Men's Mental Health Crisis?

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So be sure that you check it out at least. we're also on YouTube. So make sure if you're not watching this on YouTube, We do have the video version of this podcast also now available on YouTube. We post shorts there as well. All right, and without further ado, today we are going to be talking about men's mental health, but probably not in the way you think, so hang tight. And before we do that, let's have some tea.

I actually have some. Well there's a lot, it's been a lot going on ladies, but I think my favorite piece of tea from the past couple of weeks that I don't think we've mentioned yet is the uh falling birth rate. Sovereign was just talking about this off air So they just did a survey of a nationally representative group of like over 40,000 women aged 15 to 44 about a broad range of fertility related indicators.

Finding showed that there was a little change during that time in the proportion of women who said they intended to have children. So on average, 62 % of women said they intended to have a child and 35 % did not intend with only a small percentage saying they didn't know. But up to 50 % of the women who intended to have children said they were only somewhat sure or not at all sure that they would actually realize their intention to have a child.

Women who had higher levels of income and education were slightly more likely to say that they were very sure they would have a child than those with less education and income. But even those with a bachelor's degree they were very sure they will have more children. declined from 65 % in 2014 to 54 % in 2018.

They also figured out that the intensity of desire has definitely dropped that to 25 % of childless women who intended to have children also said they would not be bothered if they ended up not having a child. which is what I love, I mean I really think that speaks to the whole decentering movement, like decentering marriage, men, children, all of these things has been really really paying off. So well done ladies, like good job everybody, round of freaking applause.

just love this because I think it speaks to women realizing that a lot of this is like a fairy tale and like a happily ever after, but nobody really gives a shit about you once you have the child. they're just happy that there's gonna be another cog in the machine somewhere, you know, working for Jeff Bezos or whatever. Like he's happy to have another truck driver, you know what I mean? But other than that, nobody really cares, like. And then they'll blame you for needing help.

Yeah. Yeah, I think it's, you know, like I the financial aspect of it was also pretty clear that a lot of women were like, with what money? Like, I want to have a kid, but with what money? Like. Just one stroll down the baby aisle is enough birth control for me to last a lifetime because how is anybody affording this? And also, they keep baby formula locked up in Target and other stores, even Walmart. They'll lock powder baby formula and the little baby food jars and some diapers.

about money than children being able to eat. And who wants to be treated like a criminal for trying to buy supplies for their baby? It's just... lot of people are just coming where they were coming in and just stealing that stuff. And so the thing with Walmart is they whenever you see something locked up behind like the glass cabinets, those are the most stolen items or most stolen oh merchandise.

So the thing that they lose the most money on because people come in here and steal, they lock it behind because they don't have everything locked behind glass, but they just have certain stuff. And the baby formula and diapers are my be ashamed of themselves for locking that stuff up. I'm sorry, like I just don't care. Like lobby the government, be like, listen, people need assistance. They're stealing from our stores. You know what I mean?

Instead you just lock it up and then you're like, no, but women should have more children because Walmart's gonna need employees. Like, man, fuck you. Give out that formula for free. From a business standpoint, I get why they're locking it up. If they didn't lock it up, they would get zero profits Their profits are already off the charts. it's and some of that is insured. even if, know, like they have, you know, insurance packages for theft.

So if a certain amount gets stolen, they get reimbursed for that through their insurance. Most businesses and most corporations especially have that bit of reassurance on them. that way, like they're not out, tens of thousands of dollars and like, and some of the things and it's baby formula. lost on us. Like that's crazy. That's babies need that to survive. if I saw a woman stealing baby formula or like, you know, baby jars, I'm legally blind. I... Mm-hmm. Yeah. Exactly.

No, seriously, let me like pretend to have like a heart attack and just... So you can slip out. Mm-hmm. What do they even make baby formula out of? I always wondered that. Like, what is it? It's certain minerals and certain bits of kind of like a grain that's like pressed to a fine, fine powder, if I'm not mistaken. uh That's what I think about, you know, with semelac, it could be different. Like it's because breast milk is very dense, like nutrition wise.

And so you can't just give babies like, you know, cow's milk or something. It doesn't have the nutrients that they need. And so formula is supposed to kind of make up for that. And it's like, as long as your baby is eating, it is what it But are you wondering if there's any way to just make it yourself at home? I wonder that. um stealing it, probably not. You probably wouldn't be able to afford, you know, the ingredients separately. Yeah. I've always known.

put it in the chats below on YouTube if you're, you know, commenting. Is there a way make it at I get it. I totally get it.

Like that looks like that shit hurts. Like clogged ducts. my God. Some people have to go to like hospitals for that because they can't unclog it. Yes. Oh cause like, you know, some of these women, they only get what four weeks off of for maternity leave. And that's definitely not enough, you know, time. And also they don't provide women facilities to be able to pump their own breast milk. women would more often than not choose formula.

remember when I was like 18 and one of my coworkers at the time was having a baby. And when she had the baby and she came back to work, she would have to go pump in the supply closet at the community college. Like. What the fuck? That's crazy. in some schools, like my school, it offers facilities for expecting mothers or mothers who are, you know, breastfeeding.

So they have like these little private rooms and they're like air conditioned and like you have space and you have privacy curtains and things like that. And it's woman ran and it's student, you know, led. And so it's, I'm glad that that's available to us. And it's just because my school doesn't have a sports department. all that money gets. uh look at that. Yeah. Yeah. Look at that. recommend it.

Yeah, when I was in nursing school, there was this one girl and shout out to you, Dee, I ain't gonna say her name, but she had a baby and literally two days later she was right back in clinicals. Title IX or whatever it was, I didn't know much about Title IX until her in nursing school, it's like basically women have the right to breastfeed, We were in the hospitals doing clinicals, so they had to find places for her to go like pump or stuff like that.

So I was like, my God, that is a lot to deal with. But shout out to her because she was, when I tell you that woman was so strong and resilient, she had a baby and was back in class the next day. to mothers everywhere. Really.

crazy and that should not be the standard that should not be the expectation that's just absolutely wild because I also screenshotted a comment on this article that I was reading from and Somebody said um, I always find it interesting that the actual physical experience of gestating and birthing a child Is never a part of the birth rate conversation i'm pregnant with a very wanted child and even with a loving husband and financial security It is a torture I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.

And I haven't even gotten to the stage yet where I'm supposed to be happy about being mildly crippled by birth injuries. My own mother had three perfect births and was still having yearly surgeries to correct spinal and urological injuries more than a decade after she finished having the people decrying childless women think growing another person is easy? Or do they just think that it's something women owe to society by nature of being born female?

Both. Like, and I, and you know what, when I was younger, I used to think, cause I always felt like having kids was just this terrible thing. But then there was a part of me because growing up in religion, it's like, okay, well, but I guess God made it to where. if women can have babies, if we can literally go through this process, then that must be what it's for. That must be, you know I mean?

And so as a child, I remember thinking, I still don't wanna do it, but it's gotta be something to it if everybody is constantly doing it. they complain, yeah, they complain, but then they'll turn around and have a fourth or a fifth child. So I was thinking, maybe there's just something to this that I'm not paying attention to. So. not.

me thinking that as a child, there are grown people, because I damn sure don't think that no more, there are grown people who really believe, well, mean, this, you have a uterus. This is, this is your life's purpose. You're supposed to have a baby. Oh, all the so-called pregnancy pains and suffering and the contractions. Oh, y'all just be over exaggerated. It's not that big of a deal.

Like people really do believe that they really believe, especially men, if they can't, if they can't feel it themselves, if they can't feel it themselves and it's not happening. I guess they better figure out how to pop out them babies. And quick.

think that it's all part of the process and you're supposed to be unhappy, you're supposed to be uncomfortable, you're supposed to be in pain and there's not anything that they can do about it even though that's mostly disproven because there are very involved and loving fathers and that they sit up with the mother while she's breastfeeding or if the child wakes up in the middle of the night, he wakes up too and holds her hand essentially through the process.

So they're waking up together instead of, know, like, I have to work. So it's up to you to take care of the baby.

Like, hundred. not gonna no told Ashanti he's not getting up in the middle the Wait, oh, Nellie, Nellie, yeah no. That's the, yeah no. i love when men say that like i have to work so i can't get up with the baby as if what the mother is doing with the baby all day is like rest That's her duty. Her duty is to be at home with the baby. work. So like, we're both working though. So we both should be waking up in the middle of the night. And if you don't wake up, I will make sure you wake up.

he said it's a blessing that he can sleep through his baby screaming in the middle of the night. And the funniest part about it, that's how most of them think. Stop. a Slavic woman you know exactly what I'm talking about a frying pan with my skavodka and I would just pick that shit up and Use it to wake him up. However, It's come scovet or okay Yeah Yes, and it's like a very common like one.

It's a very common joke trope in Slavic TV sitcoms where the husband comes home from work or he comes home drunk or something and the wife is waiting up for him with a frying pan and the whole joke is like, yeah, she's gonna kick your ass with that frying and she just starts beating him over the head with it. That's our joke. Skerro-tof. Did I say that right?

bros, when I think pass, when I, that's why when I think about passport bros, they hardly ever, you know, hear about them going to, you know, Eastern Europe, they usually go to like Southeast Asia or South Asia. They would, yeah, because they know Eastern European women, don't play, like they'll beat you. Yeah. And like also South America and Central America, those places. It's disgusting.

I think we should have an episode about that, actually, Passport Bros, because, oh, there's a lot we could talk about. So much. I think it's on the list. I don't I don't remember why we didn't. the male loneliness epidemic a little bit just because they go over there and they don't get what they thought they were gonna get and so now they're even more confused and lonely and angry because yeah, it's so funny to me.

yeah, but now they're getting better at this because now it's more organized because they have discord servers dedicated to this and they have uh Reddit threads, subreddits dedicated to the passport bro scheme. to go take advantage of disadvantaged women and little girls. That's literally, they're doing all of that just so they like sex tourism. Like it is just so disgusting. but what they're finding out is that a lot of these countries have since developed since the 2000.

