It is not my responsibility to make sure he's doing what he's supposed to do. I am responsible for myself my actions, I am responsible for allowing him to make his own mistakes without interfering. I am responsible for handling my anxiety and depression. I am responsible for me. Yes, some of the things that happened within our life. Probably the cause of my anxiety, depression, but I'm not going to blame him. It's now my responsibility to fix it.
Welcome back, welcome back to another episode until the wheels fall off. I'm Paige. And I'm Matt. And I'm going to be talking most of this episode that's new. You typically hear Matt's words of wisdom, and it's fabulous vocabulary, but it's my turn. And I don't speak anything like him. I am a dumbed down kind of person and have lousy writing skills and vocabulary. But it's how I roll and you'll get the point. I think you're selling yourself a little short. And now and it might sound like
I'm reading occasionally. But I have to tell you that with this episode, I had to do a lot of writing and reflection. So it might come across a little weird occasionally. But just hear me out. I mean, it's like close to 20 years worth of documentation kind of thrown into a short episode. So I understand that exactly. People will too. Thanks, boo. I appreciate you.
So Matt shared his story of addiction on our last episode, and I'm going to share my experience today. If there's one thing I'd like For anyone struggling with an addict in their life to come out of the story is to feel empowered, like you can do anything. I never would have picked the journey I ended up on. But in reality, I did choose it. I could have walked away many times and live a simple life. But I always saw something in Matt. I've always been his biggest fan, even when
he was at his worst. Thank you. Do you agree with that? No, you
absolutely did. You absolutely did. I don't know what you saw on me. But I'm grateful that you did. Yeah, I didn't give you a lot of evidence that there would be something better but you saw stuff in me that I couldn't see in myself. And you continue to
do so we're gonna take this back to 2001 we were freshmen in high school. I was the girl next door. Matt was the oh so charming bad boy. We met at 14 and clicked immediately. He was so freakin sweet. Y'all he had this confidence and like the swagger That was incredible. He played guitar in a band. He was a natural leader. He introduced me to so many different things like music, clothes ideas, and he always kept me on my toes. I
also had blonde tips. And I think that was a big selling point.
Oh yes. Even rolled up his sleeves which is really funny but anyway, but there were plenty of red flags back in high school you know he had a different home life to where I wasn't even allowed to go there at one point he was always late to school he got in building suspension regularly which was rack by back then wasn't it rack?
No it was in building suspension. What are you think they called it? IBS which is really funny.
I thought it was RAC
I think it was called IBS which cracked me up to know it even back then. I'm like, because couldn't have picked a better acronym for this. That's true. But yeah, you got stuck in a room and because you were in trouble, usually for not shaving it was a dress code violation most the time. Yes,
but you should have known better, but he had excuses for that too. But we'll get into that another time. So his grades were awful to where it like he barely graduated. What was your GPA? Like? 1.2 ish. Yeah, it was crazy. He liked breaking light posts and neighborhoods and like, tore up property all the time, allegedly. There's no proof. He had a lot of freedom. And my parents really didn't like him at one point, but they helped guide him as much as they could. Eventually. So I on the
other hand, had great grades. I graduated with honors, I was in the top 10% of our class. I rarely miss school. I had an after school job at CCS pizza. I was active in clubs. I was the German Club President couldn't tell you a German word except for like, actually British. Not bad. Yeah. And I was just I was just a good girl. So Matt started partying partying a little harder each year. He actually went to school drunk on the last day of our senior year,
I forgot about that I packed a backpack full of coolers.
for that. I do remember that you stole it from your dad, I think because that's what he drank. So I thought it was stupid and cool at the same time. So once he graduated, he started taking pills. I mean, he was taking some in high school, I think but I wasn't really in for sure. Yeah. His temper was starting to get bad and the peer pressure to get me involved was beginning. So sorry, so I smoked pot for the first time on my
18th birthday at his house. He would occasionally give me a hydrocodone because he You could talk me into it like no other. It was crazy what this man could do, or this kid could do to get me to do so, one time he even gave me an oxy and it was probably one of the worst experiences I've ever had on a drug. I got so sick and even felt it the next day on my way to work. I was nodding off and feeling super off and never again did I take one of those bills. I was just so easily
influenced by him. But I always had opinions on how he was doing things. When we moved out at 18, I worked full time and went to college in the evenings full time. So my schedule was super busy. But I ended up dropping out of college because I just I couldn't handle it. It was a lot of friggin work. We both partied like college kids do. But his was always extreme. Every day he had to get messed up. I eventually had my first panic attack at around 19 to 20.
