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Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my name is Noah.
They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer Alexis code named Doc Holliday Jackson. Most importantly, you are here. That makes this the stuff they don't want you to know. It is the top of the week as we hurdle headlong toward December, and oh gosh, fellow conspiracy realists, there is so much strange news. Guys, before we get into it. Kim Jongoon just got some
more international attention. He is begging the He's begging the families and the women of the DPRK to have more children.
That's interesting. Isn't it better to have less children and overpopulated parts of the world.
Well, Kim seems very very upset about it. He was speaking at the fifth National Congress of Mothers and no statement from the Kim dynasty regarding the quality of life and the Democratic Republic is AI taking jobs from clergy. The United Kingdom believes that your favorite spiritual guides may soon be replaced by computers. But that's all just mentions. We're going to talk about spying. We're going to talk
about the QAnon queen and Discordianism. What I would say, social hacking for chaotic good purposes before we do any of that. As many of us have probably heard recently, for anybody who submitted their DNA to submitted their DNA to learn more about themselves, you may have gotten some troubling news quite recently.
Oh, yes, very troubling news. There's an incident that we will speak of shortly before we even get into it, Guys ran into a thing with this story that we've run into before, and we've made a whole I think we made a whole episode about it. Twenty three and meters Holding Company is incorporated in guess where do you think I have to accuse myself? Oh, you already know, Delaware, But the address of their principal offices are in South
San Francisco, California. I've actually been to those offices with my team and I've gotten the sales pitch directly from high up people there about how safe everyone's personal information is when you give something as you know, personal as literally the stuff that makes up who you are and what you are. Yeah, they were very adamant about that, as any company collecting that kind of data was and currently is would state that they are now and will be in the future.
At least they will continue.
Saying that until something like this happens. Here's a news story from tech Crunch on December first, twenty twenty three. Quote twenty three and me says hackers accessed quote significant number unquote of files about users ancestry. Okay, what does that mean? Well, twenty three and me apparently on Friday, December first, stated that hackers had accessed around fourteen thousand customer accounts in a data breach of their I guess their servers now. Fourteen thousand is roughly zero point one
percent of its nearly fourteen million customers worldwide. People who have actually spit into one of those things and sent it in to twenty three and meters. That seems like not that many people. You know, that's teen thousand individuals and potentially data about everything from their login information, their birthdays, you know, user names, all that normal stuff, that normal private information that you share with all the companies you share it with. But this is again also potentially super
specific information about you and your DNA. Here's the weird thing, guys. The only reason we know about this is because twenty three and meters as a publicly traded company, has to put forward these what do you call them reports about all kinds of things, and one of the things they have to report on are instances of hacking, right, or weird stuff that's going on that might affect the price of their stock, right, or.
The kind of stuff that comes out like in shareholders meetings or like.
When this is like that, it's like yes, But this one in particular is like, hey, here's a heads up to the sec and it has to get published basically, so everybody has to get access to that information because it could again mess with share price or how the company performs on like quarterly earnings or something.
It's weird. How informed consent does imply to investors?
Yeah, yeah, exactly, just to investors. But hey, if you want to read it, you can find Form eight h KA Amendment number one. It's the current report pursuant to Section thirteen or fifteen D of the Securities Exchange Act of nineteen thirty four. The date of the report is October tenth, twenty twenty three.
That's a banger, stem to stern, you know what I mean.
Yeah, Well, and it's great too, because you know, it's a report on something pretty serious that happened, right, a data breach. But the way it's written, because it is these official forums, you know, and the way it's written, and it's just, oh, it's beautiful. I highly recommend you
read it. You get stuff like this. The information accessed by the threat actor in the credential stuffed accounts varied by user account and generally included ancestry information and for a subset of those accounts, health related information based upon the user's genetics. Okay, which is again scary, like that's your super protected health information, right.
Hippa could never no, no.
No, and health information could be a lot of things. Let's get to why this became a much bigger story. Initially, it's reported by twenty three and me it's about fourteen thousand users that get affected. Then three days later, on December fourth, there's another tech Crunch article and I'm just going to read you the headline ready, so stoked twenty three and meters confirms hackers stole Ancestry data on six
point nine million users. Six point nine million. That's a little bit bigger than fourteen thousand.
