Attention, Gek Nation. I am going on tour across the US to nine different cities to be a Gecko and talk to people just like I do on this podcast, except I will be on a stage at a place doing it live. If you want to come see the podcast live, tickets are available now for these cities Washington, d C. Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, New York City, Boston, Massachusetts, Miami, Florida, Chicago, Illinois, Denver, Colorado, Nashville, Tennessee,
and Seattle, Washington. So if you live in any of those cities and you want to come catch the podcast live, the link to buy tickets will be in the episode description. The tickets will sell out fast, so if you want to go, you should get them now. Anyway, let's get into the calls. Hello, Hello, Hey is this Liz.
It's live liv But yeah, that's up.
What's going on there?
Yeah?
This is this is GHEK g E c K. What's up?
Gig?
Thanks for picking up. I appreciate it.
What can I what can I? What can I do you for? Liz?
Before I start with my whole story, can I ask you a question? It's a good question, I promise it's not.
How are you sure asked me the question. I'm down for questions.
What has been the most persistent thought on your mind recently?
The most person some thought on my mind recently has been why do I do the things that I do? In a universe where I acknowledge that I can theoretically do an infinite number of things, Why have I chosen
to do what I am doing currently? I never come up with a lasting answer to that question, but it is something that I think about very often, which you know, and I think about it because the things that I do are also related to the things that cause me happiness as well as the things that cause me unhappiness, and so I weigh the happiness they cause against the unhappiness they cause, and every day ask myself if it is worth it? And every day I have a new answer.
Are you happy being Gek?
Yes?
Some days, you know, some days are more difficult than others. Some days I'm very grateful.
You know.
I'm always asking myself these questions because you know, I recognize I can. You know, I don't really have to do anything. You don't really have to do anything, so, you know, we choose to do things for reasons that I think are important to think about.
I love that answer.
Honestly, what's going on with you, Liz.
Tolid I just wanted to tell you about how I like legally got kidnapped when I was seventeen and shipped off to go to this wilderness therapy rehab place for ninety days and I'm looking up on the like five year anniversary and it's just a trip to think about.
Is this something that your parents sent you to? Mm hmm yeah, okay, So let's start with why did they send you to this place? What is it that you were doing that caused them concern?
I'm honestly a build up of like six is ish years of super heavy benzo addiction plus like almost a year I'd say, like ninety ten months of like heroin addiction is what finally, you know, put them whatever my foot in the door to go to the wilderness.
Interesting? And was this the first thing that they tried or did they try a lot of different things that didn't work before this?
I mean they've tried calling the cops and like getting me like put in a drunk take for one night that didn't really do anything. They try to like cut me off. I had to live in my car for a good period of time. But this was kind of yeah, like the most drastic thing that they did.
I would say, hmm, it's interesting, and I want to get into the actual experience, but it's interesting to me that they would go from cutting you off and deciding not to deal with the problem to Okay, let's give this one last shot by organizing a kidnapping to utah, right.
And not even like one last chance, but like that shit was expensive, like one Like they went from cutting me off completely, Like I was like bumming it for a while, like qt Tiketo's type. Every single day it's all I tod eat. But yeah, they spent like fifty sixty grand on this fucking wilderness kidnapping rehab shit. And so I think that I think about that a lot too.
Okay, so you're having all these issues, your parents try these things, they try cutting you off, and then they go, you know what, let's let's ball out on the kidnapping and what was that? What was that? Like? How did like when you said you were kidnapped, where where did they like take you? Like where were you when people came to bring you to that place?
Yeah, it's technically they call it goony, which is just like another word for kidnapping, honestly. But I was going out with some of my friends and I didn't know that one of them had like already talked to my mom, and my mom guilt tripped her and was like, Olivia's going to kill herself if she's not, like, you know, sent to rehab. And so she told my mom where
we were going. We were just going to get sonic at this place sitting nearby, and it was like eleven thirty twelve, kind of late, and this black as UV pulled up and this guy hopped out and physically grabbed me and put me in the backseat of the car, closed the door. There was another guy in the passenger seat and the doors were locked. I like instantly try to open them, and I drove off and five hours later, literally five hours from where I am in Arizona up
to southern Utah. No, they didn't answer any of my questions. They didn't talk at all. And I got there and they handed me my phone and my dad called me and he was like, yeah, so you either like stay out there or I don't know, like that's that's it, Like that's the last you'll be hearing from us. So you either graduate and tough it out, or you like be homeless and for real cut off your family.
So is this I mean, well, yeah, when this first happened, I mean to not know that this is a thing that's being orchestrated by your parents and to just be throwing in a van, I mean you must have thought, yeah, I like legitimately actually kidnapped. Yeah.
I was like here, like here it goes like it's actually happening, like sex trafficking whatever, you know, woman's biggest fucking fear, right it was. I was like solving. I still have like I worked through this PTSD for years in therapy and still kind of have a little bit of like I'm shaking talking about it because it's still so like real and okay raw.
So all right, So you get to the place you're talking to your dad on the phone. He says you got to do this or else we're done with you. What What is your what is your sort of initial reaction now that you're like, okay, I'm not being you know, kidnapped. This is the thing my parents have orchestrated. This is a deal they're making. What's going through your head at that point, honestly just.
