Draymond Green Show - Jamal Crawford Returns

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What's up, everybody? Welcome back to the Draymond Green Show. I am honored to host this next guest, which has already been on The Draymond Green Show six Man of the Year three times. Made that whole thing about a six man have any relevance, So we're going to get into that. First off, we're live, well live to you, not necessarily live right now, but we're at Hinkle Fild House in Indianapolis, Indiana All Star Game, but this legendary place.

Honored.

Thank you to Butler University for having us in this gym. Now, I see this banner up here, Final four twenty ten banner, and I'm not happy about it because Gordon Hayward filed me to get that batter.

It's insane.

On the front of the newspaper, his hand is like this, We're down one to go to the national Championship. And so yes, they would have had the banner, but it says national finalists and that should have been me, and I think that we would have won the championship. Nonetheless, I'm thankful to be here, Maul. Welcome to the show, Welcome back to absolutely Yes, sir man, I got a lot of topics to get into it with you. One

Is right now? That's a great question.

And I wasn't really a part of AU coached before him, To be honest with you, like how many years you play?

Are you coming up?

I played AA you from sixth grade to twelfth grade.

I played AAU two years period, so I played in fifth grade, left when worked on my game, and came back and played my last year. So I wasn't really hip to how AAU works, to be honest with you. Then I got back in through him just being a parent. I was a parent before I start coaching him. That kept score. I was just keeping score.

You know. I didn't mess with the coaches. I was just right there, just keeping scored. And that was that.

It gave me a way to kind of watch him in peace a little bit, you know what I'm saying. So I just kept score. And then as fate would have it, I started being an assistant coach. The coach asked me, Daryl Henny shouts and he runs the whole program. It's his program. And then I got to become the coach. And when I seen is it's kind of nasty in some ways. In some ways, it's kind of be honest with you, is kind of nasty from the standpoint some of these coaches.

They want the top kid. They want to fly kids around.

And I'm not falling the kid at all, because if you coming from where we come from, and somebody's like, I'm gonna get you some shoes, flights to see the rest of the country.

Parents and they trust the coaches. All good with them.

Coaches many they're playing through kids in some regards, they're.

Not really helping them.

They'll have you know, just older kids or whatever it is to try to say look at me, look what my team is doing.

You're god trapped, does it right? One of the few to do it right.

I mean, like we've talked where it's like he's really pouring into the kids. He's not for the wins and losses now, he's trying to help them later. And that's what we're trying to do. Myself. We're one of the only staff to have all three coaches they play D one Wow, myself, Keith Smith to play the Oregon and Pepperdine and Real Hennings that played at UC Davis. And so what we're doing is with our team, we're trying to We're watching film, we're packing three times a week.

A lot of young NBA, well, a lot of NBA players now have sons.

That's coming up.

You got JJ, Trevor, Reza, TODJ, Gilbert, Elijah, and there's been a lot of talk about Gilbert and his approach with his son, and everybody is also approaching I think, you know, Gilbert has been very public about it. It's saying, you know, he wanted his son to learn how to carry, and so he kind of sends him to a school that's not great basketball. I think it's Chatsworth of something, not great basketball team, but he's the man and he

I know you went to rain There.

I don't know if you were sending JJ there or not, But what's your take on kind of the approach of sending your kid to a team that's essentially trash and he get to do what he wants but may not necessarily be learning how to play the game the right way, or going to a powerhouse like rain There where there's a pedigree, you're gonna play it right way. Coach probably been there for a while, or there's some type of history or that you follow.

What's your take on those two philosophies. That's a great question.

So for us, let's just say Rory right now, I feel like we got nine players. I feel like basically all nine would be the best they can ego to any other team and be the best player. But I have all them plan as a team, and for me, that's needed because I want them to go for good the great. Yeah, you have to be a dog and a killer, but for me setting the foundation for them, I want them to know how to play the right way.

So I'm teaching him to function playing with other good players. Yes.

Now for JJ especially, he's playing up right, so they're eighth grader, he's in seven, so he knows he's that he's benefits a lot of it off because the ball movement. But next year he's not to play if grade and he's gonna have to carry a load. But he's ready for that too. So what I did to supplement that is I had him play for a school team. I had him play feeder, and he does that there, so

Smaller the box gets of greatness for everybody.

But it's also like this is the top of the top, So you can't just go in there being a one man band. You can't just go in there being a man show. You have to learn. The better you get and the higher levels you go, you have to learn to play with good players. Absolutely, so either way, it's gonna be an adjustment. But I think you still get

Yes, I think I think that's a very important thing. And not losing yourself because you you Sometimes you get

He got all the stuff, but yeah, he know how to play the game.

And with JJ right, and let's say he plays his grade and he's like that I can get forty. I'm like, yeah, forty is cool. I would rather have you get twenty eight and twelve assists. Yes, that's more than forty. And I told him, I said, Luca, how much do you have? Said he had seventy three, I say, everybody at thirteen assists too. The trick is this all great scores. The more you pass, the easier it is a score, right,

That's incredible, and switching gears.

