Hello, Hi, is this a gg?
Yeah?
Who is this?
This is Veronica?
How you doing?
I'm doing good, Veronica. Listen. It says here that you have a boyfriend that you're currently with right now, and it says that he's a licensed therapist and that he does not like my show.
That is absolutely correct. I'm looking at him and he's not happy.
Calling okay, and can I talk to him? Because it says you want me to talk to him so that we can hash it out. And this is actually so that I've been wanting to do for a long time. And people have listened to the podcast for a long time. No, I've been wanting to talk to somebody who does not like me because there's I'm lucky enough that people come on the phone and they're excited to talk to me, But I want to experience what the opposite is like.
Well, here you go. Here's the thing. Is I listen you all the time. He hates when I listen to you.
He can yeah, put me on the phone. Yeah, put me on the phone with him. It means Art, okay, great, Hello, Hey, what's up Art?
Oh? Just trying to enjoy another Friday night? How about you? My friend?
Okay, am I just am I interrupting that goal?
No, No, it's it's not that. I I think it's more. I don't think Veronica understands that I don't want to work outside of work or be reminded of work outside of work, which is why I don't like your show. It's not necessarily a you thing, right, I mean to be fair, I really know you or how you I do things. I might overhear her and she's watching it or something like that, and you know what, that's great. You provide a really great needed service and stuff like that that I want to know.
I wanted criticism. I want you to tell me how much you hate me. I want you to tell Please give me what you want to tell me. That tell me your honest truth art, that's all I want. You don't have to worry about offending, Just tell me the honest truth.
I just don't. I don't think you know you should be given advice without the training. That's the main thing. That's the main thing. I mean, I guess it's not really advice. Don't give it, you know, it's it's one of those things. I think. You know. It's good that you you can be a friend of these people, right, and sometimes well, I know, I know it's good. You can be a person that people can lean into, like a therapist. But you know, what do you got? What
do you got just practiced? I mean usually it comes down to people telling you like, hey, uh I you know you lean into it, Like how did you get into this? It was because one of your your friends said like, oh, you're really good at listening to people and stuff like that.
My friends, my friends don't My friends don't like to talk to me about things going on in their lives. They don't trust me with that stuff.
Why is that because they're afraid you're gonna say it on the radio.
No, I don't think that. I just I don't think they respect me.
Like what's the what's the balance there?
So art, I know this is a serious question. Okay, I'm not trying to fuck with you. This is not got your thing? All right? So so what like, what do you think I don't know, like in the practice of talking to people about stuff, what do you think I need to know that I don't know that makes this bad?
Hmmm? I think honestly, ah, well, you know, I just kind of reverse my own thought. I think that people feel the nice thing about you, I guess here's you're a shit sandwich. The nice thing about you is that people feel like they develop a relationship with you, because honestly, the relationship is the key, you know, thing to change or creating things, and so people they know you help to build comfortability as well as being detached from them.
I think the other piece of that is is, Okay, they listen to you and they think they know you, and at the same time you don't know what the fuck you're doing, which you know can on occasion. I think if anything, it's like, okay, well, you know, it's a good release. Yeah. And there's the other part of the shit sandwich that's good is you know, at least you can give them that out. But it's just a I think I think you're doing great.
Honestly, I can tell me the damn it art, don't I want the truth?
All right?
I get people coming into your all time telling me things. I want the truth.
Art.
I don't want to be at work when I'm trying to relax. I don't want to listen to to people's problems outside of my job, you know. That's that's that's why I don't do. That's my things. And you know, there are brow the criticisms of like, yeah, you know you don't entirely know what you're doing and you're doing don't great service.
They But here's the thing. Use the thing I've been thinking, well, i've been thinking I part of me and I I I. I try to set this up where it's more so you can talk to a gecko about anything. And it's almost a little bit more journalistic than it is therapistic, because sometimes people just call in and you know, I don't. I don't want to be the advice guy. I don't want to be.
Does it feel like voyeurism, Yes, it is.
It's well it's voyeurism for me and for everyone watching. And I think that in the process of, you know, explaining themselves, that people do get some kind of a relief because maybe they're explaining something that they haven't gotten the chance to explain to anyone else in their personal life. And then we're just kind of sitting here listening. I'm not trying to you know, get I mean, I do sometimes just because it comes out of me, but I
don't I'm not trying to give people advice advice. I'm mostly trying to just like ask them stuff about them, so more journalistically than therapistically. But also you could find a lot of examples of me not doing that and me just totally pretending to be a therapist.
Oh yeah, probably. But I think, you know, honestly, half the time, I feel like I don't know what I'm doing in my job, and I think.
I, ah, okay, all right, so how are we in if you don't know what you're doing either.
Well, because I'm actually trained it that I know what I'm doing, it just feel like I don't know what i'm doing it. You know, it's more inane.
