Colin Cowherd Podcast - Coach K on Tourney Upsets, NIL Explosion, UConn/San Diego St. Breakdown

win Iowa. Was a cool story. LSU was a deeper, better team, and I also felt much like TCU when they got blown out by Georgia. Remember they expanded so much energy against Michigan and the upset, and then they fell emotionally and physically flat against Georgia. A week later that Iowa came out and it was such a big emotional win over number one South Carolina. They were bound

to be flat and they were plus. LSU was deeper, longer, better, So you know, listen, there's a lot being made of some of the taunting at the end of the game. I've come to terms with over the course of two hours three hours of physical competition. Stuff happens. Coaches say things to reffs that they probably regret, players make moves, talk trash. Maybe they do, maybe they don't regret. But

the right team won. LSU was a deeper, better team, and Caitlin Clark was just a really great player, great story. But I felt like it was a fairly predictable conclusion. I also feel like San Diego State, with a last second win in it will be impossible to duplicate that energy so high after beating Florida Atlantic that they're bound to be a little flat against Yukon. And like LSU and the women's Natty, I think Yukon and the men's Natty will separate about halfway through the first half and

win the game going away. I just think it's really hard to be at TCU football, IOWA women's basketball, of San Diego State College basketball men. When you have these historic, shocking, expansive wins, he just can't duplicate it the next time out a few days later. So I think the Husky is the Yukon Huskies will end up being crown national champions on Monday Night. Something else that we talked about,

we talked about it a couple of times. But Tyler Kepner is a baseball columnist for the New York Times. He's very, very good. In fact, his book is A History of Baseball in Ten Pitches, which I haven't gotten to yet, but I purchased it about a year ago. I'm going to get to it. So I follow him a lot and read his stuff, and he already statistically notice this. Games are now faster in Major League Baseball

two hours forty one minutes, that's the average. Steals are up, more base runners eighty seven point five percent success rate, and more batted balls are turning into hits, all incredibly predictable. Now the diehards, the rigid baseball seamheads will say, well, the game's not better. Remember TV networks pay the freight. They don't care what's better. They care what drives are rating, and long does not generally in sports drive a rating.

Succinct short can help. So you could have a baseball game, but if it's three hours and nine minutes. In two hours and forty minutes, the chances it will be slightly higher rated are with the more succinct, shorter game. And so what you're going to see happen this year. Not that it will be a major renaissance, but you will see an uptick I would imagine in Fox ratings and ESPN ratings based on the brevity of the action. Doesn't matter what's better, what translates to a better rating, what's

more compelling, What can people stay watching longer? The pitch clock speeds the game up, So it's different in football again, it's once a week. It's okay if a sport asks you to hang around for three hours and thirty five minutes. If it's once a week. Baseball, you got five six games a week. You got to speed it up. Can't be a three and a half hour schlog. And so New York Times Tyler Kepner already the pitch clock, the elimination of the defensive shift, are already paying dividends, and

there's no looking back. Baseball sees it. It's exactly what baseball wanted, and it's happening in a week. Here it was another story. I probably like the business side of sports more than you do, but I like it. And one of the cool things about owning this company the volume I can talk about what I want to talk about, and a lot of this stuff I don't talk about on FS one or Premiere Radio. So the WWE has been purchased by a company that had previously purchased the UFC.

Now the WWE and the UFC together will form a separate company. And here's why it's interesting to me. I know Nick con and Dana White, who run the w w E and the UFC respectively. And boxing, because it's been so poorly managed forever, has really wilted and mostly vanished. There are occasional fights I like, but it's just not

consistently delivering entertainment. And I said this years ago and I covered boxing in Vegas, that the UFC took advantage of the scarcity of boxing matches the cost whenever there was a good one. So UFC, whether you like it or not, just delivers a more consistent product. WWE same delivers a more consistent product. And so to combine those two for a new business, to me is utterly fascinating. And I went to the Rustlemania with my son on

Saturday night. At so far I knew I could watch on YouTube TV highlights of the college basketball games, which I did Sunday morning. So the best way to describe eighty thousand people at Rustlemania is if you take yourself or you take life too seriously, you're probably missing the point on Rustlemania. I don't think my son, who's not a big sports fan. You know, he likes to ski, he likes to water ski, anything in the pool he's

good with. You know, he's played a little basketball, a little soccer, a little football, but not really a team sports kid. The environment. I haven't seen him laugh like that. I haven't seen him smile like that for three straight hours. I couldn't tell you when it's just a spectacle. And you know, I watched it as a kid, and then he used to lampoon make fun of wrestling fans. But

then when you have kids, things change. And as a dad, I'm always looking for connecting points with my son, who's very much into science and tech, two things I'm not necessarily into. So I'm always looking for like connecting points.

