New Horizons Monday 2020

it's on. I mean, do you even know how to open a mailbox and get your mail? If you do, it's it's about as hard as that. Yes, So again the Around the NFL TV show on NFL Network. Our own show, It's Never Happened UH, starting this Friday and each Friday for the next three weeks. Check it out, and also our live show from Super Bowl UH from the super Bowl at the Miami Improv. Make sure you get tickets Miami Improv dot com, slash events, The Around the NFL Podcast live at my Ami Improp. Check it out.

Let's get to the show. Be Around the NFL Podcast will challenge their indefinite suspension. Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL Podcast. My name is Dan Hansas, coming to you from a room filled with heroes, Mark Sessler, Chris Westling, and Greg Rosenthal. What is up? Boys? Hey Dan? Some people call it black Monday. We do not call it Black Monday because we respect the people associated with this terrible day. On the lead calendar. This is new

Horizon Monday. Doesn't it feel better now? Doesn't it feel Mark fresh, some new, a new chance to turn the page for these men that have lost their jobs. It's all about perspective, and you know, it's it's it's the beginning of a new journey for those that have been

let go. We did have to overtext if you recalled in have a brief chat with Greg who was getting a little too excited about breaking news and elements of news, and just sort of say, come on, Greg, as they will say around the office, let's let's take a look at what's happening to the human side of this. But he's he's in a good place now, I believe. Well, we're taping this show late Monday afternoon on the West coast, and you know, we were hoping to have all the

news that we could have before we go off. New Year's Eve is tomorrow and whatnot. But some of these situations not wrapping up not as um grizzly as it sometimes is on almost like murky horizons. But that's the way it is. But what we're gonna do is we're gonna go through all the news we're gonna save, you know, topics regarding the playoffs this weekend, wild Card weekend. For Thursday's preview show, We're gonna keep our focus here on

the hirings and firings and speculation out there. Uh, and then a little bit of our own version of the Aftermath one of the great NFL Network programs and act if it's good enough for al Michaels to come in and every year and do it comes in from uh you know, bell Air in in his own car, private car takes him there and he does our show in

NFL network. Damn, that's good enough for us after flying in from Seattle this morning or last night probably, I mean right the work course, and it was it had to be a beefy minutes that he wasn't It wasn't a three and a half minute come in, shake hands and leave type tables. So the aftermath is the network show that spins around the league after each Sunday. We're gonna do something similar because this is also exit interview day, uh in the NFL for coaches and players after another

regular regular season has wrapped up. But let's let's get into it, and we'll start with what we know for sure and uh yes, we'll start with the New York Giants Luji, who have decided to make a change today on New Horizons Monday, the sound Drapp really making it worth in this music throughout uhte or Seahawks on Sunday night. I was testing out various options working with Ricky, and

we came down with a few different options. We well, yeah, we're just gonna cycle through them, you know, to keep the listener and gage totally discordant with a fourth quarter spinning utterly out of control listening to these sound bites, but interesting anyway, so that the Giants make the decision to fire Pat Shermer up two losing seasons. Uh, there just was not enough growth obviously for the Giants, who despite having two big first round pick se Kwon Barkley

obviously a superstar. Daniel Jones showed a lot this year as a rookie. The rest of the team it just never really has come together. In fact, Um Shermer goes nine and twenty three with the Giants. He went nine and twenty three with the Browns, and that that winning percentage, which is I think in the to seventy five range,

is the seventh lowest for any head coach. Um with that level of experience mark you know Pat Shermer well from his time with the Browns, and uh, is it fair to say that he can be both the guy that maybe isn't an NFL head coach but also entered borderline impossible situation taking this Giants job. I think it's extremely fair because I think he was put into a bad situation in Cleveland and came out and showed that he can be a very talented, skilled play caller and

coordinator of offense and went into the giant situation. Anyone taking that job was stuck in this front office morass and ownership mouthpiece scenario where they're trying to cling to Eli Manning, and you know, I feel like Shermer was hamstrung with with Eli Manning from the start and then forced to try to turn it around and flip it with with the rookie quarterback. I don't think that Pat Shermer is, you know, Paul Brown two point oh. But he was put into a really rough situation and it

seemed to me doomed from the star art. I agree with all that, And yet when the owner comes out and he doesn't say, hey, you know the typical we want to move in a new direction, thanks for this, we're doing this, he says, there were so many games that felt like we should have won and we just didn't get the job done. That's just laying it online. You should have won more games, and a team that was purposely taking the season from the front office perspective

that Dolphins won more games in the Giants. I still I'm just getting used to these John Mara press conferences, and I just remember, you know, back in the mid two thousand's when he would have them, there was this sort of aura of wow, this is one of the great ones, like that when this owner speaks, they really

know what they're doing. And as the amount of these press conferences have piled up every you know, twelve to twenty four months, you just think of all the mistakes that the Giants have made to be one of the worst franchises in the League since two thousand and twelve, and you think, like he he bears a lot of their spotsbility, and he took it. I mean, he said,

put it on me. Look, I'm I It starts at the top, but he's always on the defensive, and that's part of working in New York and it's part of always failing to really pull the band aid off and always have a connection to Giants history. And he's still is going to have that connection in the front office. Well, yeah, I thought it was noteworthy that he said, um, we've lost some standing as an organization as I look around the league. That to me was the quote they hit home.