I said, I was trying to get you, but I said I got you.
Just now you got me? You got me there? Yeah, but you know, yeah, but I think you've experienced it yourself. I mean, someone will say something and it's like you almost have like that out of body experience where you're like, I don't know what the hell to say to this, you know, And I've heard terrible, awful things and just very weird things, and you know, sometimes just saying that
is the big thing. I think. I'm honestly, you know, if you want my opinion, I have no idea if you've ever considered going to school for it or anything like that. But you know, from what I've heard, you do a pretty decent job. You'd consider it with little more training. But you know, you did pretty well for yourself, I imagine, And this is fine, and people are interested in you know, people, I think, I think that's a little I don't know. That feels a little gross to me.
But you know, if if it's the if it is a getting a person into therapy, then great, if that's there.
You know what, tell me why it feels gross to you.
I think in a lot of ways, it's just kind of like getting like getting off on other people's things. You know. It's a lot like Gosip and ship like that. I say, why people like gospel and things I don't. I'm not the biggest you know. It's just one of those things. It's that's my personal opinion.
But I respect that.
Right well, you know, But again, at the end of the day, looking for criticism for criticism sake, not it the biggest thing. I just don't want to be reminded of work.
What is.
Oh? I made some pasta. I made it a nice pasta and brought Veronica has some flowers and this is what she uh show she what she gives back? Art?
Tell all right, tell me this art?
All right?
When you and somebody says something to you, and you and you're real and you're you know, fancy, Oh okay, no, I'm just fucking with you. When someone says something real to you, uh, something, you don't know what to say to them? What do you say? What do you how do you deal with that?
And honest would be like probably like you know, wow, I don't really know what to say to that, and just be honest with them. I mean, it's really comes down that field, right, You're feeling it out and like usually whatever you're feeling is what the other person is
feeling the room. And a lot of the time, you know, with that, if they're telling you something, you know, like I mean, just having someone say like wow, that's fucked up or wow, that's you know, a lot just being that because they expect everybody to look at you for answers, and they expect everybody to be like, you know, oh you know this, or people do go I mean, that's that's a lot of the time why we don't go to friends for therapy because I mean, for one, there
can't be impartial. But for two, they're going to try to tell you what to do, you know, and it's a lot like it's a lot like when your doctor needs or tells you you need to go work out, right, you might go work out for three days and then after that you're like, ah, I fuck that, it didn't really work. Unless you truly believe you need to work out,
you're not going to do it right. Just like, I mean, that's that's empathy and sympathy, right, Like, if we're down in a hole together and I can know how I would get out of the hole, it might not be the same as how you get out of the whole. That's how I get out of the hole. I can rather than just being like, wow, hey, I'll be down on this hole with you together, but you have to figure out how to get out of this hole on your own.
I like it. That makes sense. Well, that makes sense considering that people are wired very differently to how they want to solve their problems and in terms of what works for them.
I mean, we could we could get into a whole discussion on why you know, I feel my personal opinions on different theories of therapy and like, you know, fuck solution focused therapy. You're just giving me.
So listen, what do you think is wrong with me just as a person.
As a person as a person.
Well, from what you've heard, I think that.
Well, for one, Veronica likes you too much, which is an issue. But the other thing really is I think that.
I don't know.
It just gives me a little I mean, I imagine it started. I just don't know what you get out of this, and it kind of that kind of freaks me out a little bit, you know, No, imagine do you think I know?
But do you think I have like sin?
Did you get off on it? That's great? No, I don't think that. But I mean ignorance is just as bad of a thing as you know, bad intentions, right.
Mm hmm, all right. But outside of all this, like like me as a part like forget about my Gecko show? Like, what do you think like along with me as a guy? O?
You you live in your mom's basement?
No not, I lived in my mom's basements, uh for like a year and a half. I don't anymore.
Nothing wrong with that. I think, you know, I think you're looking for meaning and everybody else and not able to find meaning for yourself.
Oh wait, that's very interesting. I'm looking for meaning and everyone else and not able to find meaning in myself. Interesting. Where do you think? What? What has what has led you to that belief?
Well, I mean look at what you do, right, I mean you are looking at everybody else constant?
Yeah? Yeah, yeah?
And I mean do you give yourself time for introspection? Do you ever, you know, allow yourself good for you? Oh?
Yeah, I'm always I'm always thinking about why I do the I'm always thinking about why I do the things I do and because I because I really do feel as though I live in like this infinite universe of infinite possibilities and infinite happiness as well as infinite depression and sorrow, and there's at all times infinite decisions I could make, And it's like in all that infinite See, why do I make the decisions that I make? I think about that every day.
Yeah.
That sounds super overwhelming, right?
Yeah?
How do I do it? Well? How do you deal with that? I mean you much feel stuck and in a lot of ways, it sounds like one way is figuring out how everybody else does it? Right?
