My guest today is Jeff Snip. This man inspired me to my core. His story is profound from and I quote, a starburst of awakening to doing the hard work of d constructing his identity. He was able to move away from his patterns and into his spirit. As a result, he has had a profound impact on the lives of youth, educators, and parents. And what I'm most struck by is that after doing the often process
Jeff left his corporate life. He built a team and developed an entire educational system that at its core, is teaching how to unlock and integrate the whole self. And you know what his motivation was the question, why don't we start teaching the concepts of the whole self? Like we do at the often process. Much, much earlier. His journey is amazing and where he landed is amazing. I hope you enjoy the epic episode.
Welcome to Loves everyday radius. A podcast brought to you by the Hoffman Institute. My name is Sharon Moore. And I'm 1 of your hosts. And on this podcast, we talked to hop graduates about how their courageous journey inward, impacted and their personal lives, but also how it impacted their community and the world at large. So tune in and listen in and hear how our graduates authentic selves, how their love, how their spirits are making a positive impact on our world today.
In other words, Get to know their loves everyday radius. Alright Jeff, welcome to the show. Hey, Sharon. Excited to be here. Thank you for having me. Of course. I'm very eager to chat with you about your journey and your story. You know, I've been reflecting on your path. And I think it would be interesting to start with the turning point that you experienced. It sounded like you are on track in your corporate career? And then something happened that
had you experience a turning point? So can you paint that picture for us for sure. Thank you. At the time, I'd say when all of this kinda confluence of, seeking started to emerge for me. I was Ceo of our corporate education company that I had started. And the job was successful, but it took me out on the road most of the time. We had hundreds of Fortune 500 clients. And I spent most of my time traveling. And I love the work. It was en.
We were helping design large scale enterprise leadership solutions for large corporations, or assessment and training, and coaching and development. And, you know, the core service that we were providing was to help unlock human potential at a very large scale. So how do you train thousands of people in and I'm unlocking leadership skills. And so while I was I was really energized by the type of work we were doing in the world, It also left me pretty 1 dimensional.
My wife and 3 kids were at home, and I wasn't... I was out in the world building and growing and doing. And, you know, the time it takes to really have a healthy relationship and to be a good father and to have friends and have health and balance in your life. I I put all that on the side for the first, you know, 10:15 years in my career, and I just went and put my head down and just went after it. So by my early forties, you know, all of that was kinda coming to an
intersection where it just wasn't working. I couldn't to the career at the sacrifice of everything else in my life that I wanted including, you know, just spiritual pursuit, you know, the time and space to go inside and to really reflect and ask bigger your questions in my life. So early forties, I started really going out looking for a different way of being in the world.
And the Hu process was absolutely seminal in that, you know, in that seeking process, a period of 2 or 3 years or I did almost every re retreat I could find the up process was, was transformational for me. And so I'd I'd say it really did represent a, the inflection point where I made a decision to change and go a different way. And how did you... When you were doing these retreats and starting to shift where your priorities were. Were you still working? How did you balance
that to that that transition? Were you juggling both worlds or did you put 1 on pause? How how did that happen? At the time, I was trying to juggle at all. I was running the business and trying to schedule retreats and trying to step back. I had been the Ceo since founded a company and 9 6, and we hired a a woman who who's gonna take on a president job. So we put her in charge of all operational responsibilities. And that gave me a little bit more
space. So about 2008 to 2010, I had 2 years where I created, like, a day a week where I would do nothing but the spiritual seeking the reading and a reflection and a journal length And then I'd take AA3 day weekend kinda once a month every 4 to 6 weeks to go and go to the mountains or go visit some lu, you know, teacher. So I really just kinda forced it into the system, and then, ultimately ended up selling the company and stepping into a board role a few after that, where the space really
opened up for me. So couple couple questions come to mind. 1 is, I do hear this you know, I can't say every time. But I do hear, hey, for the first 10:15 years of my life, I put everything on hold, and then I reached this point where I reassess and Rep if you were to to young people today who be successful, but also want to have this more inner world experience. What advice would you have for them?