Now I'm not a math surgeon, but I am attempted to agree with you. This is something we were talking of air a little bit about as well, Like that's a jump, right.
Yeah, So twenty three and meters initially said the hackers stole zero point one percent of customers information about fourteen thousand individuals. They also said that they're assessing all of that, right, And they said hackers were also able to access quote a significant number of files containing profile information about other users Ancestry unquote, but it didn't say anything about how many.
That's a problem with family trees, right, Yeah, that's part of it.
Well, it also goes back you guys, remember those conversations we're having about metadata and Facebook and how the connection of just you and then imagine one user on Facebook. You now imagine all the people you're friends with. Now imagine all the people each one of those individuals as friends with.
Right.
That's funny because I was even thinking about a family tree being a form of metadata.
In a way. Yeah, sure, it's connections to other individuals that also have very private personal information on twenty three and meters, and that information can get shared amongst users with a special thing called the DNA Relatives feature.
Oh finally great, Yeah cool.
Is this an opt in opt out kind of scenario? Okay, okay, it is.
I'm clocking you have to opt out, of course.
Yes, that's when I said opt in opt out. I mainly met out.
Yeah, it's an optional thing that you can you can choose to do. And within this it shares with other people you connect with or match with. I guess it shares your DNA relatives display name. So your display name, right, how recently you logged into your account, your relationship labels such as masculine, feminine, or neutral, your predicted relationship and percentage of DNA shared with your match.
Right.
Your ancestry reports your matching DNA segments, which is another option within the optional thing. Your location another option your birth location and family names. Oh, it feels like you could have some identity problems going on. Your profile picture, your birth year, your entire family tree can be linked in this section.
Yeah, and this goes to so first off, for a lot of people in the audience. You might be wondering tonight. You might be saying, well, why do I care? Because that is not, for instance, a credit card number, a routing number, or account number, et cetera. The issue is social engineering. Yes, now you get a much more effective call from your great grand uncle Lucifius name I made up.
Apologize to Lucifius who you know. Maybe it's not Lucifius calling you directly because he's quote unquote he's probably really dead. And then it's no, it's his step kid.
Well, yeah, I know, you're right. And as messed up as it sounds, social engineering used on other companies just trying to extract little bits of information about you by having a certain amount. Let's say you've got sixty eight percent of the information you would need to really impersonate somebody. Call a company. Now you've got some of that information, and there maybe the person's really nice and feels for you.
Then they give you, oh, maybe an extra you know, a birth date or a current address or an email. It's just it's really scary.
You're right, you're absolutely right.
Well, I mean, it's just a thing that cannon does happen. And Okay, so the big question is, how in the
heck did twenty three and meters get hacked? This significantly if you go on their website, guys, oh my god, there's so much on their website about data protection and GDPR compliance stuff within the terms of service and the India Ual Data Sharing consent forms and the research consent documents that they've got on their website, all about how protected your information is, specifically because users feel a certain type of way about their DNA information.
Right, Sure, I think maybe you should.
But it's it's it's priority one, right. But the way the hackers got in, you guys, it sounds awful. But the way people got in, whoever this person or persons were, it was a thing called credential stuffing, which is when you use the same let's say, email and password for multiple accounts. So let's say you're MySpace that you love into years in.
Years racing hand here, just for the record, I'm definitely that guy.
Well, what if you're using that same password on twenty three and meters and that same email. Well, hey, that's easy because your MySpace thing got hacked for two thousand and eight, So like it's.
Just no, what what'll guess? One two three five.
Well, it doesn't even matter even even if that password is like super strong. If it's the exact same password, yes, god.
And they've already got it, then it's just a matter of it's a numbers game. It's just like, let's try We know these things exist, let's just try it out. For however, many instances there are accounts associated with this email, right.
So yes, So basically these hackers got access to fourteen thousand individual accounts and then through that little family tree of other information, just got six point nine million exponentials.
What that is?
Yeah, sure they Kevin baconed it.
That's exactly what they did. Oh and here's the other thing after this. Guess what twenty three and meter is requiring all users to use?