Yes, yes, that is a part. It's funny you say that, because that is a part of this. I have one of my biggest problems in my life as I'm very indecisive, and I'll ask I'll go and I'll ask everyone's opinion on things, Like I'll ask all my friends and my parents and my you know, just anyone close to me. Like anytime I have like a life thing or whatever,
I'm very indecisive, so I'll always ask other people. And maybe this is like a version of that, like I'm looking at other people's stuff to get a better idea of my own stuff. And maybe that's also a little bit what the listener gets out of it too, of like you know, they they're they're learning a little bit about how they feel or their unmeaning of things to other people.
Giving me I will say that, you know, that's a very big piece of what I do. I mean, you know, the only person in the room who is the expert on you, is you right? Yeah? I know I have like some education or whatever, but you know, and I think in a lot of ways, me helping people figure it out helps me figure it out, just like you helping people figure it out helps you figure it out. Which is a kind of hard, like I mean, it's
a it's a hard place to be. And I think you know, life is shitty and we there isn't really much of a meaning to anything, which gives meaning to everything, but figuring that out for yourself, or figuring out what gives you whatever it is is. I mean, say you woke up tomorrow and everything was perfect and you were feeling fantastic. What would that look like?
Well? Can I well, actually, this kind of seg this segues me into what I wanted to ask you just now, because you said that life is shitty. You asked me, well, how I would feel if everything was perfect? I truly believe, I actually believe, really in my gut that everything right now, in this moment, as it is, is already perfect. It's already perfect. And my biggest my problem does not lie in I need to change and shift external circumstances to
make things even more perfect. My problem lies eternally in my own perspective of being able to constantly consistently see those perfect things for what they are. I mean, just I mean, I'm not even talking about like my life specifically, I'm talking about like having arms and legs and a cup of clean water and shit like that's perfect as it is. And I feel like it's my issue that I can't see that and be just happy for that. So let me ask you something you said that you
you said just now that life is shitty. Why do you think life is shitty? Do you really believe that?
I don't think I necessarily really believe that, but I think a lot of people believe that. And I think that you know, the piece of it is and this isn't me as a therapist, is it's just me as a person, But I think that you know, a big piece of it is. Everything is pretty much based on your own experience.
How you how when something happens to you or you know, and that same thing happens to somebody else, you're going to respond in too entirely different ways, right, just like you know, being trying to be thankful that, yeah, you know, we are pretty lucky to live in a place where we have running water and a roof over our heads and all of these things, you know, and you still have your own problems, right, I mean, at the at the end of the day, the only one that feels
what you feel and goes through what you go through is you, and it's really just how you two to deal with it or not deal with it, right, because well, maybe the show is just a big roundabout way to not have to deal with your things and hope that it magically comes to you.
I don't know, are you talking about again? Yeah, I'm talking about you again, So it is. It is, So I'll answer that it is a way to not think about my problems. I'm when I'm doing my stream and recording my thing, it's three hours where I'm not thinking about my problems because I'm thinking about other people's problems. But I don't think that's any different from like if
I was like a fucking if. I like to sew, and I don't feel like because I'm not thinking of my own problems because I'm present in the moment of what I'm doing. That's why I'm not thinking about other people. That's all. I'm not thinking about problems, not even because I'm thinking about other people's stuff. I feel like that because I'm just present with what I'm doing because I have to be, because that's how you have a conversation
with someone is to actually be in it. And when I'm not doing this I'm back again staring at the infinite. When I was talking about earlier, the infiniteness of life in the universe, and I could make any single decision, I could make any possible decision at all. But here, as I'm talking to you, I'm not thinking about that, just thinking about what's right in front of me, which is talking to you and trying to do this podcast well.
So that that, I would say, is the big thing that I get out of it in terms of, you know, the avoidance of my own problems. But you could say that about fucking playing basketball. You know, you're you're focusing on the game.
I think it's important for you and me for that matter, to recognize, Okay, I might be escaping my own reality in when I'm doing this or when i'm you know, when I'm working or something like that, but you're still bringing you I mean, that's that's the important thing. And you know I'm not condoning what you do, but I will say that if you're going to continue doing it, bring yourself trying to bring yourself to it.
What do you what do you mean? Yeah, just now, when you just now, when you said, whatever you're doing, you're bringing you to it. What do you tell me what you mean by that? And tell me what you mean by I should bring myself.
I mean, don't be somebody for anybody else. The reason why you're good at what you do or the reason why people listen to you is because they're seeing you or they're saying a version of you. But you know, I think that to truly bring you to that, bring in that existential ship, bring in that stuff that you're scared of, you know, look into that. Add add to it, throw your own well heot your motives in there, right, because I mean I think you probably have them, you
just aren't acknowledging them, or you're don't want to see them. Yeah, of trying to figure out how to enjoy just living and the things that you have.
