Welcome to NFL Daily, where we are straight out the womb and into the Chris Westleying podcast studio here with Patrick Claybonn and really lucky to be joined by him today and Patrick Darty wrote a world coming up a little later to talk about post hype sleepers from the world of fantasy. And we'll do some dumb stuff at the end, but yeah, Jim Harbaugh getting us off to the right start this week.
Famously are again now co worker ochbar Bosha Bama says he remembers being born, so he and coach Harball have that in common.
Okay, let's just listen to this sound. Now, this was going to be part of dumb stuff later, but let's listen.
Just the way it feels. I mean, it feels like New Year's Day, you know, it feels like being born, feels like coming out of the womb. You know, it's like you're in there, it's comfortable and it's safe and and now you're out.
You're born.
The lights are on, you know, it's bright, chaos. People look people looking at you, people people talking at you, and uh, it just feels good to have it happen.
There is like a medical condition I've done I've done this, you know, research before people that can really remember things to an incredible degree. Now there's also people that say they remember coming out of the womb. There is no scientific proof or way to disprove really that Akbar is wrong.
No, I'm look, if somebody says that they remember that experience, like, I don't want to remember it because, as Coach outlines, there, the lights are bright. You've never seen light before. Yeah, people, you've never seen people before. You don't you don't understand anything. It's got to be chaotic. I don't want to remember, but you know, shout out to anybody that does a lot.
I think the condition or whatever you call is highly super autobiographical memory. H Sam, one of just sixty people. You know, there's about sixty people in the world with this that actually can't remember things like and be right about it, but not not then. And yeah, that would be a tough that'd be a tough memory. Here, here's what you got slime all you know, I got stuff all over you. Not a medical term there, just caused a lot of pain for someone that you love. I
found as a new dad. It was a tricky experience. People say that's like the best moment of your life. I did not feel that because it was it was a tough situation. The person I have, you know, loved the most in this life, my wife was not in great condition right then, and there was a lot going
on and it was a little dicey. So I was very happy that that part was over and happy to see my daughter Ellis, but I would not It took a little while for it to set in and to get over the fact that this person I've known for a long time just went through something extremely traumatic.
And now imagine that from Ellison's standpoint, right right, that's that's a whole lot.
So right, they had to like take her over to the and you know, Nick, you the intensive carry unit because it's like a soft head and stuff.
They's just a lot going on.
So yeah, that's what training camp is like, Perbro.
And you know the best part is if you watch the clip on YouTube, we are there, like and subscribe us there. He actually motions what it would be like coming out of that womb. Jim Harbor. I love having Jim Harbor in the NFL. And yeah, they're down in Elsa. I hope to get there at some point during training camp. So close, we're so close to it, and they are at their new facilities, and he's he's just the best. And yeah, they were one of the last teams to report.
Now every single team is at training camp, even the teams that had to wait one extra day because they're starting on Monday night football. Everyone is there, virtually, everyone is practicing. It is how happening. And let's talk some news before we get to the dumb stuff. All right, let's start in San Francisco. One surprise, one mini surprise, but not really today. Let's start with the obvious news, which is Brandon Ayuk is holding in he is not practicing.
He was seen at the side of practice briefly on Wednesday and then went inside to have a conversation with general manager John Lynch. I don't know if they decide I've seen this in the past, that they decide it's almost a distraction for him to be standing out there. He might as well stay inside. He's in the meeting rooms, I assume, and lifting weights and all that, but maybe
not out of practice. The bigger surprise with Trent Williams was not there, did not report for training camp and is looking for a new contract one of the best players in the NFL.
That's newsworthy.
Yeah, it's definitely newsworthy. And you know the results, like we've seen it time and time again, when Trent Williams is not there, he's the biggest piece literally infigatively on that offensive line. He's a part of what makes everything go,
what makes them so dominant. And it makes perfect sense to me at this point in his career still having that value and using whatever leverage he has, you know, because it's it's more difficult now than it was before, but you can still use that to say, hey, would I would like to be compensated properly.
Yeah.
So he has three more years left on his deal, so that's tricky. They maybe did not see this coming, but he's been so good, the best tackle in the league, that he has quite a bit of leverage, I believe, and he's willing to take the fines. I did a deep dive on these mandatory fines because it's confusing, But Trent Williams is at a point in his career where he will be fined. It's a mandatory. They can't waive it even if they want to. I believe it's fifty
thousand dollars a day. That's a lot of money. But he will make a lot of money when he gets this contract adjusted. He is on the books for a thirty one million dollar cap figure this year, but the actual money he's making is much lower. It's under twenty five million, and he sees under twenty one million. He sees the market out there. And I don't think it's a disease of more thing that pat Riley famously talked
about with the heat when you win. I think it's just a disease of you have all these great players and a lot of continuity.
Yeah, and I'm sure some folks might look at it and look at the contract situate like Debo, the bosas right, and so it's like, oh, well the forty nine ers just you know, guys are grabbing more. This is just what happens, Like you said, when you have players of this caliber, you have to pay those guys, and they want those guys around, so they ultimately end up doing it. And you know, fingers crossed, maybe for Ayu that'll take place.
Yeah, he had signed Trent Williams's signed a six year deal three years ago. Now, so yeah, it's been a minute and we'll see that one's interesting.
Ceedee Lamb.
By the way his fines, he can be fined by the Cowboys. I didn't mention this on our previous show, but because he's on a fifth year option, there is a rule in the CBA the team can waive it. So that is a situation where he's almost certainly not going to pay any fine money in the end, and I do think that we'll get done. In other contract news, Tua toungue of Iiloa is not doing everything at Dolphins camp.
He's there, He's doing some drills, not all drills. I'm not big into the D word distraction, but maybe the w weird just weird.
It's just a little weird, especially in and near the quarterback. It's unfair, but the quarterback is just different.
And like coach noted that, their relationship right, it's it's standard, it's the same. Nothing's gonna strain that. My question is why are why is why is this still happening? Like the price is not going to go down, right.
Because I don't think they've got to pay him. This is the trickiest situation contract situation. I think in the league that his numbers would say he should just get at the Joe Burrow type of contract, just like right near the top. I don't think they're gonna pay him that, so I think it's a stand I think it's gonna be a little bit of a standoff. You might have to swallow some pride or take a little less money. I think they're trying to get him at a lower,
lower amount. Well, then it puts me be wrong.
