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There's two things in the NBA kind of roll why eyes at Everybody talks about how mobility works. No, it doesn't. It worked for Lebron. It worked for Lebron when he went to Miami, he got two titles. It worked from in Cleveland he got a title, and it worked in LA he got a title. And it worked for Kevin Love who joined Lebron, and Chris Bosh who joined Lebron in Miami, and Anthony Davis who joined Lebron in Los Angeles. Mobility is and how you build championships. That's not how
it works. It worked for Lebron in three places, Okay, going to Miami, coming back to Cleveland, going to Los Angeles. It hasn't worked for Kevin Durant other than one time he goes to the Warriors. Since then, Brooklyn didn't work Phoenix bit disappointing. So the mobility thing, you know, that's not winning titles. San Antonio mostly had a core group. Golden State they won before KD. They won a title
after KD. You know, Boston gets Drew Holliday, but that team for years was built around Jalen Brown, Jason Tatum, and Marcus Smart. Now I like the upgrade Drew Holiday, but their two core guys are Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum. So I think, you know, mobility is something we talk about all the time in the NBA, and I just sort of rolled my eyes the other thing. I kind
of you know, people talked about small ball. It worked for the Warriors because they had the three best shooting players, the best shooting backcourt tantem ever, Jerry West scale good Rich for most of my life was the best shooting backcourt ever, and then supplanted by Klay Thompson and Steph Curry, and then they had Kevin Durant. Yeah, they had the three best shooters of all time playing together, and they went and got bogd at one point, they got Kevin Durant.
They weren't that small. There were small ball lineups that worked for them, but it doesn't work now they're pivoting off it by getting you know, Looney, Trayvon Looney has size, Sarich has size, Cominga's long, Jackson Davis is long. He's kind of a forward center sixt nine six nine and a half. So they're just they're not. They just more
formidable in the front court than before. So small ball worked because really the Warriors had unique players, a wing in Draymon who can defend Biggs, and Stephan Clay the best shooting back court ever. That's your small ball. People try to duplicate it. It didn't equal titles and mobility doesn't really work. It worked with Lebron several times. I think the Warriors are really dangerous. I really do. I
think they've won seven straight road games. They have a nice mix of young and old, and they have one of the highest IQ. They have probably the smartest team in the league right now. Between Chris Paul, Steph Curry, Clay Thomps and Steve Kerr Draymond Green, You've got I mean, you've got a lot of games. You've got a lot of games with those guys, and that's why I would take him head to head over an ok see, even the okc's built for the regular season. The regular season
is it is a complete marathon. And you know, for older teams who are doing load management, you know, I mean like Lebron James has a great fourth quarter, you know against the Clippers, he would prefer not to play the following night. I mean he took the Celtic game off with Anthony Davis. These old guys picked their spots. Young eyes get injured less and they heal faster. So I think the Warriors are going to be a real team.
And uh it's a nice mix of old and new and I really like watching them play.
It is you know.
The other thing about the three point shot, which I think is overstated. I think so much of analytics in baseball and in the NBA is based on regular season games, and you know, these are these are long you play. The averages analytics are averages over the course of time. But when you get into playoff basketball or playoff baseball, you just got to get outs. You go into a series, you're going to bring starters on three days rest, You're
going to you're gonna use them in late innings. A starter if you have to win a game six or a game seven, So the analytics go out the door. You manage differently, you use your bullpen differently, you use starters differently on fewer days rest, and in a basketball playoff, basketball becomes very situational. It becomes very much about get a basket. That's why Kawhi Leonard has been when he's healthy, a very good playoff performer. Get a stop, get a basket,
doesn't have to be a three. And so I think this Warrior team is obviously going to lie a large part on Steph Curry hitting threes, but they've got a lot of guys that can get you two.
Now.
Kaminga is a guy that's really good around the ten. They've got size, they don't have to shoot the ball as well. Pods is a nice rookie. He's the next play, but can be a little bit of a slasher, which I like. I don't think you have to rely on threes. And I think small ball was overstated just due to unique generationally gifted players for the Warriors that other teams rosters couldn't duplicate. I think the NFL combine this week, let's talk about that. The combine really isn't about the
measurables and the performance. What it really is is a chance for general managers and personnel people in the NFL to get together and a lot of late nights, a lot of beers, a lot of cocktails, and it's like they say, a lot of business gets done on the golf course, a lot of stuff gets done at the combine.