So all of these places that they thought that they could go to a lot of those women have raised their standards and have had a lot more autonomy and a lot more rights, I guess. And so when they get to these countries and after having this outdated advice, they get shook.

And it's so funny reading those comments, like, especially for, Vietnam, like these men used to go to Vietnam and they still kind of do like some of these rural areas are still, you know, hit or miss, the places that they would frequent in Vietnam are now no longer the same as they were in like the 90s or even 80s. it's like all of that has had upward mobility and yeah, and women participating more in that workforce over there as far as I know.

So they're more likely to say no and just be like, you know, what the fuck is this old man doing talking to me? Like, and I'm happy for them. I'm happy for my Southeast Asian sisters down there who are, growing in that aspect of gaining autonomy and rights and the ability to say no and have less pressure on you. We will always rise up, ladies. We we really, really will. And yeah. Yes, they can only win. That's what I'm saying. They can only win when women are so, so, so disadvantaged.

that is the only time that they can actually and what they're doing is preying on these women. And they know this. They know this. because they're like, well, these Western women have high standards. Yeah, so you can't prey on them as easily. You can't you know, manipulate them with money or withholding resources or whatever. which is the patriarchy, the male loneliness epidemic. They're becoming increasingly more lonely because women have rights.

We have our... uh somewhat power back to some degree. We can work and take care of ourselves. And the only way they were able to thrive and be on quote unquote top this whole time was because we were disadvantaged. Our rights were taken away. We couldn't own anything. We couldn't do anything. And so they're seeing now it's the same thing over there. Those women, especially with social media and they're able to get online and see like the way other women are living in other places.

They didn't have all of that before. None of us had all of that before where we were able to see what was actually happening. other places. So women become empowered when you can see other women. Yeah, and we can share stories. to the childless epidemic as well. And I love the connections you're making to the male loneliness epidemic here. And before we jump into that, I know I spoke earlier about some of our VIP perks that we have available.

And today I'll get to actually witness one of them because we have tea from one of our tea VIPs. You tea to the table today. So let's see what it's all about. my god, that's so That's a very good point. I think women more often than not, they listen to true crime stories like this to, guess, in some way learn from it and, you know, learn what not to do and learn, you know, what may have worked and maybe what didn't work.

so in order to have more, I guess, methods, yes, the survival thing, it's these are, you know, unlocking new methods of protection for us and be like, see, she did this, this and this. So if I don't do that, then I'll have a different outcome, even though It's hit or miss with some of these. that connection before, but that is so true. accountability that we don't deserve. Like we why the fuck is it our accountability? I cannot believe we have to share a planet with these troglodytes.

Like this is crazy. This is degenerate behavior. Before I say that, is that like a slur of some kind? Is that was that used? OK. good. So, yeah. It's one of those evolution thing. So they have like the... It would be like a monkey, a Humonculus or something, and then Troglodyte, and Human, or... And then just go up from there, and Troglodyte is like one of the ones in between. But yeah.

It's it just it means like knuckle-draggers because like I think in the picture they were tracking their knuckles So it's in between like I think a monkey and caveman if I remember correctly men. The first time I ever heard that word was watching That's For Housewives and Bre VandeKamp said, she's such a troglodyte. And I was like, what the hell is that? my god not about a woman Aww. about, I'm pretty sure it was a woman. Somebody had a party or something.

I can't remember, but I just remember thinking, what? I was like, what is that word? my God, it was so funny. I know, I know. She evolved a lot. Yeah, I just I love that, TV IP that we keep them anonymous for safety reasons, but I love that she's bringing up that. some women kind of rightfully have like an aversion to this stuff or like some people are like Why are women so weird about like true crime?

They love true crime and it's like not only is it kind of like valid, know Obviously like Gwen said some women are just using it to be like well What can I do if that situation happens to me? Which is horrifying like that it like we need to stop and think about that Like there should be like a like a minute long pause in the podcast after this so that everybody can just sit there with this fact and really think about it.

Sit there alone with that and be like, women are using true crime podcasts as safety tips. And we're all just letting that, we're all just, we're okay with that as a society. I don't know if anybody's been watching the train wreck series too on Netflix and they have all these different train wrecks. uh basically of like events that got like blown out of proportion or like stuff went horribly wrong. There's one about the poop crews. I don't know if people remember that, right?

They have like a deep dive on that. And I think other than that one, which was probably still a man's fault, they are literally all of these train wrecks are caused by men. Like it's men leading society off a cliff. Like it's men committing these. true crimes, right? And I heard somebody talking about it and they said that women are just not arrogant enough to think that they can get away with it.

it's men commit these things because they're so delusional to the point of committing a crime and being like, no, I'll probably get away with it. I'm so smart. And then when you see the steps that they've taken to try to cover it up and they still get caught, it's like you're still an idiot at the end of the day. Like that Brian Laundrie guy, like, OK, like you you ran back to like your parent, your mom helped you hide or whatever. Like. It's crazy. It's absolutely crazy. Boy, yeah, clearly.

Yeah, but yeah, all this is, yeah, just when I listen to some of these true crime stories, a lot of this, when the parents help, a lot of it, I think it's the boy mom syndrome thing. Like it just, ugh, it's so heart wrenching. Cause gosh, like that girl was still your daughter-in-law in some cases and you still, it still just wasn't enough. uh always gonna be not my son at the end of the day. It doesn't matter. If you are dealing with a mama's boy and a boy mom, you are nothing.

When she has to choose between him and you, she's always gonna choose her son no matter what. my God. we talk about the patriarchy because all of these things wouldn't be possible, right? The incompetence of the police wouldn't be possible. You know, like again, with the Brian Laundrie, Gabby Petito example, when she called the cops to report DV, the cops accused her of it because her abuser was calm and she was the one that was freaking the fuck out, you know, and like trying to tell them.

And they were like, yeah, it seems like you're abusing him actually because he was able to. And then she died at his hands like. The incompetent police officers that have that attitude, they beat their wives. So that's the reason why they don't see a problem with it. They'll sit there and they'll have a straight face. They don't really, they don't have any emotion. They don't really care. They're like, wait, what happened? okay, well, here's my card. know, here, this out.

And they'll just throw you a pamphlet. Like, they don't care. Yeah, because a lot of them beat their wives. A lot of them see themselves in these criminals, judges, male judges as well. That's why they get lighter sentences because they're like, well, what did the woman do? She's beat to a bloody pulp and their first thought is, what did you do? And sometimes... rational guy. seem like, you know, somebody I could, I could, they, they, they humanize the abuser. Johnny Depp versus Amber Heard.

People completely ignored all the evidence against him, like, you know, assaulting her with a wine bottle, which is insane behavior, um talking about how he wants to drown her, talking about her dead body and things like that. And people were like, yeah, she's the abuser because she was mean to him. And corporations dogpiled on this too.

Like it was something I've never seen before, but like corporations on Twitter were going out of their way to tweet, you know, misogynistic things and taking Johnny Depp's side. Like this was some PR just dogpile on that poor woman. Like everybody, literally everybody was out to get poor Amber Heard came out, wasn't she like one of Hollywood's it girls and she was just so beautiful and everybody just revered her?

That's proof that it doesn't matter who you are or how beautiful you are, you are not going to win at patriarchy. That is proof. Anytime you come out about your story or tell the truth about the abuse you suffered or whatever, they are always going to side with the man. They are always going to side. Johnny Depp? Oh, Johnny Depp is this A-list celebrity in Hollywood. There's no way he could ever do that. And Johnny Depp can have any woman he wants.

Yeah. And that's how people treat all, and it's always the same. It's always the same. So let that be a lesson though, unfortunately, for pick me women who thinks that they're gonna win that patriarchy. You're not. You're not. This is why we need to all stick together. That's the final boss. You're never going to beat that final boss. You really never will. And it sucks.

That's why we need to like crumble the patriarchy rather than, just complying with it or or, Do you think the male loneliness epidemic as it gets worse, because it's gonna get worse, do you think that that's going to, initially they will try their hardest to make the patriarchy stronger because they're going through an extinction burst, but do you think it has the potential to crumble the patriarchy after there are no women participating?

Well, of course there's gonna always be women participating, but when the numbers of women constantly go down and down and down. It's like, to me, that's what it will take for, to begin crumbling the patriarchy. It's already started to crumble, but you know, we still have a long ways to go. A long ways to go. There's a lot of barriers we have to break down. is a fantastic segue into our main segment.

So let's take a little break and we'll come right back and we'll jump right back in where we left off. And we're back.

Let's talk about men's mental health. And I just want to before we get into it at all, I want to make two distinctions here. uh Number one is that men's mental health is not women's concern. We are already carrying all of the emotional labor basically of society. We are already dealing with men's mental health like on an individual level, very much so.

We are already expected to care and worry about men's mental health on like an individual level with women and you know most husbands, most sons, most fathers. require a lot of emotional labor on the women's part that are in their life. And so we are not here at all to rest this burden on women whatsoever. Okay. the other thing about men's mental health is that it essentially and ultimately goes back to the model of masculinity that it's men that won't let go of.

so when sovereign was saying earlier that would this like male loneliness epidemic slash men's mental health crisis, does that really have the power to crumble the patriarchy? Well, there's like a litany of answers to that, right? So first of all, not if they force women to share our presence and our bodies and our all that emotional labor with men outside of our own consent just to survive. So not if they do that, that will only strengthen the patriarchy.

If women are deprived of rights, I mean the more rights that women are deprived of, it forces us to depend on men which fortifies the patriarchy. So if that happens then no. I think the only way to crumble the patriarchy is if men stop holding on to this masculinity thing and take charge of their own mental health by letting go of the quote unquote privilege that masculinity gives them.

Because the only thing, the only privilege of that is being able to oppress women by first and foremost, oppressing yourself. So let's talk more about that. Let's kind of get into it. um I once again just wanna. emphasize that this is not for women to like, take this and try and like evangelize to men about it. You know, if you have like friends you can send this episode to, that would probably be great. Friends that are struggling with mental health or whatever.

