Hi, everyone, and welcome to this episode of relationships rule. This is another one of those occasions that is really special because when I first started out with my podcast early on, I, I probably didn't know what I was doing. But anyway, I got started. And I just jumped in and I did my podcast. And I know that things have improved as I've gone along. And so one of the things that's really fun is to be able to bring someone back to my podcast for a second interview,
who was in that first batch of, of interviews that I did. And so today, I have a special guest one of those people, Allah bar dog, first of all, welcome to the show, Allah.
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure and an honor to be on your podcast. Yes,
it's my pleasure. And what's so special is I went back and looked at the first time you were on the show, which was actually over three years ago, I can't believe it, it was over three years ago. And we had just met not long before that, at an event in Salt Lake City, actually. And you were in the midst of your sales career. And a really going strong with your sale, selling for success. I think it's called selling for
success. Sell yourself for success. I knew I had it wrong, sell yourself for success, and all the programs that go with it. And I know that you're still doing that. But I thought that this was a special occasion because she's written a book. And the book is called Get out of the rabbit hole, building confidence to overcome self doubt, improve performance and
reach your potential. And for me, that seemed like a perfect time for you to come on the show, because you stepped it up now to the next level as well, with your book and everything that goes along with it. So congratulations, first of all. Thank you, James. You're welcome. And second, now I want to talk about it. So I want to know, first of all, how you got the title for the book, because I love the title get out of the
rabbit hole. And I'm always that hole. So I get it, but I want you to come tell me about it. Oh,
well didn't expect you to that would be the first thing Oh, really? Okay,
well, you never know. Right?
I am happy to talk about the title. Um, so there are 12 chapters in the book. And they're all a really independent chapter. But the main chapter, which is chapter six, six, that's in the middle of the book, it actually describes a relationship I had once with a close and trusted friend. And for the book purposes, we named her Carol. And so Carol's words that I replayed daily, in my mind caused me to doubt myself,
and actually sent my thoughts down the rabbit hole. So the name of the book is get out of the rabbit hole, building confidence to overcome self doubt, improve performance and reach your potential. And often we don't even realize how the words of those that we trust affect our actions. And they really, ultimately affect the goals that we set out to achieve. And so we all have people like that in our lives. And you know, for every negative experience, we can turn it
around and make it into a positive experience. It does take time and effort. But for me, the positive was that made me realize that I shouldn't let negative people take my thoughts down the rabbit hole. And I had to figure out how to get out, which took a long time. And that's another reason I wrote the book. I wanted to help other people not to go down the same path. And I provided the tools necessary to take their thoughts redirect them so that they don't go down the rabbit hole.
Oh, yeah. And it does take a lot of effort to. Again, I often come back to this phrase that one of my mentors whom you know, Cody Bateman, always the story in your mind becomes the story of your life. So you've got to change the story in your mind, right? And in this this exactly what you're talking about changing it from the negative influence to a positive influence. And it's just a switch, but it isn't just a switch, right? It takes
it takes a really long time. It takes a really long time. And you know, the interesting thing that Carol's you know, there's Carol in the book, but Carol's and the lives don't always show up in our 40s or 50s. You know, we could we could be carrying something that maybe a parent said or a coach, or maybe you know, a teacher and they they might not have even meant it they could have said it out of anger. And maybe they said you know you're not good enough. You'll never make
anything out of yourself. And you carry these words in your mind and they really anytime you encounter a challenge these words ring and they set you back and if we don't have the strategies, how to deal with them. It's Very difficult to succeed. And like I said, you don't have to be in your 40s 50s. I mean, you could be, you know, when you were 18.
Yeah, exactly. And it's just something that stayed with you a long time. So I love the way you have laid the book out. And in each chapter, you tell a story, a personal story, that then you give the audience, the reader the strategies for, for making these things work, like how you got out of it. And then so it ranges from, which I thought was really funny. And entertaining in the chapter about dress matters, which was chapter three, no, yes. Yeah. Chapter Three. Yes,
yeah. Because I, this goes back a long time, right. And it's all about first impressions, right? And you can maybe share a little bit of it with us, because I think the strategies are great.
