MNF Recap; Trade Tsunami Hits

intros we've had. Danny Tartible. You know, for most of our listeners who might not be familiar, uh A powerful, you know, somewhat memorable, you know, well known and popular, I would say, but not like one of the great uh sluggers in baseball from the eighties and nineties. I find it on because I'm on a text thread with a bunch of guy friends and Danny Tartible has been a source of jokes at least once or twice a week for twenty plus years. Good good numbers, but not

ultimately a winner. That that describes us pretty well, Actually like a Yankee. It was a Yankee. In fact, we the salary structure to don't hold anymore in the league, but about seven or eight years ago, uh, Mark, in our early days here at this company. Uh, five years twenty five million became kind of like a joke. Yeah, it was a cursed contract. If you signed a five for twenty five you would fail. Well, Danny Tard will sign a five for twenty five with the Yankees and

ninety two and failed. Neil o'donald. Neil o'donald and signed five for twenty five for the Jets in ninety six that also failed. Um, anyway, and if I had what five RBI seasons in his career and a cameo on Seinfeld. Yeah, the five of us, including Ricky are going to sign a five year, twenty five million at the NFL that will not fill as long as the money hits the checking account. I'm ready for that. Um alright, big show today. Uh. And by the way, this is purely and I'm just

being upfront with my colleagues and the listeners. This is a run out the clock situation today for the old zeuser after Monday night football. Don't really want to be here, but I mean we'll we sensed that total pro I'm here, uh out the clock situation after about a quarter it sure was. Um, so I'm not happy. I mean I sent my son to school yesterday morning in Sam Donald Jersey. It was it was my father, Keith's birthday. UM. I was looking forward to that game, as were many Jets fans.

So we'll get into all that. This is a run out the clock situation, all right. Coming up on today's show, Joe Thomas and Andrew Hawkins UH, former teammates on the Browns Good Buddies and now co host of the Tomahawk UH podcast The Tomahawks Show I should call it, which is on the Uninterrupted network, but you can get it wherever you get your podcasts. They will join us in a little home and home. Greg and Mark will do their show on Sunday and Joe and Andrew will be

on with us later on. That will be a fun convo. Also, Mark wrote a banger on his assistant Coach of the Year rankings. Will check in with that and see who's in the lead. I got a good feeling about might be wrong. We'll preview Thursday night football UM between the Redskins and Vikings. Will keep that one pretty quick. Two minutes drill, two minute drill on that one. We got some news to hit and including three trades. But before that, yes, it's a run out the clock Tuesday, So let's talk

about Monday night football. It takes the sound the Jets much for Brandy loves to throw the sack open touch out Patriots, but a beautiful throw TV twelve I could call places up here Bob soci and another guy for the Patriots radio network. From the first drive of the game, which I believe lasted about plays for eighty yards and

a touchdown. Through that Dorset touchdown, and then some more, the Patriots dominate the New York Jets start to finish thirty three zip the final a game in which um Tom Brady had all day to make decisions and did a lot of his thinking and dunking, and it worked quite well. But this story was the defense for the New England Patriots. Patriots which continues to play at a historic level. The Jets, obviously, as you can tell from

the final score, we're able to do nothing. In fact, they managed just a hundred and fifty four total yards on the game are average less than three yards per play, and Sam Donald suffered through the worst game of his life, levin for thirty two eighty six yards, no touchdowns, four interceptions, and a lost fumble passerrating of three points six So uh as one sided a football game as you'll ever

see on Sunday on Monday Night football. Uh, not a good look for the Jets and the PA or seven or I think Bill Belichick is loving coaching this defense, and I think that was maybe a little lost in the off season. They you know, they lose the defensive coaches. Maybe not the worst thing in the world that Bill Belichick has more hands on experience with this group. Sometimes he's calling the plays, maybe most of the time he's not, but he has a group of guys that have been

there for the most part. He had twenty guys played twenty plus snaps last night. I think that's I've mentioned this these stats like this pretty often, but they have such a deep roster that they can use for who they want on different plays. They all are so smart that they can execute any plan depending on the weekend.

And this plan, he had a lot of fun throwing these zero blitzes at Sam Donald, where if you've got Gilmore and the McCarthy brothers in the back, you can get wild and test the Jets offensive line, which has been banged up. Test Adam Gates and Sam Donald's ability. Uh,

to protect and they just had absolutely no answer. And I think if you're a That's fan, the biggest concern is that they didn't come up with answers during the game it got worse, and not that they gave up by any means, but they there was no fight to them. They sort of got knocked out early. Uh, and then they couldn't come up with any way to counter. Well, this Patriots defense is doing things we are unlikely to

ever see again. One touchdown allowed versus eighteen interceptions. Um, that's a a passer rating a thirty five point six. If you just throw the ball into the ground every time, it's a thirty nine passer rating. You're never gonna see a one to eighteen interception ratio over seven games span.

I don't care who's playing quarterback. It's been a bad schedule as far as the other teams the quality of play, But you have to go back many, many years to different eras of football to see a stretch like that. Are the last team over seven games span with a

one to eight teen TD the interception ratio. I just watched Belichick and feel like that there were added challenges coming into this season because they are you know on paper undermanned on the offensive line, they're undermanned at skill positions, the wide receiver position, the tight end position, post Gronkowski,

and on defense. It's not a ton of stars by NFL standards, but it is the perfect soup for Bill Belichick to put on a weekly masterclass, which is tiring too many viewers, except for the fact that I don't want to listen to the concept that they aren't playing real NFL teams because I don't. I think we're gonna find out two months from now. That doesn't matter. I have no issues thinking this team will go sixteen and oh, I don't care who you roll out there in front

of them. They're going to operate at a completely different level. And watching the Jets, Joe Douglas is a promising general manager. I just had to wonder what he was thinking on the Adam Gaze front. Is this the guy that you ride with Adam Gaze from now until the end? No final answers right now, but to your point, greg at Gaze was hired as an experienced head coach to do this, to come out of halftime encounter Bill Belichick and stop

some of the bleeding. Even with a lesser roster and from Adam Gaze's postgame pregame persona in general to how he's in game coaching, I'm I'm concerned. If I'm Joe Douglas, you should be. Everyone connected with the Jets should be concerned with how they came out, because the scariest thing, um, if you're following the Jets here is how great they looked um against the Cowboys, and how great Donald looked.

You can't hanging on all he's coming back from Mono and all that, because we saw last week that he was, in fact, he was named the a f C Offensive Player of the Week. And and yes there is the you know, big storyline that rippled through social media and became a huge story today that uh, he's miked up for sound Donald on the sideline and you hear him say to himself that he was seeing ghosts, which a nice, little unique twist is always a little extra twist the knife.