I thought my guess was that Justin Fields would be moved from the Bears to Atlanta around the combine that you just you know, you get a couple of beers, guys sit down, and what my guess the way Justin Fields would work is that, Yeah, I don't know exactly what you do, but like the Bears have the ninth pick,
Atlanta's got the eighth pick. Maybe you swap those in a third round or something like that feels reasonable, So the Bears move up one slot and get a third round or that feels like something you can do for
Justin Fields. I don't think he's going to be a superstar in Atlanta, but I do think you can argue he'll be the most talented quarterback in the NFC South, where he's just not He's not as good as Jared Goff, and I don't think he's I don't think he at this point is trending to be nearly as good as Jordan Love. So if kirk Cousins comes back for two years, as kirk Cousins right now is a more efficient quarterback than Justin Fields and so he would be the fourth
most reliable quarterback in the division. That's not a good place for him. I think it's a much better place for him to go to Atlanta, where you know Baker and Derek carr are. You know, they can win a lot of games, especially Baker. He's won a playoff game. You know, he's a playoff quarterback in the AFC and the NFC. But in terms of overall size and talent whip arm, you know, Justin's pretty special player. So the combine to me, and we sent John Middlecoff there for
the volume. The Combine's really a relationship. It's like a camp for football grown ups where you get all the gms and the personnel people and they screw around. They have steak dinners and you get a lot of business done. I don't care much about the players testing, you know, it's like these personal workouts and testing. I do think, you know, there's a trend over the last several years that quarterbacks don't throw at this thing. I think every
draft has a really interesting player. I mean, I think without question, everybody knows it's good wide receiver, good offensive tackle class, really good three or four really high end receivers, three or four really good offensive tackles. You could have six offensive tackles taken in the first round. That's a
huge number of the quarterbacks. There's a lot of talent, but I think the most interesting player in the draft is going to be JJ McCarthy from Michigan, who had a great coach, a great old line, a great run game, and a great defense in a conference. Frankly, that's kind of Ohio State and everybody else outside of Michigan. I mean, that's about the only team Michigan face that has equal talent in the SEC. Even though Alabama can be great.
There's Georgia, there's LSU. There's a lot of teams that can stack up athletically, three or four teams at the top. Ohio State and Michigan just looked different than everybody else, and McCarthy benefited from that. Now, he won a lot of games, but they didn't really rely on him. He didn't throw many touchdown passes, as his biggest games were off and against I mean he had I think it was half of his touchdown passes against three teams, all
of them awful East Carolina, Michigan State. In Indiana, he had half of his touchdown totals and he only had one game with three touchdown passes. I believe Pannix had ten, bo Nicks had seven.
I think he had.
One game with either was it three hundred yards passing or three touchdown passes. My big concern is he's really slender. And let me give an example, so I've used this before, is that Aaron Rodgers and I are the same height, and I've seen Aaron a couple times up close. He doesn't look thick. He weighs two hundred and twenty five pounds. I'm the same height and I weigh onon ninety five. I work out every day. I'm in pretty good shape. You would view me as slender. If you looked at Aaron,
you would view him as sort of slender. He carries thirty pounds more than me at the same height chest shoulders, but it's that thickness. Years ago, I asked somebody about Aaron. I said, he doesn't look that big, and this person said, look at his caps, look at his butt, look at his shoulders, look at his wrists. There's a difference. When Johnny Manziel came into the league, he just didn't he didn't have the size and the shoulders, the butt, the hips,
the wrist. He just wasn't big enough. And so I look at JJ McCarthy and he's six ' three, so he is taller than Aaron Rodgers by an inch and a half, and he weighs twenty to twenty three pounds less. That is that's noticeable to me. He comes across his slender and you know it's somebody. An NFL executive said, he looks like a stretched out Bryce Young And I never thought of that, but in the context of body types, it kind of it kind of matches. And so I
think McCarthy's fascinating. I know two people who I really like in the NFL. Executives think he's a hamnegger, just don't really see it. I know somebody else, Randy Mueller, a former executive in the league works for the Athletic now really likes JJ McCarthy. Obviously, Jim Harball loves him. He's rooting for his guys. I don't know quite what to make of him now. I didn't like Zach Wilson of the Jets out of college. I like JJ McCarthy more. I think he throws a better ball and a more
consistent ball. You know, I didn't like Johnny Manziel out of college. I think JJ McCarthy is a much much better prospect. I didn't like Tebow at all a college obviously. I mean, Tebow couldn't throw a consistent NFL football. It's not like I don't think he has talent. I do think JJ has talent, but the body type, it's just it's a completely different sport. I mean the NFL. I remember when Johnny Manziel came into the league and he was a run around guy, gave Alabama's great defenses all
sorts of fits. And I think it was a preseason game. He's playing for Cleveland. I think they played Washington. Is that the one where he gave somebody the finger and he rolled out and you know, he thought, I'm going to get around this defensive end and he could not outrun a defensive end in the NFL and in that moment, I'm like, Yeap, not going to work because his game is movement. It's just not going to work. Lamar Jackson moves, you can't stop him. Michael Vick moves, Steve Young moved,
They got around the corner. So a lot of times, you know, you play in college school, in college, and what works for you does not work, does not translate to the NFL. So I'm just fascinated with JJ McCarthy to see if it does. I just don't quite see. Now you'd say Colin, you didn't see c J. Stroud, No, I said Lance Zerlein, who works at NFL dot Com a draft analyst. He said it Jared Goff was his comp. And I said probably ten times on the air, that's
a good comp out of college. I didn't see a lot of juice with Jared Goff, but I thought he threw a beautiful ball from the pocket. I didn't see a lot of juice until the Georgia game on c J. Stroud, But he throws a beautiful ball out of the pocket. And Zerleine was on the Herd yesterday NFS one and talked about that that people give him crap for that, but if you go look at Jared Goff's second year numbers and c J. Stroud's first year numbers. CJ got
a great first coach. Jared Goff didn't. They're very similar. So JJ McCarthy is going to be really really interesting to me. You know, like this was the best Michigan team perhaps ever, and the best team in college football I thought significantly. The great O line and a really powerful run game, and a great coach, very Alabama like.
