I say, like, I'm in therapy and so I'm trying to be healed, but like I love the opportunity for emotional vampirism of you not being healed. So like you're like I burn it down.
I'm feeding off of this.
Burn it down.
You're a toxic burn it down. You know what we do here destroy shame around sex by talking about sex. Now, let me tell you something messy. So I was at the gym, and you know, in the gym, everyone is very it's fun funny to me that everyone's very demure, if you'll allow me the terminology. They very shy about having you know, their dicks out. Understandably, there's like a listen it reeks a little bit of homophobia or whatever,
like no one's checking you out, baby. But I was putting my stuff away in the locker and this guy walked by me. He got changed and when I look back over, he was in his boxers. Now, if you know me, you know I love underwear. So no matter what, I'm checking out underwear, not in a sexual way, just because I really do like to see the cut and you know, see what people you know, vibe with or or gravitate towards.
So he's in.
Boxer briefs or maybe they're trunks. What are the difference between briefs? Briefs are not loose, right, trunks are they They're like the they're like they go to like down the thigh a little bit, but they're tighter. I think that's what
trunks are. So's he's wearing his box or trunks and I and then he I swear it again, not sexually, but he does bend over to pick up something, and I notice that there is a hole in the back, not a hole, but like a purpose not like a not a rip hole, but uh, you know, a purposeful hole. It looks like the pea hole. And I was like, oh, wow, are these like sexy underwear? Like is that He's like? Is that like a peekable home for sex? So bold
and which is listen. I don't put it past anyone because there are guys who wear jock straps to the gym, which that's different conversation, but I do. For me, jockstraps are like a sexy thing. So if you were to the gym where you know you're gonna be changed in front of people. To me, I'm like, what you try to what you're trying to get into daddy anyway. So I was like, oh, my goodness, he has like a little peckaple hole in the back of his box. Thirst that's wild, And then I realized it was it was
it was actually he was wearing them backwards. I don't know if he like didn't feel that, because I would feel that. But also it made me go two things. One, should we start merch where we have underwear that has like a little pikaboo in the back so that you know, when you're getting sexy, you lay on your stomach and then your partner just wetches a little pee hole open and licks your booty hole.
I don't know.
But the other thing I would like to say is the underwear ugly. That's really like they were not attractive underwear. I would never say this to this young gentleman because that's not you know, you know, that's not helped. They always say, if you can't change something in ten seconds, if somebody can't change a thing about them whatever you're commenting on in ten seconds, don't tell them. So you know, you don't be like, hey, your hair, I don't your
hair color, I don't love it. Because they can't change that in ten seconds. So this underwear he couldn't change because he's at the gym. He only got the one pair. So I would never say, sir, your underwear it's ugly. Also, what a wild way to start a conversation at a locker room anyways, but it just made me go, hey, I just think that men should really invest in underwear. That's really what this all is about. I think it's okay.
I don't know who needs to hear this, especially like straight men or gay men who really love and value their masculinity or whatever that is. Hey, your underwear can be sexy, babe, Like you can invest in your underwear. You can invest in your socks, you know what I'm saying. And also you have to update and refresh your underwear
and your socks every so often. Honestly, I would say like every six months, please at least every year, because you know, your underwear, your socks, these are things that are directly on your body and they get tingy and you deserve, baby, You deserve clean, fresh, nice, beautiful sexy undergarments. Undergarments that feels so dated, but but you know what I'm saying, you deserve that. So I just want to
encourage y'all to look up some sexy underwear. This was by the one that he was wearing, and I did take notice because again I love underwear. It was a Joe Boxer moment. Would shout out to Joe Boxers. I don't know where you get them, but like shout out to that brand. But this particular this particular color and
cut was not was not the vibe. So maybe maybe Joe Boxer wants to do a collaboration and I can support you and making sexy underwear because everybody deserves sexy underwear like that is not just like a woman thing or like a bottom thing. Everybody deserves sexy underwear. So to the straight men listening, the three of you go get you some sexy underwear. Okay, okay. Oh by the way, welcome to the show. This is tell me something messy. I am your host, Brandon Kyle Goodman aka Messy Mother.
You can call me whatever you want, but today maybe call me peek a boo hole. My god, that's when I have my husband call me when I get back home. Okay, peek a boo hole come here. Okay. So before we get into our guest for the day. I do have a little life update. You might have seen it on Instagram, or if you follow me on subsack, you might have read about it. But let me also say it here on the pod, I am, as you already know, I'm
non binary. But I had been using he, him and they them pronouns, but now I am exclusively using they them their's pronouns again. On subsack, I wrote a whole little essay why, and on Instagram there's a whole announcement. So I'll let you find it there for more information, or we'll also put it in the show notes. We'll put the link to both of those things in the show notes. But what that does mean is from time
to time for the next couple months. Actually, because we've recorded quite a number of episodes, you may hear guests refer to me still with him pronouns. It's just because we recorded all those episodes before I decided to go to them exclusively. So I just want you to know that, just a little heads up so you're not feeling like somebody is misgendering or that it's a foosball moment. Okay, beautiful, all right? Uh, doorbell maybe you know what that means.