But this is, I just want to make it very clear, this is not women's job. This is for, this is just for us to understand. the socialization that leads to this and to actually stay away from men who exhibit signs of men's mental health. Okay, so let's get into it.

Sovereign, where were you going with that, you know, whole thing of like kind of crumbling the patriarchy, you know, by sort of like men just being like more lonely and like kind of like going through the effects of this kind of mental health crisis. So there's a part of me that feels like it almost has to happen.

The male loneliness epidemic has to happen if we as a society is gonna, if we're gonna move forward in a positive way, if things are to get better, because they are, the troglodyte thing, they are so like, they're like not evolving. No, seriously.

so stuck in this mindset, the patriarchal mindset, which is the social conditioning, you're not supposed to be vulnerable, uh believing that women are, not seeing women as human, and they have these roles that they have to do, not having community with each other, besides superficial stuff. They don't really have real true friendships. And of course, we're not saying every single man out there don't have real friendships. We're saying, as a whole.

That's why there's a male loneliness epidemic because they don't really have true deep meaningful friendships. So there's all these different these different scenarios that has led to their loneliness and The loneliness has to happen. They have to sit there with themselves and really think like, okay, what am I gonna do? How am I gonna navigate this?

For some of them, may cause them to say, you know, I've been mean to women, I'll leave women alone, I'll go to therapy for a while until I get myself together. Some guys are gonna come to the realization and they're gonna unalive or kill themselves. Some men going to try to build deeper friendships with other men because they're like, well, patriarchy exists because men. Men invented this and 90 something percent of all the problems that men face is because of men.

The laws that other men put in place, the social conditioning of other men. so some, yeah, the violence, all of that. with each man going through this sort of, What am I going to do? I think I'm the problem. There's so many ways they can go. They're either going to change for the better and treat women better, or they're going to build more community with men.

Some of them are just going to come out the closet because that's a huge problem with the way men treat women is because, you know, they really wish that they could just come out the closet and be, with other men, which there's nothing wrong with that.

It's just it's only a problem when you're hiding it and then you're treating women and children bad or treating people bad in general, because because you want the privilege of masculinity being a straight man under the patriarchy and like using your peen to dominate women like oh so gross dude like that's what gives your life meaning it's the only thing like let's break out of that box friends like this is so stupid

just want to say like I only ever see women talking about men's mental health I hardly never if ever see men or hear of men talking about this with each other even though it's exactly that unless it's in response to like women saying stuff about our mental health or women saying, hey, we're in danger. What about men? Yeah, that's the only time that they will.

And they use women, the women in your lives, your situationship, your wife, your girlfriend, your baby mama, your mom, those are the women that you're gonna dump your emotional baggage on. So they do talk about mental health, but not with each other. They use it as a form of manipulation with women. Like, I'm fighting demons, and what about me and what I'm going through?

But then when it comes down to women really wanting to sit with them and have a conversation, like, hey baby, talk to me, it's okay to cry, it's okay to be vulnerable. No, fuck that. No, you know, and then they shut down. And so then it's like, what could, and this is why I always, I hate to say that I don't care about male mental health, but I've said this many times before. nor should you.

You already care about it in the way that you have to protect yourself in the way that you have to live your life. We have done more than enough. We already carry that burden for men, like let alone let us start advocating for them on a grand scale. What the fuck? No, no, they've never advocated for us. They'll be like, men gave you your rights. No, the fuck you didn't. We fought for them. We you withheld them in the first place. Right. And to do that in the first place.

Yes. If you were a normal non-psychopath like people, yeah, if you weren't literally in the troglodyte stage of your freaking evolution where you're like, no, more for me, more for me. it's crazy. It's crazy. We literally evolved because of cooperation and men to this day refuse to cooperate. women have been dragging, dragging men and their knuckles. on the fucking ground behind us this whole time, like into forward progress. And I'm tired. I'm tired.

and when we leave them behind, that's all we hear. how could you? What about men? Look at us. We're struggling. We're suffering. You're yeah, you're committing violent crimes against women. What do you mean? Like you make sexist jokes about women. You demean us. You belittle us. Like you can't call us. What about our mental health? What about women? But women never get to ask that because then we're just complaining, then we're just bitching, then, just fix it. just don't wear that outside.

Well, just don't do that. OK, I'm going to start telling men the same exact thing. Well, you know, maybe if you wouldn't wear those cargo shorts everywhere you go, maybe more people would talk to you. Maybe if you bought a stick of deodorant, maybe more women would talk to you. It's what you're wearing. It's how you dress. you, it's their little uh Pornhub hats.

I literally see men walking around with Pornhub logo on t-shirts or hats or what have you. Or even maybe even a Playboy bunny thing. Although that's, I mean I'm glad women have taken that and repurposed it and turned it into their own thing where it's all cutesy and whatnot. I think it's different when a woman wears a Playboy thing and when men.

do it because when men do it it just it gives me the ick and because they they'll wear like the hats with like a giant playboy bunny logo thing and like girlies they just wear like a tiny little sticker of it or like I don't know you know what I'm it's still it's you're saying and I agree. I agree with you. that was another thing that I forgot to mention when I was listing all the ways that they contribute to their own loneliness. The porn thing is probably, that's probably number one.

If it's not number one, it's number two. The social conditioning is probably number one. You know, just you have to be a man. You have to carry yourself this way. And it leads you down this rabbit hole of just death and despair and depression.

it's just, and the porn thing, they... already don't see women as human and then you add porn into it and it's like they like it there's no there's no way to go from there you just really have to yeah, if you want to talk about mental health, let's talk about the mental health aspect of sitting there watching strangers have depraved like smacks on the internet, like while you haven't seen another human face, you know what I mean? In your vicinity. Yeah, you haven't touched grass in weeks.

Like it's disgusting, like wastebasket full of tissues. You know what I mean? Like what are the mental health? Effects of that. No, I'm so serious. You're trying to cure your loneliness with your own peeing in your hand in your own hand while watching You know what I mean? Like not people you don't know people you will never have met in real life Not that that would make it better.

But like people that you don't know it's like watching through a little window know strangers have sex and you're doing that for hours and hours. You're just like gooning off You have like 200 tabs open like you're disgust. I'm sorry, but like what what are you doing? How is that good for your mental health? That is the number one detriment to your mental health, if anything, because it's giving your brain an insane amount of like, it's a drug level of dopamine.

it's the same as like taking hard drugs. And it's never been as accessible as it is today. like back in the day as... Right. And like the Gen X lady, she stitched us on TikTok. MJ, we love you sis. Yes, sis. She made a point earlier that it stuck with me because it made me think about this. But like it's never been, yes. porn has never been as accessible as it is today. Like it is, it's like maybe one click away.

It used to be maybe two clicks away, but updated for, you know, current, you know, AI and everything we have thrown at us. I think it's more likely to be one click away. Um, and she was saying how like back in the day men had to, register their ID with like a video store and the video people had to like pull back like a curtain and there'd be like DVDs that you There was shame involved.

and there was like a level of shame and there's also like barriers, these like sort of stop gaps in between accessing porn that we just don't have anymore. I think about that. and I just think about what it's doing to entire generations of men, because like this wasn't, I guess, as much of a thing for Gen X men, or maybe it was, but there's definitely, you know, porn addicted Gen X men. at like 10, 11 years old.

And if the safe search is off and you type in the word woman, and you click on Google images, you're there. It's Woman, just one word, one click. That's it. That's how far away you are from hardcore porn. Right. me ask y'all this. Do y'all think that if the patriarchy did not force men to, you have to perform and you gotta be this way, you can't show emotion and you can't be vulnerable, do you think that if... that didn't happen, that they would have turned to porn with that same intensity.

Cause I kind of feel like it's a vice that they're using because they don't have any other outlets. So it's like, is the only thing that makes me feel good. It's the only thing that takes my mind off of things that I'm going through. again, the fault of the patriarchy. they just use this to self-regulate almost instead of... Yeah, it's like a pacifier to them, it's like a binky, you know?

So I do think even without this socialization culture around men that they would still be turning to porn, like, regardless. they would. I just don't think it would be at this intensity. I don't think it would be like... maybe without the intensity, but I still think it would have always existed and it would have always had this sort of like protection around it with men where they would, defend porn like it's like their life depends on it. I don't know. do because they don't have anything else.

Yeah. there's plenty of men that are evolved, right? They're not in their knuckle dragging stage. And so to them, they're looking up and ahead. They're not looking at the ground, right? The way that you got it when you're dragging your knuckles still, you are upright, okay? You're looking forward. It would be the same way as women are not addicted to porn on that grand scale. I know some women are.

I know that that it's a problem for for everybody, but it's it's because those people are using it as a pacifier. But it's because you're not seeing the bigger and better things ahead of you. Like I know plenty of men and you can tell by the way that even like their eyes move, like there's physical signs of like men who are addicted to porn versus ones that are not. And it's like. the men that are not addicted to porn, they have no problem talking about things.

Like they'll usually, they'll be like a real yapper. You know what I mean? Like they can hang with, you know, somebody just talking about regular things rather than like struggling to ask questions or struggling to like, you know, maintain the conversation. Like because they're aware that there's other things in the universe that they can dedicate their attention to and they tend to just be. normal people. don't have that man air around them where they're just like, yeah. Right.

They're more balanced. balanced right they have like they can talk to women freely and like joke around with women and like have banter with women without being weird you know there was one guy that went on tiktok back when we were having the whole gym outfits discourse and was like how am i supposed to work out when the freaking bench looks like a pornhub video or like a casting couch and it's like yeah see that's it that's that's how you can tell because they cannot distinguish

woman dressed for the gym and sitting on a workout equipment versus a casting couch. It's realities blending together. But there are men that are not like that. You know what I mean? I grew up around one. My dad barely knows how to use a phone. I can tell you. uh And it shows. It very much shows. He spends his time reading books.

He spent my dad, like I watched my dad immigrate to the US not really knowing the language, knowing only the basics and how he would spend his nights after he was done, you know, contributing to the household and like doing laundry and doing dishes and like helping clean up and all of this stuff. He would sit there with a English to Russian dictionary and a notebook and he would like just flip through the dictionary and find words that he thought he could use in real life.