Well, you know, I think the... So I have, you know, 3 kids almost all adults now and the oldest wander who's out of college and in the workplace. And in speaking with him and his friends, I think they already kinda have this message. I mean, this generation today, they have different work like balance. They they wanna have a difference style of living and, being in the world. So a lot of them already intuitively have changed their perspective on what they want their life to be like.
I think the hardest part is if you're if you're a man who identifies successes as your career, which I think is common when you're in your twenties and even thirties and forties. I would really challenge them to expand that definition of success and really think now. You don't you don't realize how 1 dimensional you are at the time. You think you're juggling at all. And it really isn't until you get to be your late forties or fifties that you realize
how focused you were. So I think just find older men that can be mentors if you're a young man or, you know, I think and just find older people in general that you trust and really ask them for be open to the guidance of the wisdom that people are gonna give you that have maybe already been done that path before? That us old people have yeah. Young people pay attention to us. That's what we're saying. It's interesting hearing that from seeing it from your kids and their cohort.
They they kinda did learn from us. They saw that we didn't balance it right, and we had to have this kind of turning point and they're kind of whether we said it or not, it seems that they've got the wisdom and they're starting their career with that that knowledge. I think that the awakening that's happened in the last 3 or 4 years in particular it's just this awareness of, you know,
unintended consequences and unaware of consequences. You know, the racial awakening and the gender gender identity awakening and the, you know, all the political polarization in the world today. A lot of it is you know, if you're just locked in your lane, and you see the world from 1 perspective, if you don't make space and time to have connections and to expand your thinking, you are gonna be very, you know, very narrow in your view of the world and I
think that's what's causing the problem. So I I do think the kids today are creating more openness some more space and seeing things from different perspectives and than we did. I think it's critical. But you you just... You didn't have the time to do that if you were working 60, 70, 80 hours a week. Right. And then, you know, you had this a devoted time in 2008 2010, and it was really kind of like you said, It was very find. I had a day in the week where I did this, I had a 3 day weekend.
You know, there were several years. Today, you're not in that what you call a confluence of seeking moment? You're kind of in the maintenance And so how does spirituality still live in your day to day life? I see spirituality was there in my childhood and in my use and it was a really important theme, and I was quite, you know, intros and thought and I had I grew up in a religious household. And so I think that the seeds were planted early.
And I'd say that, you know, you get busy as an adult and you kinda tuck that stuff away, and it's it's not gone. It's just maybe quiet. And then I had this, you know, the starburst of awakening in my early forties where I just couldn't get enough. And I became, you know, I was, like, binging on 1 book 1 retreat 1 podcast, 1 after the other. I couldn't get enough.
I couldn't get sat. And so I'd say that there was this incredible re waking and hunger and thirst for it that At this point, now, call it 12 years after that is really settled into a much, I'd say more integrated. Experience. Like, I think that, you know, after awakening, there's this this spiritual ego, where you trying in a lot of personas that you think are spiritual so I, you know, went vegetarian and I
I tried yoga for year. You know, I really committed to a deep meditation practice, you know, couple times a day, half an hour to an hour at a time. It became per, you know, a persona an identity that I was wearing. That I wanted to now just take all my achievement orientation and my accomplishment energy and just focus it on. You know, how spiritual can I be? And it wasn't so much so I became... You
know what I mean? It was like, the same driving mode innovation and instead of being successful business, I wanted to be successful being spiritual. And so it took a while, I think to kinda work through that and burned through that and integrated and kinda get to a place where it felt more settled and more quiet and more integrated and more about just being less seeking. So today, I'd say that I still and quite committed to, you know, each morning I I take walks in nature up in the words
with my dog. It's kind of my morning, you know, sanctuary. And I do still have a meditation crack this. And I do a lot of reading that I just read for pleasure, but it feels more to me, like, I'm watching it happen less than trying to achieve a goal of of breaking through. It's... It feels more like I'm really truly just enjoying the experience of whatever emerges and and not trying so hard for the outcome that I wanted.
