So normalizing, being like, I'm not okay, yeah, and that's not your problem. But I don't have to pretend I'm anything to come up here and do my job exactly. And I love it because they're such strength.
I feel like it allows you to take back your power.
You know what we do here destroy shame around sex by talking about sex.
Now, let me tell you something messy.
You know what I would really like to talk about in this moment, And it might not be long, and you know what, I really have to allow myself to let these messy stories. Sometimes it long, sometimes it's short. You know, it is what it is. But let's say the thing you know I really believe in. I think it's like a yng van ZANDT says, call a thing a thing. So let me call a thing a thing? Which is that how people can't kiss? Fight me?
If you're hot and you're upset by this.
Foosball, I'm right into me, baby, tell me something MESSI at gmail dot com.
But let's talk about it. Hot people can't kiss.
Now, listen, if they're hot, now, if you whatever your version of hot is, they might be able to. Actually, let's double back. Let's talk about what is conventionally considered hot. So whatever the conventional beauty standards that we have set, you know, like who I don't want to name, nobody, you know, you know, you know who I'm talking about. Like when I say a hot person, think about that person. They can't kiss, And I mean that from my bones.
If they've been hot the whole time, they can't do it because everyone has handed them everything their entire life, and nobody wants to give them the feedback because they so pretty. They'd be looking in their eyes and that they at they that they're at their body or whatever you find hot about them, and so nobody wants to give them feedback. And so a lot of hot people
just can't kiss. And I, being the hofessor that I am, you know, the the hoologist of thrust myself into the field of my research, my host search and have discovered that that is true. They'd be like licking and and spit in and not the good kind of spit and slobberyant or like have you ever had a bad massage?
You know this is not a visual medium, so but you know, like when you get a massage and they just be like it's like their hands are like a whisper on your shoulder and you be like, if you don't dig your elbow into it's that with the kiss, if you don't give me some passion. How people they you know, and I feel bad for them. I remember this one time.
I remember I'm gonna tell this story without Okay, let's just say this.
There was this person model, Like if I showed you a picture of them, you'd be like, oh, I've seen them like model like they they've been in campaign after campaign after campaign, a straight, straight point and I'm gonna be like, oh my god, he's so he's so hot. Friends were like, oh god, you're so hot. And I was at a party once and I got to meet them. Dull boring.
My guy was talking to me about how he makes oats.
My god was talking to me about his overnight oats and like some furniture. He was like, just like Dull boring. I was like, Oh, you're hot. You never had to get you never had to get. You know, trauma really breeds a good kisser. That's tea. That's tea. If you've been, if you had experiences, you are curious. You gotta learn
people like you know, when people shut you down. People reject you, you try to get better, You're like, well, I'm gonna come back, you know you're I think a good villain origin story really creates a great kisser, is what I want to say. Now. I I feel like this is chaotic and messy, but you understand what I'm saying.
You understand what I'm saying.
So for the people who who always been hot, like if your whole life people are like yourself, fucking pretty and you've never gotten feedback, I would like to give you feedback. Baby. You probably don't know how to kiss, and that's all right. You should just watch a YouTube video or two, you know, in fact, ask for feedback. Maybe that's what y'all shout out to the hot people listening. The people who've been hot there and tire your fucking lives,
never had to work for nothing. Will y'all please ask for feedback because I'm telling you people don't want to give you feedback, and it's stunting your life. It is. It is minimizing your growth and you have growth to do. I don't care how big your pecks are. I don't care how tight your waist is, how fat that asks, I don't care whatever the quote unquote hot politics are now I'm heated. Y'all need help?
Okay, by the way, welcome to the show.
This has to me something I see. I am your host, Brandon Kyle Goodman. Some people call me messy mom, but you could call me overnight oats period. Something came out of it, that boring ass interaction. Something had to come out of it, which was a nickname. And I you know I love a nick name. Well, let's get the show started, baby. That sound means we have a foosball. If you're new here, so foosball is our safe word. So whatever anything maybe unintentionally offends or is a little
too personal. I always tell my guests that they can say the word foosball. But I also tell you that if you have a foosball moment while listening, you can email me tell me something messy at gmail dot com. And somebody did. So let me read this messy patron's email and then I will address it and then we will continue on. Okay, So this email says I love the pod. I listen to each one and love them so much. I laugh lots, cry sometimes and learn lots.
As a two spirit trans mask being, it hits home a lot with certain topics brought to the show, so I just have a bit of a foosball moment every episode. Though at the end, when you close out and give the number, you joking only say it's for the hoes who can't spell, and that seems a little rude to our community members that may be dyslexic, never had proper supports at home or school to help with spelling, literacy, harms of colonization for BIPOC and other learning cognitive disadvantages.
I'd ask you to consider changing that phrase. Please to be more loving and inclusive to all folks, no matter their ability to communicate via texting versus talking. You're erasing the fact the black and brown folks use oral histories as facts and known truths. Please know better, do better, And there's a prayer. EMOCHI all said in so much love.
