How Social Media Has Changed the PR Game

nineteen nineties. In our wide ranging conversation, he offers insights into how social media has changed the media game for PR professionals and their clients as well as journalists. Shaun Cassidy, president of d k C, a public relations and marketing firm, thank you so much for doing this today. It's my pleasure. Thank you. So you know, obviously this is an incredibly fraught time in the world of any kind of media,

free media, traditional news media, social media. D k C has been known for as a company that was was very much ahead of the curve in terms of working with clients and generating, you know, significant real headlines around newsy projects, and that I think is a credit to the kind of people that you have worked with. How has that process of working with clients who are already in the news and and you know, getting your message

across in news coverage. How has that changed in a world where news travels around the world in a nanosecond and everybody in some form with their phone and their social media can be a reporter. How is that? How is your work in this area changed? Well, Tony, it's it's changed, but it hasn't. Um And I'll tell you how it hasn't. Is that the is the premium on news. I mean, if you're a public relations professional in today's era, you need to be thinking of yourself as a newsperson

all the time. And then that made seem obvious to you as somebody in the news. But but there was always this continuum between marketing and and editorial. And I think for many years PR firms were very proficient at being at at marketing on behalf of their clients, but they weren't necessarily great at coming up with the news side of it and figure out a way to um, you make a story attractive to the press. And right now,

I would argue that's more important for a variety of reasons. One, UM, the press matters no matter what anybody tells you about the influence of media and today's market and your readers, the readers of Variety are looking to you for direction. So so so what you say about a business you cover or individually you cover, matters greatly. I love hearing you say that I'm not just trying to be a

nice guy. I mean so. However, at the same time, there are and this is where it's this is where it has changed, is that there are so many more channel by which to communicate and and certain sectors. You see it in beauty and fashion absolutely positively with celebrities there there there are channels now which which matter in some cases almost as much as the press. And I say, I still believe that that third party opinion by um by, by a reporter, by any media outlet is extremely influential.

But brands, individuals can speak to their audiences directly right now. And again, there too, the ability to create newsworthy content matters because if it's newsworthy, it's relevant, if it's newsworthy, it's interesting, and ifs newsworthy, it gets shared. And so the the idea that that you can just sort of put content out that's really advertorial via social media, that I believe that's wrong. So I think there's still a a a tremendous need for editorial judgment on the public

relation side. Uh, there's a tremendous need for it now. And I guess what evolve this? This just there are just so many different channels by which to communicate. Yeah, I mean, you know, publicists have been putting out press

releases for decades. How is how is the trajectory of the news cycle different when you have a client who has you know, millions of followers on Instagram, and as we've seen now more and more, you have a celebrity that can break significant news about themselves on their own channel, and then, you know, do you sit there with the stopwatch and wait for the first reporter calls to come in? If somebody announces a big movie or a or a music tour or some kind of partnership or something, Um,

it's it cuts both ways. So so one absolutely positively the cycle is faster now than ever you know news. And it's very interesting because news, as also social media can blow up and get white hot really fast, but also flame out very quickly. So the site that the duration of a story can depending on how it migrates from one from social to earn to what we called our media to traditionally you, Um, depending on how that

that that goes. You know, a story can burn burn out very quickly or it can last, you know, last very long time. Here here's what has happened. UM. And I think ultimately this is uh, the advice I gy of the people in the public relations business and to anybody who works with public relations executives is following. Um, there's a belief now and it's and it's frankly, it's

it's it's there's evidence to support this. When you have have clients who have social media followings that are many, many, many millions, UM, those individuals can communicate directly with their with their with their fans. Uh. You know they can do that, UM. And that that gives you a lot of flexibility in terms of what you can say and cannot say, because again you're going directly to your directly to your fan base. What I believe has happened, and

I think this is a bad thing. I think it's a bad thing for frankly, for for um, for the client is that you have a leaf now that you don't have to deal with the press, you don't have to have relationships with the media anymore. And I don't believe that to be the case. I think that's wrong.