Yeah. Makes a ton of self it and to put it in Hoffman terminology, it feels so much like how we talk about left road right road. You know, on the left road, it was the pattern, Let's call it the accomplishment pattern. That had you meditating for 2 hours, not 1 hour. And after 2 hours, 3 hours. And, you know, that kind of, like you said, spiritual persona spiritual ego, whereas on the right road, it was just
being. Sometimes you meditate, sometimes you walked. Sometimes you just looked in the eyes of your dog, Either way in all of those, you felt like you were being, your spirit was there. You were quiet, whatever it was. And so it's very left road right road. I I think this discernment you made of identifying that and taking the time and space that is necessary to kinda break that down. It it takes time and space, and then you land in this place that feels to use your word very integrated.
No. I think that's right. I think my mind was so hungry for all these spiritual concepts, and the more and more I read the more spiritual concepts I had. You know, I had identity that was really well constructed around, you know, my sense of separate self for false self or, you know, who am I in the world, and it it had a lot of beliefs that were really woven in there pretty tightly. You know? You have to find a way to grab 1 of those threads and just gently pull until the knot comes undone.
And even, you know, this this core belief of while the way things happen is you have a goal. And even if your goal is to be awake or to be enlightened or to be spiritually present, the goal that self becomes something that your belief system then wants to figure out how to achieve and really understanding that, well, that belief from the only way you get there is by having a goal.
I, know, I kinda had to d that core belief, which is you can't even have that goal because that kept me attached to the achievement addiction, you know? And so, that's an example for me of either to really d the identity and let go and try and be present, you have to be willing to kill some sacred cows and let go of beliefs that that made you what you thought who you were. Were there any that surprised you and how relentless some of
these sacred cows were? Like, you've tried and tried and tried, but it was really 1 of the more difficult ones to d? You know, I think that, 1 of my root beliefs has always been about persistence and that, ultimately my strength was in persistence. And that translates into what you just... You don't quit trying. You know, you just keep working. And that's a pretty tough 1 to let go of if that's
what I've always relied on. And to realize that the persistence itself you know, required an effort with an intention that was in the way of letting go and running whatever was, you know, allowing what was already there just to be there. And so I think even just the simplicity of persistence ultimately is in a way of just just being. That for me was a tough 1. Well, it again brings me back to the left road right road because, you know, you said it's expressed and we keep trying. We don't quit.
And there's a way on the left road if the pattern is persistence. We're not gonna pay attention to the health of our body, we're not gonna pay attention to what our family members need, we're not gonna pay attention to all kinds of things that are important for us to pay attention because the pattern of assistance has us continuing to try. Whereas on the right road, you could still maybe not quit certain things, but you're going to be, like you said, more
hole more integrated. So if the health of your body is coming up, you may allow yourself to she pause or quit or postpone or redirect because that's your way of being in that moment. Right road. Yeah. I think it's having an awareness of well, who who is it that's trying to be persistent? I use that question a lot whenever I notice a belief you say, well, that's my ego wanting to
be persistent. You know, that's persistent around the self image or persistent around the way I want my life to look like or the way I want... You know, the way I wish something was. And the more I can just let go and let trust that something else is holding it and it's gonna unfold through me as opposed to me being the 1 who needs to be persistent. That's a release, and you just trust it spirit will emerge the way it wants to and you can just enjoy it. If that's a heart... That was a hard 1
to let go of. I'm also struck by just imagining this life that you had this this company that you built, your travel and your busy ness going from this busy, which may have equaled... You know, I am valuable or I'm important to this life of slow pace of space of expansion. How was that transformation for you? You know, it's interesting to reflect on it that way. I'd say that at first there's enormous fear you know, that if I'm not busy, I'm not relevant. You know, in
the world, the world is fast moving. If you don't keep up with the news and the trends companies and lingo and the technology and the tools. You know, it doesn't take very long that you're out of the system, and it's, you know, your network goes stale and to people that used to call you don't. And so I'd say the the first phases there's just a lot of fear.