It's taken me since episode one to feel safe in coming to you to say something thank you, and with so much love, respect and gratitude for the work you're doing. I felt it important to read the whole message because I think that this is how we address conflicts. You know, I think sometimes when conflicts come up or moments give us a little I had a professor in college who
called it like an ouch. So when there's like an ouchie, there's a way for us to express ourselves without needing to be you know, angry or blaming or making assumptions, but just kind of saying what we're feeling. And so I really really appreciate this person for the intentionality and care they took with crafting this email. And I'm so glad that you felt safe enough to share this with
me and I hear you. So I give out the number at the end of the show and I say, I spell it out for the you host who can't spell, which, let me just this is non excuse, just letting you know a little bit of context. I'm terrible at spelling. I'm constantly having to look up and what constantly I'm going to say, matth you, how do I spell this word? And so it was more it is a joke and
poking at myself. Also, like you know, when I say sixty nine messy is the number you know when you go on your phone the rotary.
Of the old school. It's a lot.
Anyways, I apologize because that is not my intention to hurt, but obviously that is the impact and that's what matters here. And I don't want anyone, especially anyone who might have it at learning disability or might have self conscious or feel insecure around spelling, reading, writing. I do not want you to feel uncomfortable in this space. So let me apologize again to anyone who may have felt offended or hurt or just you know, even just a little ouch
whatever if it brought you pause. I just want to apologize, and we're gonna take it out. That will not be how we end this, So I will correct that. I've already talked to my producer and our editor and we're great to remove that. And so thank you again. Yeah again, y'all things come up where you know, this is a messy space. So if something during a story or a conversation or anything comes up that you're like at home,
you're like ooh foosball, go ahead, email me. Let me know, and then I can bring it to the show, uh and discuss it. So tell me something messy at gmail dot com to this patron, thank you again for bringing this to my attention and for helping me create a safer space for our community.
Love you so much all right, time.
For a guest. Maybe is there a door bell? Baby?
You know what that means. It's time for yues.
Now. While they get situated, we will get our messy key key started with ah manifest doll, repeat after me aloud or in your head. Grant me the serenity to unpack my shame, the courage to heal, the wisdom to know that sex is not just about penetration, the audacity to advocate for my pleasure and boundaries, the strength and not call my ex that fuck boy, fuck girl, or fuck they, for it is better to masturbate by myself in peace than to let someone play in my motherfucking face.
That the community say ho heluja. I am so excited to have Danielle Schneider on the show. Writer and performer Danielle Schneider co created and starred in the Hot Wives series for Hulu, which I loved, and wrote and recurred on Showtime's Black Monday. Additional television credits include Hacks, Champagne,
Ill Community, and Happy Endings. Danielle can currently be heard weekly as the co host of the podcast Bitch Sash alongside Casey Wilson, where the duo dish and dissect the latest happenings in the world of the Real Housewives and beyond. I just have to say before this even starts that I will be fangirling because Happy Endings is one of my favorite shows. Bitch Sashion is also one of my favor riches. Y'all please help me. Welcome Danielle.
Hi, Danielle.
I'm so excited to be here because I have been watching it as a fan for so long and watching messy Mondays on my Instagram. Yes, and it's a joy and I've learned so much.
That's what I love.
As an elder millennial or as some say, gen X, you know, we are, you are more versed and and I also think there's so much less shame about sex from other generations and from you specifically. You. You really live in a place of no shame. And it's so beautiful. I love it so much. Shame out of it, especially, you know, for generations to come.
Absolutely, I'm hoping, I'm hoping that's what people will feel.
Love.
It's a freeze.
It makes it so and it makes it fun and funny and silly, and because it is those things right and a mess and you know, all of those things. But there's no shame around any of those things. And that's what I love about the work you're doing.
Thank you. I'm so happy you're here. I can't tell you how much I am fangirling. I was reading her By earlier to say I'm fangirling because I'm such a fan of you. I've been on Bitch such a couple of times.
Yes, Oh my god, it's hilarious, and you're a faith.
I love it. All Right.
Well, let's get started with some messy mandates.
Yeah, okay, So the messy mandates are things get to be unprocessed. Any thoughts or opinion shared have the right to evolve, shift, or change today, tomorrow, ten years from now. And if during the key key something feels too personal or unintentionally offends, we use the safe word who's ball, which gives us a chance to pause and address or pivot accordingly.
Sounds great?
Sounds great?
Shall we start with a lube breaker?
Okay, yeah, we don't have ice breakers? Love it?
Okay, So we're gonna play a game of fuck Mary block.
Okay, people here, we just block them?
Okay, which is I mean, honestly, which is death. It's a worse than death if you block someone and I'd rather be dead than be black. What is the worst in these with with killing someone? There's passion, you know, there's a strong feeling like.
I'm not dealing with it. You're there, you go, you're right, Okay, so bloh, Okay, Housewives of Beverly Hills, Okay, Atlanta, Salt Lake City, you don't have to start there except for me because these are like my favorite.
Okay, I'm going to fuck Salt Lake City because I was yeah, I mean, we didn't think when we first started watching. The evolution of Salt Lakes City has been like you know, these religious and like some people like Merit Marks, who were like, well, this is our way in. You know, whenever you start. You're a writer and every story we need our way in. And to watch this woman become un hinge has been a journey.
It's been loving Lisa Barlowe going from like my least favorite.
I just said that on the podcast today. I'm not even kidding Mary Cosby being the voice of reason.
It's incredible.
She has come a lot.
She has come.
She's like she's found her voice, she's found so.
Them I funk with also because they're a little bit dangerous. I don't want to get too close, like I'll fuck you, but I'm going to. But I don't trust them. We had reality on teas and I'm like, what do we have? But this season is giving me I'll marry Atlanta because Atlanta with for the long from.