And then he would copy them into the notebook so that his it would commit to his memory like easier and better. And he had stacks of these notebooks like that. That's what some men do instead of watching porn. Do know what I mean? They learn a new language like imagine that. And then another proof of this is like sometimes I'll have lives where I'll put up conversation starters. Right. And one of them was talking about men's addiction to corn. or porn, sorry, I'm using TikTok terms now porn.

ah And and and God forbid when I suggested that men shouldn't watch porn at the rate that they do. There were literally men in the chat being like, but what else will I do? But what am I supposed to do? Well, that's what we supposed to do. We were horrified. Those are the ones you can tell they don't have anything going on outside of. really don't think it would be an all men- I don't think that there's anything, you know what I mean, that we're not socializing.

I do think that there would always be psychopath men that don't, know, narcissists that don't understand not using a person as an object and they're probably the porn producers and stuff. And it would take a man like that or men who are socialized in that direction to- get the snowball as big as it is. Do you know what I mean? Because like, I don't know. For sure.

it's mostly socialization because you do see men that are not addicted to porn and they will typically like, they just don't even have time or space for it. That's why. Because they're just doing other things. Like they're not interested in the degradation of women because they're happy to see women as equals. Like they're happy to commune with women in that way. then porn wouldn't be as much of a problem? I really don't think it would be. It would still It would still exist.

part of the question, but whether or not more of them would be as disconnected from reality and addicted is what I think you're trying to get at.

And I do still think that there would still be porn addicts because even though, let's say, they're given all these tools to be good, decent men and are able to see women as human beings, there will still be some who still have that bit of disconnection with women and still lack some sort of cognitive facilities to, I guess, carry forward a conversation or carry themselves a type of way.

that negative reinforcement and them continuing to try to interact with women and getting constantly shut down or rejected. And I'm not saying it's a woman's fault at all, but that would pull them backwards into their little caves in that society would we have a website like Pornhub? You know what I mean? Like who would produce that? the narcissist, like you said, like those psychopaths that still exist that are able to see women as objects and dehumanize us.

types of men Gwynn is talking about will always exist. But what I'm saying is that would be, that percentage would be much lower. It would not, cause see right now to me it's like 80 plus percent. I don't think it would be that high if men had, it's probably not. Okay, okay. I tried to be generous. I tried to be generous. be different. I think porn itself would look different. I don't think it would be as depraved and like they would be choking and I think it would just be more soft corn.

regard, I think wouldn't see it as much of like, as like an addiction more than like an instructions manual. Cause like we still have to contend with the fact that sex education is not taught in the Southern United States for much of our history. So I just. hate women. Sex education benefits women. It doesn't benefit men. the more women know about, yeah, the more women know about sex, the less men can be like, you can't get pregnant your first time.

Oh, you, if I pull out in time, like, yeah, let me just put the tip in. That only benefits women. So if we lived in a society where women were benefited, like I think, you know, it's hard for me to imagine the kind of porn. Right. a world where that could exist because for much of our upbringing and, you know, living in the world around us, like, I don't know, I still, I guess maybe it's a generational thing,

but for me, it's so hard for me to picture a world in which women are at the center and we make the rules and the society at large benefits us. that. has only been, yeah, yeah, is a new thing. Yeah, it's new. It really is. You can, if you read, so there's like a book called The Creation of the Patriarchy by Gerda Lerner. And it is, she's a white woman, right? So just keep that in mind as you're reading the book. The book was written, you know, years ago.

So there's like, There's some parts of it that are a little weird, but if you really follow it, patriarchy is, I wanna say it's fairly new as a concept. It really is. Yeah, yeah. I think they came out around the same time. Yeah. slightly newer, but I think patriarchy itself has always been a thing. And I think it just depends on where you're from and your culture.

even within, okay, so I'm thinking in the context of being a part of an East Asian family, that even before we had Christian values sent over to the East, uh we had what was called Confucianism.

And in that regard, women weren't really seen as as guess, well I don't want to say like they were dehumanized because they weren't, but they were still seen as like weaker and inherently inferior to men and so you were you know pushed to these you know domestic roles and that's always been a thing like But you gotta, McGuinn, you gotta think about there was a time when women were worshiped as statues because women were birth givers.

nobody on the planet could ever exist without a woman birthing them. So there was a time where women were revered. And for whatever reason, I don't know if it happened after they started mass producing men to fight wars or whatever it were. It just, I don't know when it was. revolution. So when men, when land ownership and surplus food production became central to power and wealth, that's why I always say men hoarded resources from women in order to subjugate us.

Because that's when it like really started. Before that, when we were hunter gatherers, women were reproducing far more than men.

Like for every one man that would reproduce like 17 women would reproduce like women had the reproductive power women had the reproductive like decisions and they were not as like subjugated because they could just walk away you know what i mean like nobody owned land like it was not central to your survival to like stay on a certain piece of land and i think that that's why like religion came out around the same time was like to give credence to the patriarchy. God gave us this land.

Yes, said you're supposed to do this. you're supposed to be submissive and the man is the head and you're the tail. Yeah, all of that crap. Yeah. why you see the like, supply and demand with like porn and stuff like that, because they make enough money off the ads that they can place in these things that they don't have to charge people for it. You know, or they can just charge like a premium for the really, you know, porn brain men to the point where they're addicted to it.

They can charge them a premium and that's all it is. But it's it all goes hand in hand with the hoarding of wealth and like whenever there became more men in certain areas than women, that's when the problems really started. Because men are like, well, we can take over our strength. We're stronger than women, so therefore we are better than them. We're superior to them. And it was a snowball effect to me.

It's like everything just snowballed from there being too many men when back in the day women would all share the same male with no problem because he had the stronger genes. It's like, okay, you just pass them on to the next person and you pass them on to the next person. And this whole monogamy thing, that's all of this is, this is all made up. None of this is natural. We are the only species that's going against nature.

Like literally the only species going against nature, going the opposite of nature. is not necessarily unnatural, but it's natural in animals where the males provide equitably into the society. So by all the markers, we should not be monogamous. Men do not deserve monogamy from women. And yet they have forced it upon us by claiming land and claiming resources. And I just want to say too that like not to, you know, we're kind of straying from the topic a little bit.

I got to put my producer hat on here.

I wanna know what y'all think about my ultimate theory about men's mental health, because I think it goes back to that model of masculinity where men are expected to be stoic and independent. So there's like, those are the two biggest things. There's other things but stoic and independent, whereas actual mental health the success markers of good mental health are.

neuroplasticity meaning you are able to learn new things and change the wiring you know like the the brain pathways so neuroplasticity which is the opposite of what stoicism and interdependence which is the opposite of independence so like mental health professionals like people's mental health markers are better when they're in community real community not like we play fantasy football together but i bet like even there Even there, I bet the mental health markers are better.

Like no matter what religion you belong to, that community will have better outcomes, like less depression, less, I mean, all sorts of like health things. And again, that's not to put religion on a pedestal. don't like, you know, but I'm just saying those are some of the only communities we have. but it does show that it's interdependence that makes people mentally healthy, not independence, right? That's why we say you gotta touch grass every once in a while.

You gotta make friends, like to understand people better, right? And that makes you understand yourself better. So it goes back to your own mental health. And then being able to change your mind when presented with new information, that's better for your mental health. I agree. Mm-hmm. And empathy is another big um yeah, boys get the empathy, like, essentially beat out of them. And you're not going to be the best human being ever or not even close to it with no empathy.

And that's another reason why so many things in this world can exist is because there's a lack of empathy on the parts of... the average man like, Oh, I was I was brutally raped. And it's like, what were you wearing? No empathy. You know, what were you wearing? He knocked my eye out out of the socket and he broke a rib. Well, what did you do to him? You know, that's the first thing that they're going to ask. Like, you know, no empathy. There's just like no empathy.

And I personally don't believe you can be mentally healthy if you have no empathy. And that's another big piece of the puzzle that's going to lead to their loneliness because You can't even relate to people around you. You have no empathy for the people around you. So of course you're going to be outcasted or you're going to feel like an outcast. I mean, in my opinion, rightfully so.

I don't want to be in community or sharing a room or sharing anything, sharing an office space or anything with people with no empathy. They are capable of anything. So you will be lonely unless you do something about. that part of that portion of your mental health, that is a huge part. I think that's one of the most important. As far as just being a human in general. 100%.

men are just operating on just like a really outdated script, like a 1940s, 50s, 60s script of like, if you do the right things, you'll have certain outcomes. And this is probably the first generation where they're realizing that that is simply not the case. And then they go to tell their older counterparts of like, I guess their father figures or even grandparent figures about, you the things that they're facing currently. And they're like, well, it worked out for us.

So there must be something wrong with you.

And so it pushes bit of, isolation for them or like loneliness for them because they internalize that because I think they really do think it has something more to do with them than the fact that they're learning for the first time, that that's just not the case where you do the certain things and you'll get certain outcomes.

go to school, like one of the ones that's told to Gen Z millennials is that you go to school, you go to college, you'll get a good job and you'll be able to push yourself out of poverty. You'll grab yourself by the bootstraps. maybe you'll be in middle class or even upper class, depending on what you went to school for, and everything will be fine. We learned, you know? And same thing for men.

Men learned, you learn how to be useful, you learn how to have, you know, certain values, and you learn, I guess, have certain, like, I guess they're taught more, you know, how to be more useful to us, and so they're thinking in terms of, like, you know, being a provider or this protector. sort of mentality that's blocking them from having these soft people skills. And they're learning for the first time that they actually did need those soft people skills that they were blocked from all along.

And they're having this like cognitive dissonance about it because like I said, like they go to their trusted advisors, which are like these older male figures that they have in their life. And again, these male figures are just telling them like, I don't know what's wrong with you, man. Like this all worked out for me. Like I had my wife, that's how I had you. And I these outcomes. So. there is just a generational thing. Like, I think you just don't want to work anymore.