Because I was taking some diet pills I think he gave me I don't remember if it was him specifically, but I couldn't handle it. And there were other factors going on in our lives. And I was just starting to lose myself.
I don't remember giving you diet pills. I'm not saying I didn't I just don't remember these very well.
Well, I sorry. We moved to his college town a few years later, and partying became a norm in our relationship with drank, smoked, had a hell of a time until it wasn't really fun anymore. I was working full time while he was in school. And I had to have some type of structure. So I scaled back on partying.
Yeah, you would like just go to bed and leave us idiots up to Oh, yeah, there
were three. There were always people at our house at this point. Like everyone was partying until like 4am. And I had to get up at six because it was a long drive to work. So I had to scale it back. Matt was smoking, drinking taking Adderall, shrooms X coke occasionally. And I just sat by and watched. Adderall was by far the worst drug that you took you hated that stuff. I hated Matt on Adderall. It literally changed his personality and his
mood. I mean, he would get like, angry and ugly and he wouldn't eat either. And that used to piss me off too, because I'm like, can we please eat some chicken wings or something? And you're like, I'm not hungry. But um, I asked him to quit after college. And he did, but then he picked it back up once we were getting married. After he finished college, we got engaged, and moved to Dallas for our next chapter. I was hoping his college partying style would get better and he'd want structure.
For the record. I too, was hoping for this.
Yes, it was always a constant battle within your head, I'm sure. For sure. A few months before we got married. There was actually an incident that was almost it for me. I don't know if you remember this. I remember this. Yeah, he got drunk. And he said some really ugly things to me in front of some of our friends and some of my family. I actually snapped. He slept in the car. I don't remember sleeping. You did. You slept in the car. You were trying to prove a point. I just
remember this night. I wasn't drunk. You were remember that you thought I was drunk. That was the problem. But we made up the next day. He was very good at apologizing and trying to make things right. Like he normalized all of his behavior. But he did promise one day, he would be a great man. At one point, he started getting back injections. So Matt hurt his back when he was like 18 or something. And it's also kind of in his DNA that he has a bad
back. But he would always be sent home with a huge bottle of hydrocodone. I'll never forget these bottles. How many pills were in these bottles? 180. Okay, yeah, they were huge. There was a point where he asked me to start hiding them. And then he would fall on my feet to see where I was hiding them. This was what I would do. I didn't find out about this until later,
I would, I would tell her, Hey, you have to distribute these to me because I always take too many. I never really led you on to realize how serious it was. Just Hey, I just don't wanna go through them too quickly. I'm in a lot of pain. You take these. That's how I sold it. And then I would be in the bedroom, you would walk out of the bedroom. And then I would get on my hands and knees and look under the door and follow your feet to see where you went.
And then I would essentially narrow it down to a handful of places. You could have hid them based on where you went in the house. Yeah,
because I didn't hit them, like, hide them perfectly. I didn't think this guy was gonna go Snoop for
him. You're also a terrible highter of stuff. Oh, that's true.
It takes too much effort. But this should have been a red flag, right? This guy is telling me to hide his pills because he can't take them like this should totally be a red flag. But I had to pick my battles with Matt.
That's interesting. Because Why did you have to pick your battles because I would do what?
You were blame me. Are you a spinner? You were mean
King King gaslighter undefeated chat
oh my gosh, awful, awful. I mean, he had an awful temper and I was just so insecure that I couldn't handle it. Like I couldn't handle bringing things his attention because patterns showed me that if I were to say something, I was going to be at fault or he was going to talk down to me so low to where I would feel like nothing will just
spin it. I would say that yeah, there is no problem to the extent that there is a problem. You're the problem. Exactly. And just use, you know, all kinds of scare tactics and gaslighting tactics to make you think that you are crazy. Yeah, you did. This is what I did when I was an addict.
