Top 50 NFL Players Heading Into 2021

been like a billion years. Wait a second, you see you. Last time we had you on, you went with that same old thing you said, Oh it took so long to have us on. Now you get the second invite, which is always the seal of approval. You're not a Yeah, you're not a hit it and quitic guest, and you're still gonna bury us here in the biggest of all spots at the top of the show. Listen the top of the show. There's two things that everyone needs to note. Number one, Dan Hands has a savage tand that's the

only way to describe it. It's savage number one. And number two, I was working today, but of course I'll work anytime you guys call. I pick up the bone, I pick up the zoom, I pick up the stream yard link, you know, anything for you guys. Know that's very nice to you. And you know what, since you mentioned that I do have a savage tan, it's my not my Irish side side. It's definitely not your Irish side. And I want to do a little roll call, like where are we right now? Ricky? You could kill that

music anytime you want. Um, where is everyone right now? I am on the Jersey Shore, Um, in my parents bedroom. It's a heat wave here on the in the northeast where magic happened and stop it. And that's where I am until tomorrow when I head back to l A. Where are you Greg? I'm back home in Santa Monica. I was on the east coast Cape cod and then um at my parents place at the vineyard for nine days or eleven days. But just return this week, so I mean I don't feel quite ready for it yet,

like just jumping back in. We've got our network show coming up, and this is like an ease into it week. We're doing one. And where's your tan? By the way, not savage? It's like a little bit. But this this lighting in this room is as rough as always. I mean, if you put the light on real bright, it's just it's you always the same color. It's perfect. Here's another by the way, as I throw to Cynthia, when you're staying with your parents. Right now, it's just me and

my two parents. You know how they're really bad with cell phones, Like they just leave them around in other rooms because they treat them as landlines. My mom's phones ringing, So let me tee you up, Cynthia. Where are you right now? I'm in Flathead Lake, so Lakeside, Montana. So just go like almost in Canada and like a little bit down so right by it's in big Sky country. So there's a very large sky here, also a very large lake, Flathead Lake. I was telling you guys before. Uh,

they'll tell you around here. It's the largest freshwater lake east or west of the Mississippi in the continental United States. You know a lot of caveats. It's like the first Uh, do you have like a history their family? There is there a reason or you just go to Montana. Um So, I ran a marathon near Missoula like two or three years ago and it was really really great. Yeah, this

stupid marathon goals, it's ridiculous. Um and uh. And it was always really beautiful and this is kind of a hidden gem, like it's not super expensive, still got good food and everything that you want to do. And the lake is really really beautiful and not too cold because I was in Duluth, Minnesota and I jumped in that lake and Lake Superior is the coldest thing that could ever exist. It was. It was insane. Um because my ear piece was out. Did you mention the lake bit

that you had? Yes? I did. Oh, don't got my lake. I got at lake content that is really good. The audience needs to know that, you know, keep that in the chamber. Alright. So Cynthia's here and it's awesome. Cynthia, by the way, she is like the skeleton key for the A t N podcast non podcast stuff because Cynthia has a big role in the Power Rankings TV program. She has a big role on the pick Um TV program that Greg does with Cynthia and Hawk. Uh and we're all big, big fans of her and listen, she's

a huge hit in the analytical community. She has she has a machine. She's big on the broadcast. She does a lot with the broads. Don't forget well, okay, that too. She has a giant machine, like a giant computer, supercomputer she keeps in her in her boudoir. I believe it's actually here in Montana with me. When I hear about your computation machine, I picture like those supercomputers that Russia built in during the Cold War, where it takes up

half of an airport hanger. But now you're telling me you can actually pack your supercomputer and bring it with you anywhere in America. Listen, if you thought that the audience you need to know about lakes. Here's what you mean about how this works. When you write software like you don't, the computer can be anywhere. It's like it goes to like a cloud and then it comes back down like this thing's like it's like it's everywhere and nowhere at the same time. It's pretty great now with Dan.

The bigger the computer, the bigger the information. It's huge to Montana. You're going to get a call from your agent right after this podcast, because I'm sure your agent listens to everything and watches everything you do, and your agents number one mistake of being a giant in the analytics community. Never tell them you don't have a supercomputer, because it's more impressive you have it. No, the hardware, not software hardware. But I also have a supercomputer because

that's the way it works. It's just they make them smaller these days because you know that she's breaking another of the analytics community. Never do a program with someone else from the analytics community who can challenge you. And we have Sam Munson from PFF coming up late. How exciting that? Are you exciting that? I'm really excited. I have one question for Sam because when he does these

and I love the voice over. He does this like really cool graphic video that I watched every week, like you know, for it describes something for a matchup of the week, whatever, but he suppresses his accent in it, and I don't get it. So I needed to, like I need. I have so many questions because I love the accent working use it. Women love that he's going to be on the stoographic and just a little bit and I think that's fascinating and we're gonna have to

get into that. UM. But before we do, I just want to um touch base about UM as some of you may have heard if you follow the machinations of our business. UM. Two weeks ago, NFL Media UH announced a wave of layoffs across the company. UH. Sadly, our little world, UM, the podcast world, in the editorial group were not spared. It was a sad, sad week a couple of weeks back, and a lot of us are either on vacation or just kind of taking some time out,

and it kind of jolted us back to reality. And I just thought, and Greg, I know you and Erica UH and Cynthia perhaps feel the same way that it's that we should take a little time just to share, UM and acknowledge and say thank you to some people who are very important, instrumental really to the growth of

this show, to our careers behind the scenes. And we're just nice people to work with, starting with Ryan Bartlett, who's a rock behind the scenes, working arm and arm with Rickey on a variety of projects UM in the digital realm. Just a great guy, passionate, casey chiefs fan and UM we remember the get Bartlett to Miami, so

you got to see the Chief super Bowl. Second, John Marvel, who was our boss on the writing side of things, and you know a real blue guy in the news room, a huge Tom Petty fan, a guy with more experience and news than all of us combined in, a supporter of our show and us as individuals, and um, just a fun guy to work with and get a drink at the cozy, which I want to do with him when I get back to l A. Finally, Mark Brady, who was the guy pulling the strings of the podcast division.

He was our train conductor, the man who always was passionate about the job. You put an endless hours, vital to the success of our show, and we've grown so much as a podcast since two thousand thirteen when we started.

Mark was key to that. And he was also relentless in his pushed to get us to London and in nineteen and this is just a measure of the man to me that when I had a nice conversation with him last week, just kind of talking about everything, and the phone call near the end, he's like, here, here's where I was and trying to get you guys to London. This ball you should have this information and kind of work with the bosses like who does that? Um, after

what happened? So in short, it sucks. We don't work with these people anymore. It's part of the business. This is how it all works, unfortunately sadly, but just to thank you to them for everything that they did, and we hope to see them all down the line. Yeah, we had great times with with Ryan. I'm so glad, you know, Bartlet got to see the chiefs um when the Super Bowl up close to the memory. I know, well,

we'll you know, remember forever. And and Marvel was so instrumental helping um execute how the message of Chris is passing, you know, got delivered to NFL network and was a rock through that Super Bowl weekend and helping us among among a lot of other things, working closely with them, and and Mark Brady especially to me as such a special place in the show. We always joke about the shadowy League figures in theory. Mark Brady was like, you know what, what was one of them? You know, he

was the head of the pot always. Well, I don't know, I can think of some truly shady characters that have left the company since These were more of the guys that we we liked, but they were part of the machine as well. But but Mark was our biggest supporter. I mean it it. He was our supporter in terms of believing in what we did from day one, more than anyone. It's just a fact that even when we were being a pain and you know, being a pain to him early on. Sometimes I remember West and him

going out. We all we all had our things. He believed in us and supported us behind the scenes. And when we weren't around two to other people tirelessly like he always believed in us. He always tried to make the case of how important we were at the company in a way frankly that that no one else at this entire company didn't. So it's really sad. He's just a great man and and a and a dad and and he knows we love him and a huge supporter. I know, he was a big, big part of your

career to Erica. I mean huge. We you know, we were very very close and he's the reason that I am at the NFL. And there are many times that I was going to leave and he was like, you're not leaving, like this is what we're gonna do. Um and and talk about fighting for someone, I mean just to have someone to have. And I've worked for a lot a lot of people and there's a lot, a lot of of asks out there and he is not

one of them. Like there will be times where it's like, you know, he just just a sweet guy to his entire core. And we we talked, you know, we talked a lot still, um, but he told me on the phone, you know, started the whole phone call was saying how thankful he was that I was referred to him by someone.