Oh, I know, you have to opt out of the new arbitration agreement they came. Oh yeah, terms of service?
Are they probably requiring you to use a strong ass word they create for you?
Well, first they made everybody update their passwords, but I like, where you're going ben update your password? And now everybody has to use two factor authentications. Oh finally, which is like why anyone doesn't use that nowadays? Is kind of a wonder but I guess it is a real pain in the neck often for users and then also probably for the company itself.
And consider the demographic. Not it's a profile, but what we see in the human experience is that people largely tend to become more invested in their past as they are more confronted by their mortality. What I'm saying in a very diplomatic way is that there is a large proportion of biologically older users right who may not have the same digital savvy that a lot of people enjoy right benefit from.
Very very true, dude.
I mean, when you get into this kind of convo, looted levels of like change your password every periodically or whatever, and two factor, even the tech savvyest of us can get overwhelmed by this stuff.
Oh yeah, for sure. For sure. It's not easy by any means. There's so much more to talk about here, guys.
We went on a pretty deep dive into the story as we were all reading about today and just going back to the twenty three and meters like origin story and looking at what the what the original reasoning for creating the company was, and like how they were going to make money and how important it was going to be to get everybody's DNA voluntarily, because we're going to provide a service to let you know who you are, what's going on with your body, the you know, things
you might need to be thinking about or worrying about in the future because you've got these genes. If there's a big enough pool, we can learn enough about humanity that then we can predict things, right.
Yeah, we could. We could save the world or save more people from terrible diseases.
We could. We can even drugs specifically based on you know, small pockets of people within that population, like guys, I didn't know this. One of the main reasons that twenty three and meters has had problems is because the FDA won't allow them to share a ton of information about you that is found in your DNA. They won't let them. They're like, no, no, no, yeah, I know that's that person's spit and that is that individual's you know, genetic makeup.
But you cannot tell them the stuff you found in there.
Why because it violates it violates earlier existing legislation and also the.
Hippas for others liked why would you not be able to find out your own stuff? I don't understand right.
It's again it's earlier existing legislation regarding the role of a private company as it intersects with your rights as a person, at least in the United States and granted in the EU and other regions or other countries. These laws may differ your genetic mileage, may vary or at least your rights.
Yeah, and one of the FDA's main points is that if you get that genetic information back and then twenty three and meters as a company says, hey, cervical cancer, you may have like a seventeen percent higher chance of getting that because of the way your DNA makeup is. The FDA is worried that you would make choices about your own healthcare or get operations done, or you know, seek whatever treatment that isn't necessary, right, because they're not
a doctor diagnosing you with something. They're just a company saying, hey, here's a percentage chance that you are whatever.
So it's sort of like a more elaborate version of like WebMD, you know, just like obsessively like looking up things on WebMD.
Kind of what is your DNA?
What the heck?
All right, guys, let's talk about this more one day for now, let's hear a word from our sponsor and we'll be right back with more strange news.
And we have returned. One important note for everyone who has messed around with twenty three and Me, please know that the arbitration thing is happening now. You have a limited amount of time to contact them and opt out of the arbitration policy, which will remove your rights immediately. If you are concerned, contact all one word arbitration opt out at twenty three and me dot com. And best of luck to everyone involved.
Thanks for mentioning, Evan.
You're right, though, Matt. We need more people to know about this, and it is an episode in the future. Speaking of things people know and speaking of the moment when they know them, I have some questions for our fellow conspiracy realist and for you guys. The news broke recently amid some ongoing chaos in the Latin American theater that a guy named Victor Manuel Rocca, now retired from decades of service as a diplomat in the National Security Council.
The Department of Justice DOJ were just broke that this retired guy was moonlighting. He had a second job, and it's not uncommon for public figures to have a second job, right, like presidents do speeches and your local law enforcement named moonlight at clubs, right, stuff like that.
Sure, but oftentimes there are clauses and employment agreements that do prevent you from certain types of moonlighting that could be conflicts of interest.
Right, Uh, nailed it. Yeah, that's what happened, because Uncle Sam came out and said that this guy again, his name is like Victor Manuel Rocca, has been charged and arrested on suspicion of serving as a top spy an infiltrator for the Cuban government for more than four decades, forty years.