UM and I can I can elaborate on that, but just suffice to say, you know, the the um the third party validation or lack thereof from the press is very significant because remember, you know, an article and variety can be shared across social media and you have a global footprint, you know, hit a global footprint very quickly, right, And but is there something in terms of like, especially for the sort of the fan base, is there there's a level of authenticity if they're reading it on somebody's

Instagram account versus. Yeah, yeah, I think that's right. I think that that um that not just a level of authenticity. UM. For many fans, they're there their primary interaction with the artist, uh is via the the via social media. UM. I think where where not dealing with the press becomes a problem is when the say a story starts to spin out negatively and then that gets the purpose through social

channels at the fans say so. So the idea that you can you know absolutely positively, you know, you you have plenty of options right now is what it's dealing directly with the fan base. But I I guess the point I'm making is you just you just can't ignore the traditional media. It's a that's a mistake and not something I allow to go on here. Well, I think I want to ask you a little bit more about the traditional access to celebrities, because that is definitely I

can personally I know is changing. I can feel it in my own career, not and not just celebrities, but executives. I mean, people just feel so much behind behind the wall. But I want to ask you first, particularly with social how much do you have people if you have a high profile client and you know things are going to be going on and you know they're going to be generating headlines, do you have like people dedicated to just watching how it's playing out on Twitter and Instagram and Facebook.

Do you care on the on that granulural level. Yes, absolutely, I you know it's UM. So the answer is the first question is yes, we have people here and that that's what they do there there. And it's not just especially a digital team. Anybody who's working on an account UM has to be paying attention to how that client is being covered in social media because it's it's on one hand, it can be social media very tricky business.

On the other hand, it gives you a heads up of stuff that's bubbling up early on UM and so so so. So the answer your question, yes, we do UM in terms of in terms of UM how we handle it. It's it's tricky because you know, there's a there's a bit of a delta you cross. UM. You know, you can see something bubbling up in social media and typically will watch it UM because if it's something that's completely ridiculous, uh, you know, will be prepared for how

to deal with it. But sometimes it just fizzles out if it looks like it's taking off potentially, and this is where becomes it becomes an issue, is where it makes the jump over to the traditional media side. So say your publication, for example, pick something up that's that's in social media, then now it's real. UM. So you want to make sure you're prepared for that. And the only way to be prepared for it is to constantly be watching right and and looking you know, deep in

the deep in the comments. Because it's kind of shocking to me how much, as you said, like like things that start that sound ridiculous or or even now, there's so much back and forth with the this person said this on Twitter, and this person responded and and all of that, and and sometimes it's just it becomes so much noise, and your news judgment can be completely skewed. But other times that you know right or wrong, it

does steamroll. And I would imagine that that is a that's a there's a vigilance there that you didn't have to deal with ten years ago. Absolutely, But it also comes back to your earlier question about news um. You know, the role of the public relations executive as somebody who understands news cycles, and when you have to think a little bit like an editor when you're watching something something bubble up. It's sort of like you know, a city

editor at a at a local newspaper. You know, they'll they'll sit and they'll listen to the police and fire department scanners and they'll have a pretty good sense of, Okay, that looks like that's becoming something. Maybe we want to start somebody out to cover or you know what, it looks like they're gonna put it out pretty quickly. It's like that's it's the same thing. It's the same judgment

you're using in social media. Okay, that looks like something that could actually blow up, and we have to be ready to deal with this, and you know what, and we don't want to do something that makes it bigger, so we have to watch it. But at the same time, you know, sometimes it's just you know what it's it's it's so ridiculous that you just sort of watch it, let it. You know, you'll see if it flames out

on its own. So it's so that to to your to your point, it is about constant vigilance and and X sizing news judgment as it relates to how to deal with you know, what's going on in social media. Do you find do you for your for individual clients? Um? Do you find that you have to coach people? Are part of the job of representing them in the pr sense, is helping a person have a have a strong voice in social media? Yes? Um, But I think individuals and brand i'd say the same thing. Um, it just has

to be authentic. Um. And I think the the the easy part in the hard part is that is that you know, if you're working with it with an individual a very similar overment with the company, you have to stay what does that person believe? UM, you know what what what is that person's voice? What is that brand's voice? You know, what is it that's that's what is it

that makes that airline special? You know? And if you can, if you can, if you can decipher that reason so you can focus on that, then what's said on social media becomes largely derivative of that voice. UM. Where I think, so where you get into trouble and social media is you have no voice and you start going all over the place. And and what's interesting about um, the you know with artists with brands, you know they're they're shocking. Similar,

overexposure is a bad thing. And you become overexposed when you're out there all the time, and and and and you're all over the place in terms of what it is you stand for. UM, it just becomes noise at that point. And what you have and what you know, whether the reality of the environment or in today, is that social media can be the express train to overexposure. So understanding that voice and making sure it's authentic is critical, UM to be successful and successful um as all social media.