He's like, I'm so thankful by this person that recommended me to you, like recommended you to me, and like you are instrumental and you deserve everything that you And I'm like, what why are you saying this stuff to me right now? Like this it's he is and Ryan did so much for the podcast team as well, and uh, it's it's really really really sucks. It's it's what's what's terrible and this, you know, losing friends at the office

like this, it stinks. And then you look at how much has changed for for us as a podcast in the last you know, fifteen months or something. Obviously we lost West and now a lot of these very important people all around the show. So it feels a little bit and with all some uncertainty about the media group, right now this feels a lot like the Great Unknown era of the podcast as we edge toward our ninth season. But you know, we're very excited about what's to come

on the show. But it's also very important to talk about this because these are the people that helped make the show what it is. If you're a fan of what we do, really quick with where you move on one in true NFL Network style, I didn't know Ryan was one of the people. I didn't ask. I didn't go around asking who's gone um, And I will say the thing that I love about all three of these

men that you haven't brought up yet. In addition to being super supportive and being very helpful and instrumental in all of our careers, I loved how good of dad's they are. You you could never be around I mean Marvel. Marvel's son is a baseball player, and if you've been around for five minutes, you you feel the like glow of this dad who's just like so happy and so proud of his son and it's so sweet. And the same thing with Mark, like his kids were the world,

and his wife the whole thing. Like you just around. I mean, Erica and I actually were in Boston. We went to a Sloan conference three sloans ago and we did the podcast that I was doing, and he was so great about making it fun and a team trip

and really just pushing hard for that too. So when you talk about it, I mean, we even went on a tour of hard Harvard because like his wife had gone there and he was just so excited to see it because his only meant everything to him, and it's the same thing for Bartlett as well, like his I mean,

these people are just great human beings. And I will say, as an alum of ESPN, I've never met people that like, like, go fast forward eighteen months down the road, they'll all be in better places because they're all hard workers, they're all good people, and they're all really good at what they do, so they're gonna land in a better spot.

Almost every single person that I've ever encountered that's gone through something like this, this is not it's not personal, it's not anything to do with it's literally like changing business models, all these different things that are going on with our business. We're trying to partner, there's a lot of strategy things going on, so they're gonna all be in great spot and then they can go hire us when we need jobs again. So they're gonna be They're

gonna be okay. But they're great dads. And I want to point that out. We might yeah, we might. I mean, this is how this industry works. Like, yeah, you know for sure. That was one of my favorite moments in the newsroom history. Because my as a kid, I always want to be a baseball player. And um, I still if you if I had to pick one career in a dream scenario, would be like playing seventeen years in Major League Baseball. I just feel like that would be

the greatest life. So I've always had such um ah uh and um looked at people that are in professional baseball and James Marvels, John's son who's in the Pirates organization in Pittsburgh, and when he got called up to the majors in September two thousand nineteen, that coincided. It just happened to fall on a Sunday week one. So we're all in the news room and John was in

the news room, was at the game in Pittsburgh. Uh, and he was on TV and the and they I think they interviewed him and and and James pitched well that day. Um he threw five or six innings and pitched well, and it was just like such a cool moment to be part of that, and following James's career, and I hope to see him back in the big league soon. But I thought you were gonna say that one of the best moments in the newsroom with Marvel was when um, he broke up another reporter like wanting

to like punch me in the face. It's like, everyone out of here, Okay, you're coming with me, and he like that was all right. That was actually the best moment ever. We'll tell you about it afterwards, Cynthia. We've referred to it a handful of times on this show. But uh, well, all right, anyway, we'll see you guys down the line. Let's get to the news. He's an NBA owner, a self taught guitarist, and has guest starred in both the Office and Game of Thrones. He's unhappy

with his boss and has no options. Who is Aaron Rodgers ding Ding? That is correct, well done, projection time. I never said I'm un happy with my boss, you know, Tom Brady. I liking this guy more and more. Greg It took about twenty years, but that was in some interview ahead of that dopey golf match they were all involved in. Um that Aaron Rodgers team one. I believe

Cynthia is a big golfer. Maybe she can give us more uh information on that, but uh yeah, Aaron Rodgers, who I guess is still in limbo, is NFL future Tom Brady having some fun at the reigning m v P S expense Cynthia, why was his background blurred? What is Aaron Rodgers hiding like his bags? Like, what's going on with that? Why? Brady is the guy who's not really very funny, but he found one joke that everyone loves, and so he just keeps hammering this one joke. And

that's the way to do it. I mean, that is the way to do it. It's like it's the first time anyone's like, hey, Brady's got some pretty good singers, and so he just keeps going back and back on this Rodger. You better believe if I ever said something funny, I would keep replaying it. I'm just not funny, So if I kept doing I would just keep going to it. That's one of that's one of your long running um bits. I guess that's a bit. You just say you're not

a funny person. I'm not. I'm truly not. Then I don't try and I'm never going to do, which makes you an outlier. Because the great Dave damaschik Uh is known to say, the problem is that everyone thinks they're funny, um deep down, and that leads to a lot of problems when they tried to share a sense of humor that maybe actually isn't as strong as they may believe

it to be. But Cynthia, no, you know what I think with Brady by the way, and I think when you win six Super Bowls and three m v p s and you're generally recognized as the greatest football player in the history of this country, um, you realize that you're like, oh wait, I'm in the Sinatra zone. And like Frank Sinatra could say or do anything and nobody could get mad because he was Frank Sinatra. Like Aaron

Rodgers is basically that in the sports realm. So he's the only guy that can give Aaron Rodgers and know that Aar Rodgers has to take it because Aaron Rodgers might be Aaron Rodgers. But he's not Tom Brady. That's all good fun, but you know, you can mess with people, and Aaron Rodgers is a sensitive sort. He's like another member of the rat pack. But Brady Sinatra, Aaron Rodgers still Sammy Davis. So ultimately, oh that's actually pretty good.

Uh who's Dean Martin? Would that be Peyton Manning? Sure? Who's the other guy? There's the other guy? That nobody Joey? Uh? Who's the last guy in the rap? Back? This is where is y needed? Google? We need the Google machine? All right, let's get to the news. All right, let's get going here starting. Uh, well, so we this is the first time we've done a show, Cynthia um in I guess almost two weeks. We're podcast in two weeks. Yeah, yeah, so that's that's kind of a record for our show.

So we're just gonna catch on what we missed, um and we'll start with the news that went down late last month. The NFL is fine the Washington football team ten million dollars as a result of the league's investigation into the team's workplace culture. That money will eventually be used, We're told to support organizations committed to character education, anti bullying, healthy relationships, and related topics, the league said, and also

Tanya Snyder. So, Tanya, Tanya, I don't I never know what that was named the team's co CEO this week, and we'll take over the day to day duties and represent the team at league functions for what's been deemed the next several months, so that's pretty open ended. Her husband, of course, is Dan Snyder, and he will put his focus on, we're told new stadium plants and other matters. The NFL said, Greg, you're kind of big picture on

how this is played out. The you know, the fact that it came out right before the July fourth week and you know, played into the stereotype, the idea that it was a news dump because it did feel that way. This is one of the worst chapters in the last couple of decades of a team. Quote, you know, scandal, I guess, for lack of a better word, that that there's been. You know, it's funny to think of the attention that like the flate Gate got, just just media wise.

