Episode 127: Upstairs/Downstairs

the Afterlife with Sandra Shamplain. Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast to Coast AM, employees of Premiere Networks, or their sponsors and associates. We would like to encourage you to do your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself. Hi. I'm Sandra Schamplain. For almost twenty five years, I've been on a journey to

prove the existence of life after death. Each episode will discuss the reasons we now know that our loved ones have survived physical death and so will we. Welcome to Shades of the Afterlife. First, I want to say thank you for listening. Coming from producer Tom. The numbers have

been growing. You guys have been sharing the show I've been receiving dozens of emails from listeners, and so many of you have taken me up on the request to join our Facebook group, which, just to remind you, go to we Don't Die dot com and at the top one of the tabs says facebook group, So join in you can participate. One of the things that I've heard quite often though, is more near death experiences. Yeah. I like them too, really good stories of what people experience

when they cross over, and thankfully they've come back. So today on the show, we have another experience just for you, as you've asked for it. We have Leslie Lupo and she's trained in psychology and NLP, which is neuro linguistic programming. She's also a long time intuitive therapist and she's the author of the book Remember Every Breath is Precious. Hello Leslie, Hello, very honored that you contacted me. Oh, it is my

pleasure of course. Leslie. Can you tell us how you got into this wonderful world and what you know about life after death? It all started in March of eighty eight. I was working at a dude ranch and I was the vice president of operations. At that point. You bounce around a lot between different departments to help whoever's needed, and one of the cowboys was not feeling well, so

I jumped into the wrangling department and helped out. At the end of the day, we were on and saddling waiting for the last two rides to come in, and two horses had snuck out the gate and run down to the hay barn with their saddles on, which is dangerous for the horses. They can get hurt if they roll, and it's a problem. So I ran down to the hay barn with two halters to grab the horses and come up. And I don't know if people know horses, but they're not like on television where they're just so

sweet and like a puppy, especially a large herd. We had like over a hundred horses. But the thing about them is there's never enough food for them. No matter how much you put them up. They will eat to

their fill, but there's still panicky. So everybody's jammed in eating at the end of the day, and I had to try to wiggle between horses to bring them in, and at first I thought it was really lucky because they were standing right next to each other, but as it turned out, it was hard for me to make it through where all the saddle and the stirrups were so at one point I was clucking and poking them, and they just kind of looked at me, like, hey,

you're smaller than me and I'm hungry, and ignored me. At one point, I turned around to try to push myself backwards, and at that moment, my mind, or my consciousness, my soul popped out of my body and stood about

six feet away watching it. I was really shocked. I remember thinking what, but I couldn't even think of words as I watched myself continue to try to wiggle in between those two horses, and all of a sudden, one of the horses on my left me the soul body, not me the person, and the horses screeched and the six or seven horses around me bolted. At that time, I and my right arm went through the stirrup of the horse, and because I was dragging on him when he was trying to run with the other horses, he

first hit me with his head. He kind of headbutted me sideways, which caused me to go crashing into the corner of concrete and metal. The hay Barn and I dropped like a sack of rocks. I'm watching all this with the awareness I didn't feel. I mean, my body was screaming. I didn't feel a thing. I didn't feel any nervousness. I didn't feel any despair. I didn't feel any pain. But it was almost like dispattunately watching it, like wow, you know, like what's going on? And it

just took a few seconds to be over. But I knew I was dead, and I knew it. I mean, there was never a doubt in my mind. Yet my first reaction was to start giggling. I remember thinking, this is it, this is what everyone's so afraid of. I'm still here and I'm still thinking. And I felt such peacefulness and love and freshness. It was kind of like if you could picture taking off a body girdle that's

four sizes too small, how fresh you would feel? Oh, I would imagine, Yeah, Like like you know when you're walking around in a towel after a shower, you feel so fresh. It was almost like every cell had separated and this beautiful breeze was going through and I felt such just peacefulness and completeness and that this is the way it should be, this feeling, and you know, I'm a very curious person. So the first next thing I