The from the beginning of reality.
Exactly like day one. I meant, you know what I mean, and I these women are my aunts, They're my sisters, they're my cousins, they're my mom you know what I mean? These women they are part of my life. Yes, and so I've been with them so long they feel like family, Like you know, We've gone through good times, some bad times.
We had some really dark times.
We've had some times some lovely more hair care watching band, Like I.
Don't know what's going to happen this season with Kenya because of what you know, Like so, but I have a love for her and I'm angry with her, right you know, Like I have such strong feelings that I have to marry Atlanta. Yes, I'm gonna block. Really it's a temporary block because there have been some stumbling hills and I don't like the way that I don't Kyle is sort of like not. I don't know what's going on with Kyle, and I don't appreciate that because you're
gonna live and again, I have no business with her life. Okay, but you're on a reality show, so give us your reality. And I don't like and say with Dree like I don't like when you're trying to produce what you know. Just show me what it is.
I think the exact same good okay, Mary, Block massages, kissing, cuddling, marry a massage.
I need a massage everything, Like I'll be touched by anyone, Lily, any old can come and rub my shoulders. I got no album with it.
Same like Matthew, Please.
Matthews, I like you a little tap on the shoulder.
And I will what are they again, kissing and cuddling, kissing? I will fuck Okay, yes, because I like kissing. Not all the time, you know what I mean. It's sexy, it's kind of fun, it's thrilling. You know, I'm in a marriage, and you know, sometimes you almost like forget to see each other and kiss each other, and then when you do, you're like, oh my god, I miss kidding, do not cuddle me. Block it, kill it, wrap it up.
Oh yeah, that's new merch. Do not cuddle me, wow, speak up for the people who do not like cuddles, tell me about it.
Like it.
I mean, it's hot, it's too much, it's hot.
It's like a lot of body I just I want my own space and believe me, of the two of us, I think my husband is definitely the cuddler. Yeah, but I could. I could never touch a person.
Just color, touch my shoulders. I'm kind of that.
Exactly, do a job. I don't want to have to give back the mutual A coddler, I'm not. I like a hot like I like hugging. Yes, but then we let go, we don't. I'm not a cuddler. I find it, I find hot. I find a claustrophobic.
Yes, I feel like there are people listening like, ah, yes, I agree. I feel like you're liberating.
But it was it's just too much. We've done what we needed to do, which is either hug Why do we have to stay like that? You know, like, why does it need to be consistent?
That is incredible. We're back on the same page. By the way, I do think I think it's the same. I think I would marry a massage, because that's everything. It's the way, that's how to speak to me. It's how to love me is to offer me a massage. And I want to marry that.
I want that.
I want to always all times.
In fact, like if you start with a massage, you'll get anything else.
You want anything you.
I'll even give you a two minute.
Will And again I don't have to know you.
I don't have to know you. Yeah, it can be a stranger, strangers listening. I will kissing because I do love. I love a kiss. It has to be a good kissing. But like I love some good kissing. And I'll block the cuddling. I never my My Matthew and your Matthew are far more cuddlers. Matthew loves to cuddle, and I'm always like it's hot please like I just I just want my individuality. I love. Yes, yeah, so I do like a little cuddle and I'm down for a little cuddle.
But it's not my it's not my priority. That's my number one. Anyways, you won the game I want, I want, I used to be here.
Everything.
Yes, you win my unconditional love because it's season one so we don't have money. You know, and we won't have it for season two either. By the way, if y'all have any prompts for our games, you can email tell me something Messy at gmail dot com. Speaking of which, Danielle, can you tell me something messy?
Oh, there's so many messy things to talk about. What what?
What?
Genre?
Like genre as present, somebody else's it could be whatever it could be, could be anything that you think that's messy.
I have something beautiful.
Great.
This is a person I know, uh huh who I was friends with years and years and years ago, and they were in a marriage and the happy marriage they married. You you know, they were sort of at that point in their life where in their twenties they got married a successful person and they had what looked like the picture perfect life. And I was struggling, you know what I mean.
I didn't have.
Two pennies put together. It was a mass like living with like living in a living room in New York City, waitress, like just my life not where wanted to but you know, the struggles. Yeah, but this person just had their life together, you know what I mean, and like love them, but I also had that feeling of like remember trying to go to their wedding and being like, I cannot afford anything this wedding, Like I went, I remember going to the cellar, you know at Macy's, like in the basement
in New York City. They have like that first, like the cellar and like being able to afford like a ladle, you know what I mean, Like just be like I cannot get anything on this registry. Nothing. And they got mayor. They had this great marriage. They had all these kids, and I lost touch with them with this person, and then I remember we spoke a few years later and they had had another kid. Turns out the kid was from an affair that they had, but they hadn't told
the husband. Oh lord, so the the husband's name was on the birth certificate on the kid, but the kid obviously looked like the person.
Oh my god.
Oh I don't think at first, but she was like, I am like this is and I'm also probably in love with this other person. So but the names are once it's legal, like once it's on the burst, and that person is probably like, that's my I mean, this kid looked like the other. So eventually think she had to kind of like tell yeah, the husband slash not birth father of this other child.
Yeah, that's messy.
Never reminds me of There was like an Instagram or a TikTok that I saw where this girl was like going through her like breakups and what not with the with her guy and so she's white, her her her man is white and then they broke up and then through it you find out that she has a kid. Layer back together and there's a kid and the kid comes out and they're so happy and they reveal the kid's black. You're like, that's not.