Like disbelief and more confusion because I'd never heard of like wilderness therapy, Like what the fuck is that? You know, it's not very popular like where I'm from, And I was just more confused, and then I was a little mad, and then I was just like defeated, And honestly I was I was like shooting up Heroin at the time regularly and knew I was fucking up and was just
like in this horrible place. So I kind of finally was just like, you know, what, fuck it, Like if this is how I'm going to get the help I need, Like, this is how I'm going to get the help I need.
Okay. So you there was some resistance at first, but eventually you were like, Okay, maybe this is the only way, so fuck it, let's just do it.
Exactly.
Yeah, okay. And you were there for ninety days.
Mm hmmm, yeah, three months.
So give us the rundown of what your life is like for these three months.
Every single day except for the two like layover weekend days, is pack up camp, pack up everything we need on our backs, and hike like at least eight to you know, fifteen miles to our next camp, unpack, you know, make a fire, set up our little camp, eat, go to bed, wake up, pack, hike every single day for ninety days. It's like their whole motto was, you know, healing and like getting trauma and like all all the shit out through physical exercise and like holistically being in touch with
nature and blah blah blah blah blah. But yeah, that's all we did. I carried a backpack bigger than me, heavier than me on my back all day every day and got crazy fucking blisters and had to be put on like suicide wash multiple times. This was just imagine a group of fourteen teenagers being thrown out, no tense or anything. All we get is a sleeping bag, and it's hard that we have to learn how to make a shelter with and so like beans and rice.
So you know, you said you were shooting up heroin every day and then you came here and you're doing like this, Uh, you know, strenuous physical activity. What how is your because you know it's it's one thing to you know, go from not being I don't know, I don't know how physically active you were at this time, but to go from you know, being put in this situation where you're doing all this intensely physical stuff, but also to go from there while you're also I assume
going on withdrawal from Heroin. How does that work? They like, you know, I know that some places they like give you a they like wean you off of it so that your body doesn't, like, you know, go absolutely nuts. Like how how is your body responding to all of this? How are they helping you through all of this?
So for the first like week and a half, we didn't hike at all, and all the kids fucking loved me because like I was withdrawing so bad that I couldn't even move, But they only sent a nurse up every once in a while. They didn't give me any like medication to help the withdraws except for like ibuprofen
and a mild like sedative. But it was horrible. I just have like I feel like my brain kind of blocked a lot of it out because it was just like physically and mentally the hardest thing I've ever done. But I have like memories of laying in my sleeping bag on the dirt, like sweating and like puking in the dirt and there just like being on the side of my sleeping bag and I can't move, and I'm just like rolling around and just baking, like in my
sleeping bag in the sun withdrawing. Like some one of the staff members would come and check my my blood pulse or my blood ox and my pulse and everything every once in a while. But that was about it. It was like it was insane and intense and honestly fucked up.
Now, you said that everybody there in general, you said, you said everyone there loved. You said every you said all the kids there loved Why did why did all the kids there well and you? And then and then to explain that you said they loved you because you were withdrawing a lot? What did you What did you mean by that?
I just meant they didn't have to hike at all. They got to like stay in one camp for like a week and a half and just chill and like they ended up learning how to make hammocks and like doing all this ship and so like that's what I meant. Sorry if I was confusing, they didn't have to well.
It kind of it leads me into my next thing I'm curious about, is what is your relationship, like with the other kids at the rehab at this time, are you forming connections with anybody? What is that like?
While I was still like in active withdrawal, the only connections I was forming were with the staff that would like sit by me basically make sure I didn't die. But I was not in any state of mind to function like any sort of human and make connections. But after like a month of the withdrawal and then the anger and the sadness and just like being in my own head, I kind of got in the swing of things and made friends that I still you know, FaceTime multiple times a month now.
Hmmm, So you made friends that you still keep in touch with. Yeah, after going through the first month of of just like physically adjusting to the new surroundings.
Mm hmm.
Yeah.
Because you're sleeping outside with someone you know, with someone twenty four hours, seven days a week for months at a time, You're you have to go, like with the buddy to go on a little walk, to take a shit. You know, we're we got pretty close pretty fast.
And are these other kids are is this is this kind of the first time at that point that you are meeting other people who also have really bad problems with drugs.
No, because I have some family members with you know, inactivity and have passed because of addiction, and some of my friends and like their older brothers. But this is the first time I ever was around anyone that struggled in the ways I struggled, but also like kind of wanted to not continue this like shitty pattern.
Yeah, this is the first time you're around other people who are showing a desire to change.
Mm hmmm.
Does that do out of a positive effect on you?
Yeah? I think that like the other people that were there, the other students with me, did more than like any of the therapists or staff members or you know, hiking could have done. Just like that community that I built was is amazing, super cool.
So tell me about this. You get there, uh, you know, at first, you think you're getting fucking kidnapped. You kind of are like, all right, you know, it's either this or the highway, so let's do it. The first month you're withdrawing like crazy, you're in no mind to function properly.
And then, as you tell me, after a month of just like powering through the harsh physical realities of your situation, you sort of get to a point where you are are leaning into it more and you're making these these friends, you know, these people that you still talk to. Tell me about that transition from uh, you know, I can't do this, I'm throwing up on them everywhere to okay, fuck it, let's you know, tie some knots and you know, cook fucking mike campfires and shit.
