Dr. Jennifer Ashton on Menopause and Aging Well

Hello Sunshine, Hey, Brightside, besties. Today we're talking to doctor Jen Ashton, ABC news chief medical correspondent and the founder of Agenda, a source for science backed medical information. Doctor Ashton is breaking down everything we need to know about menopause.

It's Tuesday, June fourth.

I am Simone Boyce, I'm Danielle Robe and this is the bright Side from Hello Sunshine. Well, today we're talking about menopause. And there have been a lot of high profile people talking about menopause recently. So when you probably saw the video of Halle Berry shouting I'm in menopause on the steps of the Capitol Yes, I finally realized she wasn't gonna say it, so I thought, Okay, I have to do what no man can do.

I have to say it. I said, I'm in.

Menopas Okay, Okay.

I just love seeing one of the hottest women to walk planet Earth talking about men pause on Capitol Hill.

It's powerful. It's truly an iconic moment, Danielle. And also just this past week, Jennifer Aniston opened up about her experience with menopause. So in The Hollywood Reporter, she spoke about how she wished she had more information before going through it herself. She wished that we were all talking about it more so, Jennifer, we are giving you exactly what you asked for, Okay, to answer all of our burning questions about menopause, We're bringing in another Jennifer, doctor

She has literally been telling me what I need to know since COVID. I started following her career actually during COVID, and I watched so much of her coverage. She was such a voice of reason and I think she gave so many people comfort during that time.

Absolutely.

And the latest is she's actually leaving a at the end of June to focus all of her attention on a brand new venture. It's a new women's wellness company called Agenda. She launched Agenda with this free newsletter that brings a daily dose of health news, wellness tips, and resources straight to your inbox. And she's also about to expand it big time. Into a full digital media company with a lot more content on the way.

Yep, and we're diving into it all and of course chatting menopause, what fitness regimen is best, what symptoms to look out for, and why the best loob may be on your.

Grocery store shelves. It's all coming up.

We'll be right back, y'all. We're back, and we're here with doctor Jen Ashton. Welcome to the bright Side, doctor Ashton.

Thanks, I'm so excited to be here with you.

Guys, Doctor Ashton, you left your position at ABC to launch your new company Agenda. Now, to leave that position means that you must be very passionate about women's health. Where does your commitment to menopause education come from?

Oh my gosh.

Well, first of all, thank you for your kind words, but also for recognizing the magnitude of that career and professional decision that I made, because no one gives up my position, you know, to do something else. And I became a doctor because I wanted to help people and have an impact.

And I never in.

A million years could have expected or dreamt that I would reach millions and millions of people every single day with the insight and analysis and perspective. That has been my job as chief medical correspondent at ABC, and in my mind, you know, the way I'm hardwired is to waigh up every day and face a challenge and continue to push boundaries and move the needle. And for me, I feel that the needle needs to be moved in the fields of women's health and obesity medicine, and that's

Simon and I have been in women's spaces, in particular in the realm of journalism for years, and I think we're both recognizing that the conversation on women's bodies and research over the last few years is finally expanding, I think in large part due to women like you who are making it important to people. Why do you think menopause just hasn't really been talked about in the cultural zeitgeist until the last few years.

Well, first of all, I think we can all do like a standing ovation that it finally is being talked about, and there are a lot of great people that are talking about it today. I just feel lucky to be one of them. There's more than enough room for a lot of people in this space, and so we do need a lot of messengers and good communicators.

But I think that the reason it.

Hasn't had its moment until now, if you really want to know, and I would love to hear your opinions on this, I think it's because of the societal way that, unfortunately women are viewed, which is largely as a passive kind of victim and largely as just a human being with reproductive currency.

Yeah, and the same goes for some non binary folks and trans women too. There are so many factors when it comes to why we haven't felt comfortable talking about menopause. I'm so happy we get to talk about this with you because we want to get into the nitty gritty of the physiological processes that take place during menopause. So what happens to our bodies during menopause and can you break down those systems for us?