I'm not blaming the league totally on either um compared to this and then it you know, it was kind of shuffled at this time of year where there's not a lot of people paying attention. And I thought almost all the reactions were understandable because, on one hand, you know, the NFL sometimes feels almost powerless compared to the owners who have all this money and are ultimately the commissioner's boss,

and and it's pretty rare. It's unprecedented essentially to basically remove an owner, even if it's not fully in practice, if even if there's you know, it's his wife now running the team, it's a pretty big message to be sent that, like they're essentially removing him from his duties as an owner, is day to date duties, and how publicly like embarrassing that is and everything that that goes along with it, and the money is significant, and it's something.

On the other hand, I totally understand all of the points that have been made about like the lack of clarity of what they actually did in this report. There was very few specifics, and I thought Sally Jenkins point in the Washington Post about like, okay, let's just stick the woman, let's stick the wife to clean up the

husband's mess was was well was well said too. So on one hand, I do think it's kind of unprecedented, but it also uh, you know, in terms of the level of money and and and everything that they did to kind of put a spotlight on Snyder. On the other hand, it did show like the lack of power, because in theory, if everything they're seeing was true and they had the power to change owners, this would be the spot right, and they can't go that. They couldn't

go that far. They couldn't go that far. And so I kind of get it on both sides. But it's not unlike any other story I've ever seen in the NFL,

that's for sure. The team had been under the independent investigation since July, stemming from a number of sexual harassment allegations by previous employees over a fifteen year period, UH detailed by The Washington Post last summer, and an attorney, Beth Wilkinson, led the investigation, interviewing more than fifty people, mostly current or former employees of the organization, all granted anonymity.

It's a tough one to get out. You're rolling your eyes. Cynthia, as a woman who has worked at the NFL for a while, Well, um, I love um, I love Ron Rivera. I think he is an amazing man human, and I'm really I loved how he went about his cancer situation. I like Jason write a lot he he and I share. He started he went to the University of Chicago booth Um, the booth I started physical there. It's a long story. We'll can talk about that another time, but we share

kind of some roots there. There's a lot of good people that work there presently. I don't know how I would handle this because I don't know any of the truth, but I do know that a great organization in l A. If you want to donate to what it's called Peace over Violence. So that's kind of my thoughts. Well said, all right, moving on, UH, I feel like the start of the NFL season is the premiere of Hard Knocks.

UH in the second week of August, and here it comes once again, and it will be the Dallas Cowboys who will be feature on the program. They are the first team to be featured for a third time. Hard Knocks premiere twenty years ago with a profiled the then defending champion Baltimore Ravens. A lot of Todd Heap pop that season, a lot of Brian Billick lounging in a hammock in a d G A F mode, as I

recall Tony Saragosa. But that was then. This is now five episode season debuts August ten at ten pm the old Zeusser, as he's been doing for roughly four d years now. We'll be leading the episode recaps on NFL dot com, so stay tuned on that. Uh. And the Cowboys two thousand two and two thousand eight, we're involved in now two thousand any one and I cynthia Um you know when they you know, they throw us an as Simon at you right after the Super Bowl to

keep the website alive. Uh, they asked me to write a Hard Knocks preview laying out the teams that could be picked. The Cowboys were amongst them that could be quote unquote mandatory uh inclusion because they uh check three certain boxes that would leave them open to being on the show even if they didn't want to be. I don't believe that, especially last year after they had the Pittsburgh Steelers and they did not pick them. But anyway,

it's beside the point. The Cowboys were selected, and um Jared Jones and company to me, I wrote back in February they were the best choice of the five teams that could be compelled to be on the show. Uh, and there will be plenty of meat on the bone and uh. People like to complain about Hard Knocks like people like to complain about Saturday Night Live, how it used to be better and it's derivative at this point

and all that. But you know what, people still watch it and you will be watching it as well, many of you listening right now. I'm a big fan. I think this is a great choice. First of all, last season was I mean with COVID, and everything was super confusing with two teams, like the jump cuts between the two if you didn't kind of know what the players look like, if you hadn't been as familiar as we are, like it's it was harder to follow. So I'm glad

to But that was COVID's fault. It wasn't Hard Knocks fault. I think they do a brilliant job. It's a masterful show. I always like it. I always like Saturday Night Live too, so we're good on that. But I also think that the thing I'm most looking forward to. Will they please do you think that they're listening to this right now? Can they please like take an inventory of everything coach eats.

I just feel like he's that guy who gets the entire picnic table and he's like a little bit of this, a little bit of this, a little bit of this, a little bit of this, a little bit of this. Like I just I have to know what Mike McCarthy eats. Mike McCarthy dietary habits like that. It's got to be like amazing. It's gotta be amazing. Like that's the sub story right there, Like there's gotta be a lot. I mean, they had rexn and we didn't get that with Rex,

although he iconic. Let's go get a goddamn snack, but we didn't see Rex eating a lot. But maybe we're overdue for a food focused Hard Knocks. They the jones Is usually give a lot of access, which I like. I feel like they're not gonna be like pressing on the edits, like when they did All or Nothing. That was the best All or Nothing season because they because they like allowed themselves to look a little vulnerable at times and allowed the coverage to be better. So I'm

all for it. Anyway, Hard Knocks back in August. Can't wait. And by the way, the funny thing about hard knocks, And like I said, I write the recaps, everyone watches the first episode and it's all anyone's talking about. And then I start to feel like I'm fading into like a solitary chamber as the weeks get along and we

get closer to real football. But those first couple episodes especially are always so fun because everyone's watching and talking about it, and everybody I can tell you everybody around the league, in the buildings, the coaches, gms, they all watch it too. It's fun to see what's going on behind the scenes. UM with colleagues all right. Uh. In other news, to kill Harry has been a huge disappointment

for the New England Patriots. Um a number thirty two overall pick, a wide receiver, UM who has not been able to get his career off the ground, and after just two years with the team, he has requested a trade. Greg when we went through UM, is it rosta reset? I think it is project damn it. I knew it was the projected starters. I kind of specifically targeted Harry when I was looking at your depth chart. Is what

happens with him as a first round pick? Um, It's starting to look increasingly possible that he's going to be one of those rare guys that doesn't get a third year with the team that drafted him in the first round. Yeah, it's a little weird because after Nelson Aguilar, I'm not sure anything's really set, you know, in the receiver group. But he he's not feeling the vibe. So it's almost like he's trying to beat the Patriots to the punch.

Doesn't want the the shame of getting traded for a late seventh round pick or whatever it would be, and they're not gonna get much They're not gonna get much more for him. I don't think I was like nice little a nice little bit of NFL news to just sprinkle into the week. My focus has been mostly on Wimbledon. Dan.

I don't know if you know. I'm doing a another side podcast now, inspired inspired by Mark Sessler just uh, and you for a long time saying that eventually or Mark saying I'm gonna leave someday to do uh Courts of thunderblog, and now I'm actually doing Courts of Thunder. It's podcast, not a blog. Wait is it called Courts of Thunder? Actually? I called the Courts of thunder. Why not, that's right for my own enjoyment. Um, it's only during the Grand Slam, so it'll be over, you know until

US open uh in a week. But yeah, me and I'm legitimately curious and you're hyper knowledgeable in the realm of tennis, so I'm sure there's a lot of good, good talking there. And you do it with a co host, right, yeah, with Glenn Clark. Um, who's a boss who's been on the show before. Um, Ravens guy. Um. Do you are you finding it's connecting with an audience so far? I have no idea, you know. That's why I'm trying to

let them know. Come, come subscribe you now I'm here, and you know, the people that have been listening to it, they like it. I mean, I know it's a niche audience here. You know, you're not slicing the biggest pie with tennis, which is too bad. That's why I want

to do it. It's just, you know, it's like, it's such a great game, it's such a great next year when you redo it, when you bring it back, then you need a partner with like you know, Amazon or one of these things, and then they can send me food, so I can listen to it and eat like I'm there right because there's special food there right, Like when you go to Wimbledon, you're what are you supposed to eat? It's like strawberries and cream. You get that ready to

breakfast at Wimbledon this weekend? Yeah, you could get must be hungry all I'm talking about his food right now. But but next year I have Amazon delivered to me to my door. You can you know, there's there's your business idea then they can. Getting me paid is almost impossible with this endeavor. So getting free food for you it seems like another and for it. I really doubt that will ever happen. Did you have to push courts under through Congress? Or was Glenn like all right, whatever?