It is time for a guest. Now, while they get situated, we'll get our messy. Key key started with the whole man. Do repeat after me aloud or in your head. Grant me the serenity to unpack my shame, the courage to heal, the wisdom to know that sex is not just about penetration, the audacity to advocate for my pleasure and boundaries. The strength to not call my ex that fuck boyfuck girl, or fuck they, for it is better to masturbate by myself in peace than to let someone play in my
motherfucking face. Let the community say holuvia. I am so excited to have Blakely Thornton on this show. Blakelee is a brilliant pop culture anthropologist, and his sharp and funny takes on celebrity culture, fashion, etc. Never misses. In twenty twenty three, he created an executive produced a series called Queer Sports for Vice News, and he's now in development of a podcast called Immediately Know about the Power of personal boundaries. You can catch him covering the met Gala
red carpet for Instagram, amongst many other exciting developments. Blakely has completed brand partnerships with Arewon, Jessica mccurmac and Neutrient Ginet. Y'all, please welcome Blakely to the show. Hi, blake Lee, Hello, welcome to the show. I'm so happy you're here. I feel like when I when I'm saying I need guests, were like, which guests should I have? People always said Blakely, want to see Blakely and Brandon.
I feel like this is like the synergy because like, I'll talk shit immediately. Remember when we did the Goho See and they wouldn't put us together?
I do.
I was like, this is what the whites are doing. I was like, they want to type because I was so excited. I was like, he will get me.
We would have a thing.
We'll be going back.
And Ryan was also there, Ryan slay God. Ryan was also like they never put us together.
They never put They put one negro at a time, one day negro. We can't have two because if it was to the kikey would be it would just be called the Kiki.
Absolutely. Wait, okay, so before we get in, I would love to give you the messy mandates for our messy key key. I love that things get to be unprocessed. Any thoughts or opinions. Dared get to have the right to evolve, shift, or change today, tomorrow or ten years from now. As we were talking about the internet is about now, but podcast nuance evolution, and during the key key, if something feels too personal or unintentionally offends, we use the safe word foosball gives us a chance to pause
and address or pivot accordingly. Got it, you got it? Okay, cool man. So let's play a lube breaker. Okay, you ready? Yes, smash her pass? Okay, the Real Housewives. Oh, I know I didn't give you. I didn't give you a city, but let's start with just the Real Housewives. Smash or pass, Smash smash.
Honestly, it's anthropological interesting. Okay, yeah, is there a favorite city New York?
Really? The new one or the old one? Let's talk about it, come on both.
The old one got too racist. It absolutely becomes decrepit. It's like it was actually a case study in how someone can be entertaining but also like almost Trump is and like Ramona Singer is a racist and a Trump or she knows this, yes, but it's like, oh, she's funny, and I think adding Ebony a black woman kind of just roid the cognitive uncomfortable season, so they couldn't like they were like, oh, this is what happens when like you integrate, which is like why they were avoiding it
for so long. But then the New New York they got the lesbian soft less Yeah, black girls like black girls, you know, like you get a car, you get a car, you get a car.
They're like, here's here's the United Colors of benefit.
And in the second season they're coming into their messiness.
Okay, smash or pass boxer briefs.
Wait, are they moisture wiking material or cotton?
Get out of my studio, nigga, get out of my studio. I don't know what do you want them to be?
Baby cotton boxer briefs pass moisture wicking like under armour and moisture wicked oysture wicking like like you got minformance material.
You know.
That leaves chocolates. I don't eat those pieces are for pores. Get your credit, Get your credits a moisture wit and eight fifty. I want to gear a Deli's chocolate bitch.
Bitch, there you go say it, imperial.
I can't spell gear Deli, so.
I pass on boxer briefs. I want, I want to I want a jockstrap on a throng. I want a brief, but a boxer brief. It is just so loose.
See, that's why you need the moisture wicking. They stay tight if it's the right material, the cotton ones. Is that not trunks? No?
No boxer briefs oister wicking.
Yes, Like like like what do they feel like?
They feel like this placement? What they feel like?
They feel like it's almost like a spandex like underarmoor like that, like the tight stuff on like a shirt, but a brief made a boxer brief made of that?
Is it compression?
Yes, compression, a boxer compression.
Something loose. I want something that shows.
Exactly a boxer compression short.
You would like that, Okay, I'm gon google this.
You have a phone on moisture, moisture wick Y, moisture, win last one, smash sure pass masks I'm talking about like sex mask like like anonymous masks.
Like I'm not into it. Okay, I respect those for other people, but i feel like I've experienced them a couple of times and it's just like it makes for awkward, like talk afterwards. Whom I'm talking to, what's happening here? Or like you're obviously you're married with kids and you live in Mexico City, but like.
What's going on?
Just like I'm not gonna take a picture.
I'm not gonna tell me about it. Yeah, let me know. Come on, but do you drop the pen. I'm kind of a pass on the masks of it all. It looks hot, That's why it looked like one. I sweat easy, lazy, so I just took called my cardigan so I sweat easily. And then also, like if I can't see your face, I don't know even if I trust you, I want trust you. It's a suspicion.
You're wearing a mask.
You're wearing a mask exactly. I want to know what's happened. Also, I get turned on. I'm such a face person. I get turned on by a good, beautiful smile, and I feel like the mask I used to see it smile, but it doesn't. That's creepy.
That's very like, it's very Ryan Murphy. Yes, I bet money he's in damasks.
Blakely, You're right, okay, well fabulous, you won you know what you're wearing here my unconditional love. You did look down like you were looking for some money. What you about to show me my unconditional love? Baby, that's more important. Yeah, thank you, and I'm knowing that. Thank you. Some people don't appreciate. Okay, y'all, If you have any loop breakers or prompts, you can email me at tell me something messy at gmail dot com. Speaking of which lately, yes,
will you tell me something messy? I don't know why instead of like that that was creepy again, blakely, tell me something messy.
Okay, I'll say something messy. Yeah, this is interesting for me just logistically. I had a friend who we went to Palm Springs from Oilden last year and he met this couple and he said they really wanted to eat pineapple out of his ass. Oh, and like that, logistically that's messy because I was just out of his ass and yet yeah, so.