Yeah, the short answer is our estrogen and progesterone go right down the toilet and there are literally estrogen and progesterone receptors all over our bodies head to toe, from skin and hair follicles to our brain, to our heart, to literally every organ system. And that can happen very suddenly. It's not like a slow, peaceful, gradual walk off into the sunset. And it can start. It can start in a woman's mid thirties, mid thirties.

And that's perimenopause. Yeah, that's perimenopause.

I'm glad.

I was sitting down for that, doctor Ashton, you had me I talk for.

A living and I was a little speechless.

Well, I heard like a lot of sighing and deep breathing, and I was like, oh my god, are you okay?

And it took me a minute.

I couldn't respond at first. Yeah, I kind of have kids, I know.

And so that's like, there's so much here.

And I think that when you take that physiology and then you put that in an arena or an environment where at baseline we know that women tend to be taken less seriously by physicians. This is just like the medical system and how we deal with women, and by the way, also how we deal with ourselves.

Don't even get me started.

I could give you three examples of my own life where I've dismissed and ignored and denied physical symptoms that I'm having.

And I'm a doctor for con so like, this is just what we do.

And then when you realize the actual physiology, you're like, oh my god.

So you mentioned two key hormones, estrogen and progesterone. Both of them play a pivotal role in reproduction. Can you explain how these hormones factor into the lead up to menopause.

Well, it's complicated, right, It depends on the organ system what the effects are.

But you know, it increases blood flow.

Let's just take estrogen to the skin, right, or to the vagina, to the vaginal mucosa, or to the skin on your face, or to the hair follicles on your head. It brings blood flow to the area and it makes the tissue, whatever tissue you're talking about, stronger, more vibrant. And in terms of the uterus, it stimulates the lining of the uterus to receive a fertilized egg and it does that every single month, right, And then progesterone dilates blood vessels. It's very import to the brain. It's kind

One pound of paunch or it could be ten pounds of punge.

And the part of the reason for that is that their testosterone level is dropping.

Evolutionarily speaking, what's the reason for the paune? Is it to protect the organs?

No, you know, that's a great question. I love the way you're thinking about it. But we have to remember that if you really look back to evolution, women didn't live long enough to go through menopause.

WHOA does that mean that menopause is an adaptation that we developed later on? Like where did menopause itself come from?

Well, I mean, first of all, I am not I always think it's a mark of a good doctor to say what he or she knows and what they don't know, and I'm not an evolutionary biologist. I would love to interview one myself, and I love the way you're thinking about it, because I agree with you it's incredibly cool and interesting to ponder that.

But human beings are.

Among the only species on Earth that go through that stop ovulating and then continue to live a significant.

Span of their life.

Most mammals can reproduce up until the point that they die, Thank God, can't I mean, thanks.

God, literally get a little break there, yeah, I mean, geez, Okay, So anyway, But the other thing, the other flip side of your questioning, which I think is really really important, is that you know, one hundred and one hundred and fifty and two hundred years ago, quite literally, women didn't live past menopause.

Really right now, you could live to one hundred right. My daughter is twenty four years old. Her life expectancy could easily be one hundred right. So for her, if she goes through menopause at fifty, she has half her

I love that framing.

I love that we're going to take a quick break, don't go anywhere.

We're back with doctor Jen Ashton. Let's get into some of the more common symptoms of menopause, Doctor Ashton, How does our body tell us that we're in menopause? What are some of the early signs.

Well, you know, as I used to say to a lot of my patients, the hallmark one is vaginal bleeding. It's menstrual bleeding. And it could be irregular periods, and that could be you know, longer, shorter, more irregular. It could be literally any type of change from your baseline bleeding pattern. Right, that's your hormones. Like holding up a sign saying hello, this is a perimenopausal symptom. And it's so obvious because you're literally going to see it.

Right.

The other ones, though, I think, are they may be more common. They are probably more distressing on some level. I know they were for me personally, and they are are almost always underrecognized, even by other medical professionals. And if you start head to toe that could literally be anxiety, depression, emotional liability, brain.

Fog, headaches.

I mean change in your hair on your head, thinning, more shedding of hair, more breakage of hair, dry eye, dry mouth, like ringing in your ears. I mean it literally could be head to toe musculo skeletal discomfort. The hot flash, which is like the most glorified menopausal symptom, doesn't always mean drenched sweat. Sometimes it's just a feeling of like heat that comes right up from your core and like lasts for a couple of seconds or minutes and then disappears.