As a Jets fan, that becomes the dominant story around this game. It makes Darnald look weak um to a lot of people. And Steve Weisch, who's um a voice in this building that we all quite respect. He said it today on NFL network. That's gonna stick with Donald forever. Uh. And that's that was just the cherry on top of the game. Uh, from a Jet perspective. And I think for Donald coming out of this game as poorly as he played, and he played terribly, the decisions he was making,

it was like a different guy. I mean, I couldn't. I was watching the game in a state of shock with some some of the decisions he was making. He was clearly rattled, which he acknowledged. He handled himself well after the game. But this cover zero blitz, which Dani Rolovski at ESPN was saying this morning, is both historic and general general generational to him. He couldn't figure out

how to handle it. And it's a big test now for Donald going forward, because there is a fear that every Jets fan has, whether they're speaking or not, that this will be a turning point for Donald. And then when Donald does not make it, oh, the Patriots got the Jets again. It Never forget what happened in primetime when he saw ghosts. He needs to rise above it. I believe in him. I think he's a truly special town who had a dreadful night and he has to find his way out of it. It's a big challenge

for him. I'm not worried that he said he's seeing ghosts. If anything, that shows some self awareness. I think there's some some people who like a quarterback in that position, would be so shell shocked that they can't even be honest and communicate, you know, their weakness. That doesn't show any weakness, that's just being real. He just happened to have a microphone on him. But the concerning thing to me was the second half play, you know, the one

of the interception he threw in the end zone. He was protected well, you know, they picked up the blitz and he threw off his back foot, you know, sensing the pressure, and you saw a lot of that in the second half. Um where not that he was checked out, but they had won that game against him mentally because on the plays that they were protecting him, he was

still making really bad decisions. But you give credit, you know, a lot of the credit obviously goes to the game and plan that the Patriots in Belgick has that they've made bad offenses, and I guess the Jets. You know, in two of the three games Darnald has started, has been a bad offense. They've made bad offenses, look, you know, historically bad. I am curious to see now that they're going to face the part of the schedule that they

play some good offenses. I don't think it's gonna you know, continue at this rate, but there's still gonna be a load to deal with and still maybe the best thief. It bothers me that we need Donald to be a plug and play superstar already. I think there's some of this going on this season with Baker Mayfield when he struggles too, that we've forgotten that playing quarterback that you you know, we have other quarterbacks that are in their fourth and fifth season starting to show some of the

traits you want to see. And a lot of it is the overly long off season where expectations around a Sam Donald around at Baker Mayfield or Josh Allen or whoever. We want them to be completely prepared and ready to go, as you know Steve Young right now, and it's gonna take years. I I am I'm appalled at some of the overreaction to Donald's performance when he is essentially still playing his first season as a quarterback. The Rocky Mountains have weather swings of up to ninety degrees in a

single day. That's what you get with young quarterbacks. You know, you can look like the a f C player of the Week one week and then look like a guy who makes your fan base question him the next week. All all young quarterbacks sea ghosts, and a lot of

veteran quarterbacks sea ghosts. This thing's overblown, and it's because it's a fun like descriptive term that conjures up a striking image and really as the twin benefit of allowing the user to sound like a Ron Jaworski level quarterback expert at the same time throwing shade at your rival team for a quarter you know, just insinuating your quarterback might not have the if fact well, it's also just dominance you don't normally see at the NFL level. So

people are fascinated by that. They've they've gone forty six straight possessions without scoring on the Patriots. They didn't score on offense once in either of their two games against the Page Tree. It's so it's it's seen something you don't normally see at the NFL level. But they'll move on, like I don't expect this to leave the last. I mean, Belichick hates the Jets. I think as much as anything that exists on our planet. You're probably right about that.

Adam Gaze, for what it's worth, is furious that um Sam Donald's comment to himself was put on national television. Let's hear what Gates had to say during his Tuesday press conference. I know once a year, I have to do the same thing. I mean, it's just kind of

part of part of the deal. And you know, obviously obviously you know, you're never anticipating something like that happening, and the fact that it did just just gives us just gives us pause to to really cooperate anymore, because I mean, I don't I don't know how we can allow, you know, our our franchise quarterback to to be put out put out there like that. There's an understanding, uh, with these situations. He is the golden boy of the Jets organization. They give you access. The Jets give ESPN

and NFL films access to Donald. In return for that access, you need to make sure you don't do something that could haunt this kid for the rest of his career, which is what they did. And what seems what has the Jet so angry is that you can't point at ESPN and be angry and say how could you do this?

There is a process, and it was reported this morning that NFL Films is directly involved to the point where NFL Films is on site and they clear what goes to ESPN, and part of that job, I would imagine every week is filtering out things that could be harmful

to a player team. This gets through and again I even thought later as fascinating as it as it was, when you have Mike footage of Gaze and Donald face to face Gaze trying to talk his his young quarterback um into snapping out of it, I felt that to be incredibly intimate and overly intimate and invasive. What should have been a private moment between coach and player was blasted out because the game was a blowout and ESPN

needed something to juice it up. I understand why people want that kind of stuff, but when it's happening to your team or your organization, you understand why nobody's gonna want to do going forward, I think NFL Films and ESPN will rue the day that they handled this the way they did. I think there's probably regret. I also, I'm not worried about Sam Donald, like letting it bother him, like if that, if that, because it seemed like it

killed him. I mean, if it becomes something that like hurts his career, he wasn't the guy to begin with it doesn't. He just doesn't seem like that type of I think most of the people that get to the point that Sam Donald are not that type of guy. It's something that if you're Gaze or you're the Jets, you want to protect your guy. But ultimately, like he's a big boy, He's gonna handle a lot big, bigger problems than this, like the you know week on a

weekly basis. I'd argue that he put the Mono narrative, which was generating all sorts of giggles from a bunch of whitcrackers and hobby horses online to bed with the Cowboys game, right, But that's that's Donald's. Donald's attached. When you are a young quarterback and you get drafted by a franchise that has been a laughing stock, and there's four or five of these teams out there, and a lot of those holes were addressed last two drafts ago.

Donald's gonna have to be the mentally strong guy that puts up with the next thing that happens. And I totally see a guy in all of his media availability that it is not some drama queen that's gonna rise and fall with this. He's got a peer past it, and we are we live in a society right now that will completely Yes, it can stick to the Jets

because things do. It can be forgotten with three or four good games or a nice month by Donald because that's what he is, who cares about this moment with gaze In the end, He's not some hothouse flower bo nice night for my Stephan Gilmour for Defensive Player of the Year each week, stack them up. He probably doesn't even deserve it, but the narrative is starting to build at least that it makes sense because he's kind of

the representative of this second. You could argue, just say strongly for Jamie Collins or Devin mccordy or even Kyle van hupfull of votes for Kyl Vanoy and he's beating this team. I mean, you you get losses, we'll talk about it. In one second. You're gonna you know, we're gonna talk about the trade. This is the worst Patriots offense in more than a decade, and they showed it again. Let's get into that. Let's go move away from Monday Night Football, never to speak of it again, and do

some news. Alright, New England Patriots. You'll notice, yes, as Greg is alluding to, even in a Blood of the Jets, everything is dink and Duncan is not an explosive offense. And with Josh Gordon out, Uh, it wasn't gonna be a downfield attack, really, but they need somebody to stretch the field, which is not Mohammed Sanu. But he is a competent guy that's been in the league for a while that can make plays and is right in that Bill Belichick model right down to his Rutgers UH lineage.

So the Pats pull the trigger on a deal. They get some new from the Falcons in exchange for a second round pick. Rap Sheet reported Tuesday morning. Uh. New England had previously made a move for Senu during the twenty nineteen draft and Atlanta held off. Atlanta is now in the tank. Uh, they're looking forward. So they say goodbye to Sanu and we'll get into the value of the deal. Because I feel like the Falcons did a great job here. But let's start where you were heading.