You just you just spoke about having You just spoke about having fifty one points, and I mean, you've done that. But I want to talk about something with the NBA and with veterans and how it kind of happens for gods towards the end of the career. And it's becoming more and more prevalent now, especially with the new CBAS. Right, you got veteran minimums where a veteran will be making three million.

Dollars, the young Casey for one point one million dollars.

In a situation like to go to State Warriors, that three million dollars is actually fifteen million dollars.

It's fifteen through the tax and everything on.

The tax, and so I know it's a host and because we're in a repeater tax. Yes, and now you got that first April, second April, I'm not mistaken.

I think we're already at the second April.

And so the penalties are crazy, but it's putting guys in a tough situation as well. Here you are, you scored fifty one points, and then the next year you're not on an NBA roster.

How is that possible?

You know? So just where the league has kind of gone in a sense of veterans and the effect that it's happening on these young guys.

What's your take on that it's awful? Jake and this and this is the thing for me. And I've heard you speak about it before when you had the David West's, Jermaine O'Neills, right, like all those vets to really kind of set the tone for your career. I had Oak, I had Rick Brunson, I had Kendall Gill. I didn't know what I didn't know until I saw them guys. Oh, no, being on time is being an hour and a half early if you're a young fella, right saying after you

And y'all were getting mocked at you remember, right, absolutely, and so win and half the games was something to me.

I averaged thirty one six assists in the last game, I get fifty one and five off the bench. I just won teammate a year. I'm like, oh, I know, I'm I know I'm gonnaet a deal. I'm not saying I'm gonna get anything above minimum, but i know I'm gonna get a contract. Yes, I get nothing. And so I went through Mamas to depressing, like dam, I couldn't even watch basketball, bro, I couldn't even watch as much as I love basketball, and I couldn't even watch basketball.

And I've never said this.

I would go to rooms to kind of disappear, then come back with the family, just like cause I couldn't understand why I was not getting a call. I didn't understand it in all these same teams. Once you come be a coach, ony, don't you come run the front office. I'm like, oh, so you respect my mind, respect that, but you just don't want me on the court. Yes, And that part messed me up and it took me a while to get there, and then I had to

And I think what it is is, I.

Think when you've had a following for a long time and you go to a team that fan base is going to see you, and that could be kind of a distraction for a team that's trying to grow young people.

And it took me a while to get to that point, right.

Interesting, So my name was Jamal Johnson and I was, you know, just the same vet. Maybe I get signed with the same credentials, maybe I get signed. But if I'm me and I have some type of following and people want to know put him in the game, it could be a distraction. But well, I will say to answer your question, sorry that was so long.

Window. That's great.

I there should be a rule that on every team you need three guys that have ten years in more experience because you can help like slow some of the things that are happening down with the younger generation on especially off the court, because you know, we see it like no, no, no slow down, Like you got to move like this, and if they just have one and there's still a bunch of young guys, that's not fixed thing,

I agree one hundred percent.

I always talk about my vest that I had and how important they were to my career, Like like youre just talking Jermaine O'Neil, Jared Jack, David west, Za, Patulia, David Lee, like the list goes on and on, Andrew Bogan, like Andre Goudala, you know, and like seven right there. I played with all those guys, all those guys I just name with between years one and five. I play

Second round.

I need this, And he like, but you have to look at it as an investment in yourself.

That's real.

It's like you just have to be okay with that because who you need to be for this team.

You gotta be okay with getting some of that.

Speaking to you when you just said it just hit me when you said, when you start playing in David Lee. A lot of people don't know David Lee was an All Star. I'll tell you a conversation I've never never said before. I remember vividly, you could ask stuff.

At the time. I had some buzz to make the All Star.

So to step yep and I remember the game before, maybe a week before they pick. I'm like, Steph, you think, He's like, I think it's gonna be me or you, one of us gonna make it.

Made made it.

I remember that David Lee makes the All Star. Fast forward a little bit. You basically replace and and kind.

Of take over that position.

We played you in the playoffs, and we're on the side like, oh shit, like we knew what was coming.

Not the run you guys are.

I'm not saying that, but you personally were like, he's a dog, he's a dog, and he's he can do it all. And that gave you guys a whole different versatility, absolutely, and that made us like, it gave us pause, like oh man, like because you can you can do so many things that can't be accounted for and can't be duplicated, especially with your group. Right, so we're like, damn, we knew you guys were coming. We just didn't know like how where we would go, but we knew you were gonna be at the center.

And it was very interesting how it happened too, because you.

Know, as you know, during that time, you got Blake dj Yes, you got Zach and Marc Gasol, you got Roy Hibbert and David West, you got like, uh, you still had Timmy and Tiago Splitter, Timmy and Boris Dia more al of the story. You still had like two bigs, like traditional biggs at the time, the Marcus Audiers at the form Portland, Like you got real bigs and It was interesting how it worked out because that wasn't me,

Do you give Mark Jackson credit for that? Like?

What you know what I give Mark Jackson credit for because here's what I will. I can't give Mark Jackson all the credit for that style. And by the way, Coach Jackson and to me is like that's like it still baffles me that he's never gotten an nbah.