He really just did a bang up job. He got him all that juicy info and now wait, hold on, right.
Yeah, so who's slapping his wrist? Yeah?
Probably somebody else in the cell pretty soon is going to be slapping more than his risk slapping his wrist.
Yeah.
So this guy, uh, this guy, up until quite recently, he was perceived to have a very strident, spotless public record, both as a civilian and as a public servant. He leaned in really hard, apparently into Trump support in his later years because he retired fairly recently, and he got to the point where people were saying, Hey, this guy's little cartoonish about this, you know. And you can read the full criminal complaint against him at Justice dot gov.
I'd like to go to some great work by Tim Paget over at wlr INN in Miami and Tim Wrights, the Tim Rights. The following This is the headline Tim Rights, or the beginning paragraph. He says, a former US ambassador in Latin America who lives in Miami was charged this week for being a covert agent for Cuba for decades. The mystery is what led him in that direction and how much damage he may have done in the US.
And that's I don't know. I think before we go any further, we have to acknowledge that post Cold War, especially the United States has kind of been the bad guy to Cuba, right Can we say that on a yeah?
Oh absolutely, in terms of the embargoes and all of that stuff.
Right, Well, yeah, I mean the influence in Cuba before the revolution.
I mean the perception is strong, yes, is that the US is the bad guy?
I got you, Well, we haven't been friends. How about that we haven't been good to them?
And I think I mentioned that there was a brief moment where the borders opened up, and you know, Americans were welcomed back into Cuba, and in that tiny amount of time, my kid and their mom and stepdad visited Cuba and then right after that trip shut right back up. Just goes to show the tenuous nature of these types of agreements.
Yeah, I had several close friends who also took advantage of that, And I think during even during the official closed down or before the brief opening of that civilian window, there was still nonprofit travel. There's still military travel to Guantanamo. When specific this guy was ambassador to Bolivia in two thousand and two, like he was in the upper echelons, he wasn't just some crooked consular officer sometimes stamping things
he should not have stamped. And yes, for any student of presidential history here in the US, being ambassador Oblivion two thousand and two means that he was active under the George W. Bush administration. Again, super weird that that guy's father was president and then he was in a apparent democracy. So Rocca is leaning in hard to the right wing area of American ideology as it sold to
the public. This means that if you have if you have a Latin American leader who appears leftist, people like Evomo rallies in Bolivia, or people like and I'm not supporting these guys, but people who are you know, former leaders of Venezuela like Ugo Chavez. Check out clips of his morning show, which he did for quite some time. This guy was all gased, no breaks against them. But it appears the entire time, at least per the FBI and per US authorities, he was maintaining some sort of ratline,
some sort of backdoor communication with Cuba. And what they're saying in these complaints is that he purposely put himself in a situation where he had access to non public information, so not necessarily classified, not the stuff you can't know about, but the stuff they don't want out yet, and he was sharing that with Cuban intelligence, which means that they were sharing that with their allies across the globe. Now you might say, okay, look, I'm familiar with the United States.
I know that there have been quite a few public figures of late who have clearly been compromised by foreign intelligence, one of them, most notably being a former president of the United States who is currently running for office again. That is true, That entire statement is true. But the question I have to ask here, the most immediate question, Love you guys thoughts on this? What is like, what are we defining as spying here? And what are we
defining as information? Was this guy damaging? Why did the CIA call it? Or a former CIA case officer call it the most damaging spy scandal in US history? Are they making a mountain out of a molehill? Is there more information we need?
I guess it's just a bit weird if it actually did begin in nineteen seventy three, I think that's the year right when he like allegedly made some trip and became a quote good friend of the Cuban intelligence of whatever Cuban intelligence apparatus. I mean, that's a lot of time to be in like working through public offices in the State Department, gathering intell at you know, all of these different embassies, because he's how many embassies has he
worked out? Like, I don't even know it's it's it's probably less than a dozen, but it's a lot.
Well that's still more than the average person, right, Yeah.
But I mean, what actions do you think could have been taken from that stuff? Like if he's just assisting the Republic of Cuba, what does that mean, right, Yeah.