But I kind of I if I would love my owner to say that to the show, understanding you know that we are not what we used to be, and we understand what's been happening is no boy no, and we need to try to change it, and that's what we're setting out to do. I still feel like if I'm a if I'm a Giants fan, which I've been accused of on this podcast, I still feel like I'm in good hands and I give them a not a total,

but they chose Macadoo and Shermer. No that absolutely they've made a couple of bad decisions, but they've also had an incredible run before of this slump they've gone into and the end of the Eli Manning era. Uh, maybe the Patriots are about to learn this too. It's it's always gonna be a little bumpy figure out how to get out of that era and into the next. Uh. Dave Gettleman, though he stays and this is now this

is worth potentially criticizing as well. Let's listen to what Mara had to say about Gettleman, the GM who does not lose his job despite some big swings and missus. We could we could have differences of opinion about whether those were hits or mrs. There definitely have been some mss, no question about it. I think that can happen to anybody. There was reasons for some of those personnel decisions. Um, he does know that the batting average has got to

increase going forward. Though West love those baseball metaphors and other sports they always pop up. Yeah. He John Mara said that he happens to believe in Gettleman, and he happens to believe in the changes he's made, and and that's his prerogative as the owner, but there's a lot of changes as we go forward. The way he's building his roster isn't how a lot of people believe you should build a roster with running backs, with big behemoth

defensive lineman who stopped the run. And then, to me, the bigger question is a desperate general manager usually doesn't work well with a new head coach leading the search. It's fine if he's an established GM with with job security, but a desperate GM, it's usually not a good combination bringing in a new coach. They they butt heads to it feels like hazardous territory again for the next hire.

Now exactly they have more aligned. It's the same thing the Jets have been through in various forms, the same thing the Browns have been through and are about to go through too. With the GM that might be on the hot seat hiring a coach that in theory is not exactly aligned and has a little more um seniority.

It's it's a problem. We mentioned Eli Manning, and he will certainly, almost certainly not be back with the Giants, and he kind of put a period on that today with comments he made at his locker as the you know, players across the Lead League are cleaning out the clubhouses. He's turning thirty nine. On Friday, he was asked if he was interested in being Daniel Jones backup next season. Eli had this to say, I doubt it. I doubt it. Being uh backing up is not real fun, which opens

up the window he is open to playing. He going, but it is not going to be with the Giants. It's for the best possible situation at this point. Yeah, I think he's just it's gonna sink in eventually that retirement is his best option. I just don't see anyone looking at the game field from the last couple of years and saying, yes, this guy's a starter. I think he's expecting. He even said he's gonna take a couple of days and and then he'll talk. I think he's

fully expecting to retire. I mean, I maybe he's gonna see if there is some crazy opportunity out there. But the way when I listened to all the things he said today, he he sounded like he knew and and that played out in the way that he approached those last two starts where his family is there and he was soaking. We've also had a pretty unmatched influx of young quarterbacks where four or five years ago you could have maybe matched Eli Manning with a desperate team that

didn't have anything at the under center. But what team is that today? Someone on NFL Network mentioned the Cults bringing Eli Manning into be where Peyton was. I mean, it was just conjecture, but but there's just no good match. That's the early leader in the clubhouse for best point of the podcast. We're gonna be keeping track. It's a new thing we're doing. Uh, it sounds competitive. Ricky is gonna announce who had the best point of the podcast

at the very end. Finally, the Giants now turned their attention to finding a new head coach and a lot of connecting dots to Matt Rule of Baylor, who almost ended up with the Jets last year didn't work out, and the Giants are said to be interested. Uh. And Rule is a local guy. He has his stock is sky high after really putting together a bailer program that is on the rise and is expected to continue to

be on the rise in the upcoming season. And we'll see if that's the guy Josh McDaniels whose name is popping up again. Adam Schefter report of the Giants and Panthers have requested permission to interview with the Patriots o C. So all those hot takers that said McDaniels had burned his final bridge by walking out of that, uh, that handshake agreement with the Colts place, it seems like Josh McDaniels will continue to be a hot name this time of year. Uh. And we'll see if he actually takes

a job this time. Well, Mark was really excited about this New York Post article, uh, speculating that now would be a great time too for Belichick to make that move to the Giants. I mean, they play the hits at the New York Post. They know there's no basis for this whatsoever, but it's probably the I bet it's

the most highest trafficked article on their site. Well, the root of my excitement is that it was a sandwich bet from late August that I proposed, So if it ever were to happen, I'd basically just retire it right there and just go live in the middle of the farmhouse. How would you feel about Josh McDaniels as the Browns coach. Why not at this point? I mean, we'll anyone into I mean it, He'll be there for ninety days to

two years. So wait, I don't know. I'm always literally when it feels like people are selling you something, and people are always trying to sell us. Josh McDaniels in his personal growth that he underwent after his Denver years, he had to go through them some things and find himself. Okay, Well then why did you leave Indianapolis in the lurch? If you found yourself m moving on? So that's the he got his family maybe the best point, why did it keep? Okay? Moving on? So that's what's going on.

Who's even elsewhere on New Horizons Monday? Hold up, you gotta be quick with it. I'm playing a harp here. We are at a different situation here, we're in a different stage. Everything's a little different sound stage with a fake Rubik's cube two feet away from Dan shoulder. I don't know. A gigantic trend zone. Guys who we love, you know, they are the Spanish around the NFL podcast. They're up in the studio and we expected Ricky to muscle him out when you just you know, compare numbers

in terms of audience. But here we are on the stage five instead of the podcast studio, So it is what it is. I guess, yeah, but I couldn't fit the harp up. There quite a diverse skill set playing the harp and muscling people out anyway. Yes, So, uh Jay Gruden has been out of work since October when the Redskins let him go, and Ron Rivera, who has been out of work for a couple of months since the Panthers let him go. He seems to be the guy that will be the head coach of the Washington Redskins.