Put him a situation where okay, so Toua signs for something very short term, right, okay, and then he outperforms that. Now you've got the same exact problem, but it's even worse. Right, So if you gotta you would see it would seem to behoove them to make some sort of decision where if you dropped them out there to be the starting quarterback, considering the seasons that he has had, you're saying he should be paid.
So it's just gonna cost them money, right, Like.
Maybe, But I guess I'm looking at this as a view of like, he's not necessarily their quarterback in three years. He probably is, but they I think they're maybe checking to see if he stays healthy another season. I think that's I think that's part of it, and so maybe they're being a little more hardline than most teams. We'll see. Daniel Jones, of course got his money. He got one
of those short term contracts. I'm sure they'd give him Daniel Jones' contract like two years, forty million dollars a year, which for Daniel Jones was great, but it's a very clean out after two years. I wonder if they're they're closer to that type of deal. Good news for Jones is that he is healthy enough to practice fully at camp.
He's taking all the first team reps at camp. I found that a little noteworthy because our friend Daniel Jeremiah put it out there over the summer on his podcast Moved the Sticks, which I believe is on a high eight.
Now.
I'm just kidding, it is still happening. I need to not throw out that bad information. It's great him and Bucky and Tua. I mean, Daniel Jones will be backed up by Drew Locke, and Daniel seemed to indicate he thought Drew lock has a real chance to win this job long term, but for now they're not giving him any reps.
Yeah, for now, it's it's dimes all the way I could. I could see a scenario if Daniel Jones.
Isn't right one hundred percent back because athleticism is such a big party in this game, and maybe Drew Lock sneaks in there. There's also Tommy DeVito still around. Oh, Tommy DeVito's still out there.
I have noticed that Tommy DeVito never gets mentioned on Hard Knocks when over there talking about quarterback. I mean, I guess that's obvious, but like they went through the whole backup thing, they never mentioned DeVito. They really wanted Tyrod back. That didn't happen. They made sure to get locked in the building because they thought he was great. Daniel Jones, it was interesting on the latest Hard Knocks,
you know, had a conversation with Joe Shane. They didn't show it, but Shane talked about it of you know, when they were going into trying to get these quarterbacks, and they did try to trade up for Dadon Daniels. They did try to trade up with the Patriots for Drake May so they were down with either one. It didn't happen. Patriots didn't want to do it obviously that they told Janel Jones ahead of time and then they said, look, if if we don't court, if you see Drake May
around the building, don't get freaked out. And now they didn't get one, and they got a weapon. And I think Daniel Jo's I don't think know if he's underrated at this point, but I think people forget who he is. His first two years in the league. I always said, like, he's way closer to league average than people give him credit for. I would put him just below the Dalton line. So that's not like what you want out of a top ten quarterback. But he also is in a disaster.
He's just been in a bad situation. I think if you put him in a good situation, he'd be like a mid level Bridge quarterback.
And so for a couple of years he was underrated.
Then he had that one year and I was like, he's really not this good guys like, he's still that same guy, but the situation's better. The Giants over pay him, and now he's back to like underrated again because he's not the thirty second best quarterback in the league. To me, I think if he got in good situations, he could have a Teddy Bridgewater type of career.
I think, right because we get The thing that leaps off the page, right was those seventeen turnovers right in eight games.
He had like a really really bad stretch. He's not that.
I don't think anybody is really that guy that's going to give the ball up that much. But then he went into super safe mode where the risks weren't really There's got to be some in between where he has to be willing to turn the ball over.
But all he could make.
He used to those first two years. Actually, he is a pretty thrower of the football. It's why he got drafted that high. Like he can do that. So I'm just hoping Brian Dable can get that go and make them more watchable. One big contract that happened on Tuesday was Christian Dara Sagany, a four year, one hundred and thirteen million dollar contract, ton of guaranteed money on that nice development story for him two years out from being
a free agent. So again, these are teams that are being smart and getting ahead of the market and he got paid. And it's a reminder. Tackle, maybe more than any other position, seems to take some time. Because his rookie year, everyone got on the vikings of like, oh, I don't know about this guy. This guy's a reach and then shows up second year and he's awesome.
Asking a lot for rookies to start, especially a tackle, And now they've got I think Darrisol's twenty five. I think he just turned twenty five too, and so you get that youth value at this position for a long time. I think it's a great deal sign more guys early, like I was talking about with Tua.
If you can foresee them being a part of your team, then why.
Not seventy seven million dollars guaranteed forty three point seven at signing. I bet that's gonna look great in two years when the actual extension even starts. And yeah, I think the Vikings are in better shape.
I made a I got Vikings.
Twitter annoyed on Wednesday, pointing out that Michael Pratt Tulane getting more first team reps right now than JJ McCarthy because I was begging this drum during draft season. I was like, is JJ McCarthy and Michael Pratt that different? I like, look at Michael Pratt, and I see a guy who's going to be in the NFL for twelve years.
That was just like taking a little shot.
He's getting first team reps only because Jordan Love's not there, but I think he's going to be a good backup. But I actually it is kind of high on the Vikings. I don't know what they were over unders, but I bet I would take the over. I think it's a good team around, like around that quarterback position. I think the defense has a lot of potential. I trust them
more than the Bears, but that way. We talked a lot about the Bears on our last show with Stacey Dale's but I think the Vikings have a chance to be five hundred this year.
Yeah, especially considering what they were able to accomplish last year with the situation after Kirk went down. I didn't think about it like that, but yeah, why wouldn't we.
Believe two great tackles, like literally one of the best tackle combinations in the league. That's hard to find. Two great receivers in absolutely premium position. Maybe the best one two in the league has a chance to be I think Jordan Addison is that good and more defensive talent than you realize, and good coaching, like they have a lot that you want. It wouldn't surprise me if they're in the playoff Micks. All right, we'll fly through the
rest of these news items. Sad that Michael Gallup retired. Sad for me. I hope he is happy with it. He had signed with the Raiders this offseason. He had struggled with injuries. We had him on the Around the NFL podcast before last season, and you know, he was trying to come back from that acl and he never fully got back to what he was early in his career.
Yeah, and it's so explosive, right, and a part of just a really good run on Cowboys offense. And you know that's it's just a sign of what can happen to a guy when things go wrong physically. It's not like he did something wrong. It's an accumulation of things that didn't go right.