Did let's just start the episode. Liked the name of the podcast, h Yeah, I and I had a better name initially called only Slams, like kind of like only fans, but we're only doing during the Slams. It that was better. And yet um, I don't know. I just courts no Courts of Thunder. That was the right move. I didn't even know what that was till this summer. I watched a lot of episodes of Catfish. That's what I learned

when only fans was so, you know, learning everything this summer. UM. In other news, offensive line news the NFL excuse me, uh NFL football team the Pittsburgh Steelers, now that UM have released right guard David DeCastro. This was pretty stunning when it happened a couple of weeks ago. My Garifolo reported. Then we found out that he's dealing with all sorts of issues with his ankle and it could lead to

the end of his NFL career. UM. So the Steeler is with a lot of turnover on their offensive line and a stone age pony, as Mark Sessler puts it behind center in Ben Roethlisberger. A huge roll of the dice on that offense in a lot of ways. And another news, my New York Jets continue, in my opinion and the opinion of many others, to get better. They signed Morgan Moses, the right tackle, to a one year,

three point six million dollar contract UM. He will compete and most likely win the job at right tackle UM, which would kick George Fant into a swing tackle type role which might be a better fit for him and also with as great as McKay Beckton one was as a rookie, he had trouble standing on the field, so it gives you some much needed depth. I just really like um this Sprain trust, the sale and Joe Douglas and this was a move that made a lot of sense,

and the Jets have a proven starter. Um Moses was a good, dependable guy in Washington for several years. Yeah. I mean, I think anything to address the Jets old line is smart. I think if you're if I'm a Jets fan this season, I'm thinking, okay, let's just make it look better and better. And if I'm going two years out, then you can start to talk about things like you know, late January football, like you know not because obviously the season has been pushed out, so now

everyone's playing January football. But you know, it's it's just, uh, it's it's one of those things where just be patient. Jets fans aren't known for their patients, but this is a situation. The offense is good, that's all that matters to me. It's just like the secondary is not good. Your secondaries back Wilson looked good. This was the move where it's sort of got me over the hump of being like, Wow, the Jets could be a pretty fun offense if Wilson can play the guitar. As Dan would say,

I mean they really did. This was this is one of those moves like if Morgan Moses was a free agent coming into March, he probably would have gotten like four years, fifty million or something from some team. Not saying he would have been worth all that, but he

probably would have. But because this all happened late, like and everyone would be like, oh, that's one of the big signings of the off season, number thirty three on the top one hundred, Morgan Moses goes to, you know, the Jets, but now it's just like kind of buried in June. They look they should be eminently watchable on offense. I really am. Actually he'll be fun, like a scheme, the players, everything about it. I want to I want to watch them more than I have for a while.

It all hinges on Zack Wilson, and I'm I'm refused to get too excited because the Sam Donald experience was pretty hurtful and we know there are a lot of factors that went into his struggles. But the reports on Wilson are very good. At a camp from beat reporters. I trust that he just looks like he's gonna be able to handle this and maybe even thrive in an offense that is modern and suited to his skill set with better players around him. I want to watch I

want to look forward to watching the Jets again. It's been a couple of years now, um where I haven't even been excited about watching them, and I feel like this could be a turning point, but I'm trying to keep things under control here, Cynthia. Okay, So Reagan on our show where we have to pick the winner of

every game, and it's it's a lot of fun. And I think, because yeah, I struggle to coming back, we don't know, but I think in honor of that, whether or not it comes back, in honor of that, I think right now, since Week one is Sam Donald versus your Jets, I think that that me and Greg should in the Panther side and you should be on the Jet side, and it should be for like, you know, some snacks or food, because I can't stop talking about food, like something, you know, go have a beer somewhere and

we'll be the Panthers and you be the Jets. It'll be fun and we all right. I'm certainly down with that, is because somebody don't even know if I want that. You're sticking me with Darnald. I'm a pretty anti Darnald. Like my anti Darnald panther, Thank you's going to travel with me to Carolina, so I'm not too high on these panthers. I'll do a sandwich with you on this, Cynthia, good week one all right? And final in the news, UM Rest in Peace Supplemental Draft. It won't be held

this year. And I actually reached out to Handsome Hank Henry Hodgson, who for multiple years on our website NFL dot com. UM offered up his UH supplemental draft mock draft, which was always one of my favorite pieces of content on our fair website. I asked for him to give me a statement to read UM. But what he sent back to me, unfortunately, UH is not something I would keep him employed. So I'll just say that he's disappointed and UH, is this the end of the supplemental Draft?

I don't know. I didn't read the story very closely and forgot to check it out before we started. I just know it's not happening it's startbreaking two straight years. No supplemental draft, just the the amount of draft prep that goes into it um for me, for all the people who love it like Henry, you know, just the citement it brings, like Wimbledon and NBA Finals. No, this is supplemental draft season and we've missed it two straight. We need to rebrand it. It just needs it just

needs a rebranding. Supplemental draft sounds awful, like some terrible iron pill you have to eat with a banana or something in the morning, like you need to real you need to think of a clever name for it. If if it were called Courts of Thunder, people would they wouldn't get rid of it. You just need to rebrand it, all right, let me get Greg's projects fit before we bring the sand Bounce all set, before we bring sand

Bouncing on. He has the Around the NFL podcast, he has the Debrief, he has the Debrief, a written piece on r j VP podcast with Anthony Jesson or the Rosenthal and jel Nick project, which was the previous iteration. Well that was at the end of the Yeah, now he's got the first name, Courts of Thunder. Now you have UM one of my missing uh your Game Day Pick Show, game Debut, Game Debut, Yeah, um, anything else Emmy nominated just so you have some national radio spots.

I mean, we have an Emmy nominated host of that show. I mean, I don't know if it was nominated for his work on our show, but Hawk was nominated for an Emmy and he is on our show. So you guys get a little bit annoyed when in our newsroom everyone has an Emmy except for us. Yeah, maybe you have one, st I don't know. I don't have. Seriously, I want an Emmy. Maybe make a better TV show because that would help us. Actually, I think I do

have one. But when I on the other side of the business development side, like I worked at the ABC and we did that show, like we did that sync project with Gray's Anatomy, it was like, you know, you have the trophy. We'll didn't get the trophy. You have to pay for It's like and it was like my name in a list of like fifty other people, So it wasn't that special. I got to vote on some other Emmy sounds cool. Thank you for running through them.

I might be returning to an old object though again this season that Chris Wesleyan took back over for me, taken back the reins on the old QB index. I mean, what a moment, What a moment to be on the Greg train. That's all same of which I am a passenger. I'll tell you what I'm like. I'm in the first roup. I paid for the upgraded seats. I'm the first class on that one. That's what's happening in the news. You

promised the guest. And you know, we really sprung this upon Cynthia because we know she is in the analytics community and here with us now joining us on the show is a man who is the lead NFL writer analyst for Pro Football Focus. I mean that is that's a job title right there. It's a great Sam Monson, Welcome to the Round the NFL podcast. A thank you. And it's a critical distinction there that the you know, the writer not math person because smile level of math ended.

You know, we did from adcational system being over in Europe, but g c S intermediate level, which is like just above being able to count numbers, so other people do the maths stuff and then not just you know, interpret it makes sense and write about it at PF. Yeah, but like a lot of the guy you know, there's a lot of guys over at PFF. You guys are now in Cincinnati. You have that like underscore PF in your Twitter name, but none of them are the lead writer.