Yep. So I was in denial for many years. And that is a very comfortable place to be. I remember that actually. Matt's counselor told me that denial is a very comfortable, comfortable place. And I didn't understand it until she said that I was like, wow, that's, that's actually pretty powerful. But here's the thing that I do want people to know that Matt never got physical with me. So he threw things. He loved to throw phones. He probably went through 10 to 15 phones while we were together.
Yeah, that's about right.
Coffee tables, chairs, there were always holes in the wall. That was
an accident. I was practicing a baseball swing with an umbrella and the handle came off. And it stuck in the wall, which was actually kind of funny. It stuck straight in the wall.
Even in our apartments, honey, there were like holes in the wall. Probably yeah, you there was a thing. So he took his anger and his anger out on things like he would get angry over very small things to like traffic or if something broke in the house, you know, something that he had to fix. Anything that was hard would basically anger you.
Even to this day, I still keep keyboards like old keyboards around because there's nothing better than smashing the keyboard if you're angry. Oh my god, like never used to have a punching bag out. You bought me for Christmas? Did so I could go out and just just wail on it. Yeah, but keyboards are the greatest. Like there's nothing more satisfying smashing keyboard. It's just fun. Sometimes do it for fun.
Okay. And I understand that, but yours is like, Okay, I'm pissed off. I'm just gonna go
Yeah, issues. But so
again, we've been together for so long that this was this was normal. This was my normal life with him. So once I got pregnant with our first child is pretty quickly after we got married, things seemed to get worse. I thought he was going to change. I wanted the perfect family with a present husband who wanted to do all the activities and raise our kids with, you know, extended family. But that wasn't the case. He was emotionally unavailable. He always took hours to run
errands. He'd say he was going to the store or go take a drive around the lake or grab doughnuts that were like 30 minutes away. Or he'd be playing golf. And he lied so much. And I didn't know I trusted him. I thought he was doing these things, but just taking his sweet time. Because I thought there was something wrong with me. And he didn't want to be around. So um, no, he was going to his dealers dammit. I was not gonna get emotional during this
episode. But it does bring up some feelings because it was hard. He was going to his dealers houses and getting his next fix. And he did this a lot. He also had a lot of random people over in our house. But Matt did what Matt wanted. And it was always about him. He began draining our bank account, when we were wanting to buy a house. We barely had enough money to pay rent. And sometimes we had to x ask for extensions. Do you remember doing that? Yeah, that was awful. Yeah, it
was scary. Because I worked my ass off. And I just wanted a husband who cared for me, like I cared for him. I mean, I was I was working a lot. But after our kid was born, the lies just kept happening. And he was never home to help. And honestly didn't trust him with our daughter. It was always scary in the back of my mind when he was watching her.
You know, it's like your story and my story are very much alike. In a lot of ways. I would say that. The one that I can really see and listening and reading through this with you is you always think there's going to be some event in your life that changes things for the better. Like as if by osmosis when when you have a kid or when you get married or when you move or when you buy a home that it's going to change you. Yeah. And maybe it does temporarily, like a really short period of time.
But if you don't address the things that are really going on, this stuff just never happens. And it's you don't know what you don't know you don't see these things until you look in the rearview. But I'm looking through this and you were feeling the same way. I was feeling like okay, things are gonna get better when we do this. Yeah, this happens. It'll get better. It'll fix itself.
And I was thinking the same thing like, right, at some point, I'm going to find something better than what I'm doing and I'll just won't do that crap anymore. Right?
It's wild. It is wild. And I didn't even connect that. Yeah.
Like I'm reading through this and like my house is very familiar. Yeah, yeah. So So what happened with Sydney was born.
So I started to gain a lot of weight. I mean, I gained a lot of weight when I was pregnant with her because I was just pretty miserable. But after that I was still gaining weight. And then I was even drinking heavily because that's what we did. I started to begin my journey of detaching with love, but I didn't know that's what I was doing at the time. You know, I started going to family functions without him and giving excuses as to why he wasn't
there. I was kind of starting to live my life without him in a way, but I was still miserable. I was becoming numb and accepting the fact that this is the life that I chose. Like, I chose a man who didn't give a shit about anyone but himself. I chose a life of anxiety, depression, over indulging, and you know, single parenting, someone once told me, you pick them.