And if you start looking at all these Alabama quarterbacks, the Bryce Youngs and the Tuas, you know, they looked Mac Jones, Boy, did we really like them out of college? And then you get to the NFL behind an average offensive line and you don't really have a number one receiver.
That's what JJ McCarthy feels like to me. The great coach, the great O line, the great run game, the great defense support, playing with the lead, getting very good field position, just like Tua and Mac Jones and Alabama quarterbacks time and time again. Then they get into the NFL and they trail and they don't have a good offensive line and they're moving in. JJ McCarthy weighs six three, two hundred and three pounds and then he probably needs twenty
two pounds more with that size, so we'll see. He is to me, the most interesting player in the first round. You know, I love you know, I like poking people in the ribs from time to time. And you know, whenever I, you know, hear people say if I say anything about politics, stay in your lane, stick to sports. It's funny that people who are telling me that don't stick to their job. Mortgage broker, banker, school teacher. Everybody
gets an opinion except sports guy. But you know, I've been in the market since nineteen eighty nine, the stock market. My dad was a stock market investor. Two of my best friends, three of my best friends are in the market. If I didn't do this, probably something I would do, you know, be a broker. Always been fascinated with it, you know, been a Wall Street Journal Forbes subscriber for some time, and I'd like to reading that section almost as much as the sports section. Not quite, but I do.
But you know, I was, I was tweaking people over the weekend. It's just, you know, ex slash Twitter is a hell site, and I was saying, I'm going to be the balance from this point forward to some good economic news. Whenever I see it, I'm gonna post it. And you know, people always say you don't know anything about politics. Well, people will say, you know, you don't know much about the economy. You don't have to pay attention. Every flight I have been on, and I've seen bad economies.
During COVID post two thousand and eight, the market crash, I've seen bad economies last four years, three years. Every flight I'm on is packed Tuesday, Thursday, Friday, vacation, holiday, business, personal, doesn't matter. It doesn't matter where I'm going. I can go to Rhode Island, I can go to Providence, I can go to Salt Lake, I can go to Dallas, I can go to Boise, I can go to Arizona. They're all packed, and I know those tickets aren't cheap.
That's one way I've always measured the economy. Hey, during COVID, the early and late stages, you know, there were open seats on planes.
You know.
One of the things years ago, I got picked up by a driver. It was the late Berning Max driver in Chicago, and I was asking him about how the economy was, and he said, well, I can always tell the economy. This was just a you know a driver in Chicago for Bernie Mac, the late great comedian, and he said, I can tell the economy based on the traffic. He said, people have jobs now, traffic's awful, So you don't have to be an economist to figure out what's the traffic like, try to get into a hotel. What
are restaurants like on Thursday, Friday, Saturday? How about a Tuesday, a Wednesday? Are they busy? What are they charging for cocktails? I can tell you in the life I live, and I don't hang out with the ritzy crowd.
I don't.
I got stay at home dads as friends, school teachers, regular dudes. Nobody right now is in dire strait. That doesn't mean people aren't in dire straits. But when I hear wow, the inflation, it's down, job growth ascending, unemployment three point seven, historically low. The economy's fine. I'm not saying it's on fire. I'm not saying the economy is great.
It's okay.