By the time you hear this, he might be the head coach of the Washington Redskins. Um, but he's not at this moment as we're recording. Its just pointing in that direct and uh Revera will as he takes this job. You understand he probably has some reservations about the culture in Washington, but I guess money and power talks, and I'm sure he's gonna get a lot of both. One guy he won't have to worry about clashing with is Bruce Allen. Rap Sheet and reported that the Redskins informed

Alan that he's been relieved of his duties. Um, the team president was his role. Uh, it is a run that was deeply, profoundly unsuccessful. And Alan is shown the door. So it does Greg open up. Um, you know, a power of vacuum that someone's gonna fill and maybe Rivera gets a bigger voice and the type of decisions that

Alan was handling. Yeah, it sounds like that's some of the you know dots that are being what do they say, you know, they're crossing tease, They're they're figuring, yeah, dotting eyes, they're figuring out how the front office is gonna work. There was a report out there that Rivera was dining on Monday night with what happened, I don't know. There's a lot of strange ambient sounds. West's jacket keeps bumping up against his microphone. There's a lot of things going on.

We are we're prosh I saw a report that Barack Obama, Dan Snyder, and Ron Rivera were out to dinner. That's pretty bald, that's pretty I mean, that's he's joining the team. Mike Silver was on our network saying he was like looking at a text and you can guess who was probably from that everything is going fine, that there's no delay. It is all Obama and the team president and the head coach of the team. How about that by Obama,

I guess a little civic pride. He probably wants the local team UH to not be a an embarrassment, which they have been. I mean, the Bruce Allen news to me was almost bigger than the Ron Rivera news because Bruce Allen has been a plague on this for anchise. There's there's a box in for the last couple of years, the fire Bruce Allen movement that was so popular. The Washington Post like wrote an article about the movement, includes ESPN, Matthew Berry and all this stuff. And I think it's

it's a good thing for them that he's gone. Well. One of the reasons that he stuck around for so long, mysteriously to most is that his father obviously was George Allen, and when Daniel Snyder, I don't know if that's how he was telling people that news, but you know, Daniel Snyder grew up a Redskins fan during that George Allen time and was friends with Bruce Allen. But that's not how you run a team. So this I think was an absolute must for Rivera to even consider this job.

He was with the Bucks from two thousand four to two thousand and eight. He was with the Redskins from two thousand to two thousand nineteen. None of those teams ever hit a playoff appearance, a playoff win under him, No playoff wins. He's like a one man Bengals. They always say like he he makes a lot of like he's good, but you know, he's good at the business

side of things. But all you gotta do is look at a game, you Washington, and here the here first of all about the fan experience, and look at the empty seats. And he's also good at misrepresenting the truth. He sits up there like Nero as the organization burns around him, and he tells people the straight face the culture is quote damn good with the Redskins as he's firing Jake Gruger. Which that was the worst press conference of the year. Little known fact his sister, I believe

did you see Adams introductory press conference? I would say this one, this one tops that one for me, just kind of out of just absolute utter, NonStop lying to people, what about our boy with well that wasn't this year that was you know, the one Jim Tom Sewel that was a lot of fun. That was the most uncomfortable

press conference. Hey, I just golch ball. I mean, what if what is Ron Rivera hold a super McDaniel and went out to dinner with the President of the United States, the former president of United States never have dinner with the president and then walked out on the redskins? What did that great power flex and what did that on some level make him even more in demand? Is like,

whoa this guy? He's ruthless man? How can you were saying that about McDaniels though it would be a brand the next level you got Obama might kill this like endless buzz that you know. And I and I'm sure it's true that Ron Rivera is just this wonderful man. I mean, I mean, I I'm sure it is probably just you hear it NonStop and it's like we get it, we get it. He's a wonderful man. But you know, doing something like that be like he's very's diverse in

his behavior. Maybe he's got a mean streak to marks a little grumpy. It's twelve past five here in California. We're off to a little bit of a late start. I find uh that New Horizons Monday is essentially Agenda Monday for a lot of people with their message. It's a lot of Phil Air time with with the same talking points for nine or straight to ten, nine to ten hours on television. That why you were mad that we had to wait that minutes the start here ten

minutes trying like thirty seven minutes. Yeah, a little known fact here, you know how you've pointed out. I'm like the NFL network historian. I got a good one for you. One of their original um on air talents was Bruce Allen's sister, Jennifer Allen. Hey, that's a great point, right. I read her book fifth Quarter, very good. Hap Uh, there's no such thing as a fifth quarter, but it

was actually very well written book does. I would recommend you should check it out personally, Dan Hanson can be an overtime period, but a quarter by its well, they could rebrand that. They could rebrand the novel with a new title that would be more acceptable at this point. Alright, other news, Let's move now to another team in the NFC East, the Dallas Cowboys, who in true Cowboys fashion. They just can't let go the guys. They don't even

know how to do it. It seems because Jason Garrett, who everyone assumes is out as Cowboys coach after an eight and eight season that was deeply disappointing. Jason Garrett, excuse me. Jared Jones gave an endless press conference late last night. Uh, no announcement. Then we go all through Monday today, no amount announcer today. Uh. The day has included exit interviews for players. A team meeting that followed.