Back up just a second, I remember when you started to detach with love. This was this was near the end of it all. And this was when it started to scare me because it became real in my mind, like, I am going to lose her. Like I can see her being happy without me. She doesn't need me. And as an addict, I can tell you right now, that's one of the scariest things you can do to an addict to start to move on without them.
Do you think that that kind of helped click? Oh, absolutely. It did. Absolutely. Didn't know. It was like not intentional that that's what I was doing. Yeah,
it did. Like it was scaring me because you were showing me that life goes on. I don't need you to live this life that I want. I don't need you. I can do it on my own. And that scared the shit out of me. Ah, dang. Detaching with love is seriously powerful for the person doing it. Yep. And for those that you're showing, yes. I don't need you right now. I can be happy regardless with or without you. Job or no job, whatever. I'm going to figure it out. Right. Right. Yeah, it was powerful. This
powerful. Okay, so the day that he told me he needed help. I was at my mom's because he was out of town for work. And I'm so grateful that my mom was there to help me. I would just go to her house and she would be there to support me or whatnot. I used to have alerts on my phone that showed me when an ATM withdrawal because I still have them Don't you know, I took them off because they were triggering. I think okay, they
might be back on again. But I took them off for years after you got sober because it was very triggering for me. He when He was gone, he took all the money out. I was very, very angry. I was it was a different kind of angry. I wanted to leave right then in there. And I was over and done. But when we got on the phone, he came clean. And he said he needed help. And I just decided I'm not going to throw all the years away just yet. It was time to see if his promise to be a good man would
finally happen. rehab was scary. When Matt went to rehab, I was ashamed. I'll be the first to admit it. I've always said that I was very ashamed. You know, my husband was going to rehab. What does this mean? Who did I marry? Is this real life? We're one of those kids? Yeah, we're one of those people like what is this? You know, there's a there was a stigma attached to rehab. I ended up staying with my mom for a month because Matt owed people money and they knew where we
lived. So I packed our valuables and stayed away. I didn't feel safe in my own home with out him. But the rehab facility had a family program that really opened my eyes to addiction and how I was sick to. I was codependent, I really don't like that word. And we'll tell you why here in a little bit. But I lost my true self and my core values. I allowed him to control me. And I found out that I had a part in all of it. I had my own demons. I thought this is his problem, and he needs to fix it.
But it was far from the truth.
You know, I didn't know about codependency when I got sober either. I thought that once I got sober that two would fix the issue. I had no idea that there it takes two to tango and this relationship between addict codependent and that they sort of feed on each other. Yeah, I had no clue this was even a thing. I think that a lot of people are probably listening, maybe hearing us for the first time that you're both sick. And you don't realize it's not just the person who's
obviously sick, right. It's also the partner of that person that has a lot of their own issues. And in that the last thing you wanted to hear though, was that you had issues.
Oh my gosh, I didn't want to hear that. I was like, What are you talking about? I've been doing everything right is is his problem, not mine.
I heard it put one time that the truth will set you free. But at first it's gonna piss you off. Yep. And I find that to be true anytime I'm ever told hard truths. Yeah. But yeah, it blew my mind too. I'm like, wait, no, no, no timeout. There's nothing wrong with her. This is my issue. They were like, You need to let her walk her path right and walk you
and I'm gonna get to that in just a minute. I want to talk about how it was once you finished rehab. So you were in rehab. for 30 days, yeah. And I was hoping that, you know, he was a new man and everything was gonna be right in the world.
