Dak’s Deal, What You People Don’t Realize, & Sarah Thomas

did it on a Saturday. No no, but it falls on a Saturday, the nie um. I thought to mark this um passage of time to just check out how how it all sounded when we did our first ever Bunker cast with an added bonus of hearing Chris's voice. So let's let's hear what it sounded like one year ago this week, Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL Podcast, presented by Intuit Quick Books, official sponsor of the NFL. My name is Dan Hanzas, and I

am joined in a city filled with heroes. Mark Cessor, Chris Wesley, Beg Rosenthal. Oh my goodness, what is up? Boy? This is? This is? This is different territory for uh, well, I was gonna say for the podcast, but then let me just I'm gonna pull that back, go above the tree tops and say human civilization at least in modern culture. So here we are, well, I think we should explain where we are. We're in five different houses littered across the Los Angeles area on some Google hangout that Erica

tampost He did a great job setting out there. It is um yes, Ricky, and welcome back. Ricky. Hollywood rigged a temporary set up to allow us to even do that, to do a remote show, which we've never done one before. And uh, it's really funny as a time capsule boys to go back and check it out, because first of all, I say at one point, well, we'll be here this week, probably back in the studio next week. I also I also say, oh, guys, sorry I missed. I didn't realize

that I had. I missed the previous show, the last show at the studio because I had an illness which was probably almost definitely the coronavirus that I had picked up, but at the time I did not think I didn't think that was the case. But it's pretty amazing we're still doing this one year later and not amazing in a good way. Yeah, I um, I feel uncomfortable hearing that. I'm glad it was a small portion. That's the first time I've heard my voice on our podcast and the

last time you played it. It makes me want to puke. And I can only imagine, yeah, like just just the naive, naivete And I remember I was we were pushing to do the Daily Bunker cast. It's like, this is something we're gonna like look back and like remember and what what a cool like thing that we're gonna stand apart and do this and and that's all fine, We'll like

be doing it together, that's all fine. But I think part of that was like a thought of you know, it's only gonna be for a certain amount of time, a moment of time that we look back on. Um, in hindsight, it's like, I don't know, if I if if I had known we had been doing it for a year, I'd be like, Okay, let's just keep our normal schedule. Let's not get too crazy. Well, it was it was the start of free agency, and I thought

we right that that part made sense. Right. Our method was to like know what, everyone else was kind of shut down, and thanks to Erica and setting it up the way we did, I think we went leaned into it hard. And I know that, you know, within days of Corona landing, I was renting airbnbs and like just enjoying the version of it that Let's backtrack a little bit because I have been gone a week, Um, so what like do you guys realize that the show wouldn't

have existed if it wasn't for me? And I think I think Greg did a great job in that clip, you know, actually giving me some credit, and Mark you did too, But Dan and I think you you should probably jump on now and just kind of, you know, talk a little bit of no. I was just I was thinking that if we felt like we were boxing there, I could have given a LA call or call and we could have Okay, well was deleted. It's true amazing, Ricky.

You were a huge part of getting us running, and you helped the entire company because everybody was caught with their pants down as it were, right. I mean, the pandemics really hurt, you know, the ability to produce podcasts. If you look around the country, it's been like no one's been able um to overcome this sort of challenge. Do you know what kind of work it takes to make your nasally annoy You say you want to puke when you listen to yourself? What about the thousands and

thousands of people listen to the show. Do you know how much work I have to do so they're not puking out their car windows at their houses that you auto tuned Greg's voice, Yeah, I mean I have to if he's gonna throw digs like, you're gonna get it right back. You know, listen, it's like a brother and

sister of the two of them. And you'll notice also that you know, I was listening to the first like six or seven minutes, didn't hear a lot from West there, And it did make me think, as we're very you know, thinking back with West and and I was thinking, how like the four of us as a team. If I'm like all bombasted and arena rock and Mark is prog rock, maybe a jam band depends on what day you get him. Greg likes rap, uh and then West West was like jazz.

You know, he picked his spots and he filled the space with like smooth efficiency that was West and he would he would get the definitely the highest PFF score of the podcast because he didn't he didn't need to fill up the space like someone that's talking right now. Yeah, he's like, um, you know, he was a big NBA fan. I'm becoming more of one. You know if he was an NBA play he's like Joel Embiid. It's like he's efficient with those minutes, like ficient with you. You give

him the ball, like he's going to score. I mean, you have a He was a Spurs fan because Tim Duncan. Maybe he's Tim Duncan. That was a big fundamental of the podcast game. Um. Anyway, that that is memory road. We ended up doing uh thirty three Bunker Cast. That's what they were titled before, just saying oh, this isn't stopping. So we stopped calling them Buggler Cast, and here we are twelve months later. But we did it daily for I think through the draft. That was about the moment