James later reports that Garrett used phrases that suggested a permanent departure rather than a mere end to another season. Garrett later met with Jara and Stephen Jones, the vice president, for roughly an hour. That said, still Greg, nothing to report. How did they meet for an hour and not happening? It's like only Jerry Jones, Like what he was like talking about Arkansas football and all the good times that they had, and like he's like he was waiting for

Garrett to fire himself because he didn't. Doesn't he just want to own the Tuesday news cycle because all these other teams have a piece of the piety. You can talk about it as if it's happened, because it's it's happening, and they're apparently orchestrating however they wanted to be played out with a press conference or whatever. It doesn't it

doesn't matter. I'm more curious about who's next. And Jerry Jones said he's not worried about what other teams are doing, and he hinted that who he's interested in, those names aren't on these lists. And so you've also seen some speculation. Could Mike Zimmer be someone that he goes after Ian Rapport throw that out, Mike Florio threw that out. Uh, there's some big name college coaches. Bob Stoops has been

whispered about, maybe Urban Meyer. So it seems like those are the kind of big fish that Jones might be going for. Vikings have to make a decision on Zimmer, whose contract is only through two twenties, so they make a decision on him this offseason, and something tells me they do not want to leave. They don't want to lose Kevin Stefanski, who was a big candidate with the Browns last year and is getting interest again. So I

think Zimmer is interesting. What's gonna happen? Especially if they lose. If they lose to the Saints and the defense doesn't play well, it's three straight losses. It's tricky though, because they've had one losing season out of six. I mean, he has five winning seasons. Ron Rivera has three, and Ron Rivera's talked about, you know, like he's in the next one Mike Zimmer season. Ron Rivera. It speaks to

the madness of covering the Cowboys. Clarence Hill, who works down there, Uh, he was live tweeting like everyone else down there. Uh a press conference that Jared was holding. I feel like it had to be around midnight, uh Central time. And uh, here's just a snapshot of when all any sane person wants to know is Jason Garrett fired or not? And instead he's he's opening Jara on how how Dak Prescott and miss Tony Romo's passing record mark for a single season by one yard? And here's

the quote. It really breaks my heart that Dad didn't get that record by what a yard? A yard? I would have gone out there run a route for him and at that at that time to get that yard. He deserves that. And I locked the boy who's got the record sometimes there are there are whiskeys involved. We are we talking about this? Uh? In other coaching limbo news, Doug Maron still the coach of the Jaguars. So a brief timeline timeline here, Tom Coughlin, the football's are gets

canned about what seven to ten days ago? Uh. The assumption is that Maron's gonna go, But then some reports are bubbling that he could perhaps survive. Then at ESPN reports UH that in fact Maron had been told already that he was fired and he would finish out the

season and then be gone. That was disputed and then ultimately proven to be false, because Maron still is employed as of now with the Jaguars, and there is apparently a meeting scheduled between Maron and Shot Khan at some point this week, UH, ostensibly to finally settle his fate, to which I say, Chris Westling hed better be staying at this point. I'm not saying it's the right move, but like, what are we doing here while all the other teams looking for a head coach are whining and

dining and pursuing the top options. Uh, you shouldn't be pussy footing here. Make a decision Esther get off the pot well, Mike Gara Folo said it's about a fifty fifty chance, and I think it might be higher than that because it seems like Tony Khan, a friend of the show we've had him on before, seems like taking on a more responsibility on the football side and making these decisions. And maybe that's part of the hold up

is there's changing responsibilities there. Tony Khan allegedly is a big fan of Doug Moron and a big fan of David Caldwell. I would imagine David Caldwell is also safe. Of course what role he has in the organization that could shift, But I guess, yeah, Greg, do you do you does it feel to you now that Maron is gonna be back to me? It just seems like Tom Coughlin ended up being the big fall guy at the end of the day here. Yeah, I think that would be a mistake. But I guess I'll wait to wait

to find out. Uh and other news, what do we have a Panther's candidates who's jumping out right in that search to replace Ron Rivertt's not Perry Fuel. I can tell you that. Well, they've they've interviewed Mike McCarthy twice now and supposedly that it went very well. But Matt Rule is also very high on their list, according to rap Sheet, who also mentioned Josh McDaniels and Eric the Enemy. Yeah, they asked for permission for McDaniels. Rule is interesting because

I think they still have a game. And he says he's going on vacation after that with his wife and he's not taking any interviews until he's back from vacation. So if playing a little hard to get and and he said yeah, if he if, if it doesn't work out, then then he's fine with that. Rule. By the way, Bob Bates d d as my father in law, good husband, moved, by the way, probably well, and then publicize it. So you look, you look, you just look like an excellent

family man. So Bob the dds is as great. Point is as plugged in on bailor as anyone. And he is going to be furious of Rule leaves. Now, He's not a man that gets furious, but he will be very unhappy because what Rule has done there, Yes it is not um, well, my father in law hasn't built this bailor program, But what Rule did with Baylor after they had their scandal. Uh, it doesn't. It doesn't touch what happened with Bill O'Brien at Penn State. But he

quickly rebuilt Baylor back into a powerhouse. And he's young, and he's exactly a type of hot shot college coach that you think is going to get plucked. And he was open it seemed to go into the Jets last year and the Jets failed to seal the deal. Well, they wouldn't allow him to pick his own staff, which I would say, ultimately if he feels like a match for the Giants, and it's it's hard to see the

Jets always get put in these situations. But if he were to go to New York and completely raise the Giants from the go of the earth, well that is a tough look for the Jets. I simply wouldn't allow to pick his own assistance. Although maybe that's a point to why Gettleman could be a liability, you know, like what if Matt Rule isn't isn't feeling that partnership. But they've worked together before and know each other, So uh,

let's move on. The Dolphins make a move on bright horizons. Monday, parting ways with two of their coaches on Ryan Flores's staff, including their offensive coordinator uh An Irishman. Chad o'sheay out after one season, and the first sense think is, well, what are you talking about? Why would you do that? Ryan Fitzpatrick, you know he taught he turned water into

wine down there this year. But as we pointed out on the Sunday Week seventeen recap show, which we heartily endorsed and suggest you check out even though it landed not eighteen hours ago, Um, Fitzpatrick just made a lot of that magic happen on his own, and the offensive line coach also got fired. The offensive line was a turnstile, and to Fitzpatrick's credit, West he just found ways to stay on his feet and make plays all year. I think that's a good way to put it, that Fitzpatrick style.