I can't believe it. It's insane all the time. It's crazy, it's insane.

I can't give him credit for that, per se because the switch for me starting like permanently actually came under Steve.

Okay, I don't personally think.

Mark had the blessing or okay to even be able to do that because you think at the time, de Lee is making sixteen.

Million dollars at All Star.

And this is at the time where sixteen is max, you know, like exactly right.

People hit sixteen and they're like, oh, like that was max at that time. And so I don't think he necessarily had the power to even be able to put me in the starting role, where as opposed to when Steve came in.

Steve came in with a whole different power.

People forget when Steve first came in, he came in with a five year, twenty five million dollars dear, when I was a ton for coaches. He was the first time coach. He came in with a totally different power. So but what Mark, But where I do give Mark credit is the confidence that he instilled in us to be okay with being us. The confidence that he instilled in Steph to be like, na dude, Like I can remember vividly conversates to him like, no, dude, you the baddest dude on the planet.

This is before Steph Curson All Star bro. He said Steph and Clay were the best shooting back. Where we all was like, is he crazy? What's wrong with you? Everybody though absolutely rus what's wrong with you, dude? Why are you saying these I'm We're like, we're in meetings, we're in the locker room, we're.

In practice, and he's like, dude, You're the baddest dude on the planet. And I'm just sitting there like this isn't tight him. He's the baddest dude on the planet. Steph was just now starting to come into his own, like coming off the ankle injury. I remember my rookie year started. My rookie year before training camp actually starts there. This is when they're in and talks about giving Steph

Right there, like going through the draft process or something.

His workout because he was coming off the ankle surgeries.

So they're trying to figure out through the workout, is he healthy enough to give him this forty four million dollars.

It's crazy, It's the most unbelievable thing.

Meanwhile, Mark Jackson is telling this man, you the baddest dude on the planet. Klay Thompson, like Clay has no conscience zero sometimes to a fault. But guess what what I've learned is your biggest fat can also be your biggest strength, right, and so sometimes even to a fault. Most coaches would have essentially forced him to have a conscience for sure. Mark Jackson fed that like, no, dude, you don't think shoot? Like, what are you thinking about?

One of my biggest pepeedges.

When people call me too small, he's too small for the position. So David Lee got the ball in the post. D Lee, that's my dog, that's my vet. D League got the ball in the post. And you know Lee, you played with d is my rookie? Is your vet? That's crazy? Delee's an eyeshole. Yeah, Like I love him to death. So d Lea gets the ball. He catched the ball in the post. I'm on this side and he's like, oh, I got a mouse. I got a mouse. Mouse, y'all better come help turn he's holding the ball on

Are you crazy? Mark Jackson is pouring into that.

Yeah, he tells me right away when as soon as I get drafted, I'm on the phone with him. I want you to come in here, and I want to see the same Draymond Green. I saw a Michigan State leadership blah blah blah. But he's saying me though, absolutely so he is still that in us, like where we believe. So then Steve come in. Steve implements a great offense. Mark Jackson had our defense on point already. Steve comes

Yeah, it starts getting very short after that.

When you look at when you bunch that group of guys together, they'll come for like forty something championships in NBA history, if not more, that group of guys.

Steve Kurr is in that group of guys.

He's the ways that they Steve Curr's taught me about winning, it's insane. And so what Steve then brought was like that, the offense and.

The winning ways.

And think about what you just said, you said, Steve Kerr, Phil Jackson, Pop and pat Riley the other two he played for absolutely, so all the knowledge he got from those two, right, And they may not see it exactly the same because I know Pop comes from the Larry Brown coaching tree, right yep. So it's like the knowledge he's given, I'm sure the details you're getting, the game you're getting, it's just that's priceless.

Absolutely, And so that's where a change it really changed for us, Like Mark instilled it in us, but Steve took it to another level.

Okay. So that makes all the sense in the world, okay, And.

Which came out of an interesting time because then I saw so the time that we're running up against y'all Live City. Yeah, you coming off the bench, which leads me to my next topic.

Six man.

So, I feel like you're in a very interesting space right now where you're becoming.

More known for TV then you are for Like we talked lou Will.

Lou Will's great what lou Will did, love it, but that started with you, and you're now becoming You're not far removed from playing no, but you're becoming more known for TV. Before we get into the TV thing, talk to me about your place in the six man Goat conversation. How you like you were kind of one of the first guys that really embraced that and make that a thing.

Talk to me about that. And like, so I've won since I was a kid. I won as a kid. I went in high school. I went to Michigan and played seventeen games, but we won thirteen of them.

I wish y'all lost thirteen of them.

But the first one I missed was Michigan's State Mo Mo Peete, Matteen, Cleeves, Charlie Bell, that whole crew, and I remember, speaking of which dig Vattel's coming to He came to Christ the first time in years because we wasn't doing much before that. That's the first game in n C double A. Here you go, the first game n C double A tells me I can't play, and so it's an ESPN.

Game National crowd. I'll never forget.