Not on it, but like I wanted to put the pineapple okay, go ahead.
And then again exactly I had questions like is it chopped?
Yeah?
Chunk? Yeah?
Are we cutting them? Like little dick?
I was just asking questions because I was like, okay, So even logistically, like did you go in there? They had a bowl chopped and ready. Yes, scus was it.
A surprise fresh pineapple?
Fresh? The whole foods was an airworm.
I want to talk about it as a from Trader Joe.
Like I had. I was just like I need you to draw me a diagram at a time, like like storyboard this. Ye.
Yeah, so that was. Have you ever had anyone eat pineapple out of your air or anything out of your Have you eaten anything out of anyone else's ass?
Yes, well not out of but on it. Yeah obviously again I'm an adult.
What did you eat?
It was like the standard like strawberries and cream stuff? Wow, yeah, I'm.
Kind of cream like a whip cream.
Like a whip cream, like a cool Actually was cool. Get out of.
The cool whip Oh my goodness.
Wait what's the one?
Oh look at that voice. Sultry? Okay, it was sultry then too. Wait walk me through strawberries and cream?
Does?
Okay? So walk me through? Yes, how is the person? They're on their stomach, on their back.
On stomach, stomach, stomach, booty up, bowl of strawberries to the side like they were prepared. Okay, so they brought this something he wanted.
Oh he wanted, yeah, okay, and so then.
So what kind of just like chop strawberry up on the bootyhole? Rugoff, you know, okay, and where does the cream come in later lately?
Take me to that time when it comes in.
The strawberry was actually more of like a delivery tool for the cream. So you dip the strawberry in the cream on the bootyhole and then you eat it house seed, not out again. It never went in and out. I it was just a roll of power to everybody. But once it's been in there, I don't want to all the way. I don't really physically want to eat that and digest it.
Got it? That's fair.
I mean that's for me. I mean that's your You might call that prude. I just yeah, if you want to make sure it's you know, it's.
Still the booty hall, as you said, it's still.
You know or exactly yeah, it's not my, it's not my you know, I'm playing in away game.
Oh my god. Okay, Wow, that was really lovely sex education. This is what we're doing. Okay, it's time for messy mail. You want to sing this a little messy male theme song? Because that sultry, messy.
Male is the one booties and mess man go.
Me in. Yes, okay, this one says, my my seituationship misses me and is now willing to go on dates?
Do I trust them? Did you do you want to go on dates? That's oh, it sounds like you do. You wrote a letter about it. Oh you Aliah, you wrote a papa. Yeah, but go But that's.
Actually t What you just said is actually important. It's like, do you want to You're asked like somebody can ask you out, but do you want to go?
Also, if you're asking if their trustworthy, maybe it's like he's going to steal my credit.
My feeling is if you are asking if you trusted, you shouldn't know your intuition. Now your intuition has you right in to ask if you should go on a date, and do you trust it?
Feel like it's giving the goodness to your social security.
Yeah, it's giving identity for aud and.
So honestly do it for the story. For the story.
Oh my goodness, because it's.
Not gonna hurt me. So I say dealing yes and jump in that pool.
And tell us what it's like. Now, let me ask you this do you do things for the story. What's the last thing you did for this story? Oh, you don't have to tell us, but you could. But you don't have to, but if you want to, it's a foosball. I just don't know if he listens to podcast, Oka saying, I don't know if he listens to podcast. Okay. This one says, going on a date with my ex's friend, hoping to have a messy time. Have you ever.
I'll have done that? We come on, have we all?
We've gone on a date with your exis friend. You're looking at me like.
You apostrophe period period? You know you have have I negro.
I have definitely fucked somebody's Yeah, yeah, come on, but it was just sex. It wasn't okay, okay, it wasn't like a full day. It is a date messay. Actually a date is message. I feel a date. It's messy because it's like emotional.
Actually, I love this person. You're like an unhealed scorpio. I say, like, I'm I'm in therapy and so I'm trying to be healed, but like I love the opportunity for emotional vampirism of you not being healed. So like you're like, I'm burning it down. I'm feeding off of this, burn it down. You're toxing, But I love that burn it down. I'm not in my own life, but if I mean this is feeding my soul.
We love the mess.
This is twenty twenty two. Give me, give me some self, honey, let's start fires and fights. I actually got it started to fight at your birthday party in twenty twenty two.
You did that. Literally, what are you'all fighting about?
I just cust him out. I don't even know why. It is something stupid And I was like, well, I buy that, But it was just like I was on the right amount of are you harry Scorpio?
Would scorpio scorpios? I have arias and scorpio and my ears and scorpio.
It's something and I was just ready to go off. You said it, yeah, not today, Satan, and I did it?
Would you do today?
Though?
Twenty twenty four?
No at all? Like who truly? Therapy work?
Therapy does work. I would have been like me, okay, yes see therapy, that's a real girl.
Why am I going to fuck up my night?
Why will I fuck up my night over you?
But I see what I might do is if I like, if I knew he was allergic to something, I might like mildly poison cut that cut that.
Cut that uh, not like deadly deadly, but like a little like you know, a little bloated.
Yeah, or or like you know, like you're lack some tolerant I put like whole milk in your coffee.
That's not light at all. Yes, it is that nigga will be diarrhea but not dead. Okay, this one says I visited family, I couldn't host this beautiful man, so we fucked all over the building stairwell. I mean, I guess fabulous.
Wait, people, I need more details.
I know they don't be giving me a lot all the details, like.
