Hello, Hi, Hey, is this Lyle?
This is what is your name? Uh?
I'm Coco.
Coco. What's up? Coco? How's life going? We're recording the show right now? Is that cool? Do you want to talk?
Yeah? I saw. I was hoping i'd be able to get on.
Actually, well, Coco, what's going on? How's life well?
Longtime listener, first time caller. Wait for a minute.
Rock and roll, rock and roll.
I often joke that I'm your oldest listener because I'm almost forty. But I did hear somebody the other day who I think was thirty nine, So that made me. That made me feel atle bit better.
I think it's general. I mean it's a lot of I think like eighteen to twenty five year old, but there's people all over the all over the bend. I mean, shit, we had a I totally talked to some lady who was like fifty something and some lady was like sixty something. So I would not say you're the oldest in the bunch.
Okay, makes me feel better, It makes me feel better. Well, I've gotten the pleasure of seeing you live a few times, and definitely I've seen you in Dallas twice, and I saw you in Orlando.
Oh cool interest two very not connected at all cities.
Yeah, no, not at all. I had a little condo in Florida about an hour away from Orlando, so I was always kind of looking and hoping and praying that, you know, you would somehow make an appearance there, so I had an excuse to drive out there.
So well, yeah, I'm glad you came. Yeah, I was just thinking about those those shows, not like those particular shows, but I guess that tour and yeah it was. I mean it was a good time because I feel very honored to have gotten to do.
Any of that.
But you know enough about me, Coco, you said that you are. I've been wanting to call into the show for a while and if I wanted to give you the chance, if is there anything particular you wanted to call into the show to talk about. If not, it's cool, we can just shoot the shit.
Yeah, for sure, for sure. So a lot of life changes have happened for me since I saw you last while. So I am currently going through divorce after thirteen years of being married. So for a hot minute, so I feel like I have some wisdom maybe to offer in that department. Maybe for some people. So yeah, And actually at one of your shows, at one point you had asked, is there anybody in here that's been married for ten years or longer? And my husband and I at the
time are the only ones that raised our hands. So I'm here to deliver some precautionary tales maybe to some people who want to listen.
Sure, what do you have to precaution us about?
Well, you know, Lyle, I feel like people are always kind of right telling you what you need to do, how you need to approach going into this, how cautious you need to be, all of the questions that you need to ask all of the time that you should wait. But I'm definitely I'm an example of how you can do all of those things and it's still not work out.
Hm.
So I mean, I guess in short, I'm sure there's a lot of reasons, and I don't know, you know, what you want to talk about and what you don't want to talk about, But why did it not work out after thirteen years at this point?
So I kind of I kind of walked around for a long time carrying a lot of shame over exactly why, or not really wanting to tell people what exactly happened, but I kind of told like one person, and so now it's just easy for me to trauma dump for you know, with anybody who wants who wants to hear.
So I married a cocaine addict, So I've been I've been dealing with that for the last four years, hoping and praying that maybe he would either you know, come to his senses, maybe he would finally listen to me. Maybe someday he would just wake up and just you know, see, hey,
this is like not not a way to live. We as a child together, very successful in his career, making six figures pretty much mostly throughout the entirety of our marriage, which is which is which is awesome, which is great, which is great for him, was great for our family and and all of that. But you know, you can't make somebody else want that for themselves. And I mean,
I've I've been listening for such a long time. There there are so many people who call in and and struggle with this, either that would be know personally or or with a partner like I have. And yeah, I mean you can you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink, right, mm hmmm hm. So yeah, I think, uh, I think being married for thirteen years, having you know, close to a decade of
really fantastic memories and awesome experiences. I mean, part of the reason we had the you know, condo in Floridas, because he had been very successful in his career, and then the last four years of our marriage. I mean it just I mean it it went downhill quick. It went downhill.
I assume he was not addicted to cocaine when you met.
Him, not as not that I no, I don't think. So. He was a frat a frat boy, so there was some red flags there lyle for sure, So for sure.
How did things begin to go down?
So I've spent a lot of time pinpointing maybe when, when, when, when it happened? When did it start? I didn't I didn't use with him or anything like that, And I'm
not really sure when when the when the first time was. Again, this is a this is a you know, a frat kid from the suburbs, So I mean could have been at any point in time, right, But I don't want to say it's a common trope, But there are definitely a group of people who you know, started going to doctors for legitimate pain care management and kind of got in that that loop of being on pay medication legitimately
but still in in that in that horrible loop. So I'm pretty sure it was after he left to that world behind that he just kind of dove into the deep end of of of coke, honestly.
And is that what you would say, is the main issue that led to the divorce or was there kind of anything else peripheral to that?
You know, I think that was a huge contributing factor to it. I mean, I know that, you know, drug addiction, you know, doesn't just stand alone. You know, it's it's definitely there's there's other lots of other things that at play that that allow that to to live and thrive. Definitely, he had some challenges throughout his life. Throughout his life, he had a brother that that died when when they were kids, and that had a major impact on their family.
My my in laws are very very conservative, very wasty, very let's let's brush things under the rug and let's pretend they didn't happen. So he definitely did not get the mental health care and support that he really needed early on in life. And so I definitely think that that was a major contributing factor to right. Just it set him right up for something, for something like that.
And how recently did this happen? That you guys got divorced.