thought was, WHOA, what do I look like? So I looked down at myself, and I still in my blue jeans and my boots and everything. And it wasn't see through or anything like that, but I didn't notice. It was almost like this little tiny mist was rising off of me. And the mist was just a little tiny bit of blue and this mist that was rising off of me. The other thing I noticed was how intensely

accurate my vision was. When we were staring at something, we look at the center, and then by the time we get out a few feet on either side into the edges of our periphal vision, it's gone. And that didn't happen. It was as if everything within my peryphool vision was perfectly in focus, and yet it wasn't overwhelming, like too much information. The same thing was sound. I heard every little bird, I've heard every little scurry of a lizard, you know. The horses were chomping again. I

could hear their woofing. Breathfast kind of grabbed the alfalfa. So I just stood there, marveling at everything. And then down by the bottom of the holding ten, I saw the cowboys. Both rides were back, so they opened the gate, and I felt this really sweet nostalgia, like, oh, I know what they were doing. I've done that, you know, Like it was almost like going back to a merry go around and watching children ride on it and remembering how thrilling it was when I was a little that

kind of just happiness. And they came in and they started up, you know, got the guests and closed the gate, started towards the unsaddling part and saw the boss's wife laying face down in the manure, and raced over and I was just a few feet from them, and they flipped me over and started trying to resuscitate me, and no matter how much ice cream, please don't, please don't,

I'm fine. They kept trying, and two of the guests had gotten down, and both we were both doing his CPR together, and one man that was doing the breath kept watching his watch. And then after whatever minutes they said it was six or seven minutes, they stopped and they still couldn't get breath. And the cowboys later told me that my skin was pure gray and my lips were the color of my blue jeans, and one of the men sat back and said, go get Bob. She's gone.

So at that point it was interesting because I began to let go of being in tison. But two son just started to fade. I know a lot of people have talked about feeling like they were lifted up or above. I mean, I wasn't feeling like I was standing on the ground, but just like maybe a foot above. But it's almost as if this world started emerging. Two Sons started fading, and another world came in with true, it

was an oak forest. It was a very thick oak forest, and my impression was, I'm just going to another level. Like I studied energy, and I know the magnetic field and the color spectrum and the sound spectrum, and I felt like I was being moved to a different part of those spectrums, you know, outside what we normally see, because I got the impression that it was just me closing my eyes and waking up and being in a different on a different plane, but in the same area.

And it was a beautiful oak forest, and all of the crisp alertness that I had downstairs is what I call earth, and upstairs is what I call heaven. All that Christmas was a bit gone. I felt like, you know, you wake up a little groggy because you had two glasses of wine and might be both just groggy. You know. I was kind of like trying to get my sea legs, so to speak. And everything was so intensified as far as the beauty and the peacefulness. All I could feel

was this extraordinary level of selfless love. I know that we've had speakers here and Tuson and a few of them had talked about the unconditional love, and for me, I just use a different word because the time that I feel it on earth. If you've ever given someone a present and are opening it up and they look at you and the look in their eyes, you know it was a perfect thing, or like a give a gift like that to a child, and look at the joy they feel. When you know you hit the bulls eye.

We get this rush through our bodies that just makes us feel so alive and loved because it's a selfless gift of giving someone something you know will bring them great joy and that kind of feeling, you know that, that selfless love, And the other thing I was amazed at was it was a very thick forest. Now I live in a forest here in Tucsung. There's not many of them, but for some reason, I have a house here and there's a great deal of shade and shadow.