Thank you. And I'm just gonna take it for a second. And as you said, every chapter has a personal story. And in each through each, through each story, you know, people can relate. And people can say, hey, they can transpose themselves into themselves into my story. And they said, I've been there, I understand. And strategies fade, but stories stay. So they might forget the strategies. But if they remember the stories,
don't remember the strategies. But the big thing, we always hear so much about dressing up, you know, dress for success, you hear so much about it? And yes, it is very important. You know, because whatever you wear, it's it's going to make a first impression or not, then you only have seconds to make the first impression. And that's what really people think about, you know, I need to look good, because I want to make a first impression, I'm going to this event, but it's not just what
your clothes say about you to other people. It's also what your clothes say to you. So I always tell people, you know, you take it's like a, like a gas gauge, and put on and see how you feel. Don't even worry yet about what IT projects to other
people. But how do you feel. So you might put something on and you know, it has a high tag price, and maybe it's a brand name, and you know, that looks good, but if you don't feel comfortable in it, or if you're going to be demonstrating something and you're going to raise your arms and your shorts gonna raise, raise up, you are not going to have that confidence. So the main point out of the chapter is it's not just what your clothes say about you, but it's what they say
to you. Right? Which is beautiful, because that's the first and foremost thing, right? Because if you don't have that, then you're not going to be confident. Another piece in the book that I loved. And actually what this reminded me of was my mother, and the chapter is complements chapter six, I think it is or no, not chapter chapter five, it's chapter five. says it's a please accept my gift stories. And you have a quote, at the beginning, I get awkward when someone
compliments me, they don't know what to say. They say you look pretty today. And when I say Happy Birthday birthday. Yeah, exactly. And they reminded me so much of my mother, because for so many years, my mother did not feel worthy. And you wish she'd always look 100% and loved clothes and love to you know,
entertain people. And if you sent her a thank you note, she'd send one back thanking you for the thank you note like this is how she wanted to always it wasn't she was trying to do anything other than just be grateful of the other people.
And you, you in the strategies. In this chapter, you talk about how being able to accept a compliment, helps build relationships, and I highlighted this because I want to just read it, when you accept compliments from those who don't know, or don't know, well, you have an opportunity to thank them and start a conversation. Accepting compliments creates the
opportunity to develop relationships. And because I'm all about relationships, I that jumped out at me as well as it reminded me of my mother, that story that you told, I thought that this was a really good strategy for relationship building. So I just like to hear your your tests on what you want to share.
So a lot of times when people get a compliment, and let's just transpose yourself, say we're in a business meeting, and you're hoping to get the business of this potential client and the client complements you on something and you say, Oh, this dress is so old. Oh, I bought this suit years ago because you're thinking you're downplaying You're being humble. But in turn, you are not. So the first there's, there's so many aspects to you not being able to
accept the compliment. The first thing you're doing is, oh my gosh, I gave them a compliment. And they did not like the dress or whatever. Now you feel like I have to give them another compliment. So now you're scrambling What else can I tell? Say, if it's to Janice, what else can I tell to Janice? Oh, my gosh, you know, your hair looks great. And so you're scrambling to find another compliment. And then another thought is, if you're not worthy to accept the compliment, why
should you be worthy to accept their business. And so if you just met someone, you're already starting a relationship on the wrong note. And on a negative note, because you just made the person who gave you a compliment, you really deflected that compliment, you kind of knocked it down and put the other person in a really awkward situation. Well, what do I say
to make Janice feel better? And so but the interesting thing is, so how does that give you confidence, but knowing what to do, when somebody gives you a compliment, if you know that, you just need to accept it, not just that you need to accept it, you have confidence that already gave you a confidence booster if we just met. And I give Janice a compliment. And she said, Thank you, or thank you for your compliment. If you don't know
what to say, or how to accept it, I give many ways. But if you just say thank you, it means a lot, or thank you for the compliment. That's literally all you need to say. And now you're just starting, you're starting this meeting on a positive note, it's open, it's welcoming, and the other person doesn't feel like they have to give you another compliment. And also, a lot of people feel like, once somebody gives you a compliment, you have to compliment them back. Don't do that, because
that does not come out authentic. Say Oh, I like your dress. And you said, Well, I like your dress as well. So you really don't want to do that. But I give these strategies, and they seem so simple. But But following them will help you build confidence and improve relationships, as you said. And the first relationship I think maybe we discussed it a few days ago, the first relationship that matters most is the relationship
you have with yourself. And if you don't value that relationship with yourself, if you don't value yourself enough, then why should anyone else?