So we separated in September. I told his parents. It got to a point one day I went into his office here at our house. I don't know why. Something said, just go look in this briefcasete, go look in this pocket. So what in his office? Put my hand in the first pocket, pulled out a handful of about seventy to eighty empty baggies of coke. Yeah, it was a lot. It wasn't like I found one. I was like, damn you,
I can't believe you did this. I mean that this was like one instance in a long line of things, but in terms of the divorce popping off, that that really what sets things off. So I found those and I just kind of freaked out. And I had caught him in other ways before, never at that level, but it was at that time when I thought to myself, Okay, holy shit, like this is beyond me. I can't handle this alone. There's just no way. There's no me talking
to him this time. There's no me threatening him this time that in any way, shape or form is going to be appropriate for handling something this big. So that was in May of last year, and so I call his parents, which again, you know, there are people who you know, don't don't really think that there's any problems, and if there are, we're gonna we're gonna cover them on up. So I called his mom and tears, saying, look, there's this problem, and there's this big problem, and it's
out of my control. I can't handle it anymore. I quite frankly, I don't know what to do. You know, I'm embarrassed. I'm mortified that I'm coming to you telling you about, you know, your son and this problem. But there was definitely a huge weight lifted off my shoulders because she immediately said to me, like, this makes so much sense with everything we've seen with him sleeping till ten eleven noon, and you know again we have we
have a child together. Yeah, yeah, we're trying to maintain a life, a family and all all this other you know, all all all the other stuff that goes along with that. So that was in May and last year, and I mean basically it was us staging interventions time and time and time again for him just to say no, or say I'll go and see a therapist, not i'll go to treatment, not I'll go and do impatient or output.
And he would never agree to anything like that. He would only ever settle for going to see a therapist once a week. Who who told me at one point and she lost all credibility to me when she said that, well, I think weeds just as bad as coke. So and I was like, you know, I really am not trusting any of the choices he's making right now. But I wasn't. I definitely wasn't confident in him, in him wanting or maintaining sobriety on his on his own, I was pretty clear.
But so it was just me and his parents time and time again. I spent time with his parents coming up with lists of different rehabs and pros and cons and you know, just kind of a game plan and a game plan for our family and our life and our finances because between you know, that time and basically the time that we split up, I mean, any money that we had just gone. He took out a one hundred thousand dollars loan from his parents, which I didn't
know about, which again big privilege. Totally understand that that's a huge deal. And I mean, my family could could never do that for me, and shouldn't. No, I mean, really they were just enabling him at the end of the day, I mean clearly. But I mean by this time, I mean, he had not only just put our family in danger, but we were just you know, close to financial ruin at that point, and it was it was an everyday thing, was I was learning. So we're basically
through the divorce process right now. We're waiting for the divorce decree to be signed off on. But September fourth of this year will mark a year, and I gave him the ultimatum. Actually all of us did either either leave or go get help, and he refused to go get help. So he ended up we have the condo in Florida, so he ended up taking off to go live there, and he was there for about three months. Don't really know what he was doing. I mean I
can only imagine. I mean, shit, as Cox you know, not hard to get in Texas, It's sure as hell not hard to get in Florida. So he spent three months out there doing god knows what while I stayed here with our with our kid and did everything and paid for everything, and you know, all of the soccer mom things and football mom things and the lunches and me nat agting a new a new career and all of that, while he just took off and did god knows what.
M hm, how old is your kid? He's thirteen thirteen, Okay, so he's not. This is not like a little kid who doesn't know what's going on. This is like a yeah, oh yeah, man, so what so dude? I mean, like, so he just goes off for three months and he has no contact with with your son.
He had minimal contact with him, but but definitely nothing meaningful, and you know, just ceased to be, you know, a fixture in his everyday life like the key had known right for for all of his thirteen years. And and our son is our only, our only child, and he's incredibly bright. I've just you know, only have one. So I've just funk everything into him, for better or for worse. And I mean in some ways he handled it more maturely than I did, which was which is just incredible.
But point before before his dad took off, I took him on a walk and I said, hey, I think it was definitely one of the hardest things I've ever done, if not the hardest thing I've ever had to do.
And I had to tell him, Hey, like, you know, you're noticing, I don't know, you notice your dad is sleeping until this this time, and you notice that he's irritable, and you're noticing this, and and there's a reason, and that's, honey, because that's that's because you know your dad is on drugs and totally mortifying, totally, I mean, just all of the things, even though of course, I mean I know, I know now and I knew then that it's not
my fault. There's nothing that I'm doing wrong, but you know, just having to admit that to your kid, and of course, I mean, his his natural first first a question was you know, what is it? And I just didn't want to tell him. And I didn't necessarily think that that was completely relevant that he needed to know. I know that, you know, if I were in his situation, I would be of course just you know, completely curious about everything. But I just, you know, I didn't I think that
at that time. I just thought he needs to know the facts, and I don't you know, need to tell him that his dads are raging Koquead, this is this is not the time yet, This is not the time yet. So he he knew that things were going on, and he knew things between his dad and I were not in a good place because, you know, we were fighting, we were arguing. You know, I would love to say that we were a couple where we never fought in front of our child. Now that's just absolutely not not true.
You know, it got so bad that we would bleed, you know, into just anything that we were doing, you know, because it was just this this dark cloud that hung over us for for just so long. And so he didn't know for a while what what his dad had been doing. But his dad took it upon himself to tell our son that that that that his dad was dealing with with a cocaine cocaine problem.
So you told your son before your husband decided he wanted to tell him right right? And then how did what was it? What was the distance between that? Like was there a period of time where like you wanted him to just tell your son directly and he wouldn't, or like, how how did that kind of play out?
You know?
I just I never to me, I guess it wasn't so much about what it was. I didn't feel like that that was like super relevant, you know. I didn't think he needed to know that his dad had a coke problem versus cane told problem versus whatever kind of problem. I just felt like it wasn't Oh sure.
No, no, I guess I don't. I don't mean, yeah, I know, I don't mean like what it was. But I guess it's like, uh, telling you son that he had some kind of drug problem.
Oh oh, so I mean that was I mean that I I spearheaded that if that's kind of what you're asking, Uh, he he had, Yeah. I mean, my my ex husband had had no idea that I was going to tell him. And to be honest, I'm not even quite sure if he knew when I did, because at the time he was still living here, you know, we were still holding out hope where we were still you know, somehow thinking that you know, the next intervention, he's he's gonna he's gonna
do it this time. And and you know this is somebody, you know again who has all these resources at his disposal. You know, the people deal with this stuff all the time, and they don't have means to go to rehab. They don't have means to go kick off to you know, fucking Florida condo or whatever bullshit.
