Double waffled up in your. There it is. Double Waffle, John. Is that how do you guys eat waffles? Not like that with a damn fork, you freaking. Well, I think we're live. So John is starting to show off pretty solidly. Good evening everybody. Wednesday, November 29th, got a couple couple things to talk about today. We got the Down Under championship coming up this weekend down in Wollongong, Australia.
So we'll walk through the athletes, do some previews and walk through the the the workouts that I know John is a big fan of. Maybe get some some guesses as to who will do well in that. We'll then talk about only lifting in CrossFit competitions. Are we seeing too much of it? And then we'll wrap up with some PFAA and the WZA. So thanks for joining. Where's Rambler? Is is Jr. Rambler. He worked too hard today. There was too much going on. I know there's been a lot of
shows on today. Hopefully everybody caught Pedro's, Pedro's new show. That was a good one. I think he's a a friend because when I was on Savant's show today, Rambler did not show up until until I said his name. So he's like, I don't know if you all remember this, but there was a supposedly Rambler is also yellow. Yellow was a character in Simon's thread for a while and he wouldn't show up until you said his name either.
So. Jr. man three times he's beat him here so. I don't know if that's something that you should strive for. Jr. Beat Rambler on that J Rs Here to win no matter what it is. What if Jr. is Rambler? No. I think he's out for. Randy, he's got a split personality and we have bigger problems. All right, down under championship, down in Wollongong, we got some athletes that are, we have Caitlin Vanzill. She's withdrawn this this week due to a hernia. Sarah Sigmund's daughter had a
lower leg injury. She's withdrawing. But we still do have a a pretty solid roster, especially on the women's side. So want to walk through that and then kind of walk through the the workout. So 22 men, 20 women are in the elite competition. Jake Douglas and Emily Deroy are the two athletes that competed in the 2023 CrossFit Games as an individual. And then we also have seven men and 10 women who were in semi final competitions, not just in Oceana.
Christina Liva Todakis from Africa, she's in there and I think there's one from United States as well. All right. So you have on the men's side kind of the roster, the main guys, I think that will be in the running. You can kind of see where they did in 2023, but Jake Douglas, Peter Ellis, Kim and 5th and Zach Thomas and 7th, Isaac Newman and 8th and Zane, Sheila,
Bear, Healy and 14th. On the women's side, Emily Deroy, Christina, Liva Dukakis. I don't even know how to pronounce her name, but she got fourth in Africa. Maddie Sturt, Grace Walton, Georgia Pryor, Julia Hannaford, Annika Greer, Amy Kringle and then a last minute edition Taylor Williamson. So from team proverb and then you also have Marty Sykes. She was on the Mayhem team from
Australia that competed. So the women's side definitely has quite a few bigger names there, but and on the team side, a little bit of a change. Ricky Gerard, he was with Benny and Spencer Panchak, but now it's just Ricky and a couple other guys who are local to Australia. Noah Olson, Chandler Smith and Tola Marquinho are the hombre hombres. That's such a great name. And Jay Crouch, Bailey Martin and Royce Dunn are Team Frog Grips. That's the fun team.
Is it bad that the team is more exciting? Teams are more exciting than the individual. No. This is what Tyler wants, Tyler. Wants. I love it. Like he wishes America was like that. He wishes the Games was like this. Yes, it would be. Before you get to the, before you get to the individual side, the the team side, who who do you like better in this one? This is tough, I think. What do you I mean, what do you all think? I think I would say the hombre hombres.
Unfortunately, I would love the Australians to win of 13 frog grips, but I mean, Noah Olson and Chandler have shown that they're very, very good together on a team. Usually it's Travis Mayer is the other teammate of theirs, but they picked Tola and like Royce, Dunn is extremely strong. So it's like Jay and Bailey picked a strong guy. Well, Tola's stronger. So like I, you know the stuff that Royce is good at, Tola is also good at. Like Royce is very good at walking on his hands and he's
very strong. Tola is very good at walking on his hands and extremely strong. I would, I think Royce is a fitter individual, but he's not as fit as Noah or Chandler. Jay Crouch is as fit as them, Bailey, Martin probably so too. I just think they work together better as a team and I've never seen the other three guys together.
So I would say hombre hombres, but I think it's going to be between them too the whole time and it wouldn't shock me at all about if I'm just going to call them Team Australia because that's what they are as far as you know, teams that matter and I would rather them win the Noah and Chandler, but I see Noah and Chandler are going to win. I like frog grips a little better, I think you had. They're like on the hombres.
They're like polar differences in fitness types, Cola and Chandler being really, really strong and I think less enduringly fit. And then Noah like it's just a fitness machine, whereas the Frog Grip guys I think are all kind of closer together. Yes, Royce is like super strong, but Bailey and Jay are sort of like they're, they're stylistically similar and I don't think Royce. I agree. I almost think you don't want
that on a team, though. Like you want to compliment each other because then you're going to be bad. If you're going to be a bad in an event, your whole team's bad. It well, it then that comes down to programming style, right? Right. But I mean, there's always going to be one event where like, you know what I mean, they. Yeah, you got Homer hitters, you know? Yeah, yeah. Do you think that, I mean, do any of these teams finish outside the top five in any
event? No. I mean, is it literally Who wins more? Yeah, I think, I think Hombre and Frog Grips will be first and second in 90% of the events. Do we know Johann Robertson and Joel Molina Mullinena? I think one was AI think. I can't remember which one it is, but they were. He was in the teen competition one year, so he's a younger guy and I don't know the other one, but.
If that team, if like they're full of good runners, maybe they could beat those other two teams on some endurance test, right? Like if Johan and Joel are both good runners. But no, I I think they're going to be first and second on like every single event except maybe one or two and it's just going to be and it's just going to be some freak event that the all three of the guys on the team are really good at. We get this every time. Bailey's from New Zealand.
Guys, it's all the same. You're all the same. No one's here. It's like Hawaii. Yeah. I did find out last night. Sorry, New Zealand. Is closer to Australia than Vancouver is to the Games, OK? And that's where half of our podium comes from. Peter and I have talked a lot about where Watkins comes from, so I did research last night. We come from Wales, but there's a bunch of Watkins's who immigrated from Wales to New Zealand.
So I got a bunch of family out there in New Zealand somewhere, a bunch of Watkins's running around. That's funny. I'm Scottish, believe it or not. I can see that. So we don't like each other. I guess we just don't like England. We both don't like England but. Yeah. So we got that going for us, Yeah. Linden and Jerry has Sarah. I assume Sarah Sigmund's daughter competed the last couple years. Yeah, we've seen her. She was at semi finals last year. She was at Water Palooza last
year. She's just not as fit as the other girls, unfortunately. And yes, injuries have held her back, but when she has competed, she's not fit enough to make a splash anymore. Well, that's sort of what I meant. Like, yeah, she's been there, she's been present. But we're not. We've not seen her compete like Sarah used to compete. So I think the field's just better. I think she is competing how Sarah used to compete, but in 2015 the girls weren't as good. That's true.
I really believe that. I I think you that might be true. I mean you look at I always think about way back in the day with like Miko Selo right. Like he was awesome and then you get to Carson and it was like a couple bad luck streak and then he couldn't come ever come back and make it. Yeah. Like, yeah, really rough run for two years. He got hurt one year and then another year he blew out his eardrum. And then he's just not good enough anymore. He's not bitter like.
Right. And we always, we always wanted to see him come back every year, just like I want to see Sarah. But he could never make it make it work. Because you're still fan favourites, but that hasn't changed that people have gotten better and everywhere around the world's doing it. You don't have this little secret that you know about that nobody else knows about, which was the case when Miko Salo was competing and like, and Tyler, this is really fun. You should go back and just pick
a random workout. Like, pick a workout you'd be good at. OK, but like one of the games workouts and see what you do. Because 2014, I did the 2115 Nine Complex and I beat richest time. Now I get it, I get it, I get it. It's not, I'm not. I've done the games, He's done way more than that, blah blah blah. I know his time. I could pace all that stuff. It's a Sprint. It's like a 4 minute workout, right? And it's not a ton of
gymnastics, right? I would have broken on everything, split up, split up, chest of R2, muscle up gap, and then when I'm broken on everything else and I'd be Rich freaking Froning and now he's he's fitter than me. He's fitter than me in 2014. I'm not saying anything like that, but go back. That's what I'm saying is the field is is so much worse back then than than it is now.