I mean, it's so obvious, but it's just such a brutal sport. I thought about it with when Ryan Ramcheck retired to that twenty seventeen Saints class for instance, like it just it's maybe the best rookie draft class of the last twenty years, and yet after five or six years, it's tough to stay at that level. Now, Ramcheck, you can can't play right now because of injuries. But even Alvin Kamara like time comes for everyone.
Time is a thief.
Randy Gregory doesn't didn't report for your mini camp, I mean training camp. He also didn't report for mini camp. They don't seem to know why. He also sued the NFL this offseason and the Broncos, So there's a lot going on there. Not sure if he's going to show up with the Bucks or not. Cooper dejen is out three weeks to start training camp. He's on the NFI list. He suffered a hamstring injury in off season training that we didn't know about, so could take him a little
while to get going. But they're pretty deep in the secondary. And then I liked I saw that Kyle Shanahan offered Bill Belichick an open ended job.
Did you see this?
Yeah? Just job.
He was just like, whatever you would want to do? Do you want to join my staff? I wish I liked the idea of Belichick in the media. But that would have been cool too, Yeah, it would it. Maybe maybe it would be cool. Maybe it wouldn't have had any material effect in my life. That's another It could.
Have gone horribly wrong.
Or they you know, they might win the Super Bowl anyway, so it's it's one of those things.
But Belichick didn't didn't want to do it.
But I think that shows I do like Kyle Shannan's the confidence of like, yeah, I'll put Bill Belichick in my room. I'm not going to be like threatened by him. I just know he's gonna make me better, us better. Belichick's probably thinking, like, this guy's gonna steal stuff from me, but Shannonan's probably thinking he'll do the vice versa anyway.
He wouldn't mind.
It's a risk worth taking for Kyle.
No one was Mike Shanahan's bigger public supporter as like one of the greatest coaches of all time in Bill Belichick, so that those ties run deep. Finally, we got a trend here to start training camp a couple puke stories. Jamison Williams puked at training camp today and then return the next play and scored a touchdown. I mean, if that's not football is back, then I don't know what is. McKay Beckton also puked four times, supposedly at Eagles practice hot there in Philly early in camp.
That's not great.
No, it's not great.
And throughout my track career you find out that there are certain people who just simply physical exertion equals regurgitation, like that that's a part of their deals. And some people come to it a whole lot easier and then don't. I don't even always think it has a lot to do with people's stomachs or food.
Some people do it before games because they just are so nervous.
Some people are just giving it back and I'm like, whoa, like, are you okay? And then they're just they're running a ry with puker. No I am not. I have to have consumed a pathogen. I will not name the establishment, but I received a case of dia burger from this one well known national chain.
And yeah, I'm not a huge one, but I in college. Yeah, they don't close the bars in New Orleans. You show up,
they're eighteen. It was eighteen to get into bars when I was going there, Like it's asking a lot to make it through the night, and these nights last a while, night after night, and so I was very much like a boot and rally guy where I would I would pull the trigger at two pm as like almost as a matter of course, not every night, but quite often, and then keep going because other wise, I would just be on the floor or you.
Know, I that's the I mean, you.
Always felt better I did. I also was a strawberry the game. Yeah it was stupid, obviously, but this is what you do when you're That's what I did when I was in college.
I also puked.
The worst experience I ever had. Why are we talking so much about this? But was as a strawberry truck driver up and down the East Coast. I've mentioned I had this job before, of course after freshman year of college. And yeah, you learn fast. Yeah it's free strawberries. Just got him there all day. You're in a truck for twelve fourteen hours. Like there's a limit to how many strawberries you can eat. Don't just like eat it all day?
That was a one time mistake. Jameson Williams maybe is also a guy who just eats poor food.
Randy. I don't know if you have this to fly up, but.
He has posted on Instagram over the years some like that's a very revolting food.
What is this exactly, Randy? Can you can you step in? Yeah?
That is a mcflurry on top of a cheeseburger that's on top of a double quarter pounder correct game recognized game. I understand not wanting to admit that you knew any but I mean we all know that's.
What you've done that before.
No, it's just you know, the two pickles. You can see the two patties there. It's clearly a clearly a double quarter pounds or MC double one of the two.
So I don't know if Williams, uh yeah, I don't know if that had anything to do with what happened. What is this is? This is another instagram from from.
What I can from what I can infer, it appears to be nacho cheese, ground beef on top of hot cheetos. So this, I mean, this looks like ballpark food though like something you'd get at.
A high school.
Yeah. I got to the front or something of a line at Dodger Stadium this week and I thought they had some like carne asada tacos, but then it was just the carne asada on top of the cheesy nachos. And I got to the front after waiting a wow, I was just turned right around.
I was like, I can't get that. There's no way that's happening.
Jamison Williams, though confirmed dog put them up your fantasy boards now. And speaking of fantasy, let's talk to Rota.
Pat. You're not done with me today. Patrick.
We're gonna come back after I talked to Pat Dherty and we're gonna wrap up the show with some dumb stuff. But before that, Yeah, I'm excited about this fantasy season. I'm diving more into it. Some post type sleepers, some guys not past their prime but maybe not getting as much sign as they used to.
After this.
Back on NFL Daily, one of my favorite fantasy minds in the game. We're not waiting until late August this year to talk fantasy. We're doing it in July. We're gonna sprinkle in fantasy segments each week as you get ready for your draft. And no other man I'd rather start with than Pat Dherty, who I've tried to take credit for hiring over at roadal World multiple times. And then Evan Silver reminds me he's like I hired him, man, I'm the one that hired Pat. I was like, I
supported him. I think his tweets are funny. Pat Dready, what's up?
Evan hired me, You supported me.
You hired me in spirit though, because no one would have been allowed to be hired without your approval.
There you go.
You still had you both hired me. This might be early for you in fantasy. You're very late, though.
We've been talking about it since really, probably before the championship game weekends, like we don't even wait for the Super Bowl to be over, but there's only four teams left. Then you kind of start talking out the following year.
Yeah, the game, the game has changed.
Not to do it back when I was doing it, but yeah, this was the ramp up period.
Certainly we paid attention.