I know based on my AD rates and commercials, we have turned a corner in the last six months, probably the last four months, we've really turned a corner with our ad revenue on our podcasts. I have a big business dinner tomorrow night with a really important advertiser. I can tell based on my ads the rates how many dinners I'm having. Airports US casinos last year made six point five billion dollars. That's discretionary income. That's a lot of money. So because Biden's in office, you know, no
conservative wants to acknowledge. Oh, the economies. It's not terrible. I don't give presidents that much credit for the economy. But the stock market does matter. When people tell you the stock market is not the economy, well it's my economy. Fifty percent of my net worth is in the stock market, so I pay attention to it. So when my four to zer one k goes up, my step IIRA goes up, my mutual funds, my net worth goes up. I travel more, I vacation more, I buy more stuff. I can't be
the only person in the country that thinks that. So I know that DraftKings. I know that people are sports betting and gambling and traveling and going to work. So what I don't buy into, I'll vote. I'll vote left and right. I would have voted for Mitt Romney. I don't have a problem voting for a conservative. I voted for George Bush, I voted for Obama, I voted for Clinton. Right now, I'm not a fan of Biden or Donald Trump. I am an independent, left leaning moderate on social issues,
right leaning moderate on fiscal issues. But this idea that you have to be an economist to know the economy, No, you don't pay attention. The economy is fine. Nobody said it's on fire. Nobody said it's equal for everybody. It never has been. I grew up in a small rural town without a lot of money. We were struggling to buy groceries my entire childhood. We were not rolling in it. Today'somy is fine, and I ain't sticking to sports ever. John Middlecoff, former NFL scout, going to the NFL combine
here three and out. His podcast Go Low is his golf podcast. You know, the NBA draft is fun, but there's two rounds and these guys coming at nineteen and they go to bad teams. So and the hit rate's pretty low because you don't have as much video. It's hard. In the NBA NFL college draft, you have minimum three years of film. A lot of these guys come from two or three major conferences. They're playing against NFL guys, So there's misses, but there's a lot of hits as well.
You know, Now, I was thinking about one of the things in the draft that I was reading a story and I forget God. I want to give credit to whoever did it. They went back and looked at last year's draft and graded it. And again it's not so. Houston had the most successful draft. So when CJ. Stroud comes in and crushes some of it is very explainable. They hit like on five draft picks number two. I know the Rams and the Seahawks were up there, the
Packers were at three. And I got to tell you something. I said this, I like both the Packers last two drafts. Is I sometimes wonder about this, but by the way the Jets and the Giants terrible. Is that I sometimes wonder. And you worked in the building because Philadelphia, where you worked, it's a wealthy franchise. There are a lot of money here.
Green Bay, I could argue, over the last twenty five years, has done a better job than anybody in this league drafting and developing and when you were in the league, and my take is a lack of an owner helpful. The guys run at it are just all football guys. But the Packers they went to last year's draft and the receivers hit and the tight ends hit. And just when I look at Green Bay, I think, Okay, they've
had different GMS, different coaches. They nail quarterbacks, great o' line, they always always find receivers and tight ends when you were in the league. Is it one of those classic the millionaire next door that if you're on a school teacher salary, you're just not gonna waste as much money. You're going to be smarter than a stockbroker who's got money to right? Are the Packers seen as frugal because
they don't have the game day revenue? But when I saw that list, and again I apologize for not crediting who it was, I saw it on the plane. It was best draft from last year. Packers were third, and I thought, God, when is the last bad draft the Packers had.
I think a lot has to do with, you know, a lot of cultures. When I get rid of everyone, right, a GM and a coach, the owner gets to hire everybody, and he's always the boss. He's always hovering over everybody. It goes back to ron Wolf and Holmgren taught all these guys right from Ted Thompson. Gudakins had worked there forever, so they've had the same culture in terms of management since Ron Wolf showed up in the early nineties. So the way they look at players, they've always been obsessed
with high weight speed. I don't think it has to do as much with like pinchion pennies and not being able to like, you know, you're the Rays, they're the Yankee, so you have to outthink them. I just think that they've taught and streamlined it from generation to generation very very well.
They have a.
Like a company culture there that I think has transcended general managers from ron Wolf to Ted Thompson to now Gutikins, and I think they've been pretty consistent. Back to what you're saying with the draft of like they all know what they're looking for because they've been looking for the
same thing now for thirty years. Helps a lot when you have a quarterback, right, they have a quarterback and they know how to surround the guy, and they've always done an incredible job of surrounding the guy on offense. I think the Ravens are a pretty good example of how they transitioned from Ossie to Da Costa because Da Costa was his right hand man forever. So it's like point when you have the cohesion, Like why are the
Chiefs so strong right now? Because Andy has Spags who's never leaving, I mean, and who has been goes back for twenty years beating Belichick and Brady.
It's very unique to have that.
Kyle or McVeigh get a good coordinator, boom, the guy's gone. They can't hold on to their defensive coordinator. So I think having the cohesion the Packers is a great place to work.
I remember when we were there.
When I worked in the league, everyone was always kind of envious of like because it was like this chill vibe, but they were winning big and it was just through the Green Bay Packers. There was like the pressure we had in Philadelphia, felt it every day when you went in the building. They definitely don't have that. Yeah, I think the Chiefs really have that going on right now, but a lot has to do with winning. I just
think it's it's a very unique organization. But I do think it gets back to the streamline vision from generation to generation, and they've all crossed, you know, like John Schneider hires Mike McDonald know each other.
They're hoping this.
Chemistry works because he's good coach with the Ravens, and you know he knows. But it's like you're kind of keeping your fingers crossed. You look at Harball goes to the Chargers. Who do they hire as his general manager? A guy he knows, A guy he's comfortable with from Baltimore. So you're like, yeah, it's probably gonna work out. He knows John there. It's all in the family that matters. Like Shanahan's had a lot of success with people he knows.