Greg on what he does for the offense and a Patriots offense that needs help. He gives them some versatility. All I could think watching them the last few weeks is they are a Julian Edelman away from being a bad offense. Right now, they're okay. They're thirteenth in d v O A, they're twenty one in yards per play. You know, they did not they had involve fourteen different times. Last night they had three twenty yards. I mean, that's kind of what what I've expected. Everything is hard, everything

is a five yard game. They don't have good left tackle play. Hopefully they get Isaiah Win back. They don't have anything really down the field. Sanu gives them diversity. Mike Reaes pointed out how in the Giants game they ran the same personnel package the whole sete and half. Last night they only had two personnel packages. One of them had two undrafted rookies in it. Jacobe Myers is playing well, um, but you don't necessarily The other one

had two tight ends they signed that week. And that's it, And that's not takeing. I think Tom Brady looks pretty good overall because you're not taking advantage of what he does well, and that's putting a lot of different personnel groups out there and then him being able to pick the mismatch and beat you before the snap. When you're that limited and you have no versatility, you're not gonna do it. So Sinew adds another guy over the middle that they can use, and they might not be done yet.

This is the perfect NFL trade. I like it for both teams. It's a respective veteran with Super Bowl experience, a glue guy, a gadget play skill set which Josh McDaniels will fall in love with. Saves Bill Belichick from using that second round pick on a cornerback. It will sit the bench for two years and to get flipped to the Titans or Lines for a conditional seventh um. Josh McDaniels are probably taken for a Wildcats spin in

the next couple of weeks. Put those trick plays on ice until the divisional round where he picks up a key first down and then uh he'll collaborate with Edelman on a double throwback reverse flee flicker statue of liberty with a hook and ladder to a streaking Rex Burkhead for the game. When he scored to beat Aaron Rodgers in the Super Bowl, everybody's happy. But this is another

instance of a seller's market. Look at the Falcons once got Tony Gonzalez for the same price, right, and then he went onto four Pro Bowls, made the Hall of Fame. At Bill Belichick was using gunner coverage on him in the red zone. I've never thought the Patriots made any decisions based on that the end might be coming for Tom Brady until maybe this move. You know, just that hey, we really need something this year. We've got a chance this year. We only have so many years, and so

I think the value makes sense. They're gonna have some new uh next year as well, and so it's not just a one year move on a very cheap cond I think they just continue to pound away to position the needs help. You said that about acquiring Josh Gordon last year, that they're seeing the end of Tom Brady. I think it's a position group that New England's gonna

treat this process differently than other teams. It was a raging weakness that's on the edge of being one if they had more injuries, they continue to produce and they're slowly turning that position group into a strength go A healthy Gordon Edelman and Mohammed Sanu is an awesome wide receiver group. If they're all playing door and the fact that it's gonna be, they're gonna they I don't think they're going. But but who's there, Like, who's scaring them

in the a f C right now? Right now? AFC is a hot mess right now, right now, to me, it's not that important. But I think the Ravens, the Texans, and the Chiefs are all very scary long term that one or two of those teams their best they're gonna be.

But I I can I can already see it now that we're going to get a Baltimore, New England playoff matchup where Belichick is going to relish and totally thrive in the Concepts gonna erry the Ravens for one week and allowing seven points, like you know what, the different organization than any thirty one other organization. Absolutely, this is the best defense that they've had since one or oh three.

I'm not ready to put them above those groups at all, because I think you have to see them against better teams and aunt in the talents out there, but where we are going to see them. They do play the Ravens, Texans and Chiefs. Coming up, they play the the Eagles and the Cowboys. Those are their next games. So after the Browns game this week, which I also you know, think has its dangers to it, we'll talk about that.

Like I just think it. The Jaguars and the Cults can shut down the Texans, who are hot and cold, and when they're hot, they're hot. Yes, the Patriots can too. These challenging games that are coming up on the slate, there's no bigger challenge than trying to outdue Bill Belichick over the course of the three day preparation period. Another wide receiver trade to hit here. The Broncos are trading

wide receiver Emmanuel Sanders to the San Francisco forty Niners. Uh. The Niners are sending a third and a fourth round pick in the upcoming draft to Denver, who are also including a round pick with Sanders in the deal. Sanders, thirty two years old, came back from an achilles injury suffered just last December, but had a really nice year last year before going down and despite uh playing with Joe Flacco, which presents all sorts of challenges for a

wide receiver. He's been productive this season as well, not all pro productive, but still seems to have it. Uh So this seems to me Chris Westling like a nice pickup for the Niners. Yeah, still moving really well in and out of his breaks, being a little outproduced by Courton or a lot outproduced by Courtland Sutton. But he's also drawing more coverage than Courton Courtland Sutton, which may

explain some of those numbers. Nikki A Walla of The Athletic had an interview with Kyle Shanahan in December of last year, and he called Sanders one of the most underrated receivers in the league, a true number one since he's been in Denver, extremely quick, knows how to separate, can beat man coverage, and is fearless. He's been a big Emmanuel Sanders fan for a long time. They've they've been playing four to five wide receivers all about the

same amount of snaps. Donte Pettis, Diva, Samuel Kendrick, Borne, Goodwin. Now they've got on that they that they know they can count on each week and it didn't cost much at all. I saw some people like, oh, well, no, wonder the Eagles didn't trade for him. That was a heavy price. He would have gotten a compensatory third round pick back for them. Anyways, he might get that for

the forty Niners. They just traded what a fourth or a third in a move down from the fourth and a fifth, and you might get the compensatory pick back. They almost got him for nothing. I do wonder if this completely shuts the door on the Bengals moving AJ Green, because there were there were people linking the Niners with A J. Green, and you do you have to imagine because that front office in San Francisco goes for it.

They really wanted Odell Beckham in the off season, did they try and or the nine or the Bengals just saying we're not giving this guy away, even though we made probably no way on this past That trade will never happen. The Bengals will never do anything fun for the league. I believe CBS is J. J. Green, who is not going to be trade right. Locking for a saying it's not going to resign with him has not happening. That not going to trade him one years old, many

many foot problems over the last few years. His value will Probably he's never gonna be able to draw like a first or second again, probably, I don't know. He uh. He's also not going to resign with that team three months from now. He's also not returning until after the trade deadline, which I read that report as you know it's I know you've gotten on Jalen Ramsey a lot. I don't think it's that sort of situation. I think

Adrian Green is smart. He's not going to return from the injury until he's absolutely ready, and he's gonna see if he gets traded first. There's no reason to save yes for the for the Bags. It's so much like the Redskins refusing refusing to trade Trent Williams. Both players passed their primes. Neither one is gonna be on the

next good team for for that franchise. The NFC is so awesome with the forty Niners being kind of the new blood there that you can see six different teams going to the Super Bowl and the and the forty Niners and Cowboys are two of the ones near the top for me, and those are just like those well, yeah, the cost comes in the a f C, which has got a heaping um round of milk toast operations trying to make the playoffs. A third and fourth round pick

for centers. That's what I would have guessed if someone said, oh, most of New got traded to the Pats. That's why I just circling back there real quick that I thought that was a great trade Atlanta. He's essentially their third receiver and you get a second round pick, which is gold in the NFL. It's a good good trade for them too. It's gonna be the back end of the second round, at the very back end, but yeah, that's all right. I think it's a good trade for both.

I think it's fair alright. Another trade, garyon Conley, the Raiders cornerback, a first round pick in two thousand seventeen. He was the guy that got stretchered off in Week one with the neck injury, but was able to get back on the field. He is now a member of the Houston Texans. The Texans shift a round pick to the Raiders for the cornerback. Um. This is a deal that once again Mark shows Bill O'Brien going all in on his team right now, giving up that third round

are they acquired in the Clowney trade. They go get Connley, who has not played up to expectations, But O'Brien sees them as somebody who will upgrade their secondary now. Yet they lost Bradley Roby for you know, another month or so, if not a little bit less than that. Lonnie Johnson is the worst ranked player on their entire defense. According to PFF, they needed a lot of help in the secondary.