Even to 2015, then to 2016. Like, I know there's there's different kind of eras and I think probably this era would be 2021 to 2023 because we had a weird COVID 2019 in 2020, yes. 60% of the men have won the CrossFit Games from that year. Yeah, yeah. Crazy stat, right? Yeah, it is a crazy stat. That's kind of cool though.
But you kind of see the I I think the right people are in 2020. But you should go back and do some of those events, Tyler, just to see, just to see how you do 'cause I think it'll, I think you'll surprise yourself. Yeah, I used to. I used to do them every year. But that was when like in 2014 that was terrible. So I I haven't went back in a long time and looked, but yeah, I do feel like the the jump from 2014 to 2015.
I remember being like in 2014 I was like I could see myself at the games one day and then in 2015 I was like, I will never make it to the games. Like there was a jump in professionality that year that was just rival by no other year. Even even Rich though, like got a lot fitter. A lot fitter. You should try the 2159 complex. I bet you get top 10. What's the barbell in that? 155. Yeah, but what's the movement is cleaning jerk. No snatch. Snatch. I don't remember.
Ryan, do you remember because I did this, I did this like 8 months ago. It was just stuck in my head, snatched and then power cleans and then maybe cleaning jerks. Somebody off the top of their head can do it. I know it was pull ups, chest bar and bar muscle UPS. Chase would be able to rattle it off like it was. There you go. Deadlifts. Deadlifts. Clean snatches. Deadlifts. Power clean snatches. The deadlifts is what I forgot. And I'm telling you dude,
nothing. Nothing like like you never get tired. The gymnastics are like, low enough that you never I felt my grip 8. Pull ups. That's what I say. And like Josh Bridges, like he was doing the pull ups and the Chester bar together. Nobody else did that. Right. And and like. They come down and drop. Yeah, and for the yes. And like Camille did the whole thing unbroken with the gymnastics, right. But they all split up their
weights a lot. Like you should give it a crack because I bet I bet you can get I bet you can get sub 5 minutes. It'd be a good right? There with Noah. That's not a hard. Because I think I did it like four O 7. You could say you beat Noah Olson in a workout. That'd be pretty cool. Patrick Clark It's proof the sport is evolving. It happens in every major sport. Glad to see it happens in hours. If only HQ would evolve with the athletes. All that to say, Sarah's done. Back to our main point.
Back to. What we were doing, unfortunately. I wish it wasn't the case, but I think it is the case. You guys disagree? I I don't want it to be true, but I think it's true. Yeah, it'll be tough. Yeah. I mean, yeah, and. And oh, sorry, one more thing about Sarah. Like, she also has a life. Like, she does other stuff and good on her, you know? But like, at a certain point, you have to stop entertaining the idea that you're going to be a pro athlete anymore.
It might be over for you, and that's OK. You had a killer career move on. Yeah, you're one of the fittest women of all time. On the women's side, got three, I guess more notable names, More on the team side. Danny Spiegel, Emily Rethwell and Jesse Smith are California girls Next Letica Gold, Brioni Shelley's Christy Hollard and Amy Alessi and the Fit Mama's Club, Alethia Boone, Justine Beeth and Jaylee Manzi. Can anybody beat the California girls? The only people who have a
chance are the the fit mama's. I don't think so. I'm saying they're the only ones who have a chance. I'm not saying it's a good chance. To I'm on. I'm on the next letting of gold has a chance. I don't know too much about Amy, but Christie and and Brioni are are pretty good. I think it's more likely that California girls will be convincingly out front and then like the second and third place, go back and forth. I could see that happen.
I will say I haven't heard rest will in a in a in a while. That was like a blast from the past. Well, you're not seeing her or that name. That name in. A. Although vindicate makes a good point, Travis makes a good point. This proper judging. Yeah. Maybe that's only a third of the equation. I think they'll be OK. By I thought Banzilla is going to be on the Fit Mama's team. No, she was going individual so she qualified through the qualifier. She got first and then had a
hernia and. Decided. I'm sorry, Caitlin. She said that she didn't. She didn't feel it. She feels good when she works out, but the doctor was like don't go to a competition and you need surgery so keeps getting worse. So do take surgery now. You can still come back for 2024, hopefully. I do think she would have made it a lot more interesting. Yes, yeah. All right. We'll walk through the workouts. I just kind of give some thoughts on it.
So Friday event one adapt outside on a beach, 15 bar muscle UPS, 20 chest of our pull ups, A1K beach run, 25 dead ball cleans which are I think just a a Heavy D ball, A1K beach run, 20 chest of bar pull ups and 15 bar muscle UPS. What do you like about this one, John? It's just, I mean like it's just who wants to? I mean, it's almost like, who wants to gamble?
On what part? From the start I think you do the 15 bar muscle UPS unbroken and then you do like fives on the chest of bar like quick fives, but you're resting there. I don't know if you got 20 chest bar unbroken. You probably do that because you're going to rest on the 1K on the beach run. Not if it's all sand that'll suck. No, no, I'm saying you're like your grip, your grip, your grip and your pulling will rest. 20 chested bar is not irrelevant after 15 bar muscle UPS.
So like if you do 15 bar muscle UPS unbroken, which I think for these ladies like, it's going to be hard for a lot of them to do that. After the bar muscle up, yeah. And then 20 chested bar pull ups, you probably do that unbroken and then the I don't know how heavy the dead ball is, but if it's like see, that's what. I want to know. Yeah, if it's like 151 hundred, I think whatever guy can, it's probably who runs the fastest. I'll be honest, Whoever can run the fast because 1K is enough.
That's 4 minutes, yeah. You can lose you. Yeah, it. Depends. Again, it depends if it's. If it's soft sand, it's not 4 minutes. For what? Much slower? Yeah. So 4 to 6 minutes. Yeah. So let's just call it 10 minutes. Like 10 minutes of running and it's 5 minutes of total work, 10 minutes of running. So I mean like the most time
it's made-up on the run. I think if anybody can do 25 unbroken dead ball cleans for instance, like if it's 150 and Jake Douglas can just do 25 unbroken like it'll hurt but. So the the dead ball cleans are 70 kilograms, 50 so 100 and 5550. Five. It's a heavy for the ladies, isn't it? Heavier. Yeah. Compared to the men, probably, yeah. 1:35, 1/31/32 1:32 it says 60 kilograms for the ladies in the comments that is 110 is the. Weight It's 5070 and 50. Per competition quarter.
So yeah, I mean, I think if you can go 25 dead ball cleans unbroken, they're just touch and go. You can knock those out if you're really, really strong like Dan, I know Danny's people's not competing, but like I this is like a workout where she could be behind and then I'm going broken on those and be ahead of everybody and then end up top five, right? And then after the other beach run, you see who can hang on to those bar muscle ups.
I I think doing the bar muscle ups unbroken on the last 15 is going to be huge. I don't think very many people will be able to do that. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think. It all come down to gamesmanship because it's like OK you can't win the you can't win this event on the dead ball. Like you can lose it if you go too fast but you cannot win it
like you can only go so fast. And again like like you said, it just really comes down to the beach run and then when you get back to the bar, like you got to see where you are, how much time because it's like if you can take a quick rest between 10:00 and 10:00 on the chest of bar, you can probably go unbroken on the bar muscle UPS. I think I go fives on the chest of bar on the second one 2GO unbroken on the bar muscle UPS.
Yeah, I think you have to go unbroken on the bar muscle UPS and it's just about pushing the chest of bar. You don't have to, but the winner will. But I think if you want to win you, you have to. Those chest of are just there to juice you up. They're not there for anything else other than to juice you up. How How does Jake Douglas do on this one? I don't think he does well does this. I actually think this might be his worst event. Does it prevent him from winning it?
Is this the one workout, like a Gee situation where he's far enough down the leaderboard that he can't come back? No, because it's not it's. Athlete pool. Yeah, I like, I think the the second best guy who who honestly might be the first best guy who who do you have second? Can you can I see the guy's roster again? Because I think I had the win. My winner was not. No, that's not who I was thinking of. I think Luke Dehong's going to be really good.