What kind of building? Where is it? Is it a brownstone? Is it a doorman building.
I'm imagining I'm imagining it's not a doorman building because it's too much security. It's like a regular building, like a regular party.
I know, because you could go into like the gym.
Oh sure, they're in the stairwell. I've seen those videos on only Fans where niggas are fucking in the stairwell and it really I mean, it's hot, but also like I couldn't.
I couldn't just logistically, I don't have that energy.
I don't. I can't pull my pants.
Also your family yeah, also your family in the building too, Yeah, like your little cousin or maybe they fucked.
In a different building, like no, we fuked all over the building stairwell never mind, Yeah, with their families building.
You don't like your family.
I mean, also, why couldn't you host them?
Honestly, this is giving the families home of phobe fair like vengeance.
Well also, like, even if your family is like pro homo, would you still bring a man off a grinder back to that Christmas vacation?
Oh, this is a grinder house. I'm assuming I was thinking like Thanksgiving.
Well, I mean I don't know a visiting family, so I'm assuming it could be a holiday and so like you're back at your home. Oh my god, I literally.
Thought, like, this is a person you liked in your family? Was homophobias?
Oh you went there?
No?
No, no, no, I think they I think they were just a visiting family and they couldn't have somebody in their you know, childhood bedroom, and so they were sucking the stairwell.
Okay, okay, I mean not at this it's fine you do. I would not.
I'd be like, you know what, those stairs are hard knees.
Also, I'm more I'm more interested in the person that said yes to this. Well. It's like I can't, but I can sucking the stair with my mom in the theother.
Room, Like why don't you say? I think you leave that fart off? But I fuck you in the stairwell. I feel like that's a kink, right. Public play? Have you ever had public play?
I don't think so.
I fucked an alleyway once. I feel like, if you're near a gay bar, it's.
Not really like if you're a hot dog Sunday or it's like, okay, you're like you're feeling yourself that day, but like nobody's gonna I don't think anybody's gonna take a picture.
Yeah, public play would be at Target, which is like, yeah, that seems.
Big box stores, yeah, fast food chain, casual.
Yes. But if you Chick fil A, I'm actually for you. Gay sex a Chick fil A. That's that's radical, that's protests, that's protests. I'm actually I call that a du oh wow, doula peep.
God bless her. Yeah, God bless her learning to dance. Kind of Yeah, she did it, did she?
And this is why they.
Didn't put us together on that show. I'm gonna really, I'm gonna. I had so much contempt for them, but they really saw something I did.
They were like, no, you can't, this is we won't get through the show. Okay, this one said. The throuble ended because we caught our third cheating with his ex. His ex has a husband, So I told him, this.
Is wait, whoa, you're an asshole. You're an asshole? Whoever?
This is thule ended because we caught our third cheating with his ex X has a husband, So I told him, told the oh told the.
Exes husband, you're an asshole. That's your Okay, that's that's homophobic. That's homophobic.
That's yeah, you're not for the cause.
That'shobic. That's a little too far your business. Also, like, you're in kind of a polyamer a situation you're in. If you're calling someone your third, then you're tearing them down.
You're in a higher ARCA.
You didn't say one of the people did this, Y said our third, which means you're an asshole, which control free. I don't like you. I don't like your face, I don't like your aura, I don't like anything that self hating gay you a messy bit, and I invite you to fight me.
Inviting someone to fight you is wowd meet.
Me into Mecula, Meet me into Mecula, bitch.
If I can say this, if you ever get an invitation to fight, don't take it like that person. I'll kill you exactly, exactly exactly. If somebody says I invite you to fight, run.
Run a man. If a gay man from Texas invites you to meet him into Mechula on a podcast.
He baby, he's gonna fight you, fight you, well, I would say I'm angree with which is I I hate that the third well, let's call him the the person that rounds out your throatle. I hate that they cheated on you, But I also don't think that telling the ex's husband is so hurtful.
It just felt like, let's mess up everybody. Yeah, let's mess up everybody ship, Like why why didn't you confront the third person?
The third person? And also like, I don't know if.
You're sleeping with your ex or confront the x and maybe he went to his ex because you treat him like a fucking third.
So so blakely'st meet you into Maculam. I love that Blakely is gonna tell you the crimes on the vodcast. We're gonna turn this legend allegedly allegedly, and then we'll do a follow up episode when we turn this pod into a crime pot.
Also, I would like shooting Gatwa to play me in the Menaz Brother's remake of it.
How dare you? Ryan? Are you listening?
It needs to be highly homorized.
Please just shooting if there's not anything happening. I don't I'm not gonna fight.
This person in a speedo, but when Ryan films it, I would like shooting in those thighs. Yes, and oh, I don't know why I would have a speed that makes no sense.
Not those boxer breaks. Never need to Ryan Murphy shows anyways. This one said, oh, and this one will be we can have a real key key This says. I want to connect more in gay spaces, but find it hard because I tend to talk about things that maybe are too deep, and everyone seems to just want to talk about partying or working out. It sounds cliche, but it's been my experience. We're supposed to be such a liberated community.
Why do so many gay men not like to talk about their feelings, especially around relationships and sex like a like a light.
I love this person that had some they had some subject verb agreement. Come on, you know, there were people, places and things. I really set to see that.
Yeah, respond vulnerable.
I think it's interesting. I actually find myself confronting this a lot too. I think it's the fact that being queer in and of itself is an identity for better or for worse, that is rooted in risk or rejection from family, from friends, for identity. So I feel like we all it's almost cellularly encoded in us to avoid that in our adult lives or avoid that feeling which
is very which is very similar. So I feel like we talk about partying or fun or sex, but when it comes to like deepness and emotions and identity, we have to like announce ourselves to the public, which is still a thing. So it's like it's that's that's something we don't we have to we risk that exposure just to be ourselves. And I think once we get over that hump, we don't want to then go deep and examine the why of it all.