And did.
That It felt like the way the video ended like they didn't like they were just like, this is our this is our baby. I'm so excited for my son. Like yeah, that's not your what's tough.
That's that's messy. But you know, I do think that in this situation, I think everybody's okay now, but well that's good.
But I couldn't deal with the.
I'm really bad at lying, Like it's my husband, like it is always like you'll lie to me.
I can't. I just can't hold it either.
I can't. I can't make eye contact. Even when I used to play hide and seek, if someone was like be like I'm here.
I can't lie to you. I can't lie to you. And so like the idea of like holding onto that and then like having.
I couldn't evidence, right, I have to say it.
I have to say.
That's something pretty messy.
That's very messy. Thank you so much. Okay, shall we do some messy mail?
Sure?
Please? Gorgeous? All right? As always, these remain anonymous. So this first one says, my girlfriend's recent ex is watching all my stories? Should I let her hurt her feelings? Or block hert we were talking about blocking? What do you think?
So say that again?
Yes, so my girlfriend's recent x is watching all my stories? So should I let her hurt her feelings or blockers?
So it's like, yeah, you're like trying to I say, let her, let her do her if this is what she needs, like because then you're blocking her and it seems sort of like you need to not care.
Yeah.
And also I don't even watch who's watching my story.
I don't either. Do people do that because half.
The time they're not watching their stories. Like a lot of times toople think I'm watching their stories. I just let it run like I don't even know it's on.
That is always to you, like I'm always just like I'm like, I might watch one person story and then just like.
Like, so, I'm like, you don't you don't know what she's doing. If you're blocking her, it's like, oh, you're paying attention. Why are you looking at who's looking at your story? That's in your position, and just you know, let her do her. Don't look a. Also, don't look at who's looking at your stories. It's not your business who's.
Looking at you.
You put your stuff out there for the world, even.
O who's looking, I don't care who's that's tea. Actually that's really good advice, that because because sometimes I feel like we get so wrapped up in who's watching and the perception and then it kind of stunts the magic. Yeah, yeah, okay, I'm with you, all right. The next one says I was talking to my brother and his girlfriend in his room. I happened to glance down and saw her panties on the floor. Then I realized the room smelled of sex. Yes, yes, yes, yes,
what does sex smell like? I remember as a kid growing up, like hearing, you know, watching on TV, and it smells like sex. And then I remember one time and I don't know if I've made it up like as maybe a teenager or like a young twenty year old walking into a room and feeling like.
I smelled sex. But now I'm like, what does that actually smell like?
You know what?
I think it's tell tell me what a sex mall?
Maybe I'm outing with my sex. I've walked another rooms. Yeah, there's a heaviness to there's a there's a potency. Yeah, like there's a steam in the Yeah, that's what you know of the room. Yeah, it's changed in the closest smell I could say, because I smell right now not that I've had sex, and I did have a spray tand and it doesn't smell that different, which is like boon like a musky like musky but sort of body, but also like a hint of sauce, some chicken or some.
Sauce.
Is so clear not you're not say it smells like, oh.
My god, what does it smell like? It's like because it's not. It's not a bad smell because right like it's like musk versus must it's like a I want to say, like I keep saying, like cheese and like birdy amber.
Musky, like they're not a light sex.
It's not light.
It's like a deep ritual list like a Yeah, it's like a pot of something.
It's similar to like, well not as well if you burn, say it doesn't like that, but you know how that smell you're like, oh you've been burning?
Yeah, like it feels a room. Yes, yes, And it's not bad, it's not good.
It just it just is it?
Right? Yeah?
Yeah? Yeah, okay, right, but I do I always wonder like when you walk in on somebody having sex and there and they're trying to hide it. Yeah, I feel like we should just be able to get to a place where we say, hey, we just has eggs for a moment, it out.
Loud, it's beautiful. But I can't imagine my mouth saying you know, like just say that in the eye.
You have to look in the eye, like, hey, maybe hold their hand too.
Yeah. I don't think I could look someone in the eye. There's still some shame around it, which I hate that just like it's like because you're seeing it, you're seeing sex.
Is a vunery.
It is, it is.
It is.
So it's like exposing the soft underbellyer, that's fair.
That's fair. Okay, this one says, oh, a date on Saturday with a guy who ghosted me in June. I know it's dumb, but his dick is worth it. It's the dick.
Ever worth being a clown. And I mean that respectfully.
I mean, you know, because I feel like when we go back to the people that we know are bad for us, there is there's a clown erry in that.
Oh yeah, I mean I've done it.
That's why it's Yeah, I've been to this.
I would say, how old are you? That's fair because in your twenties, like, you're just gonna get clowned and clown you know what I mean, Like you're gonna make bad decisions and sometimes the d is enough twenty you know what.
Yeah, that's fair.
Yeah, it's like, look, I.
Know you're not my forever person, and.
I am being disrespected. I make it knowledging with disrespect.
If you acknowledge if you are, if you can be like I am being disrespected, I think it's fine.
Yeah. Like, and again, if you are forty five, yes, and you are looking for something more than just sex, do not correct. Yes, But even if you're you know, twenty five and you're looking for more than just sex, don't do it. Don't do it, because he has ghosted you. He would have to come back with a lot you do. Yeah, he'd and I don't know that just since June.
Yeah, Jude, we're recording this in October.