He was really, really good. Like two years ago. Up and coming athlete. And then and then. I don't know. He either got hurt or something happened to him. But there was like a year break for him. But I think he'll be better than a lot of people think. Luke Dehong, I'm home. I'm saying that right? But yeah, I I don't think Jake Douglas wins overall. Yeah.
I don't know. I don't know enough about the the Australian field to pontificate on that, but I would say he's still, like, he's still top three. There's no way he falls that far. Like, even even if he gets hurt. I know, Yeah. No, I can't see him not getting top three. Oh, you're talking about in this event, top three? No. No, no, no no, no, no overall. The total, Yeah, I I feel the same.
I don't think he doesn't get top three, but I think he was lucky to make the games last year there was a Max snatch in the semi finals and then there was a 185 snatches before a run in the semi finals. I think the semi finals stacked up really well for him and then he back doored it in, you know what I mean? So, and I don't think, I think, yeah, like I think I would not be surprised if Zach Thomas won. I would not be surprised if Peter Ellis won.
I think either one of them two could get ahead of him. Even Isaac, Isaac, Isaac Newman. Yeah. I I like that you pulled this up because like do you think he fares better in workout one and semi finals better than he does this workout? 100%. Just because it's same that. Yet another sled. Oh yeah, Body pulling. The workout one was pulling up the sled. Well, not not in Oceana, like
everybody did very. No, I know, I know the sled was lighter in Oceana, but he still has an advantage pulling that sled other other people. He still pulls it faster than other people. No, John, no context. Just no. Taylor, when you make a prediction that's better than mine, then you can start talking because I don't think you ever have once. You just disagree with everything. Taylor never plays. Because he know he doesn't. He knows he's going to be wrong about a lot of.
Stuff he knows he's got. To put it out there and be willing to be wrong a couple times, I think this is Jake Douglas worst event and it could stop him from winning the event. I don't think that that's a relatively crazy statement at all like this. Being I don't either, I don't know what. I just yeah no no's just ambiguous but he's heavy the beach run and it's like the dead ball cleans just just are not enough to to make a difference in this workout as far as win ability so.
No, no. Especially if he has to run, he has to go too much on the run to keep up. He may be slow. He won't gain the advantage that. I think the better runners will be in the will be the winners of this workout. One thing I did notice. So all of the events have a video. They do have written standards
for all of them. Tyler, I know you like that and we'll get to the PFAA in a little bit, but is this something that we should see from competitions with video standards maybe in my opinion, to some degree, written standards? Should we? Does it have to be a thing? No. Is it? Is it a nice professionality thing? Yeah, I would. If I were running an event, I would strive to have these. I mean, you know. With video performance on the standards, when I think it's great 100%.
I don't think it's a must have, but it it's it, it is probably a should have. I mean, think about like Crash doesn't have the biggest budget in the world and they still have them, right? Taylor, I literally said that before we talked about the workout. And then you're going to come out here and say, no, get out of here, bro. I said that before we even started talking about the workout. Oh man, go eat some. He just likes to disagree.
Yeah, you need some waffles. Event 2 On Friday on your bike 27 Burpee Box Jump Overs at 2420 Inches and then we. Didn't talk about the women. Do you want to talk about the? Women talk about who on the women's side on on event one are you looking forward to seeing? Oh, you don't? Want to say the women? That's my you have. He's my answer every single time. I'm a can you look, can you pull up the roster every time? Because I I'm going to have to see the roster every.
Every time. Are you taking Annika Greer? I'm taking Wait, hold on, I always get this confused. Is Amy Kringle the runner? Or who am I thinking of for that? Yeah, she's pretty good at running. Yes, yes, Amy Kringle's the runner, right? Because I know I heard another girl confused and then I like, I don't know who. Because remember, I made that wrong pick in fantasy once I ended up paying off. You know, Amy Kringle ended up being a pretty good pick. But I OK, yeah, I would say Amy
Kringle wins this event. Georgia Pryor Georgia Pryor is also a very good runner if I'm not mistaken. I could see that I'm. Picking on a skirt. Does does Annika finish last? No, no. She's a bad runner. But the field the field is lower than semi finals. What did she post that one time span and you were like? That's not good. Yes, Chris, that's who I get. That's who I get Mixed up is Lucy Campbell. I get Lucy Campbell and Amy Kringle mixed up. They're very similar.
I can see how you could confuse that to herself. She'll make up Brown on the gymnastics, though. Like, I think she's good enough at gymnastics that she won't be last place on on in the workout. Taylor Williamson. I think she does. Good. I don't know. She'll do good, dude. I know she'll probably do those D ball cleans on broken I. Mean she was at Mayhem, and they were in a lot. Yeah, I just don't. I like it. Anytime her or like the other one. The other one. Does, does anything, does
anything individual. I'm just like, I don't know what to think of y'all Andrea. Anytime, anytime. No, no. I know they're really good. But anytime Nestler and Taylor do any individual competition, everybody just assumes they're going to be amazing. And it's usually somewhere in the middle. They're not amazing, but they're all they're pretty good, you know what I'm saying? It was top 15 in the. World, you said Nestler to pick. Yeah, yeah.
And she got like 9th at the individual competition she chose to do. Do you remember which one it was? It was the. Pre games before there was the Invitational to the the COVID games, it was that at home. And she got, she got like 9th, right? Yeah, yeah. It's to herself that year to well. It didn't have. Team She wins everything that Rogue does. Yeah, anything that's a. Kind of the Queen. She wins more than Colton does. She's a freak, dude. She'll she'll do well if she
doesn't win. Her 50 Cal echo time is like 51 seconds. It's something. It's something insane. All right, event two. So the 27 burpee box jump overs and then 2115975 of C2 bite calories and deadlifts. This is something I could see Taylor Taylor Williamson went in. But yes, she's big. She's she's tall. What's an analysis? Just an overall large. The Hard Hitting Analysis by Tyler She's big.
It's not. It's not even as bad of analysis as as John just saying that she's going to win, I I mean. Taylor Williams So what did this work out? Right, this. I just see this and think about how bad it's going to hurt. Like you're not going to be able to walk at the end of it. Like you're going to fall off. Like you're going to drop the deadlift and just collapse. At the end, how fast? How fast are you getting through those burpees? A minute. Minute and 1/2. I think you can do it in a
minute. And then 2159? So I don't think they're going to be sprinting it. So I I yeah, a minute and 1/2 is probably more the right call, 'cause I wouldn't. You're not going to Sprint the burpees and then you're just going to go very, very hard on the bike and the deadlifts probably really hard on the bike and the deadlifts are just very smooth and controlled. So this is a 12 minute time cap. Are we Are you guys underestimating the time it's going to take to do this?
I don't know how. Long a bike's going to take like each one of those bike segments. It's not going to take super long, right? And then so it's just all deadlift. I don't know dude. I think. I think 8 minutes. I'm. Doing the math. Taylor, now's your time, now's your chance to tune in, but yeah. There it is. Zayn Healy. Yeah, but that's if you're not doing anything else, you got to go into something that's really, really leg heavy. I'm going to say sub seven, sub
seven. The winner will be sub seven. So why do you think do you I I would say that time cap is, is so that everybody has to get through it as opposed to being a rush. Yeah, no, no, I think it's so everybody has to do it. This is a workout where your legs will feel pain and it like that fill up pain and I think they want everybody to feel. That thing. All the way through. So yeah, I think the winner gets sub seven. I don't know. I think everybody should be done in 10 minutes.
Ldy 2742499 Thank you Taylor really wants a spot on the spin cast. You can't after he friggin train wreck the show on the last one, that was like me trying to ride two bulls at the same time. It was an absolute. Please, please use a different analogy than that. That didn't That didn't sound right. If people aren't watching this, that's. I don't know what's it, what's going to change if they're watching it? I I don't know. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right.
I don't know. It just didn't feel good. Zane's saying sub six. That's better than. There's no way that it happens. Maybe on the guy's side. Taylor agrees. Sub six. Sub six. That's moving, yeah. Jake. Jake on this. Way I think there's Berby slowing down and then just make him tired for the rest of it. I'm just asking about Jake. I'm not. Saying he's going to oh, oh oh, I feel like we just want to say Jake for everybody because that's the only name that we know.