Michigan State won the game, but mat team Klees came to like little bro, it's all good, keep your head up. And that meant a lot to me because here he is. He is a rock star. He's already a rock star, you know what I'm saying. But he came and showed love and I felt supported even though I didn't really know him.

Like that song, but.

I've always won, and in the NBA at this time, dre Is is like, first off, this positions you playing a point.

You plan a two, youre plan a three.

Yes, And also this thing like, oh he's a good player, he's on bad teams. And I was tired of being known as that, and his fate would have it. I got traded as that, I'm gonna start my last years in Golden State. I leave and Steph comes the next year. Because I played with Monte, I played with Jack right, Wow, it was between the it was a transition between the we believe team with BD and I mean Monte at the Mope and then Steph coming.

So is that little gap right there?

And so I get traded to Atlanta and they already got their starting file. They got Josh Smith, Joe Johnson, Bibbie, ol Horford, Marvin Williams and coach and Woody. I love Woody wood. He was like, you ain't gonna start here. I'm like, I ain't got no eag. I'm cool or whatever. I come off the bench. I'm the second leading to score average eighteen. I should have made an All Star that year. Let me speak to that real quickly. Yes, sir, I hate that people ask people to sacrifice they come

Yep.

One of the top fourth quarter scores. But anyways, I go there, I do my thing. And what I didn't know at the time I won a six man was that it was changing the perspective of how the six man was looked at. It Minu Genobia six man, Jason Terry was six man. It was appreciated, but I almost gave it swag and gave it a face. Yes, sir, like you know what I'm saying, Like, Okay, he's six man, he got game.

If he could do it.

Oh, it ain't so bad because you know, in our community, six coming off the benches frowned upon absolutely period childhood.

Oh you donna start, are you weak? That's just how it goes.

But come off the bench doing what I did, doing it with swag and still winning games and doing that, it gave it a face. And now every gym, like you said, I'm in the au Wil so every gym I'm in, it's like six man. I want to be six man too, and that wasn't the case. So it's dope to see that. And one things that's most impressive. And I saw this stat and I'm not flexing. I promise. I'm fourth all time and fourth quarter score fourth. I'm the only person that's off the bench in that in

Off the bench.

So I wear that with pride because it's like, you got shit done and move mountains even though you're come off the bench.

That's interesting because Manu obviously was a six man for the majority of his career career, right, but it was looked that way differently to your point, it's like, oh, he's a starter, come off the bench.

He's sacrificing.

Absolutely, he just don't want to start, so he comfortable coming off the bench. So I was never viewed as like him being a six man. It was actually viewed as you like being a six.

Man because it was like Minu could do all these things and I was more like a specialty, special team Eames type dude. So it's more myself Lou were looked at as that. But to answer your question about the goat conversation, I would never say I'm the goat of that. I think I'm in the conversation because I think everybody Lou has an argument.

Minu has an argument.

As a champion, Jason Terry Hardy came off the bench before Lama Oldham like, there's some dope. Six man Ben Gordon was cold to win Rookie of the Year and six man the same year. So I give all them dudes their flowers. Kevin McHale obviously that left shrimp. But I think I'm in that conversation. And however they see it, they see it. But I think you let others sing your praises, so I let other people say it. But to get that respect and get that love, you would never know I was a six man with all.

The love I get from people.

Clay recently just came off the bench for the first time since his thirty five pot Clay like, since his rookie year. What would you say to Clay? Like, should he embrace that and say, you know what, I'm going to be the sixth man? Should he continue like, no, I'm still at this level. I want to fight, to be a start. What would your advice be to a Clay Thompson actually reach out to Clay?

Wow?

Really, I reached out to people all the time. I actually reached out to Clay before he came off the bench, and I'm like, because we talked about on TV and everybody's like trying to bury Clay, I'm like, he's still averaging seventeen points.

Crazy, I said, it's Clay is.

The fight is with himself because he's been so legendary for so long. Right, yep, seventeen points on a great team is great. Clay's battle is that and obviously the injuries and everything, but with him, I tell him to embrace it.

It can give him a whole nother win.

Like we don't see legendary players like that mine know we talked about, but legendary legendary guys like that who have had four time champions averaging seventeen Like, I'm gonna come off the bench. Now you're seeing second unit guys. Now you're the focal point of the offense. Whenever you like it gets you in the rhythm. Forget the off the bench or starting. You're gonna have better numbers doing this than you would as you're doing it right now with more of a folks, and you may have more fun.

You don't want to look back with regrets.

Man, the last few years I was mad at like, enjoy it because it goes so fast, like, and you've earned that. A lot of people haven't earned that right. You've earned that right, Like, enjoy it, embrace it, and have fun.

And speaking on the other side, I mentioned earlier, you're becoming no more known for TV personality and speaking about basketball, which I think is great, like because that just shows the success that you're having and doing what you're doing now. But it brings me to a conversation of you're now on that side of things. But obviously you've done what

My problem is.

Basketball is one of the only sports or only things where you don't have to be a professional judge professional and get people looking at it like you're the gospel. Absolutely, And it's crazy to me. Bro, I can't walk into Microsoft and tell Bill Gates create this or know that what you're doing is wrong you're supposed to do.