You know, I started.

Getting random musculo skeletal aches, and I thought it was just from working out, you know, hard or whatever.

And I didn't connect the dots on my.

Own symptoms until literally like a year ago. And I'm a board certified guynecologist. So I think you can imagine if this starts for a woman in her thirties, there's almost no chance that her main healthcare provider is going to recognize that these could be early perimenopausal symptoms. Can I ask you a personal question, sure, how did you feel when you started going through menopause?

What was running through your mind?

Well? I actually if I hadn't been so busy, I would have thrown myself a menopause party. And I literally mean that because I freaking hated my period so much.

But I'll tell you.

Something that I didn't feel so good about is I started to see literally visual changes in my skin, in my hair, in my body that you know, were not fun to recognize. And I think it required a lot of kind like self dialogue and saying, look, this is the privilege that you're alive and going through this stage. And then I really tried to actively connect the dots between menopause and how I felt when I was pregnant with my children, and I even tried to, you know,

Like this is not pretty.

Did you feel that month nine, right, get this baby out month eight even like I'm done?

Yeah?

And then also what you look like and feel like afterwards, you know, you have to engage in that nice self talk, right like, after you've had a baby, you have to be like, Okay, you know, you just grew a human, like, don't be such a perfect you know like, And I felt I had to draw on a lot of that as I started to go through menopause too.

Positive self talk, reimagining it as a superpower as opposed to a flaw. That's something that's wrong with your body, for sure, Totally we need you to tell it like it is on menopausal sex. Okay, we have come all right, we have come to that point in the conversation, ladies. So I love it. I've heard about vaginal dryness. I've heard that menopause can cause discomfort and also a significant

Well, it's not so much a question, it's more statements, And you hit the nails right on the head. It's a statement of either I have no libido, and usually that's a woman who's been in a monogamous relationship for twenty or twenty five years, to which I say, like, why are you shocked by that? That's not a normal, Like, it's not natural for two human beings to be together for twenty five years. So first of all, recognize that you've already done something that's you know, defies the norm,

Right, So I think the answer to.

That, other than get a divorce or have an affair, is as their work, yeah, right, is to bring something new into the equation, because that's the cure for boredom. Right. So you know, some women find some relief with some testosterone supplementation. There is an FDA approved libido medication for women that gives an additional one satisfying sexual encounter a month. Personally, if that is worth it for you, go for it.

It's almost insulting. It is the vaginal dryness.

We can cure, and we can address whether it's with estrogen, whether it's with vaginal estrogen. I always recommend literally pure from the grocery store aisle cooking oils as lubes because.

Everything else, like like cooking, vegetable oil, canola oil.

Coconut oil, olive oil. You better believe it.

The only thing is be careful of your sheets because obviously it can stain your sheets, but it is safe. And all the other lubricants, literally all of them, with any chemical ingredient is like putting ice on a crapped driveway. It will dry out your vagina ultimately, even if it makes that initial encounter more comfortable, and it doesn't treat the root cause, which is low estrogen, which makes the vagina very sensitive and nonpliable.

Did you know you can use coconut oil as.

Lub I didn't.

I've heard of people using it in their hair. But I have to tell you, doctor Ashton, not once have we been taping this show where Simona and I kind of casually look at each other like.

Whoa, oh, you've blown our minds times over today. Oh good yew our minds, but a mission accomplished.

I want to actually ask about hormone therapy because this is a big topic of conversation around people going through menopause or perimenopause.

Do you recommend it.

Yes, But here's what I want to say about HRT. First of all, I take HRT myself. I think the vast majority of women who are having menopausal symptoms would benefit from hormone replacement therapy. It has been demonized for the last twenty two years erroneously so because of flawed data with the Women's Health Initiative and flawed interpretation of that study that we're still doing the cleanup on and a lot of those initial kind of findings have been retracted or disproven conclusively.

By the way.