I like. Thor what would be very similar to semifinals. Not really. Workout seven, I would say whoever. Workout 7 and be the biggest. Which one was that again? The bike and the sandbag and the toaster bar. Isaac Isaac won it, followed by Peter Ellis, Zach Thomas. Jake Thomas. Yeah. So I would say Isaac Newman then Isaac Newman is going to win
this workout. All right, guys, the reason why I'm thinking, I think I this is this is good that you use the semi finals because it has a lot of the semi finals guys in it from Oceana. I like, I like this. Everything is not going to have a one to one correlation, but you think about the guys that did great in that workout, Roman Hopper, Dallin, how do you think he was doing this workout? Right. This is a Sprint workout where
you could pump on the bike hard. Everybody who, everybody's going to be able to do the deadlifts semi unbroken should be unbroken. It's just going to hurt. I think everybody will do the work, the deadlifts unbroken. But so yeah, I think this, I'd say Isaac Newman.
The only thing I would say is that if you're a smaller person, like on the lighter side, like more of a gymnastics person, it'll help you because you're going to go into, you can go at the burpees at faster rate and you'll go into the bike less tired than somebody big. It's a Sprint, man. You're not going to be tired. Well, I guess it's not. It's 8 minutes. It's not a Sprint, but I still think, I still think it's not going to help the the the bike.
The bike and deadlift is the majority of the time everybody's going to do. You're not going to Sprint those 27 burger. Why do you think? Why do you think they put it there? It was only to pre fatigue your legs so that the. I agree, I agree. But it just makes the power output guys have more in an advantage. I think it's not going to take their power output advantage away. It's the only like that's the. Only I'm not saying that, Taylor, I'm out to X, I'm about
to rinse you off here. OK, Where you can't comment again. All right. I just said the opposite. If you say one more thing that I didn't say, I'm going to block you from comment. The thing that makes this better is I can read it in his voice. My point is, I don't think it's going to make the big guys tired because nobody's sprinting them, which we just. Said I I could see it as a trap, like the the first round of the bike was in Event 7 of semifinals, like how fast Roman
went out, like it's a trap. Like just get get them done. Don't Sprint through it because otherwise you're going to sit there and struggle at the end. Right. Or we're. All wrong. And that's the only way you win it. Please, somebody take that tactic. We want to see what? Happens, we'll see. Just go out and finish those sub sub one. Go for it. Three event, three Saturday 5 minute AMRAP, 40 calorie ski, 6 rope climbs and then in the remaining time Max overhead squats.
Gosh, this is this is rough. That's a neat workout. So you're going to have a little over 2 minutes of overhead squatting. Do you think? I mean, man, it's going to be hard to hold that bar after that. Everything's going to be fatigued core. Think about that. You can overhead squat for 2 to 2 1/2 minutes. No, I mean. I know that. What I'm saying. Like I'm just saying, you got to get it into position every time you drop it, so it's almost
worth it to Max out, right? Like, I don't know if it's worth it or not, whether they, like, just do fives or this is something I think Jake Douglas can win, just 'cause I think he can. The bar will feel better overhead. I think he can just overhead squat better than that, but he knows. And it's not really like there's just going to be a pace that all the guys have to do. Like you can't win it on the first two parts again, but you can lose it.
And it's like everybody's going to go with relatively probably the same pace on that. And then it's just who can hold the overhead squats. So yeah, I like Jake. I. This one I think I like this one. My only question is, I wonder if they'll have required breaks to walk to walk down the field. Right. It's like. A procession of reps on the on the overhead squads. Yeah. I hope not. I hope it's just staying in place. It'd be hard to know who's winning, though.
That's my only thing. That's true. OK. I see it from a production standpoint. I like that. But that answers your question like if it is a handful up, here it is. Zane. You have to move the bar every five reps. I don't mind that you guys don't like that. I mean, it's going to test a lot of guys just to see if they'll hold on. I don't think I would hold on on any of them, like do the five and then and then move like drop and move versus like do the five, hold it overhead and go.
There's no way, right? No, you don't do that. You could take it back to your back, walk, and then go back. I always forget about the back, the backdrop. I always I'm mixed on that. Like you think about events, event six with the overhead squats at semi finals and they had the two sets of 10. I would have rather seen them have to you know, somebody try to hold on for all 20 and fail on #19 'cause they didn't have a break. But by moving the bar up, you know where people are.
Comparatively I. It's such a long time domain. I think you just do five and then put it down your back, walk up and then jerk it up and then do 5, put it on your back. You probably can last a really long time doing that because you get to rest a little bit every time you're transitioning. I don't think you might not make it 2 1/2 minutes, but but you can probably make it a really long time. You know who would be really good at this one?
I'm, I think Gracie Walton will be really good at this one. But freaking Annika Greer probably has the greatest overhead cycle rate out of everybody. Like I think of like Colton Merton's. This is a workout that he could come out and win and nobody really picked him for. But just because his squat cycle rate is so fast and that's literally going to be half of the AMRAP, a little less than half of the AMRAP, almost half
of the AMRAP. Like, I think somebody like Annika Greer can come out and win this and it'd be really shocking to everybody. I may be totally screwing this up, but didn't she suck at a rope climb event though? I mean, yeah, I may be it's. A legless rope climb event. If these are regular rope climbing, it's not like it's
legless. So Julia Hannaford, Grace Walton, Emily Deroy. Of those competing on the Max Snatch during semifinals, I think it's probably a pretty good correlation to what we'll see The men's side, Jake Douglas. There's Johan Roberts. That's on Ricky's team with Isaac Newton. Newman. Newman He has to be tired. Of that he didn't invent gravity. And neither did Isaac Newton. Look how much, look how much how much bigger Jake's snatch is compared to. Yeah, Isaac, I I yeah. No, no, I agree.
I think I would take Jake Douglas in this event. I probably would take Gracie Walton and then and with for the women. I just would not be surprised if Annika Grier comes out and smokes everybody. Especially with six of them. What the What was the top weight for the women on the snatch in in in Australia? What was that? What was the top weight for the women in Australia for the snatch 190. Julia Hanover, 190 OK Monica is 180. They're so I she's done more than that.
That was in the semi final though. Yeah, yeah. Like, I think she just snatched 200 on Instagram, her E one 95190. Not after a damn rope climbs. No, no, no, no, you're right. But it's open squats. It's not. It's not. It is different. Right, like Colton doesn't have the best snatch. I think Colton would win this event. Just 'cause he can clean it just because his. Squat rate is. Squat rate is so fast.
It's so much faster than everybody else, and the majority of time on this is the overhead squats. If you did boil it down, are you going to ski more or rope climb more or overhead squat more? If you're overhead squatting more the than the other two movements, Annika Grier has the same squat rate that Colton does. Well, let's think about. Relatively, relatively. And I'm just thinking of the sandbag workout. None of y'all said Colton was going to win that workout.
I was the only one, and that had that ended up happening. That's how I'm thinking about this workout. I'm wondering though like, so let's let's set her. Let's look at the other end. So Taylor Williamson, she's tall and so the the ski and the rope climbs are both going to be easier for her and the weight isn't is probably relatively going to be lighter for her. So I like her for this over Anika. Anika, whatever. Yeah, I honestly think that'd be a really, really good race.
But. Watching both of those. Yeah, because Taylor Williamson should have a lead on really everybody, honestly, because she's going to ski faster than everybody and I don't think she'll be fine on the real times, you know what I mean? Yep. Event 4 Hard Yakka 20 Minute 20m Hanson Walk 20m Slalom Hanson Walk ten single arm kettlebell snatches on each side. 120 meter dual kettlebell farmers carry another ten single arm
kettlebell snatches. 120 Dual kettlebell farmers carry another ten single arm kettlebell snatches and then it go back through the handstand walk. This is a different 120. 20 meters, 60 feet, so 100 and. I wish Bailey Martin. 40 Mark would be a good one to watch. I'm going to pick. I think Peter Ellis will win this on the men's side and I think Emily Deroy will win on the women's side. I think they're just the best handstand walkers in the group and that's what I'm basing that off of.
That's it. Start got start. Do you think the handstand walk is the the signing factor on this one? I think the last bit of it will be. I think all that other stuff is tiring you out for the last part of the handstand walk. The last, because it ends on that too. I mean, the whole thing is just terrible on your shoulders. Yours. It's well, So what? It's 53 LB Kettle bells for the women and 70 LB.