Yeah, yeah, I feel like when you're so when I think about, you know, gay spaces and you know, listen, my experience with gay spaces is very much limited to Los Angeles and New York, which I will one hundred percent say is very different than my experiences when I've gone to even like a San Francisco or or something yeah or yes, or to Madrid. But my experience there particularly, I'll say in LA is that I feel like a bunch of gays left their towns, descended upon a big city.
They left those towns, many of us, probably because you experienced rejection or bullying or oppression of some kind. And now you're in this free space, but you don't know
how to claim reclaim your power. And so your power actually comes from posturing, exactly, from holding and from not being vulnerable, and that or that's how you feel your power comes from, yes, And so then it becomes hard to connect with people on deeper subjects outside of you know, how many salads you eat a day, because the healing has therapy has exactly, the healing hasn't happened.
People don't want to examine the why. Yeah, I'm a very curious person. I always say like, I'm the boy that like never gets invited to like the orgy or the group sex, and like what are we doing? Are we all having sex right now? Like I'm down for it? I need to like know what's going on? Yes. And I often think because I came out like kind of late and I played college football, that I read nonverbal cruising as violence. When you were like look at me, I'm like, what the fuck do you want?
Then it could be like absolutely could be like it could.
So I never gained that skill because I didn't have it in my late teens early twenties. I was just like, oh, you want to fight? Yes, But yeah, I just think it's about like nobody wants to examine the why because I don't think we want to experience any further judgment. I think I'm all. I think being open and queer. It's about like constant communication. I think you're so good at it, Like Messy, there's actually a deeper feeling and meaning to Messy Mondays, which is living authentically you and
knowing why you are here. We are without shame, And I think that's kind of like your brand, even though it's funny and it's pithy. But I think, you know, if somebody says like, oh, I like I took no ten dicks at the Eagle, I'm like, why was that fun? And people they implied judgment on that, but I'm like, no, I just want to know why, like, and I don't think that person has I think often when people reject that,
it's because they haven't examined it. Yes, and I think that there's often that there's a there's an excitement shame spial with our behavior. Instagram has created body dysmorphia.
Oh my god.
You know it's like there's always someone better, there's always someone more interesting. I've been to these pool parties where it's all these bros that are on cycles or like you see these kids way to party and people like go in the back to like do kedemineum, like we know you're doing drugs. We're adults, just do drugs and bumbody. I know. It's just a weird thing of like hiding the behavior that we know you're doing. If there's a cognitive dissonance there where I was like, there's one kids
like you want some rooms? I was like, no, thank you, But I like you for just coming up and asking a normal human being.
Which actually in some ways creates more trust because I know what's happening here exactly, I can trust. But the hiding is because there's not a trust, which, if you really think about it, is kind of built into our our queer DNA. We've had to have a hyper awareness and couldn't always trust our surroundings, and so that kind of continues even.
In our Even in queer spaces, you skip the steps. It's like you go to a party and you're like, oh, there's an orgy going on upstairs. No one said anything, Yeah, no one's no one's telling you they're going and coming back, right,
it's just happening, yes. And I think it's because it's like there's the open, there's the public self, and then there's like the desire which we kind of there's an internal shame that nobody is speaking about where somebody I wish there were people woul being like the Orges at two thirty, there's where you can shout yes, I'd be like, oh that's the vibe. I'm like cool, the drugs are in this room. The in this room, yes, Like people
have written on their cup like what they like. You can go and talk to them, or you can just come and drink and smoke weed and like listen to music. Yes, like there are levels of the party.
Those are the best parties to me where which are very rare, but when they when they've been curated, where it's like here's sweed and here's the drinks and your cup color means there's your level. Choose your level, choose your ya baby right, Yes, yes.
I'm like because sometimes I'm like I come in and I went to a party again Memorial Day and they were like, oh, we had a human centipede last night, and I was like, I thought this cent people was like a place. I was like, oh a bar, Oh it's a bar. I'm like, oh no, I don't. I don't know. I'm like, that's not for me. But I love that you guys did that. Yes, I love that you were interested in it because for me, like, that's just logistics getting on my knees ten people in a circle.
That sounds like a lot of work.
Did somebody today who did? I don't want to be behind that, Like, those are the questions I would have, which is why I'm never going to end up there.
Yeah, that's fair.
I'm just like, who ate who didn't? Who didn't? Yeah?
Who do I trust in this? Exactly?
The bottle of butts?
That's t But I think what you brought up, you know, like if you do have the the you know, the the gang bang or the train or the human centipede, do you know why? And it's not that you always have to interrogate, but I think it's people some people never And it's not that it's bad right now, it's fabulous, But are you doing it for your pleasure or you doing it to numb out?
Exactly?
Are you doing it for your pleasure because you want to or because you think it's how you're supposed to be. Something I come up against with gay men specifically, is people expressing that they feel like they have to be this kind of gang yes, which is a gay that is just truly promiscuous and something that moves, and they feel weird about needing a little more emotional connection exactly.
And it's like, no, like both of those things are correct, you just kind of have to know why, you're Like, I've.
Dealt with that and like kind of like I love the rejection of heteronormativity, but I also think it comes to it can metastasize into people just doing whatever the fuck they want and being kind of selfish. Yes, because I feel like, okay, cool, if you can be we can be ethically no monogamous. But if I want to know for my safety and you don't want to tell me, okay, that's that. Let's discuss why.