I will think about how I be looked at.

Yeah, if I walked into Microsoft and I'm telling Bill Gates how it should look and what should be done, and this is Bill Gates.

They look at you like you was out of your mind.

Like I'm something, but we allow it, And that kills me. So I know exactly what you mean when you say new media, because it's crazy to me, like there should be a certain credential that you have not to speak on the game. I'm not saying that everybody's free to speak how they want, but to say it with your chest out like yeah, I said it. So you guys are gonna fall a line for this.

Ain't that crazy? It's insane?

And so that part kills me. That part kills me, And that's why I think I have a responsibility to be in this space. And I've given so much of my life to the game as you have, as like certain people have given their life.

And for me, I'm not a hot take dude.

And what I'm saying I don't mean I may not say something that goes viral. I'm saying I'm always following the game, yes, and I feel like the game will always lead me where I need to go. And I owe that to the game. The game's given me everything. Nobody would know who I was, period if I didn't play the game right, So I owe the game. I'll never cheat the game. And so my thing is follow the ball, fall the game, and if I follow the game, I'll be able to say what I feel is right

You know what's crazy is I always tell like football players like I'm envious of you because they can only really watch and see, man did such and such run for x amount of yards? Right? Did he throw for this amount of yards? What was this complete? How many passes did he complete? How many receptions did that guy have?

And they're watching it only from the lens that benefits them or whatever they want their narrative to be. So we see the game from so many different level. I can tell you from the star point of view. I can tell you from a bench player's point of view. I can tell you from just a teammates point of view. I can tell you what the coach is thinking. I can tell you how the front office you're trying to

So what makes you think you know more about this than me? And I'm not saying we.

Can't have a a great conversation about it, me and this pert, X, Y and Z, but I'm just saying, in general, what makes you think that You're like, no, no, when I said this is in and this is going, and you may even bring up a good point within the conversation, but you don't know more, bro, You just don't.

You ain't put enough time.

In absolutely and and and it's the bravado that comes with it, like some of these guys that gets talking.

I'm just sitting there looking now, like the nerve of view, like the nerve of view, like how dare you? How dare you say that?

The nerve of view? But if I come at you, you're wrong, I'm wrong. But who validated you?

Right?

Like?

Who validated this thing?

It's in that and and now especially with social media, right Aha, that's like a whole different thing because I'm sure some of these same people will have the same thoughts. But now we hear him, we see him, and it's like and now they're even louder because now they have a voice and we might respond to him. And sometimes at the end of the day, they didn't even care about what they were saying. They just wanted a response. They wanted your attention, you know what I'm saying. So

We spoke earlier about your involvement in the game. How you continue to get back. I saw the other day you were showing weinby and a couple of young guys and moves. I don't think he pulled the move out in the game. You talked about having ten new moves that people haven't seen.

They't never seen him, and they would have seen him if I made just one All Star game. This is my plan, right, this is my ultimate plan. If I made one All Star game. You know your first All second, how do they mens you play eleven?

Maybe?

So that's something thinking. If I make it. I'm ready to play seven. But it was gonna be seven minutes of funk. Every single time down the court. I was gonna do a new move. Every time I touched the ball, I was gonna do a new move. So how t mac hat that moment we threw off the glass and everybody talked about it. I was going to release one of those moves every single I'm like, I've never coming back here again? Why not?

Why not? Right? They gonna remember me? And that was my plan and so I never made it.

And so now it's like they in the vault, bro, they're just sitting there and I'm not passing to JJ yet because he's young.

He's gonna do it at some point.

They'll take more while to learning, but he would do it, and I want him to do it when he's when he's really there, he's ready for it, so that he won't see me either. Nobody's seen him, even the winby moves like that was just we had a mom and I asked him if he could do the shake and he's like, yeah, I learned that when I learned the sham God. And I say, yo, if you do it in the game with who you are, and you know what, I'm gonna just give you the full version of that move.

I was just freestyle of order. Tell me this. So I watched Weeby.

I haven't gotten the opportunity to play against me up and I watch it and he's, uh, he's a special talent.

The league before he came into the league, I said, And I said obviously as a cheek holding Pop, right, but I said, his skill, whatever he does best early, we don't know, but it'll be highlighted.

Right.

So Pop's gonna play them to a strength, whether it's pick and roll, whether that's setting the pick, whether it's catching on a certain block, whether it's getting in transition, whether it's trill, whatever it is, they're going to highlight that the cheek code is pop though, because I don't

Changer.

So he's better than the hype, not because the shit you can see. It's the shit you can't see. He's a little things dude. Every single time he's sprint and try to block shot, every single time he's running, every single time he's in the right area on help, every single time he makes the right play.

He's a little things dude. And this what really got me.

After the game and walking out, he's in the weight room. He puts it, he sees me, he drops the weights, he comes down, he shakes my hand, he shakes my hand. He doesn't even say nothing. He just puts his head down like he wants some wisdom or knowledge. I saw he's gonna be great because he wants to keep learning, the drive to keep getting better. But the little things he does, besides the big things you see, is why he's gonna be out of He's actually better than the hype is scary.