This is a good point by me, absolutely. I think Greg should update the standings there. That was a good point. Ricky is in charge of this. I just she's typing furiously. If I mean maybe my idea for this entire bit that could be as a good as a good one. That was right. I mean, anytime you can just you know, throw and tack on more work onto our producer while she's trying to do seven other things at the same time.

You'll undoubtedly win this contest. It fits is out there playing sand lot ball or as our friend Patrick Claiban would say, going John Wick on the Patriots. How much credit does the offensive coordinator get? And I know they had a just a brutal running attack, but they also had Mark Walton who looked like a keeper from minute until he ran afoul of the law again. And I don't know if O OCEE should be blamed for that, but there's obviously something going on behind the scenes that

Brian Flora wasn't happy. Right They've they've worked together for a long time. They knew each other forever in New England. So I guess is it's less about production and more about either they already he knows who he wants to hire that would be my guest or just Chadowha has never had that role before, and Flora's is making the decision that that's not even though it likes him personally,

like that's not the guy he wants. Or Belichick on the phone and said, you fire that man now, because we're about to lose Josh McDaniels, and I'm taking him back onto our staff. I mean that this really goes against your whole trojan horse thing that they went up there and beat the Patriots though kind of well that's why now it's it was a it was a thorny phone call, not a pleasant one for all the fits magic sizzle in Miami. Uh. They finished seven in total yards,

averaging just north of three a game. And the offensive line coach that was let goes Dave do Googlia who why is that name familiar that I can keeps getting fired? He's got five by the Patriots before you know he was He was with the Jets at one point too, so he's been around. But he so SCARNECKI retired, They brought in Googs and then canned Googs and brought Xcarneck. Tom Googliott is still my favorite. Good He's the guy

after the guy and the guy before the guy. Yeah, in this case, whatever, he's the guy you don't want to be moving on the Brownies. Brownies, they are taking a more measured approach to their head coaching search. Uh, digging through a bunch of options. Uh. Mike McCarthy is now connected to the team which I am on record saying that feels like a sensible match, though everyone else seems to hate Mike McCarthy. Josh McDaniels, connected to the Panthers, Uh,

Greg Roman is connected Towns Robert Sala. I'm gonna throw out another one. I saw that happened on air, connected to both teams, connected to the Browns, Jason Garrett well connected in what sense someone put that out there's actual information or yeah? I thought it, thought it might be someone that I can see. I think he fits what they now. You know, they've had every type of head coach in the in the book, but now we want an experienced head coach, so they're gonna go get an

experienced head coach. It's usually it's also the famous. You want the disciplinarian, then you want the players coach, right, disciplinarian players coach. I am, I am beyond exact. I was never a fan. I was never a huge fan of McCarthy. But maybe it's this pr work he's done. I don't know, it's as he's like into analytics and what's the update video of my quarterback's feet and he

wants the updated offense. I just feel like the Browns keep having total strikeouts and he would be like a single up the middle, and so that is not bad. Mike McCarthy. I feel like Mike McCarthy is one young jeezy viral video away from being like the hottest candidate out there. The pr campaign has worked the one thing that like with Josh McDaniels, and I think I kind of feel like Josh McDaniels is who they want because they've they've wanted him before whatever. You would feel differently

about Josh McDaniels. But there are a lot of people saying that the Browns are into the Josh McDaniels experience and that he would want to bring the infamous Nick Kissario with him, not the pastor who's down in Houston, but the Patriots Nikossario and John Dorsey. Sits right in the way of that. So I think the Dorsey is another guy that you gotta do. Whoever they bring in has to deal with the Dorsey experience. At the same time,

it's completely muddled. All right, Let's go through some soundbites from Exit interview Monday Monday. Now, my children's horizons, they both sound like rehab facilities, but that's fine. They are anyway, here's speaking of the Brown's Jarvis Landry, who didn't waste any time sounding off on why he thought that Freddy Kitchens wasn't the right guy. There are always times in seasons where things happen, you know, guys get hurt, um

off the field issues. You know, a bunch of different things happened, um, you know, in crucial points in the game and breaking points of the game. UM, being able to hold your composure, of being able to um, you know, talk to each other, um, um, treat everybody in respect.

You know. I just think at times, you know, there was a lack thereof there's just opportunities in games where you know, I know on the outside, on the outside that we could have taken advantage of you know, teams you know, um weaknesses you know, and that and that that we did and and um, you know, we just didn't really um, I just didn't really know what the plan was or what we were trying to do or

I don't think we ever really found our identity. Well, that is quite a take that of the Freddy Kitchens experience. I mean, Mark has been on this corner for a while. They've been taking them down on the sidelines, like you can basically tell what's going They orchestrated, not that he was gonna necessarily stay or not, but they essentially it was like a coupe. How much more can you do than telling, you know, the other teams to come get you.