I wouldn't be surprised to see them make another deal for this, because I think you're right, Bill O'Brien is kind of in what I love, gigantic fu mode. You don't like the way that I'm running this team, I'm gonna keep doing it my way. And if we're okay with the bell with the Bill Belichicks of the world making NonStop moves. Maybe Bill O'Brien is not as crafty

a tradesman as Bill Belichick is. But I kind of think if you're a Texans fan, you can at least live in the comfort zone of knowing my team goes for it. We're not gonna sit on aging assets and not move them or not try to go get the guys that can improve, right away. Their offensive line is vastly improved because of that Huntled trade. So we're not gonna draft anyone in two thousand nineteen. Well, but more and more teams that we're calling out the wave of

the future, do it. We We crowned them with read it's different. Gary and Conley struggled. I mean Gary and Kindley with this was I'm not saying Gary and Conley's answer for it, No, I agree with that, but it was an emotional trade. Gary and Kindley had an awful Sunday and they traded him the day after. The Texans lost two different cornerbacks in the last two weeks to injury, Philip gaines On I R and and Roby Shirt. They need someone to play. You know what, that's code that's

code words again, Greg, what an emotional trade. That's a way of saying that O'Brien didn't think out. I'm talking about them, the Raiders, and that Conly had a terrible game and they traded him. I can buy it from the crewden Angle or he's like, you know, this guy's out the house. The reason I was gonna come to Bob's defense here, Bill O'Brien was he I'm giving him a little bit of the benefit of doubt because he's been pretty good the last few months. UH, crew and

I could totally traded clown Anie for Conley. Basically, he got a third round pick for Clowney and he treat used it for Conley. We knew in August they were desperate at running back. They were desperate on the offensive line, and they were desperate in the secondary. And they fixed running back an offensive line. They're still desperate in the secondary. This doesn't fix anything, I don't believe, all right. Finally in the news, the Super Bowl cramper black of Baper

old Man Willie Yes. One of the indelible images in the history of UH the NFL, shot by NFL film cinematographer cinematographer Ernie Earns was Willie Brown. UH. It's in Super Bowl leven with the pick six that clinched the raiders first ever Super Bowl title. John Madden on the sideline, Hal Davis uh the king of the world at that time, and and Willie Brown passed away on Tuesday at the age of seventy eight. Um had a great career over

sixteen seasons. One of the great ball Hawks, he was known as the godfather of the bump and run UH played twelve of his sixteen seasons with the Raiders. UH. Nine time Pro Bowler, five time All Pro UH, Hall of Fame in shrine e and uh Wes. You will not hear anyone say a bad thing about Brown, who stayed connected to the football and the Raiders for his entire life. UH. And he is one of those guys if you grew up um a little bit got you know,

guys a little older than us. If you and women and women, if you grew up watching the NFL and watching NFL films, Willie Brown and those Raiders teams, UH, they stick with you. He had such a long story career, the best cornerback in a f L history. And then when the merger happens and John Madden's there, he's in Oakland for the entire John Madden era uh, in which the Raiders, Steelers, and Dolphins ruled the a f C.

And he's on that franchise as Mount Rushmore. I think I like growing into a football fan around age eleven twelve in my case, some kids, you know, we have kids that are watching football up more than I was when I was young because of the of the place that we work, and I always wonder what they're gonna think and remember about the stars of today. You've got another couple of years with Tom Brady. Some of these guys that you were watching clips of who are already

essentially out of the league. They know who Joe Montana is by name, But Willie Brown was someone that growing up. When I started to dig into the history of all these teams and read about the these weird seasons from the sixties and seventies, Willie Brown's name on highlights two would come up over and over and over. And it's almost just because of our age that we don't really remember him in the flesh. Is one of the biggest NFL stars around. Yeah, he's He's Inner Circle Hall of Fame.

They should create that, and you know he would. He would be up there of the top five or six cornerbacks. He has five first team out pros and a couple more our uh second team All Pros. That that is special stuff. He also had a four interception game against the New York Jets. So talk about your pain rankings. Even back back in the sixties, Old Dick Wood and Mike Talia Faroh, We're intercepted four times while Brown was a member of the Broncos. Greg had to dig deep

for that painful to not necessary. Today, West a little impromptu game of win West's toaster in a big spot Willie Brown, like I said. Cinematographer Ernie Earns for NFL Films captures the runback. It's super slow motion, one of the great images. Pick six, Super Bowl eleven, go through the pass super Bowl eleven. I don't know Red targeted alright right now with my sons are obsessed with Rocky right now, right now, you haven't gotten the eye of

the tiger back. You need Apollo to come and say, come on, man, you're blowing it and you need to start running on the beach together. Well, I'm as rusty as Melvin Gordon, so you'll have to. Yeah. The toaster also still belongs to Dave Damnaschek. Alright, Yes, Willie Brown passes away at the age of al right, that's what's happening in the news. All right. We teased it at the beginning of the show, and now here it is. We're very excited to say it's a crossover here a

home and home if you will. Yes, the Great Andrew Hawkins and Joe Thomas from the Tomahawks Show from the Uninterrupted World. Welcome to the Around the NFL podcast. Boys, Well, thank you for having us guys. Quite the honor here. This is this is gonna take a little bit of time for us to get get the rhythm down. We're in like seven different locations doing this podcast, but it is long overdue. We've got to set this up so many times though. It's a pleasure to finally be here

on the Ronnie Nifoh. Yeah. Your producer, of course is Head, who once upon a time produced our show here at NFL Media as his um profiles grown across the country. Um, and I did mention Uninterrupted. I just want to start here. When when you guys come to that company, Is there a sit down with Lebron where you you pitched the show? Do you get Have you had any deep conversations with Mr James? Yeah, it was like a recruiting process, so

you know, we had official visit. Lebron bought us the hummer um just to get everything kicked off, and from there we had a big bag of cash that he dropped off at Joe's house and Wis constant that was used to class um as a top recruit, though, and

here we are, man, it's been blissed ever since. He actually came to my mom's house and he sat down on the couch and he explained why un interrupted was the right choice, and I said, well, you know what you gotta do, Mr Lebron, You gotta show us the money. We don't go anything anywhere for free. This brings back memories of the film Blue Chips starring Nick Nulty, and exactly all right, Oh, you guys, your show is like

our show. You talk about football, you talk about the Browns probably more than you should, and you do it with a little bit of mirth. So why don't we Why don't we get into some discussion and West, do you want to get us going here on some football talk the Cleveland Browns? I do because I have questions

in need of answers. We we really thought this Brown's offense was gonna be dynamic, you know, with Odell Beckham providing that spacing banker making his offensive line look better last year, throwing receivers open, and they've kind of been the opposite of that against a pretty tough schedule. Do you guys see this as an offense. That's fixable the rest of the way. I was gonna say, if you could just direct the question that one of us, though, and it looks like you're looking at both of us.