Kettle bells for the women. For the men 120 meters it's it's I mean that's that's no that's long but you can run most of that like I I you can run the 1st 120 unbroken if you wanted to. I don't I really think most of them will be fine on that it is far but I just did a 400 meter carry with the 70s and I would not unbroken but like I ran half of it before I put the before I put the kettle bells down.
So I think most of them will be OK on the 120 meter dual kettlebell carries and then they're not going to struggle on the 10 single arm snatches. I just don't you know what I mean I don't think they're going to struggle so I think it'll come down to the handstand walk. They're all really fit right. And so I just think the best handstand walkers will come out on top. Who has better hair than he does? That's hard. He's got great hair. So it looks like the slalom is
unbroken. Sections of it are unbroken. Or just the whole thing. I don't know. Oh yeah, See, I don't think slalom is all that challenging. Like you don't have to be a great handstand market to be able to slalom. No, I. Don't think it's that much different, no. I mean, I guess. Originally thought it was the things that Jr. had at Crash where you had to step over the things. I think that would be better. I did like that. I thought that was a new twist on something that we hadn't seen.
Well, they just seemed, they seemed really big too. Like really big thing, really big to step over. Like, just big enough that it's uncomfortable. Yeah, Event 5 Crikey. So this is our our heavy, heavy lift. So basically you have a 2 minute window to do 10 ring muscle UPS, 8 for the women, and then a four load 3 squat cleans. You get the rest a minute.
Then do another 10-8 ring muscle UPS, 2 squat cleans for load rest a minute, and then you get 3 minutes to do another 10 or 8 ring muscle UPS followed by a one Rep Max squat clean. You take the best. Yeah, so you pick your weights and then the score is adding up your best three Rep, your best two Rep, and your best one Rep squat clean for a total weight. I'm gonna go out, go out on a ledge here, OK? Risky pick. I think Jake Douglas wins this one. Yeah.
That's probably a good pick. Scott, it's just the cleans. I would have liked to jerk does this it? Hurts Taylor Williamson a little bit. If it was Pat, if you could just clean it, I think. Oh, it's set a Yeah. Hurt power in it. Yeah. I still. I mean like. Do we there'll be a like this format, like are we gaining anything by doing this type of volume? I'll try to say this without Oh, what do you mean, just the competition as a whole, in
general, like so far? Or are you talking about this? Event this event right like you're you're if you're the strongest, if you're the one, if you're the best one Rep, squat clean. You're the strongest guy. You're Jake Douglas. Is there any way you don't win this like? Well, yeah, I guess the ring muscle UPS don't really like you're you're going unbroken. I think for everybody. Everybody should go unbroken. Why would you? On the muscle, I wouldn't.
Well, yeah, I guess. Well, you only have two minutes. That's plenty of time. You do 55. You could do six and four in literally 40 seconds, rest 40 seconds and then do your cleans. Yeah, speed doesn't matter, but. Are you going to do multiple tries at 3 reps on the on the squat? No. So I would take your time with the muscle UPS, take your rest and then do your cleans. I guess well so this, this leans into what we're going to talk about later.
So the other way of doing it was just take out the ring muscle UPS and and it does the same thing, right. And I would, I think I would rather see something in there. I'm I'm not sure that this is programmed correctly, but I'm I'm more happy something's in there than not like some other you. Think the ring muscle UPS would affect cleaning jerks much more than squat cleaning? Like if you wanted the ring muscle UPS too?
That's what I'm saying, right? I do think they would affect cleaning jerks just from overhead stability in your triceps being worked. Yeah. It's pointless volume. I like, I like. There's another modality. But yeah, it feels a little pointless. Maybe this could have been programmed better. And I mean, if it is pointless volume, then then you would rather it not be there because then we get to see freaky numbers, you know what I mean?
Like if the strongest still winds cool, but we didn't get to see the crazy of the craziest numbers because of the ring muscle UPS, right? But this shouldn't affect anybody. What's a better What's a better workout? Jr. Go. Well, we can talk about this when we get to our next topic. Yeah, Yeah. I I just, as I was reading through this, I I felt like well if you're the strongest one like you're going to win anyway. Like are we just doing volume to do volume?
It's just there to piss Jake Douglas off. Why? Why? Why? I guess it does weed out someone who's bad at ring muscle UPS, but it. Doesn't matter. There's no, but yeah, there's no way that like they are there if that's true. If you can't get through those, you probably shouldn't be in the elite, yeah. 112 off. That means that means one minute to do your ring muscle UPS and cleans. So then the ring muscle UPS would kind of have to have to get through, not have to be unbroken.
But I mean, you don't get to rest very much. Right, right. Because I mean this, this last one, you have 3 minutes to get through it. So like to John's point, you're not going to be, you're not going to be doing, you know, a whole bunch of one Rep squat cleans. And then you're just going to sit there for? Take your time, I put your onus. On the ring muscle UPS a lot more, but I mean it's just if you're bad at ring muscle UPS it lowers your Max.
If you if you're good at ring muscle UPS, it lowers your Max but not by as much. And Taylor 21159 ring muscle UPS instead of the 10. Got one? Then it's just 21159 and then he spells it out. Thanks. I ain't got changes to work out entirely. Yeah, I like next one. Next one Sunday catch you later 2 rounds so 10 strict wall facing handstand push ups, 10 dual kettlebell squats more, 10 more handstand push ups, 15 back squats, 10 more wall facing
handstand push ups and 12 squats. 2 rounds of that four time 16 minute cap. So none of those squats are very heavy. I don't think they're going to play a role in everything. I think this is just who's the best at handstand push ups, shoulder handstand, push up, endurance, strict wall facing, handstand push ups. It doesn't change from that. It would have been cool if that would have been like progressively.
Harder. I think in like 1 round, but it gets progressively harder on the handstand push ups like it maybe it into the 10 parallet handstand push ups, you know something like that, but. 60 of those are. Going to add up, yeah, I think at the end, especially with the shoulder demand on the dual kettlebell squats, even if it's just right here, and then the back squats, I mean, like this isn't a comfortable position. And then the dead ball squats like you're going to be right here like this.
It's a lot of it's shoulder dominant. I mean it. For sure, for sure. But like I think people remember. Well that's the best thing. I don't think so. I think you just break it up. Do you have to wall walk this or can you cartwheel into it? I hope it's cartwheel. I don't know. Damn, they just cut to him in it. Oh, here it is it. Looks like he wall walks, yeah. Yeah, but does it say you have to? I'm sure it does, because if you
don't have to wall walk, do any. I mean, cartwheeling saves so many seconds. Yeah, it looks like. So he's going to it each time. Yeah, they cut it out, but yeah, it looks like he wall walks it out. But I think, yeah, Annika Greer, I think it's going to smoke this. I think she might beat everybody. I'd like to know the Z score on this one because I bet she beat 2nd place by a lot. Peace score. Peace. Oh, I'm sorry we changed the letter up.
My bad, my bad, my bad. It's totally different formula, John, come on. Gotcha, gotcha. All right. All right. Any I mean I'm going to just say Peter Ellis again on the immense side, he did the best on workout six, you know so like in semi finals. So that's who I would pick. Yeah, I don't, Thor. I don't know how Jake Douglas
will do in this workout. Like he's a guy that the handstand push ups might could get and the handstand push ups get if he if the handstand put you get you and you get 15th out of 22nd guys, 22 guys. What you're doing poorly on the 1st event, that's. Enormous like that, you know what I'm saying? I mean, if we go back to our our previous event, I'm definitely taking Monica over Taylor now in this one. All for the handstand push ups. She's getting a murder and it's not.
It doesn't hurt you to be shorter or like not way as heavy in this workout. Well, I know we don't. We know she's great at handstand push ups. She's won handstand push up workouts before. But like the the barbell or the the squats aren't really going to slow you down. I don't think anything else. Does squatter. There's nothing on that that she's going to be bad at on that event and. Then we end with 60 cleaning jerks, 2 scores, 50 points each.
First is the 30 reps and the 2nd is the total time. This is an interesting thing. So my prediction for this is Jake Douglas wins event 7 and then he gets 11th place in event 8. No, No way. This is his to win. This is his to win. Dude, grace is not a strength thing at all. At all. Taylor would beat me in double grace easy. And then if he goes on broken on grace on the first one, then then we tie.
