You should consult with a intellectual property professional while you're going through your branding. And when you start your branding, or at some point in the branding where you've selected a name, right? And what you want to do is you want to make sure that that name isn't already taken by somebody else, that somebody else doesn't already have a trademark that covers that name. And sometimes that's harder than it seems. Because there's only a finite
number of names available. You see a lot of companies now just making up fanciful names, names that don't mean anything. That's because there's only a certain number of words you can
This is The MindShift Podcast where we trademark. share real stories, real strategies, that will help you find real success. This is the place to hear from people just like you who have taken their ideas, goals and dreams from a point of inspiration to realization or when life knocked them down, from a point of breakdown to breakthrough. I'm your host, Darrell Evans. Let's get started with today's episode.
Hey, everyone, welcome back to The MindShift Podcast. I'm super excited to have you here. If this happens to be your first time here, I am your host, Darrell Evans. And I just want to thank you in advance for taking some time out of your day to spend it here with us. Our goal here on this show, every single time we show up, is to help you shift your mind so you can shift your results. And today, my guest is Richard Gearhart. He is the
founder of Gearhart Law. And he's the host of a weekly radio show for entrepreneurs called Passage To Profit. And I'm loving this conversation because I got a chance to be on his show. And we're going to talk a lot more about what they're doing and how they just became a syndicated show. I'm super excited for you to hear this. He's built a law firm over the last 30 years with an international presence that helps entrepreneurs from all around the world with their patent, trademark, and copyright
needs. Richard's passion for entrepreneurship and startups really aligns with mine. And that is, he believes that entrepreneurship grows the economy, and creates jobs. Richard, welcome to The MindShift Podcast. Really glad to have you here.
Well, thank you very much, Darrell, I'm thrilled to be here. And it's great to see you again, it's been a while since you were on the Passage To Profit, but you haven't changed much. So, ah and that's nice, because you were one of my favorite guests, for sure. You brought a lot of insight to the show. And it was a pleasure to work with you on that project. So thank you so much.
Oh Richard, thank you. You know, I really appreciate any time I get an opportunity to be on someone else's platform and to hear you say that and to know that your show is syndicated, it reaches so many people. I mean, I was really impressed with how far your show has gone. It really gives me something to aspire to here with our show. But you know, listen, thank you for taking time to be here. I'm glad
we had a great connection. And I think that's really the benefit of podcasting for me over the last three years or so at this point. It's just been the relationships and the diversity of like minded individuals that I'm not sure our paths would have ever crossed otherwise, had it not been for this medium called a podcast. I mean, what part of the world are you in?
Well, geographically located in Summit, New Jersey, and we do some of the recording for the show in New York. We did, when the first show, first started, but because of COVID, of course, we all had to go remote. And it turned out to be one of the best things ever for the program because it gave us access to guests that we didn't have
before. People on the West Coast, people overseas. And I think that most podcasters would agree with me that being able to do a podcast or a radio show remotely really opens up a lot of doors, a lot of possibilities. And since migrating from the studio in New York City, we've had just a really phenomenal array of guests, who we've really enjoyed speaking with. And like you said, we formed some great relationships with some of our guests. It's been great for
networking. Typically on a Passage To Profit show, we'll have myself and my wife, Elizabeth, she's the co host. And she's actually much better and funnier than I am. So when they, when the producers go through and edit the show, my stuff gets taken out and hers stays in. But that's okay.
Yeah. You guys have a great dynamic. I love the way you guys banter back and forth. And again, we agree that it may be the pandemic,ais interestingly, challenging as it was, it opened up the door for the virtual ideas. I know we had an office and we were doing a live studio podcast at the time and we've migrated to this next level world of connection. So let's dive in Richard. I mean, give our audience a little bit about your backstory. I think
it's always interesting. 30 years in the the world of law and now also running a syndicated Radio Show, give us a bit of your backstory. How did we get here?