So yeah, So to answer your question, Um, I think we all thought the Browns offense was gonna be a lot different than what we saw in the first part of the season. But I think when you added O'Dell, you added such a deep threat, which was kind of missing last year. And I think they really thought early on in the season, Okay, we need to push the

ball down the field. We need to get the ball in Odell's hands, and so they were scripting a lot of plays trying to move the ball down the field with deep throws, and I think that kind of disrupted the rhythm a little bit, and Baker got out of that rhythm that he was in towards the end of last year, doing a lot of the r P O s and the quick passes and getting the running game going. Um, And I think it led to some inconsistency, and that

was pretty much throughout the entire offense. You saw a lot of inconsistency, and it was only the games that they were able to really efficiently run the football that Baker was able to kind of get into a rhythm. And I think they've done some scout self scouting in the bye week, and I think we're gonna see a lot different offense coming out of the bye week going into New England next week, and you're gonna see a

renewed focus on a lot of those quick passes. Hawk talked about it a ton on our podcast, like, let's get some of those easy completions, let's get some slants, let's get some sticks, Let's get some of those easy routes and put the ball in the playmaker's hands on the edge. Give Baker those high completion percentage throws and run the football, and then the deep shots they'll be there.

They'll open up those. The defense can't cover everything. They can't take away you run game, you're short passing and your deep stuff. So let the deep stuff happen within the flow of the offense. Get Baker in that running game going, and I think that's what we'll see in the next half of the season. If you're a team and you know that next up, we've got the Patriots and they've been the same team essentially in terms of being an imposing opponent for like seventeen decades in a row.

If you're the Browns or you're a team that's struggling to find yourself, do you look at the matchup with Bill Belichick as a player and just say sometimes, and I'm not talking about Freddie Kitchens, but maybe you've been on a couple of Browns teams that had some suspect coaching going on. Our guys simply cannot match up with Bill Belichick. How do we stand a chance in this game? Or do you have to put put the horse blinders on and just say we do have a chance. How

real How realism? Where does realism play when you deal with New England. I think that no matter what in the NFL, you always do have a dance. I mean, and I know that the cliche we always say, but it's through I mean, everybody getting paid, everyone's under contract. And for Bill Belicheck, the thing it becomes is more of like the coaches. The coaches have to feel like they have a dance. The browser talents. I know, the offense hasn't looked great, No, the team has not looked incredible,

but they have talent. Their problem is they haven't found that cohesion as an offense. As a team, they haven't established their strategy. It just seems like they're just throwing plays out there like they're playing Madden and you can't

do that against the New England Patriots and win. So if they can come out and say, hey, here's what we do best, here's the place we're gonna start and call instead of these plays, understanding what the the Patriots are gonna give us and understanding what the Patriots are gonna take away, then I think it gives them a chance because man for man, the Browns are still a very, very talented football team and if everybody comes to their

a game, they will have a fighting stamp. Joe, you were there obviously forever um and in the back half of your career especially, there was so much churn at the head coach spot, and I would wonder how much that begins to um press on a team. Now. I know when Dorsey's there, it feels like a different vibe

around there. But they're coming out of the by If things don't work out against New England and the seasons really starts to spiral, does that in fact the clubhouse at a certain point the locker room once the speculation in the media starts ramping up. When whenever there's speculation in the media about the job status of the head coach, it puts a lot of pressure and stress inside that locker room because then you don't really know who to

align yourself with. Right is are you gonna align yourself with the management that's gonna still be there, or are you gonna try to buddy up with the head coach and really defend him in the media. And so I think that puts the players in a difficult perspective or difficult situation. But I don't think that's gonna be the situation here. You know, John Dorsey, he hand picked Baker Mayfield. That was the biggest decision he had to make so

far since he was a GM. But the second biggest decision he had was who should he make the head coach, And he went out on a limb by hiring Freddie Kitchens and making him the head coach, even though Freddie had no head coaching experience, and so to be able to take that type of risk, I think he's got a lot invested in Freddie and he wants to see this thing through. I think he understands that there's gonna be some growing pains when you're dealing with a rookie

head coach. And I think they're they've built up enough capital with the good things that John Dorsey has done since he's been there, that they're gonna be able to fend off any speculation or rumors that will swirl in the media about the status of Freddie Kitchens. And I think for the most part, people are gonna believe John Dorsey when he says, you know what, Freddie Kitchen is

my guy. I still believe in him. I like the things he's doing, and I think for the most part that should shut down any rumors or anything that could swirl around Freddy Kitchen's job status, because I truly believe from the Hasms to John Dorsey, they want this to be a long term thing with Freddie Kitchens, and they don't want to be pulling the trigger after one season like they've done with Rob Chazinski and when he was the head coach a few years ago, and with some

of these other coaches that they've got rid of quickly. They want to be the stable franchise like the Pittsburgh Steelers are as two of the great Cleveland Browns of all time. I mean, they're you still like communicating with with the team and the coaches. A lot of feelers out there. You're hearing from them, Sparrows Hawk. When are they entire in your number? By the way, I'm waiting to get into the ring of honor. Um, you know, I'm I'm the most efficient receiver they've had there, they've

come back that that's that's that alone. I'm anything, I guess, right, yeah, so that's a big deal. I'm also the shortest receiver they've had. The list goes. I want to know, guys, Um, Joe is the expert on getting coaches fired. But I'm glad you asked you that question because he's an expert on getting coaches fired. For Freddy Kitchens, he was really in a no win situation, right, Like, he comes in

with the team with all this hype. Either A they are good and they say, well, yeah, that's because the roster is still good, or be they don't play well and it's oh, he's a rookie head coach. He doesn't have enough experience. So I actually think for Freddy Kitten's career, this was the best case scenario because now that we see that, oh, this is gonna be harder than everyone suspect.

If he can turn it around, it will actually show what coach he is in the kind of job that he's done there and not that it's just he had the best players. Oh, it was an easy button for him. And it says right there on the Tomahawks show of course, Joe Thomas, uh and and Andrew Hawkins, it says right there that ten Pro Bowl bids between you, uh we uh, we've done our part for sure. And to obscure movie cameos, but those are none on the Thomas side. No, He's

has a he has a space for podcasting. So I I think, uh, in front of the camera for the most part, what we're what are your movie? I was actually in IDEs of mart This is like when I was in the CFOW was in Cincinnati and someone walked into a coffee shop and they're like, hey, you want to be in a movie. I'm like, sure, that's how you're gonna You're gonna play political intern number two. And there was actually a scene in the movie that I'm only I'm in there for like a split second where

I'm just walking by at the beginning. But the one thing that I filmed, I was right in between George Clooney and Ryan Gosling as they were in this heated argument, and I was so excited because I was like holding the coffee and he yells at me during the scene and I like rush off, and I'm like, oh, I'm about to be a movie star. And of course it didn't make the film, and there's no like deleted themes on the DVD, so that the complete made up story

to anybody at TALL. I know that Cluney and Gosling are still talking about that encounter with you and upset also that it it hit the Joe. You're you're a member of the NFL network family. Um uh, we We're gonna ask you about Colleen Wolf in a moment because we're wondering where she's at head wise, as her career is kind of risen beyond us. But I also I know you you spent a lot of time obviously in Wisconsin, not too much time in l A. Um, have you

been to J. J. Watts's log cabin yet? I you know that feels like the number one location that every male needs to get to before he dies. Actually, how I was able to lose my weight and get my current physique. I spent a lot of time at J J. Watts. Happened in The great news is It's only a few

minute drive from Chicago. So when I'm out of town, i can just fly right into Chicago, drive the five or six minutes out of downtown, and there's the log cabin on thirty five and acres in the middle of the city, and I'm able to get a great workout in no matter where I am in the city. I heard I heard any bulldozed an orphanage to build it, So it wasn't technically an orphanage. It was more of like a group home. But you know, you know affected, But no Colleen, she you know Colleen. We love her.