That's a great question, Matt. What it means is that it gives the Cuban government visibility on future plans. God, it gives the government of Cuba the context of in which those plans are germinated, in which they occur. And so when he is arrested, the first time this is reported in the West is by the Associated Press. When he is arrested, we hear multiple diplomats, former peers of his intelligence circles saying that they had no idea. They're all saying he had the keys to the kingdom, he
had the crown jewels. If it's something had to do with Cuba, this guy saw it. And I would also shout out great work by four journalists over at the New York Times, Glenn Thrush, Ernesto Londono, David c Adams, and Francis Roebliz. You can read a great story about this retired US diplomat accused of working as a secret agent for Cuba. Attorney General Merrick Garland may be familiar name to some people.
Merrick B.
Garland, excuse me, says that this is one of the highest reaching, longest lasting infiltrations of the US government by a foreign agent. So sorry, Russia, good hustle. You know I love the Americans too, you guys. I get the Mordecai Venanu stuff. This Roca has you guys. Uh, he lapped you. He's got you at a loss.
I don't understand this spin. This guy who made it this far undercover, like completely nobody knows, right, he tells some undercover FBI.
A channels, Right, yeah, he says, I got some real grand slams.
Isn't that the.
Quote something like that?
But that's that's like a perfect storm like conditions, right, Like it seems a little suspects that that was just random.
Well, I just don't understand how you go through all of what he's gone through, right, and then you just decide, you know what, this looks like a good place for beans.
Still, he knew who he was talking to. It wasn't like accidental, like well, well, no, it was an undercover undercover you're saying that with all his training, you would think he would have been able to sniff that out, and then he wouldn't have been so loose lipped, therefore sinking ships or just not tell anyone ever.
Yeah, just don't make it to the coffee shop, you know what I mean. But that's what this is what appears to have happened. To your point, Matt, he is on record speaking with undercover FBI working in concert with the CIA. There's a lot of alphabet soup here wherein he is saying stuff like this was a real grand slam for me. He's alluding to some of his activities not just in not just in the Caribbean, Central and South America, but also as far as far east as Italy.
The Department has brought more and more charges here. Here's what I think, Here's what I pause, and I'm gonna be again, this is absolutely honest. We have no proof of this. I highly suspect that the US government knew this guy was shaky far before the FBI said, oh, we just found out about it a year ago. Because if you are, if you are actually playing that kind of reindeer game, then you're not going to expose a vulnerability that you have caught. You're going to turn it
into an opportunity. And I posit to you also that we see indeed a larger pattern of snapping down on people that ordinarily would have been allowed to You know what, It's like, this is so weird. It's like, it's like tagging wild animals. It's like when biologists tag a bird or you know, a tiger or something like.
You to check for radiation and environments and things.
You're still wild. Go do your thing, bro, you know, and don't worry. Don't worry about that. Don't worry about that black what is it usually like? Don't worry about that black suv that's kind of lingering behind you at the airport, right, because you're on your own.
You're wild.
You're so smart, bro, And we see a larger pattern. I want to thank the New York Times for pointing this out, because not as many sources are pointing this out as they should. This comes on the heels of other accusations of other charges. In October of twenty twenty three, a New Jersey Senator, Robert Menendez, was charged with conspiring
to act as an agent of the Egyptian government. There are foxes in the henhouse, right, But the question is how long did Uncle Sam know about these conflicts of interest? Your earlier phrase, and why, perhaps most importantly, why is now the time to clamp down on these. That's the question.
It's a good one, do. I don't know why.
I think Matt put the word out. I think Matt, I think you've got my eye on the spy.
You know what I'm saying, Ben can I really quickly? And you shared an ABC News article for this story. Man, I've was seeing this all the time, this kind of thing in news stories. I'm just going to read a quote here ready dot dot that later led to assignments in Havana, Cuba between nineteen ninety five and nineteen ninety five.
What yeah, what?
Who wrote?
It's Mandela effect. It's a multiversal thing. It was a nineteen ninety five in a different universe versus nineteen ninety five in the current timeline. Everybody please check out the amazing sci fi show Fringe.
It's been rewatching it lately. Holds up?
Wait really, I like I think too till the end of the season.