You know.
So you know, I guess just in my my heart of hearts is just hoping, you know, eventually he was going to say yes, I don't really My only goal I think was telling our son was just somehow, you know, giving him some idea that like, what you're seeing, you know, isn't normal and it's a result of something like this,
you know, it's a result of drugs. And again, my our son is very mature, and and you know, other than him saying like what is it, his next his next response which it still always blows me away in saying like, well, you know, he must be really struggling a lot if he feels like he has to do that. She's like who, Like, holy shit, I'm like she gets it. And so I definitely feel like telling him was was
the right was the right thing to do. But I also had a feeling like, you know, some shit's about to go down, and I don't want to completely just blindside our child and make him, you know, I don't want to give him this false sense that things are great, and you know, he's hearing this arguing and he's seeing his dad sleep and not work and all this stuff. I mean, I think the writing was on the wall for sure, but I definitely think that it was it was the right thing to do to, you know, give
him a heads up in hopes of giving him some clarity. Right, so he knew he knew about it. And again this is like from a period of like from May to September of last year. So I finally tell him after finding those you know, seventy eighty bags of coke or whatever, and going back and forth with his parents just begging him to go get help, and you know, still staying all the fine, nothing has changed, you know, Like I knew it was bad when the only time that we
could get along was when he was high. I mean, the only time I would ever want to approach him about anything or ask him to do something was when he was high, because that was the only time that you know, he was kind, that he was agreeable, that he would listen, you know. So it was this this really you know, sick cycle of you know, but of just but then also just noticing he's just going further and further off the defence. It's it's just it's getting worse and worse. And so one day he would have
always fall asleep. Obviously he would sleep to like eleven and twelve all that kind of stuff, which again no judgment that, you know, we got a kid in a house and all that kind of crap, you know, And he fell asleep with his phone open. And I'm not a woman that's going to go through somebody's phone. I don't we do on each other's passwords. I just I
don't think that's any way to live. But I knew the app that he had been messaging with his dealer on and just being a dumb ass, you know, leaves it on his Homeskoe Green doesn't leave it password protected, which for some reason, I don't know why that bugged me. I guess it was just because it was like so flippant. It was just all like I don't care, you know, I'm not even try to it was you from any of this.
Yeah, yeah, I could see why I would piss you off.
Mm hmmm hmm, Like come on, man, like you know, to do something, try to hide something. So for some reason my friends laugh about that, but that was for some reason, that was really a really sore.
Spot for me.
But I finally, I finally get in there, and I see the messages to and from his dealer, and it's wile, it's every single day, It's every day, it's every night, you know, like I'm an aw comedian convenience store, grab you know, a pack of cigarettes, or I'm gonna whatever, run the store or whatever it was. It was. It was because he was meeting his dealer, and it had it had ramped up, but it was it wasn't even
further than that. I found out that he was having drugs drug off when we were at home, and you know, the guy would roll through the alley, put it in the trash, can't put it in the mailbox, hide it wherever.
And I mean, this is again when me and our you know, our twelve year old son are you know, at home doing homework, you know, just picked him up from school or you know whatever, you know, normal type of thing we're trying to do, and you know, we've got some drug dealer rolling by the house and dropping
off drugs while we're there. So of course, of course that was super concerning but then I think also the final the straw that broke the camel's back for me because I didn't just find that, I found out that he had been arranging the half prostitutes to our home. So I mean, just completely in total violation of this you know, sacred space that I thought that we had, despite you know, this glary.
You.
And that was it for me. I thought, well, you know, I can't. I can't be married to somebody who I'm just never going to let touch me again because that's just never going to happen. And that's it, like this has to be it, you know. And that was again when I went to his parents, I said that, and I didn't to this day, as far as I know, they don't know either of those things. I didn't. I just didn't think it was relevant. Didn't even want to
go down down that road. Was embarrassed enough that I had to come out and tell them that their child was a coke addict. Was not going to be the one that's like, oh hey, and guess what, you know he likes hookers too, you know, Like it was just it was just something that I thought, you know, like this is it. I needed. I needed a you know, the final nail in the coffin, I guess, and that's kind of what this is. So I called them up and I just said that was it, and I can't
do this anymore, and you're a kid. It's got to go get help or I'm leaving. I said, straight up, I'm going to leave. I'm going to pack up the car, I'm going to pack up our dog, uproot our kids life, and we're going to go to the condo in Florida. So that that was my goal. I obviously had not thought things through very well, but I wasn't fishing clearly through a lot of this stuff. I was just kind of,
you know, like it was like triage, you know. I just was trying to clean up whatever disaster or mess that I could. And the best way that I could with with no was you know, there's no guide out there, at least that I'm aware of. And I just said that that's it. And you know, they told me, hey, you know, why the hell do you need to leave? You know, like, your son's in school, you know, you have, you know, a life here. You know, why the hell are you the one leaving? You know, she needs to leave.
I was like Okay, well, yeah that makes sense. I was like, yeah, okay, well let's you know, let's do that. So we gave him one final kind of push, and he just refused to go get help and decided he was just going to go take off to Florida. I mean, he had a place, you know, he it was all set up, you know, and so he took the out.
He took the out, and and so he just goes down to Florida for three months and then what happens when he comes back.
I mean, it was a total shit show.
It was awful.
It was absolutely awful here I am, so I decided to go into teaching. I'm an art teacher. For that first year though, I was just kind of all over the place, teaching different you know, grains and different subjects and just really trying to figure out, like what the hell I wanted to do with my life because I knew that this this wasn't gonna work. So I filed for divorce, and he filed stuff with his attorney saying, I want to take our son to Florida. I'm going
to move him to Florida. He's going to live here full time. I'm going to go to school here. We have no family there. My parents had had a little beach house there for a little bit, which is why I got the condo. They sold it. We have no family there, there's no reason for us to be there. And I mean that's not that like the schools are great in Texas, but they're definitely not good in Florida.