She's one of our closest uh friends here at NFL Media and before she became the big TV star, she used to be on the podcast a lot. She still is. But do you reluctantly do you feel that that that that star power. Have you felt that around you and whether that's changed her as a personality. Yeah, I'll fire off with a serious note for one second. Colleen Wolf has been an absolute joy to work with. Last year,

I didn't know what I was doing whatsoever. I still don't know what I'm doing in media, but I know a little bit more. And I jumped on Thursday Night Football and she was the host, and I was like star struck right off the bat. But she was so warm and welcoming and inviting and so helpful that uh it really it meant a lot to me. And so she's the true star of Thursday Night Football and I

just feel blessed to be able to work with her. However, we can still tease her a little bit because after the show last week, me, Andrew Siciliano, Steve Smith, Colleen and then one of Andrew's friends tried to go to the local bar right right down the street from the hotel after the game to grab a beer and have some corn hole, share some stories, break some bread, and we got turned away by the bouncer at the door.

We did not have enough star power to be able to get it to a half empty bar in Denver on a Thursday night. You got hit the big tim I know, me and Steve Smith were easy to turn away, but Andrew, Siciliana and Colleen, well, if they got to be able to get into the best night clubs in Manhattan didn't happen. Then, Wow, Steve Smith was turned away by a bouncer, had that go. It was actually cool about It was like, all right, we don't have to come here, We're gonna go somewhere else. Good for him.

Bad bouncer work, though, colleens a triple threat. You know, a host of podcaster Joe. What do you think about the fact that Andrew is now breaking into the host moll that we do a show together game debut. There's a lot of crossover here between our podcast that and yours, and now he's going like Frank Gifford. You don't see a lot of former players that are also the hosts of the show, you know, kind of outshining knew Joe. What do you think it is tough to work with Andrew?

He has clearly left me at the laundromat in my media career because he is on a trajectory to the moon and back. He's the next pet sam Roll. I told him he's gonna be doing like somebody that's actually talented some someday and I'll just be telling my kids, my grandkids that I knew him at one point. There's almost just used Joe to catapult my media career lawlessly. He picked the wrong guy. He should have picked Lebron, the guy that's got the office right next to him.

He could have used him, and he would have already be way above the Tomahawks Show. I feel like there's too much crossover going on right now. It's like in Ghostbuster they say, don't cross the streams. That could send us into another dimension. If we do one more crossover, like a West Joe Thomas offensive line breakdown, that that feels like that could be the final piece that we

all just disappear into nothing. I usually Andrew calls me about thirty at night when he's really tired but he can't sleep, and he says, hey, give me that extra breakdown of the old line play from that game this morning. He doesn't really having a hard time sleeping, So we always avoid old line talk like the plague on this show. A right, the Tomahawks Show, and this is a home and home facilitated by TV. One of the great pickup

basketball players in the history of Los Angeles. Never scored over here, never that his name here, never scored a TV ever scored up Actually, I thought that was his name when I first met him, called him never scored him and I was like, how do you spell that? Never? Or is it any v are CD still catching it? Um? On Sunday, Greg Rosenthal and Mark Sessler will be guests

on the Tomahawks Show. So I don't know where that leaves West and I but whatever, I'll bury that and it will come out to a psychiatrist at something actually requested. We requested all four and they were like, well, you don't need these two. They're not that show. We were like, okay, I guess Erica, that ain't right. Um, but yeah, check out the tom Show all the time, but especially if you're if you want to try it for the first time, you're gonna have two of the heroes on their week

eight recap program. And gentlemen like we said this, this does feel right because you guys talk football, you talk ball. You're mixing some pop culture and just a touch of the mirth and and that's why we're all brothers and uh and and we fly together. We're doing a live show before we go. You guys just did a live show in London that was an absolute smashing success. Yeah. Yeah, we're doing in a live show Hall of Hall of Fame weekend. It's not really Hall of Fame weekend, but

it is a awsome blues in Cleveland. The game is Thursday Night football versus the Pittsburgh Steelers Wednesday Night Tomahawks Show. Can you give us any tips before our first live show? West? Drugs helped? Drugs help? Definitely? Yeah. I always. I always just telling myself, I'm walking into my favorite bar and everyone there loves me. Because the crowd is stacked in your favorite They're gonna love you. They're gonna love all

your jokes right away. It's a canny bail situation. Yeah, show, Thomas Andrew Hawkins are gonna play well to a Cleveland centric crowd. You got that right out of the gate. But yeah, it was modern part. I would say, yeah, shot a towar it all for each just just to keep it all. It's goood with funny because this will be the first Cleveland crowd that we've done together. It actually does love us because on Sundays that was not

the case situation. Alright, man, thank you so much for joining us, and again, check out the Tomahawk Show every week. It's a banger every time out. Thank you. Guys. Thanks guys, you guys, thank you all right, that was great. Enjoyed it. Like those guys, I think we could be friends with him. I think we could have beers with them. I think we should get a condo together, mate. And we don't all live in the condo at the same time, but we have like a set schedule where we always, um,

you know, oh, this week it's Andrew and West. Next week it's Joe and Mark. Oh, look it's it's a Dan and Joe week. Greg Oh. Greg. Greg says he wants the condo to himself. No, that's that's that's fine. But then we'll have parties and we'll all be at

the condo together. I don't I find myself. I find myself in a little bit of a little Debbie scenario where the three of you, I think, are having a very productive conversation with Hawk and Joe Thomas, and I'm still sitting there with the Browns fan of me being like, what am I doing talking to Joe Thomas because he is as totally love bull a bowl professional, and every time we've went with them, it's like, this guy's how

I feel. That's how I feel with Hawk. I was such a big fan of the reality show Fourth and Long hosted by Michael You mentioned where Hawk made his name. I think that every time people should check out game debut, by the way, every Saturday on NFL Network, me Hawk and Cynthia Freeland making picks twice twice on Saturday. It's a good plug and that in the Fourth and Long show. No one has been a bigger fan of the Fourth and Long program. I'm telling you, well, here's the thing.

No one remembers it. I know one remembers it except Greg. No, here's the thing. No one watched it at the time. No one else watched it except I'm not bragging, but I don't know. It's sort of like it was like on a terrible network. It was what net work was it on that doesn't exist or something? Yeah, it was Spies first, it was Spike. It was. It was a delightful show. Can we start every every episode? Now? Rest fine,

I've moved on. I do like the small you know, it's also nice to have an NFL player that we work with that's my size, at least certainly not in terms of like you know, fit Mass got breaking news only six times faster than you nes Chris West. I love when West of It delivers it. You know it's gonna be good. Well, it's major injury news for the Detroit Lines. Bad bad news. Uh. Carrie On Johnson had to go on I R with a knee injury that he suffered in week seven. That's not good. He injured it, Yes,

he injured it. Uh this past Sunday and he showed him on the sidelines of the pants up with the brace on, trying to walk it off. Had a heavy limp, and you had a bad feeling about it. But I R is a surprise. They've got fellow, They've got rookie Ty Johnson j D. McKissick, who's more of a gadget player. And I believe they claimed Paul Perkins off waivers from the Giants. But very suspect depth there at that C. J. Anderson,

I can't even get a sniff out. Everyone says, you know, running backs are important until you lose carry On Johnson And now they're running game is not going to be relins trouble. You know in the movie where like there's the midway point where it's like a cast of adventurers have to say say goodbye to someone that's sort of sacrificing themselves in a heated moment against some sort of

mythical beast. I like, we're quietly, uh, moving away from the Detroit Lions who've been left underneath the big boulder and are not going to be advancing with us on to the next stage. Schu The next couple of weeks, tried, we tried, well, we brought them along on the journey. You know what, the schedule softens up, get a couple of dubs in here. We're not out, We're just we're we're attuned to the reality situation that they've lost three in a row and now one of their most important

players on offense. Right, We're not We're not um, you know, pointing fun at them or giggling at the whole situation. We don't. We don't approve of it, but it's the reality. I'll always look fondly on that late September early October time, and the Lions were salad days alright. Mark wrote a bunk, absolute banger. I mean, I'll read the headline and you tell me if you think it's a banger. Assistant Coach of the Year question Mark Robert Sala tops competitive field.