Yeah, well that's that's all the I mean, that's all the ship I was was just talking about. I want to know from you. Yeah, Art is you know art or ants.
Art like Arthur.
Art, Arthur it is it is, it is your real name, Arthur Art art. Forget. I asked that question, what is the what is your meaning? What is your personal meaning of life? Why do you do what you do?
Why do I do what I do? I think because I'm good at it. I don't particularly love what I do. I like what I do. I think it by what I did, I would take it home with me, and I don't want to have to take it home with me until I have to talk to you on the phone on a Friday night. But no offense this is that was more of a jab a b.
But I appreciate Brian eating you on the phone this long because I know that you don't want to be here. But I'm enjoying talking.
To you, no, I I am.
And you know what art I think. I think a small part of you is enjoying talking to me too. But anyway, you were saying, you don't like what you do, but you love But you don't love what you do, but you.
Like it, Yeah, because you know, I think at the end of the day, you're gonna have good days and bad days, and it's really just you know how you deal with it. I mean, the job is the job is a job at the end of the day. But I think, you know, I think I'm good at what I do. I think that that really helps. But I don't know, It's just kind of one of those things you lean into it I guess for me, nothing really,
I'm very in the same boat. Nothing really feels like it matters, so everything kind of matters.
Yeah, uh, if you could be doing let me ask you, if you could be doing anything, if you could literally just wave a magic wand and you could get paid to do anything at all, what is it that you would do?
I don't know, maybe just read books, not really any job in particular. I'm very lazy, I will say, so, really not a whole lot. If I could read books and you know, just kind of hang out with my friends, if I was paid to do that, that'd be great.
Unfortunately, you wouldn't get like and get like bored after a while of don't you want like a challenge of some kind?
Sometimes, you know, I will say that at the end of the day, I don't know if I'm going to be doing this job for my whole life and the rest of my life. I will say, there's a part of me that always wants to be doing it in some aspect because people are pretty amazing, as I'm sure you are well aware, and you know, even if I'm old, I mean, I've done you know, construction, I've done I was a farm hand, for years. I you know, a lot of physical labor and things things like that that
are there's a lot of joy in that. You know, you get to see the fruit of your later labor, fruit of your fit, of your of the loom. This is a a ad for underwear art.
Do you have you know?
What?
Do you have a therapist?
I do? I do?
What do you so when you go to therapy? What do you typically talk to your therapist about?
Probably my anxiety. I've got pretty bad general anxiety and a little bit of trauma mixed in there. But I think, yeah, just mostly how I deal with it and dealing with like shame and just the general emotions. You know, there's a lot of ship like that that comes.
Up when when you when when you when you have a client who comes in and they want to talk about shame and anxiety? Do you think that, like your personal experience with it and the fact that you like still deal with it, does that make you better for you or maybe even worse? I don't know, Like, how does that affect the way that you talk to them about it?
I wouldn't necessarily say worse. I think it's interesting because you know, I like to think of it like I said, you're the expert on you, right, And so it's a collaborative approach. And so essentially I do my job is you know, we're gonna be walking down a hallway together. There's a lot of different doors we can go into or not go into, and it's really up to you
where you go. But to better understand things like shame and anxiety, I try to help people create their own definitions of those, right, Like, that's one of the very first things I do. It's like, okay, well, what is shame your body? What does anxiety feel like for you? What are each of these feelings, and how do we
understand them? And then once we can do that, like, for instance, for shame, all shame is is when your needs aren't being met, but rather than looking at where they're not being met, you put it back on yourself for having those needs in the first place. Right, So if we can understand that, we can understand that shame is not only that, but it's also just a response to help us fit in and be around other people. Then how we can better use that and in a lot of ways, how I can better help my own
myself understand that and create my own and better understanding it. Sorry, go ahead, no, no, you go ahead.
I was gonna ask, when you talk through these things with your client, does does that help you? Unders Does that reinforce the ideas for you in a personal level?
Sometimes certainly, But I mean the other the other thing about me is, at the end of the day, the really hard part, I would say the hardest part is I but with all my personal biases and all of these things, I can't judge the other person. And I will not judge the other person for telling me anything. A person could can literally tell me anything and I won't judge them. And I again have heard some awful, awful, awful things. But you know what, they're not there for judgment,
They're not there for whatever. They're just there to talk. And yeah, sometimes it does help me continue to formulate my own formulate form my own opinions on things and all sorts of other stuff. But I think you know, it still is, at the end of the day, just two people in a room.
When somebody tells you something really fuck Let's say somebody tells you they did something really fucked up. Because I also try and this is I don't want to declare things about myself because I'm always this is a goal I'm working towards and I think I'm pretty good at.