Well, 30 years is a long backstory. So I'll try to be as as succinct as possible. I went to college and graduated with a chemistry degree. And I worked in industry for about three years, and then decided that I wanted to go to law school. And I really wasn't that interested in law when I went to law school, I was interested in the training because I knew it was a rigorous program. And I really wanted to put myself through a very
challenging program. Once I got there, I did really begin to appreciate the law and began to understand it in ways I hadn't before. And when I graduated from law school, I was really ready to become a lawyer and working in the legal field. After I graduated from law school, I took a break for a couple of years, I completed a master's degree at the University of Geneva in Switzerland. And I also worked for an international law firm called John Stay, which is one of these big multinational law
firms. And, . . . . . . but I had a great experience studying
Okay. in the school, I met people from all over the world. And it's really interesting if you've ever had a chance to be overseas, how different people view the United States compared to how we view it here in the US. So that was a real eye opener and a real positive for me, plus, I again, I met some great people from Africa, Latin America, Europe, obviously, it was very formative. And it kind of gave me a taste for working internationally, which is what Gearheart Law does now. Wow.
After I completed that stint, I came back into the United States, I got interested in intellectual property law, I worked for big companies. The last one was Novartis, I headed up the intellectual property function for the United States, got tired of the corporate world and hung out my own shingle 16 years ago, and I've been in heaven. I really enjoy working in the entrepreneurial world and I think I've always just been entrepreneurial. I just didn't know it, right. Because when I . . .
Yeah!
. . . I was told that you needed to get a job in a big company, and keep a job and stay there for 30 years and claw your way to the top. And that was kind of the definition of success that I grew up with. And having, I guess, in some respect, achieved much of that, I realized I wasn't happy. And so, you know, I left and my wife said, why don't you start your own law practice, and I thought she was nuts. But it turned out to be a good decision for me. And I'm grateful that, you know, she was
so supportive. So that's kind of the backstory.
I love it. There's a lot of nuggets there that I know our audience listening, we got a lot of people here that are great at what they're doing in the corporate world, because I talk to them and coach them. A lot of people that are gonna want to hear some of the story that I want to back you up to maybe the 16 year mark, when you made the transition from corporate because there's a lot of people listening to this show that are in a job that want to start something else. They're doing
great. They've excelled at the corporate career, but something's unsettling. And I definitely want to pick your brain on a few ideas there. But before we do that, let's talk a little bit about, what was it about patent law, copyright, trademark, intellectual property that drew you to those disciplines?
That's a great question. And I would say, first of all, that I'm a very visual person. And so things like mechanical inventions or things like chemistry, that have a visual element to it, I'm very good at seeing those and understanding them, I was always very mechanically inclined. And so when I first started doing intellectual property law, I just found that I sort of had a knack for it, an aptitude, and
it came naturally. And I was so excited and passionate about it, I just couldn't get enough of it. Right? And I would . . .
Interesting.
. . .read all sorts of books when I was younger and, and study it. And the other thing was, is that I saw that there were so many avenues that I could take with intellectual property. There were policy issues, you know, should we have patents on drugs? Should we not have patents on drugs? You know, what are the ethics of patenting things that come from nature? There's business aspects. There's international aspects. You could work for a company or a law firm
or the government. And it just seemed like there were a lot of options. You know, you could do litigation, they're agreements. So there were a lot of facets to it, and I tend to get bored quickly. So I'm grateful that there's always a new shiny object out there. So, . . .
Yeah.
. . .the new shiny object when I left corporate was to start my own practice, right? Because I'd never done that before. And I've done a lot of other stuff in the field but now this was something new. And, you know, it was a challenge. And it's actually grown into something more than I had expected.
Wow, that's interesting. But can I ask for the audience listening, and even for some of my own inquiry, everyone, I think can probably get a patent. Patent is on an invention. Right?
Right.
But let's distinguish this idea between trademark and copyright. I struggle with both of those. And can you for our listening audience, and for myself as well, can you talk about the difference between those two? And maybe if we want to go even a little bit layer deeper, when should we be thinking about a trademark or a copyright on our work? Because you didn't get here 30 years, if this didn't matter. Somewhere, somewhere this matters, otherwise, you wouldn't have a career.
