Talking COP26: Major Breakthrough or All for Naught?

to the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change. You might know it better as COP twenty six. This is the annual conference where in twenty fifteen the famous Paris Agreement was reached. Its goal was to keep the climate from warming by more than one point five degrees celsius from pre industrial levels, and since then the progress toward that goal has been kind of underwhelming for a lot

of people. This year's COP was held in Glasgow, Scotland, and Bloomberg Laws Bobby McGill was there covering the whole thing. He's still in Scotland, so I thought i'd give him a ring and have him explained to me what exactly went down there and what it was like reporting on this famously difficult to cover event. Well, this is my

third COP. I covered COPS twenty four in Poland and I stayed there for the first for the whole two weeks, and then I just one week in Madrid the second half of that conference in twenty nineteen, and this was the marathon. This was in part because this is this was such a big momentous COP. You know, this is this was such an important conference because it was where countries had to come back six years after the Paris Climate Accord to sort of ramp up their emissions cutting commitments.

So as we're talking about this, I'm realizing that when you're talking about negotiations and and you know, covering these negotiations, it involves everyone being in the same place together, which is not necessarily something we can do now with the pandemic is still in play. What was that, like, how did the pandemic affect the ability of you to cover this and also of the negotiators to negotiate. Well, you know,

they pulled it off. It happened. There was a lot of mask wearing and there was you know, they tried to get out The British government sponsored a vaccination schemes, so that as many people from the developing world could be vaccinated as possible. But the key here is that even though the conference went off without too much of a hitch, and you know, there were some cases. I don't think we know the final number, but there were

some cases of COVID. The key issue here is that because of the hoops that people had to jump through to get to Glasgow from the developing world, there were activists and NGOs and other members of civil society who said that they did not have access to this the COP twenty six and the and the and the process that they would have previously, And there were voices that

were not necessarily heard. But at the same time they did have And I don't know if the final number is available yet, but I think there was an estimate of about forty thousand people attending this COP which is a lot of people, and a lot of people in a very concentrated area. Because the US was there, there were a lot of different things that I had to

cover compared to previous years. Yeah. Actually, well, and I wanted to ask you about that because this is the first COP that has happened since President Biden took office, and it sounds like, based on what you're saying, that changed like everything. I wouldn't say it changed everything. I would say that it certainly puts the US back on the map. You know, the US tried hard, it seemed to, you know, regain its credibility on the world stage and on its you know, with its with its climate agenda.

This was, uh, this was notable because you know, in the previous two climate summits. Uh, you know, the US didn't have what they call a pavilion, which is it's where they host side events and basically get their message out to the world. This time, they hosted Interior Secretary Debt Secretary Deb Holland, and they had other and EPA Administrator Michael Reagan and other cabinet officials who were who were there to discuss the Biden administration's climate agenda. In

previous years they didn't happen. Yeah, well, I mean that's that's a big deal onto itself, because I mean they're only you know, about a dozen and a half cabinet officials that exist, and two of them were there. At least two. It sounds like, okay, so let's get into what actually happened at the cop over All, I get the sense that people were a little disappointed with the outcome as specifically as it pertains to coal and coal subsidies.

Can you talk a little bit about that and why some of the sort of environmental activists weren't thrilled with what happened there? Well, I think part of what happened was the very last minute there was in the US was a part of this. Actually there was a last minute deal to water down language on coal. But the difference here is that these fossil fuels have never been called out by name in any previous climate summit outcome.

So even the Paris Climate Agreement didn't mention fossil fuels, and so the first time we get, you know, a mention of fossil fuels in the in the Glasgow Climate Tact. And that's significant because, especially with coal, even though the the language is watered down a bit, you know, I think it was perceived as writing on the wall for the for the coal industry. And basically the way they phrased it was the pact is calling for countries to

help accelerate the phase down of unabated coal power. There's no metrics for that, right, but you know it says countries need to start moving away from coal, and the market's already doing that anyway. And the other thing is that it talked about a phase out of inefficient fossil

fuel subsidies. What are inefficient fossil fuel subsidies? I don't know exactly, And and so you know, that's open to interpretation if if you think that, you know, if you are an activist and you think that climate change is the existential crisis of our time, this language sounds disappointing. But if you're familiar with this process, you and you see that this is actually calling for a shift away from you know, even in water down terms, from these

traditional sources, these polluting sources of energy. You know, it's progress that's really interesting. I also I get the sense that China and India played a big role in this sort of last minute change too. As you said, water down this language. Can you talk a little bit about that?