And so his goal was to just take our kid and kind of just go and live the life he wanted to live with again, of course, not having gotten any help, not when you know, suck, any treatment or
anything like that. So I file in October, and he goes back and forth with his attorney in mind trying to get all of this craft that he wants, thinking somehow that he is going to be able to take our son before and I guess somebody somewhere, you know, knock some sense into him and said like, hey, dude, like you know that, like you're not going to be able to have like take y'all's kid and move him to Florida. You know, like you had a drug problem.
And outside of that, they don't do that. They don't they don't let they don't let one parents, you know, take their child across the country. And just keep them there, you know, and you know, he thought, well, our son's old enough, you know, he he's allowed to choose where he wants to be. And unfortunately, and it was really heartbreaking, but my son really wanted to.
Be with his dad.
He wanted to go live in Florida, which I also can't blame him. I mean, it's you know, it's like you're on you know, you're on vacation. All he knows is being being there and being on vacation, right. He
doesn't know what it's like to live there. So it was it was heartbreaking to be the parent doing everything day and day out, and you know, having a child who you know wants to go live with his dad, you know, arguing with me and saying you knew what was in my best interest, which you know was interesting that you know he phrased it that way. But you know, if you knew, if you really knew it was in my best interest, then you would let me go live with dad. And so that that was also just totally
heartbreaking to have to have to go through too. Is you know, feeling like the bad guy. You know, I'm sure my son is thinking I'm trying to keep him from his dad. Obviously that's not the case, but you know, hell yeah, I'm absolutely not going to let him go live in Florida with his dad full time by himself when you have no idea what's going on at all.
Of course, of course, so that.
That was a major uphill battle. But the probably the hardest part for me throughout all of this is I had my in laws to really, you know, my to lean on. You know, I was very open and honest about once things went down and what I found and what their son was doing. You know, we became very close, and you know, they were a great support system for me. My parents didn't didn't live here, I don't really have any family in Texas, so you know, having their support,
especially during that time, was just incredibly helpful. But somehow, some way, I don't I don't know what the moment was or what the thing what was said, but they just completely turned on me and went to supporting their son wholeheartedly, telling me he doesn't have a problem, he's fine. Now. My mother in law called me and she's like, you, no, you don't understand. He's fine now, he's fine, And I had to be like, look, listen, listen, listen, listen. I want that I hope that I pray for that. I
hope that he never does it again. You know, in my heart of hearts that the day he left was
the last day. But like, let's be let's be pragmatic here, let's you know, and kind of like look at the facts and kind of like look at statistics, lady, and like, you know, figure out some things here, you know, like, yeah, it's highly unlikely that he's clean and sober, and regardless of that, like, why the hell do you think it would be okay for him to uproot our child's life, take him out of mine, and go move him to fucking floga, you know? And they could. They really never
had any response to that. They completely stop talking to me, have nothing to do with me. He told him that I had at several points quote manic episodes, which just makes me laugh because I'm like, anytime I tell people that, they're like, well, yeah, I would have after all the shit that you dealt with. But also I'm like, dude, are you really do you you go to a fucking therapist who thinks weed is just as bad as coke?
Like, are you really.
Qualified to make that assessment right now, like what a manic episode is? Dude? Do you really know? So I don't really know exactly the narrative that he's fun to his parents to make them just like completely hate me over like a matter of like a few weeks. But
so they just they rallied behind him. And obviously he comes from generational wealth clearly, you know, and his dad's an attorney, so they just sunk all of their resources and their time and their effort into, you know, his legal case against me and doing whatever they could to make him seem like, you know, this superstar dad, you know. And and you know, he was gone like in Florida for those whole three months and just had basically nothing nothing to do with him. I mean, he didn't send
a dime. And here I was somebody who we had a company together, and right as his addiction just progressed, you know, I backed myself away from that and realized, okay, I need to okay, now I need to get like a job on my own.
You guys had you guys had a business together.
We had we had a few businesses together.
Oh really okay, but so and was that your guys' full time thing? Together or did you each have your own kind of independent jobs.
Yeah, No, that was our that was our our thing together. That was our thing together.
And how I mean so this, I mean, Jesus Christ, that's a whole other, entirely crazy element to this. I mean, how were the businesses doing while he was kind of strung out?
Oh?
Terrible, terrible. I mean he he ran them all into the ground. I mean, we had one that was incredibly successful, and I mean obviously I'm not trying to doc myself, but I mean it was it was quite successful. I mean it had garnered like you know, attention and like national media and and all kinds of stuff. I mean, it was incredibly successful. And and also furthermore, it was it was it was a product that a lot of people relied on and it really actually like helped them
be able to manage their lives better. And yeah, and so I could obviously sense that he wasn't doing what he was supposed to be doing and in his job. That was clear. Obviously I worked with him. I could tell. I could just tell from the fact that I mean, you know, he would just be in home all day and literally wouldn't do anything. He would do any work.
He would hardly move from this chair. So, I mean, it was bad, bad, But when I started to when I started noticing that with the with the companies and stuff, that's when I was like, Okay, that probably he's going to sink this ship on his own. There's only so much I can do to help, So maybe I need to like turn my effort, focus my efforts somewhere else to you know, come onto solid footing on my own without without any ties to him.
Basically, So you you weren't even like, Okay, let me try to kind of salvage my own kind of make my own fight for this business that I'm a part of. You were like, you know what, I don't even want to put up that fight. I just want to get out of here exactly exactly.