I noticed that there was no shadows. It was as if I walked up and I was looking at the ferns and the trees and the bushes, and it was as if they were lit from within. And the other thing I can say is this evening, when the sun is setting, go out and put a tree between you and the sun. And when you see the sunlight coming through the leaves, that's maybe ten percent of what it is upstairs, but you get that feeling of how things

are all lit from within. Leslie, we have to take a quick break and when we come back, we'll find out more about your forest. It sounds extraordinary and for those listening, you can check out Leslie Joan Lupo dot com. We'll be back. You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network. Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sanders Champlain and we are with Leslie Lupo as she talks about

her near death experience after being trampled by some horses. Wow, Leslie, you were just talking about being in the most radiant forest with no shadows. What happened next? I kept marveling, like just touching things. I walked over too. There was a little river behind me, so I walked over, and there were box and there was a lovely splashing sound, and I saw some ferns dripping in and these spiky flowers and butterflies, and there were birds flitting around and singing.

And then I turned back. That was to my right. I turned back and I saw over on my left a little opening in the forest and there was a table that kind of looked like lapis Missouli that were blue lappis and chairs around it. And I was watching the table and it was again as if things were still coming through. There was people standing around there, a group of people. So I walked over and everybody greeted me.

And at that point it was really the first time where I got a really strong sense of something familiar, like, wad a minute, I know these people, I know this place. And I sat down. There was eleven other people, and there were five women and six men and there we sat around this big oval table. In the middle of the table or some wavy lines that kind of looked like when you're driving and you see those heat waves. Because they were just wavy, I really couldn't see people

on the other side of the table. I could see just really the people around me. And because they were so I was so groggy. It took me a while to really process. Well, I don't know what a while is. It wasn't as sharp as I was downstairs, where everything was sing being being. I noticed a woman on my right and I recognized her because when I was really, really little, I used to see what I called angels in my bedroom, in the garden and all around me.

Every once in a while, not all the time, but ever once in a while it would almost be like something kind of kept me still, and then I would see this woman was next to me and her name was Mina. It popped in my mind and I wasn't sure if I was remembering it or if it was telepathic. One more thing before that before I saw them me again,

what do I look like? And I had this long dress on and it was a deep, deep Prussian blue and it was very elaborately embroidered with little gold, and I looked my hands looked like babies, you know, like I was maybe twenty years old. It was just very young. And I had big, really large kind of like almost like nickel and border size freckles, just a few, but they were really light. And then I was like touching my Okay, I have short curly hair, short hair. I

like long hair. I was thinking. And so when I walked over the table, everyone was so harmoniously beautifully dressed it they looked like felted wool, or they looked like silk or cottons, beautiful embroideries, and everyone again looked very very young. It looked like college kids, except for their eyes. There was so much soul and wisdom in the eyes. And I looked over on my right there was a gentleman sitting and he had long hair and a beard.

But it was interesting because everyone was so harmoniously dressed by him, and his name was Raoul, and he had this brilliant right ultra violet shirt on, and then he had these pants on that where this kind of garish orangey brown, and I was thinking to myself, well, now wait a minute, you've got all the colors of the universe to work with. Who dressed you? You know, I was thinking, well, man, they must see you know that

even up stairs, I can't dress himself. No, I'm kidding, but well, the funny part is this Rao is actually the arguatic, which I knew nothing about this until actually a couple of months ago. Rao is a planet in Sanskrit, and Mina is pisces in Sanskrit. And on that date I had the accident. Rao was going through Nina, which happens every twenty years. And the other thing, Rao's color is ultra violet and his stone is hessanite garnet, which

is orange brown garnet. So that we finally made tense to me after twenty six years, I figured, oh, okay, that makes sense. But I sat down and Nina and Rao were the only ones that talked to me, and they explained that I had gone down on a mission with my soul group and this was the remnant that had stayed behind. There was ten that were stayed behind originally and twenty went down and I had contracted to come up when I was twenty one with another person

on the sole group. We were just going to come down, shift consciousness and bring in a level of forgiveness and begin to open the door to a huge shift of consciousness. She explained to me that between the years of forty five and sixty five, you know, with a few years on either side, the majority of very very very old salts had come down after the two World Wars to

help shift awareness and bring up consciousness. And I and another Soule group person were supposed to pop back up at twenty one, but she said at the time, right before I was supposed to go, I turned and jumped my contract. She said, that's not a problem. You are a volunteer and they don't mind any amount of help on Earth. But now you have a choice. You didn't contract to have two children. You have two children. You can stay up here. Of that, you know, you do