I want to return to that because I think to your point, about um, you know, particularly celebrities individual stars that are UM, I certainly sense it that there's a wariness about press and and and certainly for the all the dynamics we've just been discussing. One quote can be you know, potentially even taken out of context, can travel around the world. Oh my god, can you believe he

or she said that? And UM, is there do you sense is that do you have to convince clients sometimes to do like if you if you're going to do a major story that requires a reporter tagging along with a person for a day or two, like, is that a harder sell to some people nowadays? I think I think there's definitely a greater trepidation now than there was before. And um, and I sort of sort of break that question in two parts. One, I mean, the notion of celebrities,

artists being protected. I don't think that's new. I mean that goes all the way back to you know that, you know, when when studios used to create fake relationships between couples. You know it's like that, Like I mean that that the the paper over the problem that happened that weekend in Mexico or whatever. Right, Yeah, I mean that the idea that um, that image is uh, celebrity

images are very carefully manicured. UM. I don't think that's super new, and I think there's always been a level of protection of the artist that has that has existed

for for many, many, many years. UM. I think what what you're seeing in today's environment is where it's changed, is that you have a UM, there's a bit of a clickbait code, not a bit of it, there's a clickbait culture and so so one of the things you have to be careful with is, you know, if you have a have a five thousand words story about you know, somebody's fifty years the entertainment industry and there's one little personal revelation in there, UM, that can potentially overshadow the

entire the entire focus of the piece, which is somebody who changed the industry. You know, you have to hope that an editor is not going to pull that out and make that the focus of the of the social media push. But in an environment that is very clickbait driven, that's always a concern, um, you know, and that that's that, you know, the salacious nous tabloid ism. I mean that that is that I've been doing this almost thirty years now.

That's always existed. But that notion that you want to get as many clicks as possible, I think there's just an automatic temptation to try to pull out that which is going to uh to to create controversy or or or a salacious interest on what have you. So, so yes, I think you have to be nervous about it. But I'm a big believer um that it's very important, certainly for public relations executives to have relationships with the media

with whom they work. I think it's really important, and by extension, I think there has to be a bridge with with the client there. I think that I think that just do do nothing and communicate entirely social media. I don't know. I'm not a believer in that. I think that that that some degree of access is a

worthwhile long term investment as long as it's strategic. There is definitely a you know, there's definitely going to come a time in the most glittering career where you're gonna want to have where you're gonna want to have those relationships, no doubt. How do you deal with I I often think about you know, for me, in the course of my reporting career. It has definitely become it was. It's never a nine to five business, but it has definitely

become a seven business, Thank you Internet. But how do you all deal It's it's also much more of a global business. And how do you I would imagine when you have a big client in some big news is breaking, your people probably get five hundred calls from reporters you know, around the world. Have you guys dealt with just the sheer expansion of the of the number of platforms and outlets that call themselved A journalists? Sure? Well, that that's where, um,

where social media is your friend and your enemy? Um, I mean you know, obviously because of social media and because of the proliferation of news and you have news platforms globally, Um, you know you will literally get five hunter phone calls in a day. Um. Where social media is your friend is you have a means by which to put out authentic communication pretty quickly. Now, uh does that mean we we don't eventually get back to many of the five Yes, but you but look, you have

to live in reality here. You have to very often if something is breaking, you do have to get it out quickly and that is where social media can be very effective. You know, you can get it out to it and we we you know, we we we we've certainly had this situation with stories where you guys have been have been aggressively looking for information. You will usually social first and then we will look to put together

a depending on what it is. You know, the depends you know, for example, like we do a lot of crime management here, um, you know, and and when when you're representing clients that are involved in allegation, are involved any anything, anything that involves attorneys, the PR firm is typically is at the table, but the ultimate decision maker is going to be be an attorney. Uh And so sometimes you can't say as much as you'd like to write away so because you know, because that could ultimately

have an impact on a case. Uh So there will be a little bit of a of a playbook will follow and sometimes all you can do is put something out via social media and that eventually, you know, as things progress, you can you know, you can be a little more open in terms of what you can say later. But um, as a general rule, when we have been in that so we're in that situation quite frequently where you're getting five front a phone calls, um, you know

at two in the morning. Um. They you generally want to get something out pretty quickly, just just to keep the cycle at bay and then uh, and then you can figure out what the next step is once once you get all the information you need because sometimes sometimes how about how diligent you are in terms of monitoring social media, stuff can happen very quickly and you have