I don't know what to tell you, but like like if you want to do go to an event seven, you have to go unbroken, right? If you want to win event seven, you have to go unbroken. Do you need to though? Somebody will you know if you're a person. Yeah, but you only get 50. But I It's true, you only get 50 points, so. But I think, like enough guys, it's all about what everybody else does. You know, 'cause if if like I like Tyler probably could do Grace unbroken if it really
meant something to him. No. Well, you. Don't think so. No, I've tried. I Well, well, I beat her out somewhere. Around I'm saying a lot of these guys can go unbroken on Grace and so I it's just like if 10 guys not they're like irrelevant to the leaderboard go unbroken on the first Grace. Do you not think Jake Douglas is going to or Peter Ellis is going to or Isaac Newman, right. I think, I think this is like you kind of kind of just got to see what everybody else is doing.
I think you find, yeah, I mean it depends like I'm wondering the heats now like. This is a really great. This is a really weird one to do this with because I think a lot of guys can go unbroken in the 7th 1:00, so it just depends what who wants to. To me, you need to find your your, what you're. I mean people are just going to play their thing. So it's like, yeah, if you can, if you think you can win the 30, just go for it. But like, don't do it to the detriment that you're going to
get last and basically just get. Them in the pack score overall you wouldn't but like I'm. You don't think so? No. No, no, no. Yeah. I think if you go unbroken, you're ahead of everybody, right? That doesn't. Maybe not by much though. No, no, not by much, not by much. But then you just start doing singles because that's what everybody's going to do in double grace is singles, right? 30 unbroken and then 30 singles. You're not going to be last
place on that. But I and I think that's what I think we'll see a lot of people. I think we'll see more people that you think go 30 unbroken and then 30 singles and you. I think this is just an impossible workout to win both of them. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe enough. Maybe they all try to go unbroken on the first one and everybody is like in the same hole. Right. And then it's just the fittest guy can do well, you know, we'll do the 60 cleaning jerks.
Dan, There's a famous video of Dan doing Grace in 3rd and 90 or in in under 60 seconds, right. But what's the top end score on double Grace or. I mean, yeah, what's the, what's the best? Where we're going to be on double Grace. So you can't. You can't do them unbroken, so it's. Oh, they have to purchase. They have Mats, they have a set of 20 and then then 10/10, 10:10. I guess you can walk it that way.
OK, well then I think they all do 20 cleaning jerks unbroken, and then I think they all suit in more cleaning jerks. And then I think it'll go to singles from there. And I just don't think, I don't think Jake Douglas is going to win both of them. Like people are too fit nowadays. If it was 155, maybe then. But people are really, really fit now. It's not just who. It's not who's the strongest. On the women's side, you got anybody? Grace Grace Walton. Yeah.
I don't know, man. I I I don't. Grace or Julia? Dude, I think like Maddie Sturt could come in clutch on something like this. That's what I'm saying. Freaking Sturt, man. Like for the 60, for the 60. Maybe she won't win the 30, but I think she can win the 60. I think she can win one of. Them. Yeah, 30, Sorry. And I don't think she can win 30, but I could see the 60 for sure. I think Taylor Williamson could win the 30. I don't know. This is a weird one. I don't like this.
I don't like this workout as far as it being like this is your I'm I I like that it's worth 50 points because it does feel like you got to pick one. It feels like that. I don't think you do. I think that's dumb. You know just, I mean you can do 20 reps and then rest and then do 10 reps though at a slower rate than you would like all out I'm saying as far as to to win to win it feels like.
You. I'm just saying like it if you're not good at. If you're not good at double grace, you're not going to be good at the at regular grace, Like you're not going to go out too hard trying to win something. So like they're all going to pace it and if Jake doesn't have to as much, he'll win that one and he'll be fine on the on the back end. Oh. I don't think they're all going to pace it, man. I think people are going to go for that first one. I really do.
John's the guy who went for the first one. And I wish it was, I wish it was 100 points each and it meant like there was bigger swings. Yeah, 'cause then, then it's legitimate. Like pick one. I tell you what, who was that guy in 2019 that just went for the double ringer one in the very first one. He went for it and sold his soul on the bike. Wasn't an Australian guy, they like to go for things down
there. It was James Newberry OK, and he beat Matt Fraser in a 30/20/10 assault bike toaster. Ring, I'm telling you. Like there is a a syndic mentality that Australians have, like it's more prevalent in Australia than it is here. I know it's James Newberry, I'm testing them. Chris, come on now, you don't think I know it's James Newberry. I just think way more people are going to send it on that first one than you guys think and that's going to affect the
leaderboard a lot. What do you think Jay? If you're still here, Jay, can you tell us what you think this would? This would be a great one to have your insight on. Taylor must be eaten or he would have. He would say Maddie's going to win. I picked Maddie for the the the second one. All right. Overall overall winner, Men's and women's. Who are you picking? Peter Ellis. That was my pick. Tyler. I don't know, Jake. OK, it's a great analytic brain. There you got that. Was good, that was.
Good, I. Don't know enough about the field. It's so hard because it's like, I'm sure there's great people in there. It's just I don't know anything about them. You know what I mean? And and the guys I do know aren't there. No, no, no. Specifically on event 7, Jay, do you think people will send it on the 1st 30 cleaning jerks? That's what I'm asking because they don't think so. They think everybody's going to
pace that first one. I think there's going to be a lot of people that send it. Would Jay go unbroken? Jay would go well. He can't because 20 and 10. What do you go? Yeah. I think a lot of people try to go unbroken and then go to 3rd to singles on double grace. I think we see that way more than people pacing the whole thing. And on the women's side? I actually guys I'm. Actually, going to say. Taylor I want. I want to see Tyler go first all. Right, Taylor. Taylor going to win it, OK?
Taylor's going to win. I have Grace Grace Walton. Yeah. I really like that pick. She's with underdogs now. Yeah, well, that makes me like it even more. OK, I'll ride the train. I'll go Gracie Walton. 20 and 10 so he's going all out, so. Yeah, there you go. Heard from him? I. Wonder if everybody goes like that. I still think Jake can win that one. Both of them. I How you think he moves faster than everybody else because I don't think he moves faster. I think he'll have.
More than a tank 5 minute workout. I think he'll have more in the tank after that first thirty than everybody else. No, but I'm saying I don't think he wins the 1st, 30. Yeah. He's act like that's a given. Maybe he does, maybe he does. I you know. Allegra are welcome member. So I set up memberships. I haven't done anything. I think I may have set up a couple emojis for it, I don't know. But when when Pedro did it, I was like, hey, I'll turn it on. So hop on the train.
Thank. Thank you, Allegra. T Bird also prime member, I think. Maybe I didn't see her. She's got the thing. I don't know if that's. What he said, he said, he said. Peter, Peter Ellis. Peter Ellis. Yeah. Hey. Jay, other than Maddie, who do you got not allowed to pick her? TuneIn. I don't know why it's doing this, but I think I have AI. Did AI did a mountain emoji? Oh. Did ya? Yeah, There we go. Second, second topic. Dubai came out with a event for theirs, Max Snatch, Max clean
and jerk. We don't know. The format caused some discussion amongst our group and Brian Friend then wrote an article about are we testing one Rep Max Olympic lifting too often? The stats department got in there pretty heavily, went through a lot of detail on every time a Max snatch, clean, clean and jerk has been programmed and kind of broke it down. I mean even going to the Malaga throwdown in 2022, so going way
deeper than I would have. So the question is, we've seen it at the at the Games this year. We've seen it plenty of times before. I think really what Brian kind of drew is that if you look at the entire history of the of the whole CrossFit Games, it's probably not been too much, but we've seen it a lot lately. Are we seeing Olympic weightlifting tested in a single modality format? Too much in your opinion.
Tyler my yes. I mean it's such I think the clean and jar so the snatch more so than the clean and jerk because you can. Like Chandler is not a real great technical mover, but he's he's good at the clean and jerk because he can out strength it, right? And essentially that's what those two things we're testing is strength and skill. And there's a point when the skill is so specific and it doesn't make sense to me to be a broadly Chet tested, tested event.