not have to go back to Earth. However, think of how it will impact the children. They will have no problems either way. But you have a decision to make if you can go down to Earth or you can stay up here. You have to think about this. And so Raoul and I walked around a little and I went to meditate in this cave behind a waterfall, he brought me to a place. He said, this is a

place that you like to go for stillness. And when I went in, there was a very potent light being there and as soon as I walked in, I recognized it to be Jesus. Now, the interesting thing is this accident came at a time in my life when I was basically agnostic, bordering on atheists. I had no interest in spirituality. I was a good person. I was a hard worker, I was a brother, I was a good friend.

I was very science minded. You know, I was not quite a materialist or atheist, but I was definitely not at all interested in any spirituality. I had left that behind due to a tragedy and during college and I just gave up on all that spiritual stuff and just

went into work. And so me seeing someone like Jesus really did surprise me because I wasn't, you know, a fan, but I just had no I mean, I believe Jesus, I believed at that time Jesus existed, etc. But it was really interesting because he had such a strong aura and such a loving aura, and we talked about forgiveness and he actually had me laid down on this cable that was like white. It was beautiful white marble. In fact,

the whole inside of the cave was polished. It looked like it been handcarved and polished, and little like symbols and ledges were put around there. But it was it was actually quite huge. It was probably like forty feet by forty feet. He took a little bowl with white marble and he had I could smell rose and sandalwood, and he put them on all my chakras and he said, we've done a lot of work. We want you to relax.

I'm going to clear some stuff off of you. And so he put them on all my chakras, and then he also put it on my ankles and on my wrists, and we talked a little about forgiveness and self forgiveness, how difficult it is to accomplish what you feel a goal is. When you're working part of a team, you have to be patient, you know and understand that the

goal is emerging, and to be patient. And then I was peaking at him, so he put another big blop on my forehead, my third eye, and we were laughing, and he just told me to rest, and I think I napped, because I do remember closing my eyes, and then when I opened them, he was gone. So I climbed down and Raoul had pointed me out to the village, saying,

go over there when you're done. I walked over, and I walked into this big, huge room, a building you could put an indoor football dome inside the middle of it. It was that large, and the gate the doors were wide open, and I walked in and there were all the walls were covered with these tiny little like a dentist,

old dentist office, those little drawers. Yeah, And so I walked over and I pulled open a couple of the drawers, and I was looking at different scrolls in different books, and again was that memory, like, oh, I could read this. It looked familiar, but I couldn't quite grasp what it was.

And I put them back and I walked along again, and then I saw there were these transepts on either side that were mimicking The room had again huge, all this library, and I got about halfway through and there was this little pedestal that looked like it was made out of bake light, which she's kind of like a white glossy material like the old telephones were made out of big light, but this was white, and another being,

a big, really bright being came up. She was probably if I'm five foot six, she was maybe nine feet tall, and she had this beautiful robe on. It was indigo on the top that kind of went into white, like brilliant white at the at the hem. And she introduced herself, but I didn't catch her name because it was like a melody, and this was very telepathic. I was listening to her, and she said, I only come when I'm called. Will you have a question, And I said, I'm sorry,

I don't understand your name. And she laughed, which sounds like this beautiful laugh, you know, and kind of sounded like little glass chimes. And she then said, on Earth they called me Saraswati. And so she said, what information and what had happened was right before my accident. I felt like I had really like just something had turned off my hope. Leslie. I know you have a lot more to say, but we need to go for a break, so we'll hear more about this incredible woman when we

come back. You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network. Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sanders Champlain and we are with Leslie Lupo, who was trampled by horses and had a near death experience. Leslie, you were just talking very descriptively about your experience in the hereafter and you met a beautiful woman and you said something turned off your hope. Can you tell us more about that?