He's worked with Robert solid he coached Tamiko Ryans, Brian Greasy he worked with when he was young in Tampa's dad knows him. We're all comfortable with people we know, right, who do you hire the volume like to run your management people that you're comfortable people with. You know, it helps now they have to be talented, but like when you're all on the same page, it's a lot easier
to operate. And I think for thirty plus years the Packers have just had a lot of cohesion, not a lot of people leave their coaches, do you know, but there their scouts. I don't know if they pay top notch relative to the NFL executives, but I sure know when they're winning, things are having success, people like working there.
Yeah, you can also buy a hell of a house in Milwaukee, live like a king a four hundred ninety thousand dollars.
You know.
It's it's just it was when I saw the list, it was like, God, Green Bay knows what they're doing, and to your point, quarterbacks kind of make it all work, you can. I mean, listen, Brett Veach in Kansas City's had some misses. You forget sky Moore, you forget him really quickly. Malmes makes you forget shit really quickly.
Well, it's like someone told me with the Jets a couple of years ago. They're like they had all those picks in the top whatever. The first couple of rounds for two straight years, could we could go seven of eight? They all could be pro bowlers. If Zach's a whiff, were in trouble, we'd go one of eight. If zach'sa hit contract extensions, Well what happened? They went seven eight? Maybe not seven eight, but five or six of eight and Zach's the problem and they got issues that quarterback.
I mean, if Jordan Love and we're all gonna pencil him in, I do think there's a difference of kind of They got to fly unto the radar a little bit.
This year.
They started slow and they came on. Everyone next year is going to be looking at them like double digit wins playoff team. It is a different pressure. So why I give a lot of credit to the Lions. Everyone took the Lions seriously this year coming in and they handled it well like it's another Now Lafleur has success. Now he's been a part of those type teams with Aaron, so he's I feel comfortable with it. But sustaining high
level play year in year out, that's hard. So you know there's going to be a lot of tangible pressure on Jordan Love next year.
I've always kind of measured how often I talk football. I don't work at the NFL network, nor do I want to.
I like the NBA.
I like, you know, an October September baseball series. I like the World Cup, a good UFC fight, I like March Madness. I could never just talk football, and I've always kept the number around sixty five percent of the show. But I was talking to a TV exec. I had a meeting about ten twelve days ago with a really smart guy, and we were talking about the Big Ten and he said, those ratings going to go up fifteen
to twenty percent. And I had given college football about an eight year break a hiatus on my show because it got very regional and very southern. And I'm not anti SEC, but if it was all it.
Was Alabama, Georgia every in Clemson every year for seven straight years.
Yeah, and so it just like listen, once baseball became very local. Nobody in Minnesota is going to watch the Mariners. Nobody in Seattle gives a rip about Tampa Bay. You had a Seahawk fan would watch the Buccaneers in Baker Mayfield play. So once baseball about ten twelve years ago, I felt it really got local. I just didn't talk about it. College basketball is a turnstile now between the transfer portal one and done. You can't name the starters
on Duke, but it is sort of interesting. I was talking to this executive about the growth of college football. He goes, you're not going to believe the numbers are going to explode. And he started talking about the Big Ten schedule and he's like, you're going to get Washington Oregon or Washington, Michigan, Ohio State, Oregon, Penn State USC You're going to have three and four games in a row all day. And it did make me think as I was off this week, and I you know, I
kind of shut it down. When I'm off, I don't watch sports. I just leave and there was nothing going on anyway. I'm watching the Warriors Nuggets today. But the biggest story in baseball last week as the season starts, uniforms, you know, they're kind of sheer see through. Biggest story in the NBA was how bad the All Star Game was. The biggest story in college basketball was storming the court. Yet, the NFL is the sport we talk about because we watch the games. Listen, if you're a fan, listen to
what we talk about. When people, sportscasters, podcasters talk football, we actually talk about strategy in the games that the NFL. With the growth of college football, which by the way, between the Draft and the combine, they really started to go hand in hand. College basketball in the NBA are the Grand Canyon. They have nothing in common. Most of the great players don't even want to play in college basketball, college baseball, but major League baseball, college hockey they don't connect.
You know, college soccer and the MLS they don't connect. College football connects with the NFL more and more. And I was sitting there this week watching people talk about sports, and I thought, am I going to do an eighty percent football show based on the audience. As I've said, the audience drives the show what they want. I follow ratings and I'm sitting there thinking, I don't want to work at the NFL network. But John between legalized gambling,
people now stick through bad games. This massive, yeah, big ten sec explosion where now the two conferences are going to have all the games we watch, The ratings are going to skyrocket the twelve team playoff. I was sitting there this week and I thought, Jesus, you're talking about see through pants in baseball? Is that amongst your friends when you go golf, does anybody talk about anything other football?