I think you're just lazy. I think you're just not trying hard enough. And so they're, they really are kind of like struggling to grasp that. And so I think that's another reason that, you know, is contributing to this like mental health crisis. And I've talked to some men in my life about that too, where, it was like after practice, cause I go to Taekwondo and it's kind of a male dominated space. And so I have access to like these men that I can just like talk to and ask questions.

One of the ones that I asked them is just like, why do you think there is like a men's, know, loneliness epidemic or like a mental health crisis thing? And just doing my research for this episode. And that was one of the things that they told me was that like they're learning for the first time that they have this outdated script and it's troubling for them because now they don't know what to do because they don't know who to listen to.

right, because it sounds like there was exploitation involved in order to, make a man's life happen. Like it sounds like somebody had to be exploited and used and squeezed for every single last drop so that a man could have all the success he felt like he deserved under the patriarchy. Mm-hmm. always happening at someone's expense.

It's kind of like when, you know, I don't know if anyone has seen that comic where, uh you know, the more rights that we get, there's always somebody, crying about it, right? people were saying to abolish slavery, people were like, well, that'll drive the prices up, you know? And it's like, well, yeah, because you were exploiting people.

to make those prices happen. And it's like, maybe things shouldn't be that cheap. Maybe things shouldn't be that affordable or accessible or, you know, whatever. And people struggle with that. You know, if we raise the minimum wage, then a burger will be more expensive. Well, why was it so cheap in the first place? Because people are not getting paid a living wage. Because when you look at, know, McDonald's actually was forced to produce like.

how is a worker supposed to survive on their, salary that they get paid? And McDonald's put in into the income breakdown income from that person's second job. They were like, now with the income from your second job, your second on top of this full time job, that's how you're going to pay for your cell phone bill. Because we ran out of things that our salary will cover for you like a long time ago. wage that you make working out like McDonald's will cover rent. That's it. That's it.

Everything else, you need either assistance or a second job. And so it's like, yeah, people are just simply being exploited. And so the rest of us can have access to a very cheap burger. And what's worse is that prices go up anyway. a meal at McDonald's costs $20 now. and people are still not getting paid above minimum wage and that's how they dupe you is the patriarchy. Like the patriarchy is the basis of exploitation.

For the first time ever, a pound of beef or maybe it's like an ounce, but it costs more than one hour minimum wage, federal minimum wage, $7.25 an hour. So I think I need to find that article that I was just reading about this. Sony, you will eat your peasant gruel in your tiny homes and be happy. We don't even have like the communes. You know what I mean? It's going to be tent cities all over again. What were they called under uh Hoovervilles or whatever?

Yeah. I still think that we'll be better off going back to the barter system. I'm always going to be on the side of the barter system. women will thrive in that. And I will tell you that that is what's gonna happen. Well, so I grew up in a country that was like post war and like there was no economy. And let me tell you the barter system works. My mom used to have her friend make my school uniform, you know, because my mom would help her out with other things or like.

And it works among women and that's why men hate it. Men hate the bartering system because it fucks up their whole global economy and their whole exploitation system because it's a non-exploitative system. It's like you give what you can and other people give what they can. That's how everything worked when I was growing up. It's like, hey, I have to work late today. Will you watch my kid? Will you feed my kid after school? And it's like, yes.

because I know one of these days I'm gonna be unavailable in the afternoon, so you're gonna have to watch my kid and feed my kid. It all shakes out when it comes to women. And the only people that were not participating in the system and had the cold hard reality, economic reality, was men.

even then, men would still be able to benefit from the benefits of women bartering because their wife would have... you know, free access to like babysitting services from other women, like taking the kids to the doctor with other women's help. even though we only had public transportation, you know, like my mom always made it work. Women always make the barter system work. The best way- only work in local systems. It wouldn't work, I guess.

This is like a post-apocalyptic situation, the reason why bartering isn't a thing now is because we needed something like, we needed currency because one of the functions of currency is to be able to establish a system of value.

So that way, things would be less arbitrary because it was hard to place a value on something where it was like, guess, a car and let's say you're a dentist, it's hard to say like, this car amounts to however many teeth you could pull or like, you what systems you could perform. And so currency acted as like a medium of exchange to where it's like a car is now worth like this many shiny rocks. A car is worth you know what saying?

Or like, not a car, but like maybe like something else of value of like, I don't know, you would need, you know, a childcare, like, okay, well it would be this many shiny rocks instead of just like a certain, thing you could offer. Cause like, you know, what are they gonna do with like somebody who could pull teeth or. whatever your chosen skill was. Like, what they didn't have something that needed mending?

Like if you were somebody who could only do sewing, and if they didn't have anything to sew, like, well then I guess you were SOL. So medium of currency worked to, I guess, not necessarily end the bartering system, but like, I don't wanna get into the... a great point. Like I totally see where you're coming from. I'm just saying like we are so used to having access to things with money that we have lost the social safety net aspect of it.

And it benefits our overlords that we have lost that because now we have to pay for everything because we have no community. Right. That's why like child care is not free because they know people have to pay for it. if it was, you know what I mean?

If it was like the kind of thing where And I'm not talking about exploiting like your older relatives or anything like that, but where we like used community for communities sake and we were forced I don't know, live based on, yeah, you had a village, but you were also forced to like live in like conditions that support that, right? You would have a lot less need to outsource.

certain things that have now become outsourced and have made, you know, like I said, child care has been women have been priced out of it, basically, you know what I mean? It just sucks. Yeah, yeah. But then they want us to have kids. I'm saying, there is no reason for childcare to be that expensive. It's just another, to me it's another ploy to keep women, put women back in the house depending on men.

Because that's the one thing that all the moms complain about as to why they choose to stay home. Because they're only working just to pay for child care and I'm like well How come your husband the so-called provider isn't like helping you do that like why why is that solely on you? Yeah It's just I having to pay for it? Like that's his baby too. about women? You know what I mean? Men's mental health is men's mental health that this is how men treat us. Right.

You pop out, carry the baby, pop out the baby. Wait, I'm going to do the fun part. Right. I'm going to first hang you from a chandelier or whatever. Right. Put some porn on the background. We're going to do something you don't enjoy. Whatever. Now, boom, I had fun. Now you're pregnant. You're throwing up. You can't get out of bed. You know, all this stuff. I'm still making you go 50-50 because I'm a liberal progressive man. Like, fuck you. Fuck you. I'm so done.

Like, no, you don't care about anybody else's mental health. Like, you will look at a fully pregnant woman and be like, yeah, I don't know. What do want me to do? Like, go get you a snack? Like, no. you should be able to do that yourself. Aren't you like an independent woman? Like, we'll throw everything back in our face, you don't want to go to work even though you're pregnant? Well, I don't know. I thought women wanted equal rights. ah I was just watching em a podcast or something today.

was a guy, guess somebody wrote in. was some woman was saying that she wasn't supposed to get an epidural and she ended up getting one anyway because she couldn't take it. And the bill came back and the husband said, that's not even my responsibility. You are, you're the one who needed to get the epidural. So you got to pay for it. these are the types of men that y'all are having babies with. And it's just like, why are y'all still, I am always going to be team let the birth rate.

Plummet to hell, shout out to Bourbon Bougie. Because what the fuck? Y'all are having babies with men who are like, it ain't my responsibility. She probably wasn't gonna make it. She's probably gonna pass out from pain if she didn't get the epidural. A baby, I'm pretty sure you begged for. And really, that's what y'all having babies with. be actively cruel and then be like, what about our mental health? You know what I'd love to see?

I'd love to see how men's mental health would get if we actually had equality across the board, because women say they want equality, but they refuse to commit 90 percent of all violent crime. They refuse to, you know, heckle men. They refuse to like, you know, come out and jump men in a dark alley. to sow seeds of doubt in these men regarding their own safety, where it's like, you're a strange man inviting a strange woman back to your place, like, aren't you a little nervous?

Like, don't you think I'm gonna like, you know, yeah, rob you, yeah, mm-hmm. I would love to see the kind of mental health issues that men would have if they were actually treated like the way that we're treated in everyday life. Because my mental health is hanging by a fucking thread every day. And then it's like, well, what about men?

we all know about our, you know, our own mental health crisis thing, but like the fact that, you know, it's only for men, men's mental health crisis, not a mental health crisis just in general, including women. That's how you know it's just, it's a very male-centered society. It's a very patriarchal world that we're living in. So. will never be an article about male loneliness, I mean a female loneliness epidemic unless it was to be condescending.

Like it will be, see this is what happens when women uh standards are too high. You're just going to end up alone with, then die alone with cats. It'll never be, it never, never, it never. say that the male suicide rate, that is a real thing. one that I wanted to show y'all was one that varies by age range. So it actually spikes higher in men aged 72 and higher. It arcs upward. up on the screen for us. in women, it lowers. like, actually it sloughs off.

So like it slopes downward, meaning like less women at that age are committing suicide because, and I can't help but think about this one uh TikTok I saw of a woman who works in

uh elderly care or like a home, a facility for older people. And she says like, women always get visitors and men, they're, yeah, they don't. It's a very lonely experience for them. And so I think about that. coupled with the age and I, not correlation and causation to get into that conversation, but I do think about the fact that like maybe it's, you know, just a consequence of how you were in life. You, if you were selfish and yeah.

has a great bit about that because she's like, I bet y'all didn't know I used to be a mortician. And it is men that die alone in their apartment in their tidy, whitey surrounded by cans of soup. It's not women. She said, yeah. Mm hmm. to show you how much. Remember when someone else came out the stats on the amount of unclaimed bodies that's in the morgue? It's usually men. That they'll be in a morgue for weeks, months, and nobody comes to even claim their body.

Because yeah, I think many times it's their karma. Even me working in health care. taught me that women always had those older ladies always had somebody coming even if it was one person even if it was a whole bunch of people even if it was women with no children they had the most visitors Mm-hmm. Yes, yes. end up cultivating all these friendships and you have all of these neighbors and you got people. even whether the women had kids or not, they had the most visitors coming to see them.