That's right. So no, that's a great question. So I would say, as you correctly pointed out, Patents protect technology and inventions. So if you have a new widget, if you have invented a new tire, or mousetrap or whatever, Patents protect those. And then trademarks, protect a brand. So trademarks identify the source of the goods. And what that means is if you buy a bottle of Coca Cola, because of the name and the logo, you know that that product originated from the Coca
Cola Bottling Company. And so that way, you know that it has certain amount of quality, you know, it's going to taste the same, no matter where you buy it. It's passed all the government inspections and everything, so you know what to expect when you buy it. And that's really what the trademark system is for, is to keep customers from getting confused over two different products or
two different sources. So if the trademarks are too close together, if you had Cocali or something like that, that might confuse customers, because they don't know is it Coke, or is it from the Cocali company? Right? And so that's what a trademark does is that it
Yeah, yeah. helps people know who they're buying from. And then copyrights, they protect original works of expression. So those are movies and music and books, and you know, statues and architecture, it can even protect plush toys, with copyrights. And so those are really for more artistic works. And in order to gain copyright protection there has to be a creative element, there has to be a minimum creative element, which is subjective, but that's almost like you know it when you
see it kind of thing. And so those are the differences. I hope I explained that clearly. Yeah, and it actually just brings up a couple other thoughts that just I want to think about. It's almost like trademarking the source so that there's no confusion as to the source of this product, this service. And you mentioned Coca Cola so I just think about it like Dr. Pepper. Is Dr. Pepper its own separate trademark, or is it known that the Coca Cola Bottling Company owns Dr.
Pepper? Can you distinguish that?
Sure. I guess I even forgot that Coca Cola owns Dr. Pepper. I haven't had a Dr Pepper in a . . .
I think they do.
Yeah I think, sounds, I think you're probably right, but I haven't had a Dr Pepper in a long time.
Okay. It's Friday. Dr. Pepper, you know, all of . . .
But no, that Dr. Pepper would have its own trademark.
So he would have its own? Okay.
Yeah. So I mean, the idea is that when you buy a Dr. Pepper, it tastes like a Dr. Pepper, right. And so you can have a housemark, what's called the housemark, which is the trademark that protects the name of the company.
Okay.
You can also have trademarks on product lines. So Coca Cola would have the Coca Cola Bottling Company would have its Coca Cola line, and it would also have its Dr. Pepper line. And I don't know if it owns like Sprite or whomever. But if they did, then they could have a Sprite and then each one of those product lines could get a separate trademark.
I think back to someone I was speaking to, and they're like Darrell, we need some help with marketing and stuff like that. And we already got the patent, the trademark, we already got the attorney working on all that stuff. And I'm thinking, in my opinion, my sort of naive was Why are you doing all that before you have a customer base? Like I wasn't sure but when is it the right time to think about a trademark and when is it just maybe just
not necessary? Is that a fair question or a way to think about it?
Oh, absolutely, I think there's a couple aspects to that question. And it's very fact dependent. So it's always good to consult with a professional. You should consult with a intellectual property professional while you're going through your branding. And when you start your branding, or at some point in the branding, where you've selected a name, right?
Got it.
And what you want to do is you want to make sure that that name isn't already taken by somebody else, that somebody else doesn't already have a trademark that covers that name. And sometimes that's harder than it seems. Because there's only a finite number of names available. You see a lot of companies now just making up fanciful names, names that don't mean anything. That's because there's only a certain number of words you can trademark. And so you should at
least do a search. Now you can do, you know, if you're on a budget, you can search the internet, you can even go to the trademark office database and do a search there. But you're taking a risk, there's always things because you're not familiar with trademark law, you're taking a risk that you might be getting yourself into trouble. And so what happens is that if you pick the wrong name, then somebody who owns the trademark will send you a cease
and desist letter. And you'll either have to change your name or spend a lot of money on litigation, which is, you know . . .
I saw that.
which is not great for an entrepreneur.
Yeah.