Outside of Eric Mangini and you know, Joe Joe Thomas and Andrew Hawkins told a story of the team kind of throwing a party when Andrew when Eric Mangini was released. But you know, honestly, that didn't happen the same way with Hugh Jackson. There were a lot of players that liked the man and whether or not the experience was good, obviously it wasn't. But you you just couldn't find a Browns player that really went to bat for Freddie Kitchens in the past twenty four hours, which kind of flies

in the face of because I haven't heard. Baker just sort of threw it into the you know, it's not my decision kind of thing, which is, you know, Baker someone that's going to go out and back someone if he if he feels that way. And of course, as the story goes, it was Baker that helped get Freddie Kitchens hired. I wonder how their relationship. I mean, to Baker's credit, sometimes he doesn't know when to shut up. He never kind of came out and said anything that

made things even worse for Kitchens. You didn't Baker never really spoke out. I think this will be one case that or where as more reporting comes out in the next week. There was another. I saw a source that talked about that the team had never been so befuddled by a lack of direction when it came to organized game day management in preparation week to week, and it showed on the field. And I think that that by the end of the year, veterans who have been around

better coaching, we're just starting to lose it. And so the right choice was made. I mean, we all get that Freddie Kitchens seems like a dude you want to go hang out with for a weekend, to go on a road trip with, but not necessarily game plan for the Patriots. Two more points Landry made There was too much on the head coach's plate. And this was a bone of contention that we brought up a few times. Why is Todd Monkin not getting a chance to call

the offense instead of Freddy Kitchens? And the other point was Landry said, we relied too much on plays and not players. So Freddie Kitchens wanted to go with his offense instead of tailoring it towards the skills of his The whole staff get let go last year on the market. It's in process. But what they weren't immediately fired there they can look for jobs, as have four thousand billion other assistants in Cleveland. All right, um, let's move on.

John Elway. Yeah, John needed uh the second half, he really did that. He's the general manager, the czar in Denver. And this one's for John. I've heard this one's for John. This one's for John, This one's for John. This songs for John, and that one's for John. This one's for John. Oh yeah. Also that ones for John. So not surprising. Laugh at the end. We didn't get the Sydney version. I always thought that's beautiful. Not a surprise, Yes, John Elway, Yes.

The Broncos finished x and two to finish seven and nine. Uh. Drew Lock wins four of his five starts at quarterback, and Elway was asked, Hey, with this nice start from your rookie second round pick, does that change your approach? Are you gonna be looking to bring in competition for the kid entering? And Elway was pretty strong on it. Well, I mean I don't see any options right now. I mean, obviously he finished and did a heck of a job. He won four out of five games and played well,

but got a lot of work to do. But we're excited about where Drew is and so, um, you know, I don't like to show our hand, but I think it's unrealistic to say that we're going in a different direction. I think it's an upset that in this room there's someone that is more antagonistic to John Elway than I am. Who I mean, it's just well, I mean why I witnessed other things happening during that. Okay, there's legit antagonism there.

I missed that. I like that. He was like, I didn't want to show her hand, but yeah, it's definitely Drew Lock. Why even to show your hands? Who needs you know? Why? He can't help himself? Because who needs who needs a w at the quarterback position more than Elway? And if he gets a chance to take an off season long victory lap, even if it's built on perhaps a house of cards, as Drew Lock really shown us

that much. Always smart, he gets it. He's gonna use this off season to show that, Yeah, maybe I'm not so bad at this Bozos. Well, like Greg mentioned on the last show, what you do for the last five six weeks of the season has no more bearing on the future than what you did for the first six weeks of the season. I don't want Drew Luck to be overrated. I don't want him to fail. I just feel like the Broncos are putting too much stock in the last six games as far as expectations for next year. Yeah,

it's it's right. I mean that it was pretty telling. I think maybe they sign a veteran backup. But it does sound like Drew Locks the guy. Whereas, if you compare his comments to how Anthony Lynn talked about Philip Rivers on Monday, just he was, you know, he's very positive. Why wouldn't you want a quarterback like that? A lot

of great qualities. But stop short and then John Gruden especially uh stopping short of promising that Derek Carr was gonna be his quarterback, saying, look, he improved a lot, the stats went up, we we got better, But I'm not going to make and he promises right now that I think that shows the differences between those three teams in that division, that those teams are looking for options, probably the Chargers most aggressively, Raiders in the middle, and

the Broncos at the end. I think a Raiders option could be Philip Rivers down the road. Oh, I like that. I could see that. I don't know if it would work, but I could Philip Rivers. Everyone's like, oh, John Gruden wants a young guy. John Gruden always wanted an old guy. That's who he always signs, Rich Gannon, you know, Jeff Garcia, Brian Greasy, like every old guy. He could find that because that those are the guys that under stand his

offense and run it how he wants it. I could see what could phil Rivers football van drive to the desert and back that many times? I Philip Rivers in Las Vegas do not feel like a match now, It's like a minute forty five minute plane ride. Oh what kind of works? Um and other news. Bruce Arians gave his end of season presser and uh, he flying to practice every day on a plane. No, but you go home for like Friday nights and stuff. He quarterbacks have

done that. You go home Friday nights. You know, it's like, oh, I'm the assistant coach of the soccer team here, I'm just really breaking film. I'm sure there, I'm your QB one here, I'm just dead. Bruce Arians is still salty about his quarterback. He was salty as we talked about on Sunday night. He's salty as we talk on Monday because, uh, you know, his quarterback is killing him. It literally could

be killing Bruce Arians. You see his face and how read he's getting because he just can't deal with the the swashbuckling QB who cannot stop turning the ball over thirty interceptions. Give me a break with the swashbuckling business to pick six to end the season. On Monday, he was asked Bruce Arians was if someone other than Jamis Winston who Winston? Of course, his contract set to expire in March, someone other than Jameis Winston, Uh could handle

quarterback duties for the Bucks in with another quarterback. Oh yeah, we can win with this one. We can win and we can definitely win with another one too. These guys. And he's sending he's sending a message to Jamis that he is, he's p oed well. He was asked about the evaluation process and his answer was, the first question is what's behind door number two? As in, what are my other options at quarterback? And then he disclosed that