And that was like, What do you mean by that? Like, when I got out,
I thought it was gonna be fine. I thought we were gonna be old Matt and Paige and everything was gonna be great. He's gonna be emotionally available to me and everything was gonna fixed. Yeah, I thought he was gonna be fixed. Yeah. Or the shop gets out. It's fixed. Right. And I thought that he could finally put his family first. Oh, yeah. But that's not true. He had to put recovery. First. He had to go to 90 meetings in 90 days. He had to go to the outpatient. It was
outpatient, right? Yeah, I LP, which was every night. It was every five days a week, I think, yeah, find it for like three hours. So he was not home for 90 days. No, he was always gone. So I was like, okay, drugs consumed him before. And now recovery consumes him. The fuck is this about? Like, I actually blocked a lot of this time out of my mind, because I was processing a
lot. I really did. Like, I can't think back to honest, I went to IOP a couple of times, because I had to do my processing there too. But I don't remember much that was going on. Because I I don't know, it was something that I've just completely blocked out in my brains
a lot that I put you through. So it's understandable,
trying to wrap my head around that he has to put recovery first. Now as we're further into recovery, I think it is the most beautiful thing ever, and he doesn't need to put his family first recovery has to come first. That can actually be another episode that
because without it makes sense to without that at the top of the pyramid. Nothing else is possible, right? Without recovery. The family is not even possible without recovery. The job's not even possible. Yep. So recovery does come first. But in all actuality, like how many hours a week are dedicated to recovery? It's probably like five hours. Yeah, like time that I spend with other people at media. Now it is and it's beautiful writing, doing everything I have to do.
It's good for you. It's growth. It's important for me to accept that. I
think it's important for couples to hear those like yeah, in the beginning. It is a lot. Yeah, it is a lot to adjust. But then once you've got your feet under you, it's pretty minimal time commitment to have the whole the rest of your life ahead of you. Yeah, yeah, essentially be fixed. Yeah.
So within the year, we actually had a lot of changes happen, which he wasn't really supposed to do. But I guess he was just
I spoke with my sponsor on this stuff. And I was in a good place to do it. I did not do this stuff without checking with someone. They say in your first year of sobriety, you're not supposed to make major changes, like, make big purchases or have children in your relationships, or we did like all the above. Yeah. But like I said, I checked with my sponsor, and I had other people hold me accountable that I was in a good place to do these things. Right. So
we were able to buy our first house. Ain't that crazy? Where all that money came from? Yeah, no, right. We were actually able to save money and buy a house. I got pregnant with our second that was not my choice. Oh, come down with all him. That's not true. I love him to death. But yes, I became a stay at home mom. And then Matt was working full time. So we were in a really good, really good place for about five years. You know, new home new kid New Chapter sober husband. Sounds
like a fairy tale, right? I mean, it was great until we weren't Okay, again. But this time it was me.
which blew my mind. First time I haven't been the cause of a problem in my life. Yep. I was sort of proud not to go that
was not me this time. Oh my gosh. Okay, I'm not gonna say anything. All right. I didn't face my demons until they hit really hard about five years after he got sober. So he was working his program becoming the man he promised to be. I was raising these tiny humans and I had a lot of built up resentment in me that I never dealt with my anxiety and panic attacks came back full force when I was about 31. I mean, I'm talking about daily panic attacks. I was miserable every day. I coped
with alcohol and food. I thought something was physically wrong with me and went to the doctor a lot had my head scan. And I even asked Matt to commit me because my attacks were happening daily. I was on I got on medication. I was afraid to work out because I'd have an attack and I fell into a deep depression. He ended up getting me a therapist and I started going every week.
And just to be clear, like, I didn't I didn't like make you see a therapist, and I just thought maybe they should help and then but you were to panic. It was
a boundary that you put up though, but yeah, it was because you did tell me you said I wasn't Sydney's room on the phone with you. I remember specifically you said that conversation I will leave with the kids if you do not get help. You did you told me you put a boundary up and that I was like oh, how dare you say that to me out of all the shit you put me through. How dare you say that to me.
He was coming from a healthy place though. It
was a very healthy place. So that's why I don't hate you for it. I think it's an I think it's a beautiful thing because look where we are now. You know, I learned how to quit blaming others for my issues, I learned how to mind my own business and work on myself instead of worrying about what the hell he's doing. You know, I never worry too much about him using again, because I know that that would be his problem and not
mine. That's huge. Say that, again, I do not worry too much about him using because I know that that is his problem. It is not mine.