Because if you're not really busy and active and in the game, it there's a real that you're just gonna become relevant and not be capable and not know, you know, how to get things done. And today with technology, it's fast, you know, using different tools and systems and processes. And then I'd say there's a second phase after that, which is if you can like, oh of that fear.
For me, there's a bit of a paradox between the natural energy that emerges when you're inflow and alive with something and excited about something. If your mission or your purpose is joy based or, you know, in pursuit of purpose or spirit based? I still have a lot of things I do, but I do it with the right I'm not attached to to it in nearly the same way. So I think there's once you let go of this fear, there's still plenty to be done, and then it's a day by day you know, just feeling
into it. Does this feel true to me in this moment that this is what I wanna do or I feel like... But I don't have the same stress or you know, sense of attachment to the outcome of what I'm doing. There's a lightness to it. So I'm curious what what what was birthed from that moment where you were in flow or you are coming from this place of joy and spirit. Once you moved away from the busy,
what emerged for you? Well, I tell you, Hoffman was a spectacular catalyst for me, and the the really deep experiences that you have in that week. No, I I get the concept of the quad and I can you can read the book, but it's so different when you have the deep experiences and you really hold on through the resistance and the discomfort and go into the real deep work that that they do. You just get the so
many different levels. It's like, holding a yoga was, you know, way longer than you ever thought you could, and it just keeps opening and opening and opening and opening. And so for me, I I was able to, ultimately sell my business in 20 12, and I took some time off, and I went, you know, on my ice I used to like, going up to the mountains and backpack and sol suit for a week and asking these sorts of questions. What I came away really inspired of was we'll, all the stuff that
we're in a hoffman. Why isn't that taught anywhere? This way of being in the world, but you're filled with love and self awareness and sense of purpose, you know, why isn't that what we're teaching because I had a background in leadership in education. I started working in schools and going around and meeting with educators and asking this question.
I'm looking at the curriculum of what was established and it looks like this was mainly designed in the late 18 nineties, you know, around why we why we study what we do today. And I couldn't really find a whole self curriculum that was really authentically, you know, quad based education. And so I really, you know, got excited about this idea of creating an educational program around to. You know? And so I launched
a a nonprofit called millennium dot org. This is about 2 or 3 years after selling the company where I had some time to really reflect and do some research and think about it. And I found a great partner and together, he and I started a school in San Francisco called the millennium school. And it's a middle school, a hundred and 8 students a year, and it's a basically a laboratory school we call it an innovation lab and we've designed from scratch kind of a quad based educational program.
The curriculum, the com dependencies, the courses, the experience, everything is designed around a wholesale framework. A few years after that, we were invited to go and share our mess it's with other schools and other teachers and so we launched to sister program where we now have several hundred educators that we train and how to teach using, a whole self method and how to be in a community of practice with each other in a sustained circle design where you practice
these whole practice. So you know, Hoffman wasn't just transformative to me personally. It planted a seed that evolved into an idea or concept for education for young students and lessons which turned into a teacher training program, which, you know, continues to emerge and each year, new
ideas come out of it. So I'm still very alive and very active in the world, but it's it's with a a purpose of how do you teach wholeness and how do you create a framework for a spiritual development as a central part of the educational program? Wow. No. Seriously. I'm I'm somewhat speechless at just knowing the impact. I mean, Bob Hoffman is not with us, but, I think this got to him in his grave because to think that you had a powerful experience. And like you said, it planted the seeds.