Yes.
And people are like, no, you're judging me. No, I'm not. I'm just saying, like, I want to know, just because again, I'm a scorpio, I'm a fucking water side, Like I don't want to get embarrassed. And we're going out in public and you're having sex somebody I don't you're having sex with.
Yeah, I'm curious, And I also I know that I know how.
To interact with that person. I'm not going to go punch them. But I'm like, I'm aware, so I'm not blindsided by something. And I think people want to do the thing without saying anything. They want to fulfill whatever need they have impulsively with themselves, without explaining themselves or without any kind of like care for the other person, especially when your relationships. I was dating somebody and I
was like, we're not we're not together. But I had moved from LA to New York and I or New York to LA, and I didn't have my prep and I was like, okay, well for the for the time being, could you like use a condom when you have these other people? And they're like no, And I was like okay. But I was like okay. I literally just said, just like okay, that hurts my feelings. But I get it, like because I'm like, we're not together. But I was like,
why are you mad? Like I don't like what you're saying is the opportunity, the opportunity to have sex unprotected with other people is more important to you than the relationships. The relationship, Like no, it's what I was saying, Like, no, that's literally what you're saying, and that is okay, sure, And I think I think that's the thing too, is we're all invested in the idea of ourselves being good people.
You can do something that hurts someone's feelings and still be okay, but you have to recognize that what you want might hurt someone's feelings.
I think that's so interesting. Interesting Is that the right word? But there's a lot of juice there because I'm so curious about kind of like the shadow of self, because you know, I do want to be a good person and my highest self. I'm always evolved, I never fight, you know, but I'm also human. Yeah, we're also human, and so that is kind of the hard part is knowing that you might make a mistake or you might do something that hurts somebody, and so how do you
hold yourself accountable? How do you show up as opposed to walling off or running away or gas lighting or making other person wrong. Being able to understand, oh, I have a misstep here, or like I made a mistake or I did something that hurts somebody's feelings. I can say I'm I say this to my boyfriend all the time, Like I'm not afraid of saying I'm sorry. Yeah, like I used to be, and like now it's like it comes for free, Like I'm okay with also obviously the
change behavior. Yeah, but I think it's like reckoning with your shadow side. That's like, oh, I will make mistakes and I will do something that might disappoint you or hurt you. In fact, that is a relationship.
Adding people avoid that feeling so much that it creates more toxic behavior. They want to avoid the fact that they hurt you so much, and they will gaslight, deny the reality, reframe it into something that is completely different, and like, I did this that hurts your feelings. I'm sorry. It's very very simple. We learn it when we're in kindergarten. But like the ability of adult men and adult gay men, especially in major cities to do it seems to be somewhat regressing.
Well, you know what's I think interesting about that or why that's connected to is is gay men are not exempt from being men, right, And I think that sometimes and like I'll talk about I think white men especially suffer from this where it's like, because you're gay, you think that you haven't been socialized as a man, and a lot of men socialized do not have a connection to their emotions exactly, Like we're just not exactly societally
raised to connect with your emotions. But you think, I'm gonna say you lot, but we think that if we're gay or queer, suddenly we're evolved. Yeah, and it's like, no, not quite. You still have a lot of that male socialization that hasn't been interrupted, and so you you're just showing up toxically. It's like the emotional top.
It's like the emotional version of like everybody always saying gays are stylish when they just like they really justs wear tighter clothes. Yes, like if you've been to high Tops on a Sunday, we're not the most.
Stylist baby world. If you look around everyone's and of the guilty of this. It's a crop top and a white sneaker.
Exactly, And you know it's not like we have a uniform, but it's not necessarily chic. Yes, yes, but going back to emotions, I completely agree you've been socialized as a man, and I think I would say even more so. White gay men are not aware of their privilege in terms of like, oh, no, you've lived life with the of
a cis white man. But for this one thing, yes, and that comes with a lot of that comes with you not having to interrogate yourself on the level that somebody who is a minority does, or alone somebody who is trans does level one, somebody who is a combination of those, yes.
Or even like yeah, you're you know, even I think a femme white boy might experience a little wake up. But that but that femininity. Piece of it too, is that these.
Like you know, Chicago KPMG bankers who are one eighties and five eleven with dirty blonde hair, think they're like evolved because they suck a dick. It's not this not the case, Brian.
And I hear Brian, we need to say that out loud. I think I think it's what's interesting is we uh is hiding is avoiding. That is avoiding saying that, avoiding looking directly at that and saying, oh, you have work here, your shadows side, you have work here to do as well.
It's a It's interesting also in these career spaces, and I always say, like I think I've talked to you maybe like Vincent about it. Like when we go to a party and like the only black people there are like mildly famous. That's a red flag for me. Yeah, that's a fucking red flag for me. I go somewhere and it's only like you, Vincent, a little nase and you're just.
Like, we gotta run, absolutely get out. Absolutely. I I one hundred percent agree because it's like, oh, one, why am I the minority in this space? That's not really quite making sense, And just gently interrogating like what are these spaces and where am I showing up? And why am I showing up? And what why are we showing up? And what are the experiences the other black people in
these spaces are having? And I'm curious when you and we may not be able to know, but like, if you see that house and there are three only three black guys, and you know twelve white guys, and the three black guys are especially beautiful, what do you think is happening in their head?
I think I think one the black experience and the black gay experience is on a monolith, sure, depending on what the way you grew up, depending on the way you identify and your value system. I think there are certain black people that crave inn adjacency to whiteness and that and they think that validates them in some way.