Unless you were just an awful person. A lot of times if you were just an awful person, your kids would just put you there and like they wouldn't have to deal with you anymore, man or a woman. yeah, but the men would just be sitting there and it was always onry and angry all the time. it's like, I was like, you sometimes there were some of them. And I'm like, he's a nice old man. But then you have to think about it. Like, was he always nice? Was he an asshole?

He got six kids, none of them come to visit. There is a reason. There is a reason your kids don't come visit you at nursing homes, especially when you are a man. Or a woman too. Because especially when you have kids thinking that there's some kind of a life insurance policy. But I think the thing with men overall is that they never anticipated not being on top. So they stop growing mentally. Yes. spiritually to me. They stopped evolving and because it's like man.

after like 18. and I feel like they don't realize that the thing that they're doing is gonna bite them in the ass eventually because an old man is the closest that most men will ever come to feeling like a woman, you know what I mean? You feel weaker, feel um like everything, like nobody really cares about you, like everything is just on you because... you're no longer useful. Yes, you're no longer useful. You no longer have a job. You no longer like contributing. Right.

And so people are like, well, you were only ever good for your material. You know what I mean? Like a lot of men over invest in like the stupidest things because of this, too. They over invest in their work. Right. They become workaholics because they think that that's what makes them a man. And then they're like on their deathbed. They're like, man, I wish I hadn't worked so much. I wish I had spent more time with my wife. I wish I hadn't spent so much time away from my kids.

Yes, you over invested in something that you thought was gonna like bolster your masculinity when really bolstered your loneliness. bolstered, yeah, like it basically made you push away the things that are good for your mental health. and invite in things that are only bad for your mental health, like being, you know, pressured and evaluated and walked all over, you know, by your boss who thinks that makes him a man. You know what I mean? It's turtles all the way up and turtles all the way down.

Like it's like this hierarchy and they're trying to climb it, trying to climb it. And then all of a sudden, boom, they're an old man. And it's like, you know. a good correlation. I never made that connection. The closer that they will ever feel what it's like to be a woman is when they get older. And it makes sense, yeah. And it makes sense that that's the age range where they commit the most suicide. It makes perfect sense to me. And I never made that connection before, but that is so spot on.

yeah. I was also like asking earlier to like this group of men that I go to the gym why so many young men turn to, alt-right podcasts and like red pill stuff or like Republicanism like what draws it to them? And it's what you kind of like were talking about where it's this like stoicism, this show of like masculinity, this lack of like, wanting to invest in the soft skills.

And I just think about how it's like the blind leading the blind, because if they don't have like an older male role model that they can ask these questions to that have, you know, given them real answers where they're like, because like these older men are telling them like, well, it worked out for me. I don't know what's wrong with you. Like you're, you're fucked up, not me.

And then they turn to these, you know, male role models that have their own podcasts and they have like maybe their own fame on YouTube. And they're given this sort of like platform that is equivalent to somebody who went to like Harvard, like where it's like you should listen to them because they're just as smart as somebody who actually graduated. And it would be somebody like Charlie Kirk or like Tim Pool or like what's another one?

Ben Shapiro. Although Ben Shapiro did actually graduate from college, but I digress. And so I think that also is contributing to the male loneliness epidemic because all that these men have in common is that they're not telling these men to grow the fuck up and. actually be a better person.

And like reinvest in these soft skills, like as much as you're putting in towards, know, getting that bag and like this grind and hustle culture, you need to also be putting in that work to like grow mentally and emotionally as a person.

cause like stoicism is like the closest thing that they can come to having their own form of strength because they don't look at, you know, something like our emotional maturity as a strength and like our ability to connect with other people is like that only it as weakness because it results in cooperation and they're like no it should result in you dominating somebody if something is working that means you're dominating and it's like

no we can all work together like my god it is it's literally an unevolved mindset because if you look at why our evolution works it's literally because of cooperation like we are not you know and a lot of men want us to go backwards to like you know basically uh Might makes right and it's like but it's not survival of the strongest it is survival of the fittest the fittest Right and the fittest of us are succeeding and those people are women.

Mm-hmm buying more houses more education You know starting to out-earn men just in mental health markers Absolutely soaring over the men and it's like, you know, I don't know Maybe there's something to it The male loneliness epidemic is a result, a direct result of patriarchy and other men who put y'all men, if y'all are listening in the situations that y'all are in. This is not a woman's problem. I always say how much I don't care, even though some years back I might've cared a little bit.

I don't care anymore because they don't want to do anything about them. They don't even want to acknowledge that though they're, they complain. You hear men on these podcasts, especially will complain about all the systems in place and how it disadvantages them and it's like, yeah, men are the ones who made these laws. Men are the one who said that you can't do that.

Men are the one who made these, you know, and they refuse to see it and it's like, it's right in your face, but no, it's, they, can't accept that. because then they would have to admit everything that they were ever told about men and women was a lie. And that's their whole identity. Their whole identity would come crashing down. And I think that's the reason why they won't. And that's the reason why they're going to continue to be lonely. Because, I mean, what do you want us to do?

We are learning the signs of a depressed man and watching the crime shows to see how we can figure out how to be safe to get away from you. Because if you're not going to want to grow and be a better person, I don't fucking want to be around you. to help while I don't have the rights to my own body. Hell no. Hell no. Yeah, it's a rap. Absolutely. It's a rap. When men didn't come out to protest us losing rights to our bodies, because I thought it was men that gave us our rights.

So ah I guess I don't give a fuck about your rights either. If I could take more rights away from men, I would. And this is all mother nature in my opinion, moving things and orchestrating things in order to get things back in balance. And if that means a lot of, absolutely. yeah. that means a lot of men are just going to take themselves out the game or they're either going to be better people or whatever, whatever that is, however that turns out, I don't

give a fuck. Mother nature doesn't give a fuck. Mother nature is just going to orchestrate things to get things back in balance and how whatever that looks like. And that's just the way I see it. The survival of the fittest. because the way that men want us to react to this is to once again, pick up all the emotional labor, pick them up like a little baby and baby them. That's what they want. They just want us to tell them, it's OK. I know that you don't feel, yeah, here's your binky.

Here's your porn. You know, here's your free vagina. Like, no, you're not going to get shit. We don't have rights to our own bodies and y'all are making it worse. Like it is absolutely crazy that we should also be tasked with, dismantling the system that oppresses us at our expense and like gives men benefits at our expense. Like everything comes back to it is at women's expense and and every day men just want more from us every single day.

It's like, yeah, but what about this and what about that? Yes, exactly. It's like until you learn that it is your personal responsibility.

we're all going to stay stuck here and until we make our society women and children centered men will never get out of the mental health hole they never will they will continue living in the hell that they continue to build for themselves it's like you're adding logs to the to the hellfire that you're living in because you keep insisting that society should be male centered Okay, I guess we all ain't shit. I guess we'll all suffer.

I guess we will all just live in hell because you want to center it around you instead of rightfully centering it around women and children, more specifically black women and black children. Okay, but okay. it's always so interesting because also when you talk to men, they think that they're being left behind. Like there are these systems that are helping women and there are no systems helping men. And that's so interesting, right?

Because it's like, well, why do you think that there's no systems there to help men? Why do you think that there are systems in place to be able to prop women up and help them along their development? Because like we've only had these rights for what, maybe 25 years. We're like some of our first in our generation to be able to have degrees and be able to have these careers that we have, these white collar jobs.

Like we were some of the first and that's so, gosh, like we really just live in two different realities and that's always, and like as much as I wanted to like yell back at them and you know, like scream, you know, just like give them shaking baby syndrome, like grab them by the shoulders and like, but it really it's eye-opening to me.

Cause like this is what, you know, these lonely red pill podcasters are telling them too that like you're being left behind because the system is only made for women to succeed and it's not made for men. Like the system is no longer in place to benefit men and that's all feminists' fault, it's all women's fault. And that's crazy. Anyways. m like women or the female of any species, but women, represent the natural flow of a river.

And the men are stones and rocks and sticks and boats swimming against the stream of the river. That's what they represent. If they were on in their boat going with the flow of the river. and not trying to fight against the natural flow of the river, they will be better off. But they just, they don't, Oh! don't think like that. They think going against the flow makes them more of a man, makes their pee pee bigger. It's true. I'm gonna go against the Florida Reds.

You're only hurting yourself and you're hurting the women around you and the children around you. But also to the women who think that they can help men out of their mental loneliness or illness. You're just gonna get either beat up, like abused or killed. Mm-hmm. because the problem is is that a lot of y'all are trying to help men that don't want to help themselves. They are not taking any steps. You're trying to force him to go to therapy.

You're trying to force him to to absolutely and they're not even willing to do the work for themselves. So naturally you're going to just be collateral damage. And that's the reason why going to happen at your expense. Yeah. And that's the reason why I am so against to help men out of their mental health crisis. Been there, done that, would never do it again. You're only going to become collateral damage.

And a lot of women unfortunately lose their lives because those men fighting demons, you're one of the demons in his mind that he has to fight. And he's going to take you out before he takes himself out. And so it's like, what's the point? Y'all have to, I think women need to, as much as you can, separate immediate threat. because that's what it is. 100 % ladies. That was a wonderful conversation. And unfortunately, we do have to end it. And I'm glad we're ending it on this note.

What about women? That is the conclusion to our men's mental health discussion is what about women? What are you all going to do about our rights and about our happiness and about our mental health? Maybe consider committing less violent crime. Maybe consider wearing, uh you know, less cargo shorts. Maybe consider just being less of a insufferable troll. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Think about somebody else other than yourself for one second.

That's my advice to the men affected by the mental health crisis. We love you. Bye. We got a mail bag to get to anyways. about women is All right, ladies, time to dig into our mailbag and we have kind of a long one today, so hang with us.

love it when y'all write in, just please make sure you make it as concise as possible will do our best to advise. but also keep in mind we're not like professionals. So take everything with a grain of salt. We're speaking from our own experience. You know what I mean? Don't take this as like God's words or anything like that. This is just input from other women, okay?