We did news at OT's, but there was just not the competitive social media tweeting of like the entire industry already doing ADP and best ball in like April. Everything is different. That's why I need someone like you to sort it out. And so we're gonna do an exercise. Actually we used to do back at rohatal World, which I think is very useful, which are called post type all Stars and post type all Stars to define it for the listener. They at one point were built up
their ADP. Their average draft position was probably pretty high. It didn't work out for whatever reason, and now it's lower and it's part of the two things I think are the most important fantasy football, if you don't want to over complicate it. It's like, number one, take good players like that are talented and great at football, like that's very important. And then number two, playing the game is just buy low and sell high, Like, don't take Travis Kelcey in the one season of his career where
he's in the first round. Take them after an off year, and hopefully we're gonna go through all these positions and get a lot of guys out there. But these are the types of guys I would be targeting in draft without even necessarily being huge fans of them, just because their their value is low and it's lower than it was in the past, even if they're still in a good situation. So I'm going to start out with wide receivers.
I think that's where I had the most people. I'm going to go T Higgins as my first one, and he's a lot of times this is going to be like a young guy who actually hasn't done that much, and T Higgins actually has done a lot. But I just couldn't help noticing. I looked at Fantasy Pro's average RAPT position this year, last year, PPR. He was the fourteenth wide receiver last year. He's the thirtieth wide receiver
this year. There's literally no difference in his situation other than he had a bad year last year and couldn't quite stay healthy. But he's the same guy, the same opportunity, and he's getting taken four rounds later and we've already seen him be great, so to me, he is kind of a perfect post type allster.
Well, yeah, there's no difference in his situation except for Tyler Boyd is gone and there's right target competition and Joe Mixon has gone, who is one of those highly targeted running backs in the entire NFL. And really the only thing that is different with T Higgins's situation is that he was always slightly overdrafted. He's always taken like a wide receiver eleven or twelve before, and he's the classic guy where he didn't quite return adp quote unquote
a few years in a row. So instead of just like put him where he really should be, like in the probably the wide receiver fifteen or sixteen range, everyone is now over corrects, of course, and he's the wide receiver twenty nine or thirty.
So I totally.
The only thing was different, like positives for him, it's the classic contract year narrative, and they.
Really need him. It's not a super deep scope.
It's very top heavy, some superstars to the top, but it's not like the deepest skill core or anything like that. So they really need him. And yeah, he was someone I almost put on my list. I did not, so I'm glad.
Okay, I'm glad. I'm glad you didn't. And yet I think this is sometimes it's good. You guys have been in the Fantasy Mines all season, all off season, digging that coal or whatever it is that you do, and I had I hadn't looked at average apposition until yesterday. And then sometimes these names just like stand out as like common sense.
Why is that dude so low? You give me one that you like?
It's not the coal mines where sand mines by their silica. Is that what it's called. Yeah, we did nothing as glamorous as coal in the Fantasy Mines, but this first one could be stretching the definition a bit. I'm going to go with George Pickens, who is not like he's like under hyped, but kind of like t Higgins, he was over hyped the past two years a little bit, maybe still only barely two really strong seasons to begin his NFL career.
But it's people.
They don't want to touch the Steelers offense because Russell Wilson is toxic, Arthur Smith is maybe the most toxic fantasy figure in the.
History of the game, and people his huge finish last year.
So the best stretch of George Pickens's career came when people kind of weren't paying attention to him, they'd already kind of written him off, and they switched to Mason Rudolph of all people sparks like the best three game stretch of his career, Like even marginally improved quarterback play really got George Pickens exploding down the stretch. There's this
zero target competition. He seems like a good fit with, like Russell Wilson's moon balls to me, unless unless Russ is totally done, which is no.
You know, the one thing Ruskin absolutely still do at an elite level is throw a sexy deep ball. That's what our original producer TD used to say in the back in the day, Like he throws a sexy depot. If he's protected, he can still do that. I don't know if he can do that much else justin fields can throw a nice deep ball too. Pickens is wide receiver twenty seven, and their wide receiver room is a borderline disaster.
It's all off season, like.
Oh yeah, the Steelers. They're going to add a big name before the season, Like who is trading their receiver to the Steelers?
It's all Pickings. I love that. I'm gonna go, man, I have.
Brandon Ayuk would retire if he were traded to the Steelers, by the way, so if they actually got the big name, he would just retire.
I don't know, man.
He's been putting out like instagrams where he put up the Washington you know, play calls and stuff like he had. He was like looking at their coaches film from their internal that was a problem. So he was he was down with the Commanders, but he also was down with the Steelers because he mentioned that. That means his agent was putting a burd in his ears, like these are the teams that will pay you that money, but I don't think they're going to give up the first round pick.
He is posting cryptic trade demands so often that I don't even have Instagram anymore, and they still just show up on my phone every morning. Brandon, I U cryptic trade requests from Instagram stories.
Okay, I'm gonna go with Stefan Diggs. I wanted to be a little spicy here again. I just looked at wide receivers who fell in ADP from this year to last year, and he was fourth last year. He's twenty third this year. Everyone's going to be worried about the target share there.
I don't care. He's good. He was still getting open.
It's the classic too, first year in Dallas or Philadelphia, honeymoon year, and twenty third to me is too low for a guy that talented. I don't think it'll be top ten necessarily again, but I'm I think people over worry about the fact that there's other good receivers there. He's still going to get plenty.
Yeah, you can nitpicked with all three of the lead Texans receivers, but you should do with the least, probably with the superstar like you said, and it is.
I love Nico Collins, but he's wide receiver eleven into me. They're about the same in terms of fantasy value, and Nico.
Collins do that just seems like buying at his absolute peak, a pretty rare third year breakout.
He's clearly very good.
The Texans front office agrees they've paid him seventy two million dollars, but you'll get kind of a one year wonder so far in Nico Collins. Tank Dell we love, but I really dislike when guys as a rookie kind of live up to their negative pre draft billing. So Tank Dell lived up to his positive pre pre draft billing. Explosive play. Guy can make play us all over the field, you know, but he's undersized and small. You could get hurt and then to stuffer like a really serious orthopedic injury.
Even though it's very questionable usage, I think is still a concern for Tank Dell. Steph Diggs is just like, was this a protest season or was this decline? And I am more inclined to believe it was a protest season. And for whatever reason, he no longer liked playing with the second best quarterback on the planet.
And you can just see it.