But I have been watching them. The beginning is as good as I remember it, being the one on the air plane, in particular with the weird melty like people pilot. Yeah, I know, the whole airplane's full of like weird corpses that their skin is melted off and gone trans That very first couple of episodes are great.
Yeah, my favorite is the flower based episode. I think white tum, I think it's white to something like that. It's beautiful, it's poetry on screen.
And the guy that plays the crazy scientist he eats tomatoes very aggressively in the Lord of the Rings movie. Just putting that out there.
Right, And so this guy broke up. He is not again, he is not a low visibility figure to these authorities that are now cracking down on him, just like the senator who is charged for working with Egypt. This indictment says that Roca unlawfully enriched himself or attempted to do so while furthering the intelligence interest of Cuba. So does that mean that he was spouting ideology to both sides of the game and then making a pretty penny off
the like off the discrepancy. Probably. The indictments thirty eight pages, you can read it online. We'll save you some time because we're going to move on here. But what you need to know, folks, is that there is no law against your public officials making a lot of money by breaking the same rules you were expected to follow Congress is never going to have a substantive insider trading bill.
They're never going to apply it to themselves. And with this, before we go to the break, I want to leave you with a question, how many other folks are out there? How long have they been operating, and why is the US government choosing to point them out today? One A three three STDWYTK Conspiracydiheartradio dot Com will be right back.
And we have returned with one final piece of strange news. Uh. In the way of an update, We've We've done a couple of updates on this topic, recently the QAnon Queen. You all remember the q Andon Queen? Yeah?
Oh yeah?
Uh? Did did Dolo? Romana? Did Dolo? Have you guys seen that a movie or read the book Doctor Sleep. It's a it's sort of a I guess a sequel to The Shining. I think it's one of Stephen King's better Latter day books. And he does a good job of incorporating a lot of the things about The Shining.
And it's nice to see where Danny ends up, and he ends up a lot like Jack, but you know, a little more of a benevolent version of Jack played by Ewan McGregor in the film, which is directed by Mike Flanagan, who has kind of become the you know, more modern day torch bearer of like good Stephen King adaptations.
There in that book and in that movie, there's a roving band of psychic vampires that live in caravans and they rove around the United States looking for people that possess the shining, you know that that ability, and they sucked them dryer of their they seem the steam is what they call it, right, so Didulo in her whole posse, And they're weird like intimidation of Canada roving around in
these like motor homes. For some reason, in my mind, I connect it to that in terms of just like, oh, you don't want to see them rolling into your town. And that was certainly the case when this group occupied an abandoned school in a small town in Saskatchewan. Is it Saskatoon? Do people say that? Is that just sort
of being funny or I think it's Saskatchewan. But we've talked about that was the last thing we talked about, where they essentially occupied an abandoned school in this very very small town, like in the you know, numbering in the thousands, like in terms of population, and we're you know, using some really crazy intimidation tactics that were just kind of spooky, like videoing the people of the town that were watching them, you know, from the rooftops and like
setting out this like like do not cross this like rope line kind of and just weird stuff. And just for you know, by way of a quick reminder, this whole posse led by Dodulo. They are QAnon believers, whatever that means. That can be a lot of different things. But Dedulo has convinced her followers that she is the legitimate Queen of Canada and caused a lot of people that have you know, fallen into her ranks to quit
their jobs. She was convinced convincing them that they would you know, didn't have to pay their bills, and subsequently a lot of them like lost their homes and had their power turned off and their utilities turned off and all of that. But as is often the case with people that really go down the rabbit hole with cult leaders, they still were in her corner, you know, even when things went completely pear shaped in terms of their actual lives. But it turns out that there are some people out there.