So again, it depends on how much risk you take, you can check the Trademark Office website, you can check the internet, but lots of times entrepreneurs start out and they're not very well known. And so somebody who has a trademark, say in California, suppose you live in New Jersey, you may not be on their radar yet, but then you put up a website. And you still might not be on their radar, but then somebody calls looking for them, and they call you instead. Or even worse, they call the other
company looking for you. And then somebody over there looks and they see that you have the same name for the same types of goods. And they say, Hey, wait a minute, you know, we've invested a lot of money in advertising on this. And these guys are using our name. So then they get the lawyers involved. And so getting it done early means that you can avoid that problem 90% of the time. So a trademark maybe cost $2500 bucks from start to finish, a search. $650 to $1000.
It's worth it to get that information, before it becomes a problem where you have to completely change your branding, or you know, change your packaging. And that happens a lot. I mean, I see that on a daily basis, I work with those issues. So it happens more often than you think.
You just struck a chord! Got talking to a friend of mine the other day, and he doesn't have a trademark on his company name. But another company has launched a company with one letter different in their name and borrowed the logo style, his same industry. And he actually asked me, What could he do? And I know this is not legal
advice. But since he didn't have a trademark, are they in the wrong at all, because they literally borrowed his likeness, his company name, his reputation, then the company is showing up in the marketplace, the confusion is starting to happen, and . . .
Well, it's not too late for him to file a federal trademark registration or even a state registration. So without getting too much into the weeds here, he has common law trademark rights if you used it first. And federal trademarks are based on the date they were first used. And so if he used his mark in interstate commerce before the other party did, he could file a trademark and then that would trump their rights and he should be able to do something about that.
I'll just pass that on to him. He just asked me the other day. And he was more worried about his online presence, which is what we do. But he was also very bothered by the fact that they were accessing customers and were causing confusion amongst their business market. But anyway, I know that that's more of a legal conversation. But it was just interesting. I want to ask about your journey. I'm gonna go back 16 years and jump back to this
entrepreneurial journey. And then let's move into this Passage To Profit show and your passion for entrepreneurship because you didn't start that way. And I want you to think back to the decision when Elizabeth was supporting your transition and you were frustrated. What was the biggest thing you were concerned with when you were making the decision to go from corporate to your own practice?
Well, the biggest thing I was concerned about clearly was could I attract clients? And so I had no idea. I mean, I had been in corporate where you never needed to have a client, right? The company was your client, right? So you didn't have to go out and find them. And I compensated for that by charging super low rates. And I had fortunately had a lot of good training. So I was always confident that I knew
what I was talking about. But I didn't know whether people would have enough confidence in me to work with me or not, you know, and . . .
Interesting.
. . . you know, I literally started in the attic of our house, and you know, with literally a single light bulb and one of these particleboard desks, and a phone
Sounds like an entrepreneurial story to me! and my . . .
Yeah, there wasn't even carpet on the floor, right? And I go up there, and . . .
I love it!
. . .I would get everything set up. And I had to have a lot of forms and create a lot of that. And then I went out and I networked like a crazy man.
Yeah.
And that was a big part of it. And then the other piece of it was, I put up a website. And back when I started, which was like 2006, I think, 2005, 2006, there were very few law firms that had websites. And there were a lot of people told me, you'll never get anything on the internet. It's all about relationships, buddy. And don't even go in that direction. And I had a great guy who helped me with a website, it was still kind of the early days, and we threw up a clunky
website. But within days of that I started getting two or three phone calls from prospective clients a day, and, you know . .
So good.
. . . and eventually I landed one. .
He said yes!
And you know, and then from there, it just kind of took off, you know, so. And to this day, our digital presence still accounts for a large portion of our new clients.
Yeah, I love it. What size firm do you have now? You know, just 16 years later, have you kept it boutique? Have you grown and expanded to a large team, what's been your strategy as an entrepreneur? Because there's a lot of journeys you can take as an entrepreneur.
So right now we're at about 20 contributors. And you know, we have eight lawyers. If anybody out there is an intellectual property lawyer, we're hiring. So we're trying to get a couple more. And so yeah, we have more work than we can handle and . . .