I've heard the reports out of Texans camp, but Paul Gallant, who's on the radio there was like, I've never seen anyone practice harder than steff On Diggs. And it's like it's just like his press conferences are just he loves the world. He's talking positively about Josh Allen. It's just it's just all there. He's playing for a contract, and I will not dan for any Nico Collins slander. I love Nico Collins, so I will not call him a one year wonder. But it doesn't matter to me. That
doesn't take away from Diggs. And they know there is no world where he is gonna be happy being a second receiver, and there's no world where his talent would would make him one.
Give me another wide receiver, Pat.
What if he is the second receiver by the way, and then just immediately protests but uh, the second one. I don't know if this one counts you. I think it does count. Christian Watson, Yes, that actually.
Is a perfect way. I don't believe in it. I looked at him, but he is a tailor made post type all star. I'm just not with it because I think that Dantavian Wicks is better.
I shot you down before you even made your point.
You did.
There's yeah, there's a lot.
It's this is kind of like a total Battle Royale receiver corps where there is like a genuine like hand to hand combat for the targets. But Christian Watson, he's never not been productive when he plays the promise he just doesn't play very often. But he quite literally went to the lab to get his hamstring issues figured out.
Like we're big into the lab narrative here at Rotal World, where he went and was studied like like a science experiment and they figured out like the strength and balance that was making him suffer hamstring injuries every other week. And even with the Battle Royale an uncertain target situation, it just seems like there's you talked about the two main tenants in fantasy. Are they good? Are they of value?
It just seems like there's too much value to be had. Okay, the guy with his track record is the wide receiver forty one. So I do love Christian Watson as a post type guy.
Okay, wide receiver forty one. It's fine. My issue is just and I don't think he Dantavian Wicks does not fit this exercise.
He's just a straight sleeper or whatever you want to call him. What I see is he's wide receiver fifty eight. And he would be I picked to be their leader in wide receiver yardage. And I like Jayden Reid and Dobbs enough that I think Watson's got a specific skill set. He might be a good best ball guy, you know, best ball's not my jam, but he'll have like four big time games. And otherwise he's just a deep guy,
one guy. And again I don't know if he's I'm going to give you actually a bunch of names because I want to get through the receivers. I want you to pick who you want to talk about. But I think these all could make sense. Terry McLaurin, I've been wrong about year after year, but he's so talented to be the thirty first if Fantasy wide receiver that I
just don't care about the situation. Jerry Judy, I don't know if I'd actually want to do it, but he's fifty ninth right now, So that's just a flyer, a post hype flyer. The what I believe the most. Cooper Cup doesn't work for me. I thought he would go be way lower when I looked at this list and he's still wide receiver eighteen. I was like, no man,
the way he looked last year. Sorry, if he was in the twenties or thirties, maybe Deonday Johnson is the guy along with McLaurin here is probably my favorite why receiver forty one, the only guy on that team gets open, they're gonna be better just because you can't be worse. So to me, he has a nice little post type all star. But pick pick which one out of those you like the best. McLaurin, Deontay Johnson, or Judy Well, Judy was the classic.
He was the last guy threw on my list but didn't put any notes for just because he's such an obvious post type guy. But no one really wants to make the case for him, So I'm just not gonna make the case for him.
And it is Deontay Johnson.
I mean, like fantasy, we focus so much on like workload and who was getting touches, and he got one hundred and forty targets three straight years for he had his protest season last year. Everything about the Panthers offense this year is about salvaging Bryce Young's career, getting him lay up looks. There's really no better like lay up receiver in the entire NFL than Deontay Johnson, Like you said, his ADP is just absolutely cratered. He's been beyond like.
It makes no sense, Like we have seen how good he is, We've seen him produce. People are scared because he's on the Panthers, but brace Sung had like a one hundred quarterback rating.
Patrick Claybud mentioned this earlier.
You know when he's thrown at Adam Thelen the only decent received a team, And to me, Deante Johnson is just a younger, better version of Adam Thelen, Like you're not going to get crazy explosive plays, but he's very good with with body cat like catching in traffic and he's gonna get open.
I've been drafting him almost every team this year, and Judy was on my list. The other guys on my list with two other pretty obvious ones, well you could argue how obvious there are.
One was Jamison Williams.
I love how Dan Campbell basically Dan Campbell begins every press conference with like a Jamison Williams hype session. Right now, I feel like called him a man on a mission. I just he just will not quit talking about Jamison Williams, who had probably the best game of his career. In the biggest game of his career, in the NFC Championship Game, where he made some game changing plays. He's finally healthy.
He maybe seems like he's finally with the program. Before the I promised you last week I would bring up a gross one. Okay, yes, and it's Quinton Johnston. Oh does he count because he might not even count.
That counts. You gotta stand for it.
But he might not count because he was never hyped to beginning.
No, no, no, he was at least enough that people were drafting him, and before before he had a bad camp, people were, yeah, he's definitely that. But yeah, as two of the only you know, grown men that still use the word gross, which I think went out with Wicked back in the nineties. Although you're not nearly as old as I am, despite your four children, I mean, shout out to Rotopad getting it done here.
I take my orders from that point.
When did it become okay to make fun of parents for having like more than two children. Jim Gaffigan has a whole whole like bit about this, which is great that people just treat him like a freak. Like once you get to three or four, it's like, oh, what's wrong with you? Like, meanwhile, it's like everyone's got like seven dogs and no one gives them a kick.
I don't know when it became okay, but I feel it acutely because when I tell people we have four kids, I seriously self consciously going, I don't know, man, like, we're not like it's not a religious thing. We're not like weird freaks. We just like kids, and we keep having kids. And I do feel very self conscious.
Kids are Kids are great.
They make you happier, and then you're like, Wow, this relationship is cooler than any other relationship I've ever had in my life. Maybe why not have more of them? Back in the day, four point five was like ADP for kids.
So you're just old school.
My family's only half done too.
No, that's not true at all.
I don't think that's right. People making you feel But all right, let's do running backs and quarterbacks. I'm gonna I'm gonna start with one. And this is where I think when you're drafting fantasy, sometimes you gotta be emotional. Not just make it all about about your feelings. Just look at the facts. Tony Pollard was RB eight last year, a top fifteen overall pick when he was coming off a devastating injury. He is now much healthier, should be
more explosive. He is now running back twenty nine. I get that he's not gonna have the same workload. In fact, I think Taj Spears is incredible and is also a good value. But both things can be true. Twenty nine For Pollard, I think kla as their offensive line coach, even though I didn't love what I saw last year. It's just if you just look at the facts, you look at his age, you look that he's healthier now, you look where he is and what his talent is.