Is also being like I feel like, especially in my personal life, people could tell me anything about themselves or about me, or about whatever or something they do, or just anything, and I won't judge them because I don't feel like it is a I like the phrase only I don't believe in I'm not religious, but I like the phrase only God can judge because even if there isn't a God, just the implication that it's not a
mortal ability to judge. And so let me ask you this, when you're in your sessions, even if you don't say anything internally, do you form judgments about people that you have to fight against?
Oh? Certainly, I mean I'm a person, right, But yeah, overtally I'm not going to judge them, and I have to kind of, you know, work it out to non I mean that's I mean, that's part of the training in and of itself too, right, is like you've got to be able to essentially create a face or a stonewall or whatever, you know, because the slightest thing or the slightest movement can say a lot about a person, right,
body language tells so much more. But yeah, yeah, I'll certainly judge, but you know, it's my goal not to or at least not to show that or at least be open to that. But because I'm not going to judge them, I can't judge them. It's not my job to judge. It's my job to listen.
Right, definitely.
Be there, but yeah, you know, and I think like there's been things that I have literally only ever repeated to my therapist, and that's like the only time I will ever say that, you know, there's some stuff that's locked away, and that's I mean, that's I mean, I imagine you've heard the same thing, and they are some of them, and I think that you know, how you deal with it says a lot, and I think that's
part of it. I don't like when I overhear Veronica listening to you, because it's you know, I have cultivated a pretty good amount of ways to be able to just leave work or work just as I imagined you do. It's almost like, you know, not to say you're two different people, but there's two different parts of you.
Oh yeah, I mean you have to. Yeah, as soon as I'm I'm gonna forget about you as soon as we're off the phone easily.
Yeah, but.
No, Actually, I don't think i'll forget about you. I'll remember you when i'm thinking about uh, when I'm thinking about what calls I want to put in the podcast. So like that was a good call, you know what.
I like.
Here's how I think about this, all right. I've talked about this on the podcast before, is like, well, I'm on the phone with you right now, and this is this is to the point of leaving your work at work. So because I don't want to be insensitive, even if it is whatever, I'm on the phone with you right now. So in so in this moment I'm with I'm with you, we're talking. I know who I feel, uh, I feel like I feel a connection to you art over the phone.
You know.
We we're we're talking, We're having a real conversation, like we're I'm feeling very present with you right now, and I feel like I can do that with anyone who calls into the show and then again and then. But in order to be able to do that, in order to be able to show up with the energy, to be able to be fully present in the moment that I am with the person, I have to be able to completely forget about them as soon as I'm not
with them. But if I'm with you, i'm with you, and if I'm not with you, I'm not with you.
Yeah, I mean, I I that's exactly the same thing I have to do, right, I mean, there's the things that you know, I would say compartmentalizing is the wrong word, but almost like looking at that, you know, I, if I'm with another client or whatever, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna remember what somebody's boyfriend's name is, or who their parent is or what they do or whatever. But then as soon as i'm with that person again, it
immediately all comes back. I can't I can't really explain it, but it's like, oh, tell me about or whatever, and they're like, oh, yeah, no, how do you Oh yeah, certainly, But you know, I totally get that because there's just too many things at the end of the day to remember and again, we're just people, right.
Yeah, That's why I always forget people's names, because well, because I feel like names are the to I forget the name to make space for more important things, like you know, Felix and shit.
Yeah Dukes the Cat, famous nineteen eighties.
Felix the Cat, the famous nineteen eighty movie.
No, I would say that, Yeah, it's very much, very very similar. Like I have had sessions where in the middle of it I will forget the person's name and I have had to be like, oh shit, okay, what am I? Okay, there they are again. But I think you know the other piece too. It is too truly listening. Isn't you know, thinking about how you're going to respond
or whatever else. It's just listening, right, Because like if I was working with a couple, for instance, and they might be in an argument, A lot of people don't realize that two people in an argument pretty much if you're in a relationship, you both want the same thing. You're just really bad a communicating and to really listen, to really put yourself in charge of being like, Okay, the whole thing I want to get is I want this person to tell me what they're trying to tell me.
I want to be able to attempt to repeat back to them what they're telling me before I formulate my response.
Right, yes, exactly exactly, And it's fine. I think people think that that is like like, you're not adding anything when you're doing that, But I'm like, no, I'm doing that to show that I actually understood what you were saying, so that whatever it is I do add is based off of what you just told me and not just like a random fucking thing that makes it so that you just wasted your breath talking to me.
Just now exactly it's exactly that you know. Oh and if you can do that, I think, you know, yeah, it might feel like, you know, some people get annoyed with that, maybe, but you know, then you just do why they might be annoyed or like okay, well sorry, you might feel like you have to repeat yourself. Maybe they just don't feel listened to. There's a lot of little things, right.
And then you just play on that in your life.
Next.
For me, I don't know.