You maybe will recall that Dodula was using Telegram, which is an app that's like an encrypted kind of chat sort of app often used by drug dealers and folks that don't want people to be able to access the information that they're putting out there. Because it's encrypted, you have to be invited to these private channels. And Dodulo was using Telegram in order to spread her doctrine, whatever it might be. And let's be honest, it's very vague
what her whole, you know, thing is. And there are some I guess you could call them benevolent trolls out there that are trying to shut her down by infiltrating her telegram exchanges. And I think that's pretty interesting. So Vice mac Lemoreux reports in Vice, I'll just read the headline, trolls tricked the QAnon queen's followers into volunteering to kill So a lot of times, these types of leaders, they'll
really just straddle the boundary between legal and illegal. You know, they'll invite people to make up their own minds, but they won't outright say do this illegal thing. But if you are able to kind of game the system, like these benevolent trolls have been able to do. You can get folks following these types of people to basically admit to, yeah, I will do this absolutely illegal thing that could cause a kind of sea change in terms of like the
way the authorities are viewing these types of folks. So shortly after Romana Dedulo set up a new group on telegram that she titled Volunteer, Peace, Prosperity and Love Officers. This is sort of a way to organize followers by region.
Another little subgroup popped up that had a very specifically violent bent, and it was intended to recruit what the thread or the group referred to as military tribunal officers who would essentially act as judge, jury, and executioner for Dedulo and her aims, you know, her goals, because one thing that we maybe remember is that she was very much saying that we need to take down anyone that
opposes us. So what this group is essentially done is get people to come out of the woodwork and say, yes, yes, I will absolutely murder people for this cause, which you know, as you can imagine, especially if you've got someone that's you know, benevolent, they will share this information via screenshots which you can find on the Vice article, and show that there are people within this group that intend to do harm to officials, to people that you know would
oppose this group. So within this new subgroup that was and you have folks responding with things like I would like to get the show on the road as much as the next person, but I am not sure that this is something I want to have on my conscience. That being said, I also know this needs to be done.
Oh shout out Clyde barrowly.
Great, great, very good handle Clyde Barrow being a bonnie and Clyde very famous mass murderer, right and criminal. So within this group, at this point, people start bandying back and forth. How can we kill our enemies without being too obvious about it? And this is maybe my favorite part is one of the popular methods was taking people out into the Alaskan wilderness and leaving them to be devoured by polar bears.
See here's my problem. How can you differentiate someone who is actually a part of the group from someone who was on their toatrol because that quotation could be from an uber control on there.
Right, Absolutely, it's a good point, but at the end of the day, this effort is still kind of interesting, right, can we at least agree with that?
I guess what I mean is like, once you begin the troll in mass like you've got.
Yeah, especially when you're hiding behind a you know, a non discreen like, there's really no way to determine who you actually are and how serious you actually are. And honestly, it's not like, short of cyber let's say, forensic techniques, can you actually trace this stuff down to an individual. And part of the whole deal with telegram is that you kind of can't do that unless there are methods that I'm not aware of. The whole deal is that it's you know, encrypted, But.
Add to by the way the just interjector add to the fact that by the nature of what you're describing there with Telegram, with any encrypted or encrypted app, there's also no kind of there's no real barrier to infiltration. Sure, so it's super easy to it's super easy to even if you agree with the cause, it's super easy to be an armchair warrior. There are probably a lot more people online who see themselves as a supporter, loyal subject of the q Aton queen who had never visited even Canada.
That's very true. And this reminds me of the Riddler character in the Batman movie and how that person used social media, and you know, probably it's I think it was sort of an encrypted kind of like you know, peer to peer kind of chat that he used to coordinate what ultimately was a terrorist attack. But you can't to your point, Matt, you can't really differentiate between bluster and actual action until you do the action. You just
can't write. But this person, Dogwood, who I think is the sort of brains behind this whole, you know, attempt to expose some of these members. This is what Dogwood had to say. And Dogwood used their screen name to protect themselves from any you know, fallout or damage to their career. It did expose some of the bloodthirsty nature of the followers. It showed how dangerous these people really are. They can be told anything by the cult leader and they believe her and act on her orders.
Wow.
And it would seem that this is something that this Dogwood and their ilk or they're like do kind of on a regular basis. It's sort of like a white hat kind of hacker kind of mentality, I guess where you were, you know, again, to your point, like infiltrate is maybe a strong word, because all you have to do is just join the group or get an invite or whatever. I mean, it's not that hard to get an invite to a telegram channel, because what do cult
leaders want to do. They want to recruit people, so they're not always vetting people that are like becoming members of their channel. They want to have as many people as they as they can, and as long as you're seeming to be, you know, of their way of thinking, then they're probably going to welcome you in. But Ben, you you found a really good quote I believe also in the Vice article that sort of you know, spells out this Dogwood's mentality.