So I think that you know, only four percent of women who are suffering with menopausal symptoms in the United States are prescribed hormonal therapy. Four Even if that became forty percent, that would be a huge, huge improvement, right. But there are also non hormonal prescription medications that are great options, and there are complementary medications or products. So it's like a menu of options, and it's not one

I want to pivot into fitness here for a second. I know that you are a fitness girly as well, doctor Ashton, and so I know that there are some thoughts out there on hit workouts and women's bodies, that it's potentially not good for worms bodies. I do it anyways. I do it in moderation. I'm curious if you think that there are any exercises that we should be moving away from in as we're moving towards perimenopause and menopause. How have you shifted your fitness routine.

I love talking about fitness, so I'm so glad you asked about it, and I've learned a lot about it from talking to professional trainers. But yes, women should shift how they work out the closer they get to menopause, but they ideally should start doing that even in their thirties. And what I mean by that is that you know, for so long I only did two types of workouts,

It's lifting weights and lifting heavyweights.

You know, I have the body I have today half because of my genetics and of the other fifty percent, probably forty eight percent of that is because I've lifted weights my entire life.

Yeah, muscle. You prioritize muscle.

Muscle, Yeah, muscle.

And I'm going for strength and I'm going for power and to be vain by the way, which you know we all have our vanity. I certainly have plenty of it. This is a safe space, thank you. My goal is to have big muscles to hold up the creepy skin. So yeah, Like when I go to the gym, I pick up twenty pound dumbbells in each hand. Yeah, and I try to curl them as many times as I can. And maybe that's four each, maybe that's five. I don't really care, but I'm curling twenty pounds in each hand.

I'm with you.

What are your thoughts on the support people receive from family and friends and partners during menopause, because I've heard you talk about how men need to be a part of men.

No pause, Yeah, absolutely, and it's something that has been missing from this conversation so far. I've been wanting to write an article for a long time called Menopause. It actually starts with men Revolutionary.

I need to know what you mean because.

There are crickets when it comes to this conversation that you don't see any male gynecologists talking about it. Okay, there are plenty of them. Why why so quiet?

Great point?

Why so timid? Like you're either for women's health or you're not. This is a big part of women's health. If you're a man and you're an obgyn, why aren't you talking about menopause?

Do you think they feel scared in this environment, like they like it's not their story to tell, And maybe we as women need to support make them feel controversial and empowered to talk about it.

Yes, but again, this can't just be a one sided conversation. This has to be everyone filled the boat, all hands on deck, and not just because that's like smart pr or smart optics, it's the right thing to do.

Can I add one more to the list. Yeah, I'm calling on Hollywood to give us our first menopausal action hero.

Oh interesting, I thought you were gonna say rom com but I like action hero.

I want an action hero because I want to see a strong ass woman who's going through menopause and who is you know, lifting her weights in the gym. I don't know. Maybe she's fighting crime, maybe she's maybe she's fighting all the mail.

Would be amazing.

Yes, Marvel goes menopause. Yes, well, listen, I'm working on that, ladies. I want to tell you because part of agenda is developing television and media context. I will break the story on your podcast, but I am pitching for development. Some both scripted and unscript did in the menopause perimenopause space.

And I'm going to get it done. I mean, I am like, I'm not giving up.

You're the type of person and woman that when they put their minds to something, it happens. So I have no doubt. I'm excited to I'll be at the first screening same.

Okay.

Awesome, awesome, Thank you so much for the education and for talking with us today.

Doctor Ashton.

Oh my god, you guys are great.

You guys are doing really great work, and you're getting not just good answers out to people, but you're asking the right questions, which I think is super cool and super important.

Thank you for saying that.

Doctor Jen Ashton is a physician, Emmy Award winning journalist and the founder of Agenda. You can find her on Instagram at doctor j Ashton. That's it for today's show. We'll be back tomorrow with Kathleen Griffith to talk about entrepreneurship and her new book, Build Like a Woman. Tune into the Brightside on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

Y'all.

I'm Simone Voice. You can find me at simone Voice on Instagram and TikTok.

I'm Danielle Robe on Instagram and TikTok.

That's r O b A.

Y See you tomorrow, folks. Keep looking on the bright side.