I thought about getting a docted, but that just sounds like a lot of work and a lot of debt. A lot of work and a lot of debt.
No, No, I will get you a doctorate of getting ah, getting a doctorate. That does sound like a lot of work. Listen, Aunt, I just want you to know that if you ever want to like whatever you like, feel like you like a doctorate and what like in psychology probably ant. I just want you to know if you ever don't feel like going to more school, you can always go on the internet and pretend to be a therapist and nothing bad will ever happen to you.
That's a really good point. I didn't really think about that.
I'm just saying, think about that before you go get the doctorate.
Hi, Will, what's next for you?
Well, my real answer is I like, I want to keep doing this podcast. I want to keep the podcast going. But I talked to well, I really enjoyed talking to you because you don't like me or know who I am, and that was fun, and so I wanted to do more of that, where like I go out in public in like foreign countries or wherever where people don't know who I am and I just am able to talk to them. So I guess more I do. I like doing phone calls, but I want to do more things
that involve me talking to real human beings. Now that you're not a real human being, but people I can see and hear and smell and shit not a weird hair.
Well, you know, sometimes it's a weird way and we can't judge yourself for that.
But you said that, I mean, well I did.
I did. It's okay to be a person. Well, I love that. What's your fake answer?
My fake answer?
He said, you want real answer? Playing?
I don't know. I don't have a bit. I don't have a bit. I was going to try to do a bit about how I'm going to get a larger lily pad, and then I realized that was a thing and not a gecko thing, and I don't I don't have gecko bits. People do them to me all the time, and I don't know how to yes end them and be in them with like people will say, oh, are you on your way to the forest, or they don't say that this is something more funny. But I don't know how to I don't know how to be in that.
I only know how to be. I'm Some people are considered themselves trapped in loops of irony, and I'm trapped in a loop of sincerity. I can't joke around anymore. I don't have I don't know how to do that.
I think I don't know, dude, I think you're pretty good at it. I mean, you just don't take yourself too seriously, you're dressed is a gecko for God's sake. Yeah, that's the thing. You gotta remember yourself, right, I mean, that's that's that's part of it.
But art do you? How do you feel about art? Do you feel like your feelings about me have changed the past forty minutes or do they stay exactly the same? And to please tell the truth.
Oh, for sure, I like you as a person. I'm still not going to listen to you just simply because I don't want to. But no, I've been I've enjoyed talking to you. It's been great.
Yeah, I mean I've enjoyed talking to you too.
I feel like I could have a beer with you, but you know it's you don't want that in a lot of people, So I think that's the other thing. It's Yeah, my biggest thing is yes, I've enjoyed talking with you, and I am going to continue not listening to you. But thanks for your time.
See, this was perfect. This is like we said, we we enjoyed being in the moment with each other for forty minutes, and now we're going to go forget about each other.
Yeah, pretty much, that's all right. I agree, you know, Hey, thanks fans. What's your real name?
My real name is Lyle Lyle.
Well, thanks, Lyle or you know, I really appreciate it.
Appreciate it too. Is there anything else you want to say to the people of the computer before we go?
Uh?
Good luck? Go feel your feelings. Well, don't let yourself feel and be you. It's hard, it's really hard, but just being open to it is the start.
Thank you for calling in.
Yeah, I have a good one man, you too, Take care?
Uh I that was that was you know, look, that was I I've been telling you guys, have been wanting to talk to somebody who disagreed with what I do. I'm really lucky. I'm really lucky that like most of the things that people say to me on the internet are nice and they like what I do. I've had real therapists tell me they like this podcast. But I want to talk to people. I want I want contradicting opinions. Throw them at me. Fuck it. I'll take on a challenge.
I'll admit when I'm wrong. I'll admit if I'm doing something. I don't think i'm doing something dangerous. I think, like I said, I'm trying to do it with more journalistic intentions than therapy e intentions. But I throw that away all the time. I'll get off of a phone call or I'll listen to a phone call that I had back, and I'll be like, fuck, I really was just pretending to be a therapist there. But I'll also be listening back and I'll be like, you know, I didn't say
anything that I don't believe in. I'll totally say things that I'm hypocritical about, where I'll tell someone you should go do that, and I'll you know, not do that, but I but then I'll but then I'll think, well, when I'm not doing the thing I told the other person should do, I'll think to myself, man, I should
do that. It's like if somebody It's like if I told somebody to eat healthy and then I went and got those new Nerds gummy clusters where it's the little clusters of Nerds ropes, and while I'm eating those, I'll think, man, I told the other I hope the other person is doing that because I'm not doing it and I really should be doing it. Anyway. Thank you to Aunt thinking of Ironica. I totally forgot about Veronica. I hope she's doing good. We did it. Fake therapist to real therapist. Hello, what.
Hi?
No, what's going on? Man?
No? No way, Oh my god, that's going dude.