Exactly. So good. So I think it's an interesting question about confidence. Because I often ask people about curiosity, and is it learned? Or like, is it innate? Or is it learned? And you have a question that came up? That I think is worthy of talking about too, so Can Can somebody? Yes, I think I think they can become confident. I think that's, that's, that's evident in your book, if you follow the strategies to build confidence, I think it works. But are you born with it? Or is
it learned? I think that's a different piece. And I'd like to hear your take on them. So we,
you know, throughout our lives, we often hear people say, you need to be confident, or sometimes we think when I'm confident or a lot of times you hear parents say you need to be more confident. Yet no one ever says here's how you do it. That's another reason why I wrote this book. So the problem remains, how do you become confident? And the story if I took you back to Cuba back and you say, well, here I am,
obviously, you can hear my accent. So if you're wondering, I immigrated to this country when I was 15 years old, I did not speak a word of English. So how does someone like myself talks about confidence. And so it was during my college days that I decided I was studying accounting, and I decided to go sell vacuum cleaners door to door. That sounds like a fun thing to do. And I was learning to speak English and and so I spent a lot of time shadowing other people learning all the
sales skills, and I was so good at it. I can close any sales that can overcome any objections because I learned the skills that were tools for me to learn. But then I was missing one thing. I had a hard time getting through the front door. Once I was in the door, I had it. So I realized I was missing one component. And that's that confidence to get through that
front door. And so what I realized is that while if you wanted to learn how to cook, oh there cookbooks if you wanted to learn how to drive, you can go take driving lessons, but there was no there were no instructions on manuals on how to become confident, and really trying to become confident without the tools needed was difficult. And that's when my quest began. On, hey, can you learn confidence? Is that a
learned trait? And so it took me it's been a 30 year journey, trying to figure out So during that time, I have discovered that confidence can be learned, practiced and mastered, just like any other skill. Just like you exercise the muscle in your body, you can also exercise your mind to build confidence. You just need to know what to do. So you learn it, you practice it, and then you master it. Does it take time? Absolutely. And so in my book, I outlined 12, confidence building strategies.
And it's not if you asked me one hour, if I do them, if I had read the book in one week, or in one day, and I go practice them, Am I going to become instantly confident? Of course not. So my best advice is, read a chapter and go practice it for a week,
read another chapter, add to it, and go practice it. And over time, when you can, when you can perform these strategies without even thinking, you will absolutely gain confidence, you will absolutely people will notice, you will become more confident you will become a better a better person, overall, a better parent, a better spouse, a better significant other, so you will become a better person. So yes, you can absolutely learn and become confident.
I think that there are people however, that I think of when I was a kid, even that I can remember, you know, people who just oozed confidence as kids or teenagers, whatever. And they were the ones that were quite often the maybe they were the valedictorian in school, or maybe they were the leader of whatever was going on, because they they stood tall, they knew who they were, and they had that inner confidence. Do you think
that there are those people? Have you come across those people in your world?