Good on you.
So the growth pattern is great. We were Inc 5000 Award winning recipients for two years in a row. It's been harder to grow at that pace, once we got past that milestone, but this year we'll probably grow by, oh, I don't know, 8 to 10% in terms of total revenue.
That's amazing.
And that's been pretty consistent since we started out.
What's one thing that you thought would be true as an entrepreneur that you know now is just not true? I know, you maybe come into it from a point of frustration, which a lot of people come to entrepreneurship, from a frustrated corporate role, are tired of it. Some people come to entrepreneurship because of the allure of owning their own
business. But what's one thing that you may have thought about entrepreneurship before you started that now later in, you're like, this is definitely not what I thought it was gonna be. Or, is there anything like that?
I think my biggest thing is, I thought it would be easy. You know, and a lot of entrepreneurs make that, Oh you know, all I do is hang out my shingle. And people come and I'll write the patents and then do the trademarks. And I'll send them a bill and they'll pay it. And that's all there is to it. And it's more complex than my role at Novartis.
That's right.
It's more challenging than a top corporate job because I have to manage, I have to do the leadership piece, I have to do the business development piece, to make sure the legal piece is running right, the IT piece, the financial piece, the HR piece. I have to wear a lot of hats, and it's taken me longer than I would have wished to acquire those, some of those skills, right? I thought, you know, managing people, piece of cake,
but it's not. Even as a top level manager in a corporation, managing people in an entrepreneurial environment is different. And it's another skill set, at least for me, it was.
I love this question. What's the part you love the most? And what's the part you dislike the most about entrepreneurship?
Well, the part I love the most is the challenge. I'm really a problem solver. And for me, growth is really only about playing the game better and more effectively. And so I really enjoy trying to solve those issues and then moving things up a notch. So that to me is very occupying when I hit those kinds of, if it turns out my intuition was right, which is is only about 50% of the time but those times when it is right, it's satisfying, you know, when the
plan comes together. You know, the thing that I like the least is probably feeling like I have to be on all the time. And I'm at the point now where I can take weekends off, although I never completely take them off. I don't do as much client work anymore. But I'm often strategizing or thinking about the business. Elizabeth and I help each other quite a bit. We brainstorm on things. But it's hard to turn off.
Yeah.
Even if I take a vacation. It's hard for me to really just relax and turn it off.
Yeah.
So that's the downside.
Yeah, it's hard to have one of those hats not have an issue that needs some attention, right? Because when you show up at corporate, you can go into your world, whatever that part of your world in corporate is. And you know there's people in other departments taking care of those other areas. But when you own the whole thing, they all belong to you. And in one way or another, right? And that is the challenge. And that's the piece that most people underestimate.
Most people don't care about it as much as you do.
No. No one will, and trying to get your employees to think like you as an owner is a failure attempt as well. And I did this for a long time. I used to try to get my team to take ownership. Well, they don't own the company. Why, why in the world would they want to do that? Like they don't want to own the company otherwise they'd have their own. They, they want a job. So anyway, let's talk
about Passage To Profit. You and I share a common belief in that entrepreneurship and small business, I call it the fabric of job growth in the United States, at least. I can't speak to all the economies of the world. But I'm very passionate about entrepreneurship, been around here for 30 years, you've been around it a long time. Talk about Passage To Profit and why you believe that entrepreneurship is one of the keys.
Well, I mean, first of all, I love the freedom that entrepreneurship gives you. It gives you financial freedom, it gives you the freedom, for the most part, to associate with people that you want to associate with, it gives you freedom of time, how much time you want to invest. In my case, it's like a lot of time, you know, at least mental energy. And it also gives you the freedom of purpose. So you can decide what things that you want to work on, and things that are
important to you. So having gone through the entrepreneurial experience myself, part of the Passage To Profit experience is what you're trying to do here, which is expose people to entrepreneurism, who are thinking about maybe taking the leap and giving them a sense, as best possible, of what it's like. And, you know, to show them that it is possible. I mean, we have a wide variety of guests on our show, which airs on the IHeart app, and is also
available on radio stations. It airs at 11 o'clock on Sunday evenings on WOR. And our sister stations, it airs on at 7pm. And then it's always available on the IHeart app, as well as on our podcast, which can be obtained anywhere you get your podcast.