What had happened was I had come across an article that was written in honor of some anniversary, or maybe the lady was trying to go for an appeal or get out of prison. But the woman had these three little, gorgeous baby girls. And I saw this picture of these three little children. My children were three years old and one years old, and you have all that mummy juice, you know, and you're looking at this beauture. Oh, three

little babies. And then I read the story of this woman who took her children one by one and shopped them because her girlfriends were going out and she couldn't. She was a hype, like eighteen or nineteen, and she had three children already. She had a child every year for three years, and all with different fathers, and she tried to make it like someone to come in, and it knocked me for a loop that a mother could have a visceral connection to these babies and think of

so little of them. And I just felt like, you know, I would have taken those children. One hundred thousand people have taken those children. You could have taken them and just given them up for adoption. And I just felt very frustrated when I read that, and I could feel myself just shut down. And then she explained it to me by saying, you know, again, you have to keep your eye in the big picture, and you don't know,

you know what their karma is to understand that. But at the end of the conversation it was very it was very hopeful. You know. She kept showing me ways to take a breath and keep your eye in the bigger picture. And she also was kind of both during me with just letting me get a feeling of you know, you've got your breath now you can understand that that is sometimes what happens in life. Because I was still going back to how could God let this happen? And

her answer was basically, God didn't let it happen. Humans let it happen, So you can't blame spirit for this. This is showing that there's a lot of things that still need to be fixed. Just to be patient and recognize that not one person is going to change at all.

It's going to be a group effort. And it reminded me of the random acts of kindness, remember when that first started coming out, and she was very very adamant that stopping to let someone in mine if you've got fifty things and they have one, letting them jump ahead of you, or when we're going down from three lanes to one lane. The more polite people are about letting people in the quicker you get through, rather than the people that race ahead and try to shoulder their way

in being polite. Whether they say thank you or not, it is irrelevant. So she kind of reminded me that, and then she also just gave me like the light

around her was so intense. And she also told me this was one of my favorite places to hang out because this was the Hall of Records, and we call it the Akashic Records, but upstairs they called it the Hall of Records, where everything was new or cutting edge was up there, and oh, no, wonder, I like Encyclopedia so much online, and I spent so much time researching new scientific breakthroughs, you know, whether it's physics or magnetic field or biology or health. I'm always reading. I'd like

to keep abreast of what's cutting edge. And so then I finally went out and Mina was waiting for me. So we went over to a smaller building and she said, now we need to decide, and we had a really long talk. And the interesting thing was it was the first time I began to feel tired. When we were walking over. I could feel tired, which I had never felt before. In fact, I had never felt any negative emotion.

I didn't feel fear. And it's interesting how we have it so hardwired in our psyche, with that reptilian or what they call the animal brain, that fight or flight reflex. How totally you know, it's part of our our dynamics. Is a human, yes, And that's zero up there. All you have is all the high, happy, loving parts of you, and all of the fear or conquering or competition or all the negativity envy you know Greek. Oh, they didn't even there was not even a quirk of that in me.

So that was like again, that was so joyful. So we sat down and we talked about a few things. Again. They showed me in that little wavy line like when I first got up. They showed me the accident so I could understand why the horses panicked if they had actually let out the herd boss Montana was his name, And to be the her boss of a hundred horses, you've got to be really cranky and mean and tough. And when they come down, all they have to do

is put their ears back. And he nipped one of the horses, and that was the horse that screeched, and they all scattered like pigeons on a square, you know, just bolt and I just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. And then we talked about my decision whether I would what do I do up here and what will I do back there? And the thing that she said I would do up there was really really fascinating to me because it made a lot of sense from some of the people, so many

of the people I meet as a therapist. What she explained to me was this that throughout the evolution of human as a bodymind, spirit being, there have been very, very very old souls which will incarnate to shift energy

and to be teachers. In other words, you could be going talking to the safe weight who guy who's bagging your groceries, who's never going to stop doing that for his entire career, And he could be an extremely old soul who's having a nice, pleasant life, but he's just here to ground the energy, whereas other people are teachers.