And people in the comments, please chime in too if you know of like, know, ways to help with this because this one's kind of something I have a feeling a lot of us have experienced, so. Let's all listen together. Hi, Sovereign Lisa and Gwen. Thank you for doing everything you're doing to support people in building awareness of the world that we live in. I recently discovered your podcast and individual social media accounts and the amount of knowledge I'm gaining has been invaluable to me.

I really can't thank you all enough. That is so kind. Thank you so much. Yes, we really are just trying to educate people. So I'm glad that, you know, I'm glad that it's being seen as helpful. I have been in a difficult work situation for the past 9 months that I would appreciate your advice on how to best handle moving forward. I have just handed in my 2 months notice today with my end date being the 25th of September.

The team I work with seems to be the pure personification of patriarchy and it has been soul crushing and horrifying to be a part of. I am also the only person of color. I'm a 33 year old Indian British woman who is well educated, attractive, child free, happily single and ferociously independent. I know they hate you. I started this job in November, 2024, working as a therapist in an eating disorder service. My mental health quickly went down the toilet.

I began struggling with depression again and low self-esteem and have completely lost all sense of myself. After listening to you for the past few weeks, I've been able to piece together. that despite the gaslighting from coworkers, the problem is very much them, not me. I work under two male consultant phys- psychiatrists who are very red pill and give off revenge of the nerds vibes.

my God. I have had one of the consultants target me from the start, being very nice to me when I started, asking about my day, always checking in, going above and beyond to help me with my patients. Then he switched up gaslighting me to believe that I was doing everything wrong. undermining me and implying that I was stupid in every interaction we had together and in team meetings.

It's gotten so bad that I feel afraid to speak up in any meetings with him because I know he's going to make me his target practice. He's a married man with two young children and I know that he has had a crush on me since I started. I will also admit that from how nice he was when I started, I did develop a crush on him too. Despite this man really not being my type, he is short and objectively unattractive.

Thankfully, thankfully I knew that he was married and did not act on these feelings, but I do feel very confused and as if I am recovering from an abusive relationship. What you are experiencing is an abusive relationship. Just FYI, I have seen enough like that's very fucked up. Yeah, all abusive. Yeah. of like just bringing your self esteem down so that he thinks he can get more of a chance with you. Cause he knows he's short, so he's gotta like, you know, lower you to his short ass level.

What's worse is that I work in a mostly female team. my God, I was hoping you wouldn't say that. Full of 40 to 50 year old pick me's who adore this man and do not see any harm in the sexist ignorant shit that comes out of his mouth. So I feel very alone in seeing this abuse and poor behavior and not feeling safe to say or do anything about it.

This man has openly called other women's names exotic in front of me and has tried to tell me what is and isn't racist as a middle class, cis hetero white man. It gets worse. my God. Over the past couple of months, I've caught another male colleague staring at me in inappropriate ways. And because I feel so worn down by this team, when this happens, I generally shut down and walk away as fast as I can.

I thought this man was gay when I first met him, only to find out that it is his partner's maternity leave that I am covering. This man is the epitome of a weak man, bitching about his partner to other female colleagues to garner attention from them while she is at home taking care of his child. I also found out today that he left his fiance a month or so before their wedding, they have a daughter together, to be with his female colleague and then got her pregnant.

I knew when I met him that he is going to leave his current partner and I fear that he is going to just keep doing this to women because he is broken inside and hates himself. also this man looks like a foot with a mustache whilst his partner is stunning. They remind me of the wizard Liz and Landon physically and situationally too. With all of that being said, how do I proceed and survive my remaining eight weeks in this hellhole?

I feel a lot of shame that I have felt too exhausted and alone to stand up to these men and call them out. I feel ashamed that I haven't been able to protect future female colleagues of color who will work within this team. I don't know what to do and what version of myself to be anymore. I feel too deflated to clap back at them now because it feels too late because I've said nothing this whole time.

Do I try to educate this ignorant team and clap back at their inappropriate behavior or do I just play it safe, keep my head down and focus on getting the fuck out of there? Thank you for taking the time to read through my concerns and for your support, sending a lot of love and hugs from the UK. We love you, so sorry about that. We are sending you lots of love back and keep in mind we don't live in the UK so I don't know legally what the ramifications are of any of these things.

So we're just giving advice on like how to handle yourself attitude wise and you know, just how to kind of, like you said, live out these remaining eight or so weeks under this, horrible environment. So ladies chime in, what do you think? So I was taking notes. first of all, don't feel ashamed because you can't control other people's actions and you sound like you're in an impossible situation. There's no reason for you to be ashamed.

that's probably a defense mechanism Where we, are in a situation that's really not healthy for us. So we just automatically go towards self-protection mode. That's the word I was looking for. So that's normal. That's very, very normal to do that. That's probably, that was probably your gut just telling you to just kinda, you know, keep it low. I'm wondering, I don't know how it is in the UK legally. I'm wondering if you have enough evidence to file a lawsuit. I don't know.

I don't know how it goes over there. It's like, you know, possibly, or maybe you just want to get the hell out of there. I also want to know too, if this is a job that you would even want to put on your resume, because I'm one of those people that have not put jobs on my resume because I knew for a fact that if a new job called that they would legally, professionally try to mess it up for me because they were mad that I was leaving, that does happen.

I don't know how it is over there, but um so yeah, there's been times where I'm... you want to take legal action so that you can hold them to like a non-disclosure type thing. Like I know women who have had to do that and I have helped them with that. But again, that was in the US. And so you would basically get a lawyer to write statement of like, this is what legal actions we could take and this is what.

we have seen this is what we have evidence of proof of and then let them respond with either a settlement or like conditions of non-disclosure. Like they can only confirm the dates that you worked there. And, you know, say that it was a mutual. parting of ways or that you quit or whatever. Like whatever details you want them to confirm. And then if they don't do that, and if you lose out on a job because of it or whatever, it gives you then grounds to sue them.

that is, I know you're kind of like tired. I know that gathering this evidence would be a pain in the ass. I know that calling lawyers about this, that's just more mental and emotional labor for you. And it might be necessary. I One more thing. she made the comment about the guy who she thought was probably gay but then she found out his partner was on maternity leave, don't gaslight yourself out of that. you thought that, if that was your first initial thought, it's probably still true.

is probably both. Two things can be true at once, okay? Yeah. And that's probably why he's acting so hateful and trying to get as many women pregnant as possible. Yes. Especially when they're in the closet. what I'm saying. So don't ever think that because a man has a wife and kids or whatever that he's not on the down low. A lot of times that, yeah, he's not. In many cases, it's a dead giveaway. Yeah, that doesn't mean anything. So yeah, don't gaslight yourself and also don't confront them.

It sounds like you're outnumbered. They will all most likely stick together to be against you. Yeah, so you're gonna be outnumbered in that case. I just don't think that you should bother with that. If you're going to do anything about this at all, would have to be, in my opinion, you can be working on it now and gathering evidence and maybe file a lawsuit later or just remove yourself altogether from this situation. Yeah. the best way to go about it is to what's called gray rocking.

Look that up and just that's it seems like that's what you're doing already. And it is the only defense mechanism that works against a narcissist. Like you're never going to beat them at their own game, which is gaslighting, making up false.

Claims and statements like trying to ruin your life sending in, know flying monkeys to to attack you all that kind of stuff like look up how to deal with narcissism and do that, but they're all gonna tell you to gray rock until you can remove yourself from the situation and It's the goal is ultimately anytime you're involved with a narcissist is to just remove yourself And so it sounds like you've done that.

It sounds like you know But I just also wanna say that this is why you even having had this experience, mean, notice how much of the system it takes to not think that this behavior is weird. You know what I mean? A man being nice to you should not be so unusual and so exciting that you develop a crush on him. No offense, I get that it happens, but it's kinda like, you know what I mean? not even attractive.

Yeah, like I was kind of stuck on that part because I was like, man, like that's another part of things we don't really talk about is that, you know, even when men are like transactionally nice to us as women, it still is like kind of like what? Like kind of sexy, kind of attractive. It's like, my God, the bar is literally under hell. she did say that she was having self-esteem issues. So like that tracks.

And when you have self-esteem issues, I could see how, you know, when the bar is just that low that it, you know, I'm gonna give sis a pass on that. Yeah, because her brain went to survival mode. Yes. And I'm not saying that as a knock on that. I'm just saying it's so unusual for men to be like, we don't even expect men in professional settings to be nice and helpful. Like, does that make sense? Like the fact that he was kind of going out of his way, like he should have been doing that anyway.

Like that she shouldn't have expected any kind of transactional, you know, benefits from that, because that's fucked up. You should just be nice to people without expecting anything. The hell's wrong with you? too, I don't want to make you paranoid, but I'm wondering, did it have to be eight weeks? I've never heard of a two month notice before. Usually I hear two weeks or, yeah, so, okay, so I'm wondering, okay, okay, so that makes sense if that's the case.

I was going to say because you live in, first of all, you know, congratulations on putting in your, your eight weeks and you know, finally giving yourself the space to call it what it is and leave that's, I know that's gotta be like a weight off your shoulders. So congrats. And I hope you're able to take some time to celebrate that for you. And second of all, I wanted to say if I wanted to ask actually if the UK has, the glass door.

So you can leave reviews on workplaces so that future people who want to, you know, inquire or like, you know, apply these places, you can look on glass door and see the reviews of people who have previously worked there and make comments on like maybe some of the work culture, like the toxicity. And so at least you have like a heads up. So I'm wondering if like, if glass door is an option for you to like leave a review probably long after you leave.

So like I would set a reminder to do this like. three months out, four months out, so that way they don't automatically suspect. Because if you do it before your eight weeks is up, I think they would know who you were if you left that comment and if they read it. But anyways, if that's a way for you to do that, or Google review At least you can leave a Google review at these places.