And you'll find that in the way they speak and the people they date, and the things they in, the things, the things they say about other black men, and they are willing to say in a white space because I'll say, I'll yell, i'll yeo, we got forty five minutes, I get to see another Negro where I'm leaving. I literally did this yeah. I was like, and they can't be famous. Yes,
that does not count. And I'll say that and if you're like, also that to my white friends and they'll be like tea, Like I'm yeah, Like that's the test. Like if I say that shit to you and you're like like, then you don't really get it.
Absolutely so.
But I think with the like I was at a pool party and it was like maybe two of us and then literally fourty five minutes they were just came and I was like, we gotta go. That doesn't count. We leave it. We believe right now that we said not famous. Yes, But there was one other boy there and it was just giving, like he is giving, he was there for work. The way the man was talking to him was like like like it was a controlling
of the body. I see that too, and I wonder it's like, oh, do you just want access to this space fiscally? Do you think you're going to gain something? And that also affects the way people talk to you, because I've had older white men talk to me like that, like I looked about your clothes. I'm like, well, I work in fashion. I can give them for fucking free. You're talking to you and I think it's coded in
the way they approach the relationship. They're like, oh, I'm older and white and you're younger and black, so I can talk to you as such, or they talk to you like you're an object.
That's always I tend yes, well, especially and I'm going to market to their to the generational too. Yeah, but like the way that an older white man, old white men have spoken to me, it's always curious.
And I blow it up immediately. I'm just like, I was like, I'm not spoken to you like that. Do not call me boy contextual that, And I was like, I'm also like, I'm very aware of being like hyper sexualized. If you're going to come at me like as an older Caucasian man, you to come at me mentally, you need to be like I remember things about my day, about my preferences, talk to me especially like a person.
But I'm like if you're like, oh, but I'm like, nope, if everything's about the body, if everything's about giving you a nude and like, no, the.
Moment I hear I love that black dick, I'm out. Oh, I'm out the moment somebody highlights my skin or I'm out blocked like, what are we talking about?
I think what's so what is so confounding.
Confounding or or tintillating about all of this is that one there's so much nuance, and what we don't talk about is there so much pain. So even to me for the two black guys that that always are at the party with the white boys or the white boys trying to be extra mask and particularly they don't watch
Drag Race all of it, I'm like, there's so much pain. Yeah, there's so much desire to be normal, to fit in, and so much energy being spent on that, which is why there isn't the ability to go deep because there's so much time being spent on.
But I think you hit it on the nail. People are avoiding pain. Yeah, they're avoiding like the thing they're avoiding talking about is the thing that makes them feel rejected or shameful in some sense, and that to substance is like it's really just the blanket state will be internalized homophobia. I don't want drag race, but I'm still I'm a bro. I'm gonna dude, I'm not that kind of gay.
I'm not that gay.
I'm not You don't do that like I'm just like a brother, like Dick, I'm like, what what what Max Mappien is?
That was a straight man? Shut up?
Like it's early people were like, oh, like I've had a man be like, oh you pat your nails? Could you not see that? In THEE It's different now, like I'm sorry, it's the pink jail set today, but like, yeah, I do.
I hate I also like I hate the mask for mask, which you know, listen, I hate when people say preferences, which I'll probably do an episode on what preferences are. But it's like when you say that to me, I'm going, oh, you're not actually curious, because where did your preferences come from?
And also you're kind of about performance. Also, your sexuality is performative, which means your sex will be bad.
It's not pleasure for me now, it's about it's about what this looks from mask.
It's like, so you don't really you're never gonna truly be in your body during sex, as you're more concerned with maintaining heteronormative, misogynist version of what a man is, which has no place in a bedroom where we're both sucking.
Yeah, so we're already being radical. Why are you saying like, you're already here.
We've already dot, You're already here, baby, you already hear you, Dick is hard, You're already here. There, We're both here, you already you know. Yeah, Like I remember I had attitude once. It was like he didn't want me to like cross my legs when I sat and I was like, I've been inside you.
What are we talking? Like? What are we talking? That policing of somebody else's mannerism, mannerisms of being feminine or masculine, is also something that I feel like you obviously something we learned from. Yeah, but but the fact that one would hope in an ideal world that you would come into queer spaces and be liberated of all of that, exam able to show up how you are, in whatever
way you are. But instead there becomes more policing and more and with the social media just kind of adds to it.
I think some almost like commodifies, and I say, and in the dark side of social media, it commodifies and flattens, where the thing that rises at the top isn't necessarily the most interesting and the most pleasurable. It's the thing that like causes a knee jerk reaction. The fast is like, you know, every dude having the same pose and the Charlie by MZ Speedo, which we've all done. I'm like he without saying, casts the first stone, but like, baby, it's.
Why I like whenever I see somebody, First of all, if your nails are painted, or your toes are painted, or you're not afraid to have a little makeup on, or your look softly, I know you fuck. Like I'm like, oh you're you're okay in your body exactly, okay with us, so you fuck. It's when they're not even like the most I always hands down, the more muscular they are, the more of a bottom they are, like, the bigger whatever, and the more masculine they look, I'm like that that's
the bottom. That's a they love dicking the ass. But like there's but there's which is no problem with that. It's just to me, the the presentation to try and pretend like.
Well, because they have the most arched back at all, maybe protrude exactly, I'm like, that's not how like there's a good posture, and there's like and then there's the bottoms all the time, you know, yeah, it's interesting.
My I guess my last question. I lied. I have two more questions are the questions that we asked everybody here. One. Yes, have you ever had sex on a porter potty?
No?
Would you?
No?
Do you desire it at all?