The other thing that it comes up consistently? Even and I know a couple of guys and play golf with some former Major League baseball players. They talk football. I mean the Bill's fan, a Packer fan. That's all they want to talk about. And during the fall, I think college football, like you said, think about next year Texas, Alabama, Oklahoma, Georgia, Texas, LSU, the SEC and the Big Ten get it's gonna feel like NFL light. I think the NFL, I've said this forever.
I don't know if it's gonna last forever my entire life. Like I'm almost forty, does that forty years dominating When I was growing up. Baseball was huge the nineties with the Yankees, basketball with Michael Jordan. But for the foreseeable future, I don't.
See how that gap.
I mean the All Star Game, guys actively talk like why would we even try to participate. Anthony Rendon, who's making two hundred and forty five million dollars to that story, He's like, yeah, baseball is not even a priority. It's like, well, I think for two hundred and fifty million dollars, probably probably don't want to say that, buddy. You know, it's like,
can you imagine an NFL play? I think the relatability sometimes with you and I don't even blame these guys cause you're getting two hundred fifty million dollars guaranteed.
Some of these.
Basketball players I played. I played golf last week during the All Star break with a guy that calls NBA games, and he was saying, one problem is, and he's on a pretty high level team, but he just sees it around the league is it's always like you have to max everybody out. Well, you can't lose them. Well is the guy a max player? Like we had the max zion? Did you or I mean, did you have to? Cause in the NFL you don't have to, and you would not.
And so everyone's making all this money. I don't care who you are. If you're twenty five years old and you're basically guaranteed to get an astronomical amount of money, you're gonna be jaded in the way.
You think about everything. Yeah, we're in football.
It still has this old school meritocracy that if you do not produce within two years. I've seen it forever. It's why when I used to go to Niners camp a lot like I'm not gonna make it too big a deal about a third or fourth round pick, because every year I've seen that fourth round pick. By the time training camp ends, the undrafted free agents beating him out and might even beat out the starter, and all of a sudden, two undrafted free.
Agents are starting. Guys are coming from everywhere.
Every team. I don't care if you're a playoff team or a shitty team, and they're it's kind of like it relates to our life. You gotta produce whatever you do. You either generate revenue, get your job done, or you gotta get replaced. Where I think in basketball and baseball, it's kind of like scholarship. Once you get paid, Like, I can't what am I gonna do with you? Even in football, you're gonna see so many names this week. You're like, God, I thought that guy was under a
long term contract. You're like, yeah, we're thinking about cutting them. If you won't take a pay cut, we'll thinking about trading them. So basically every guy, I mean, we could probably name thirty guys like untouchable in the NFL. A lot of them are quarterbacks, and then a lot of like high level Trent Williams, Travis Kelce, like those type guys. But basically every other name you go half the Pro Bowl roster, You're like, yeah, yeah, they could move on
from that guy. Yep, And I think basketball and baseball used to have an element of that, and definitely their guys were wired. Like working in like local television in the Bay Area and meeting a lot of guys that played in the eighties and nineties, they had that attitude in baseball and basketball. I can be replaced, I could be cut. They were very relatable individuals. It's why Charles Barkley is like one of the biggest TV stars of
all time. He's relatable. I think it's much more difficult for the modern guy in that sport to be relatable because you're making one hundred million dollars guaranteed, whether you're good or bad. No one has a problem when you're good getting paid. But he's like, is this guy, even Jordan Poole's making one hundred thirty million dollars, he's like the worst player in the NBA.
Yeah. Well, and I've talked to a handful of execs and I've brought this up before. They laugh at the NBA structure. They're like, what a joke they make fun NFL guys. I remember having this conversation a couple of years ago when the CTE thing came down, and a lot of these Northeast media types who don't understand the passion for football in the Midwest or college football. They're like, it's the end of the NFL. Like you've been in the Northeast way too long, where baseball still talk about
on sports radio a lot. I'm like, football's not going anywhere. It's way too big to fail. There's way too much money, and they've cleaned it up that nobody hits at practice anymore once the season starts. By the way, you get to the Super Bowl, usually the teams that get to the Super Bowl are missing maybe one starter, like everybody's got the ye I mean, guys are healthy.
Miners and Chiefs were healthy.
Yeah, so there's a you know, the Chiefs a few years ago missing their tackles, and it was like, yeah, that's what happens. But one of the things the structure of the NFL is the structure of most of our lives. You're tradeable, cuttable, fireable. And I never understand fans like this is like we're fans. I look at fans that I just think you guys are out in your mind this idea.
I want my guy to get the bag. Fuck that.
I don't want many players to get the bag because it limits my flexibility. I am always rooting for the team to sign a reasonable contract, so it gives the team flexibility. I mean, I like, Dak's got a three hundred million dollars net worth after his next contract. He's fine, but you're not. You're not fine if you overpay players. But it is interesting. The NFL is the only sport, and I will say the MLS and hockey are the closest. NBA and baseball are a mess that it's like you just I turned.
To a former hockey guy that played fifteen years. I didn't know who he was, but we started BS and he was one of the most relatable individuals I had to google after us.