And so I told him, I said, we're gonna go to this, and I have a feeling you're not going to know all the storylines, but you're just gonna boo and cheer thumbs up, thumbs down, And we got pretty good seats and I gotta tell you it was as good a night as I've had in a long time. And I've said this before. My wife isn't into sport. She loves going to UFC because she likes the spectacle, the crowd, the glamour, the cocktails. My favorite sports to go to for years and years was boxing, but there's

just notn't that many fascinating boxers or boxing matches. So I just found that story at WWE and UFC being combined. I can't wait. My wife and my son's favorite thing to go to and now they've morphed. Can't wait. I want to bring in Mike Shashevski, the legend coach k who, as you know, has retired in the last year and John Shire has taken over that program at Duke. We got a lot of things to talk about. He'll talk about that Yukon basketball team, which I think is going

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it was It's an interesting year. I follow recruiting, so Kentucky Duke, Michigan State, ukon or having very vibrant recruiting years. So I imagine next year the big brands will be back at the top of college basketball, that's my guess. Or or has the transfer portal created a new phenomena where the San Diego States the Florida Atlantics are going forward going to have older players elite transfers. How do you view this wacky kind of unique March madness this year. Well,

I think it's a sign of the times. I think there's going to be a mixture and they're going to be more more really good teams. I'm not sure how many great teams, because to be great, I think you have to be together for a little bit more than one year. And so over the years we've had good recruiting classes and we've been able to try to mesh

them in one year, and then a lot of them go. Well, now when they were talking about one and done, they're about eighteen hundred one and done in the transfer portal. And so now each year in the last few years, so probably be more this year. And so how can people build chemistry in one year? And so the people who go to the transfer portal a lot, they're gonna have to spend time trying to figure out how they

how they developed culture. I just think like when the year started, I said, it's going to be wide open, and I didn't think it would be this while. But it's wide open, and I don't I don't think anything's going to change next year. You know, Um, replacing a legend is hard. I think you did it the right way. You gave it a lot of thought right and john Shire to me, really works. But have you ever thought, okay, because if I'm John Shire, I'm like, okay, I want

to be respectful to coach k and the culture. But what if there's something I really like it really is different than Mike, Like, have you ever thought about replacing you? Is not the easiest thing in the world. Well, I've talked to my wife about it, and that time she said that it wouldn't be that hard. But most of the time she said it would be hard. You know, it's not just picking the right person, but giving the

amount of time that's needed. John was with me for nine years and when he was announced as a head coach, we had a runway of about seventeen months before he ever coached, so he could recruit two classes on his own. In other words, were with them knowing that I'm not going to be the coach, and the develop the relationships that were needed. And I think you saw it this year. He had great relationships with his team and we had an outstanding year. I've always told me, just be you man,

being you. A lot of what you are will be us because we've spent some much time together. But you can't fill someone's shoes. Just be comfortable into shoes you're wearing, and you know our culture and you develop it the way that you think is right. I have all the confidence in the world and John, I am a big fan of new things, but also regulation, be at Wall Street or tech. I am for the transfer portal and NIL.

But there needs to be guardrails, right for everything. It doesn't matter if it's our freeways, our government, Silicon Valley, or college sports. It was a little to me wild wild West. For the first fifteen months, it was just the gold rush. Right. Is there anything you see so far if you could make a change and go, like on the NIL, let's start with the transfer portal, Because the NIL some schools are just not going to partake

in it. But transfer portals here for everybody. Is there anything you would say, hey, let's be very careful of this or maybe alter this. Yeah. I think, first of all, comment both concepts are really good. There were intended consequences that are easy to see. You know, an athlete should be allowed to you to benefit from their name, image and likeness. An athlete should have the opportunity to move

and so okay, that sounds really good. Yeah, But if if it's a business, you say, okay, these are the intended consequences, what would be the unintented In other words, put the guardrails up before you let the horses out, and once once they're out, Like, I don't see how you can control NIL completely. And it's a pre market. Yeah, if you have a better NIL than meet, what are you going to give it up? Is someone going to put a limit? Where do we put a limit on

anybody in our society and how much they make? And so the transfer portal, I think it's been confused a little bit with the extra year of COVID, you see, I mean that combination nil, you add that to it, add that to it, and so you have guys who you know, there are three different schools. You know, they're in a five year year period. I think the average age was a year and a half older this year than it's normally been for college and for college teams.