Yeah. So I think eventually I just got to this point of like acceptance, like I'm already out here, I might as well learn all these skills and engage in these activities so I can sleep comfortably and stay dry if it rains, and know how to build a shelter and know how to you know, make better food on the fire than this just beans and rice every single day.
I thought I was gonna be out there, might as well like make something of my time and not just go through the emotions like I think it's sad, Like I know some people that just went out the exact same, like, went through all of that physical and emotional and financial, you know, struggle just to walk out of it the same. So I got to that point and I was like, you know what, fuck it, I'm gonna have fun out here because that's just the type of person I am. Enjoy the journey.
So I like, I really am trying to piece together the full story of the character arc that I'm seeing of, you know, month one, month two, now in month three, as we're sort of nearing the tail end, as you're forming, you know, what you say is a community of of you know, other people who really want to get better, you know, people who you formed an elastic connection with. What is going through your mind as you're nearing the program?
Who are you? What's going on with you physically? What's what's the picture there?
I I feel like I finally came into myself. Like month three was live, you know, becoming this person and the old Olivia kind of dying off. I had like this whole ceremony to like bury my past self and to leave everything out there and like genuine me try to you know, make something of my life in blah blah blah. And so yeah, it's like month three, I just I learned that I wanted to be a leader.
I learned that I wanted to work in the outdoors like wilderness, not necessarily rehab, but definitely like touring.
Something that interesting.
I learned that I'm a uger, total like fucking dirt bag, and before I was I thought I was like a city type, suburban girl, but that's not the case. So it was cool.
That's fascinating to me that you were when you were thrown into this. It was like, you know, a really you know, fucked up, you know, shitty time, and and you're being forced to do all this stuff and then you come out of it, you know, feeling like it's your it's your passion, and it's the environment that you really uh identify with.
And not even identify but like thriving. No, yeah, it's super cool. I so parents a lot for like getting the balls to send me out there.
Yeah, that was something. So a really important question I have is you know, I mean, you're telling me that you know, you're when you described being kidnapped in the van, you know, thinking that you were going to get like, you know, something horrible is going to happen to you.
I mean, you're telling me that you have PTSD from that, that your voice shakes from that, that it was just a really fucked up thing, and yet you you weigh that against the fact that by the end of this program, you know, I mean undeniably it did a lot for you. And as you said, just now that you have your parents to thank for it, how do you reconcile those two feelings? You know what I'm saying.
Kind of?
Are you ultimately thankful to your parents for you know, putting you through all that, even though it was really difficult.
Yeah.
Yeah, at the end of the day, I'm thankful that they spent the money, honestly is what it comes down to. But thankful for sure because it made me like find you know, what I want to do with my life, and I want to start like a whole career in wilderness therapy, but maybe try to develop one that doesn't consist of the kidnapping and the like just so many fucked up things in wilderness therapy, and I just I want it to be more inclusive and more safe and
more available. And without my parents sending me, I wouldn't know any of this and I wouldn't have this like passion. I started going to community college so I can get a master's in psychology, so I can become a wilderness therapist, so I can like actually have some credentials to like start this nonprofit type wilderness therapy and it's going to be more of like a mental health and addiction therapy, just.
Like addiction.
So tell me when you get okay you oh no, no, it's fine. When you get back from the wilderness retreat rehab thing, what happens then? Do you move back in with your with your with your mom and how are things? How is the relationship when you first get back.
So one of the requirements for graduation is that everyone goes to like a halfway like sober living place before they can go back back to their regular environment and you know where some triggers or some old friends or whoever may be there. They have to because going like from living deep in the woods for months at a time, like no phone, no showers, like no toilets, it's overwhelming and overstimulating. And I couldn't even sleep on a bed
for the first couple of days. It was scary. So they for sure like try to send you, usually out of state to like a sober living building halfway house. So that's what I did. I went to Salt Lake City to a halfway house, and it was super scary at first. I felt like a little like beer and headlights, Bambi, like car horns, were so loud and there were so many people, and I didn't even want to leave this like little room that I got in this you know,
halfway house. But I got my groove and I met the love of my life eventually and it all worked out. But yeah, you have to go.
Oh you met, you met, you met a significant other in the halfway house.
No, no, he just lives in Salt Lake City.
Too, Okay? Are you still with him?
Yeah?
So, uh, you know, I well, Olivia, thank you for is it live, Lvia, it's live, live, so live. Thank you for sharing all this stuff with us. I want to get before we go, like a picture of where you are, you know, right now. So, so, how long ago was all this stuff? Five years? You said? Mm hmm, yeah, okay, seventeen yeah, the end of twenty seventeen. And so are you still with the guy that you met in fuck? I think I already asked you that. So you're with the guy that you met in Salt Lake City? Are
you guys gonna get married at any point? Are you thinking about starting a family?
Probably not. We are kind of in like a very open, non monogamous relationship.
Nice and he lives up in Alaska, right now, he's doing like tours and weeded guides up in Alaska and he actually lives with his boyfriend up there.
And I'm in Arizona and I'm living with my girlfriend. But we are still like very much together and we text almost every day and I hope to marry him one day. I want to marry him.
And Uh, what's your relationship like with your parents now?