Yeah. I was like I had always I had always worried that if we ever had gotten divorce, our lives were so intertwined that it was going to be just so freaking difficult to untangle, and just even from the from a professional standpoint. So I kind of at that point I was waning. I mean, I STOs felt like,
you know, I follow the writing on the wall. I saw that like where he was going what he was doing, he had, He had no motivation whatsoever to to to do better, to be better, to you know, focus on these businesses, pull them up whatever, or even just sustain where they were. So I thought, you know, I really honestly, any anytime I spend with him is not going to
be productive. So like, let's move on. Let's figure out what I want to do so I can be stable, and I don't need to I don't need to have anything that's tied to him, you know, I need to be self sufficient. So I really had just no freaking idea what I was going to do. I went to college, I have my degree, I have a paralegal certificate. I thought, okay, I'll go work at a law firm. Tried that. Have lots of friends that are attorneys. None of them, not one could find me job, not a one. And I've
always done art on the side. So that's when I thought, okay, well, let me let me thinking about going into teaching.
M did you, like, were you able to keep any savings from the divorce so that you weren't at least like, you know, against the wall.
Yes, it was, it was not a lot. It was not a lot. There were some and I really tried not to ever touch any of the emergency phons that I had squirreled away over that time. That was kind of my goal, even though it was definitely in an emergency type situation. I just in my head, I'm always wondering, like, I don't know, there could be some thing down the line that's way worse than that, or it's even worse than that. So I ended up substitute teaching for and
I don't know how much. I don't know if people really know how little substitute teachers make, but it's anywhere between one hundred and ten, one hundred and twenty or thirty dollars a day. So I mean, just just so so small. And I thought to myself, Okay, well, you know, I can't get a job in a law firm. No
one wants to hire me. I love kids, I love teaching, so you know, I'm gonna just suffer through it, you know, my one hundred and ten hundred and twenty dollars a day, and you know, just see if I can, if I can get by, you know. And there were some definitely lean times, and I think about it now, I think about you know, the amount that was in my bank account and just totally shit, I don't know how I did that, and you know, I just it's just even came back on it, I'm like, I can't believe that
was my life. But so yeah, I put my focus on, you know, finding something for me and you know, making you know, my own money. And you you hear about this too from women that have been you know, married for a long time or that have been divorced after being stay at home moms for for you know, decades. You know, they say, you know, don't you know, don't give up your own career and always have your own money, and and you know, it's it's it's solid advice. It's
very smart advice. I thought I was. I was in that camp though, as somebody who had been working, and you know, I wasn't just sitting at home eating bomb bonds, and you know, I was obviously an active parent, but I was an active you know, financial participant and you know, our life.
So how are you doing now? This has been I guess it's been about a little over a year since almost the year almost the year, so I mean, how are you doing now? What's going on with you today.
So I see I'm seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. Now. I think a lot of the hard part of the divorce is behind me, unfortunately, because you know, my my ex does come from a family that knows what they're doing with money and knows how to protect money. I got. I kind of got screwed in the divorce. I really didn't get very much as anything at all, which is funny to me because people, you know, oh, you know, you get child support and you get self with support, and you every you know,
half of everything is yours. No, it's not. That is not true. If things are set up in a certain way and people know what they're doing, No, it's you don't. You don't get half. So, you know, I was at least hoping that, you know, I would maybe get half of our house, you know, half of our assets. You know.
He took a lot of things, sold them, hid them, so I didn't and I never really had a good financial like a clear financial picture of our assets because he was really good about about hiding that stuff for me. So where I'm at now, I will I have to be out of our house by the end of the year.
So that's That's probably the biggest stressor on me right now is just kind of like every moment, I feel like that there's this this thing hanging over my head because I know that, like I'm going to be moving and I've been in this house for seven years, and you know, this is the house that you know, my kid has been in the first grade, and you know, he's in eighth grade, so he's going to be going
into high school. So I had all of these, you know, just these pictures and and and stuff of you know, of him coming home and you know, high school and graduating and all of that stuff and being here in the scheme the home base. So obviously that's that's out the window. So that's that's the most difficult thing to grapple with right now. Definitely the financial aspect of things has been really difficult. But I I have a job. I have teaching art, which is which was what I
wanted to be teaching. I'm almost a certified teacher. I had to jump through a lot of hoops for that too, and and doing all of the coursework and all of the exams for that while I'm going through all of this has been just immensely difficult. But I'm in the better place. But I'm also in a place where there's a lot of unknown for sure, and so that's that's probably the scariest part for me. But I do I try to remind myself that hopefully, more than likely probably
the worst is behind me. And you know, I'm not gonna I'm not going to be in this beautiful house anymore, and I'm not going to be living this idyllic life and and all of that anymore. But I definitely have a lot more peace in my life. That's that's for sure. That's for sure.
So where is your son now? Does he live with you? Does he live with his dad? Is he kind of in between?
Well, you know, a lot of people too, I guess you know, there was that's a lot of assumptions made here. They thought, you know, drug addict parent, You know clearly that parent's not going to get custody and this, that and the other. I mean, no, it's not what happened. We is fifty to fifty is fifty to fifty. I had evidence out the wazoo of everything. I was really smart about keeping everything and timelines and photos and just everything you can imagine. I mean, it wasn't It wasn't dispute.
There's just no way you could dispute that he had problems, and he didn't deny it. But when it came down to it, it just it didn't really matter. They're like fifty to fifty. You know, you get him fifty percent of the time, you get him fifty percent of the time. So I mean, I guess in a sense that was a win from where we started from, which is where he just wanted to take him, you know, the whole time, and then just move them to Florida and just never
see me again. But you know, I still held out some hope that you know, like, well, you know, maybe somebody somewhere would see, hey, like this dude had a raging coke problem for four years, you know, maybe he should go get help. And and my only confession was I said, I'm fine with fifty to fifty. If you go get help, I will I do not. I have no problem. I'm not going to fight you. We will do fifty to fifty. I'm not going to be petty. Just go get help, just go to treatment.
Did he didn't? He didn't do it?