Yeah.
So I just wanted to put that little plug in there. I hope your listeners will try us out.
We're gonna link it up. And here's the thing that I like to say about the show. First of all, it's a very thoughtful show. It's a very entrepreneurial driven show. I know you guys talk about patents, you talk about a little bit about your work. You guys have nice segments to the show. It's just well thought out. I enjoyed my time there. I shared the opportunity with two other very talented entrepreneurs.
Great.
And so I love the way you do the show. Talk about this idea of syndicating. What does that mean to the listening audience? I think it's a big deal. You got it syndicated recently, it sounds like a big deal.
In the radio world, the syndication IS a big deal. I'm grateful that more people will hear the show. But what it means is that the show is played on, right now, 30 different stations across the United States. So it's played on a radio stations in Portland, in Chicago. We're in the Cleveland market. We're in several markets in Texas, Arkansas. And so radio stations are essentially playing our pre recorded broadcasts to their listeners. And so it's expanded our listener base
significantly. So we're with OR. We were reaching about 20,000 people and now we're reaching about 100,000 people weekly, and I'm just grateful that we can spread the word about entrepreneurism. And as Darrell mentioned, my wife and I, we have a great marriage and we like to joke back and forth and tease each other. So I think that provides an element and the show is fast moving, and we have different segments. So that you really get to see entrepreneurism on any given show from three different
perspectives. And I think we're the only show that does that. And so what you learn is that everybody does it differently. There is no one right way, there are some basic principles that you can follow. But some people are successful by breaking the principles.
Yeah.
So I think it provides a rich education and it has some entertainment value, too. We usually try to pick out a humourous patent or trademark. So for, for example, today, when we taped the show, we talked about a GM patent where the car has sensors, and it can figure out how many layers of clothing you're wearing, and uses that to control the temperature of the car. And so the debate with the guests is does this make any sense, right? I mean, on the one hand, you can just reach down
and turn the knob. And a lot of cars have temperature controls for each passenger seat. But they've got a patent now where you can step in, and it'll detect your layers of clothing, which is a little creepy.
Auto cooling.
And what's even creepier is that it's supposed to work eventually with Alexa, and some of the home systems. So they're going to, I guess they're going to be detecting your layers of clothing in the garage or something, I don't know. But the you know, the question is, is well, is this really necessary, right? Is this really . . .
Yeah.
. . . an add on and one of our guests made the comment that if you look at your operating manual now for your car, it's about three inches thick. It's like you have to have a PhD in auto mechanics to operate it, right? They're putting in so many features, nobody can even keep track of them anymore.
Yeah, that's interesting. I was on the show, you definitely bring on intriguing topics, people that have invented things. Two people that were on the show when I was there, they had invented things, it was just intriguing to hear. I think you create a great platform for the diversity of entrepreneurship, as you were kind of alluding to, and it is very interesting, what inspires an entrepreneur to take the leap into their idea, their invention, their, their product or service. And I think that is
the most fascinating thing. I think, as I've lived just turned 52 a little while ago, it's just interesting how there's no shortage of good ideas. There's no shortage of good potential things. And again, this GM thing a little quirky, perhaps it seems, and of course, we thought the internet was quirky back when you launched a website. Yeah, we all thought this stuff was quirky. And yet I thought Alexa was the quirkiest thing ever. And I don't use it that
much but I do use it. And it's interesting that where things just end up in our lives as normal.
We brought up the example of heated seats. I mean, we never had heated seats. And now, I don't think, I'm living in New Jersey, I'd buy a car without them. So it's, it's funny the things that you don't think you need that you eventually end up needing.
Yeah, it's almost like things become like it's subpar.
If it doesn't happen.
Like today, it's like Amazon. If I go to an E commerce site, and it doesn't have two days shipping, I actually wonder if I really want to buy it or not. Like . . .