Pretty good? Yeah, it was a little rough like right after because I like came out to them and I can test a lot because I just wanted to get everything out on the table while I was up there, So it was a little awkward at first for sure. But yeah, I think that relationship has grown tremendously and we're pretty close now. We talked and I see them a lot.
Well, Olivia, fuck I called you a living and live well live. So you you have a good romantic life, You have a good relationship with your parents. You have these dreams of starting this wilderness retreat that is based off of, you know, the sort of dos and don'ts that you learned from your own experience. I'm really happy to hear that that that things have worked out for you like this, and I really appreciate you, you know, sharing this very very unique and interesting experience. It's it's
it's you know. I know it sounds like it was a lot, but I am glad to hear that it ultimately sounds like it changed you for the better, and that you hope to give that change for the better to to other people via what you're pursuing Live. Is there anything else that you want to say to the people of the computer about this experience, or about anything at all, or any sort of you know, aspect of this that you feel like we didn't cover that you
want to share, or anything at all. The floor, the floor is yours.
Yeah, I just want to say to all of the people listening on the stream, please speak out about your mental health and ask for help, and do not think that suicide and drastic measures are the only option, because they are absolutely not. And yeah, there's the suicide hotline, there's friends, but just take care of yourself and don't don't kill yourself. It's illegal, it's not allowed.
Live. Thank you very much for calling, and good luck to you and have the rest of.
The night.
You too.
By get that was a really interesting story for Live to share with us. Lots of character development. That's those are my favorite stories and things on here is when you start as one thing and then you you know, something happens, and by the end of it, you're another thing. And yeah, I'm glad to hear that live. You know, even though she was dealing with some pretty hard hit shit,
it eventually all changed her for the better. And now she's using her experience to hopefully go and help other people. And I think that that is neat and you know, maybe in her wilderness program she will add somemores. I think that that is a good thing to have. Thank you again for sharing liv.
Hey.
This is Kyle.
Hello, Yeah, this is Kyle.
How's gone Kyle?
It's going very good, Kyle.
It says here that you are an aspiring stand up comedian, but you're wondering if this is something that you should actually pursue.
Yeah, so.
This is the thing.
I don't have my license, so I haven't had it.
I'm getting it this year, probably in by the end of September, and I have not had the chance to go to a club and do an open mic. And you I heard you on the stream. He said, you want to give me a couple of chance to do some jokes.
Well, I just thought of a few, Okay, Yes I did. I did say. I did say that there was an aspiring comedian and the call Q, and that I would love to hear him give some jokes. So definitely, let's hear some jokes.
All right. Well, I'm a heavy smoker, but at least I'm not blind, because I'd probably light myself on fire.
I wouldn't walked into a stop sign.
I learned that day.
The only thing to get me to stop talking was a stop sign.
Anything else.
No, those are just off the top of my head.
I mean, I can think of one more if you.
Want me to like you? Like you mean, if you just thinking of one right now?
Well, those two I saw as you were like staying my name?
Okay, and so do you do you feel like if I okay? Yeah, why don't you try? And why don't you try and think of one more and then and then tell it to us?
Uh?
I'm not in due guy myself, But the combination not complete without Dorito's or cryptocurrency.
Okay, So let me ask you, Kyle, why do you want to become a stand up comedian?
I used to Well, my friends and I especially my.
Friend Dave and shout out to Dave Carlos and Nick. So, my my friend Dave and I we used to watch Joe Rogan a lot, even before he got popular, and then through all through Joe Rogan, I got introduced to his bert like Joe Rogan's friends like Burt Kreischer, Theo Vaughn, Tom Segera and stuff like that, and they're always saying how difficult the comedy scene was, but how much it pays off to be on page. And I've always really loved the attention. So if I can do it, then
that sounds great. But I also heard that you were you were trying to do that for six years, and I was wondering myself, what made you change.
Up the things?
Because, you know, for for a stand up comedian like me, what would stop me from starting If you've already done this for six years?
You know what I mean?
Let me you know. Yeah, So I did stand up comedy from about sixteen to twenty two. I kind of kind of slowly faded out of doing it and into doing other things. Can I can I give you some advice? Of course, you said you like attention. Here's here's here's what I'll tell you about Open MIC's stand up comedy is, if you want to go do Open Mike's stand up comedy and you only do it because you really love
being on stage and telling jokes. If you only do it because you love being on stage and telling jokes, even on nights where you don't do well, even on
nights where you bomb horribly, you still love it. If that is the reason why you're doing it, and that's the reason why you continue to go, do it is for absolutely nothing other than you love getting on that stage and telling those jokes, and not for any reason of anything that happens surrounding that, you will be significantly happier than you know anyone who does not operate from that place, you operate from any other place such as you know, I really I really want to you know,
be successful. I really want to do this for a living. You know, if you operate you know every day, every time you go out from that desire, you will be very very unhappy. So that's all I will tell you about. So let me ask you, so, So let me ask you this. Having said that, would you say that the reason why you want to do stand up is simply for the love of being on stage and telling jokes. Absolutely, then I think you will be more successful than other people who who do not operate from that place.
And you know what's the thing about it is, especially like you said too, you don't want to go in there.
For the money mindset because that pollutes it.
Man, you just want to be as she like.