Right? And there's there's so many other ways you can test strength that I would rather see. And so my boat is yes, specifically on the snatch but then also the queen and jerk. John, I'm interested to hear your take. And one more thing. I hate. I'm really bad at snatch, so fair enough. The first thing I would say is like, are we you, are you tired of handstand walking? Because that is is there's a handstand walking only event in
every single competition. It's almost always just a handstand walking event, especially at the games at specifically at the games. I know handstand walking is in a lot of workouts, but there is a handstand walking specific event a lot at the games and if there's not then 30 ring muscle UPS, like that's a single modality gymnastics and I and I get mixing them around. I use handstand walking because like that's the one I think comes up the most.
But and then what about running? Like we do a running only event all the time, right? I'm not complaining because that's all I freaking do. Now I'm looking forward to the running event at the fittest experience. But guess what? There's going to be a running event at the fist experience and then there's going to be a lifting event at the fittest experience. I get. I get where people are coming from, where it's like you only see a one Rep Max snatcher clean
and jerk. Well, an Olympic lifting there's only two lifts, It's snatching, clean and jerk. And you could split the clean and jerk up into two different ways, the clean and the jerk, right. That's, you know, if they wanted to test power, I think that's a way to change it. But you got to be real strict on your standard, you know what I mean? Like I don't know how you like you. We've only we only test powers because it's hard to hard to
see, right. But like overhead squat, I think that's a part of Olympic lifting and anytime that's on a a Max out thing, people don't get in a bind. I just think people get tired of it because it's 2 lifts and running. You can Sprint running, you can run long, you can run the middle, you can do a mile test, but it's still just running and we don't get tired of that and I'm not tired of it. Either.
Yeah, but you don't. You don't have to put in the hours to run as well as like to the level that is is really good that you do with snatch. How would you argue the opposite? I snatched 275 within one year of trying to snatch. Yes, John, and you're a freak at lifting. That doesn't count. Man, what? There's freaks at running. I just think there's more of them. I think there's more. People. If there's more of them, it doesn't make them freaks. No, no, no, no, Okay, that's fair.
There are more people that are just natural or like take aerobic fitness better than others. Then there are people who take strength gains better than. Others, and I think that's because of the skill, dude. I don't think it has to do anything with with your your ability to get better strength. It's that the ability to run is not a hard skill. We're built to do that as humans, but to do a snatch is not a natural movement in any manner, and it's a very specific skill you have to work on.
But I guess, I mean if we're doing a one Rep Max lift like even your boy brawny right here saying we shouldn't be doing these types of single modality tests whether it's running like LDY has here, are we running, we're testing running too often as well like as a single modality or should we build it in and like we just talked about down under like they just did the the squat cleans but they have to do ring muscle UPS. Right. And we and what did we say?
We said it was muscle. UPS were irrelevant. But they programmed it that way. Right, I think the idea. I think the idea is. Right. Maybe. Do we make it differently, right, like you got? And I would argue if you did it like how Jr. did it, it's no, like it is a strength test, but it just hurts the strength athletes more than the gymnastics athletes basically evens the playing field.
So then, right, for a strength test, essentially you're saying, hey, you guys that are strong, you don't get to be strong anymore. Hey you gymnastics guys that aren't strong here's a bone and I'm not saying it's wrong. OK, before you like we like start arguing. I don't necessarily think it's wrong. I just don't think it's like hey we don't need to one Rep Max test anymore. Like I don't. I don't. I think the games, I don't know like the games did A1 Rep Max sandbag clean.
Is that a part of a one? It's a one Rep Max lifting. Right. But that's tired of that. My second question is, should we be doing things like that instead of like the games just had it? And I know that maybe they've already been planning this the the programming for Down Under before this was announced, but. Dubai. For Dubai, well, no, but like
maybe the games programming. Dubai was programmed before the games came out with it. But do we want to see Bratislaw go do A1 Rep Max Snatch and clean and drink again? Or would we rather have him lift a sandbag or do some other type of strength based event, whether it's like a strong main event or something like that? I would argue more people would rather see them snatch and clean and jerk. I mean, yeah, imagine the reels that are going to get created.
That's a lot. That's probably got a lot to do with it. It's really easy, like visually and sellable. And to me, as a a bit of a purist, that kind of pisses me off. But I think it was really sellable. It was really sellable to see people lift a sandbag. It may have taken Jacqueline Dahlstrom an entire real length to be able to do it, but it's really cool. Yeah, I'm just wondering if if should we be testing different things for the strength piece of it versus just clean and jerk
and snatch? I'm saying that you take away from the clean and jerk and snatch if you test it for different, it's a part of strength. It's our main thing of strength. It's hard. To do many. Different things, but OK, Like if they had like the CrossFit total, for instance, they had the CrossFit total at the games, right? That's a great way to test strength, right? In quarterfinals they had the other total, which has an Olympic lift and then bench press in it.
Great way to test strength, right? Sorry, there's a car out here. My dogs are freaking out. And what I'm saying is I think we should have. So like if you have the games or Dubai, you can have a brute strength way to test strength and then you can have an Olympic way to test strength and then you have things that combine
them, right? That's CrossFit, and you also have your single modality running event, your single modality gymnastics event, and then you combine them like, I don't see any problem if like if it's just the Olympic lifting thing that you're getting behind. Like we always have a single modality endurance event or we have just a. Single modality, yes, not single movement. Yeah, I mean, you get running. You've had Handstand Walk in the semifinals in the past.
Yes, but those are always variable. I yeah, so, so like, I think, I think the Olympic lifts are just less variable than those other two things. But we have it in other things. People just don't complain about it the way they do Olympic lifting. And and I think it's just because it's skews, I would argue Olympic lifting skews the leaderboard more than those, more than running does or more than handstand walking does.
And that's why it's like this shouldn't be there, but I I absolutely think it should be there. If you want to make it like a three Rep squat clean Max, you can make it variable like that, you know, Travis Mayer, three Rep squat clean 350. And I've not ever seen anybody else do that, right. Like, I think Jeff Adler probably can do that, but I've never seen him do it. And like, you can make it variable. So like if it's one Rep Max that's the problem, then do an 8
Rep Max clean, right. That's really hard to do right. Eight reps like touch and go, you are not allowed to rest on the ground. That's a variable way to test strength. You know, like that's how you can make it variable. I don't think we should just do away with it though, because it feels like we do it too much. It's a part of testing strength. I think every competition should have a brute way to test strength. Squat, deadlift, bench press. Hitler made a great post about
bench press. I don't think we test bench press like at all. Which again, I don't have a problem with it, but or sandbags, A brute way to test strength, sled push. We don't have to do it. Pull a. Volkswagen do something different than always just doing the two lists hear. Me on, hear me on, I think there's. Always Volkswagens. A brute way to test strength and then a Olympic lifting way to test strength because it's a part of strength, fitness, it's a part of it.
It's a whole sport, right? Like, and I think every competition should test strength in those two ways. And then you can test running and however way you want to test it, probably sprinting in long distance, right? Which they always do sprinting in long distance.
And then if you want to test gymnastics, usually with handstand walking, and then pick your thing, legless rope climbs, ring muscle UPS, there's always a varied gymnastics specific workout where the gymnastics is the crux of the workout. Sometimes it's handstand push ups and then every other event that covers 6 events right every other event's CrossFit. That's it. It's a lot of events which I
have my own thoughts about. If you have, if you have 13 events, if you have 13 events, that's seven events. CrossFit. The game. That's the games, I'm just saying. Is a different Taylor, so. I'm just saying for something like Dubai. OK, so, but OK. We only have 678 events for sure. OK, OK. How many events do you have? 8. 8. So then for a Dubai, there should be 1 endurance specific event, right?
Yeah, it's probably, it's probably going to be, I'm just saying one one year, one year it was climbing stairs for 40 minutes and then there should be one specific strength event. They chose Olympic lifting, so that means they should not be a
brute strength one. And then you have one gymnastics specific event, probably ring muscle UPS because they love it or those funky freaking whatever backwards chest of our pull ups they like to do. They like to do whatever funky stuff they want to do, but like gymnastics specific event and then the rest is CrossFit. So you have 5 CrossFit events where it's a whole bunch of stuff the way to moderate or light however you want to do it, and then the gymnastics is
whatever you want. It's all it's just called Crossfitty. There can be running in there too, you know. You know what I mean? You know what I'm saying? But there's three events to test specific modalities, endurance, gymnastics and strength. They chose Olympic lifting. It could have been a one Rep Max deadlift. I think people would be just as mad about that because that just happens, right? Should. We find some other ways. That I don't think so. I think you should.