And next thing you know it is wait a minute. Why aren't we teaching this earlier. Why do we have to wait till our? I mean, I'm a hoffman of teacher. Sometimes we get... I shouldn't say kids. Young adults in their twenties? And I'm always thinking are they ready for this? You know? And yet, the immediate reverse thought is, wow. I wish I did this in my twenties. But why even wait till the twenties? Let's just have a foundation of this, so we don't have to un learn as much. So
you did this process. You were deeply impacted. You now started working with young people, created a school brought on teachers, who now teachers are embody this whole person. Right? This this foundation of spirituality as they teach and impact their kids, talk about a ripple into our future and into our world. Yeah. I mean, I have to say I I get goosebumps, and I I got goosebumps.
And the idea that well, what if we could invent a educational about that grounded and teaching this, and it's the center of the educational focus. You know, so we have 20 educators on staff or at the school. All of them are invited to go into health and. I think the vast majority of them have now spent a week doing the process and they come back completely transformed. We pay for professional development, all of our educators practice, some conte practice, you know, a
daily mindfulness practice. They go on retreats. They've been, you know, down Costa Rica in places where they do 1 week journeys and experiment. And, you know, all of it is in the spirit of if you can access your whole self as an adult, and you can be the catalyst for the students. It's like inviting parents to reflect on how they now are parenting in
a different way. The formal programming, I can talk about formal programming of, you know, the activities and courses creek all of that, But our theory of change is that the educator themselves is the catalyst, The same way that parents are the catalyst for the children. You create a certain environment, you know, where the kids swim and certain ways of being and values and and questions. So you have to do a lot of
translating. You know, we we don't just... You can't just pop kids into the direct techniques of the adult hoffman method, but you can't translate the building blocks and the questions and the curiosity and the exploration into an age appropriate way. For students and man I gotta tell you they get it. They they totally get it. I really believe that it's the natural state for most people in a healthy safe environment.
That it's the way they want to be and that they actually have to con themselves to conform to a traditional institutional model of education that is the exact opposite of this natural way Being. I it's harder for them to institutional themselves into sitting in rows and memorizing facts that they really don't care about. That's just not their natural curiosity or
motivation? And we simply just kept asking, well what is a natural state and how do we create an environment where the kids just come alive with their own curiosity. And then they pretty much led the way for us. I have so many thoughts when in my head, but the other thing that I'm I'm realizing that's an impact here is is keeping educators in education. Because we know that it is really difficult to keep good people who are genuinely drawn
to this industry of impacting youth. They go into the traditional place and they're usually burned out pretty quickly. And this feels like this must really address that with your team of educators. Yeah. I mean, we're incredibly privileged and fortunate in our particular design. It's not something that's easily transferable. We haven't yet figured out how to make it accessible to everyone, but it's... It is
very hard to watch. I mean, I think most of the educators we worked with, as I mentioned, you know, educators from public schools, private schools, charter schools all interested in these techniques. Most of them enter education because they're inspired to work with children and help children thrive.
And unfortunately, our current system, just doesn't allow that, the the lack of training and support in a number of kids and classrooms in the amount of time they have to spend on so many things that aren't relevant to instruction. It's it's just awful and the, you know, pandemic just turn the heat up, the the burnout out the stress, the behavioral issues, I have enormous empathy, and I'm such a fan of these educators that find a way to stay in the saddle and committed.
Against all odds. It's disheartening. And so, your theory of changes at the educator is the catalyst. And so if I think about a kid's you know, who are the most influential players and in the development of a child. For sure it's the teachers and educators. It's also the parents, Does your curriculum expand into parenting? It does. So the the signature program that... We use as kind of a centerpiece of the design this school is a small cohort method. We call it forum, F0RUM.