I'm sure that this is what you think too, and everyone who's talented with it, like, even if I think that this is what they think, I think that if.
You are the kind of god like, this is what I want to do. I want to do it as a hobby. I want to go up on stage and do it like whenever I have the spare time, and that's it. And if I get successful, that's great. If not, it's just a hobby, you know what I mean?
Oh yeah, yeah, no, no, no, I think I think you'll be fine then if that's if that's the mindset that you're going in with. And and by the way, I you know, I'm not, I hope. And it's not like I'm being a dick or being facetious, because I actually mean that. I would tell you that, you know, I would tell that to anybody, you know, because I think if you go in with some heavy expectation of results, you will just be unhappy. But if you go in because you actually like to do the thing, then you
know it doesn't even matter. You know, how good you are or anything like that.
Is there any your stand up comedy out there on the YouTube?
Yeah, there's a fucking video of me. If you want to go see me do stand up comedy at eighteen years old, you can find it. I'm not gonna tell you how, but it's there. It is on the internet.
Hey listen, Well, I'm going to try to get to New York and maybe i'll see you there. I don't want to hog the stage again, but I do want to see you as like a guest of the venue. And on top of that, maybe I'll start a podcast too, and I'll give you a shout out there if it ever gets popular.
Kyle, you're exactly the kind of person that this world needs, and I appreciate you calling into this podcast.
I appreciate you and your team for taking the call.
My friend, have a good time.
You too.
Bye.
I have so many post call thoughts on Kyle. Yeah, I did do stand up comedy for a while, you know, stand up comedians. Uh, they're they're very big shit talkers, and it's probably because of some kind of underlying unhappiness. But I really, I really meant everything that I said to Kyle.
Uh.
If Kyle is going into this simply because he enjoys being on stage and telling jokes, even if he's doing it to zero people at an open mic, Kyle will probably be happier than a lot of the stand up comedians out there who are mainly in it chasing some idea of you know, success or some sort of external outcome.
And I know this because I went into stand up comedy also pursuing some kind of external outcome, and it's you know, it's It's part of the reason why I think I quit is because I got to a point where I was like, man, unless if you really just love being on stage telling jokes, you're not going to get anywhere with this. And I didn't feel that way. I really didn't like being on stage after a while because it always made me nervous, and you know, I didn't like when it wouldn't go well, so I couldn't
hack it. You have to you have to like be having a good time even when it's not going well because you're just you just love fucking doing it so much in order to get anywhere with it, So, you know, God bless. I hope he gets farther than I did. Hello, Lyle, Hi is this Jay?
Yes?
It is?
What's going on? Jay?
I'm driving to see my family this weekend.
Okay, so you're where We're in a car.
We're in a car, Yes, I have my dog with me.
How fast is the car going right now? I want to really set the scene.
We're at about sixty two miles per hour going down a long highway back road to Tennessee. Bought the trees.
I gotta say. Normally, when people are on the car phones or speakerphones, I can't hear them at all. But you've got a pretty good car phone.
I actually have I thought a head while I have my AirPods in and my hair's covering it. So hopefully no cops can see me.
This woman. Yeah, I was about to say that sounds extremely illegal, but anyway, Jay, it says here that actually know what it's like. Do you want to you tell me what's going on?
Oh? Yeah, it's a little bit strange, but I you know that all the time. So I was doing some research and apparently this is a thing that other people have too. But ever since I was younger, uh, I have this like infatuation with like when fictional characters, particularly attractive men or men that I'm attracted to, uh, get injured like they're fictional characters. Though I don't think it's like in real life. It's like in fictional situations in books, movies,
or TV shows. And I don't know how to describe it, but I get like this feeling of butterflies light pleasure, and it's always perfected me. Why it happens. It's confused me for years, and I have no idea what it means, uh why it happens? And I wanted, uh an anonymous opinion from you on what the fuck is happening here?
Okay, So I don't know so so so to sum it up, when you when attractive male characters in uh fictional stories are injured, it brings you pleasure.
Great and it.
Says it says sexually, I don't think. Okay, that was that was was gonna ask is any of this sexual?
I know, I don't think. So It's just kind of like, you know, when you feel like really like into something and like passionate about something kind of like that, like okay, but I also get butterflies in my stomach.
It's okay, but flies in your stomach and it makes you happy. But it is it is not a sexual thing.
I don't think so. I mean I never had thought to do anything sexual when it happens.
No, okay. And it says that there's a name for this. Is there a name for this? It says, it says the name is wump. Is this real?
Yes? You can actually yeah, you can actually look it up.
I'm what.
Yeah. And there's like playlists on YouTube of like clips of people getting hurt.
Okay. Okay is a term which originated in the fan fiction community to describe a genre of fan fiction in which a character endures injury, torture, or other forms of mental and physical suffering. Yes, yeah, okay, all right, so you're into onump. All right, So so wump is not This is not a this is not enough DSM. This is just a fan fiction thing.
I don't think.
So.
Okay. When you said, when you said, there's a word for it, okay, what is a genre? It's not. You don't have it. It's it's just a genre that you're into, I guess.
So it's something that I enjoy partaking, for listening, watching whatever.
Okay, cool, all right, let's get into it. So, uh, have you told anyone else about this?