And think there's also there's a fine line between confidence and arrogance, especially when it comes to salespeople? Yes. And then yes, I do think that maybe some people are born a little bit more inclined towards being confident or possibly their parents. So I think the parents or the people around them, they have observed things, and they have applied what they've learned versus some other kids
that might not have. So modeling, yeah, as exactly as role models, you have to look at, you know, who are your role models? Who are the people around you? What are they? What are they exhibiting? Since you brought this up, I will mention I was doing training for this company. And we were doing strictly confidence, actually, we're doing sales training, but as part of it is always a confidence training. And so this, this gentleman would go home, and he would share what
he's learned from me within I think, weekly or monthly. And he would share it with his family with his with his 15 year old daughter, actually, for quote is in my book, her endorsement from a 15 year old. And she was a professional, not professional, but she was playing sports. And so he would share it with her every time that we had training session. And he shared with me that one time the mom said something negative, and she said, Mom, we're not being negative, this is not gonna help
us succeed in life. But this is what the kids are observing. So if you're observing, if your parents, which most of us most of people really, truly tend to lean on the negative side, we're kind of expect negative outcomes. And so that does affect those kids. So I do think that yes, absolutely. What you're saying that some of those kids, yes, it's part of staying tall your body language will affected? And if you want I can I have been asked, Are there habits that are destroying your
confidence on daily basis? I have been asked that question, you know, a few times. And so possibly, it's something you do, or if you observe as a teen you observe or as a kid, your parents do it, then it's very difficult for you to be growing up as, as a confident, you know, teenager or adult. And those are negative self talk. Yeah. Because especially when we're faced in with challenging situation. So our tendency is to engage in negative self talk. And then also we expect negative
outcomes as our mind. Our mind is just programmed, you know, that way we expect the negative and then of course, self doubt. And, you know, we discussed it and people experience self doubt for a variety of reasons, including, you know, their upbringing, somebody that somebody said, maybe they're extremely competitive, or maybe they're perfectionist, so So they're different things but yes, to answer your questions, I think some kids are okay based on their environment.
So it was something that came up yesterday you and I were working together yesterday on an on something completely different and and you You exhibited this amazing attribute of being able to visualize. And when you visualize something, I don't have that. I don't see pictures the same way. I don't think I've trained my brain that way enough. And I love it. I love that you are that this isn't one chapter in the book as well called visualize it. And you say
the subtitle is my eyes made it happen story. And I love the story. And I love what happened. And I wondered if you'd share that story. Do you remember the story I'm referring to? I do?
I do. It was, it was of course, of course. It was my corporate career. And at the time, we had three kids. We had the young, the young, the younger one was, had some health challenges, which caused me to retire from corporate life. And it was during that time that I decided to start this little side gig on the side. And it was a jewelry business and was a custom jewelry. And I thought, you know, it would be fun while
I'm being a homeroom mom, and I'm doing this. And so I really wanted to get this jewelry into, into a, this fancy spot I'm in and one time I walked in, and I saw, I walked into the spa, and I saw all of this jewelry that they had a jewelry display. And I went and I asked, Are you looking for any vendors? And of course, the answer was no, that they you know, we have not added. And the first thing as I stood there, I mean, I was just in shock. And I'm sure the lady was thinking, oh my gosh, she's
crazy. She just stood there, I'm not moving, I'm not saying anything. And all of a sudden, I did not see the candles, the body wraps or the the jewelry that was there. All I saw was my jewelry. I saw it on every shell, I saw it displayed. I saw it everywhere. And so that visualization drove me to create an action plan and to follow my steps. Instead of you know, the tendency when we expect negative outcome, you say, Oh, well, you
know, it'll never happen. You know, I'm just beginning I only started a month ago, who would bring my jewelry in here, right? And yes, the visualization really, really helps you know, and it does not the visualization does not replace the work that needs to take place. But what happens visualization is that you go through the action twice for the action. So you go once in your mind, then you plan it really
three times. And then when you meet, then you've already overcome you already overcame all their objections, you already came up with all the answers. So it's, it really it just helps to bring your aspirations to life. And if you look at the you know, the ancient monks, if you look at celebrities, if you really talk to athletes who've achieved, you know, the highest level, they will tell you it all starts with in your mind, it starts with visualizing yourself, achieving
that goal. And so the strategies I give in the book for visualization, how do you achieve it? What do you have to go through? So thank you for picking on that chapter. I think it's very it is very important chapter is
that you have to finish the story. You have to finish the story.