And it's... It was inspired. I'm in... Called Y p, and that's why I first learn form, but lots of organizations use circle methods. And so it's a peer to peer coaching circle, with about 10 people on it. And the students, all of our students are placed into a forum when they join in sixth grade. And they stay in that forum for 3 years. So these are mixed gender, but same grade for 3 years, and that form meets daily. On advisory topics. And then on Wednesdays, they
spend 2 hours together. They go super deep. And that's where we introduce all of the often like practices, the visualization techniques and the, you know, the mind, body, heart and spirit protocols and how to really explore what's going on in different parts of themselves and how to bring it into the circle and share with each other. So that technique is the technique that we've now taken out the educators And in the last year, getting back to your question, we
started doing that with parents. And so all of our parents then are encouraged to join a forum practice. And so they then spend 3 years with other parents in a circle where we introduce all of the Hoffman self. Techniques and methods every month we introduced a new technique and then they practice for a couple of hours with each other. We're hopeful. Last year, we highlighted it went really well. We're hopeful that what it does. It
creates a consistent environment. We're not only at the kids getting the language and the tools and their methods at school, but they're getting them at home, and the parents are benefiting because they're well being is increasing, has their consciousness is increasing and... So so far we're seeing a ripple effect as you just said? Yeah. No. I I think this is 1 of the biggest challenges we face. And education is a, how do we get our teachers to
embody this, and you've addressed that? And then be how to we how do we ensure that the influential players in these kids lives are all embody and all on the same page all consistent. And it feels like this forum practice for the parents is exactly how to do that. So this this these kids are getting this reinforced by all their key influencers, all their all their key people,
all the grown ups. Yeah. I think that, you know, so systematically, I think that's where you have to be willing to redesign the system. You know, take out a blank piece of paper and ask, you know, with your mission aligned teammates, ask yourself, what are we gonna put in the center? What's at the middle of this? And then let's design a system around our our mission? So for example in a traditional school system. They have a a very rigid system around academics and 35 kids in a
class, 50 minute periods. Everybody learns same subjects. We all move from 1 cost to the next. And so that's such a rigid system. You you really... Is... It's hard to create the environment and experiences we wanna create with that system in contrast. Take out a blank piece of paper in the middle of it, draw this whole self. And the spirit of mind the heart and the body is the whole self. And so the mission of the school is to unlock and integrate the whole self.
Well, okay. Well, what expands from Utah stone into that pool and watch the ripple spread out from there. What... Other competencies. And, well, they're are spiritual competencies. Their heart competencies are on compassion and understanding emotional intelligence. Or are mental capacities around curiosity and seeing from multiple perspectives and and there are, you know, physical capacities are out translating alignment with intentions and integrity and and greater service in the world.
And so your competency set of what you're trying to teach then expands from there. Your schedules of your week of when you want kids spending time in expands from there. You, you know, the role of the educator is now, you know, that 1 educator has those kids for 3 years. And their role is less about delivering content and it's much more about being a coach or a mentor to those kids. So they meet with them every day,
the kids create their own goals. They write their own evaluations, and the evaluations and goals around wholesale self development. You know? And so you have to be willing to change the entire system around a a new paradigm know, we had to let go of the flip phone to create a new paradigm for the iphone. And then the iphone had to have everything had to work. The app... You change and the, you know, everything had to
work together. And so this is a paradigm shift to a whole different approach to education. So let me ask you, hearing you talk about this. I'm hearing the skill of, I can't quite name it, but clearly building curriculum, taking complex issues and building and and kind of breaking them down into step by step by step, kind of bricks as you're laying down the foundation. Is this from what you did beforehand in your corporate world
Yeah. Yes. For sure. So the gift of my corporate career was 20 years designing leadership development systems. For Fortune 500 organizations. And if you think about leadership as a system, you know, it's... For example, you know, the talent that comes into the organization, how do you train and develop and promote the talent, how do you reward it, what are the competencies involved? What are the, you know, the leadership, role of role modeling, you look at a sec months you look
at training, you look at feedback. All of these are aspects of, a talent development system. You can't just drop in, for example, a course on you know, how to think strategically or how to be innovative and expect the system to change because it's not enough by itself. So we were very good at large scale enterprise wide system. Developing leadership programs for them that really moved culture and really move behavior. The scary part of that was that we got very, very good at it. And so
whatever behavior the leadership wanted to produce. So for example, if it was just scale at any cost or growth at any cost or globalization at any cost we could create an entire culture that was kind of like, aligned with that intention. What I took from it, a real deep awareness of, you know, if you know what the levers are and you know how to design an interval system, you can shape culture.