No? No, it's it's one of my deep dark chains and I don't ever want to talk about it. I actually mentioned it was one person, my boyfriend, but I haven't gone into depth about it because it's I don't know, it just doesn't make sense.
What is uh, what was the conversation with your boyfriend?
Like? Well, I basically just said what the term was and didn't go any farther than that. He wasn't like judgmental or anything that was good. He kind of just laughed about it and shrugged it off.
All right, So I have another question. I have another question for you. I need you to answer this honestly. Yeah, well, the answer this will tell me the truth.
I honestly.
In the news with real life people, if like like ye, has anything like that ever given you a similar pleasure? Let's say, for example, I don't know who you're into, but let's say if Chris Evans some video went viral of him like breaking his arm playing bratt basketball or some shit. Would that be something you were into interesting?
Interesting? My immediate answer that comes to my head is no. But I've never experienced something like that in the news, so I can't really tell for sure.
Sure, Okay, so you don't know, I said, So the answer is the answers You've never come across it, so we don't know.
Yeah, I guess so, and I don't. I don't know. If I ever want to come across it, I don't.
I don't.
Yeah, okay, so okay, So it's not a sexual thing. It just gives you butterflies. Okay, So Jay, tell me how has this affected you in your actions, if at all, in your day to day life.
I wouldn't say it really affects me socially on a social basis between people, but there have the nice rise stayed up like hours and hours just watching like videos, okay, characters like getting injured and stuff passing out, anything like that made me watch a lot of like fucking TV shows that I'm not even interested in, but just like want to see that situation play out on the screen. I think that's the biggest way it was more intense.
In high school, a couple of years back, but I can still feel it sometimes when I'm watching shows nowadays.
Okay, because I I you know, I'm not a real therapist at all, but my my working philosophy on things like this, Uh that is like and I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't know. I don't know. But I've always kind of felt like, you know, well, okay, well so I've always feel like thoughts and feelings and obsessions are are rather dormant and uh not crazy you know, big problems until they start to have uh you know,
manifests as actual negative things. Uh Like if if if these obsessions are causing you to like, you know whatever, you you don't do your class work because you're watching fan fiction of Prince Eric breaking his arm or what. I don't know why I keep focusing on people breaking their arms, But you know what I'm trying to you know what I'm trying to say, if it's if it is negatively interfering in some sort of concrete way other than you like to watch it, you know, is it
negatively impacting you? Is it negatively impacting anyone that you care about? That's that's the real thing that I'm trying to think about when we're thinking about is it a problem?
I don't.
I wouldn't say it's a huge problem. No, it's more of just your thought. I've been wanting to discuss this with somebody who doesn't know me.
I would say, Okay, so we've established it's not a problem. Was just cool, So I mean we could dive deeper. Okay, so we can dive deeper into why you feel this?
Maybe perhaps that's kind of what I'm like.
I guess, why do you feel this?
That's a great, excellent question. The only explanation I've been able to kind of come up with in my head is it puts this character who's supposed to be traditionally manly and tough and super like stoic into this situation where they're actually like showing emotion in some way and they're vulnerable, I guess, And it creates like a sent
of urgency for the characters around it. So I guess I kind of like the dynamic that it creates between like that character and the other characters, and like how it changes the story completely, and it also it like it I think. I don't know, have you ever played The Last of Us?
I have not.
Damn it.
Okay, to summarize that, it basically like shows the true relationship between two people and homemuch they actually care for each other.
I guess is okay, So you're describing this less as some sort of weird negative obsession over human suffering and more so as a narrative device or a character building device that you find interesting.
Yeah, you can look at it that way.
I've never thought of it that way.
Okay, Well interesting. Why do you think that you are so uh protective of telling other people about this?
Mainly because it's so difficult to describe. It takes a lot of words to describe, and I just don't want to take that effort to do that, Okay in daily conversation, I guess okay, and I didn't fully understand it. I guess I go ahead.
But now you are in the fan fiction community, I.
Assume I used to be no longer anymore.
Okay, So you probably I mean, I you know, I know you haven't discussed this with uh, you know, you're a boyfriend, or with any of your friends or anything like that. But I assume you've talked about this or or you've at least read on forms other people who are into this.
Yeah, to some extent I have, And.
Have you picked up anything interesting or helpful from that?
Nothing?
Aside from that, there's other people that experience it. I think there was a term that one of them used, like the lumper flies or something in terms of like the butterflies that you get. So it's definitely not just me, I guess is the main thing that I learned a lot of other people experience it, So it can't it can't just be something that's exclusive to like my upbringing. It's got to be tied to something like I don't know how you're brought up, or like some trigger that
happened when you were younger, something like that. Because it's, like I said, it's not just me, it's it's a community of people.
Right right, I learn more about it, Yeah, I feel like the fact that it's a whole community of people opens up the various reasons as to why you could be you could be attracted to this sort of thing. But I mean, lit's say, before we go, Jay, do you feel as though talking about it has given you any further insight into it?
I think so. It's definitely made me think of it in a less shameful way, which is helpful. I think it kind of changed my perspective. Maybe I shall share it with some close friends of mine, talk it through them as well.
Listen if it makes you feel any better. The other day, after the stream ended, I stayed up until one o'clock in the morning watching videos on Reddit of people getting hit by cars.