Yeah, it's so a lot of growth hasn't happened. If it was like three or four years.
From then, it's like, look, I've been to therapy.
Yes, And he would have to hold himself accountable yes, and say I gooested jew and I'm sorry for that. That was wrong.
Then you're like, okay, there's growth here in this person. It was something there. I wasn't lying to myself, And okay, let's give this another a little go. I think people make mistakes, for sure, we'll change, people grow short. But again, there's so many variables that I don't know how to answer the question. So I think we tried to answer it at different You.
Have options options. Okay, this says got on top, Sorry, got on top. He grabbed and spread my butt cheeks and a little sport of diarrhea shout out. Well, first of all, thought some persons, I do you like asking this question, because like we know what it is you like, there's no like you know, honestly two things. I do think it could make you closer because Danielle's like, I
just feel like I have a lot of questions. One beginning, I do feel like, you know, when something is not well here, especially with diarrhea.
It's That's what I'm saying, say real like something was, something was.
Off quite honest, whatever it was, and so I would be hesitant to get on top of anything to or get.
Me like I would you need to put me in a red red tent like they used to do to women when they had their periods of the olden days.
I'll take care of myself.
I'll go be.
I do think that like once it comes out, though, the one thing that I always say is that the water in the toilet bowl is doing God's work. And so when ship is out of the bowl, yeah you smell that.
That smells right.
Quick immediately that's the smell that we don't have to actually sit here and try and discern what it is. No, we know what it is, and so I guess I uh again, thoughts, I don't really have anything. I don't know.
I'm so sorry for You're a loss, and I I hope he or she forgets your face that you never see them again. That's what I hope.
Yeah, I mean, because like, who are you preferring to look in the eyes the person and saying I just had sex or after the diarrhea? Whose eyes am I looking into me?
Honestly, I think yeah, the diary assets. Just like I would get up.
First and foremost, the first move is to get it.
I would be like and I would. I would run. I would run. I would pray that the ground swallowed me, and when that doesn't happen, I would run. I would grab my clothes, not even put them.
Put them on. Even if it's my house, No.
Run out of my house. I would light a match, set it on fire. Never see my house or this person again. That would be it, that would be there.
The house has to go.
I don't know.
I can't honestly solid advice.
You're done.
And this one says, my partner and I want to have kids, but we barely have enough time for ourselves and our sex as it is. What are the tricks to keeping the spark alive in a long term relationship with kids? Shall we talk about this. I don't have kids.
I'm gonna want term relationship for nine years.
How about you We've been together for like almost twenty Okay.
Let's start here. What is the secret in twenty.
Years growing together and again, like you know, I think in like acknowledging that you're not the same people that you were, yeah, but still finding stuff you like about each other. H you know, having a good time together and having laughs, like laughter, you know you're a comedian. Like laughter is such a hugeage. It's everything. And if you still make each other laugh or like get a kick out of each other, yes, that's what keeps going
and still being attracted. Like there's gonna be days and weeks where you're like.
Years yeah, you're like I right, don'tule.
But then you just look at them and you're like I really like that, Like they're hot.
Yeah.
So like that is the secret to like and it doesn't have to be every day, but like you still catch that.
The glimmer, the glimmer.
Yeah, but also knowing that like you, you you change and grow. You're not especially I don't know. I think I was very young when I got in my relationship, and obviously you were too, and so you really do grow. Like I was twenty two when I started dating my oh wow, so like twenty three. Yeah, so it's been a while. I mean I was young, just out of college.
Oh my goodness.
And he's a little bit he's eight years older than me, so like, but I've changed so much of course. Man, my god, I'm a whole other human.
I feel like there's a quote something that's like, you know, love is being present for every new version of the other person, and it's true.
Yeah, but in some days it is a battle, and some days it is like, oh my god, like and also accepting like, but some things will never change, yes, you know, and realizing like you're not going to change this per since so like accepting things about each other, good and bad.
Like this is who this person is, not trying to change.
Them, no, and not being mad at them for being them. Yeah, Like you just have to kind of like you have to move around who they are and accept that this is who they are.
Now.
What happens a lot of times in marriage is it's like I can no longer accept who you are.
Yeah, and then and if that's then that's.
Okay, I have no problem.
You know.
Sometimes people grow and change and not in the same direction and it or they don't grow and change and then it's time for a new thing.
Controversial, but that's why I'm pro divorce and pro breakup because if I would say this to my husband, and I think it's why we're able to be together this long. It's like, I'm not interested in suffering from my relationship. And so like if we are not happy and we've done everything right, like we do everything and did that, but like if ultimately, after giving it everything we've got, we're not happy and we're realized we're just two different people, that to me is it's okay to like move on.
I am completely, No, I am in agreement completely. Also, on the other end of that, would not throw away everything we have for a bit of unhappiness at a moment or somebody very attractive that you know, like you know what I'm saying. So it's both of those, both of those things.
Yeah, like that I understand that we are full humans and so there would really have to be a wall that like we're just like not meeting each other at that would change things. But otherwise it's like, oh, I'm here to work through this, like.
Exactly, but if it's not it, it's not it, And I'd rather people. Life is short, period, and you does. Everyone deserves to.
Be happy happy, and you don't have to be with another person to be happy.
You can. That's what I'm saying. Like, I'm like, if God forbids something ever happened with Matt and I, I never need to marry again.