Nope?
So how I mean, so, how was the how long have you guys been fifty to fifty four, like a year.
Probably since the beginning of this year. So yeah, I mean, yeah.
How's that? How's that been? Like? What's the schedule?
Is it?
Like he's with you for a week, he's down in Florida for a week.
So he ended up moving back to Texas. So he's here now. But yeah, we do one week on and one week off, and that seems that seems to that seems to be to be good for us.
Oh so your your ex, your ex husband is back in Texas. He is Okay, cool, Okay, that's I mean, that makes life. That makes life three hundred times easier, you know. Yes, I mean my my parents were divorced when I was growing up, and the nice thing it was nice that my had only lived like my dad lived like a fifteen to twenty minute drive from my mom, you know, so like we saw I know, I feel like I got to see both of them, you know,
I mean I mainly lived with my mom. That was kind of like like that place was the place I had was home. But you know, both my parents were really in my life. I can't imagine what that would have been like if my dad lived in like, you know, a different state or something. It'd be tough, yeah.
Which I doubt was so my when my parents divorced, same as you, they they lived very very close, probably even less than you know, ten minutes away from each other. And then my my dad did end up moving out of state when I turned twelve, so that that was a huge adjustment for me. That I mean, I don't think I ever really recovered from you know, So yeah, I mean right, having having him close by made things
immensely easier. And didn't know that he actually ended up moving here because that was that was hidden from me. But yeah, so he's here now and we're about ten minutes away from each other, which is great for our kid, and it is very convenient for for us. And yeah, I mean I think I think we're we're managing okay.
I think our son has adjusted to the schedule. He doesn't sit there and say go when she goes, let mean what my dude, dud and and that's that's also very helpful for me, and and that was really hard for me to deal with for months on end. So I think that we're in we're in a more stable place. I mean, we're we're able to communicate, We're able to get along, and I mean we're actually probably in a much better spot than I ever thought we would be,
you know, this far into things. But like if you asked me if I still thought if he was using, I would say, yeah, absolutely. In fact, when we had our mediation and stuff, that was one thing that he really did not want to have. He did not want us to be able to randomly drug test each other. And you know, my dad said, well that that there you go. I mean, that should tell you everything that
you need to know. If you had any doubt about his sobriety, you shouldn't anymore if he's just completely unwilling to take any kind of drug test.
So are you planning on trying to like date again at all?
Yes, I am. I've went on a few gates. The one person I really liked ended up moving away to Colorado, So there's there's that. But you know, I met my husband before dating absot like a thing.
So so.
Just navigating that whole world is just just totally foreign to me. You know, having good dates and thinking that they went well and somebody saying, oh that it's a great time. I'm going to hang out again, and then you never talk to somebody again.
That's that's true.
It is, yeah, now now now I'm learning. But yeah, no, it's been exciting. And you know, I was really miserable for four years, so and you know our marriage was done way before I filed for divorce. I mean, that's just that's just how it is. And you know, I don't want to be miserable forever. I alsouly just like people, I just enjoy the process of you know, meeting somebody new, learning about somebody, seeing things from a different point of view.
You know, I've definitely had some you know, moments of commiseration with other war people, which for better for worse. I don't know. I don't love going on a date and then the whole date is just us talking about our divorces, right, So that's that's that's that's been interesting for sure. But yeah, no, I mean I want to
be happy. I know I'll be happy again. I have no idea if I'll ever get married again, because you know, like how we started this call is is you know, you can do everything right and and things just just still just just not work out. But yeah, I mean I still I still believe in love. I'm sure that there's somebody out there somewhere, and you know, I am lucky in the sense that, you know, I am still seemingly you know, young, So you know how had I waited another ten years, this would have been a lot
more difficult, you know. So I'm I'm, I'm definitely it's it's it's a moment in time where it's a lot there's a lot of uncertainty there. It's just there's so much uncertainty. But there was a lot of uncertainty when I was married and I was going through all of the things I was going through with him, you know, so that's just kind of what I have to you know, remind myself. But you know this this time also too,
isn't isn't you know about me? You know, I'm not nothing is ever going to you know, supersede anything that needs to be done for my son or anything that he has going on. But I do think, you know, it is important for him, you know, to see his parent right happy, but also knowing that, like you know, your mom can have a life outside of her family. So absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah.
This was Uh, I felt like I've been listening to my own podcast for the Fast fifty Minutes. I really, I sincerely, I really, I really appreciate you telling your story and going in depth on it because I think I'm sure that there will be people who resonate with it.
And it sounded like it was very, very difficult, and you're still kind of like, you know, optimistic of being able to put together the pieces and move forward after you know, the disillusion of something that's been kind of your like day to day life over the last thirteen years.
It's tough. I mean, it's emblematic of like life just fucking throws things that you and disruptions and as you said, as you said, and it's a very interesting thing that you said that you could do everything right, you could be patient, you could be It's not like you met this guy at a gas station and you got married that night. And it's not like it was like, oh it was it was not like the writing was on
the wall when you guys met. You know, it's like, you did everything right, as you said, and things still don't work out. And dude, that's just fucking that's just life. You know, life, It's just fucking life. And I think it's uh something to like just learn, I guess, just learn how to how to take and move on from the best that you can.
Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely, So I appreciate you sharing this story with us Cocoa right.
Yes, yes, no, And I really appreciate the time. I again, I've been listening to you for a long time. We've met actually, and I told you you pulled me out of COVID because I was listening to you back in the day on on Reddit. You know, in my you know, three hour long path that I would take because there wasn't shit else to do. And you know this, I mean really I was kind of going I was going
through this whole process, you know. Then you know, so you've you've really seen me through a dark time in my life.
While when did we were we met in person in or in Orlando, or we.
Did and with my ex Actually.