Interesting.
What kind of emotions did that bring you?
I I like a car would be like, you know, send a person flying and right at the impact, I would go that was the emotion. Yeah, I know, it's a shock. I couldn't honestly, I don't know if I could explain it. Yeah, I know, there's definitely a thrill of it. I was on shout out r slash crazy fucking videos. There's some insane it's not cool. I totally I don't know what the fuck I'm doing on when I am watching like don't go, don't go there, don't
war sufficient warning to people, don't go there. It's fucked up stuff. But I got sucked into it, just like a morbid curiosity. There's sort of there's like a Memento Maori element to it, where it's like it shows you the fragility of human life and kind of almost makes you have a little bit more respect for your own uh brutality. But I totally don't go there if you're not into very fucked up things. Anyway, thank you very much for calling you.
You're welcome. Thanks for talking with me.
Have a good night.
You too, Ullo.
Hi there, what's going on.
Hither Lyle? I'm doing I'm doing just fine. How about yourself?
I'm a gecko on the computer and it feels good. I was saying at the top of the stream that it really does. It really does feel nice to get, you know, get into other people's lives and thoughts and ship because it I feel like it lets me take a break from my own. So so I'm enjoying doing that this evening.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
It's almost like you're plugging yourself into the metaverse whenever you're I guess, experiencing someone else's thoughts and whatever they're sharing, like reading a book.
Maybe yeah, a little bit, a little bit like like plug we're plugging ourselves like metaverse.
Perhaps of a lower resolution, but of the same milk.
I would say, perhaps, So, what's going on with you today? Alan?
So I want to talk about just the coping mechanisms. I mentioned to the the color person that I have an issue with compulsive masturbation, over eating occasionally alcohol, and you know that was reading this a tweet that said that once you kind of master your addiction to food and sex, then you know, you become way more productive
and way happier. And I think that there's some truth to that, just having lived firsthand, just the effects of you know, with things like hemorrhoids and you know, having a you know, just like a weirdly shaped dick and all that.
But well, Alan, I'm so sorry to say I have absolutely no experience whatsoever with compulsive masturbation and overeating, So you'll have to talk to someone else. No, just kidding, Yeah, No, I've been thinking a lot about this ship because I also compulsively masturbate and overeat, and I've been thinking a lot about how my life would be would be better if I could overcome these vices. So I'm I'm I'm
with you on this. Let's talk about it. How have you been thinking, Well, who else have you talked to about this stuff? Or what else have you researched about this? And what have you found?
Well, you know, being someone that's I grew up with the internet. You know, I am familiar with the subreddit
called no Fat No Fat Ye. I'm sure you're you might be familiar with, and you know, given the I guess public opinions about it, you know, I've heard both sides, you know, kind of deriding it, saying that, oh, like it's just bullshit, like you think you're going to your life is going to get way better if you just stop washing corn, which you know, there's some truth to that, because like you can't just only stop washing corn to
expect your life to get better. But you know, I think the point of it is to really kind of curb that I guess, like addiction to it, so that you have more time to spend on other ship that's probably more productive, channeling that energy into something more I don't want to say positive or negative, but just maybe something that is more productive and has I guess more long term, uh, you know, just things that's you know, like practicing guitar, you know, like I was actually most
recently these pasts, I was on a sixteen day streak and I wanted to reward myself, and so I broke the streak. But during those sixteen days, you know, just fecting a guitar and going out bird watching more often, just trying to expand my interests and proclivities and manifest them in real life instead of just imagining it all day.
Yeah.
But yeah, yeah.
I feel like, no, this is totally totally a problem that I'm actively trying to solve for myself alongside you. Right now. My thought loops about it are like, you know, we've all we've all had really active days. I feel like, where the I have a day where at the end of it, you're like, oh, I forgot to eat today, or oh I forgot to jack off today because you were just doing shit. You just were I don't know, you were out, you were working on something, you were
like lost in some other activity. And I've thought about that, and I'm like, I get into this weird conflict about it because that seems like a great way to overcome these vices. But on the other hand, it's like, well, fuck, is it possible even for life to be so go, go, go, go go one hundred percent of the time, Like there has to be downtime, and in that downtime, how can
you avoid, you know, jacking off and eating food? Also, for me, I find like when I get depressed, you know, I mean this is a classic like fucking I don't know anything about this shit, but like chemical thing where like you're feeling depressed and so you use the sugar or the fucking coming to to get your brain to like fuel something. But when you're out and about, your brain is kind of always being stimulated. And I'm so
talking out of my ass right now. Your brain is always being stimulated with shit, So you don't need the the jacket off or the food. What's worked for you so far in the uh, in the in the realm of this, because I would personally love.
To know, you know, it's funny you mentioned that, because you know, I think that really is kind of at the core of the issue. It's really kind of trying to recreate a lot of the sort of stimulus that you get when you're kind of plugged into life.
So to speak.