That's you could make the argument that it's a very good thing he isn't gonna have the same workload because his greatest success, both as a real life player and as a fantasy threat, came is like the one be the change of pace guy who got put on the field and situation. It was always like a third down where you can make an explosive play or in the red zone where you could score a touchdown. So maybe it's a good thing that the workload comes out.
And yet I think it is They're going to run a ton and they'll each get two hundred touches in a perfect world.
Just sue super convenient narratives like you said, he's actually healthy and he got paid. When someone gets paid, they want to use to it.
So he got paid.
Give me one. Give me a running back.
Kenneth Walker, Like, I know it's Ryan Grudd.
I thought about him.
It's Ryan Grub, mister passing game from the University of Washington. But early in the offseason, Mike McDonald did the classic talking up Fire and Brimstone talking about the running game, he said he wanted to win the time of possession battle. Like, yeah, I feel like I hadn't heard that one in a while, especially from like a progressive minded coach like Mike McDonald. This was like April. So maybe it's like the Ryan
grubbification of the offense. As intensified, they will look more like the UW offense and not like the Ravens offense. He's just such a rugged runner. He's the classic guy like if you want to limit Gino's attempts, if you do want to win the time of possession battle, Kenneth Walker gives you those kind of carries.
He was not efficient last year, but.
Things were just going south kind of in general are still a tackle breaking force, and he's like the RB sixteen seventeen. I think he could easily still get into that ten to twelve range.
I think that's good.
And Grubb had awesome offensive lines in Washington like they they always were coaching as well, And to me, he's a classic. Even though I like him, he's probably better in fantasy than reality because yeah, big he's gonna hit those fifty yard touchdowns and he's gonna have those negative two runs, but those negative two runs don't really matter that much in fantasy. Kind of the opposite of him, who I think is underrated is Ramondre Stevenson last year
RB eleven. This one is an asdramatic, but thirtieth this year RB eighteen, fifty eighth. Just one of the few guys who is going to have the backfield to himself. They're not going to over use him like a couple of years ago, but it's great on passing down. Is clearly the best running back in that room. They paid him like a top five running back, and I think
that shows what they want to do for him. So again it's just looking at value, like my son got carried away and took him in the second round last year. I think her first round. I think it was second round. It's like that was too much. But now he'll be fourth or fifth and give you that second round value.
The only thing with Reminder Stevenson that I fear is Bill Belichick clearly determined that he caught too many passes and scaled back that role last year, and.
Then they did great.
He's a great receiver.
Gibson. I just feel like it's back to back regime.
I get it, but Jacoby and maybe not Drake me as much, but Jacoby loves loves dumping it down.
So you're not moving me off this one. Give me one.
Do I have to give you another? Running backs? I didn't really even want to say Javonte Williams, but I am just going I don't.
I'm not drafting him, I'm I will say that. So one of the reasons he's a post type is because I'm not hyping it. But there's just so much talk about the Broncos running back competition and he still has the strongest case by far to be the number one guy. And he's kind of like Tony Pollard. Will He'll be another year removed from his injury. He didn't look right to me. No, he doesn't look totally right.
In a minute, I just go, hey, the Denver situation seems to be one of those in fantasies.
Just like you can you could just be like.
No, no, I actually don't think it's never gonna help.
Like maybe a waiver wire pickup that like hits for three weeks, that's what.
I would want out of a Denver backfield.
I don't think it's hyperbole. I don't think I've drafted a single Bronco.
Now.
I haven't done enough Best Ball drafts to do that, because you eventually draft everyone at some point.
But I haven't drafted a single Bronco.
Two's spicy ones here very late. One I really believe in. One that's just funny to me is Jackie Dobbins RB forty nine right now. I just think he's I just think it's Jim Harbaugh in the situation, and it might be something where he just helps you late in the season. But he is fully healthy. I know he's coming off a torn achilles. He's shown that level of talent that that's worth of shot. And then if you just want to get freaky in a deep draft. I mean, I
couldn't have been more wrong about Damian Pierce. But if you go from the first round to RB sixty one and you're not totally confident in the guys in front of Damian Pierce staying healthy, I would take him in the seventeenth round. I mean, give me a little RB sixty one Damian Pierce, fine.
Another one I would get freaky. I don't believe in this player at all either, But Alexander Madison is the RB.
S okay, see, but we want we want players we believe in. I've seen Damian Pierce excel at the NFL level. That's the thing I think people missing fantasy. If you've seen it once, it can happen again, even if they're coming off a bad yue. Let's wrap quickly with quarterbacks. Give me your favorite quarterback pick.
Does Kyler Murray count?
Yes? He was one of my two. He counts.
His ADP hasn't really fallen as much as I would have expected. He's like QB seven an underdog. He is QB ten really, and the more normy drafts I see thirteen, I see ten.
It depends.
Yeah, it's got he QB seven on underdogs so like the sharp square quote or not fading him, like the general public will be fading him because he's just disappointed three too many times in fantasy and another he's never been in a better organized offense. He's another year healthier, he's gonna run more. He finally has another weapon, a signature weapon, and Marvin Harrison Junior. I just really like
the way the Cardinals are coached and organized. It could be famous last words, it seems like it's gonna be his best setup he's had in a really long time, and that the dual threat will return a year removed from the injury.
To be a quarterback.
Like if you're not getting taken in the first four rounds or so four five rounds, it's almost like I don't care if I have to take Like if Kyler is gonna be one of my two quarterbacks, I'm fine taking him around early because he has that top three or four upside and you're not gonna have to use one of your first five or six picks on him. And so I love that. I think he'll run. I think he's gonna pass better than he ever has. Justin Herbert was getting taken sixth at this time, a year ago.
He's now getting taken fourteenth. I think just people are wallowing the whole, like Jim Harbaugh likes to run the ball thing a little too much, and that this is where I'm just betting on talent. If Justin Herbert's my QB two like get out of here like Murray Herbert combo if you wanted, or even just one of them, and pick someone at the end and just go cheap at quarterback, He'll find a way to get yards. I think they'll run them a little bit more, maybe in the red zone than they have before.