That's insane.

Like I said, I haven't gotten the opportunity to play against him, but I actually think to your point, I think his best attribute is defense. Yes, he can control the game defensively right now, better than he can offensively.

Yep. And he's already pretty amazing offensively.

The Rising Stars game, he literally locked down the whole key and I said it, I said, to win this game, you're gonna have to get a mi range shot because you can't go in there and you can't pull up a three.

And my guy, uh, I want to mess up his name.

Zeal went to a mir range and I told Bizelli's after the game, I said, I'm glad somebody did because you weren't going in the key. Even the shots he doesn't block, he alters. You're thinking about him, Oh, I can get this one off.

He goes and gets one. You're like, damn, I ain't seen that.

Like, he's he's We use the word different so much, but he actually is different. I think what he is for real. I think he was a guard that he just stretched all the way out. So he sees the game like a guard. He's not like a big trying to dribble. He sees the game like a guard. A boom boom, that shitd went right there already shoot it. Like he's like, I'm like, damn, it's he's. He's a different breed. I've seen it in person. It's crazy. The little things what separates him though.

So if you're starting a franchise today, yeah, all the guys in the league.

You starting it with Wimby and it's my franchise. Trying to go for it the next three years and trying to go to say, you starting a franchise and you know you you're you're the owner of the franchise, so you could be tough going all in in the first three years. You know, like you try to go all in the.

First three years, it can possibly set you back another five for six years, That's what I'm saying going forward in three years, so just say you starting and in the runway is the runway?

Oh yeah, for sure, it's no doubt.

If it was three years, then it's like a joker, right or it's like indeed, But if it's like seven years or five to seven, yeah, it's him for sure. Now it's just about who's gonna play with him? And to your point, okay, what does he do best? Where we can we know what to put around him? Yes, you know what I'm saying, So that part of it. But if it's that, it's without a doubt he's the one. I'm sorry, joker m B. Who you rolling with.

And why?

And be's more dominant in that regard, and he should have win MVP if he doesn't get hurt. But I think Joker, when he's just factoring health, I think he's and helps nobody's fault. But I'm just saying his style of play, he doesn't use athleticism. I have to go a Joker. Joker's playing the game backwards. And what I mean is my man averages thirty points and he doesn't want to score. That's fact, brother, I don't want to score here here, here, and he still gets thirty. Then

And you just spoke on health, which brings me to probably the hottest topic in the NBA right now.

The sixty five don't like it.

Dre, I don't like it. I love the fact that we want everybody to play with shit. I was in year seventeen. I played all eighty two.

That's crazy.

So I love the fact of playing I was man for years. I've been saying before low management, low management when dudes were still practicing low manage in practice, because low managing practice. So these kids can see everybody playing and it's still for the league. It's good for the kids, good for the game. So I'm all for this is

But if they're injured and they can get injured.

Worse trying to be out there to meet a quota, that's the part I have a problem with Like.

We've actually seen two guys that happened to already this year. Joel, he's actually playing against us when he just hurt his knee. I mean I had already heard that the knee was not doing his face, and they told us like, if it wasn't the game thing, he wouldn't play the night.

Then he played hurst the knee.

We've also seen in We're here Hinklefield House and Indianapolis. We've also seen it with Tyres Holliburn. Yeah, Tyree's came back from the hamstring. He's on manustriction right now too soon. Yes, he's now been back for three weeks and he's still on them in a restr it's your elemental restriction.

But he's forcing it to get back.

Why all NBA, Because if I'm not mistaken, all NBA actually affects his contract.

I think yes it does.

I think what maybe forty one million, absolutely fifty three million, three million dollars.

So he's forcing it to get back for that.

But and say he missed three more games before pushing it to come back, right, I don't think you're looking at that at the end of the year, Like.

He missed those three more games. He not all NBA. No, you're not. You're not.

So we're trying to save the voters from themselves because we're not technically putting it in a place where the guys are going to play more.

He may miss more time if he gets hurt.

Absolutely, and yes, exactly, we don't even know when he's coming back, right, And that's not good for the game because here he is having an MVP season, he's not playing the All Star game.

His team is hurting.

His team is their second, third, fourth, and five player can be the best they can be and it won't matter if Joe Embiid is not there. Absolutely, So that part I understand what they were doing, Like I said, to get people to play. We want that as fans who watch the game and talked about them, we want that absolutely, so we're not saying that. But also on the other side of that, we can't have guys risking their health if they're injured trying to further play and injured themselves more.

It's the unintended consequence, right, that's the problem. Right. You know, you're getting these guys who really.

Hurt and it wasn't necessarily intended for them. But they're catching the consequence for it, for sure, So what's.

The right thing?

Okay, if maybe it's maybe it's not. I think it shouldn't be attached to their money. I'm not a component of he has to play this many games to get elgible or all in mere to get eligible.

I mean that's a bonus, obviously. I'm not sure what the right thing is.

I'm sure they've had these conversations they've had to right, you made all NBA.

I have before a couple of times, a couple of times. What's your take on it?