Jameis Winston is near sighted. He can't see the scoreboard and he can see the guys in front of it. That was a joke. That was a joke. It was pretty great. I mean, it's a great Arians line. He can't see the scoreboard, he doesn't you know, he's hurting our team. But if he showed up at training camp with like Rick Vaughan glasses that completely correct his vision and he's like Steve Young crossed with Dan Marino, Well, the reason why I took it seriously is he was

a specifically about Winston's vision issues. One of one of our favorite Twitter follows that that boy Wolf has had this theory forever that Jamis Winston just needs context. I think that Bruce arians was absolutely first of all, the the that interception might change how their offseason goes if they were feeling good off of an overtime win. I feel like none of they have these quotes wouldn't be happening.

But I also think he was responding because he knows he has a contract negotiation that's probably already annoying him, and he probably heard what Jamis Winston uh said in his prop press conference, and he was like, responding to Jamis Winston on Monday, here's what Jamie said. We all know. I guess we know what we gotta fix. There's no reason for me to be specific. You look at my numbers. I'm I'm balling. You know, I gotta stop giving the ball to the other team. All right, it's not a

trick question. I think you're exactly right. I think there was more to it too. He was like check the stats. He said, like check the digits. He's something just something like that. And I think Bruce Arians went into that press conference ticked off about that comment and going, does this guy really think he's well, that's the only way you throw thirty touchdowns in thirty interceptions if you have

that attitude, you know what I mean. He's Bruce Arians is not going to be coaching for the next seventeen years. So it's like, do you want to go out with Jamis Winston or do you want to find something better? When there are a lot of quarterbacks that he's a lot. He's a little like Ryan Fitzpatrick, except he just was taking number one over all. Right. Uh. And finally in the news, Adam Gates wrapped up his regular a season

conversation with the media with a press conference. He was asked if Levyan Bell, who's coming off really a dreadful first season with the Jets. He never had a twenty yard run this year? How about that average? And I believe three point three yards for Carrie was not all his fault, but certainly some of it is Bell just maybe not being the guy who was with the Steelers

after that one year layoff. The Jets are are really locked into another year with Bell money wise, unless they decided to take a real hit or can move him via trade. Gaze was asked if he saw or if he wanted leaf Bell on the team in and this is what he said. You he's under contract for three more years. You're gonna ask Joe tomorrow? Do you want you can ask Joe tomorrow? I'm not the personal Church personal m alright. So a couple of things done unpack

here one. Uh. Famously, Gaye was not on board with the signing of leve Bell. Mike mccagnen with ownership, uh pushing forward as well, made the move, and it got out that Gates didn't want Bell, getting them off on the wrong foot. Gates then sits out a lot of the voluntary work with the team after the one year layoff, which I think led to a little more heat than than the really bad season. Uh. So you can understand

why Gaze might not want this guy back on the team. However, this is another example to me why Adam Gates is just not a good fit in the New York market. And I'll tell you why. Is that he can easily just give a a diplomatic answer here, say who wouldn't want to have Leve Bell back? I know the numbers didn't say it this year, but he did a lot of good things for us and and we we hope to work together and do something much better next season.

He could have done that, and it's not like that none of this is being talked about, but he I don't think he's able to do that. And I also wonder Niche Meta, who I brought up last week, who wrote the hit piece about Gaze only caring about money or whatever that was last week. He was the one where he like he kidnaps Orphans uh and throws him in the trash on Christmas Eve. Yea, it came out on Christmas Eve. Uh. He asked that question as well, And I just wonder and some of the beat writers

connected dots on this too. If Gaze, because he's so furious that Maniche would would do that to him, was being short with him and gave him clipped answers and said, go get it from somebody else, go get it from the GM, not realizing, not being savvy enough in the big chair to realize that you could have your issue with Maniche. But when you answer like that, people are

gonna read it in a different way. And it's just the type of stuff that I think he has to learn to have any chance of Except I mean that it's a fair question based on what Gaze has cases

come out and supported Bell throughout the season two. And you know, when you dig into a little bit more, if you look at everything he said, there's been a pretty balanced take on Levan Bell, except that I'm not sure I really buy or believe anything at him, Gates says, And as someone who wears like their heart on their

sleeve and sometimes can't hide their own emotions. I can get that side of gaze, but you gotta be winning to be treating people this way and treating the media this way and allowing these clips to filter out and take over Twitter for five or six hours. Well, I know I'm not I'm not battling, but I'm saying, it's like it's it is it is. It's super toxic way

to kick off the off. It's such an easy way to avoid this and he has not yet learned how to avoid these types of do we think he's gonna learn this suddenly, But it feels like a people we've talked about as presscarfences in Miami. More importantly, in terms of treating people, it's it's how you're treating leviyan Bell. I mean lebian Bell is not it. He shouldn't be on the team. Lebian Bell does not have it. I mean, he had a million chances to have those those twenty

yard runs. He still has those great instincts where like it's in his body at the exploit, it's not there. I mean they should move on from Lavy in Bell that that is a separate issue. But when you're a player on the team who's friends with Lavy and Bell and like how he's approached things. Or if you're players who might want to join the team, you don't want to see your coach talking about you. Think there was a group text chain with some of the players, like

what the hell is wrong with this guy? Absolutely there, Robbie Anderson can't wait to get out of there. I mean there's like that's that is a issue with you building your team, and it's probably driving Joe Douglas nuts. Somebody can go pay that's fine, but it's another player that ends. But it's another player with a fracture relationship with the coach. It's just it's a little concern. I think he doesn't seem to be glowing calling at the big Chair Dan, and there's only thirty two of these.

