoholic home. Or if you're listening, and you come from that background, you know what it was like, you know what that's like, you know, what it's like to have emotionally volatile and emotionally immature parents. Also, what it's like to be around substance use and substance abuse, and how scary that feels as a kid and not at the same time. Being raised in it, you feel like it's
just normal. And I think that's possibly the most dangerous thing that he and I've talked about was that it was it was totally acceptable to get blasted on a Tuesday night. As long as you were at work the next morning, and there was bank and there's money in the bank. That's all that mattered. It didn't matter what you said that night, it didn't matter how much you drank, or where you drove while you were drinking or anything else. That's all that mattered. So it really
normalizes the behavior. And since alcoholism and addiction have scientifically been shown to have a genetic component to them, you think about how dangerous that is for your children. So if you're living with someone who isn't an addict, there's a there's a likelihood that your children could carry the same thing. And their environment could very well unlock it when they're around that person. So I can't speak from experience here. And so I'm not going to go on a limb
and tell anyone what to do. I would just say you have to be incredibly careful. And I think that boundaries are probably part of that conversation that I can't quite have. And I think that that's incredibly complex to like, you know, we're talking about parents that both have a right to their children. But if it's not a safe environment, I think that that's a probably illegal discussion session.
Absolutely.
You know, something that you're really going to have to process and make some really tough decisions on. But I think that, in my mind, my belief is there's no such thing as a functioning alcoholic. It's like, it's like the most ridiculous thing ever. It's like saying that, you know, I have a truck with a blown motor and I get to work every day, you know, fine everyday, like, No, you don't like you're taking Uber, like you own a vehicle, but
doesn't really work. Yeah, it's on a tow truck all the time and doesn't make a difference. Like it's just a horrible example there. But it's just what is the point like you're a functioning alcoholic just be a functioning human. Like there's no such thing as a functioning alcoholic. Like, you can just think about someone who's a quote unquote functioning alcoholic, how much more productive and intimate and amazing and creative they could be if they weren't an alcoholic.
So you can't say your function alcoholic, that's like, you know, that's like a, that's like the minor leagues man, like, you're selling yourself short, you're selling your family short, you're selling your job short, you're selling everyone around, you're short, because you choose this path and this life. And, you know, I don't necessarily believe that whole term functioning alcoholic. And that's a really popular thing. And I believe that for myself
for some time, too. Yeah, because you can, because people think that alcoholics are the dude under the bridge with the paper bag. That's what people think alcoholics are they think that they're homeless, they think, no, we're walking amongst you, everywhere. Yeah, we're all over the place where you're where your bosses, where your friends where your kids, teachers. There's a ton, we're everywhere, all walks of life, and we appear normal, but we're
dying on the inside. Some of them just don't know it yet. They just don't know it yet. But we're all selling ourselves short. If you're not able to experience your emotions from beginning, all the way to the end, that means that you're not processing, which means that you're not learning, which means you're not maturing, and over time, that will bite you in the ass and you won't be a functioning quote unquote,
alcoholic anymore. You will be the dude under the bridge, you will be the guy six feet under you will be the guy in the institution. That's what happens when it's left uncapped. So let's just say you're a functioning alcoholic. It's like, Are you kind of pregnant? Are you pregnant? Yeah. You know, like, right. Yeah, you're an alcoholic. Yeah, just because you go to work. No, alcohol was go to work. Yeah, there's just it's a spectrum. There varying
degrees of it. But at the end of the day, we all have to end up at the same place. If we don't deal with it. You will, your life will end sooner than it was supposed to. Point blank, man. So how do you live with one with children? Incredibly carefully, I suppose. Yeah. It's really tough. This was fun. You said Good. Did I?
You're great at answering questions like on a whim?
No, no, maybe it's a gift of mine. ask us more questions. I'm more than happy to ask what your answer questions about anything, anything relationship stuff, whatever.
Yeah, that was our last question. From what we pulled out. So
yeah, it was a fun one. Okay. You want me to recap it and get it off? Yeah. And close us out here.
Yeah, obviously, I can't talk today.
Yeah, Obama said there'd be days like this, right? I have way too often. You're awesome what you're talking about. Alright, so happenings. You guys have heard in the last episode, I just drew a picture of me. That's awesome. My beard, my curly hair. She drew a funny doodle of me. You should take it up there and show the camera. And that's actually kind of funny. Anyway, a picture of it
and posted we've got. So if you have more questions about any of this stuff, you can reach us via social media, you can reach us via email. And you can find all of those things at our website. www.tufo.com. That's T w fo.com. You can find us there. Reach out ask questions on a personal basis, whatever you want. And we try to get to everybody as soon as we can. So if I haven't gotten to yet or page hasn't gotten to yet, we will I promise. Check out old episodes.
Check us out on YouTube, Tiktok, Instagram, Facebook, you name it. We've also got an awesome Facebook community now called Tufo community. And you get a chance to get in there and not just interact with us but other wheelies other people who are dealing with this stuff, other people who are going through the same things and they have the same mindset that you're in right now, which is how do I get better? How do I grow? How do I get out of this crap that I'm in whatever it might be? We'd love
to have you. Until next time, I am Matt. We'll see you