And and I guess also about the role that these countries that are sort of developing very very rapidly play in you know, combating climate change and potentially you know, wanting to hang on to fossil fuels for a little bit longer. Well, I think ultimately they want there, They want the same quality of life we have, and fossil fuels has brought that. And so you know, uh, these countries. India is not going to it doesn't plan to reach net zero until well into the second half of the century.

And and so that's that. That means that they are going to be committed to the fossil fuels for for probably and possibly coal power for you know, possibly another fifty years. They were an active player in trying to water down that language. Let's talk about Alex Sharma, he's the president of this COP. He said at the end that you know, we're still one point five degrees is still a possibility, But he also said that it was you know, the pulse is weak, that it's a very

very remote possibility. Can you unpack that a little bit and explain what he meant by that and and how how one point five degrees is even still a possibility. Well, he's right in that. So there was a UN report that came out just before COP twenty six that said that we that globally emissions have to fall by half by twenty thirty in order to reach one point five

Is that realistic? I don't know, but I mean, I think we can all look around and look and and understand that the political will for that is probably not a strong it should be if we were, if we're at if we actually wanted to be on that trajectory. With all of the climate commitments that are on the table from more than one hundred and fifty countries. Right now, we are not on track for one point five. We are somewhere in the neighborhood. We're above two degrees, and

that's still that's catastrophic climate change. And part of the problem here is that the the math that countries used to estimate their emissions cuts and their current levels of emissions, it's it may or may not be exact, and so there's there's a lot of uncertainty in the system. Ultimately, countries are going to have to come back to the table and agree to do more, and so that's what

the next step is. They they have to come back to the table at the end of twenty twenty two, presumably in Charmel shake Egypt next year for Coup twenty seven, and revisit those twenty three goals that they've had to cut emissions, and they and the mandate is to is to cut emissions even more deeply. All right, and finally, really briefly, let's talk about next year. You know, are we did did this COP kind of set things up

really well for Sharmel Shake next year? Or do you think is there like a lot of are there a lot of open questions that you know are unanswered that will need to be answered before we get to Egypt next year? Well, I think that the big thing on

the table is is you know, more ambitious commitments. So you know, we won't know until we we won't know until we get there ultimately, and you know there's going to be a lot of you know, intervening talks, you know, as there as there always are between now and then, but you know they're developed countries are going to be asked also to come back to the table and and you know, put up more money for to help other countries adapt and you know, to help countries they can't

adapt to you know, account for their loss and damage. So there's there's a lot of progress to make. This was a significant step it COP twenty six in Glasgow and uh, you know, we'll just have to see how things go and in a year, all right. Well, that was Bobby McGill speaking to us from Scotland. Bobby, thank you so much. This was really great and have a safe trip back to the US of A Thank you, David, And that'll do it for today's episode of Parts per Billion.

If you want more environmental news, check us out on Twitter. We use they handle at environment. Just that that environment. I'm at David B. Schultz. That's b as in Bobby, don't forget to buy me some Scotch. Today's episode of Parts per Billion was produced by myself, David Schultz. Partsber Billion was created by Jessica Coombs and Rachel Dagle and is edited by Rebecca Baker and Chuck McCutcheon, and our executive producer is Josh Block. Thanks everyone for listening and

have a lovely Thanksgiving. You don't need to be a judge to be interested in our nation's laws and legal institutions, just like you don't need to have a law degree to be curious about the inner workings of courts, law firms, and law schools. That's where we come in. My name's Adam Allington and I'm the host of Uncommon Law, a podcast from the Bloomberg industry. Group. Uncommon Law is where

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