That listen. I told matth you never have to worry my math, you never have to worry. Like, I'm not trying to do this, is it like I gave, I gave this. I'm all if we end, I'm living by myself forever.
Too, like I'll have sat I.
Do worry, but I am not doing this. Students, No, no, no, this is and this is so beautiful, but it's like, oh, it's so much worse.
Oh it's a ton of Oh my god, and it's worth it. But it is. But it is work and sometimes it's not sometimes, but the joys are so great and history is so great and what we have is so great. And even like those times when you see you remember who each other were, when you.
Like when you think about those love like how you met and you have those moments you're like, oh wow, we were so so sweet.
Yes, and you can even I can see that person in fact, to their question, which I've gotten away from. No, no, no, about having kids, it's hard, especially in those first years. Yeah, Like my daughter's eleven now, so it's different.
Sure, but in those first years.
First years are hard. And I remember saying to my girlfriend, one of my girlfriends, like who had had some kids and I just had my daughter, And I was like, when do't I ever like feel sexual again or feel like my body is mott Like I felt so weird.
I've heard mothers talk about like your body is no longer yourss.
It didn't feel like mine. Yeah, And I was so separated from my body, which was so strange. And I was like when will I And she's like, take like it's going to be a minute.
Yeah.
And so it's that first year especially is hard, you know, because it mentally, physically, emotionally, everything changes. And it doesn't mean you won't get back to sex, and it doesn't mean you won't have sex, but it's it's a trip.
I think what you're highlighting, which I think is always so helpful sometimes. I remember I had a trauma teacher.
Who was like, sometimes you just need permission, like you already know what it is, but sometimes you need to
hear it out loud somebody to say. And so this permission of like it's okay that it doesn't feel the same, I think is important to like to just have somewhere in your system for anyone who's a new parent or navigating this where it's like, it's okay that it won't feel the same, and like to know that so that you can maybe give yourself some grace as you navigate the transition of what it means to be us in this couple, but now us in this new version of
our family as well. Imagine requires a lot of patients.
Yeah, that's from both people too, because the other person who hasn't you know, and I don't know how you're having children. You know, sure there's many ways we can have them now, but if the child has come from one of your body, yes, it's traumatic. Yeah, and so
everyone has to be patient for that. I would also say, if you're having sort of sexual stuff right now, and I'm not saying it's a problem, we all it ebbs and flows, So you might just want to talk about where your sex life is now with you guys or with a professional.
Sure, just to make.
Sure that like Okay, we're gonna have kids. We're already kind of like dealing with this other. If you guys are okay with where you are sexually, even if it's not super active, that's time. But if you're unhappy with where you are sexually, I would also talk to someone about that before you have kids, just so that it's not like more of the sick, you know, and you're blaming the kid for that.
When when oh, that's so important already it was already there, something is already there. That's so true because sometimes which I think also happens sometimes is like kids become can become a solved yes or not that they are actually able to, but that we think that they can solve, sure, or we think that they can fix.
They're the thing that's going to make us closer.
And and yes, it's like no, maybe if anything, it's going to actually put.
Some on This does not make anything easier better. I mean, your kid is wonderful and you love them, and it is one of the greatest loves I've ever known in mine, but it is not necessarily the thing that will make you and your.
Yeah, it will make you hate them, right because being being mother or father or parent and being husband wife's spouse are not the same thing, right, So, like there's one thing about us being parents together, but then like us being our couple version of ourselves is a different.
Different beasts, a different beast. So I would just get right with each other. Yeah, and again, it doesn't mean you have to be having more sex. I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with your relationship if you're not having a ton of sex. Like whatever feels right for you, guys, but figure that out before you have a kid, so that one is not about the other. That's going to be its own.
Shit, how did you get back to yourself? Like what was your process in like getting back into your body as mom?
It was hard, I'm not gonna lie, like I felt so other, Like my body felt so different, and I was breastfeeding too, and I'd had a C section, which was very hard on me. So just it was time. And also like doing things I used to do, like what like like going out with girlfriends or something like that, like being still me, identifying with myself as who I
was before I had a kid. I think that like just doing those things, like almost going through the motions of being myself because I felt so other and I didn't understand who I was. And I was also working during that time, because you know, they don't really give new moms.
It's crazy.
It's crazy.
I was working four days after I gave birth. What I mean, I didn't have to go in sure, but like you were back in, I was back in working. So all of that was like traumatic in the sense that I.
Was like, and that's a new version becoming a mom or a dad or a parent. It's a new version of yourself that's also emerging. So you're trying to get used to the new version of yourself. And that is such a mind fuck because you're like, I want to operate at the excellence of a ten, but I'm also new to this with a child.
There's also the stakes of like I don't want to.
Fuck up.
It is. It's like I don't know what I'm doing. Yeah, you can read all the books, but.
It's but it's still it's new.
And but when you look at me, you still see me. But I'm a I'm two point zero, you know what I mean, Like I there's been an upgrade and I'm still adjusting to the upgrade. And so for me, it was so much time and just kind of like until I felt totally.
Yeah, like was it two years, three years, seven years?
I would say about a year. A year Okay, doesn't mean I wasn't like, but I would say a year, about a year till I was like, oh, I'm I'm back, this is my upgrade. But I'm I'm I'm I know who I am now, not a year for me.