And the thing that happens too when these kids stay, there are less scholarships for the high school kids. And so that was not an intended consequence, I think. Yeah. I think first of all, we think Congress is going to solve all this. We got to be Rooney Tunes here, and but they the main thing Congress can do is to make it equitable in every state, which it isn't. Transfer portal is equitably nil, it's not. There's some states that don't allow it, and so it's got to be

equal for everybody. And you know my big thing. I wish we could take men's and women's basketball and make it its own entity, just like football is, and be autonomous. Have a certain foundation of rules with the NC double A. But let our two sports, our sport, be run like a business, have a marketing plan, have be autonomous. Football is autonomous. The game of basketball is not. Speaking of

the game of basketball. I just read where the NBA is proposing going forward a positionless all NBA team, which and I remember years ago I worked in Portland. This is a long time ago. Bob witsit with the GM and I remember Bob smart guy saying Colin, you guys in the media get too caught up on positions. I just want good, good, long, fast, twitchy basketball players. I don't care. So Bob was about twenty years ahead of me, right unintended consequence, I do like an old school point

guard who distributes first score second. That's me. I'm probably outdated. What do you make of positionless basketball, or does it Lebron make everybody think it's easy? Or the truth is, positions are pretty good. It's just Lebron's blown it up because he can do anything. Well, you know your love for the point guard. I'm a point guard, so in some essence you have a love for me. But maybe

it's not that big. But the old fashioned point guard just doesn't exist, or it's like an extinct animal right now. You know, really, in the late eighties and early nineties, we started at Duke what I call positionless. I always used to tell my staff and family, Well, this isn't a baseball team. There's not a third baseman they go to a position. Why the heck do we have guards,

forwards and centers? You know, just introduce him as as players and in other words, like you and I are two of the top four players on a team, and we are both the two guard. Am I only going to play one of us? Or am I going to play my four best players? I'm going to play both of us, So why put a limit on us? Saying that you know we're two guards, we're really good basketball players and both of us can shoot. I always like saying that because I wasn't I wasn't referred to as

a good shooter. So that's that analogy. Actually, I feel pretty good about it. Well, you were a defender and you were tough. You had the many of the Chris Paul qualities I like, which is that's where I'm I'm very much about. I like the new basketball. I think it's very very skilled. I covered our vedas a bonus

who was pre Yokich, almost like a point sound. He would have been the greatest player, one of the great if he was here young, yeah, young, like in his early twenties, he would be one of the top five or ten players in the history of the game. Uh yeah, no question about it. You got him later in his probably mid thirties or yes, yeah, yeah, But he was a great player, not a good Oh oh, I mean Mike. He would hit a twenty four footer and he would make a behind the back pass. I got the heavy

footed Arvidas Sabonis. Yes, remarkable player and a fun guy to cover. So do you remember, because really what you you you Nick Saban, it doesn't matter if it's Beheim Mark few your talent accumulators. So what you're doing is you're a and you're finding kids who aren't fully developed emotionally physically. It's very difficult a pro football coach. I get four years of film through college. I know what he can and can't do. You're taking kids. I'm a

late I'm a I blossom late. I think in my career, I think a lot of people do. Um, how often do you see a player and did you know instantly, oh, okay, that person will be a pro now at Duke. I think a lot of people would suggest, oh, it's Duke guys. But you've recruited some three star guys in your career right follow it. How often did you see a lebron Ish player and go okay, that's done? Or do players develop more slowly than most of us think? Yeah, well

there are there are a few. I mean you can see Scion if Grant Hill was in this time, Yes, you know, uh dose players, Uh, Jason Tatum, you know Bagley one, Dell Carter could have probably stayed another year. But now you can see it. But you also you also can see like where their bodies In other words, do they fit the dimensions of an NBA player? Winspan. It's not just height it's wingspan, speed, okay, and then

are they where are they emotionally? We try to recruit kids with good character because they're gonna in order to not just to get there, but to stay, they're gonna have to have balance. And so we're able to see that pretty much with the guards. Like when I saw Tias Jones the first time, I said, Wow, this kid's like a machine. Now he is an old point guard. And when he has his name on that ball, you can't when he throws it, you better catch it because he doesn't want to turn it over. When I saw