That is something that she gets asked about a lot. DMS people will say, well, well, what do you do? Like, do you make sure he's doing what he's supposed to be doing? Do you worry about him relapsing all the time? She truly doesn't. She walks around like, dude, if you that's on you, you know what happens? If you do? So go ahead and try me,
right? Because it is not my responsibility to make sure he's doing what he's supposed to do. I am responsible for myself, my actions, I am responsible for allowing him to make his own mistakes without interfering. I am responsible for handling my anxiety and depression, I am responsible for me. Yes, some of the things that happened within our life, were probably the cause of my anxiety or depression, but I'm not going to blame him. It's now my responsibility to fix it.
Well, the anxiety depression this is the thing is that they were always there. They were just different catalysts that then made them appear in your life every day. So whenever you're scared for your finances, and things like that, because I was using drugs, that's obviously going to cause some panic attacks and some issues and some anxiety. But then once I got clean and sober, and I'm everything, I promise you I'd be and more. And you
still feel that way. And now you have started looking within yourself to say what's really going on in me? And was this always here? It's a journey, you walk and you kind of find out about yourself without, you know, realizing it's like, holy crap. Was there something wrong with me all along? I just didn't realize it. I just blamed you. Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah,
it is. But like these last five years have been where I have grown and learned and that I didn't cause his addiction addiction. I can't cure his addiction, and I am definitely not able to control it. The three C's, the three C's, this is something that we've learned. And I learned in Al Anon and it's in a as well. So I went to an Al Anon a few times, I think it's an amazing program, I really do. I just, I got a lot out of my personal therapy. So I, I haven't really gone to many Al Anon meetings.
But I do suggest anybody who's struggling to seek it, because they will definitely give you some truth bombs and help you handle whatever you're going through. Because we think we can save these people, I thought I could save him, you know, but it's up to us to take ownership in our own lives and become confident and be willing to grow and change. You know, our relationship, we have been down different paths at different times. But we learned a lot from that. And now we have balance.
And we're finally on the same page. And we're able to share with others. So they're aware of how this you know, thing works. Being the spouse of an addict is really hard, but I wouldn't change your journey. I am who I am today because of it. And I have more confidence than I've ever had just by letting go of control and focusing on me. As long as we're willing to accept help and change we can overcome anything. We didn't allow these
situations to define us. Had he not gotten sober when he did I may have either left him or gone down a really dark road myself with depression. I think you were on your way out though. Yeah, I was I was pretty close. But I learned how to set boundaries, to protect myself to detach with love to become an emotionally stable person. So thinking that I can only be free and help if the addict receives help will not work. Our demons will eventually come back to haunt us even if the loved one
is sober. Working on ourselves first is where the healing happens. Yeah, so it's powerful bottle. It really really is.
I think this is something that people have needed to hear that have seen us kind of grow and change and watch us go through this but hearing it from you for the first time is so powerful
it is. So I kind of want to talk about the signs of a codependent real quick about the word I do want to talk about the word so I'm when I first heard that word, I said I am not codependent I hate this word. Like they used it all the time in every program that we went into because I thought it meant I had to rely on Him for everything like financially and a home everything. Because I had my old job. I was financially stable. I was independent. Should I always told myself I'm
independent. I'm an independent woman. Yeah, I'm
way smarter than he is. He needs me You mean all right, right. I'm talking about so
that word threw me off. But let's what's another term Matt that you can think of? I like emotionally reliant. Yes. That's a good one. Yeah, yeah, that's what I like to use is actually relaxing mashed. So these are just some traits of a codependent person. You provide money to support a loved one's habit. I didn't necessarily do that we had a joint account you did. You just did. I just didn't know. Sorry, denies that there is a problem. I did that big
time because I was in denial. I didn't know I didn't want there to be a problem avoids conflict at all costs. I told you all why I avoided content conflicts at all costs. feeling responsible for your partner's thoughts, feelings and actions? Who does that sound like?
Yeah, that's a big one.
Me? Yeah, that's
a good one. That was us for sure.