But the thing that's different is those old souls were put into families that supported that, like the Dalai Lama when he was born, the two months found him from astrology predictions and he saw, at the age of seventies, two months walking up, and he ran home and said to his mother, I have to go, you know, he was like six or seven, and his mother supported that, and then he went into a monstery where all he did was learn and train in the spiritual to raise

spiritual consciousness. So Mina said that around the eighteen sixties that the energy had shifted enough on Earth to where they started a new problem, which was a volunteer program. So if you could picture like a bunch of old souls being around condens and ashrams and synagogues and temples and things like that, different mosques, you know, different places of learned people that were spiritually learned. The children would be brought in, or they would be brought into families

that honored that gift of the child. But what they did was they and she showed me kind of a little movie of me doing it, where I had a little tiny light about as big as a half a grain of rice, and I was looking over a map where you could see the light being clusters, and I was putting it right in the middle as far away from any light as I could, so that this older

soul had to come in. And they were talking about They said, it's like we're bringing light into the shape, not like the shadow saw i'd like young talked about, or dark. It was just a place where there was not light, just people that hadn't been exposed to it yet. But they were totally alone at that point. They had

to go inside and find that light within. So they may have been born into aggressive, hateful families, they may have been born into fear based, fundamentalist type families, but they were born into families that did not recognize their soul level and taught them against it. So I call them Houdini kids because Houdini used to be blindfold tied up, put into a bag, and thrown into the ocean. He

had to get himself out. So these beings, these light beings, had to go inside and find that light within them and say, no, this is not right. So for all the children that were born and felt like they landed in the wrong family, that they and not in a superiority way, just like there's no one here for me to talk to about what I'm thinking or feeling, and people tend to squash that out of people. They can

terrify you. I remember asking a priest one time that used to come to our house for dinner about the angels I saw, and he said that they're devils because he just thought I was an overimaginative child. And so he took his water and he blessed it and he sprinkled it on me. He said, now, if you're possessed by the devil, your skin will sizzle. And I was terrified.

I think he just thought I was an overimaginative child, and he wanted to, you know, put the fear of God into me or whatever he was, and I, oh, it worked, and it happened like a week after I had psychically seen a car accident before it happened, and it happened, and then I thought I caused it. So I was very com views, but I shut down. I just shut off anything that had to do with spirit. And now it was about seven or eight when that happened.

So people were born into some of them were very loving families, but they just didn't couldn't teach the PhD level of spiritual not have been in sixth grade in their evolutionary levels, so they had to find their own light with him. I've had so many people in lectures when I'm doing this lecture come up to me and say,

oh my gosh, I always thought it would change. You know, I was looking and then you'll find you know, as soon as you find out, you know, no, I'm okay like You're okay like you, but I'm okay like me. That also brings across the idea that there's many different paths to the top of the mountain. And Buddha said, yeah, so, which is a good thing. Yeah, And I felt very much alone with my thoughts and stuff like that. So yeah, but now you've got your tribe arounds you, don't you.

Hell yeah, yeah, Well I shouldn't say hell, but yes, you are you going to tell me? I have the sneaky suspicion that when you return back to your body it was only minutes that you were out. I don't want to finish up your Your time goes by very quickly. Okay, Yeah, I say that they said I was born. The guests whom it was ten to twelve minutes minimum, probably twelve

to fifteen maximum. That's a long time, Leslie. Well, you know the weird part is is that if I show my cat scams to neurologists like Evan and other neurologists, yeah, I'll look at me and they go, you should be dead, you should be a vegetable, Leslie. We have to take our last break and we'll be back. You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network. Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain and we are with Leslie

Lupo as she shares her near death experience. And Leslie, if you were out from ten to fifteen minutes, you're really lucky to be alive. And I was in the hospital like almost three months. I mean, it was a massive head injury, and you know, I had to go through all that coming back and getting back in my life and figuring out how to organize myself because I left an agnostic and came back going Okay, I got to go back to the light. I can't ignore it anymore.