to you have to react for your fast. And the worst thing is is when something from an official channel or official pr turns out to be not quite right, that that really makes reporters cranky, cranky, and and it goes back to to that credibility point you're making earlier about being authentic, is that it's that if you're disingenuous in terms of what you say or in an effort frankly you know to do the right thing and just and just just answer a question quickly, and you don't

have all the facts it can be And that's where you have to very level head in this business. Uh. You know, I this is not an industry for people who panic, because you know, you have to be able to take a deep breath and and think about the consequences of everything you do and everything you say. You know, not just one minut it from now, but twenty four hours from now, a year from now. What are some of the biggest misconceptions about how the news media works

that you find when you're working with clients. I taste two things. One that uh that relationships don't matter. Um. I think it's extremely important for anybody who deals with the media to have a relationship with relationships with the individuals who are who who are working in the media. UM. I think too to you know, I deal with this a lot with major corporations that think they can exist entirely by feeding statements two reporters. Um. I don't think

that's a real relationship. UM. I don't think it's effective. I just I don't believe in it. The second thing is, look, your role is to get at the truth. UM. You know a a if we're doing our jobs, if you're doing a job at a reporter or producer, Look, you want to get at the truth. Um. And that doesn't mean that the reporter, the producer, whomever is out to

get the client. And you know, for so many years, one of the things I found, particularly major corporations is this goes back before the year of social media, is that the press was something that wasn't easily controlled. So if you had these companies, if they had a really big budget and really and a really big footprint um through advertising, they could just communicate with their customers that way and and just really react to the press when

they got a call and maybe issue a statement. Is that And then what happened is then all of a sudden you'd have a reporter digging into something and asking tough questions, and and these companies were so uncomfortable that often little issues seemed like really big issues because they were so elusive when it came to dealing with the press. So I'm a believer that you have to be very

proactive and you have to maintain relationships. You know, you know, you know, you should should have a cup of coffee with that reporter it was covering you. You just should you have that relationship. And so I think that the answer the question very sucinctly. One of the misperceptions is that is that that the press is the enemy and you can't you can't, you shouldn't deal with them because they are out to get you. I don't believe in that. I think the press is there to get at the truth.

And as long as you're comfortable telling the truth, you know what, there's there's no issue. I couldn't agree more with that message. Sean. You've been at d k C since nine two, you worked your way up to partner and president. What is it that brought you into PR and what has kept you here at d k C so long? Well, I really fell into the public relations business. UM. I graduated in the degree in American History from Tough University and UM and I didn't really know what I

want to do. UH, and I was one of those one of those kids who graduated and it's probably a slow was a relatively slow economy. UM. I did not have a job when I graduated, and I did what people did back then when they were looking for a job. Was I. I set out resumes and answered ads in New York Times and UM. About after about eight to twelve weeks of looking, I ended up with two job offers.

One was to edit pharmaceutical textbooks for a Swiss company and the other was to work in a small public relations agency UM in midtown Manhattan, and I opted for for that UM and it was interesting about it was I I had grown up in a family you know that was not in the news business. But my family, believe, my family loved news. My mother read the daily news, my father at the New York Times. And um, and I was it was just something I paid very close attention to. So it was a fairly logical. It was

a skill set that I I took to it pretty quickly. Um. And I had I had worked at at this a I had worked on a small agency everybody a year and a half, promarily doing real estate clients. And then a friend of mine had gone to work for for Dan Cloris and and he he called me, and he had just started the business. It was only six months old at the time, and and he had built up an extraordinary reputation and the firm that he had been with had an extraordinary reputation. So I said, look, I'll

give this a try. UM. If I hated, you know, I can always maybe be a lawyer or something like that. Um, and I like, I liked it. So years later, Uh, and what's what's kept me in the business is the following, the the pace of it, the mix of work. UM. You know, we represent every righty, from airlines, the high profile celebrities, to health systems, to sports franchises, to apparel manufacturers to beauty fashion companies. This this growing analytics business

right now. We have an experiential practice so interested a product design and events and influence the work. So so no two days in this business, and certainly this company for me has ever been sane. So while twenty eight minutes in this business now seems like a long time, you know, twenty years has gone by pretty quickly because

it's um, it's just been an extraordinarily diverse um experience. Well, I can honestly say that you're you're, you and your folks have always been among the most professional and the smartest people in this business to deal with. That's high praise. Report. Thank you very much, Thank you for your time showing you're very welcome. Thank you, thanks for listening. Be sure to tune in next week for another episode of Strictly Business.