him the first time, I said to have him. I didn't know that he would be a pro right away. I felt that he would be a pro after a while. Mike Dunleavy when we recruited him, he saw out of Portland. Yeah, and he was six six and a half one seventy five, had no hair on his chest, did not shave. Three years later he was six to nine and a half and two thirty. And so there's some guys brandon Ingram. When we recruited him, I told his parents they were

going to the McDonald's game. I said, we're not allowed. The first day the pro people will be there. Your son will be a top five draft pick. After the workout and they said, what do you mean. I said, he's got all the dimensions. He's got you. Not only that, but he can play any position. He can be a guard. And so you can see those those type of things and predict them, and some kids you can't. Batty did not fit. He wasn't a great athlete, but after a

while he became. He was intellectually ahead of others. And in today's game, the younger players are not They're more athletic, but they're not as savvy about the game as the players even five years ago. That's something with all the workout guys and that they're great, but they teach you stuff with the ball. And if we're playing a forty minute game in college, if you have the ball three minutes, that's a lot. So you better learn the game without the ball. You got to learn to get your shot

before you get the ball. That's not taught to the level that it used to be. So I think we're getting better athletes, but more undertaught players as far as the game goes. I always love when the Patriots played the Chiefs because I get a chess match between Belichick's brain and Andy Reid's. I love that. I love when they play. Was there a coach and maybe it's a well known coach, it's a Jim Calhoun, Um, it's a Dean Smith. But is there a coach maybe that I

wouldn't think of off the top of my head. That you love the intellectual chess match that he was just move for move. You always knew it was not only between Duke and a team, it was between you and that coach. Yeah, I think that the frequency of the time he competed against Dean Smith, you know, because he you know, he was a remarkable coach and he had immense loyalty from from his players. You know, he really

really wanted a great coaches of any sport. My buddy Jim valvano U the spontaneity of doing anything at any time. There was some predictability with some coaches up to a point, and then there was the unpredictability of like like Jim and uh. But you know, sometimes you play against your coach against the team that you say, I don't know if I can coach a team better than John Becker at Vermont, you know, and who year after year just

produced his that that high level of team. I thought one of my good friends, Fran Dumphy, who got back into college coaching when he was the coach at Penn, he was on a decade movement of just he got it at a high at a high level. But uh, now, I think you weren't from coaching against all different types of people. But those are a few of the ones that made an impact on me. I remember covering I

was a young sportscaster. I was in Denver. Bobby Hurley had about with stomach sickness all yet at that yeah, and so I remember you saying it could have been to me or a group because I was in Vegas as a sportscaster. You and this meant so much to Tark. I can't tell you how much this meant to Tark. You said, we play hard at Duke. I've never seen any team play that hard between Gurgerich and Tark, and I covered Tark. You have no idea. You and Mickey

were very complimentary of him. It meant so much to him, and I was. I look back at your career and I think that's one of your great moments because that team was stocked they so you lost in Denver the following year. One of your stars was a true freshman. You'd been beaten badly by him the year before. There was a psychology there. Go back to the time you beat you and lv If. I said to you, through

or four moments of your career. I remember walking out of that game and thinking, I don't think the media gets what just happened. I thought it was just an incredible moment. You know, I've done I've done a lot of speaking, and since I retired, I did a couple of commercials. I've done some things and one of the statements and one of the commercials has closed the gap. And we were able to close the gap from ninety to ninety one. Grant Hill helped us close that gap,

but also the experience. We were pretty good, but then we got to be really good. And the ninety one semi final Final four game with Vegas, it's one of the epic games in the history of our sport. One I had Jerry Tarkanian were good friends, and I had ultimate respect because anybody who can get his team to pay that hard with that especially that level of talent,

you got to be crazy good. But we were really really good, and I thought what helped us in that game was that it was a semifinal, not the final. They had won forty five in a row, they had beaten us psychologically, we have an advantage, you know, we do have an advantage, and they had destroyed everybody, and no, not beaten, they crushed, crushed everybody. So we got We were talking about if we can get them in the last few minutes. We've been there before, they haven't been

there before. And everyone talks about Latner shot against Kentucky and which they should. But one of the defining moments for me it was Hurley shot with just over two minutes to go. I think they had gone up by five. A Tark went to his amba defense and before I could say anything to call out anything, Hurley comes down and he jacks up at three and he hits it. So for me, I think in possessions two points, there were three two point possessions. His shot knocked it down

to one two point possession. It was really wanted the biggest shots in my you know, for my career that a player took and I didn't call it. I didn't call it, and then we were fortunate we got their guard filed out. Uh you know, and um Greg Anthony and uh Waitner hit some free throws and god bless America. You know, we won a lot of sad people in Sindon City. Believe me, I was a sportscaster there. I want to pivot to Yukon San Diego State. So I had Duke winning. I felt it would be a hard