So I'm all about it. I believe in Harba.
I believe in Herbert too, and it's become a mantra in fantasy. Tempts are a quarterback stat. We are going to find that out with the Chargers this year because we are getting the ultimate experiment and they're not.
Gonna take the ball out of his hand. I think their defense might be pretty bad. Like he's the best player on the team. Jim Harbaugh has like posters of him on the wall that he goes to sleep through. What so he's gonna hand it off to Gus Edwards and JK. Dobbins fifty times a game. I don't think so.
So now you don't like j K.
Dobams H No, I like him, but I like him at But hey, you didn't say neither one of us had the courage to say Aaron Rodgers is he post type guy? No, that the lead balloon falls in the show?
Where is he?
He's outside the top twenty at quarterback and quarterback's crazy man because Caleb Williams, Stafford Rogers are all like outside the top fifteen, and it's just another reason not to take any quarterback early met Although you know, I don't know do what you want, but I won't.
I want to take Aaron Rodgers, but I mean, we've seen vengeful Aaron Rodgers before and it's his best supporting cast in a long time.
He's a fun QB two. That's a good one.
No, I agree, that actually fits my profile, a player that's shown himself. He's like literally one of the best players of all time. Yes, and you're buying low as hell. Patrick Darty, one of the best Rodo writers of all time, still using the word roto world.
How about that?
I still think it's corny roto pep, but people remember it, So you gotta use it. And if I'm one of the you are the best what you do. I'm so glad you've got the show, and I'm so glad you had me on.
Uh well, yeah, I want to have you on regularly. Like I said, We're gonna do fantasy, you know, regularly. God, I got the Big Dog, the Big Fish, even Silva. At some point, we're gonna we have a Mike Florio from NFL and Marcus Grant coming up in the studio in a couple of weeks. I think we're gonna do a mock draft, but just sprinkling that in, especially in draft season.
Love you, Boddy, Thanks Pat.
Love you too. Promise to yell at Evan. You guys need to yell at each other.
Back on NFL Daily, wrapping up the show with Patrick Clayband before.
He hits the road.
Although he's gonna be on this show from the road Monday Morning show. He'll be in Cincinnati, excited for that. But in the meantime, he's gonna hit some teams before that though, let's talk about some dumb stuff. We just want to wrap up the show with dumb stuff. And you were talking about Patrick, like, who's going to have the quote of training camp. Would you say you thought Sean Payton had it last year?
Yeah, And it's a little It kind of counts right because it's in an interview.
You know, he's in his office, he's comfortable. And then I thought, like, who is in position.
When he dog Nathaniel Hackett.
Yeah, yes, when he provided maybe his analysis of the twenty two Denver Broncos.
I want somebody to do that again this year.
But I'm worried that there was so much fervor that everybody's going to be buttoned up in p's and q's in respect mode, that we're not going to get any fun.
Well, Sean Payton's to me a good candidate to make it happen. I think Jim Harbaugh we already heard on this show he is a good candidate because older people not gonna say guys, but older people they don't care.
They know, what does it really matter?
Like there, I'm looking forward to being even more of that person that just doesn't care and they'll say whatever. And Sean Payton, he's won a super Bowl, he's made the money, he doesn't care. I really actually found this interaction at Broncos camp very funny. It was his Shohn Payton's first press conference of training camp.
Coach Cecilamie Denver Sports. I'm gonna piggyback on the.
Greg dulcuch thing. How far behind is he?
Based on Lucas Kroll was maybe your best player this entire offseason.
And I hope you had a good summer, by the way, I do too, But did you say Lucas was our best player, best tight end?
It's arguable he was a No, I wasn't no, it wasn't all right. I'll answer you a question, but you're not close.
Lucas Kroll.
I mean, if you're wondering who Lucas Croll is, He's a third year player who attended three colleges, has played for the Saints and the Broncos, has eight career catches, ended up at Pittsburgh, and like he's taken shots.
There from his coach.
But I found that very funny that he was not gonna take like weird hot take from someone who was at too many OTA's and just was impressed by Lucas Scroll.
Yeah, and no.
I do want to hear Lucas's reaction to that interaction because it's an ears burning types of choice, like whoa Lucas Kroll mentioned, and so like his phone's probably blowing up and now he's got to click on that quote, and like I want to I want to see him watching them.
Shout out to Cecilami though, who asked that question old school fantasy guy online at football guys when I was starting at two thousand and three and still getting it done, and knows a lot about football, So I'm sure he just was really impressed by his off season workouts.
But he was shut down eventually.
Sean Payton actually threw out a couple names of like people that were better than Lucas Scroll and he said Patrick sartan good choice and Quinn Minors, who they just gave eighty million dollars too.
So he was like, there are two players who.
Has had better off seasons than Lucas Kroll, but that I love that it was unnecessary, but he wasn't wasn't gonna let that side. Do you have some candidates of who might also have some good quote?
Well there was.
Brandon Bean was reacting to an anonymous gem saying that Josh Allen was overrated, and he said, there's idiots everywhere.
Mmm, okay, and I think it's not.
It's not spicy because it's not like something that some other team is going to have to answer questions about.
But it is.
It is a fun quote that kind of takes me in the direction where I want these guys to be comfortable up there answering questions and not, you know, shying away from from having fun.
I love that.
It reminds me of Tom Emory, my high school tennis coach who who had a vision of this this group when we were just in in elementary school and it led to a high school championship.
But he once told me.
I remember a practice and he was like, Greg, one thing you got to learn ninety nine percent of people you meet in life are idiots. And I was like, well, let's coach. But I gotta say that that I don't know if ninety nine is high. That's a touch even ninety five I don't remember now, but it's a touch high. But I gotta say that quote pops up in my head in a way. Most words of wisdom at that age have not stuck with me quite as long.
I want to hear from Jamar Chase. I like this.
He was interviewed as part of the Top one hundred that we've been rolling out the top one hundred at NFL Network and on NFL Plus. My son Walker, it was actually watching it on NFL Plus going player by player. I don't think they got to Jamar Chase yet, but the NFL sent out this clip of them asking who's the best player in the league, who's.
The number one player.
I don't know what I'm not saying him. I give credit when with due, but I'm not saying his name. You're talking about, yeah, you do.
I'm not saying his name.
Brother.