What was the support that that your your partner gave or even because you know, I think we can all learn to do things better, Like what were the things that you wish you were able to articulate to your partner at the time, Like if you were to do it again, you'd be like, oh, these are the things that I would need that might have supported I don't want to say going through it faster, but just maybe feeling a little less in the wind.
At all, because there is a part of it that even though I had a partner who was there and helpful and you know, is a very involved parent, husband is God. You know, we are very involved and he is there. He's there there. But you know, when you're a mom and you gave birth and are breastfeeding, I think it can feel very lonely. I wish I had just been able to articulate that more, to talk about my feelings more. I've always been a little bit of a bake it to you make it type of person.
That's just my m which is also like very like very like theater actors and.
Capricorny those things. So I don't think I articulated how alone and how much I needed emotional support more because I've always been like, no, you got it, I got it, I got it, I got it, you got this, you know what I mean? And I just I wish I had said because he doesn't know of course.
Yeah.
And I don't like to be vulnerable or weak very much, not weak.
But no, but like it feels, yeah, it feels to ask for help.
Yes, And I didn't even know what I needed help, ye, So it's like that feels like I don't even know what I want. I just want something like So I think it was just I felt alone in it.
There is an operating system that precedes them, that doesn't allow you to to ask for help or feel like you can, and it's not it's it also is like nothing that they're doing because honestly, if you ask, they probably will.
And it has nothing to and they you know, it's nothing to do with them, and it's.
Everything to do with you, but not knowing how to because which is also interesting is like you've become a mother, but there's also like your.
Child, your your Danielle the child.
Danielle is also now activated because she's doing something new and needs help, but also is now writing this line of I'm in charge, but I'm also kind of I'm a baby as a mother, and.
I wanted so much during that time. I wanted and I say the same quotations my mom and I am not very close with my mother. She is nor yeah, and so we have an interesting relationship. I mean were I still talked to her and that stuff, but she is not a vulnerable help maternal the way that some of my friends moms like came in and swooped in. I was so jealous of that because I wanted that so bad. I wanted to be mothered. Yeah, and I
didn't get it. I didn't have that person. So I like when you're saying, I was still I Danielle the child needed mothering, and that was very hard.
Even just saying I don't know what I need. By I know I need something to your partner.
There's a bit big like fake. It can also like I'm fine, I'm fine, and never let them see you sweat and we're all doing okay, and people smell when it's not okay and everybody backs away like you farted, and so normalizing being like I'm not okay, yeah, and that's not your problem. But I don't have to pretend I'm anything to come up here and do my job exactly. And I love it.
Because there's such strength there's I feel like it allows you to take back your power.
I do think there's so much strength in showing up as your true self and not sugarcoating and not making it like just saying like I'm I'm actually it's a tough day, but I'm here and thank you all for being here and let's go so everyone, Like, I feel like that sort of energy wakes everybody up, yes present, to.
Be present and to like also acknowledge how they're feeling. And then it's like we which I think goes back to this, you know, as parents with kids, it's like if we can be honest about how we're actually feeling, then the other people around can like step in yeah, there's space too. They might not not in terms of like hopefully in your relationship, yeah, but in work they
might not. But at least that there's you're creating space for people to show up yeah, or to a just expectation a little bit to say like I'm not I don't have the full compares.
We're also making a space where someone can say by you saying yeah, they can also show up as their true self yes, and not everyone has to be like we're great, We're great, We're great? Great? Are we great? Like there's so much strength in that. I wish, I hope we can do that more.
I love that, and I love that for especially parenting and being in a relationship with each other, so not just not just co parenting, but also like we are together in a relationship, being able to say how we're actually feeling, even if we can't quite articulate it perfectly.
I think kids sometimes, like our daughter doesn't like it when we cry, but I've had to tell her like sometimes mommy and daddy are going to cry and it's not we're okay, Yeah, we're okay. Part of it, like because you know it's I think you know, and it looks like I have said to her a few times, like sometimes mommy is going to cry, sometimes Daddy's going to cry, and that's okay, yes, And like sometimes we're sad, sometimes we're frustrated, sometimes angry.
It really feels like one, remember why you fell in love? Yes, but two which I never thought about. But the spark is kept alive by us being honest about how we're feeling. The spark is kept alive by saying I don't have it in me right now as we.
We're just saying.
I can't do that, you know. But the spark is kept alive by staying in communication and figuring out how we can both kind of get.
On the same well.
Also, like there have been times where I just haven't been feeling it or whatever. My husband will be like like he'll want to have sex and I'm like, I'm not feeling it, Like I'm just yeah, and then we'll talk about it. I'll be sad, I'll be down, We'll have some laughs, and then I will be in the mood.
That is key. I will say that, like if you make space for how you're actually feeling and then we start talking, there's when I'm not in the mood. And Matthew wants to and then oh, you know, we talk about it. Then like there's something about that emotional connection of talking that makes me suddenly like, yeah, I love that.
The best thing you can do to get your partner in the mood is just listen to the most talk.
Yes, I love that, Danielle.
Thank you for being here, Thank you for having me. I had such a good time and you are a.
Joy and thank you so were you. I love you so much, love you too.
Well.
You know we are hose here, but hose with heart.