I mean they're all just kind of like, hey, we're just guys. We're not Sam. You know that's it's a big it's a big flex go and lead right, But a big part of that was just claiming it and hope nobody noticed or criticized me for it. So it's I'm not sure there's a ton of merit involved in that, just uh you know, you shoot your shot and see what happens. So about a week ago, uh, PFF dropped

their fifty best players in the NFL right now. Uh Sam had the byeline on that, and we're gonna get into that and also some guys that were notable cuts. It's a great piece of content to run in late June, and I know the football world devours it and that's good. But before we kind of get to that, I just wanted to talk with you, Sam because I touch based

with you briefly before the show. Um, just that just to know how long you've been around and at PF and you said since two thousand and eight, which is going way back there. And you know p F has a seat at the table um in professional football. And I think, um, that's very interesting because the NFL, like most businesses, but especially in the insular world of pro football, they don't take kindly to outsiders, especially those who quote never played the game. And I know Nick Hornsby uh

founded the site in the UK. You're an irishman, so I mean that's another layer to this, and I'm just curious, Um, as someone who's been with the company for well over a decade now, Um, how long did it take in your in your mind, uh to get a foothold and to kind of feel like you would earn the industry respect because you certainly have because as of a couple of years ago, h PFF has customized data that they send out to all thirty two NFL teams, n C

double a FBS team, CFL teams, media all over the country, sports agencies. I mean, you are a power player as a company. Um, how did this take hold? And did you sense a lot of pushback industry wise until that happened? You're right, the NFL doesn't like people didn't play the game or aren't real football people. And you can only imagine that that gets magnified massively when you're foreign as well. Right, you know, you're British or you're Irish or you're European.

Coming over and telling us what to do with football and never played the game, everything's going to gain you. So yeah, that was definitely a big thing that we had to battle against all the way. But critically, once you talk to people you know for any ended period of time, it becomes very obvious very quickly if you

do or you don't know what you're talking about. So as soon as you're actually able to get in front of any NFL guys and walk them through what it is PFF was doing and what it is we could bring and help them with, that disappears and that dissolves.

And that's that's the story in a nutshell of how Chris Collinsworth ended up buying the company that you know, he found PFF was really interested in the data, bought a kind of kind of consumer conscripted or subscription that we were selling at the time, and then you know, I thought they realized that the site was run by European British guy Neil Hornsby and you know, phone him up, thought he'd been cheated out of his money. But ten minutes later on the phone with Neil and you know,

he was convinced. It's like, okay, this guy maybe from a weird place and the bank orders of Britain, but he he knows what he's talking about. He knows football as well as anybody in the NFL. And that's where that starts. So the first hurdle is the toughest. Once you can yet in front of people, once you can get them to accept the premise of what is you're bringing to the table, then it all falls into place.

And really, you know, our first few years, we would go to the Combine and we would try and set up meetings with all these teams, and just getting the meeting was the achievement. You know, once you got them in the room and you walked them through the process, nobody ever left that room going well, this is ridiculous, Like this is useless. We don't need any of this, this, this doesn't make any sense. Every single meeting you would be like, wow, this is amazing stuff. We could do

all kinds of stuff. This is fantastic. Getting the meeting was the achievement, and then each year it it built on the last year, and we went from a few meetings to you know, half the league, to most of the league to all the league. Um, And that was sort of how it went over those for a few years. I think it also partly changed. I noticed when like pffs evaluation started having real world implications, like guys like

Andrew Wentworth. I'm trying to think of a few off the top of head, just like guys that like PFF always had as one of the top people started making more money because I think in making more Pro Bowls, I think partly because PF had them ranked so high, and so the media sort of started, you know, catching onto how good they were, and like people started getting paid through like some PF grades and then I was like, okay, that is that is some real like economic impact they're making. Yeah,

it's funny. Um. I think offensive win in particular is one area where we've really helped a lot of players along guys like Witworth. You know, Evan Mathis was one of our first players who we were kind of championing way before anybody else. Because offensive line there aren't You don't get the stat right there, before we existed, all the writers ever tell you about the offensive lineman that your team and signed is you know, started eight games last year. Well what does that mean? I mean were

they good games? Were they bad games? What? Like? That tells me nothing? Um, So now you know with PF grades, even ignore the grade we'll give you date on in terms of pressure and pressure rat and all those kinds of things. So you can start to quantify how good these offensive lineman are. And even if you don't agree with this, like even if you think we're crazy, it

makes you go and watch that guy. Right, So, even if you think we were way off and Evan Mathis, people that would never have watched a snap of Evan Mathis, we're going and looking at this guy and it's ruining from the cells, whether it was good or not. And then people watch this tape came to the conclusion and suddenly Evan Mathis is a guy that actually does get

covided in the NFL signs. You know a couple of decent deals with teams having been you know, the essentially the backup and a two man rotation at guard with the Bengals back in the day, I would say the thing, those those metrics, the ones that you've pioneered and created, I think, especially like from the college into NFL kind of the bridging the gap between the two. Nobody has those for college, especially right, Like some teams have their own version of like they do a free agent tracker

and blah blah blah. But you know, it's it's really standardizing and become like the gold standard of what is like an a accepted form of a pressure from college and then a pressure from the NFL. So that's it's really like very I think those, even more than the grades, are what's really been so instrumental. I think just generally being able to put everything on a standardized universal system across all Like it's huge. You you know, so many fans will will sort of come at you with this

kind of stuff. It's well, I watch every snap of this guy, and I think you're wrong about where you have him ranked or where you have him rated, Like, Okay, where does that rank compared to everybody else? Like maybe the league level at that position or that spot is a lot better or worse than you think it is.

You know, you have to have the context of everything else, even if you disagree with the exact methodology and how it's all put together, the fact that it's all done the same, and you know, we put all this time and man hours and double blind systems across the board to make sure that it's as standardized as possible. Like that in and of itself has some value. Well that's why the good teams actually can use it as like an arbitrage. Right, If you're the league standard, then the

team can find the undervalued stock for their system. Right, So I think that I think that that's like if they have one system and they know every league, every team in the league's looking at you know, this is the number or this is the this is the whatever. On our team, we believe that number can be expresent higher because we play you know, with we have this linebacker,

you know something like that. Right. So Dan was cool with this discussion until you said arbitrage like a little too much, just like you know this just think it's like you get the better thing, you get something for nothing,

little extra. It's actually arbitrage. But you know it's like when they give you the guacamole at Chappolan forget to charge you kind of like that right by the way, I like to imagine Colin's Worth just kind of rolling into the office and his pajamas with a cup of coffee at a random time in Cincinnati just to keep everyone sharp, like or is he kind of like and I know, maybe it's all a remote type gig because everyone's all over the world here, But is he like

a Lumberg type that will kind of just like head you off at the exit at five pm on a Friday in the middle of June and be like, I need you to do some p f F TPS reports this weekend. What kind of I haven't seen the pajamas thing? You know, That hasn't mean he'll He'll roll in there with you know, one of those kind of airport travel briraces, the things on wheels with the like six foot long

handle that he tracks behind them. So he'll be pulling one of those with the laptops and the iPads and all screens that he's got with him, um, you know, rocking the kind of the summer casual, you know, the khaki shorts and the polos. But yeah, you can definitely catch some you know, wayward flak if you just happen to be in the vicinity at the time when he wants a question answer, you know, because if you don't have the answer off the top of your head, it's

now your job to go find that answer. So that can definitely happen. You gotta keep right and in all seriousness, I mean Collinsworth obviously, UM he has one of the top media jobs in football Sunday night football. He watches obviously a ton of games. Is he is there ever a situation in UM without calling anyone out specifically, where Collinsworth is covering a game and then he goes and he checks his website and the grade doesn't match with

what he saw and then he's upset about it. Do people catch heat if they're not on the Collinsworth scale of what you guys do in terms of measuring play. It's it's never we've never been in trouble for it. But there's definitely times where we've had to explain that discrepancy.