You've seen you sound like you have just been in the desert for a month and you'll finally found society. And I guess maybe you were in a proverbial phone call desert. You were calling and calling and calling, with no sign of any human being to ever be on the other side of the phone. And now one is so, what is your name? Will?
Yeah?
Will? How how can I get you today? What's going on?
Oh? My god?
Oh my god, I'm sorry. I gotta collect myself a little. I'm trying to find my notepad you had.
You had a note pad you wrote notes for this. Okay, great, No.
No, no, I I need information from you, Lyle.
What information do you need?
I'm too lazy to do this on my own, but I have and I've taught. Oh my, can I like sidetrack really quickly? U?
Sure you know what it's We haven't even begun any tracks, so your sidetrack would be okay, the main track at this point.
Okay, I'll just main track at this point because this is what I've been waiting for I've been.
Trying throw me, throw me on whatever track you want.
I've been trying to get in touch with you, Lyle, because I have I'm living with my parents, and I bought like a green screen last week, and I really want to start this like podcast. And I figured, but I don't want to like look up all those tutorials on YouTube on what stuff to buy. So I just thought i'd ask you because I know that you had to go through the same process, and I figured that'd
be a cool way to christen. And in my own mind, you'd be like christening like me starting this whole process too, So that might be a big motivator for me.
So you're telling me, and by the way, I've seen your call will, I've seen you in this queue every single stream I've done for the past three weeks, and today I decided to pick up. And so you're telling me that you were too lazy to Google search what equipment you need to start a podcast, but totally willing to call in to this show over five hundred times to get the same answer. I don't know if I
would consider that. I mean, look, it's an inefficient way to do it, but I don't know if I would consider that laziness roundabout.
Noess, for sure, I'm a big believer in.
People.
I'm a big believer in doing things your own way. And this is just the way I wanted to do it, and I was able to put a good amount of work into the way I wanted.
So listen, Well, I'm not going to tell you what equipment to get to your podcast, but I'm going to tell you this, it does not matter. Get whatever you can afford that has a microphone and do it. You could go and record your podcast on your iPhone and that would be fine. Okay. I'm I'm going out and doing vlogs and filming shit and everything, and I'm I'm using an iPhone so you can all you can write down in your notebook is, uh, whatever I can afford. Okay,
I've seen people spend just wasteful amounts of money. I mean the facts to me. Will listen, the fact that you have spent three weeks you still haven't started the podcast.
Correct, I have an episode out, you have.
An Okay, so you've started the podcast.
Well, I started it my senior year and then I went to college and I started my senior in high school, and then I went to college and I really didn't like it. Now I'm back and now I want to just do my podcast.
Okay, don't do the Okay, people this, I see this happen to people all the time. They obsess and freak out over the type of equipment to use, and it stops them from just recording the damn episode or filming the damn video or whatever it is they want to do. Just go and make the thing and don't worry about what equipment you're using.
Hmm, Okay, I'll write that down.
Write that down. Is that truly it? Well, you seemed so excited. I'm I'm I feel like there's got to be more of this.
Well, No, I don't want to like force anything, because you know, I like, I've just been listening to you for for like a long time. Like I'm almost like I still have like a ever since you started putting out more podcast episodes, I've been trying hard to keep up, but I'm almost listening to all your podcast episodes now. I'm like, I've just been obsessed with you, dude for like over a year. Now, I just think you're great.
I appreciate that. Well, Okay, how about this? What what's your podcast about?
It's I told I told stage like so many times, this is like non promotional, So I'd like, I'll stay I'll like, I'll stay true to stage. I don't want to like, I like. That's what I was afraid of. I didn't want to sound like I was.
Well, I will listen. Well, I'm not asking well, I'm not asking you for what the Instagram page is. I just what's the podcast about? What are you trying to make.
I'm trying to make a bug podcast.
You're trying to make a bug podcast? Are you calling bugs? Are you talking about bugs? Are you? What are you doing with bugs on this podcast?
Well, because I'd like, I've I've listened to a lot of podcasts in high school and I'm a big true crime fan and I still am. But I I've like listened to like a good handful of podcasts, and I realized that for all of like it's, I feel like it's very gen z and maybe a little past that for people to just have like a common interest in
like bugs and to like bugs. And I realized that there's no like real someone doing it on their own bug podcasts, like on Spotify, or like any bugs thing for that matter on Spotify.
So I do you personally like bugs?
I'm not crazy about them, but I've worked.
I worked. Okay, hold on, hold on, hold on, Okay. So you're telling me that you don't really care that much about bugs, but you want to start a podcast and you're looking for a niche idea that nobody has done before. So you're going to force yourself to get into bugs so that you can have a niche podcast.