Whoa crazy shit. You know, it's funny. It is funny. I'm like, uh, I don't like the idea of I'm like, oh, okay, I probably met these two people and I took a picture with them and they walked away, and the whole I had no idea like of all their there had
was so much lore between them that would happen. It's like I only had like a little screen shot of like that moment where I'm like, oh, this is a couple and they're together and that's amazing, it's great, But I only had It's the and you know whatever, you walk around life like that, you just have little screenshots of what appears to be and you have no fucking
idea about fucking and it's really wild. It's really the the more I do this show and the more I just live my life in general, probably more related to just living my life in general, the more agnostic I become about just absolutely everything about ideas I have of people, or about life, or about what I see in the world. I just become more and more agnostic as I as I'm truly understanding how little I can actually gleam from the screenshots of everything that I see, you know, day
to day and through life. It's interesting to think about. But you take it all in and you just, I guess, keep moving forward in however positive a way you can.
Yeah, I just, yeah, keep moving. I definitely have those times where I'm just like your Lord, you know, like I just want to call onto to a hole and die. But now I think one of I definitely think I'm, you know, toxicly optimistic. I don't know if that's the right.
Term, but I don't think you I don't think that it's toxic to be optimistic. Okay, good, Well listen, Coco. Is there is there anything else that you know, I know we talked for a while. Is but is there any other kind of like aspect of this or like anything at all that you UH want to want to cover before we go?
No, I just want to say thank you. I want to say, if anybody out there is struggling, you know, and you have a support system and you have means to go get help, do it, do it. There is there is something so much better on the other side that you just you can't even imagine, but you'll you'll never know. You'll never know if you don't if you don't make that leap and you don't try and attempt to be the best version of yourself.
Uh, Coco, thank you very very very much for UH sharing the story with us and the end the rest of the UH and the listeners. I really appreciate it.
Oh, thank you so much. Get gek bless you, Mike, Oco, Thanks By.
That was really fascinating. That was a really interesting call, and that woman was really, really, really smart. She she like, I loved the way that she told her story. I was thinking that while she was talking. I liked the way she told her story. She was very had a nice grasp on the situation, and you know, she really took us through the I appreciate she that was she was very generous with how in depth she took us through all the different aspects of that story, both kind
of like logistically and emotionally. So I appreciate I appreciated that. And uh yeah, the idea that you can kind of do everything right and things will still go wrong, it's interesting, right because she correct. She's correct about that with all endeavors, right, And that's something you have to, I think, come to terms with in life, whether it's a relationship or a business or a moving, a play or whatever whatever life thing is. The thing is, it's true you could do
everything right and things will still not fucking work. And I think accepting that and deciding that it's still I guess worth it. I don't know, I might be taking the wrong thing away from this cautionary tale, as she called it, but the idea that yes, you might do everything correct and it still won't work out, But I guess you should just do it anyway. That's what I think. Just do it anyway. Why not? You know, what are you? I mean? Because well, what other option do you have?
It's like, like I was talking to someone about this recently, like stow Is, I used to be really into stoicism, and then I realized stoicism is kind of just this ultimate act of avoidance, and it's this ultimate attempt of like fully just diminishing, like let me, let me diminish,
not do anything that might hurt my feelings. That's not really what I think stoicism is, But I think there's something about like surrendering to the true helplessness that you have as a person, to the events that happen to you in your life, and realizing that, yeah, you could do everything right and it's still could fuck up, but we should still do things. We should still try to find love and try to make stuff and try to do things even if they might not work, or they
might might. They might not only not work, they might fuck us up. They might kill us or leave us homeless or give us some cancer. I don't know, I'm I'm but we should still do What else are you gonna do? You do nothing, you do do not, you gotta do? You know, do something, fall in love, take chances. Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah. You know what I'm saying. Thank you, Coco for sharing your story. I appreciate it. Hello, Yo, Hello, how's it going.
It's going good. How are you.
I'm hanging out. I think I smell like shit, but that's fine. I haven't showered yet today because I know I was going to put on this paint and so I was like, I'm not gonna shower, just to shower again anyway. That's I know. You found that very interesting. What did you say? Your name was that? He just said it? All right, Kalem, Kalem, what's up, Kalum? Would you want to talk about today?
I wanted to talk about how you can have any job in the world that you want. Yeah. I used to work as a construction worker doing remodels and like stinky basements and stuff like that, and I really hated it. So I just started applying at state parks and it worked, and I'm currently in a state park right now, sitting by a waterfall, counting how many people cross a bridge?
Do you have to do anything? Or you just kind of sit by the waterfall.
Right now, I'm just sitting by the waterfall. Like other days, I do other stuff, but like just stitting by a fall, now.
That's pretty good. What do you normally do on a day like this? In this job?
I do a lot of stuff. I do like trail maintenance. I'll like keep a trail nice and clean and cool. Where I do like chainsaw work, where I'll go and thin trees out stuff like that.
That's pretty cool. So you do you believe you can get any job that you want.
I think you can get I believe that you just got to try for it. I mean, I got this job, and I love it, and I'm sure that you enjoy your job from time to time.
Did you think that you wouldn't be able to get this job.
No, it was just a shot in the dark. I just kind of did it out of just boredom pretty much, and I got it.
M h.
And uh, you're counting people who walk by?
Yeah, last tuesday here in the park they installed a really big bridge with a crane across the river, and and I and watch how many people cross it for data for the park.
Is are you formally counting anything? Or are you just gonna go back and they're gonna be like, how many people cross it? And you're gonna be like, uh, seems like a lot.
Uh, I am counting formally.
You're counting collies on. Sorry you you cut out a little bit. You're counting formally.
Formally thing.
Uh you cut out one more time. Say it again.
I'm formally counting.
Uh So, how are you so you're talking to me while you're counting.
I'm counting. Someone's on the bridge right now and I just counted them.
How are you right now? Well, you have a little clicker right.
No, I just write a little tally on my piece of paper.
So you're talking to me right now while you tally up all the people that cross the bridge.