Now I got a little business like in the back end of the headline. I'd like to keep it saucy all the way through. How about how about Colon, you know, assistant Coach of the Year Robert Why the question? I think the question is asking, like, did someone actually pen an article about assistant Coach of the year. They're still processing that as content providers. I think so is this is this essentially in the slot reserve for What's grinding My gears? With Mark Sessler? It is? And like, this

is something that I do care about. I do care about this topic. That was that his week column? Is that what's grinding my gear to? That was the old westling? Uh? That wasn't old grind gear? Like, when Dan is going to present anything that I do here, I just have to, you know, kind of shoulder the concept that he's not read it, does not care about it, and only cares about it. Well, that's true. I I am not reading

anything about the NFL today. And I told you it's a run up, which is the same thing that happened when I wrote My Brown's long form. It happened after it came out the day after a Jets loss. And you refuse to read that and still have not. So I enjoyed that piece. Question will at some point run out of excuses. I read that piece and enjoyed it. All. Right, here we go, let's all right, here we go. Let's get to it. Robert sala I don't want to. I want to save it because he's at the headline. You

can figure it out. But let's start in the back end. Um, you got some honorable mentions. Eric Washington's getting votes. Yeah, I don't even know if we need to dig into that crew. But north Turner is getting some poppy even but you got I got some questions. Okay, why don't I'm gonna turn it over to Chris Wesley. Why don't you like offense? Alright? Groman has like turned the Ravens

offense into that thing for the first time. If More has the number one d v oh A in the nf O, I would argue that you want Here's what I would argue, back it up. This is all these awards are optics and perception based. And but you're the one writing the argument. You're doing you can make your own No, no, I'm are I'm arguing who who is going to win it? I think is it a real award? I'm not even I'm not joking here. Yes, Actually, we've been discussing it for half a decade. I thought it

was kind of like your award. Now. They started, they started five and there was the way dismissed. There was the one year where Scarneckia got some serious votes, but he did not win it. And four of the five winners have gone on to become head coaches. I really right, And he's the one who is the reigning assistant coach of the Year. It is Vic Fangio. Okay. West West says that because on Mark's list, the top four options right now, the leaders in the clubhouse um and five

of seven are all defensive minded. I think for me it's because of the which it's a shorter sample size. The Niners defense, the Bill's defense, the Saints defense has been more consistent, I believe than the Cowboys offense. The Cowboys offense ten weeks from now, Kellen Moore is the perfect guy to win this award, and after three weeks I mentioned would have wanted going away. I think that he's got competition, But I I hear your point on

Greg Roman. For me, with Greg Roman, I would want to just see where they are a couple months from now, but he's done it so far. I agree, and that's why he's on the list. He's on the list. He would be in my top two. Petton has been good, but he's you know, their defense been a little up about the fact that the Ravens have a top five five offense running it in a different way than basically

any offense. And and maybe Roman doesn't get credit for Lamar Jackson just scrambling because that's the last couple of weeks. It hasn't all been called runs. It's credit for for doing something that no one else is doing. And there really no one else has ever done about that fourth and two call that swung that game a brilliant call.

Leslie Fraser is an interesting one because I think he gets forgotten because his head coach feels like the yeah, well, I mentioned that that that's it's tough to win those awards when people are wondering whether it's McDermott or Fraser, because it is McDermott. I think, ultimately right, it is his defense and and Fraser and him make a great pairing.

You got Dennis Allen, who's done wonders with the Saints. Um, this would be a sweep, I think for the Saints because it feels to me and less Frank Wright goes and gets it. The Coach of the which is basic. If you tracking Coach of the year, screw you. It's about assistant coach. And you think that Peyton's gonna win Coach of the Year. Probably now is Dennis Is he gonna swoop in where we are now Dennis Alan swoops and grabs assistant Coach of the Year. That tells you

a lot about why the Saints are so successful. Great staff. I'd be stunned if the Academy went with coach and Assistant Coach of the Year a coy a k a a coy Assistant Coach of the Year, if they if they gave that to the same team, because I am cynical enough just to not to believe in how a lot of these awards work, that that's not what they do. They're going to find a way to give a little

piece of the pies to some different storylines. Well, you got Allan at number two right now, and you do have Robert Salat would need to be kidnapped by you know, an angry band of Taiwanese. Uh, you know, terrorists to to not win this thing at this point. I mean he could take them out. That sounds like John Wick. You know, it sounds like an action movie. Would be a good action movie. I mean I kind of the way.

I like the way the second one you saw. I don't think that's how it is done to the taiwan Well, here's the thing. That's that's a question to Mark, as you often say, and you said it earlier, this could be narrative based, although you would think Assistant Coach of the Year is underground enough where it would be maybe more pure than the m v P, which is a bit of a soap opera. You you you love getting

to the narrative. But what are the terrible award picks that have been narrative based over the last few year. Come Back Player of the Year. I am okay, I think what they do a lot of times though m VP an Offensive Player of the Year to me feels like Best Picture, Best Director, where they find a way to give a little bit of everyone. Offensive Player of the Year is a joke. Why I have that award? That's the that's to Mark's point, I still understand what

it means or how it's figured out. What we're talking about that a man of of of character. I don't even vote for Offensive Player of the Year when they do that little NFL dot com writer things, I refuse you sleep. And I used to say that. I used to make a little point about how the awards stupid, and they published that once, but then they just stopped to stop. So salah um to the point of the narrative base that was when we were in London. Um, who were they facing that week? It was the Ramsay.

You kind of need that big national moment to get on everyone's radar, and I think that has helped him a lot. And the fact that the Niners are I think that's a lot of it because the voters are not watching every one of these games. And let's be honest, like coordinator level coaching, we hear from these guys for fifteen minutes a week, and the idea that we know what a coordinator is doing from team A to team B two team C is is ridiculous. It's an ultra mystery.

So it's all uh, image based, it's all ego. It's just like everything we do all the week long. Yes, you could extend that to every bit of NFL an right back to back primetime games for them in Week nine and ten. I can already see it. We're in uh Fort Lauderdale in February. Forty Niners are there and everyone's crowding around Salah in the crowd at media day because he's already Everyone knows who's already accepted that the

Falcons job or some other job. You can't exactly talk about it yet because they can't announce it, but he's a big Stan. A year ago, his defense recorded an NFL low historical low seven takeaways. So you know, hopefully we all can come back the X and theo's. It's it's not the exes and the os, it's the Jimmy's and the joe like that. And you want to talk about a clean sweep of the awards, I was gonna

say solo maybe best bod of assistant coaches. Remember a guy named Dan Campbell, once upon a time the interim head coach of the Dolphins. Well he's now the tight ends coach of the New Orleans Saints. They can sweep the entire awards, including Hottest Body. I wouldn't say they're tight ends are killing it. No hottest body, Well what about I didn't notice you didn't mention, uh, Steve Belichick

or anyone from this you know, historic Patriots defense? Explained to me what I don't know who says it has to be a coordinator. They've got like three they've only had three coaches. Two of them are named Belichick, one of them in charge of the secondary. They're the ones with the eighteen interceptions? Oh do you? Was he? What

was really funny? You go down memory lane this summer when Greg was trying to figure out things to be nervous about the Patriots, and he kept on going on to their homepage and be like, look, they don't have any assistant coaches under on tracked because there was only four or five head shots still that when you were talking about that, one of them is Brett Bielima. Remember when you thought that was something to be concerned about. It was partly a bit that was Patriots dot com.