Brackett hard marks to predict. I didn't think there was a great team. I thought there were a lot of good ones. And then after about three games, I just said on the air, Okay, Yukon's gonna win this thing. This this They're really good. And Hurley the coach had said in January early January, there's a quote he said, you better get us now because we're figuring things out really quick. So I tend to like them over San

Diego State. You've had many classic battles with Yukon, the toughness of the program, their ability to find talent everywhere. You've watched them in this tournament. If watching them from outside, what makes them good and why do you think it took them a while to figure it out? Well, they have a lot of new pieces and and Danny and I are really well, we're really the Hurley family and our family and we're bonded together. Uh you know, to me, uh, to me what they've been able to do. They have

great depth. Okay, and by the way, I hate when people say there are no blue bloods in the final four. You have to be you have to be kidding me. With Jim Calhoun built, you know, one of the great coaches but also maybe the greatest builder of a program. You know, since nineteen ninety nine, they've won four national championship. You know, maybe give them a different color, but certainly they're at the level of all the teams, use of the few teams that you say are blue bloods. And

uh so, what they have is incredible depth. They stay fresh, you know, I've been amazed at their rim protection, their their backup center, how good he is, and their bench. Their bench comes off feeling like they're starters. And I think any coach, if they use eight or nine players in a game, if they can teach and get across to their players that when you're in you're not replacing anybody, You be you and have a starters intellect. I think

all of them have starters intellects. And and they're not afraid. They aren't. They are not afraid, just like they're just like their coach. And I want to commend Danny too, because I've watched him mature as he's always been a good coach. A lot of times he was fighting referees more than the other teams, That's right, he admits that. Yeah, and he's he's changed that, uh completely, but uh, you know, and they could keep it going. Yeah, they know they

have a lot of underclassmen. It'll be interesting to see what happens with the success maybe a national champion. Well, the guys on that team stay, but let's try to win a national championship first. Well, what strikes me is you say Dan Hurley has changed you did with one and done. I think the great coaches in my lifetime Nick Saban. There's a great New York Times article talking about Lane Kiffen, and he and Lane could have battled, but he came to an understanding when Lane was on

his staff, is I can't stop these offenses anymore. Years ago, Alabama was known for linebackers. Now they're known for quarterbacks and wide receivers. The world changed, and you were very good at that where the one and done. I think your talk your comment was well, I started getting beat by him the one and done. We'll take a view to my program. Do you remember the epiphany, Mike, the moment you're in a car, you're talking to Mickey that you just said, Okay, Mike, get over, Mike, I gotta

evolve here. All right. Well, I don't know if there was one moment, but over a period of time, yeah, we stopped. Yeah. Remember in the late nineties, guys could go. We recruited Kobe Bryant, Lebron left, Kevin garn and so we stopped looking like I just did. About a month ago, a conversation with Lebron and he and are very close, and he said, you know, you didn't recruit me, and I said, I knew you were. I wasn't going to get you. And he started laughing. He said, you're right,

And so I had that mentality for a while. And then these guys had to go to college, and I don't know, over a period of time, I said, why aren't we recruiting these guys? But don't these guys are are not different than the guys we recruited. In other words, they got talent they're pretty good academically and they got good character. So really it wasn't it wasn't that we recruited a different kid. We recruited kids that might go or had had a chance a chance to go, And

that was a good decision to make. That was a really good decision to make. Yeah, Stanford admits with some of their best students. If you have an idea, it will beat the diploma. You have to leave early. And I think that to you, you came with an understanding is listen, they're all good kids. Some are just going to be able to leave early. Like that's the world we live in, right, No, you're and you mentioned you know,

Duke is the same way. And there are young men and women here who don't complete their four years because after their sophomore years they're starting a startup company. But where the one or kids and other sports, you know, in tennis or golf or whatever, there were there were kids going early, but because at the spotlight on our program, it appeared that only our guys went early. And now everybody's a one and done that. I love I love how,

I love how how that's changed. Finally, um, before I get the affleck Um, there's a lot of things you're gonna miss. The camaraderie, although you still have that because you have an office. But is there anything that you think, you know, I don't miss blank. Now there's a list of the things I don't. I don't uh, you know, the main think that I don't miss his preparation, you know, the In other words, everybody wants to win, and from Lester, you're an idiot, you know. Do you want to win? Yeah?