Oh, when it was realisation that with the jury, yes, what your delivery? They did, yes, they did, I did call and I did set up a meeting. And I was because of visualization that I was able to visualize where every piece would be on which shelf. So to down to the point where I told them while you have these body wraps that you really haven't sold a whole lot. But if I put my piece over here, it's going to bring the attention to it. But that all happened in my mind first, and
then I brought it to the manager. And very after the meeting, it was we'll get back with you. And it was within it was so fast when they got back with me. And they said we would love to carry your jewelry. I know that. And so so yeah. So that was, you know, that was a very, very exciting moment for somebody who's just starting to do something and been at it for a month.
But that's not that also, though, comes back to the fact that number one, you're a great salesperson. And number two, you're an entrepreneur, and you know you had all of those things going for you but the visualization is what jumped out at me. That's why I let the story and you're right now there was just the NBA basketball draft was just last month and watching the new players coming out of school and I don't know if you're familiar because I know you're a basketball family
like we are but maybe not in the same way. But we are watching the draft and there was a set of twins and they were drafted fourth and fifth out of everything. And that's number one, it was the first of its kind that they had twins drafted. But number two, they were, I read a story about them and magazine just last week. And both of them since they were like five years old, had been visualizing being in the NBA.
And you're, like you said it previously, that it's with people that reach a high level like that, that is often the beginning, is having that vision and maintaining that vision throughout and believing it right. Because it's the belief
eliminates because it's very, it's very difficult, because you know, you're gonna, you're gonna encounter daily ups and downs, you know, it's not always great, you know, you will be defeated by other teams, you have to break through the mental, you know, the mental barrier, because it's not always, you know, it's not always roses or whatever they say, you have to work hard. But the tendency is, oh, my gosh, there's these kids are better than than we are, will never
make it to the NBA. But you cannot win with that kind of attitude. Because if you see yourself daily, if even if you have to cut out the pictures, I know, I forgot, I told you in one of the other picture, or in one of the other chapters that I was trying to help my roommate lose weight. And it's also the visualization. So was a college roommate. And so I took a
picture of her favorite celebrity. And then I took a picture of her and I cut out her face and put it on everybody's face, that creates a visualization, hey, this is my, you know, my idol, I want to look like that. And when you and I hung it in our closet. And so every day when she would look at it, you know, it made her made healthier choices. So that's also visualization. And it can play a huge part in just about
anything that we want to accomplish. Even writing, writing a book Never did my life did I think that I would write a book. But the first thing is, you know, your visual, you visualize, you visualize people reading it, you visualize the impact it's going to make on others. So very, it's very important.
That's, that's so great. And, and comes with this new venture that you're on. So you're from this book, you're still doing your sales, training, and all the different aspects of sales training. And now you're going on the road with your book right now you want to share this information by talking on stages and, and in groups of people that you can spread the word. Now I understand there's a workbook that goes with this
workbook, and it's a GET OUT OF THE RABBIT HOLE workbook, developing your confidence building strategies. And that's really the only way the best way that you can put all the strategies to practice because then you can apply them to yourself. The nice thing about the book is, you know, you don't have to write on margins, I didn't have to leave you empty spaces. But the cool thing is, it has by chapter is structured by chapter and it gives you examples. And then you write
out. You write out the situations based, you know, based on your situation, right. And a lot of chapters have a moment of truth. And this is where you actually write, you know, this is what I do right now. Because oftentimes your first thing instinct, oh, I don't do that. But if you are going to, if you are you going to really take this book and put and put it to use and really become confident. And so the
moment of truth is something very important. And we were mean you were talking a lot earlier, we were talking on a podcast about the compliments. And so here's a moment of truth from the compliments chapter and it says, thinking about the past, prior to reading the book, write down your responses to when someone complimented you, if you can't recall, start by paying attention to how people around you respond to compliments, and
write it down. So an example I got this shirt two years ago from a garage sale, it's most likely out of style now, but I want people to write down because unless they write down and they start catching themselves, you know, it's all about awareness, and replacing what they do to something to what they should be doing to become confident. So that's what the workbook is all about. And it's available on Amazon as well.