It just surprises me as much as it surprised me that Freddie Kitchen's got a job in two thousand nineteen for the All Shucks kind of like good old boy persona has. You have to have communication skills, you have to have emotional stability, you have to have public relay sans to be an NFL head coach. And I don't know how Adam Gates got hired the first time, much less the second time with those issues. A lot of people say Peyton Manning, the power of Peyton Manning is

a big thing with his career. Anyway, before we go, we got we got an update, We got an update, another edition of keeping up. It sounds like Bengals tight end more read's bow wringer. He's staying in Cincinnati. He signed a reserve future contract with the Bengals on Monday. He spent the second consecutive season on the team's practice squad in the set to remain there for yet another season.

The German born, German born tight end um still looking to make his NFL debut since being drafted in the sixth round by the Minneso the Vikings in the twenty sixteen draft. Okay, if you're gonna go sixteen weeks only using fifty two your fifty three roster spots because you're carrying a j Green, the least thing you can do for Maritz is give up one of your you know, reserve contracts slots for the It's gonna he's gonna he's gonna write a beautiful ending to this story that loves

all the skeptics in this room. Wrong Mobile Nation was really excited about this news. I saw the mobile lies onto an actual I saw our friend right saw our friend, Henry Hodson driving into work, and he immediately stopped. He took out his phone. He showed me the news update and the excitement in his face. Mobio carries a lot of hopes and dreams, um not just in this country,

but especially in Germany. Well, Henry approved the Henry gets a seven point five percent cut of any money that mobile makes on the said practice squad and Roger Goodell's job. He's locked on the squad. He can't even be activated to the for a whole other year. No, no, no, no, it's future contract. Is just basically, you're signing squad this year.

He was. He was stuck on the because Henry is taking no no, I wish the best contract, like basically all the players that are invited to training camp and is on. He's on the ninety man roster and then they'll decide what I remember when Dion Lewis was playing really well for the Patriots, they signed him by way ever reserve future contract. It's just a way of adding practice. One guy. I wish him just simply the best. And that was another addition of keeping up with one of

the best additions. I thought it was mobile eyes ten pole moment for him. I gotta get going around. The NFL show reminder Friday, six pm Eastern, three pm Pacific on NFL Network. They actually gave us a show. They did not want to do this, but we just through the sheer power. And this is there's some unsolicited advice. We get this a lot, actually, people, How do you make it in the business? How do you how do

you build a career in sports? I will tell you one of the secrets, and I'm not even joking, and it carries on not just in sports, but in any realm or profession you choose. Just stay in the picture. Yep, it's good, Crank. Stay in the picture, and opportunities will

find you. Don't leave. Don't leave, don't say oh well, amount of time, because if you just stick around long enough, one day, they'll be executives walking around the building and they're like, wait, we need to fill that three o'clock slot. Is anyone around? And there we are. We were just sitting there that day. They tapped this on the Shoulder's exactly how would played out a guy shopping a giant cigar like a five pound man those guys around here

and say, hey, you whip a snap us. You got your own show six pm Eastern, three pm Pacific on the NFL Show. Also, yes, are Miami Improv Live show super Bowl week That's gonna be fun. The Thursday before the Super Bowl we'll have that live show. So check it out on Miami Improv dot com, slash events and get tickets and join us. It will be a lot of fun. We'll be back on Thursday with our wild Card weekend preview of four big games. Don't forget the big reveal at the end of this show. Yeah, I

have a less time for Erica tam Possey. No that we don't need a list. No, yeah, I have a list of like the nominees. It's like the list of The best point in the podcast is Greg letting me pick the best point of the podcast. I also thought the best point was me asking Mark about McDaniels to the Browns. Um. I also had a place at the time, but now I realized you just wanted to get a point that you could put on the list of points. Um.

But then I have two little sub things. That's Greg pointing out that Dan call to the NFL Network historian, which was like a way to brag by putting it on Dan, And then Dan brought it back and was like, oh, remember I was on the record for McCarthy, Like you kind of like did that? Did it bad? West said something about Nero. I wrote that down literally, something about Nero. Um, someone said something about Fitzpatrick's style. I mean, not points that we've made in the show. No, no, there, Okay.

So also on the best point in the podcast is when I thought to myself that since Cliff Kingsbury did like a pretty decent job as a head coach, that maybe that persuaded the league to like look more into college coaches, because we've been looking into more college coaches than ever before. On this you said that. No, I thought to myself as if this segment could have ended any other way, right, But it was a smart move wait by her to guarantee we never do the segment again.

It's gonna be a recurrent thing. And the winner, the winner of the winner of the best point of the podcast was Greg's throat noise. Okay, can we hear that? There? It is I'll never forget it. It's been a long is that he You knew it was bad when he started deflecting, He's like, what about what's the jacket and send a microphone. I'm talking my jacket in they were making fish noise. I was trying to get your attention. Got the creature of the black lagoon in the studio.

He's like, yeah, there's a lot of ambient noise in this studio. It's like it came from your throat. Poor Greg. We've all done it, but with these mics and these and these cans, it was picked up. It was it was aggressive. I don't even remember it. You have to go see a doctor immediately. I blacked out. If I ever, it would be painful. Let's go. We gotta get out of here. Please another New Horizon our first group trip to the hospital. Dan Hans is signing off for Quiet

Storm and go home. A mailman, the old Boss Whatt of Collywood behind the glass heill Thursday m