I want to win. Somebody says I want Lewis as I'll see you later. I'm want to talk to the person wants to win. And but not as many people prepare to win. You know, I've coached some amazing anal preparers Lebron Kobe Bryant, JJ Reddick, and I was kind of that way. And but also preparing means recruiting and so much time. It wasn't a change to transfer port or whatever. It's just too much time. I'm seventy six year old and you have coached almost fifty years. I

don't miss any of that. And like people say, boy, what the final four? I'm excited for these guys. Yeah, I've been there a lot. One lost and now it's okay to watch it's I'm. The one thing I do miss is the development of a relationship with a young man and uh, I still keep that somewhat with John Shire, you know, even though I'm not at practices, I'm trying to keep away in games so he it's his thing.

But privately we talk many many times and uh and uh I've loved that level of relationship that he and I have and uh and I'll always have that. But yeah, I'm I'm, I'm okay, I'm I'm having I'm busy, I'm happy. I'm doing a lot of speaking all over and anyway, I've been the luckiest guy in the world coaching at West Point Duke in eleven years with the US. You gotta be kidding me, you know, it's been an honor to do all those things. Yeah, I think successful people

have a threat of common threat as they are grateful. Um. Yeah, it's hard. Everything's hard. Parenting is hard, coaching's hard. Life can be hard. Aging is hard. But you're grateful for it. And you can tell I think you'll look great by the way this off the zoom cameras often don't make people look the greatest. You look healthy. I just walked my dog too that I have a new dog, one year old lab. His name's Coached. His name I didn't name him. And we have a lot of lands, so

he's I I love taking him out running around. And we got him at eight pounds and eight weeks at our basketball banquet. He's just over a year old, and now he's eighty two pounds. To the very last, you know, days of my mother's life. A wonderful lady. Her animals give her such incredible joy, and I got that from my mom. We've got Buddy and Yosi and fitting in the cat, and we have a little bit of land in Utah. We got goats and three horses, and there's

just something about the love. It just keeps you young. They made me. Yeah, and like this morning, you know him, we have some streams here and that he'll run through streams. He's jumping and look I got two artificial niece and hips. When he starts doing all that stuff, I said, yeah, I wish I could do a little bit, just a little bit of that. So finally, um, I love that you're doing afflet because I think Stavens really really fun. We see these football coaches we see Mike Kachevski is

very intense, but it's playful. It's fun. I think an athlete gets it and talk about it well. I love doing it with Don Staley. I think she's one of the really great people in our sport. And then I love doing it with Afflet because I really believed in what they're doing. I didn't realize there's such a gap between you know what insurance pace and then the bill and huge amazing. So I got educated. I've been out recruiting too long and I didn't know that. So they said,

you know, we got a goat. We got a duck. It's the Afflack duck, and we got the gap goat. And I said, all right, let's see how that works. I said, but one one stipulation. I'm not going to talk to any animal. Okay, I'm only going to talk to Dawn because I know I'll get it. And the expertise that they put together to put you know, for these commercials there are one hundred and thirty people there. Yeah, like you're doing it over and over again, and and

I laugh with them. I got some street cred from the commercials really, and especially being with Dawn. The Duck and the Gap goat Holy mackerel. Yeah, Well about once a year, you and I get a chat and I've always appreciated um, and you text me from time to time. I always appreciate that. I know you're a very busy person. I learned things every time and I just Mike, it's been a pleasure to cover you in your career and I just want to thank you again. Yeah, thanks a lot.

And by the way, I'd become a big Las Vegas guy. You know, with US, we practice there for eleven years and we go there all the time. And it's ironic, you know, it's ironic that although the first time I coached the US team in an exhibition game there, they did booming all right, even though I was the US coach. But I understand it. I didn't I didn't take it personally. But Vegas, what they've done with Vegas sports wise, it's incredible.

The Final Four will be there and in a short time, and hopefully an NBA team will be there in a short time. Because to any coach, all right, thanks the volume. Make sure to check out the Draymond Green Show. I brought Draymond Green into the volume because one of the more entertaining voices in sports. Unique perspective understands behind the Rope also chops up with guests like Gary Peyton, Zach Levine,

Tracy McGrady. Make sure download The Draymond Green Show wherever you get your podcasts, only on the Volume podcast Network