There's only one picture that panned out to be an extreme crisis for the I now do support a future where it's just Steve and Bill Belichick, McDaniels and Scarnecki, a four man coaching staff cut out the fact. Let's keep Mayo because he's a he's a patriot, you know, Hall of Famer. Alright, one more quick game of when West's Toaster before we get to Thursday Night Football, Chris Dan Willie Brown, Rest in Peace is iconic? Pick six return?

You're really putting a lot of sticks? Slow motion shot, Yeah, running towards the end zone for the clinching score. Who was the NFL film cinematographer, a photographer behind that show? You should know this. I would say Steve Stable. On a broader scale, yes, but no, the exact I've mentioned his name twice at today's show. Oh, Ernie Earnest, that's correct, the toaster back, big ern I can't if you remember that? Alright? How many? How many guys are named Ernie Earnst? All right,

let's get to it. The Washington Redskins at the Minnesota Vikings slaughter Um on Thursday Night Football. The Skins one of the only winless teams left in the league. In fact, no do they win. It counts if he beat they they beat the Dolphin. My people's minds, really, but my mind. Apologies to the Redskins. They do have one win, but they got shut out um at home on Sunday. But you know they're playing a pig slop against the Niners,

so we won't go too crazy about that. But they are a bad football team and they head to Minnesota place where um U s Bank Stadium, where the Vikings are gonna lose against the good a good team, so against a bad team. So West, when we checked the boxes when Will kirk Cousins struggles, well we almost hit it here because you got primetime game. Um, you've got a lot of people watching. But what you don't have as an opponent that's gonna give him trouble that he

should keep rolling here? Right, Yeah, this checks all of the boxes. And I can't even envision a scenario where the Redskins win this game. I know Dick Greg likes to say that any team can beat any other team, but the Vikings are set earlier on the show. But the Vikings are so much better than the Redskins, and they are so much better at home than they are

on the road. I love the way their defense is playing Eric Kendricks in particular, but their offense, Dan you said before the season, top five offense, their top five and d v O a bang. Well. Two things stand out to me in this game. Number One, everyone should listen to what Mark said. Uh, that game is a delight to watch on game Pass. They were loving on this up. It's fun. You know, it's a little weird. The Redskins didn't allow Case get him to throw until

they were down nine. Nothing with him. He couldn't, but I guess he couldn't. But the beggar story is Cousins throwing dimes. He's had some throws in the last couple of weeks that were amazing. I mean that first touchdown that got Theeland hurt was an amazing throw, moving to his left, throwing to his right. The throw that basically ended the game against the Eagles where he's getting pushed out of bounds was an incredible throw. Cousins is feeling it, yeah,

I mean, it's it's revenge game. They have a plan on offense. Now. I love that they were able to look at look in the mirror and change the way that they're attacking teams with their offense, and it's it's covered a lot of sins. There was a lot of grumbling in there. The Redskins, to me, like that Niners game or really any game on offense, they seem scared of their own personnel. They seem ultra conservative because they

lack a plan. And there's no way that you can really imagine the Redskins attacking a team unless that other team his injury riddled to the core. And I this this Dan, we have to cover this as a what will amount to a separate breakout pod on Thursday night. We're going to be digging deep. Like you got Peterson in Minnesota, who's running pretty well. West's boy ultimately still juicy little yeah, right, he's got a high. He says

he's now feeling that he can play. He wants cousins against Walter Payton touched him for him, Yes you want that's about case Keenum against the Vikings. Oh this game. He swatted that down. He said he's played for so many teams at this point. Then every week he brought the Vikings two years ago too. He could say that, yeah, I got hurted, but it's fine, but I don't. I mean, it's if that's that's the benchmark for revenge and revenge.

But that was hopefully, you know, he has other great moments, but him getting to the NFC championship, but that that was a pretty great case. And then they ship him off and they take the high you know, the young want to be treated. We'll get two quarters of Dwayne Haskins in this game. I think this is an unpopular hot take, but it does. Nobody wants to say it, but this is checking all the boxes that the Redskins

already know they have a bust in Dwayne Haskins. The fact that he's not playing right now, this doesn't happen anymore. There's no such thing as putting your quarterback in mothballs. When you pick him in the first round and there's no one else in front of him, that's that can play a damn I mean you could. That's that's assuming that they're that your first year of your career is instructive for the rest, which I'm not. I'm not saying

he's I'm yes. I just think it's a very bad sign that they're not having him play and they're able they could stand behind well, we don't want to rush him. He's not ready. But the fact that that doesn't happen anymore makes me think that there are some real concerns

behind it right now. There are because every single broadcraft cast crew that goes in there, including I can't remember who announced the Redskins game last week, but including them, they all talk with in form ration based on what Haskins isn't ready to do or basically that the coaching staff doesn't want to But the one thing is they are zooming towards number one overall pick potential if the Dolphins ever won two games this season, So you can't be in the position to draft one of the big

quarterbacks that everyone is organically tanking for. And well, I'm saying the Redskins their quarterback guy. I mean, that's their owners guy. Yeah. All I'm saying is if Haskins is not is not ready to play, and he's there's issues with him, then why do you not move on after one year? Look what happened at the Cardinals. They wound up doing the right crazy. I guess it'd be crazy to me without having to actually play. And that's what

I'm saying the owners. The owners, I know, but if you if you know it's at the time, it's not that crazy. In it would have been crazy four years ago. I don't think it's that crazy. If you're like millions and millions of dollars are riding and having the right quarterback. And I know he got it. He had a cup of coffee this season and then got sent back to the bench. But who is the last for astur round pick quarterback to stay on the bench for a whole season?

Essentially is At Mahomes. He played the final week of the year. But Alex Smith was a Pro Bowl quarterback at that stage that year. He was in front of him. All I'd say is if they knew, let's say, if you if you were gonna get Patrick Mahomes three weeks into that season was out Alex Smith, have ever really kept him on the bench. They just took a measured

approach with with Patrick Mahomes. We talked about this after the Bears game when Khalil Mack killed that offensive line, but they were that offensive line was injured, and I understood why they weren't going to put him behind that line. But this line's played a little bit better lately. They're running out of excuses not to play it all. Right, there you go. That is our Tuesday Show. Thank you again to Joe Thomas and Andrew Hawkins for their um

contribution to the program. Yes Great Guys and Mark and What. Mark and Greg will be on the Tomahawks Show on Sunday, so check that out. Will be back on Thursday with our week eight preview show, and yes, Mark and I will also will be on Thursday night with our recap of Thursday Night football. So it's two shows coming up Thursday. Check them both out. That'll be a thick seven minutes. I'm hoping it's It could enter that Eddie Spaghetti Virgo range where you just you love ball so much you

can't quit. I just gotta talk Case, Keenum and Peterson go into Minnesota and make it a classic. They get within thirty five points, all right, Stan handsOn signing off, punching that clock, going home for the Quiet Storm, The mail Man, the Old Boss, Bricky Hollywood Behind the Glass Steal Thursday,