I think me not being totally obsessed with bugs, I feel like in the in the like the outcome of like the episodes I put out, it's something about like the guy who isn't like totally crazy about what he's saying, but is giving out like factual information seems like someone that I would want to listen to. So I'm just going to be that guy. I guess.
You want to make a bug podcast where the whole angle of it is that you could kind of take them or leave them.
In like maybe not like surface level people don't see that, but like in in a way, you know, how.
Do you know any how do you do you? What would you even talk about? Do you even know anything about bugs?
Well?
I did one episode, and I made it about the stink bug and I wrote down like a bunch of notes and I put it out and then me and like and then just I just had like my high school friends would just like be like, yo, like when's next episode coming out? Because then I kind of like dropped it, like I haven't posted in, like I haven't put out the episode.
And okay, I haven't put out so so okay. So the stink Bug episode, did you what did you talk about? Did you like research stink bugs and give stink bug facts? Did you bring on a stink bug excer expert and interview them? Did you tell personal stories about your relationship with stink bugs?
Like?
What? What? What exactly was the podcast?
So my format for the stink bug episode was uh uh, it was take it through stink bug life cycle, stink bug defence mechanisms. I'm pretty they don't really have them.
Stink bugs are pretty like it was like stink bug life cycle kind of like they're like like they're one two just like their like whole like bodies and like how like you know each like function, you know, hibernation like infestations general, And then it went to stink bug historical event which was in two thousand and nine when all these stink bugs were attacking apple orchards and it costs like millions upon like it costs like over a million,
maybe over five million dollars for apple orchard farmers, and a town's mayor called the bug the bug from Hell. And that was in like the caption of like the description of the video, which I thought was funny. And then how to kill stink bugs and how to prevent infestations because they're really common, especially in winter, And that was the format for that episode.
And you don't even like bugs, Well.
Well here's the well I got really amped up on that. Like I got really amped up for that episode. And that's why that's why I'm back here now because I feel like with your you know this this exchange, I could gain a lot from this exchange, and I think I could get back to that.
Okay, here's what I Here's here's what i'll Here's what I'll say to you before we go. Will Is I want you to imagine, uh see, I'm not what I'm afraid of for you is I'm afraid of this podcast becoming wildly successful, Like you're topping the Spotify charts, you're getting deals from major podcast networks, You're getting the foremost bug experts on your pod, and celebrities want to do it,
and you know you have millions of YouTube subscribers. That's what I'm worried about, because then will I feel like you're going to be trapped in a life of researching and analyzing bugs you don't even feel strongly about, like the cool.
Like when I started, I'll I won't hold you up for too long. I'll just add one more thing just when I started this whole thing, the like the original thought that I had in mind is this podcast is going to be alive as long as I'm alive. And I don't want to underestimate, you know, like I eat healthy, like I want to live for a long time, and so that will like by default, mean that this podcast will be a long will be around for a long time.
Oh okay, So I'm kind of just at my leisure with it, you know.
Will I going to be okay? Well? Will I think? I think, to get to your main question, You're absolutely going to be fine. Whatever microphone you buy, I think you have what it takes to do this.
Do I need a do I need a camera. I think when I had a visual ask, maybe I would defeat this. You know here, I'll let you go. I'll let someone else on the song.
What's the name of the podcast? Promote the bug podcast? I want people to listen to it.
I don't want to from I promise that you have to.
You have to have like Saints New it doesn't matter, it doesn't I don't, I don't will. What's the name of your bug podcast?
It's called bug Rast.
What is it?
It's one word.
It's b U g R.
A s T bug rast.
What does that mean?
We I have a co host that hasn't made an appearance.
You have a podcast host?
Well, because he is at college. He's my good buddy, David. If you're listening, he's my good buddy. And uh, I can't remember, Like I think. We were just like going back and forth over the name, and we figured that bug Grass podcast is something that we both really liked, so we just named it bug Grass.
Okay, I'm gonna go listen to your snink bug episode.
It's no listen to it in two weeks.
The first episode is so bad.
No, No, I'm listening. I'm listening to it. It's too late. Well, thank you very much for calling.
Thank you so much, guest, have a great night.
You know, one day I'm gonna I'm gonna be I wanna be a guest on the Bug the bug Grass podcast. I would love to be a guest on the bug Grass podcast. I don't know anything about bugs, but I feel like I know as much about bugs as both of those guys do. And here's why they're here. They're gonna be fine. And they're gonna be fine because they didn't let the whole thesis of that call. If we wanted to tribute something to it, it's about not letting minor things get in the way. You know, Will didn't
have nice microphones. He didn't care. He wanted to start a podcast. Will doesn't know anything about bugs. He didn't care. He wanted to start a bug podcast. Will doesn't even like bugs, and he didn't let that stop him. So I think he's going to be completely FINEK goes on the line taking your phone.
Calls every night. Never Bean goes.
To his ride. He's teaching you cloud in the interview line, but he's not really an expert