Okay, awesome. Yeah, I remember always saying to my mom when someone was if I was around her and somebody complimented her mom, just say thank you, just because it was hard for her to do that. Right. So I guess yeah, yes. So last thoughts, in terms of the strategies that people can do to become more to apply to become more confident? What would your top two or three be to share with my audience I'm pretty sure I know what they are, because we've talked about, go ahead.
Yeah, so I really want to cover probably self doubt, because that's the, that's the main chapter and just some things to, to put into people's heads because we all have self doubts and self doubt does not discriminate against age, or your, or how successful a person is, when self doubt is a destructive state of mind. And so the first thing, so I'm gonna give people three things, actually five things that they need to do, and then they can go for more details into the book.
So the first thing is questioned the validity of your doubt of your doubts is what should as I always say, doubt, your doubts, doubt your doubts. Is it really true what you're saying, you know, and maybe you need training or some skills, then
great, then go and get them get that out of your mind. But what I also say is voice voice, which you're thinking to yourself to a group of people that you that love you and your trusted circle, voice it to your significant others voices to maybe your grown up, kids voice it to your best friend, who has your best interests in mind, and say, This is what I'm saying to myself? Is it true? Chances are, it's not they wouldn't agree with you. And probably you should not agree with yourself
either. And, you know, and then you possibly could be also hearing the voices of someone else what someone said, to make you feel that way. So that's number one. question the validity of your doubts. Number two, become consciously aware of when you're talking to yourself, you know, what are you saying maybe I'm not good enough? Maybe I'm not the person they're looking for? Nobody's gonna read my book. I mean, is that true? No, it's absolutely not true. But these are the things that
you go through as you're going through the process. So consciously become aware. And then this is my favorite part, and acknowledge and name your doubting thoughts. So anytime you hear a doubting thought that that comes, name it. So for me it was go away, rabbits go away anytime. And to this day, any you know, because we're not no one's immune, no one is immune
against self doubt. But if you have the strategies, and you know what to do, so you name anytime I have a self doubting thoughts, and especially in the chapter when I explain it, name it. So go away, rabbit go away. And then what you want to do is shift your attention to now. And you know, now is the only really moment that we can control whether it's through your breathing through your music, you know, whatever, however, it is that you that you can come to now. And then, and then replace
them with something positive. You know, I have a separate chapter on I am statements. So if you're saying I am not good enough, who will read my book, I am a great author. I am, I will be helping so many people build confidence. So those are just a few. A few strategies really on self doubt, because it affects so many of
us. Yeah. And all starts with ourselves, doesn't it? It
does. It absolutely does.
So thank you so much for all of that. All the strategies, sharing your stories with us, and where can i Where Can my audience find you? And I will put
they can find me on my website is sell yourself for success.com? Yes. And the book, the book is on get out of the rabbit hole.com And it can be the book can be purchased on Amazon as well as Barnes and Nobles.
Perfect. I will put all that in the show notes. And I do recommend that anybody who's an entrepreneur in business should read this book because it definitely brings all of these things to the forefront that we can help that will help make us a better person conference. Yes, thank you and thanks for being here. Thank you to my audience. If you liked what you heard, please subscribe and leave a an honest review. Thank you again, and stay connected. Remember Thank you