where we stopped. So that's Mark makes a good point. It was free agency that week. That makes sense, and we'll be hitting you know, we'll we'll we'll have special coverage next week and everything. But to keep it going for six more weeks after that. That's maybe how I look back, and like, I don't know if that really I love. Greg's just um in need, uh sort of just the way it is. It's so nostalgic about the past and just it's a man just who can't get the fond memories out of out of the memory bank

when you look. It's not about warmth, it's don't you Almost everything I do and this is more a personal thing, but or but as a group and everything. The only thing I look back on and just think and think about is the things that could have been better. That's maybe a bad way to you know, the things we could have done better. I'm joking about doing it every day, but just in hindsight, you know, I think we've done

a few things adequately, to an adequate level. And when I and I look back at those shows and I did them, I was doing them in my garage, my rented garage, um, and I remember I think back of those shows that like it felt like there was a little bit of safety and numbers because it was a very scary time and everything was being turned upside down in a way that none of us had ever experienced before.

And I think that's part of the reason we're like, let's do a show every day, because then there was the thirty to forty five minutes probably an hour where we were, you know, together in life was normal on some level. So that's why I think that's absolutely true. I'm glad, I'm glad you you said it that way. We've done this altogether. We almost take it. We've almost are used to it now, we are used to it that we've done this. Um, but that's part of the reason,

you know, Chris is passing. It is part of like this year, you know, this crazy pandemic year. My daughter is going to go to school next week for ninety minutes only for the entire week, by the way, but that will be the first time she's in school and my son, you know, since since that week, they have not been there one since, which was which was also a nice little bonus with the podcast. It gave us something to do that was not, um, you know, watching

them while they're not in school. But it is we're still so in the middle of it that it's like we've gotten used to it, and it's been crazy. It's so weird, so weird, and um, you heard Ricky's back and we're happy to have Ricky Hollywood back and thank you to Stephen Manny for helping out while she was gone. Uh Erica sat down with Sarah Thomas, the first female

official in NFL history. She actually became the first woman to officiate a Super Bowl UM last month and uh Erica interviewed MS Thomas today and uh in an old mark, an old nod to DDFP and how we got our humbles start with the a t L debate Club. Ricky will be on the back end of the show with Sarah Thomas. Looking forward to that, Erica, I know you were happy with how it turned out. Estate it was awesome. Now she was. She was really cool and we had a lot of fun. So people should check it out.

We're gonna have part I'm sure you'll put it on on social too, Ricky, but we'll have it on the around the NFL broadcast, which is back. How about that? Maybe who knows, maybe all those podcasts help us actually get UM a slot on the network. Finally, if we have had it during the pandemic, and hopefully that continues UM even when they is not a like global catastrophe going on. But it's nice. We're there. We're there for good, and I hope we're there for good throughout the season

and everything. Either that or we've been just sort of used by the executives to you know, fill time, and I hope to be back to normal to get these clowns out of here. We got a new commercial, Mark Sauce. I'm excited about. They updated, well, they did it. They did a nice little update because the previous one, Yeah, and the previous one, um, they have me saying like you just can never doubt the Patriots or something like that. While they were like going they were going, you know,

deep into into hell. Um. This time around, it's some more bland comment that you can't really tell what now it's Mark like you always have to doubt the Patriots. They just need a site slight edit to update it. All right, let's get into it. We have a big new show in honor of the Bunker cast Um and

how we started a year ago. We're just gonna kind of rip through some news and then end um with a little what you people don't realize As we look ahead to free agency, the legal tampering period starts on Monday, So let's get into it and do some new starting with a big move at quarterback for the Cowboys. That's not the way it works. That's not the way it works. But we've got some guys that are are circumcised in the fly and speaking. But the bottom line is we've

got it down to the nitty gritty, you know. Jara and he had a press conference with people there um which was a bit of a return to normality at least in Texas, UM, an actual press conference, and he and he brought up the circumcising an insect again. If you remember a few years back, it was circumcised the mosquito, and that wasn't the first time that. Now it's a fly. I still don't know what it means. If does anybody

know what what jarre means. It's an old down South um expression and I'm I'm in Texan culture because of my marriage, but I still don't know what that is. I'd be the last to know. I mean, it feels like a completely unnecessary procedure also, but I mean I think, yeah, that's the idea. I think that the idea is it's saying you don't need to get too deep into the weeds here, let's not let's not lose the forest for

the trees. To use another metaphor, let's not get so hyper specific that we're circumcising the mosquito and when we really should just be happy we have this great mosquito that Dak Prescott that doesn't need to be circumcised. Wait a second, that it totally fell apart. Do we say, yeah, what is Jerry telling us here? Because sometimes I do think people tell on themselves by what they kind of notice in others or the phrases that they use. And I don't know what he's saying, you know, by always