I'm sorry, Joe Burrow. I'm not saying that guy's name. He's good, he's amazing, he's good.
Not gonna lie.
I'm salty, though, a little salty two years in a row. Fro'm putting Borough first.
So he said, he said, I'll give credit where it's too It's like, no, you're literally not giving the credit.
But the credit. He said, he's amazing, he's awesome.
He just said he Wasn't we all well confused because then he throws in Burrow's name a couple of times. But that almost made it worse because he's he's throwing his guy's name in there right after pointing out that no, I'm not saying Patrick Mahomes's name, but the same for him. Mahomes hasn't been their problem, right, like not exactly. I guess I don't know he's everyone's problem. What do you
mean he wasn't their problem last year? But just that they're out there winning super Bowls when the Bengals are not. I think that's that's the problem. And that he's, you know, maybe the best quarterback of all time through the first seven years of his career. I wouldn't even say maybe he's definitely the best quarterback of all time through seven years of his career.
It just feels like like them being the roadblock. Yes, it doesn't like if Cincinnati when when they have it all together. Yeah, it hasn't. It hasn't been the Chiefs.
You know.
No, But I look, he's he's elevating Mahomes to like Babba Yaga territory and he's like not even talking about him a pencil and so yeah, I get I like the energy and it makes the games fun.
It was just dumb, dumb stuff.
Any other any other options for your quotes before we open the mail bag?
Just quickly, Dan.
Campbell walked out. They got a new podium in their media. Oh yes, and Dan Campbell is a large person. This podium isn't.
I am so happy you brought this up. You can see it on the YouTube show.
It's crazy a normal person is is making headway in that thing.
I did.
Nothing filled me with more glee today than just seeing Dan Campbell behind this boat, this yacht of a of a podium. And I like that there's a there's a cabinet on the side that's locked as part of it. I want to know what's in that cabinet. Is amazing that that podium. It's the opposite of the Bengals podium one year where everyone made fun of how small and dinky their podium was.
There should be a fridge in there. There was always, you know, one of the team staffers. We would go to you know, Coach Stapans availability every every week in Tuscaloosa, and Cedric would bring his Coca Cola Classic and put it on the podium with that thing. You gotta have a fridge in there, and Coach Campbell could just he would have to walk around again, go watch this on the YouTube show. He would not be able to reach and open the door. He has to walk around the
podium and open it. It's that big.
It's amazing.
It looks like it looks like one of the Tesla trucks that are, you know, just blating blighting the highways of Los Angeles.
It's a little more aesthetically pleasing, it is.
All right, We're gonna take a couple questions before we go that you guys sent in and comments to the mail box.
What is our mail address again, Randy?
That would be NFL Daily Podcast at gmail dot com.
Okay, yeah, send us send us some questions about the show or the upcoming season, and and we're gonna try to get to them at a future episode NFL Daily Podcast at gmail dot com. All right, throw them up, Randy. Before we say goodbye, this is from Faith. I listened to at in the past three years after my dad sent me an episode. I love the show. So glad there's a sequel after the hiatus. I've enjoyed this show. Wondering if the podcast segments are gonna be new or will some from ATN return.
My personal favorite inter.
Monologues Dalton Scale by the way, Judge Connie was great. Please bring it back. We will definitely be bringing back Judge Connie. That was a lot of fun. I thought i'd address this because you might have noticed we haven't done the same thing. It doesn't feel right. Yeah, like we're here, it's a different show.
Those were.
Concept we all came up together, like, and it just doesn't that. It doesn't feel right to me. So as much as like I love doing them all and they're out there, it's like that those aren't mine to to do. That's how I feel and or ours, you know what I mean. Just that was that was around the NFL's those were those shows. Dalton Scales different. That's just in the universe. To me, that's bigger than anyone. That's that's
telling the truth about how football works. Because that was even before the you know, that was just that was a concept Chris came up.
So I think I referenced it in this show.
So we will be referencing it and maybe maybe I'll do some Dalton Scale stuff.
But that's now. For the most part, I don't want to do the same stuff.
Yeah, and it's not because of the quality of this stuff now, it's just.
It's it's it's gone.
But of course we're you know, people have asked, and we did say, you know, we're having the previous show, we're having a recap show, and we'll have picks of some sort and it'll just be it'll be different. Let's throw up the next one before we get out of here.
Uh.
Don Krean says, if and when things go south, why should Nick and talking about Nick Sirianni be fired if he didn't pick his own OC and DC, if how he picked Kellen and Vic, how he owned Kelen and Vic? Who owns is aggressive? Jeffrey Lurry owns Philly Accountability. This is just how it works, bro Like, when you're not in charge, you get blamed sometimes for things that are out of your control. And I think they viewed it like, yeah, we'll keep Nick Sirianni and we'll keep it under our parameters.
These are the parameters he's gonna have to work with and if he can't make this work, sorry.
And the first person that was made aware of those parameters was most likely Nick Sirianni.
Sure, so he he is.
You know, you want volunteers, not hostages. And Nick Sirianni is completely fine being the head coach of the Philadelphia Eagles.
That's a perfect point to make, because Doug Peterson was surprisingly fired, I believe based on the reporting that came afterwards, after not apting a similar idea exactly. He was just like, what, No, I won a super Bowl? No, and Nick Sirianni was was that close to winning a Super Bowl.
But I get it.
He has a very talented team, he loves coaching, and he's going to try to make this work.
It is just a little weird, you know, slightly work because.
Coaches usually picked their staff, but the Eagles do things a little differently in general, and for the most part, it's been very effective.
And if, like we talked about Bill earlier, if Bill Belichick was willing to probably give a little lenience to his staff preparation and choices, then he'd be the head coach.
Oh, I thought you were going to say he would be the head coach of the Philadelphia Eagles because they did speak with him, how he spoke with him maybe, so who even knows how that conversation went or how it could go in the future. That's something to watch watch out for. NFL Daily appreciate you guys listening. We
have Brian Baldinger. Baldy excited about this segment we have cooked up with Baldy and Mike Carrifolo is going to be on the show to wrap up the week on Friday's show as well with some news, So looking forward to that, looking forward to having you Patrick back on on a Monday show. And until then, Yeah, we're.
Out the womb. Just wipe off that gunkin. Let's go.
Music by John Placento.
For Patrick and Randy. You'll see you next day.
Sal There's idiots everywhere.