Right when you have other obligations when you're out and about with friends, you know, it's not really socially acceptable to just, you know, start rubbing the head of your penis when you know, like a check walt walks into the room, right, so, you know, all these things to play and it's like, how do we create this environment just when we're sitting at our desk, right, you know, there's no I guess you know, stimulus to there's nothing really to stop us, right, And so I feel like,
I don't know for me personally, like it's just having to accept a lot of the sort of impulse and just like accepting that it's just going to feel shitty and like really leaning into it. Like I don't know, if you practice like mindfulness, I know it's like kind of bullshit, like you know, the wage type shit, but you know it's in the cultural that guys then you
know there's some truth to it. So I'm just kind of taking it with a grain of salt that I mind that I guess the constant needs to really just immerse yourself in a lot of I mean, this is the kind of behavior is kind of evident in like people that you TikTok and just doom scrolling and shit, right, and like I guess eating a lot and just you know, being inundated with you know, advertisements blah blah blah blah blah. Right whatever, And it's like, well.
It's interesting you mentioned mindfulness because I was thinking about this today because today I was like really meditating on like I'm fucking you know, using the internet, jacket off, eating candy like way too much. And and when you're we just when you're like being conscious about it because because you know, I know, I know the feeling of
unconsciously slipping into the vices and shit. And it's difficult because when you're like, when you are being mindful and you are being conscious about it, a little bit of your humanity kicks in and you can kind of control the monkey brain a little bit more to not like, you know, to right when you pick up your phone and just go no, I'm not doing that, or if you're about to pick up a piece of candy, you go, no, I'm not doing that. And the my problem is that
that lasts for only a little bit. But I my theory is that it's a muscle, so like your mindfulness ability can kind So if one day you were able to resist your phone or your candy or you're porn for like a little second at least like one of the you know, however many instances a day that you do it, you're able to just be like mindful about it, then maybe the next day you'll have a you know, two instances where you were like, you know, mindful, you know something in the way, or you lift a weight
and then eventually you can lift heavier and heavier stuff. I feel like mindfulness works a similar way. The difficult thing is to uh keep going down that path because I've dude, I've had so many times where like I've got you, I've been able to like quit stuff, but then you fall back on the wagon and then you just have fallen on the wagon for a long time. And it's you know, I empathize with the man. It's really hard. I'm struggling with myself whatever, just with everything.
I agree with that right, right, And it's like the idea that you know, there's this incremental I guess process with respect to you know, practicing mindfulness right, and I think for many people it can be frustrating to not really reap the benefits right away just because their brains, I guess are kind of not wired to kind of I guess crave that like incremental, like you know, just improvement.
And I think you know, so, you know, while it is helpful in those moments and like I have you know, seen benefits with it it's just something that I'm personally just trying to have the patience for it, right, and I think it's really hard just given our culture and you know, and something that's kind of helped me personally is like reading a lot of literature on something like no FAP for example. You know, they have you know, a bunch of message boards and you know, support groups
and people talking about their own experiences. And I guess like in a weird way, like spending time looking at that kind of informs my out and sort of I guess rational thinking in terms of like it kind of like re whires my brain in a little different way where it's like, oh, if I do watch it, then like this shit's gonna happen because I heard about you know, I read about this little anecdote, and I guess like embedding that in your like sort of latent memory kind
of is like a way to kind of combat that sort of subconscious like so I'm just gonna do this shit whatever. Instead of being that, it's it's more like, you know, kind of harkening back to the things that you must you read, and I guess clinging onto that. So I guess it's like in a sense like you kind of are what you eat, right, So it's like.
Right, I mean, you're hanging out on these message boards and you know, you're the whatever, the amalgam of the five people hang out with the most. So if you're constantly within this community of people who's also trying to kick whatever their advice is, you'll feel a little bit more empowered to do it yourself. I mean, that's how the twelve step programs and everything work. But you know, I right, Alan, it's been it's been great talking through all this stuff with you. Like I said, I'm on
my journey. I'm on my own journeys with all these these different vices myself, so it's good to be able to talk through them with you on the air like this is Is there anything that you want to say to the people of the computer before we go?
Nope? And yeah, likewise, Lyle, thanks for taking the time to talk about it. It's been great for me and hopefully, you know, we we uh get through it.
Hey, I'm praying for both of us.
Baby alrighty, thank Lyle.
Later on he was a nice guy. I you know, it's it's I guess by the nature of on here and people are calling me to tell me about things I, you know, would would that inherently imply that I have my shit together. I fucking hope it doesn't, because I don't want to give that impression at all. I was on a crazy porn and sugar and the internet binge
over the course past forty eight hours. I mean, it's crazy, and I'm on you know, Alan's Alan's Kick too, where I'm like, how do I get fucking unaddicted to you know, sugar and the computer and whatnot. That's some of the reasons I and you know, I was talking about displacement activities and stuff. I love the three hours that I get to come on here and talk to other people about their lives and shit because I'm very focused, very in the moment. And they had this that saying something
of idle hands or the Devil's whatever. It's really true because if you don't have anything to do that's stimulating your brain, your brain will just search for the bad shit to stimulate it with, like looking at fucking Twitter or eating McDonald's or whatever it is. So I'm learning that myself, but I again, I'm conflicted about it because I can only be go, go, go, stimulation mode for
so long. But maybe that's wrong. Maybe I'm wrong about that, and I should just find more things that are productive to keep my brain in motion so that doesn't fall into traps. I thank you again to Alan for talking through all that with me.
Goes on the line, taking your phone calls.
Every night, Evercon goes to his eye.
You're teaching your cloud in the memory line.
That's not really an expert