Oh yeah, Well, to your point, from the idea of recreational discordianism, right acting as an agent of chaotic good, Dogwood points out that they are doing this somewhat recreationally, they're not being paid to do so. I think the quote you're referring to is specifically where Dogwood says, who is identified as male in this Vice article says, quote, some people play video games, we infiltrate cults, which is
kind of cool. It's something to think about the next time, you know, like Doc and me or deep in Starfield logistics. Maybe if the game gets too complicated or whatever, Dark Souls or whatever, No Man's Sky or playing guys, maybe we should all just team up and infiltrate Occult's telegram.
Parlay that energy into like something that could potentially, you know, yield dividends.
Let's work for Cuba. You know, surely they've got to telegram. We'll never get caught.
Well, And there's another interesting quote from Dogwood is they prey on vulnerable people. We are vastly smarter than this cult, especially on a ridiculous, childish platform like telegram. They're always there to expose them, point out their falsehoods, and track their locations. It's to take our nations of Canada and the US back from the pandemic vultures of the Internet.
I love that frame itself. Vultures so good, perfectly poetically encapsulates so many grifts that occurred during the COVID shutdown. And by the way, I think it's important for everybody realize COVID continues. Mass media minds it continues, but also mass media is severely downplaying it.
You're saying the reality of COVID, the virus, but also the fallout psychologically of COVID continues. That is what QAnon is, I would argue, is what allowed it to flourish was people being pent up and having nowhere to funnel this aggression and this anxiety.
You know, there's definitely some gas, some high octane gas in the tank, right. No, as you guys know, we've also received some updates from our Canadian conspiracy realist, some of whom do live around Saskatoon, which I think is that is that the biggest city in Saskatchewan. Is that correct?
It is in Saskatchewan. It is in Richmond. Uh, Saskatchewan is the province Richmond, Yeah, and Saskatoon is something else.
That's why is the largest city in the province of Saskatchewan. But I think we're all grateful right to the to our neighbors to the north who have been given you know, these updates sometimes that don't make the don't make the mass media news.
And absolutely not. Honestly, it's this person advice that's that's largely if you look up the story about the QAnon queen, it's this one person, Mark Lemaru, who's been like, you know, really leading the charge into this research. Absolutely, and I think this is a this is endemic of something that maybe we have given a pass to, or at the very least sort of brushed aside because we don't take it that seriously. And maybe you know, this is a niche kind of thing, but what do niche things do.
They blossom and they metastasize if left unchecked. So I think it's something that's very important to keep an eye on, and and just to to go back really quickly for one more update. The occupation of that school in Richmond. I think due to a fire code violation, they were kind of chased out. It was something like there was a video that showed a like a heater or something leading against some sort of propane tank, and an inspector came and said, y'all got to go because I think
they were exercising squatters' rights. I think that was sort of what it was that sort of allowed them to be quote unquote legitimate in their occupation of that that space because it had been abandoned for so long and they weren't actually hurting anybody or threatening anybody directly. It was more like they were menacing people with their camera phones and stuff.
But similar to Waco, right, it is. Yes, there were outward threatening people at first, but internally an apocalyptic narrative that's exactly right.
And apparently they have left this school in Richmond, but they haven't gone far. There is a farm, another abandoned space, I believe, nearby, and a lot of the locals there in Richmond are concerned they're going to come back. So I think we end this one there. It's very interesting stuff and very eerie and again a huge shot out
to mac lemerou Lemereau. Forgive me if I'm mispronouncing your name, but because I think this is a very important work, and whether or not this person is going to take over the whole of Canada or the world, there are people that think this person has something of value to say, and that's kind of scary. Agreed.
Adding some more frightening frightening yule to the log here, How we have to wonder how many cultic organizations don't get mass media attention because they are not attached to viral headlines like QAnon or other buzzwords. Let us know what's going on in your neck of the woods. Let us know your experience with twenty three and me, and you know, if you are currently spying for a government while working as a US official, why not give us a shout.
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