My take on it is, I think the sixty five game rules is pathetic. I think I totally understand wanting to get guys on the floor.

Yes, and have it, but like this is the NBA.

We know when somebody really hurting, when you actually like low manage it. So my thing is do to work, like really do the work and know who's actually low manager because they keep all these notes.

Like sure, every time I go into training room, everything's tracked.

Now it's tracked, so you know the truth, Like you know if I'm in there l and every day with this knee and all of a sudden two weeks later, it's just gotten to a place to where I probably can't go tonight. You know, you know, because you've seen on my law that I've been in that training room for this right name every day every day for the last.

Two before and after practice, every day. I have to be in there or else it's just not in a good space.

Right.

So my thing is do to work like, don't punish Joel and b because say this, Say if Joe was hurting at that time and then he missed seven games instead of the two that he missed, he missed seven, and then he comes back healthy and on the same terror that he was on, can he still win MVP? Can he still make an impression on voters who's the last impression in the mind was how he was dominating, then he missed seven games, and then he come back

Let it be.

What if a person runs in player X, runs into plexture play or wise knee or ankles, that whatever, and he misses ten games because of it, How are we penalizing for missing ten games? And that part, that's the part that needs to be tweaked, and now he's not eligible because he may miss four more and then two more and now he's not eligible for or three more or whatever. He's not eligible to be for those awards.

I agree you sit on the side of media now I sit on both sides currently and also understanding that media makes decisions that does that can decide whether Tyrese Hallerbirn makes fifty three? Is there a better system that we can come up with than time, Because here's the theme, mall, I may not like a reporter and that reporter may not like me for whatever reason. Maybe I didn't give him an interview when they wanted an interview there.

Maybe they said something that I didn't like it.

I say something back to them and they didn't like that, and so then they don't vote. Should we still be in a space where our money is decided.

By their emotions because they're human beings? Like right, Like, you can't tell me that not biased the human beings?

Right?

No?

Hell? No? Are you serious?

No, no way there's no way because they're going to always feel personal about that. All you didn't speak to me, or I said something and I didn't like how you responding in front of people. Now I'm a little embarrassed or whatever it might be. No, And that's why that part of it is why we love that you're in media. We love that players are in media because you guys are in are in it, like truly in it. You're in the locker rooms. You like. I hate what all

That's a two to three day span.

So I love that players are taking the power of their own You can end it in two seconds. Literally, you can have your own press conference for millions of people in two seconds to get things right or straighten things out.

And I love that part of it. Before we get out of here, who you got winning it this year?

I think, to be honest with you, I think the West, Denver's always there. I think Phoenix is built for the playoffs, and I don't think they're done. I think they're going to get a guard who can kind of organize and kind of I think they are missing that, and I think they're missing the backup big and I think the Clippers are rolling at the right time. I saw your eyes jump up when I said the Clippers, take yourself out of it.

Now.

I need you on the media side. You need the player side right now, needs you on the media side. Are the Clippers the one team that you look at like, Okay, they can really go do this if they stay healthy, for.

Sure, because they have everything. They have a Hall of fame point guard. Yes, they have a Hall of Fame shooting guard. They have a Hall of Fame small forward. Yes, they have a Hall of Fame coming guard on the bench. Yes, Oh my goodness now, and that's a hall of fame coach.

They got role players. I think they have a lot. Now.

Health is obviously for anybody. Everybody has to be healthy. But I think they have anything that you need to compete for a championship. And like you said, it's coming together at the right time. But also aside from them having everything that you need, they got guys that need a championship. James Harden need a championship. Paul George need a championship. Russell Westbrook need a champions So they starving. And guess what, all those guys I just named are

I don't do it. No, it don't happen.

It don't happen, you know, And so I think, and then now you put all that into account, and you got Tyleru orchestrating it and ty Lou know what to do. You know what to do in no situation, not all. You know, we go to Tyl Lou. You know, the love I got for this man brought us back three one.

I don't want to.

Talk about it, but Ty was surprised you giving love to Clippers because you know we came along with with that Worriors Clippers thing.

Absolutely, but you know we smacked them up enough to where I can get I love and you know, be all right with it.

You know, I got two questions for talking to me.

Remember when word got to us when all that happened, that if we walked out and didn't play, you guys on board, is that real? You guys really not gonna play if we didn't play?

This is when Donald Sterling.

Yes, the recording came out of Donald Sterling the game that now if you go back and look how the game was us versus y'all.

This was Adam Silver's first big decision he had to make. Shouts Adam, who's.

Been the best commissioner probably in the history of sports, but this was his first big decision that he had to make as the commissioner of the NBA, and it was Donald Sterling with the magic Johnson thing the recordings coming out, the races recording and we had a game to play that night, and.

Steph was talking to Chris.

D Lee was talking to somebody else on y'all Team Andre talking to CP as well, and we were talking about what are we doing if the announcement essentially doesn't if we don't approve, and it was, well, we're going to go out there on the court like we're lining up for the jump ball and we're walking off.

What effect do you think it would have had had we done that? I think it changed out how things are in other worlds.