I'm an empath. I take on emotions. I take on feelings. I'm a highly sensitive person and I will feel what he feels but that's not an excuse to be codependent. So making excuses to cover up their substance abuse, you know, calling in sick for them when they're hungover. I never did that shit some days ago. Yeah, I know. But I was like, no, no. See me there? No, I'm saying yes. When you want to
say no. Did that a lot? Because I didn't want to cause any friction, providing care for them when addiction symptoms present physically, like withdrawal
and stuff. I'm assuming that yeah, it's got to be like, if someone's withdrawing. And you, you baby.
I mean, I didn't really baby because I was getting sick of you telling me you had a stomachache. I'm like, You need to get your ass up and go to work.
I never remember getting sympathy for
it puts me off because I'm like, There's no way somebody sick like this. Like, go to work with this. I'm so tired. Yeah, with your ass wasn't up at 3am till 3am, you wouldn't be tired anyway, I'm getting off topic. I'm putting their needs above your own and neglecting your own self care needs. That was me, you know, I didn't start eating right and exercising 100% until this past year. So I always put your needs
above mine. turning to drugs or alcohol to cope with the stress or dysfunction of the situation. I told you I did start drinking heavily after our daughter was born, so I'm codependent. And I've worked on it. You know, and sometimes, Matt and I will get people who say that their situation is different, and that their spouse is different, and their lives are different. Hear me out, we're all different, right? But we can all change our reality. We were all the same in
this. We can. We're in charge of how we react. And it was just an excuse. I made excuses for years. But if we can change and grow, so can you.
I've heard you don't understand me. Yeah, but I'm different. If you had my job, if you lived where I live, if you had my situation, or my parents, then you would understand. I don't want to hear it man. You are not unique. And if you choose to be unique, I call that terminal uniqueness. Because you have signed your own death certificate and decided that you are so different from everyone else that nothing will work for you to decision made consciously, right terminal
uniqueness. You're signing off, and the fact that you choose nothing will work for you. There you go. It's totally different. So I did want to bring up a few questions that you've been asked a ton. And I know that you've asked, you've talked to me about you. You get this so much you kind of forget. First things first,
when he asked me questions on podcasts, but we'll do this.
This is how stuff has to get edited. Usually, because she gets mad at me. He's like,
it's like you're coming at me. Don't come at me,
bro. So first of all, I think was powerful in your story is that you think that as the partner of an addict, that if the addict gets better than your problems disappear. And likewise for me, I thought that drugs and alcohol were my problem. So it makes perfect sense to assume then, if I were to just get rid of the drugs and the alcohol, so picture them in a basket, and I throw it out the window, I should be better now. Yeah, I should be better after a week of after the physical symptoms are
gone. I should be better. But what do we find is addicts is that we are so miserable because we are inept at dealing with life. It's the inability to deal with life on life's terms. That's my problem, the insecurities and all that stuff. That's my problem. And likewise, for the codependent, you assume that okay, if the addict is my problem, if this person would just get sober, all my problems would be fixed. And then that
person gets sober. And I was sober for five years, living all the promises in the program, and I was doing everything I'd ever sworn to you that I would do. And yet you were still miserable. I couldn't blame the drugs and alcohol anymore. And you couldn't blame me anymore. You have to figure out this stuff is an inside job. Yeah, happiness is an inside job. So let's end with a few questions real quick. Some things I think
people would generally ask. So what would you tell someone that's wondering, What the hell do I do with my addict partner? What was the first thing you would tell them to do?
You can't do anything to help your addict partner. Yeah, deliver
the message that you can't control it. Didn't cause it. Yes. It's a big lesson and it's what these people don't want to hear. But it's a fact it is. It's a fact
you can set up boundaries and you can get somewhat ultimatums not necessarily, but you can set up boundaries and hope that something, you know, clicks, but in reality you there's, it's you like you just have to take care of yourself.
What changes can someone make today to take responsibility for their personal recovery? What would you recommend reading or, or what
I always recommend a book called courage to change. It's actually an Al Anon book and it has like daily stories that help you understand the terminology and what you're going through. And it's amazing. It's a great book, you can get it on Amazon.