You can shape beliefs. Was you know? And so we hope that we're doing what we're doing from a as a conscious and authentic perspective as possible around seeking the greater or good. But we are very intentionally creating a system that is designed. You know, we think of it as... There's 4 parts to our school model. There's the the what, which is the competencies and the, you, the curriculum that we're teaching, the how, which are all these different experiences.
So everything's project base for the kids take on a 6 week social impact project out in the world, and they work in a team with 3 students and they spent 6 weeks working on this whether it's an environmental project or a homeless project or, you know, whatever their their topic is. And at the end of 6 weeks, they present this project. So it's experiential and the kids are innovating and designing.
And then 1 day a week on Wednesdays, the kids doing a print apprenticeship they're out in the world working and then they have to come back and talk about what they learned and how does it align with our values and what leadership skills did they notice and, you know, we do a lot of camping and nature based programs. So the experiences is number 2, which is well, how are
you learning these? Because you're not gonna learn them memorizing them in a in your head that has to be in a a full body experience. The third is the who, Thanks and that's
the role with the educator. So the educator needs to have had a often experience and a conte practice, you know, show up in a way where they're put in a coaching environment with kids and they're meeting with their 10 kids every day, and they're doing 1 on 1, you know, mentoring and how are things going at home and how are things going with your friends and So the role of the educator is completely different. So there's the what, the how the who, and then the fourth thing is the culture of the
overall community. So that's the parents. How does the whole community hold the same values around what's important. So their grades and their assessment and everything is tied to this whole. So parents have to be on board, they're expecting a traditional, you know, achievement oriented education model. They're they're not gonna be happy. So that system, I think is what allows they're us to create the experience that we were going for?
You know what I'm really moved by is seeing that you you had this awareness, oh, wow. I can identify the levers, I can then design a system, which means I can shape culture. I can literally shape culture and beliefs. Oh wow. Let me pause. That is huge. Now some people reach that realization or awakening and leave because it's quite overwhelming or leave because they're not in agreement with where it's headed.
But you you use these skills to really create culture that is going to have quite the impact on our world. I'm really moved by by what you've done with your... The 20 years or 15 years However many years, you you did that. You really just took it and are going to have a huge impact on our world as a result. Very big deal. Or we'll see. We'll see. I appreciate the kind words. I will say right now it's in reality. It's messy. You know, it's a small school, and it's a
limited number of kids and families. I hope that we're impacting them in the way that I'm describing. I'm sure that you could have plenty of people talk about the things that, you know, that aren't working and that we're still working on. So maybe 1 day, it becomes something that really makes a difference in
some significant number right now. It's, you know, the parable of the child walking along the beach and the beach is covered with Star and the child picking them up and throwing them back into the ocean so they can live and survive and the friends says, you know, what are you doing? You'll never make a big enough difference to all of these star fish and the child pauses and says, well, I I
made a difference for that 1. And so we live very much in the moment at the school Of just, you know, 1 student at the time when interactions at the time. There's a part of me that has a hope that maybe this this... You know, we attract the right people to come help us and that we invite others to come By the way, I have to acknowledge a huge movement of other people in the space
pursuing similar aims. I'm going to Columbia University to speak in a couple weeks and it's the collaborative for spirituality and education, and it's run out of Columbia University. I mean, so, you know, that's hundreds of schools all coming together to ask these questions about how do we get spirituality back into education. There's a group called the learning for Well being Foundation.