I think.

I think it changes the landscape of the NBA. I think it changes the landscape of how athletes view themselves in this whole athletes place, how athletes view their place in this whole business. Because as time has gone on, we figured out more of our place, but we still don't have a stake in it. And I think with that move, if we hadn't made that move, I think we have stake in it right now.

So that's a move that could have outlived all of us.

It would have been on CNN, it would have been on it would have been everywhere.

And what it shows you.

Most importantly is all right, guess what, go play, Go.

Play the game. Don't go on. It's over. We're done. We're not playing. We're walking off. The game.

Doesn't go on on one of the big stage at the time, right us versus y'all play all stage.

Beef. Right, everybody's watching that series. It's over.

You're a Warrior. Give me four other words. I know we're about to go to Give me four other warriors. You go to Warriors. They can't be on your team just in the league from your perspective, can be on my team and warriors like you got it. We're going to play in the roughest, toughest whatever in the world.

I need four Warriors to go with me. No pun intended, not Warrior Wars. I'm taking uh Can I be on my team?

No, they can't be on the Golden State Warriors, but four that are built like you to go somewhere.

I'm taking a bron Okay, I am taking.

John Moran. Mm hmmm. He ain't backing down from nobody.

What y'all said. I'm running up to you and he running up. I'm taking Joab, I'm taking bron I am taking uh m hm that's interesting. That's interesting. I'm taking because see here's the thing there with me, I can bring the dog. So I just need guys who got the dog, Like, as long as you got it enough for us to stand on, I'll bring it.

Bring it.

So, joh, so I need you to be nice.

But we need the dog too though. But that's what I'm saying.

So these are guys absolutely, but like they're nice. So what takes the cake is how good they are. So I need those guys. All right, I'll do that. I'll do that other ship. I can't wait till these last two. So I'm taking those two. I'm taking Uh. I'm taking Joker.

Man, Joker, maybe the most shocking thing I heard today.

Man, not dude, the animal. He is an He told you how Grety was here? An animal dog like. He don't talk, No, he don't flown it. You ain't moving him off his spot.

You're not rattling him with nothing, nothing like nothing is rattling nothing here.

An animal. I'm taking him. He's he's all timer already. I'm taking Joker. You got one more, and my last one I'm taking is uh. Shake Gills is out center.

He talked to JJ yesterday, and it wasn't the and I'm saying that to say this, it wasn't the all what's up? It was like the talk you had with him in the bay in the finals. It was a real talk. And to hear him, I said, he's a he's a dog. He's a real dog. Ain't no, he ain't no fake dog like He's a dog. Absolutely, and so his mindset was impressive to hear. So it's you joh S g A bron and joker and then five dogs can go anywhere.

Anywhere and get it done. Were going to service anywhere.

We're going anywhere, and we got obviously the talent. Yeah, but each one of those guys that I named stand on business. May do it quietly, may.

Do it allowet they gonna do it, but they stand on business and I respect that.

And you're talking guys like these are all guys by the way that carried low. They stand on business though, and they dogs, And I got nothing but respect and love for those guys. So like the common answer would be like Pat Bev you know, but like I'll bring that. You know what I'm saying, Like I'll bring that like myself, I'll bring that. So give me somebody who a dog, but they can go do all that other ship that I can't.

And them the guys, do you see anybody else that can be who can be the next not to a t not perfectly molded, who can be the next generation of your's.

Up my way? You said that quick, you thought about this. Yeah, I love that kid man. He and I don't know what's happening right now in Houston.

I haven't seen them play a ton, but I haven't heard a ton about him, So I don't know if he's playing a lot this year. You know, it can be tough with coaching changes and different stuff, directions of organizations. All of a sudden, they was getting smacked last year white like mopped across the court. And then now you bring in Emay, you bring in Fred, you bring in

I say, Tara East, Now you gotta get in the right situation. But I love his game.

I love what he brings to a team, and I think he got a chance to be like that next guy if he embraced it though, you know, because a lot of these young guys wouldn't want to embrace being me, you know, like it's not sexy.

But it's so important.

I've very rarely, and I stayed the game for a long time, very rarely have I seen two teammates that was connected and lean on each other like you and Steph in fact, And it's amazing. When I watch I just laugh. I'm like this is because when I was in competition, I didn't see it, But now I'm like, this is is beautiful to watch because you guys are switching rolls within the game, like you know what I'm saying, Like it's crazy to see. And that's the Chinese riddle.

And being with us now, he come up to me and he's like, yo, you and Steph should switch positions now, like you take the ball to him running to dragt.

I'm telling you watching it and me and C haven't even talked about that, but I can see it. It's crazy to see, but it's beautiful, and you guys will go down just as the connection of two players and their success. I mean, obviously you have the the Jordan's Pippins shot up all the but you guys will go down up there with duels that are just as connected and lean on each other just as beautiful.

I appreciate that, no doubt, my man. Thank you always the same time. Man, always a pleasure. I could talk basketball with you all day. Thank you, my brother, absolutely one of the goats.

It's a wrap. Appreciate your peace.