God, this guy played.
They have a relatability to the way they talk and the way they interact. They're actually I'm like, this guy could have talked to anyone in here and could have got along. It was very impressive.
Yeah, I met a guy at a bar in Naples one time. NHL guy was a Bruin.
I didn't know.
I'm googled them same. But I also think they have a very tight cap and stars get paid. Everybody else makes a good living, not an insane living. And I'm not anti I always said this, I'm not anti players making money. I'm not anti mobility. But in any business, if you're paying B and C employees a money, you're going to have a problem. And I do think and again, I love NBA playoff basketball, I really do. It's one
of my favorite things. But I NFL guys they look executives owners, they look at the NBA and baseball and they just laugh at their structure.
Well, I think one power of the NFL, like you said about a random fan will watch not his team and know their players. I also think because the power listen, we can argue over the franchise tag, whether it's fair or not. It's one of the healthiest things for the business by a mile, because when Kevin Durant or Aaron Judge or Shoheo Tani when they hit free agency, there is no mechanism to keep them, and in those leagues, guys turn over a lot, which is not great for
the league. If I'm the Kansay Chiefs, I would imagine bottom ten market in the NFL. If I want to keep Patrick Mahomes his entire career, or the Packers with Rogers afar I can until I choose to get rid of them healthy for my organization, for the league. The Chiefs were just in a Super Bowl and they're easily now. I would say one of the most recognizable brands in the NFL because of Patrick, and that's not really possible. Like in the NBA, if the Nuggets make the NBA Finals,
it's not great. They would much rather have that Steph Curry or Lebron in the NBA Finals. We're in the NFL. It helps to have the Niners there, but if it had been the Lions, maybe it's not one hundred and twenty What is one hundred and fifteen million.
People still watch the entie. It doesn't impact.
And that's where I think the NFL has dwarfed everyone that they're no longer dependent on markets the brands.
Yeah, that their brands.
Changed by the player, by the quarterback. Who you know, if Josh Allen's healthy is going to be on the bill for fifteen years and it's all.
You like that?
Well, we bring them on a couple of times a year. Ian O'Connor four time New York Times bestseller, twenty time first place winner National Writing Contest New York post. When I have tried to do one on one with Aaron Rodgers, I've said this on the air. I'm not a psychologist, but he pushed back on his parents in religion, he pushed back on authority in Green Bay. He has pushed back on the vaccine. He's pushed back on media. He's pushed back. He's a bit of a contrarian. That maybe
he is, you know, he's our modern day rebel. Is that if you look at his personality, what he does is constantly push back on conventional mandates, conventional wisdom, conventional authority. That's my interpretation. He just pushes back on group think. Now, sometimes group think is correct. I think people should have taken the vaccine if they were older, right, kids, maybe not as much. Is that a fair or reasonable interpretation of what you're discovering? Is that you know, he's never married,
No kids, may not. You know, I don't know if his pet situation. He's really an independent guy. He's wealthy, good looking, older, he's got his worldview. It's a lot like Joe Rogan's. They're both talented, but he basically just pushes back an authority. Maybe one of the reasons he's not married. He doesn't want to conform, and that's his personality, that's his id.
Is that reasonable reasonable? He certainly pushes his back on an awful lot of fronts, and I think growing up in a very strict religious household is certainly part of it, maybe the beginning of when you grow up in a household like that, I think maybe naturally later on, and he goes to Cow, this liberal global institution, people from all over the world, and he's experiencing different cultures and backgrounds and ethnicities and races, and you grew up into
town that was overwhelmingly white, and so I think you start to see it maybe a cal cal Berkeley, and I think he starts pushing back, maybe against the religious upbringing, and that leads to other pushback. I think that's a reasonable interpretation of the journey of his life and where he is right now. And I think that's you know, the one thing about him that I admire, even though I don't agree with with everything he says, is he's
he is pretty fearless. He's not afraid to confront opposition and to say unpopular things and to deal with the consequences of those things. And I think that's an admirable trade. I don't think that he's doing it just for that reason, just to push back. I do think he believes in
what he says. But I think that's a It's a good read on the journey of Aaron Rodgers, and I did ask him some quiescent, for instance, when he said I'd been immunized, and then he got killed for that later on, of course, when it came out that he did not get the vaccine, and he explained why he said what he said, and he was allergic to an ingredient in Maderna and Pfizer and also concerned about the side effects, the reported alleged side effects of the Johnson
and Johnson shot. Is, why didn't you just say that in August of that year when you gave that press conference instead of saying I've been immunized and sort of
misleading people. And I thought his answer to that, which I'd like to save for the book, was very interesting, And because if I were sitting there as a columnist, I don't know how you feel Colin about vaccines and I got vaccinated, but I put myself sort of in the middle on it because I do think it was not quite as effective as it was advertised, and I got COVID twice, and so I said, if you gave that explanation about being allergic and also being concerned about
side effects, I actually I think that's a reasonable explanation. I would have accepted it. Unlike Kyrie Irving, who could not play because of the mandate of New York, you could play with that position. And my biggest problem with Kyrie Irving is what he was doing to his teammates and particularly Kevin Durant, but also to middle and bottom of the roster players whose careers were being affected and could be elevated by winning a championship that they had
no chance of winning with him not playing. So Aaron Rodgers didn't have to deal with that. He was eligible to play with the position of not taking the vaccine. But I think if I were sitting there as a commist and he gave the explanation he gave months later, I would have thought that was reasonable. Yeah.