Yeah, pretty much.
Are there a lot of how many people cross the bridge per minute?
Not a lot so far. I've been out here for about forty minutes. I've gotten thirteen people.
Okay, all right, that's on that bad. I thought this was like a okay, that's all right. That now sounds like it's easier to do while you talk on the phone. With me.
It's very easy to do.
What job did you want when you were a child?
I wanted to own a candy factory.
Like Willy Wonka.
Just like Willy Wonka.
I was talking about with my friends last night. I think Willy Wonka would have absolutely been like a Republican.
You'd think so. I think I think he would have been green, talky.
I think he would have been like a Trump guy for sure, because right because he's probably like a like. He likes big business. He doesn't want the Oompa Loompas to unionize. He would probably be like an Elon Musk type character.
That's probably true. I bet if there was a tornado, he would make all of the oopas keep working.
Did that happen in one of the movies?
No, that happened at an Amazon warehouse once.
So you're counting, what what what? What are they going to do with this data of how many people cross this bridge?
Well, it's actually pretty dramatic. Some some people at this state park really did not want this bridge at all. There's some drama behind it, but it it's a pretty cool bridge. I think it helps climbers get access to a cool part of the park. But the climbers kind of wanted it to be an exclusive climber area, so now any pedestrian can just cross it. So we're trying to see how much that's true, and so far no
pedestrian has gone really over there. They just kind of take pictures with the bridge and then leave.
Do you like animals?
Yes?
What kind of animals are hanging out at the spark that you like?
I've seen a lot of deer and elk. I got rattled at by a rattlesnake last week for the first time. It was pretty cool. Other than that, there's some like elusive ones that I'm not seen yet, like bears and porcupines.
Are bears and porcupines known to inhabit this park.
They are bears come in here during the night and they knock over all the trash cans.
Is there any Is there any animal that you would be scared of? Like if you saw a bear, would that freak you out?
No? I think what would scare me is the most?
Why a most not a bear?
They're they're scarier, They they they're aggressive for no reason. They just they just kill people out here.
Mm hmmmm.
Like I live in Colorado and think mayor of a town I lived by got killed by most last year or the year before. They just they just do it for fun.
Is this the job you want for the rest of your life? Would you be extremely happy if I told you this was what you were going to do for the rest of your life? Would you would make you extremely happy?
It would? It would make me pretty happy. I am. I'm going to a class this winter for wilderness EMT. I'm want to do tons ofness environments, but I quite like this job.
You cut out when you were talking just now.
Oh, I'm sorry. I like this job, but I would like to do search and rescue.
Ah okay, oh for like people?
Yeah?
How old are you? Can I ask?
I'm twenty?
Oh okay, you're a young man.
I'm a young man.
Okay. Oh yeah, you got tons of time to do a bunch of shit.
Yeah.
Hmm do you think you could if you had to? Then you could fight a bear and win?
Mmmmm?
Yes?
Are you being serious? That was a serious question?
Yeah, I'm serious.
How's all you if it was?
If I'm six one?
Okay?
How uh?
What's your build?
Uh? Like medium?
What do you bench?
Uh? I don't bench?
You don't bench? No, how are you gonna fight a bear if you don't have muscles?
Uh? Well, I wouldn't say I don't have muscles. I just don't bench when I'm at the gym.
What do you do.
Just like the other stuff?
Like you like a run out of truck?
Yeah?
I did that, and like I usually use like dumbbells and stuff because my gym doesn't really have bars.
Okay, but do you do like do you do like a chest press with the dumbbells?
Yeah?
What you chest press?
I guess? I guess one sixty?
You chest press? To you add you chest press using two eighty pound dumbbells. Yeah, that's pretty damn good.
I think I could beat a bear.
I don't. Yeah, I mean I don't know. That's a lot. Yeah, maybe you could. Six one is pretty good. You could be you could be like a small bear.
Yeah, maybe like an adolescent.
Yeah, but then you but then if you if you beat up a baby bear, the mom bear is gonna come and kill you. Well yeah, do people still have picnics at the park?
Yeah, it's actually been a big problem here.
Why is it a problem? Isn't that what parks for?
What it's there is like picnic areas. But but there's a fireban right now and people keep starting fires. Oh the cook meats.
You know who doesn't like fires?
Bears?
But there's a specific bear.
Oh uh, smoky smokey bear.
Smokey Bear.
Yes.
What do you think about Yogi Bear? I'd win, no, not if it could beat him up? Like, what do you think about him? Just like as a concept?
Oh? Oh, you know, he's pretty cool. I guess he. I respect his desire to steal from people's picnic baskets.
Have you ever watched the Yogi Bear movie? I think it was like in two thousand, Paul, I'm gonna look this up. Yogi Bear movie ten. That's old, man. The Yogi Bear three D movie too, is fucking fifteen years old.
That's I think I do remember that. I don't. I don't remember much about it, but I think I remember it.
What's your name again, Kalem Kalum Callum? Is there anything else that I can do for you out of this conversation? Or do you feel like it was it was what you wanted?
Uh, It's pretty much what I wanted. But I was curious. I'm coming to New York in a bit, and I was wondering if you have a specific day you go to the park.
No, I just kind of do it. It's not a thing that I premeditate or advertise. I just kind of do it.
Okay, but be there.
I'll see you if I see you there, I'll see you. Yeah, because I.
Know you like parks, all right, I do like parks.
Is there anything else you want to say to the people of the computer before we go?
Kleem, Uh, quit your job unless you like it.
Thanks for calling, Caleum, Thank you bye.
See.
Klem has good optimism, and that is often actually what you need. You need an unbridled delusion. That kind of honestly goes into what I was ranting about at the end of the last call, which is that you need unbridled delusion and optimism to even have a fighting chance. So shout out to Kalem for the inspiration he provides by simply being who he is, goes on the line taking phone calls every night, goes to his teaching you an expert