Do you ever follow up with me about what I'm doing to work on my recovery? Nope. Yeah, it's, it's super rare. You will throw some really snarky comments sometimes like he's wonky. And you'll say when's the last time you went to a meeting?
Yep. If I'm seeing old behavior, because addicts have a certain behavior, if I'm seeing that old behavior, I will question you, because I'm like, what you're doing, just to make sure he's not totally wonky?
Yeah, I think it's just bringing it to the front of my mind. And I will say, Yeah, you're writing to get to a meeting.
Yeah. It's been a while since we've done that, though.
I've been pretty consistent. Yeah. But so what are some some of the boundaries you built internally and externally to ensure your happiness? And survival? What are some of the things that you've done over the years? Oh, not enabling you? That's a big one. For a lot of people. It's tough to do they think especially after a period of sobriety, like if I were to go to the doctor, like we had, I had an operation that's an operation, injection, epidural injection the other day in the
hospital or whatnot. Yeah, she's not gonna let me walk out of there with a bottle of pills, right, and thinking it's going to be different this time, right? Like you don't enable it, you would certainly say something. Now, if I choose to do that, you have actions for that, too. So what would you do if I decided I'm going to, I'm going to ease back into my old ways.
Now. I'm gone. Yeah, that that's a boundary that I put up pretty quickly, because I spent way too many years with him. Do using that. I can't do that. Again. I'm not going to do it again.
And something I've told her this was right after I got clean and sober. It's like if I ever somehow convince you that it's going to be different this time, and then it's a good idea if I do this. Run. Yeah. Run. Yep. Take everything and run. Yep. That means the wheels are coming off.
Yeah, yeah. And some internal boundaries that I do. And the wheels are coming off. I just know I cut. Sorry. So I mind my own business now. Like, I used to always be up in Matt's business wondering what the hell he's doing even with, like personal stuff, and I'm like, I just don't get involved with stuff anymore. I won't allow your actions to affect my mood. Because that was a big deal. And I just don't I have my own emotions. I don't need yours.
Yeah, you want to be mad over some dumb stuff. Have fun with that. How's it working for you? Yeah.
And one of the biggest things that I've really learned is that I will not do things for you that you can do yourself. So like coming back from the doctor the other day, they give him paperwork and like you they meet, make sure he does all this stuff. And I'm like, he can make sure he does all that stuff. Because I can't control Matt. He will do what Matt does, no matter what I can tell him to sit his ass down and not work out. But there are times when he gets up and he does it that's on
him. He's gonna have to suffer the consequences. Not my responsibility.
That's huge, though. Yeah, shoot, I'm not your third kid. Yep. I refuse. Awesome. So we just recently hit 1000 followers on Instagram, which I thought was
pretty cool. Yeah, it's awesome. Thank you all small
milestone but a big one. Yeah. So if you haven't already, please follow us. Please share. Come and say hello. There might be some stickers in it for you.
Yes. And if there's something that I didn't cover that you might have questions on, please reach out. I will be happy to answer. Same with Matt.
Yeah, same here. So check us out on Instagram at Tufo underscore couple that's TW fo underscore couple on Facebook at to pho couple tick tock as well, right.
Yes. I don't know what it is, though. Come on. I'm sorry. It's twofold. Couple. Sure.
Okay, to that we've got a website WWW dot Tufo couple.com where you can check out some further content. I think it's been a great series and enlightening. I hope for a lot of people to see what it's like on the inside, as a lot of people are dealing with this issue. And thank you so much for your powerful testimony. I know this stuff is hard to talk
about. But I think it's necessary for others because you are a beacon of hope for others for other women and men in the same position where they've got an addicted spouse, partner, brother, parent, whatever, and to show them that they can recover if they focus on themselves. You can't fix the addict and I think there's so much power in that message and so much of that stuff is lost as we try to micromanage the world around us. You have found a way to be happy in spite of all the
crap. Yep. And that's, that's incredible. I'm so proud of you. Thank you. Alright, so that wraps it up. Please follow check us out on Instagram, Facebook, Tik Tok all the things. And until next time, I am Matt,
I'm paying and we'll see you.
Soon