No? Waits time out. Okay, I was how's the porta potty? Is it like a Coachella luxury porter potty where there's a door, or this is like a blue porta potty?
It could be either.
Okay, a luxury Coachella one that's kind of like a comes on that trailer with the room. Yes, I need air conditioning. I needed to be a motor in the back. Yeah, I can't be having sex in like a steamy ass like I can't. No, I don't know. I don't like I've never liked anyone that much.
No.
Maybe Jonathan Bailey, who's white. I'm sorry all that ship talking, all that ship talking, all that therapy, and the way that came up was a fucking colonizer. And I recognize, and I recognize that I was being trafficked. You got more healing to do, girl, It's okay, Wow, it's okay, Jonathan Bailey, it was hot. I saw wicked yesterday. Also that my god, how was it? It was?
It was fucking great. I can't wait so good. I can't wait to see our girl. And the uh last question is what could you learn to love more about yourself?
Oh? The fact that I'm actually really sensitive? I think that's not I think there's a classic scorpio trait. But like a lot of my bluster and my humor and hubris and persona is about not feeling everything. But that's really because I'm kind of at my core, like I take every slight very seriously and kind of worry that everybody hates me all the time. But I think it's just like being like, oh it's not bad to feel
or be like that hurt my feelings. I like you this, Like just being honest with it has actually made me better. But it's that's a process I can fly back to, like fuck you die.
Yeah, but you're a teddy bear, yes you know. I would imagine also being sensitive being black man also tall football player, like being allowed.
To access thatself exactly, I think jour. I think being I think being allowed allowing myself to access it and also knowing when me accessing it in a healthy way. Is being rejected by somebody because they don't like it, you know what I mean. Like when I'm being and I'm like, I'm expressing my feels, You're like, you're being solf to that bit, She's like, no, I'm just telling you how I felt. Yeah, you don't like to hear
that from me, But they're the problem, you don't. Yeah, exactly, And that's a constant conversation.
Yeah, I bet that's beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. You know, we're healing. We're healing, we're healing. Thank you for being surviv You know, we are hoes here, but hoes with heart. So let me speak to yours. I'm actually gonna start with the last thing that Blakely said, which is that he could learn to love more his sensitivity.
And that is just something you know, I've talked about here on substack, on Instagram, anyone who will listen about softness and allowing ourselves the opportunity to be soft and allowing ourselves to understand the strength of that softness. But the key piece that I want to take away from Blakely is when you are soft, if it's not received, it doesn't mean that your softness is bad. Or that you were wrong for being soft, or you're wrong for
being sensitive, or you were wrong for being vulnerable. It just means that that person wasn't able to hold it. And that's okay. You know, sometimes people can't hold us. But that's why we hold ourselves. And I don't mean that in a way of like do it all yourself. I mean that, like your community holds you, and you build a community around you to hold you, but you
are also part of holding yourself. And so when you meet somebody who isn't able to meet you there with love, release them, you know, with love, you know they can. Maybe they're just for movie dates, you know, maybe they're just to talk about, you know, the surface level stuff and they're not there for the tender stuff. And that doesn't make them bad or you bad. But continue to
honor and hold your softness and your sensitivity. Also, you know, men, gay, men, white gay In my Loves reflect, reflect, be not afraid to poke at what is painful. Life is hard. I know we want to avoid what's painful, but it actually just makes us more harmful if we aren't aware of the ways in which we are hurting. Hurt people, hurt people, If we can't even say that we're hurting or acknowledge the ways that we're hurting. Then we are inadvertently hurting
other people consciously or not intentionally or not. But the impact is not good. So don't be afraid to reflect, don't be afraid to poke at the pain. And you know, finally, moisture wick boxer briefs are apparently all the rage, and I'm gonna have to get my money up so I can afford to buy a pair, because I don't know where you find a moisture Like, what where do y'all find moisture wick boxer briefs? And aren't boxer briefs supposed to have loose anyways? I will find me a moisture
wick because y'all know I love an underwear situation. I'm sure you've see me on my Instagram. I like to I like to wear my underwears. But I'm gonna find me a moisture wick boxer brief and I'm gonna report back, and if I don't like it, we're gonna trash Blakely. Yeah, have likely you hear this. I'm gonna come fight you. I'm gonna come fight you, Okay, I'm gonna invite you to fight me. Blakely, all right, I love y'all so much.
All Right, I gotta get out of here. But you can find Blakely on Instagram at Blakelee Thornton t h O r N t O N. You can find me on Instagram as well at Brandon Kyle Goodman. You can find our podcast at tell Me Something Messy, and you can join our community on the Messy Monday's substack. When you subscribe, you'll get weekly posts, recommendations on sex and
self and so much more. Also, I want to hear from you, so send your topic ideas, your messy stories, your submissions, your game ideas to tell Me Something Messy at gmail dot com. You can also call us at six six nine sixty nine Messy. That is six six nine six nine six three seven seven nine. Rate review and share this podcast with all your hoe and aspiring HOE friends. Really really helps the show out, all right?
Until next time, ask about the politics of that dick before you make it spit, make sure they eat the kitty buffo day meet the before fuckcation or sucation communication. And in case you haven't heard it yet, today you are so deeply loved, I Love you, Hie. Thank you so much for listening to Tell Me Something Messy. If you all enjoyed the show, send me episode to someone else who might like it. Tell Me Something Messy was executive produced by Ali Perry, Gabrielle Collins, and Yours Truly.
Our producer and editor is Vince Dejohnny. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio and the Outspoken Network, visit the iHeartRadio app or anywhere you subscribe to your favorite shows.