Isn't that the truth?
It's unbelievable.
Yeah. And I tell our team, you know, Amazon is the service level. People come to us and they want a patent or a trademark. And they don't want to wait six months to get this done. They're expecting to put in a credit card and get their intellectual property almost instantly, which is not really . . .
Tomorrow, yeah.
. . . realistic for what we do, but Amazon has set the bar, no doubt.
And they've set a bar in a really interesting way. Because we've been talking about Amazon in our agency for years. And that is, it has had an impact on consumer behavior and expectations in a way that can hurt some of us because there are just certain things. Like I work in the marketing and demand generation revenue growth space. And I sometimes have startups that come to me and they expect that in 30 days, they're going to have investors ready to buy and invest in their thing!
Right, yeah.
We're good but we're not that good. What do you think this is? I live in Las Vegas, even you know, I don't have magic tricks. There's a process. But Richard, man I've enjoyed this conversation, reconnected with you again. So just to be clear, you run a full service law firm, patents, trademarks, intellectual property, litigation, all of the things necessary for an entrepreneur to protect their work, their creative endeavors, their products that they're
creating. So let's make sure people know how to connect with you. Can you let people know where to connect with you for Gearhart Law?
Sure, absolutely. It's www.GearhartLaw.com. And that's spelled G E A R H A R T L A W.com. And we have a contact form or you can call. Our number is 908-273-0700. And we'll get on the phone. Our initial consultation is always complimentary. So if you ,you know, you want to call and you just have basic questions, we provide service based on flat fees. So you don't have to worry about getting hit with a surprise bill.
The hour on the train.
And . . . exactly. We really appreciate the entrepreneurs situation, the financial situation. And you know, we always treat it like it's our own money. So if we were trying to accomplish this, what would we do, and what is the most cost effective way to get the most protection you can based on your budget and what you're trying to achieve. So . .
Very good. We'll get that linked up. And then . tell everyone once again, how to find the Passage To Profit show and podcast.
So the podcasts come out the day after that the show is aired, and you just need to search Passage To Profit show. If you want to hear the broadcast live, you can hear it, if you're in New York on WOR 710. You can also listen to it on the IHeart app. So if you download the IHeart app and you search for Passage To Profit, you'll find it there, if you're outside the New York area. If you want to listen to it on the radio, you should go to our website PassageToProfitShow.com.
And you can see all the past shows. You can see our past guests. You can also see Darrell if you want to and hear a recording of his show. But you can also see our affiliate stations and see if there's one in your area. If there is please listen and then call them and tell them how much you like it. So that would be great.
Thank you, Richard, for spending some time with us today. I know you got a busy law firm. In fact, I know that you had a meeting that you kind of moved a little around for us to have this conversation. So I'm gonna let you get back to that. But before I let you run, if this happened to be your last day here on this planet we call earth and love so much, what would you want everyone to remember you for? What would you want to be known for?
Well, I'd want to be known as a good husband and a good father, which I've tried really hard to do despite everything, then that would be probably the most important thing to me. And then I'd like to be remembered as somebody who tried to help people start their own businesses. And you know, because I grew and I improved through the process of owning my own business. And I want that for as many people as I can. So that would be my fervent wish.
Richard, thank you so much for, first of all, our connection, for time on this show. And for being a positive light in the entrepreneurial ecosystem. It's people like you that I love to talk to and connect with. I've been a passionate entrepreneur for a long time, made plenty of my mistakes like you probably have as well. We can all grow through them. None of us have a blueprint for this thing. It's just about tenacity and seeking out the path to grow. So thank you so much for joining us.
Hopefully we'll stay connected. I know we will. And maybe we can have you back in the future.
Sounds great, Darrell, thanks so much.
Thank you.
Hey, my friend. Thanks again for listening to today's episode of The MindShift Podcast. Listen, let's not have the conversation in here. Connect with me on social @MrDarrellEvans on almost all the platforms. With the exception of Facebook. My Facebook fan page is @DarrellEvansFan. Until next week, remember you're just one shift away from the breakthrough you're looking for.