I think you should make sure the test is well-rounded, right? So there should be a specific strength event, a specific endurance event, a specific gymnastics event, and then the rest CrossFit. If it's a bigger competition, you do 2 of each and I think that makes for a really good competition. Well, I'm sure that the PFAA will have something to say about that at some point. I disagree with you, but last topic. Why do you disagree? I think.
It doesn't need 8 minutes it. Doesn't need to be the same the same 2 lifts. I think you should vary it such that I. Just told you how to vary it. But I don't want to see, I don't want to see one of those events always be Olympic lifting. Every single event there is one of those events is running, but you ran cross. Country. I'm not saying that I don't want to see. No, I don't. I don't want to see. I don't have a problem with it. I don't want to see running as the first event every time
either. OK, I I would argue we don't talk about that ever. And we're talking about this and I think it's stupid. You argued about you. It's your argument. Let's do PFAA. Let's go. All right. All right. So Tier Watapalooza formed a partnership with Brent Fakowski's PFAA. And basically Watapalooza agreed, I guess is the best way of saying it to commit to certain things for the competition. And so the PFA has it on there, Water Palooza has it on their website.
And so it goes through a lot of detail. And I want to kind of get your thoughts on, is this the right direction for the sport? We need Peter. We need Peter here to to make a joke about how they're trying to rival Rogues instructions for workouts with how long this there's. A There's a lot. Going on here. How like in what's the word I'm looking for like resume? It looks like the resume's the wrong word, but manual like it looks like a manual.
It's like the. It's the Organizer Event manual, so like water, Palooza agrees to provide the following information 30 days prior to the competition. The number of workouts, number of times they take the floor, scoring details, point breakdowns which athletes have to swim and swag details which seems odd. Number of workouts like. Is that really important in an event like that that eliminates surprise events, that eliminates like the unknown, unknowable of what you're going to be doing?
Like, is that where we should be focusing our time, Tyler? Why do unions exist? That's, that was my question. Whenever I started reading this, and it's usually because somebody wasn't doing something and people got pissed off about it and fed up. And so they got together and they were like, enough of this, right? And so Brent is doing that because he's been fed up with how events have run in the past. And I'm not talking about Water Palooza specifically. I'm talking about the industry
as a whole. And fair enough, like things didn't look like they were going to change for a long time and there was a lot of stuff going on. And so Brent's an industrious guy. He gets together and starts doing this. Reading through this, it's clear that Brent is a taskmaster and will leave no rock unturned. And that's his job. He's running the PFA and that's fine if I'm And so now you have this group trying to solve this problem and Dylan's face to do what? Like he can never either say no,
you can go to hell. I don't want to do with your thing which only creates bad press for water Palooza. Or you can say yes, come along, which I think is the smarter, the smarter thing, because then he controls how much and especially from the beginning, right? And if you watch the interview he did with Sean, they both did with Sean, it's like, OK, they want to create this relationship. And to me, I I get that I would rather control the relationship from the front as opposed to
have to deal with it later. But as a whole, I don't like the direction I think. I think events should just do this stuff on their own. If I were running an event, I would not want somebody in my pocket. I don't want someone telling me what to do. And so it's. Like fair, I bet. I think Brent would probably agree with you. Right. Is this true? I didn't. I didn't catch the talking elite fitness interview. But did Juana Palooza approach
the PFAA? I don't know if that's true, but if it is true, it doesn't make sense. Like just get on board with us. Like, I don't. I don't think that that's an ignorant move. I don't. I just don't. I don't like the, I don't like the wormhole. If this opens up. What is just what?
What would make it explain? To me, like a lot of problems is when groups become too large, there's too many voices in the room, nothing gets done as opposed to there's just one or two voices in the room and then everything gets done because it's you don't have that many decision makers, right? And so to me, all the athletes are going to get a voice.
And I'm not saying that they don't deserve a voice, but it's like some things like this could just rather easily be taken care of if event runners just ran a good event to begin with. Like nothing in this thing is that. Thing though. Like, you know what I mean? Like what? Do you mean if it's a cop out? I'm. Saying like it would be a perfect world if if all events ran well but.
But like some, there's so many things in this document that are low, like low hanging fruit now, like the swag thing. Like to me, why do you need to know what swag you're getting? Be happy you're getting swag and and just go on with it. Like, why? Why do you need any warning about that? That's strange. People say you're winning a swag bag. I'm like, OK, so I'm winning nothing. Like that's how I feel about a swag. Free protein. Well, like like they do that in
local competition. Like it's not worth my time. I I don't think I'm opposed to studying a framework for it, but I feel like some of it went maybe a bit just too far, like, why is this? Why are we boxing ourselves in? One of the things in there was like prize purse, great having a liaison to understand what's going on with that, OK.
But I get down here and it's talking about where is it scoring And basically it sounds like your your Peace Corps would never be implemented in what of pleasure? Because they wouldn't even know. But you know what like this is, this is a, this is an instance that it's a good example ahead of the Crucible, Jr. said. Write me up a short thing about Peace Corps, how it works and how to get a hold of you. He sent it out to the athletes and I like, made it explicit.
Please reach out to me. I don't care to talk about this. But he know he knew people were going to have issues with it or want to understand more about it. And it's like, but no one was holding his hand or like turning in his arm and saying, hey, you have to take care of this. He just went ahead and did it on his own and that's what I'm talking about. Like just run a good event. Should. I mean, we've gotten to this
point by innovation? Like my thought of it when I see this was does it stifle new creative ways of running a competition? Because, like, there's certain, you know, minimum work requirements that are understandable. There's standards for like handstand push ups or whatever. Like new movements have to be almost like they were almost like vetted in some way. Or like you can't bring something new to the table like you've seen in the past without it causing an uproar.
Yeah, those logs in 2014 that they had to carry on those on their backs, that'd be outlawed for sure, right? 2013. 13, yeah. Thank you, John. Sorry. Yeah, I just, I just don't know like why? Why couldn't you have a winner take all final event if you had some way of like, hey the top five get into it, you make it clear at the beginning, the top
five fight for the top spot. Like, I'm not saying that's the best way of doing it, but to say that you can never run a competition that way seems odd to me. I. Agree. I agree to like that for them like it feels like they kind of have strapped them down on what they can and can't do and that's a relationship is never, it's never a good relationship. When somebody says hey you can do this, you can't do this like and that's how you start the relationship, right.
With anything. I I I do think it's better that it's overdone than underdone, right. It's very clear. If they agree to this then we know what to expect and that's nice. Is that good for the sport though? I don't know. It doesn't seem like a it it says president it's it's a dangerous president eventually and maybe under the control of of Brent we don't have to worry about it. But like Brent might not always be around to want to do this And so it's like, yeah, I I I just
don't like where it goes. The one thing I did wonder is if eventually, like, like, right now, I don't know. It's like, what if Water Palooza says we're going to agree to do all of this, and then they don't do any, They don't deliver on any of it, What the Hell's going to happen? The athletes are already at the event that, like, there's nothing that's going to happen now. Eventually it would probably be not positive, but like they're.
Already there manual like if you do not abide, you owe us 30. 7 right? Like I I need. I need that in the manual. I mean like just poking the holes in this. This seemed like a friendly effort from Water Palooza to PFA, which I I do, I I do think it's positive, but I just don't like the whole contractual agreement looking thing about it. Yeah, I mean they, they even signed it.
So it's very, very contractual. Yeah, I don't know, I just thought it was interesting like is this the right direction? Should are we, are we cornering ourselves into this is what a competition looks like and that's what it's going to be. We talk about how it's a new sport. Are we? Are we really at a point where we don't need to worry about changing anything down the road? So go check it out. It's on Water, Palooza site, PFA as well. They have it in their news
section. And then you can always go to talk and Elite Fitness and see Brent and Dylan kind of discuss that a little bit more. Well, guys, hate to do this, but it got cut out early. Got to go run and catch an important phone call. Go to 3rd Z's and ESC sounds. That's right. Third Z BBS for 20% off discount on your next bag of third Z. And then ESC sounds has the ESC sounds mini. They're down to less than 100 in stock on their first run, so if you want it better go get it
now. So, all right, guys. Until next week. Later. See you. Have a good one guys.