I view you as a storyteller. I think you're a great American sports storyteller, and that's what I value. Yeah, I mean your books. I've read them all and I can't wait for this. Aaron Rodgers that's a really you know, part of this book writing thing is the topic. I tell people this all the time in my business. You can be the greatest sports talk show host of all time. You choose hockey, I choose football. I win the segment. It doesn't matter how great you are, howeverage I am.
Topic matters, and right now I can't wait to read the Aaron Rodgers book.
I can't. That's a great topic.
I can't because nobody's really done the seminole book on him, because he's been a little bit elusive, he's a little bit prickly. He can be a tab aloof and he's not that giving.
Teammates don't know him.
He's not that giving. So do you know the name for it yet?
Out of the Darkness that, oh my, the mystery Daron Rodgers is sort of the subtitle, but he he has said those words, out of the darkness. I came out of the darkness. It was more last year than I guess this year. But when he went on that darkness retreat and came outside, he still wanted to play. Then he wanted to play for the Jets. And so the idea is to bring light to the mystery of who he is, and so that's why that title was picked.
And so you're not really you're not a huge fan of his as a as a figure right as a personality.
Well, I think I first ballot Hall of Famer would always choose him over Far if I thought he was more efficient and more of a thinking man's player. I consider him like a Rod or Kevin Durant, an all time great talent, not a great leader, a little passive, aggressive. Jeter's more leader, Brady's more leader, and I think there's a there's a distinction between the two. I think Lebron
has leadership quality. Steph Curry does. I think Kawhi Leonard's just great, and so we tend to think quarterbacks all have to be great leaders. Manning certainly was.
He was very.
Confrontational with Jeff Saturday, Brady with a coordinator Mahomes, with a coach that's not Aaron. But I do think he's a fascinating personality. He's a content machine. He's a contrarian, and I appreciate him. I think he suffers from a little bit of that smartest guy in the room disease. Rich single doesn't really have to sacrifice for kids, a family. You know what I mean, Like you when you're married, it's a series of sacrifices. I'm willing to do all
of them. But it's a different lifestyle than Aaron. And I think, you know, Bill Simmons and I have talked about this older richer, handsome, never married. You know, you kind of get into your own you get into your mirror a lot. You are the son the galaxy and the stars, and I think there's a bit of that that's a little over the top. But I respect the hell out of him.
Oh it's interesting because the Jets, the players love him to death, and I think most of them did. In Green Bay, he had two guys, Greg Jennings and Jamichael Finley who had some negative things to say about him and his leadership style and approach over the years. There's really kind of just those two guys, and I had a prominent NFL figure. I used this quote in the book,
but I'll give it to you now. I didn't name the person because he said, listen, I can't stand Aaron Rodgers and everything he stands for, particularly on the vaccine. And this is somebody who's done a lot of business with the packers and the Jets, prominent NFL figure, and he said, but I have to admit, I've never met an NFL player who don't like so in the locker room, He's loved in a lot of corners, and so Hard
Knocks was very good for him. I think it became an Aaron Rodgers infomercial really in terms of how he connected with players, older players, younger players, and how they responded to him. So we'll see, we'll see how the season plays out. I just want him to be healthy. I just want to see the season. I just want to see him make fifteen starts. And I've never I've covered some of his games here and there, but I've never seen a full Aaron Rodgers season. I'd love to
see it in my backyard with the Jets. And if he could win a championship with the Jets, which is unlikely, that would do a tremendous amount for his legacy. I think right now i'd have him fifth all time on the quarterback list. I think he could probably move up to two or three, and with a Super Bowl victory with the Jets, i'd probably put well Brady's one, Mahomes two, Montana three, Peyton Manning four, and I'd have Rogers five, but I think he can move up a step or
two if he went on with the Jets. Yeah, I have.
Brady Mahomes, Montana, Peyton l Way, and then I think you get into the next four or five guys. He's in that discussion.
Absolutely, you have more like seven to eight.
Yeah, I have him more like eight. But I always preferred him over far of who I thought was reckless, not as coachable, was more instinct driven, which I understood John Madden's affection for him. But I like guys who are more kind of buttoned up on script and take the laps and not everything is sort of you know, I'm gonna do it my way. I think that's a very outdated way to play football. Thanks so much for listening. If you've enjoyed the podcast, take a moment, rate and review