And I also wanted to ask how comfortable you were willing to go, I mean, how comfortable were you with the idea of maybe going nuclear? So that's an option for you. Like if you are now wanting to build yourself up and if you have the courage to talk shit back or throw some shit back at them, I am actually a- like get out a notepad and like start writing it down, just be like, oh, just writing it down. I just thought that was weird that you said that. So I thought I would make note of it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. something like that. You can just be, you know, mild about it, or you could just be inflammatory. You can be like a crazy, woman about it, like a Karen, or, or you can be an inconvenience to them. So you can be like a pebble in their shoe. You can work slowly. So if they ask you to, you know, make some print some things off of them, go do it as slow as you possibly can, like walk slowly.

Like, you know, you're just not as much of in a rush to like get things done there, you know? And like the quiet quitting thing, yeah, absolutely. a bit. Reclaim your agency a bit because... would only recommend that if you don't plan on listing them on your resume as a previous employer. Mm-hmm.

Because they will use that again all the last few weeks They'll act like those last few weeks of you being slow and not coming to work on time or you know Just moving slow they'll try to make it seem like the whole time you were there That was that was the kind of time you were on and you know So you just have to be careful with you if you're not

planning on but the glass door idea Absolutely and just change if you do that change little information like you say you were there for nine months say I was there for a year or I was there for six months Yeah. can't piece together who you are. So just like you know if you if you go that route Yeah, but also to Things could you just expect that things could get a little worse because people people know that you're leaving Yeah, so just be careful with that. That's the only That's the only thing.

But I agree with Gwen. If you know, you're like, fuck this place. I'm not putting this place on my resume no way because I don't want anybody calling them. I'm saying this because I've done this. Like I've left jobs that they... Or something. Yeah, that's what we do anyway. Literally. None. uh None. Not one. uh Not one. We lie. It's a lying contest. It's a popularity contest as much as it is a lying your ass off contest.

The only thing you can't really fake is, you know, degrees and diplomas and certificates, because that is usually public information. But sometimes, but sometimes people bank on the fact that they don't check. um And you can usually tell... with it. They absolutely get away with it. mm-hmm. So it just, especially if you're a white male, they usually don't even question it. But as a woman, like I always advise a little bit of caution.

But I was gonna say, you if you want the mature route, I would listen to Sovereign and Lisa, but if you want, you know, an unhinged kind of like goblin route, like the petty route, you can, I mean, if that's available to you and you feel safe to do so, I mean, just be a pebble in their shoe, be an inconvenience, uh start clapping back or find ways to like psychologically mess with them.

And there are ways you can do that, and I know that you can just, you know, start looking up, you know, on YouTube, you know, ways of manipulating people and just just fuck with them, turn them into like a science expert, entertain yourself, really, really. the short man just be like, hey, are you wearing different shoes today? You don't have lifts on today? You don't look as tall, yeah. Did you get a haircut? You seem smaller, yeah, yeah, like. or also like those women.

my gosh, like there's so much you can do with them I don't know if I want to like say like, know, you could talk with them because like it's it's very anti feminist of me But at the same time you also might want to consider how doing that stuff is gonna make you feel on the inside. about to say that. I was finna say, you know what, take Gwen's advice because that's actually gonna boost your self-esteem, it's gonna boost up your confidence to stick it to people.

So yeah, uh let this eight weeks be your last little experiment. Yeah, absolutely. I'm so glad you said, Gwen. It's like, this is gonna catapult you into the next phase of your life. So, absolutely. Yes, be petty. But just, but still protect yourself. Yeah, be smart about it. Yeah. because people, know, workplace discrimination is real.

um you know, depending on the laws, you can definitely hopefully you can have some level of like, hey, if I have this documented or whatever, I can successfully sue you or I can successfully get you to settle and pay me money or something like that. some of this um for sure. Cause it's not about if you're right, it's about what you can prove in a court of law.

So I was going to say, if you have a lot, some of this like documented via email or like group chats or like Slack or whatever you have on those channels, like that workers use on their intranets, you can try that. um And I was also going to say like, what are y'all's legal routes in the UK regarding like racial discrimination? Cause a lot of that does sound kind of racial to me. Like, so especially like the exclusionary girl gang shit that sounds like like classic racial profiling.

like when I worked with mostly white women at Ulta for a brief amount of time and they found out I was Wajian, they felt so uncomfortable by that fact. Like they started like just excluding me from things and like having their little cliques and like not even, I didn't really bother me cause I'm just like, y'all are weird. And I knew they going to last long anyways because like we're just, we're in Houston. being racist in Houston, just, it. Yeah. you will be humbled because we're a mixed city.

We have people from all over the world here. and you know, they had their karma, but regardless, so like, just reminds me of, know, that clicky feeling I had at Ulta when it came to like women and they would, you know, and even though they weren't older, they were, you know, are like within the same age range as me, it was still just, it was weird. And like, that's just, that's the thing that they do. I don't know why. Like I just anyways.

And so if that's something that is documentable for you, I would definitely go through the proper channels in the UK to maybe get that documented or at least have some protection for yourself for that or maybe there's a settlement you can get. in the United States, like if you can prove that you know were racially discriminated against or if you were, yeah, they can, there's legal.

as Gwen and it's like, let me tell you, even as a white passing Eastern European woman, there are some people you'll never be white enough for and I've been treated differently because of that. you know, being, including being asked like every single day at work when I'm gonna have children or like. being tasked with doing like dishes and stuff like that in an office where I was supposed to be the office manager. So yeah. crazy girl asked me if we eat dogs.

Like she really asked that of me and like I would shriek to HR with that. I was like, hell the fuck no, you did not. You did not. And so it was just weird. and I think she was really just trying to ask that like earnestly and it still was like, girl, why would you even like, this is work. Like I'm not your friend. And even if I was your friend, like that's not you. it is, earnestly racist, like, okay, like, yeah.

whenever you know And I could just sense like the the change of tone and attitude with them from when they thought I was like 100 % white versus when they learned that I wasn't and like it was just you know night and day and uh and sorry we have to wrap this up but the reason that we suggest um going to a lawyer rather than HR is because HR exists to protect the company, to protect the money, to protect the longevity.

So the only thing that really works with these people is to get an outside counsel and just, like I said, just see what you can do. I again, I don't know exactly how things work but in the US, Most consultations with a lawyer are free, like you're just calling them and a lot of them will take on your case for free and then they'll just take a cut of the winnings. you know, hopefully y'all have a similar setup again. Sorry, we're not legal experts on all of that, but please look into it.

Call around, you know, leave some messages at some law firms and get maybe get advice on them on how you should. kind of proceed out these last few weeks. Like should you be gathering evidence or is this the kind of thing that's gonna be too hard to prove and maybe I'll settle on a different route. But definitely, definitely my biggest advice would be to call around for some legal advisement. and be professionally petty.

Yes. And professionally gray rock and wherever you can and then be petty wherever you can safely. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. because like it's just if any way you can know you can get your lick back I want you to get your lick back like I wish that for all women all women everywhere get your lick back going to blow back on you, though. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. yourself. All right. Well, we will see some of y'all in the crumpet segment that we're going to go record right now.

We got to decide what it's going to be about. before we go, let's read our poll from last week.

So the question was, lived in a world where women's consent was always respected, What would feel most different in your daily life? And the options were A. I would wear whatever I want without fear of being harassed. B. I'd go for a walk at night without feeling anxious. C. I would express my boundaries without being punished for it. And D. I would stop second guessing myself in uncomfortable situations. would say B for me, because that sounds so peaceful.

Imagine just being able to go walk outside and see the stars and not have to be so concerned about your environment and who's making sounds next to you and just keeping your guard up. Imagine if you could just let your guard down, because the most exhausting part about being a woman is just always having to have this constant vigilance. And it's mentally taxing. I know. Imagine you could like put your headphones on at night.

Like. Wow. I see some women, you know, putting their headphones on at the gym and it's like, gosh, I wish I could, I wish I could, but I'd be so, I'm so paranoid that, you know, that somebody's like doing some shit behind me and like, I'm, can't hear it or I can't like sense it. Like I just, dulls my senses and I just, I want to be able to, I guess anticipate for whatever, but that's, that's just me. Most gyms have mirrors on all four walls or at least two of them. I'm always working out.

Whenever I did, to go to I don't go to the gym no more. whenever I did, was always like, I'm always looking through the mirror behind me. I always have my music on full blast. Because the goal is to tune people out. don't want to. As long as I can see what everybody's doing, I don't have to hear you. will see a woman without headphones and be like, she wants to talk She wants somebody to come talk to her like immediately. Yeah, they don't care. They don't care. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

They'll they'll motion for you to do it. Yeah that too, they'll be like... I be like, like they're bothering me. I be like, what, what? Just take one off, like what, so they can get the hint. Like what the fuck? That's what, this is the number one reason why I don't go to the gym anymore. That right there. It's fucking annoying. What about women? I'm working on hopefully it's just women. but I always do wear what the fuck I want to wear. I always have. So just like, yeah, whatever.

tried that a few times and I was like, nope, I can't do it. And I live in a safe area and it was still. Yeah. still, I'm picky with where I go. Like if I, if I'm going, and really it is only for. respectful reasons. So for an example, you know, I was going to wear this one dress that literally you could see everything, but I I was going to my boyfriend's parents' house that day. you know I'm saying? So in situations like that, that's the only time I would ever like not wear something.

But if it was just me and him, it's like, I don't give a damn. Do you think, maybe that's something we can talk about in crumpets, like do you think gym wear has gone too far? I gotta say, like, I somewhat agree with the men on this one point where it's like, gym wear has gone too far. Like, I've seen girls come with like, you know, just a tube top to like come lift weights or something and like these really itty bitty, you know, booty shorts. That's what I'm saying. disagree.

But but but we'll get into it during crumpets. Let me just say that Spotify poll agrees with with y'all's answer. The walk at night freely and the poll that we did in our Patreon. The most popular answer was I would stop second guessing myself in uncomfortable situation if women's consent was always respected. I do think that's a big one because women second guess themselves so much because we're gaslit so, much. But yes. All right.

So for our TV IPs, we will see you in crumpets where we are going to talk about whether Jim Ware has gone too far and to what extent should we be mindful of that. we will see you there. And for the rest of you all, we will see you next week. Thank you for joining us. Bye.