So before we get out of here, let me speak to yours. I love me some, Danielle. There's so many incredible takeaways from the conversation for me, one being that
being mom is hard, which you know, I know. I have full respect for all of you who are raising little ones, raising teenage ones, raising adult ones, Being a mom, being a dad, being a parent is so difficult, especially if you're trying to do it in a way where you can hold space for whatever your emotions, whatever your triggers are, and also not put that on the child
and hold space for whatever their emotions are. To be doing that kind of parallel work where you're healing your own stuff and also shepherding a child into their humanhood. My goodness, that is a lot, so shout out to you. Talking keeps the spark alive. And I couldn't agree more. A lot of times, when the sex or the spark or the intimacy starts to wane, I think we get in our heads and we might start to and you
know we're talking about this with that. I think it's a second episode featuring Shantira Jackson and doctor Vanessa Marin where we talked about how do you keep kind of sex alive in a long term relationship And one of the things we were speaking about is how when things are going off, instead of talking talking about it, we get in our head or we start to make up a story that it's our fault or that the other person should be doing more or whatever, as opposed to
just talking and in that talking being transparent about where you are. I'm not horny right now, I don't feel like it right now, or I'm having issues with my sex drive and I've noticed that it's not you, but it's like I'm not feeling good or whatever it is. But like having that honest conversation and allowing your relationship to continue to be a safe space where you're not worried about the other person leaving because you said the
wrong thing. Right that actually saying the thing brings you closer together, listen their caveat so that if you're in the wrong relationship, being honest might push that person away, But then that's not the relationship you want to be in.
You want to be in a relationship that when you show who you are, when you say who you are, when you tell somebody this is where I'm at, whether it's it's good, it's gray, it's messy, whatever it is, that that other person again, whether it's romantic, familial, platonic, says to you, I got you. It pulls them in and allows them to know how to show up for you, and you know that talking might also get you in the mood. Finally, the being gentle with yourself is a
new version emerges. Becoming a parent is a new version of yourself. And there's a lot of milestones like that in your life. Right when you turn thirteen. I think about for myself, when I turned thirteen, I was a teenager and like this new you know, puberty brought on this new version of myself. You know, Graduating college and stepping out into the real world brought on a new version. Getting married brought out a new version. So of course being a mother, a father, a parent would also bring
out a new version. And so being gentle as you become a version of yourself you've never been before. You do not have to have it one hundred percent down or correct. You don't know how, you don't have to know how everything works.
Right.
It's like moving into a new home, right, or a new apartment, Like you don't know where everything is. You're like, oh, there's an outlet over here. I didn't even know that, right. Oh look we'veout a little extra storage in the back room ball I didn't see that when we did the walkthrough. Right, you don't know where everything is. So be gentle with yourself as you move into the new version of yourself, and don't be afraid to ask for help. This is we started this on the very first episode of the
pod with my best tie Chelsea. You know, friends are not just for for dance floors and brunch tables. They are for these moments when you are lost, when you are confused, when you're scared, when you're unsure when you don't have the words and all you can say is something is off, I'm not feeling good or I don't know what's happening. But this is different and it doesn't feel like me. Ask for help, you know, don't be
like that is strength. I think a lot of us were taught that knowing how to do things and doing it right and perfectly and correct is where our value comes from, where our worth comes from, and that type of that framework of existing robs us of learning so much more about ourselves. I think we learn the most about ourselves when we aren't afraid to say I don't know, because then that actually makes space for new information to enter into our psyche, to enter into our space. So
I don't know. It's actually a beautiful space to be. When you're asking for help and you're not able to articulate exactly what it is you need help with. Say that I need help, babe, I don't know with what, but I'm feeling off and I need help. Ask for help, and know who you can ask help from? Right, There are some people they not the person ask for help.
And as Danielle brought up, you know, I have my own baggage with my mother, right Like, you might want to go to those familiar figures, but be honest with yourself, is that the place where you get the most help is that where you get the best help. If it's not, don't go to those familiar figures. Go somewhere else. Find somewhere else, find you know, whether it's your friends, or if it's a colleague, or if it's a mentor if
it's a neighbor, if it's a stranger. Sometimes. I mean, I don't know about you, but I've had connections with strangers randomly that have healed me or expanded me on. Some of my favorite moments in life is running into or having like a random connection to, like an elder, right like running into that old grandmother or grandfather or grandparent on the subway or you know, on the bus or something like that, and getting to be in conversation with them and learning from somebody who's done it or
who's done some version of life. So ask for help. I think that's it. Yeah, I love you so much. All Right, I gotta get out of here. But you can find me on Instagram at Brandon Kyle Goodman. You can find our podcasts at tell Me Something Messy and you can join our community on the Messy Monday's substack. When you subscribe, you'll get weekly posts, recommendations on sex
and self and so much more. Also, I want to hear from you, so send your topic ideas, your messy stories, your submissions, your game ideas to tell Me Something Messy at gmail dot com. You can also call us at six six nine sixty nine messy That is sixty six nine six ninety six three seven seven nine. Rate review and share this podcast with all your hoe and aspiring hoe friends. Really really helps the show out, all right.
Until next time, ask about the politics of that dick before you make it spit, make sure they eat the kitty. Buffore they beat the kitty before fuckation or succation.
Communication And in case you have I haven't heard it yet. Today you are so deeply loved. I love you.
Bye. Thank you so much for listening to tell Me Something Messy. If you all enjoyed the show, send the episode to someone else you might like it. Tell Me Something Messy was executive produced by Ali Perry, Gabrielle Collins and Yours truly. Our producer and editor is Vince Dejohnny. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio and the Outspoken Network, visit the iHeartRadio app or anywhere you subscribe to your favorite shows.