It's like, well, explain to me why this guy's great is whatever it is when I'm seeing this, and you know, a lot of the times there's there's reasons, right, there are things that either you're you're not paying attention to or there's like again, sort of the idea documenting all is important because I think the brain functions is like a highlight reel system, and you remember the good, you remember the bad, and you toss that everything in the middle.

But everything in the middle actually makes up of a guy's game, right, So if you're just throwing all that out as the same, it isn't like it's various gradations of either side of zero a little bit um and that's where the difference is. So a lot of the times, stuff like that is you're remembering a few big plays and you're sort of not remembering the tremend a little bit and not like this whole show about Evan Mathis again.

But I think that's one of the reasons why we were so different on Evan Mathis to everybody else, because he didn't have a ton of those highlight reel blocks. He was playing at about the same time as Carl Knicks for the Saint, and Karl Knicks was like a

walking highlight reel machine. That guy would just pancake defenders left, right and center and bury them like his highlight reel would have been phenomenal for offensive lineman, but Carl Knicks got beat more often than Evin Mathis, and Evan Mathis, this thing was he just never lost. Now, he didn't always bear a dude and can fire guards off line and you know, open up this giant, yawning chasm for

the running back to go through. But he was consistently winning a little bit every single snap, you know, just moving this guy enough to give the running back a crease. And that's all you need. And if you do that sixty times a game, you're coming up with a really good grade. So in your PFF fifty here and I'm gonna quote your blurb as we get into it now. Uh, this is a bit of a humble brag open by Monson and the biggest of all spots with a lot

of metrics, Uh, a lot of clicks. One of the benefits of watching and degrading every player on every play of the NFL season is the unrivaled ability to compare players with the help of the largest football database on the planet. Whoa um And with that said, how do you not have Patrick Mahomes is the greatest player on the planet Because you have Aaron Donald number one and

Pat Mahomes number two. And we're gonna dig in, and I know Greg has some he wants to call out in Cynthy and I will, But just how does Aaron Donald? How is he the greatest player alive? Right now? So I think everybody I saw yes had a guy that ranked down Donald fourth among interior defenders. So almost everybody acknowledges that Aaron Donald was the best player at his position in the NFL, and Patrick Mahomes is the best

player in his position in the NFL. So the question essentially is, well, how do you compare those two positions are completely different. One of the things that the PFF fifty does and most PFF list is we get rid of position value, right because if position value was relevant here, the first twenty five players would be quarterbacks, and frankly, that doesn't make for a great list. So position values gone.

You can be the top of this list if you're a guard, if you're a defensive tackle, if you're a quarterback. It's all the same. So now you're like, well, how do you kind of quantify relatively how much better than the rest of the league those guys are. And I think that's where Aaron Donald separates himself because in any given year, Patrick Mahomes might not be the best quarterback

in the NFL. Aaron or Aaron Rodgers was the best quarterback in the NFL last year when m v P. The year before that, Lamar Jackson was unanimous m v P. So Momes might not be that guy any given year. And if he is, the gap between him and the next guys it's not huge. Aaron Donald, there's not like it's never a discussion. Aaron Donald is the best player in his position in the league. There is a huge gap between him and number two, and it hasn't been

a discussion for what like five six years now. So the gap between Donald and anybody else at his position, I think it's just so huge that that has to be relevant in terms of just how good a guy is and whether he's the best player in the NFL or not. Like I get throwing out positional value, you

gotta do that some up. But there is still something weird about seeing like five running backs in your top or like three in your top thirty, and you have Derrick Henry, who's not really a huge weapon on passing downs number twelve. You know you've got McCaffrey up there in the top thirty chub. But somewhere in there, Camaro was in there, Dalvin Cook was, I mean, it has to give you the like high it's to be ranking a bunch of running backs that high when all you

do is talk about how fungible running backs are. I have a huge degree of sympathy for running backs generally, because that is one of the most like a tri you know, abuse, physically difficult, demanding, taxing positions all of football.

And it just so happens that all of the numbers say that it doesn't really matter who the guy is getting the garries, like you can you're a product of the environment on a bone on a late June lift, and you think that makes up for it, not even throw them a bone, just like acknowledge that what they're doing. Like when when running backs complain about the running backs don't matter thing, they're right, like it's it's a brutal position.

They're all incredibly talented. There's some of the most spectangular athletes playing the game. It just so happens that, like the thing that will determine the most whether or not you're having success, it's not you. It's not you versus your backup versus a guy you can get off the street. It's how good is your offensive line, It's what kind of formations are your is your offense turning out in, because that's going to dictate the box count, which is

going to dictate how much success you have. Like it's just this sad Henry kind of Henry Peas number twelve and the other guys that are in the top thirty. Putting them there, to me has to be saying that they rise above that they rise above the other factors, right, And I think for Henry in particular, we're now going on a couple of years of him statistically dramatically outperforming what should be possible given what we know from you know,

all the stuff that we just talked about. Derrick Henn is not a bad offensive line in front of him, but he certainly hasn't had an offensive line that has produced that should have produced what he's been producing. And you know, there there are not that many players where we can think of specific games where it hasn't been going great and then Derrick Henry just took over and you know, won the Titans the game. So I think Derrick Henry right in the day is saying that running

backs generally don't matter. Derrick Henry might Like Derrick Henry is bucking that day to trend and has been for a long enough time now that it's it's at least notable. I think it has something to do with supply and demand two over time, not necessarily the one to one, like your replacement versus you. But I think that if you look like this list is for next season, it's a projection of the top fifty players for this particular season.

If you were to make this list out for five seasons and try to forecast it out in some way, you might have running backs on there, but it probably wouldn't always be the same one or they probably wouldn't be in the same position. Right, So it's not necessarily that each that that the running back, Like each individual running back isn't helpful or in a specific season, very impactful,

but it's that over time. Like, look like you had some pretty good running backs come out of this year's draft class, and I guess Naja Harris is a first rounder, but like you got Javonte Williams is getting a lot of talk about him, and they got him pretty late. So it's at the end of the day, it's it's less about like an individual being replaceable and more about kind of the trend of the position and all the other factors that that's kind of how I read it

at least. Yeah, I mean, I think a big part of the running backs don't matter the running backsplace thing is a lot of it is like a lot of talented run backs. Once any running back in the NFL is an incredibly talent athlete and player, and part of their problem is that the drop off between you know, the top ten guys in the NFL and the guys that are strong, you know, strong just to make Brosters is not big like it feels like it should be. But I think it's closer than a lot of other positions.

And part of the reason they're that replaceable is because you can just go to the bargain bin and grab these guys that were incredible college running backs, um and and they're still fantastic athletes and playmakers, and it doesn't have that big a drop off, and so it's not necessarily a knock on the athlete the position. It is part of that that that supply there there's an abundance of running backs that can all do a similar job.