You know, do you remember making the choice that you wanted to come back and be with your kids? And yes, yes, we talked about it both ways. And the funny part was once I said, you know, I looked at my children, they showed me my children, They showed me the things that would do down here. I'd go back into my psychology background, which is what I did. But you know when I finally said yes, then they started to stop me and they go on, now, wait a minute, it's

going to be really, really difficult. You're going to have a few years in which you are going to have to be very isolated. You know, you're going to have to integrate this. And I'm thinking a few years. What's a few years? I mean you're up in infinity with a couple of years, you know. And then I made the decision. And then finally I came and I went into a room in which I was seated, and then I felt like I was being compressed, like I was

being squished into a sausage casing. And Raoul was with me, and I guessed, and he stopped the process and he said, remember, you don't have to go back. You can stay here. And I looked at him, and then I thought of my children again, and I thought now and what I could do to help down here with bringing hope, which was my next mission. And I said, no, I can do that. I'll go back. And that's when he said to me, remember every breath is precious. And then I

just went clunk and hit the ground. What I find interesting, too, Leslie, is that your soul stepped out of your body before the accident happened, is what he made it sound like. Which is that right? Yes? But you know what's interesting is I used to work in a nursing home when I first got out of college. I had a psych degree in me during in gerontology, and there were no hospices there. There were so many people. When we would call them and say your mother and your father's dying,

they would say, call me when it's over. And my motto was, no one dies alone. On my watch, so I would go in and sit with them, and I saw that time and time and time again where the soul would leave even though the people were talking. It was almost like I could sense it standing there, joyful and very happy as the body was dying. And sometimes it would be two to three minutes. One lady was

about either nine minutes before I could sense that. And even my father died in my arms and my brother's arms. He had fallen and we were holding him, and I saw his soul jump out and I said, he's dying, don't pick him up. And Tommy looked at me and said he's still talking and said, no, if he's over there, And then like another minute later, my dad passed. So I think that the soul. I'm not going to say every time, but I'm wondering how often that happens, where

the person pops out before the accident. Yeah. I like the sound of that. Only after witnessing how my dad died of cancer and someone had said to me, it's you know, because I witnessed incredible suffering and somebody just said, you know, it's possible his soul left the body even though he seems to be, you know, moving in pain and all that stuff. I was screaming. I was screaming my body. I shouldn't say I, because I was watching it. I in my body, and Leslie was screaming bloody murder

and getting trampled and smashed in fighting, you know. So it wasn't like it was like I was doped up out there. I watched me be brutally run over. But like I said, it was dispassionate. I couldn't witness something like that in this incarnate and have such objectivity. It wasn't like, oh well, it doesn't count. There was no It was like understanding. It's like you get this immortal soul understanding of this bigger picture, and it's just part

of letting go. You know. The other thing that I just remembered, which I thought was odd, was I was asked when we were talking about the second time we sat down, Mina and Raoul had asked me, do you want to remember this or do you want to not remember this? Oh? He said that with the trajectory that I was going the life I was going to go into, they advised me to do it, but they also gave me the choice of remembering or not. And we talked

about it, and I chose to do it. So I'm wondering how many people that maybe don't remember were given that choice. Interesting, Yeah, there's lots of people. Even my sister met someone who died on an operating table but didn't have any experience of seeing the light or seeing relatives or whatever. And maybe maybe it's possible that we do get a choice to remember or not remember. Huh. Very interesting. Now, how about being psychic? Did you find

that after you healed? I mean, if you went into this being borderline atheists, even though you had these things happen as a kid, that you know you had it in there. Something must have been magnified that you decided to go into this as a career or make it part of your career. Well, the thing is, the first time I shut off my intuition or my psychic party you can shut off, was when I had that priestom, that accident when I was seven or eight. The second time was when I was supposed to die when I