I've been a part of out of Amsterdam that's running a global initiative to try and promote this exact same paradigm for Quadrant whole well being inserted back into the of education. So there are some amazing organizations doing this work. We've been sponsored by the Fe Institute is funded our our launch, and we couldn't have done this without them, and they're very dedicated to how do we get spirituality back into education.
So I'd say we're a small wave of of a movement of aligned people with are mission oriented that really think that the time has come for us to take a step back and reimagine what the purpose of education should be, And well, how do we really wanna be developing the next generation of students and the path we're on is, you know, It's not a good path, and we need to we need to reimagine a different way. We sure do.
A, amen. And your timing is I know I don't... I think it'll be more than 1 star fish to use your metaphor, but also your timing. This is it's it's right now. This is when we need this. So I I'm noticing the time, and I... So I wanna bring this to AAA close with 1 last question, but First of all, thank you for sharing, and I'm really like I said, just inspired by the realization you had of wow. This is quite powerful what I am doing, how do I use this skill for good?
That's that's really staying with me. But I wanna just close with with 1 last question. So the Hoffman process, as you mentioned was it seems that it was quite pivotal. And I'm curious if you remember, was there actually a moment or a memory that was that pivotal moment or the magical moment for you during the process. You know, there there are so many to...
So many to choose from I will tell you that 1 that has really stuck with me for a long time and it's been, you know, a 12:13 years now since I did the process. There's an opportunity in the process where we invited to go out in nature and to just go out and walk. And just be in nature and notice
whatever, you noticed. And some exercise leading up to that was quite intense, and we've been doing so much work throughout the week, but I remember going through a walk in nature and having this overwhelming awareness that my mind was free of story and drama and voices. Maybe for the first time in my life, it was just so quiet. Then I was so present. And I was just overwhelmed with the all of nature It was like, I was seeing it for the first time. You
know? It was like, I could see the trees and the leaves in the bark and the the beatles and the grass and the sun coming through the leaves and the just a sense of how perfect it was and how intelligent it was and how it was always here all the time working in this intelligent cosmic harmony I just felt an overwhelming sense of love for that moment, and it was it was transcend for me to really realize if we just stop the thinking and stop the the internal conflict and just be in
that moment. It's just I mean, it brought tears to my eyes. I was just overwhelmed with the beauty of this adventure in the journey and committed that I wanna stay like this. This is the way I wanna be. That was when I really made a commitment to myself. So whatever it took, I'm gonna find a way that I can sustain this way of being because this is this is the way I wanna live. And look at all that's happened in the last 13 years, quite something. Yeah. No. And and it wasn't planned. I
could've have net... That you could've have never in a million years and this was something I had on my on my agenda ever in my life. It was not a plan. It was just watching, surrendering and watching what comes up and just say yes. Yeah. You you hit this point earlier where it wasn't a goal It wasn't from the pattern of accomplishment or persistence. It was just from paying attention and saying yes. What a beautiful way to leave us and what an inspirational story.
Thank you, Jeff. What a lovely story. Thank you for sharing with us. Well, you're most welcome. I... I'm grateful for the invitation. It's just never know what words are gonna come out of your own mouth sometimes. So it's just hearing the having the questions in the space to kind of reflect and be here with you and think about it all. It's It's a gift to me. So I I really appreciate it. Thank you very much. I'm sure on behalf of myself and all the listeners, we thank you for your truth.
And for the work you're doing in the world, and, I hope to see you in the community. Wonderful. Well, I hope to to you as well. Thank you again. Stripping. Thank you for listening to our podcast. My name is Liza and Grass. I'm the Ceo and President of Institute Foundation. And I'm Ras Rossi, Hoffman teacher and founder of the Hop Institute Foundation. Our mission is to provide people greater access to the wisdom and power of love. In themselves in each other and in the world.
To find out more, please go to hop institute dot org.