I'm looking at the list and I was trying to figure out in my mind, who's the guy in the top outside the top ten who I could see kind of making that leap. And you have Miles Garrett at I could see him being a guy because the ada that you pulled from grading every play, obviously it's connected to um every snap. And he was not the same guy after he got sick. I wonder where he's in

this list. If he was the same Miles Garrett uh leading in after week ten as he was in the first ten weeks, I could see him being the guy that ends up maybe cracking the top five. Even is there somebody that jumps out to you that you could see making a leap based on what they gave you last year? Yeah? I think Garrett Stephaniely good one. I'm gonna be writing an article tomorrow about look if if Myles Garrett puts it together for a full seventeen game schedule. Now, um,

he's a defensive Player of the Year candidate. He's he's the one guy, or one of a few guys that could rival Aaron Donald on that particular award. And it feels like that's happened already, but if you look at his career, we haven't really seen that yet. We had half a season of that and then he you know, brain Mason Rudolph with his own helmet and missed half the year, and then we got another half a season of it, and then caught COVID and you're I wasn't

quite the same guy. So we haven't yet had this full season of Garrett in full flow, the peak of his hours. But it feels like we're right on the edge of that. But like maybe one is that year where we get the full, unadulterated, full version of Miles Garrett. And I think that player is special and it's a top ten talent um. I think, you know, Nick Bosa's the guy. It's crazy that we've we've still only seen rookie Nick Bosa. You know, we really haven't seen what

that was gonna look like. In the year two, we lasted what for something snaps and then got injured. Nick Bosa broke the rookie record for pressures in the season, which had stood until since. Like that was Aldon Smith's record that he broke, So that was a long standing number and he didn't just break it. He like blew past it by a ton of pressures. Think ended with eight on the season and was still cooking in the Super Bowl at the time, way past the rookie wall

that these guys are supposed to hit. Nick Bosa, I think, had twelve pressures on Patrick Hims in that Super Bowl and was one of the best players on the field. So, like Nick, Chase Young is the best edge rusher prospect we've ever seen come into the NFL, and he looks like he could be special. But Nick Bosta was like right there with him. I mean, his college production is

right there. He was young, he was a tremendously special talent and rookie boss phenomenal, So I could easily see him take the step this year, and like some ending himself, was one of the best players and edge rushes in the NFL. Did you get a lot of grief for having Brady seventh? Actually no, it wasn't an awful lot of back on Brady and people were more. People were drawn to other either omissions or you know, against football. Yeah, I mean it is. It is ridiculous. He's the number

two quarterback on this list. He's forty three years old. Dan was talking about hashtag gradual of decline literally like six seasons ago. Now this is whatever at the end of his Patriots run, I stay by it, I get it. That's changed around. You said that before one of his is like last MCS Right, that's what we thought. And

it is crazy though that credibly. I almost think his buck season got a little underrated because he had a couple of interceptions, you know, in one of the playoff games, and so people want to bring uh, you know, in the championship and want to bring that up. Whereas now he really was one of the top two or three

quarterbacks for last nine or ten games. He didn't start the season that way, but the way he finished, he was a top three quarterback at age forty three, which is just so blowing past the um, you know, like level of anything we would even have considered was possible for a forty or forty one year old. Well not just that, but you have to put it in the context of a quarterback in a Bruce Arian system. Right before the first year of quarterbacks in the Bruce Areas

system is almost always an absolute train wreck of turnovers. Right, Andrew Luck, Jamis Winston, Carson Palmer, those three guys each forty turnover he plays in a season the first year with Bruce Arian. That isn't like it's a monster number. I think those are all the highest numbers we've ever seen from a quarterback over season. Brady thought one second, just because I'm curious, m who had the most turnover worthy plays since two thousand eight? Is it Winston in

the thirty thirty year? I think that, Well, that was one of his for that was one of those forty numbers. I think forty is the highest we've seen over season, and all three of them have been the first year in the Bruce Arian system. But Tom Brady in his first year in the Bruce Arian system absently any preseason had twelve. So like a completely different scale. It's just not what happens, and it's not like Brady in a Bruce Arian system. Or was it Bruce Arians in a

Brady system? Well, I think they met in the middle, right, But this was definitely a more aggressive offense than Tom Brady has been in for a lot of years. Like his average depth of target was you know, pretty far down field compared to what Brady normally works with eight point nine or sorry, yeah, Tom Brady nine point six. So that's that's getting up there, said he would go entire halves of Sure, but you got better. You had better receivers than he's had in a long time in

New England that ran deeper routes. I'm just saying, like, I don't know if you tell to I don't know how much like telling Tom Brady what to do anyone? Does you know what I mean? Like, I'm sure you want to do that. Great when he's getting the house for five weeks, like in the families leaving, then you're seeing who's wearing the pants, even in that powerful household,

you're seeing. But that that essentially was the highest average at the target of anybody in the NFL that actually played most of the season, like the only guys ahead of him last year or Joe Flacco, Jalen Hurts and then again yeah not you know, not great um and then Drew Lock who was a tenth of a yard higher. So it's just okay, it's just a lot I don't like. I don't I don't talk about the Flaco Jets, Like if I ever want to really annoyed Dan, bring up

bring up my Flaco versus Donald Jets. Listen, if Flaco was, if Donald was still in the building and Flack over that matter, it would bother me more. But we've moved forward. Finally, Sam, before we go, yes it is, I did the Lamar Jock Jackson cough move because I would say the biggest thing that got the football gagnasanity buzzing was Lamar Jackson

missing the top fifty year after he was. Yes, the unanimous m v P. Now, the one thing that surprises me the most because you wrote a nice little like a bonus piece that people should check out over at PFF dot com on players that missed the cut that are you know, top players, and you kind of ended your right up on Jackson saying that you know he was behind these six other quarterbacks and spinning forward to two thousand twenty one, you don't think that was necessarily

an off year in he might just be in that seven to twelve range potentially as opposed to one of the true grades of the league, which I know it doesn't sit well with a lot of people. So soon after that incredible twenty nineteen. Yeah, but I think the really like the the step back that he took last year I think is important because the whole quarterback landscape

is kind of volatile. You know you're gonna look at Aaron Rodgers, right, Rogers, Well, I don't I don't know if he made the list last year, if he was a certain he was nowhere near where he was this year, and the Green Bay Packers drafted his replacement and it wasn't crazy like everyone was gone, well, yeah, Rogers had the client for a while. I wasn't been the same guy. But maybe drafting is replaying the well spur this Aaron Rodgers revenge tour, and that's exactly what happened. Is the

best quarterback in the NFL. But before that, you were looking at this guy who was still really really good, but was you know, ranking fifth, stick seventh, eighth in the NFL somewhere like that. I think everybody except Mahomes is in that bracket now, right, You're looking at these guys and you're saying, if he ranked number two or number eight in the NFL next year, wouldn't surprise you.

And I think you can throw like Deshaun Watson, assuming he plays Tom Brady, Josh Allen, you know, Russell Wilson. There's a whole bunch of those guys I think that fit into that category, and Lamar Jackson is one of them. I think if he has an incredible year and the Ravens have figured out the answers to why the passing game fell off, and the guys like Bateman, Rachad Bateman there are number one, Um, it's a huge jack there.

It wouldn't shock anybody. Uh. But equally, if they've just figured out a little bit and Lamar Jackson is still an incredible athlete, it's still one of the most devastating book carriers in the NFL, but it's not the most complete, polished pastor in the NFL. And that's going to be the cap of how good that offense can be. Will

that shock anybody? And if he ranks, you know, behind Prescott and Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes, you don't have to, you know, come up with that many names for him to rank behind before he doesn't make a list of the best d players in the NFL. Now, if it's the best fifty athletes in the NFL, Lamar is what like one to three. He's somewhere in the top couple. Um. But in terms of just actual player, he needs to be a better passor than he was last year, and

we've seen that from him. But the projecting it forward is how likely is it that that is going to happen again in one Now? I mean, I don't know. I think there's a reasonable case to be made. I the one point I would all make though, is that my hands were tied by our quarterback. Pankings came out first, which makes the whole thing Bruce Bruce Gradkowski's fault and

not mine. That's the important thing. I guess, Yeah, I guess when people come at you and you're like, what Bryce Callahan is thirty six, Hey, hey, Lamar Jackson is down on this list, then oh you can just go blame old Bruce and account and Bruce and fault. I like Bryce Callahanny, I was actually gonna get make sure you get that in there that I love that he made so well fifty. There's a lot of players in the league. There's like I just liked you even play

that much last year. It hurts Greg that he's out of the top fifth. You should know that. Sam. So before we go, um uh, Sam, and thank you for your time. Cynthy has something she wants to get off her chest. Um, you have a lovely, lilting Irish brogue, and some people want to hear more of it since I do. So we both do videos these voice everything, and sometimes it's brutal. I like, I hold my iPhone. It's it's not the best sometimes, I'll admit, but I

want your accent in it. Sometimes like it dulls your accent. I don't know if it's the music they but you need to play up that accent. We need to bring in more women. There's so many women that watch football. You know how much they'd like it better to watch those videos. If you got oh there's like this, I'm gonna believe everything that man says. It's wonderful. I'm telling you play that up. The real problem is that living

here is radicating my accent. It's not voluntary, it's it's it's just a like I pick up and drop off accents depending on where I live. I've had like half a do some ridiculous ones in my life, and moving over here is losing the Irish one. I can't stop it. Somebody pf F. We this c series of podcast a couple of years ago that We're History Fat Ones Talk Neil Holmesbying got like the the origin story at a PFF and it's a different Sam on it. It's an