was twenty one. I was supposed to be with my fiance. We were getting married in August. It was like a picture perfect love at first sight love and I was supposed to be with him in Albuquerque, and at the very about ten days before he died, I got very restless, and I wanted to go back to Chicago and earn as much money as I could for school. And he kept saying to me that he had premonitions that he was going to die and begged me to stay. And

he wasn't full of game. And here I am working in psychology and college, but off campus, I had a wick and high priesis. I had two medicine people and a West African shaman who I was doing apprenticeships with wow opening up and I was supposedly I mean, I say that, but because I didn't feel like it. I was very psychic, and I was working with Tara and numerology and you know, herbs and ceremony and energy and all the stuff. And I didn't feel anything like that

in Sean's aura. And I kept teasing him and saying I was going to rub his words, his nose and his words when I got back at the end of August. In fact, he called me two days before he died and begged me to come back. And it was midnight because I was working two jobs and that's the only time he could get me, and he wouldn't hang up, and I hung up, and then two days later he dies, you know, and it was like I just went on

such a tailspin. But then when I was upstairs, that made sense because he and I had come down from the same soul group to help facilitate. We had contracted to leave when I was twenty one, and I didn't go at the last second, decided to jump my contract and stay on Earth, and so all those things kind

of made sense to me. But when he died, it devastated me, and I remember I kind of took it out on one of my teachers when I came back, because I went down to rent like a five hours we talked and I kept saying to her, how could I not see this? How could you not see this? How could you knew him? You know? How could nobody

see this? He knew it? And she tried to explain it to me, and I stayed with her another month, working with her, but at the end of the day, I just walked away from it and said, it's a bunch of you know, Coolly, it's a bunch of It's a lie. I was faking it, or I was not faking it, but I was lying to myself, you know, the power of suggestion. Oh yes, I went back into science at that point, and that was when I was

twenty one. And then when I was thirty six is when I got run over and I went back into spirit. At that point, spend a lot of time in India trying to integrate human and spirit in my brain, and just did a lot of soul searching and meditation. Wow. Thanks so much for sharing that, Leslie. We are coming to the end of our time together. Do you have

any closing words for us? It's really recognizing. One of the things that always helps me is when I look at the bigger picture and watching the news and seeing the horrific things that happened, I always go back to the day I was born and I look at the shifts of consciousness that it happened since my birth. And there's many and there's another there's certain different web pages online that have optimistic news and their business people. They're

not like but they show all the positive things. Look at the whole picture, don't despare over the small percentage of negativity. That's why one of the things I do is I always do a world consciousness. You know, what's going on all over because the good guys don't get the headlines. No, I agree. I always thought there should be GNN, the Good News Network. In fact, there probably is. There's so much good that's happening in the world, and no matter what we focus our attention on, we're going

to find it. So if we're looking for negative, yes we're going to find it. But if we're looking for positive, we are going to find it. If we look at the people in our life, we can easily pick them apart, or we can just look at all their beautiful qualities and know that they're doing the very best job they can with what they have. What a great time this was talking to Leslie and for you our listeners. Just a reminder we have lots of stuff going on online

these days. Ever since so the virus hit the world in the beginning part of twenty twenty, we moved so many things online. In fact, the beginning of every month we start medium classes, psychic classes, something called the Way to Your Spirit, which is just a real nice journey for your soul and for you to make the most of your life. We have tramps in the Altered States on Mondays where we can close our eyes and blend

with the energies where our loved ones live. Very special and of course on Sundays we offer a free Sunday gathering and it's really inspirational, positive, fun funny, and there's a medium demonstration included in each and everyone. Our home base is We Don't Die dot com. As we Don't Die it's the name of my book. You can join our Facebook group, you can go to our Sunday gathering,

you can join a class. Everything we offer as money back guarantee, guaranteed to put a smile on your face and love in your heart, knowing yourself as an eternal soul having a human experience. So I'm Sanders Champlain and thank you for listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast, a paranormal podcast network. Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

Day and Paranormal podcast network. Make sure and check out all our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going to iHeartRadio dot com.