Irish Sam that it doesn't exist anymore. The accent is dead, and it's I'm now somewhere over the mid Atlantic, even further over to the US. It's starting to worry me. That's the downside of living in Cincinnati. Like eventually everyone starts sounding like the Westleying Brothers. That's that's that's why you're starting to sound like I'm a Midwesterner. I'm a Midwesterner. I used to say pop it was a thing, but no,

bring the Irish back. I'm gonna give you some like tapes to listen to you before you do it, because I'm like, I want his accent back. I think, give me the accent. I like the I did like the way you put it, though, Sam, because sometimes I feel like that's what our podcast is is just like floats somewhere over the mid Atlantic, existing partly in this world,

part lee in another world. So you are a natural fit for our show, and we thank you so much for coming on, buddy, and check out Sam's work on PFF. Check him out on Twitter at PF Underscore Sam, and keep up the good work. My friend, Thanks Gay, thanks for having me there, He goes. You know, I have I know what he's talking about too, because I um grew up in the suburbs outside New York City. My father has a very um and people know from this

podcast he has a real strong Bronx accent. Um, and my mother's from Queens and all my family UM that I grew up around, grew up in the cities, and even if you grew up in the suburbs, it's a very strong New York accent. And I do find that it has maybe gotten toned down from eleven or twelve years in California. And then I'm I'm back here and I'm throwing bags, and I'm on my seventh Tito at one am down here at the Jersey Shore. All of a sudden, you know, I start to hit talk a

little bit or something. I gave Wess a lot of humor when I was talking about a an ex girlfriend in my life who had moved on and I said Cara got married. That really gave him. He got a kick out of that. He said, what did you just say is that Cara got married? Whoka Apparently there's something. I'm glad Mine's got Mom. Can we go to the cottage? It ain't a pop like Midwestern accents are awful, So I'm glad Mines smoothed out. I mean, Boston took it

away that I haven't lived in Michigan. I don't know what's going on with Greg because like Greg grew up in New England and that is famously um and then this sounds negative, harsh Western masses like its own little farmland. It's flat. When I lived in New Orleans, though, I did find myself talking slower. It's not like I put on an accent. But if you just take Southern accent, if you just slow down how fast you talk by

that was? That was all the scissor if you were drinking down there at a sty from I didn't know it, scissor, I googled it. Um. That was good, Sam's really good. That was. That was a good talk. Uh and uh if you haven't checked out that top fifty, it's great, great summertime reading, even if you don't agree with the

PFF stuff. And that was um. West is coming up a lot in today's show, and that's always a good things used to be very vocal about certain disagreements he had with UM how they went about their grading system. But it's just I think the league is more fun when you have these grades, especially as he said, for like interior alignment, and really anybody on defense. Honestly, I mean the offense. There you have those counting stats that make it easier for the quarterbacks, running backs in the

wide receiver, the tight ends. But I feel like that's where it's helped me as like a football fan the most, when you you can kind of know more about somebody in the secondary or someone in the front seven, and obviously the offensive line, which to me is like the most guarded mystery and all of professional sports, like how

is it actually played, who's good, who's not? UM so much technical knowledge is necessary, so even if people don't always agree with them, it's good to see that they have this dedicated team putting in the work, and Collinsworth has kind of the face of it gives them a lot of Grammy toss. I'm having a flashback to an episode where we where we did have someone from PFF and I'm not sure who was, like four years ago, and West just like wanted to grill him about like

ben hart Sock being there number one. Remember that it almost got a little awkward. It's probably I remember that. I have vague memories of that. Um, alright, good stuff, Cynthia. You've said it all I mean, and I'm glad I got it off my chest. About the supercomputer, I think hardware is important, not just software, and it's it's it's

important to have the big piece of machinery. And even if there's a hollow inside, almost like a TV prop, if you just had that and then you had that in the background, we did your TV hits and it's lit in a certain way that's imposing. I'm telling you your career is on fire, Cynthia right now. But you'd be the biggest name in sports media if you just have a prop supercomputer in the background. I'll call it the hands Who's five thousand? Um? You know you know

what's actually like really interesting? UM. So I wear I don't need glasses, but I wear them for the UV filter for my because I look at a screen for a really long time. And not even kidding, Like starting off any of my career, peop were like, can you wear your glass or it makes you look smarter? A lot of people. A lot of people do that move thought right, shows up with the glasses and I would wear them even more if it wasn't a sunny outside

all the time. It feels good. Alright, thank you, Cynthia. Enjoy Montana. Uh, in the in the lake, which, as I understand, is very large. I believe that was the data point you had on it. Big lake, big sky, All the things are big here in Montana. Enjoy it. I will enjoy my final day here on the shore with the family. Greg. I will. I won't see you in l A, but we'll be back in the same city very soon, and that that will feel close that I feel like that would be going to get together.

You know, we we should have an around the NFL preseason before the seasons summit when Marcus back and Ricky when can coordinated off. Yeah, well, I also know that now it's only your second appearance, Cynthia, I don't know

if you're making this. Before the show started, Cynthia mentioned that she had gotten together with someone that works in the league and that person went out of their way to say that they were friends with Greg and then uh, Cynthia was like, oh yeah, he said he's friends with you, and then Greg like went out of his way when I asked, oh, you guys like personal friends, He's like, oh, yeah, I'm closer to him than I am to you. What I was like, why was that is such a greg answer?

So necessary to put it that way to rank things? Yes, No, that's not what I meant. He was saying, do you do you ever like talk on a personal basis? And I was just saying, like, yes, probably, probably so more just like you know, on the I don't talk with many people on the phone in my life, very few.

I would say, that's one. Oh you guys just talking the phone, but you tall on the phone occasionally, how that's like really old, pretty occasional, but still even any because you've got a tight circle you you've said, it's not like you have a like you you're you're a very you're gregarious guy and if you're in the right mood, but you don't have like a huge friendship group. I would say it's pretty tight. And Mark and I hope

to be in it one day. I guess that's maybe that's wrong with me, But we've been through a lot. You know that we're closer than you know some rando. That's in the industry that I mean, we just just the time. Just think about the time we've spent on air together, like on this podcast for real. But I mean, I never feel more that can't be like, hey, we've done a lot of shows together, man, like the world.

At some level it does count though, because we've both been getting aid by a company at the same time a lot. It's like some of the most meaningful, um well, certainly the most meaningful work experiences we I think we've Sthy has her head down texting, I was, I was. It is family business. You're right, Okay, Well, I just this is an unnecessarily website keeps tweeting at me, and I don't know what they're saying. It's I got to learn German. I guess all right, that's it. Thank you, Cynthia,

We love you, Stay head. The signing off for the Old Boss Ricky Hollywood and Sam monson the Little Thing Irish Brogue until I don't know need the fall next week. Joe Mantanga, No, Joe Montana was not in the rat back. What are you talking about? Oh my god, that's the guy who's married to m the lady I realized who's the final of the rat fact Joe I don't know as good as I don't know Frank Sinatra, Dean Martin, Sammy Davis Jr. Peter Lawford and Joey Bishop. Joey Bishop

was sent packing because he fell out with Sinatra. You sent rap packing