bringing up circumcision. It might be something that that he has to deal with as a person. That's what I mean. That's I'm I'm I'm totally with you, please for social Alright, let's get take that. The Cowboys announced with their typical uh spectacle that they have resigned Dak Prescott to a four year, one hundred and sixty million dollar contract. He gets a hundred and twenty six million guaranteed, a no trade clause. That's the most. Um What you always have

to have one record so everybody goes home happy? Is the one million guaranteed? The most? Ever? Is that what the record Dak got, I believe, so it reset the market and it uh keeps Prescott there. He turns twenty eight in July, so through his age thirty two season, and uh they get the deal done, which Mark I think is um good for the Cowboys because Dak is a to me, a top ten quarterback. UM. Also good for us because we don't have to hear about Dak

Prescott's contract anymore. I mean, I just think about the fact that in you know, four plus games, he threw for almost nine hundred yards and how dangerous their offense was before he was wiped off the field with that terrible injury. I am happy for him because, you know, tucked inside an absurd press conference, um and and I understand that for I will pause fun that for a second.

I will just say that I what I liked about the press conference was that you really got a sense of how the other people inside that building feel about Dak Prescott, that they that this is a this he has grown as a leader. He is an unquestioned franchise quarterback. And I'm just glad that it's that it's finished and done.

And he said the same thing. Dak Prescott said that it meant a lot to have this behind him and that you can really it allows you just to focus, and I imagine it would and and you know, Stephen Jones talked about the fact that the quarterback market everywhere else is so um volatile and undecided, that they knew they had a sure thing. And so for all those reasons,

I like it. Um the way that this was handled press conference wise, and I and honestly went on for an hour and forty five minutes or close to that, was highly absurd and and and I don't want to be overly cynical because that was just my raw response to it after it reached fifty to sixty minutes. UM completely unnecessary, outside of the fact that Dak Prescott, you know, looking sideways at Jerry Jones when he uttered some of

his absurd commentaries. Um, but this is the Cowboys. We have doing things, but we haven't had a press conference like that in Dallas, they said for four hundred days. Um Am, I am I being too cynical. I don't need that presentation in those bells and with watch it then it's not for you, right. But but the fact that it that it was tolerated to go on for that long. The people and there, I think wanted it

to you, Like there was no questions or anything. I think the nature of a news conferences for the assembled media to get what they're looking for, for the team to give their version of where they're at, and then it gets disseminated in in portions. Now, the fact that you use your off day to watch an hour and forty five minute I mean, that's kind of on you. Yeah. I was not tracking every minute of it, but it was just like literally on in our living room, which

is a rare occurrence. But I came I did. I came into the room seven or over the course of two hours, and it was still on. I watched. I watched ten minutes of it and that was good. Um. I think it's it's a cowboys way of doing it. And it doesn't surprise me that it bothers you, Mark,

because you do not like hubrists. You do not like um unnecessary self promotion, you know, not necessarily necessarily like people that value the almighty buck over having integrity, and those are that's the cowboys, Like, that's why they are the cowboys. Listening to Jerry Jones, I think, and we can get into the specifics I do want to have,

just like the football and the contract. But jumping off you mark, like listening to him, you would get the sense that they were an extremely successful franchise over the last thirty years, maybe the most and because in his mind they are, and in a lot of the way that our country values um the world, they are because they've made the most money. Like he did refer a few times like if there's someone I want to lose a you know, um, a contract negotiation to this is

the guy to my life who's going to take advantage. Please, no one believes that you're saying that. You know that you're taking advantage of all these players. You've made so much money, he said, like you got to overpay. Any good deal I've ever made, you gotta overpay. You didn't overpay for the Cowboys. It was an incredible thing. They print cash, and I think, to Jerry Jones, that is success.

Of course, he wants to win the Super Bowl, but I think he's as competitive or more as a businessman and I and the way they run that press conference is part of the reason why that's true. And that's fine, But as a fan, I don't care about all that. So if I'm a Cowboys fan, I'm almost annoyed that they see themselves as the team when they're not. They're they've been losing. They've been a mediocre team at best

for thirty years. So I'm with you, Mark on. I mean, they haven't gotten to the super Bow in twenty five years, and that's that. You can't get past that. And but I guess there's a part of it. It's like they are the Dallas Cowboys, that they are about spectacle, and that's why there's many people who hate the Cowboys, even when when they were great and they were backing it up with success on the field. It's the star and it's the spotlight, and it's look at us, and we

have the biggest stadium in the biggest place. And again a lot of this ties into the the culture of the region where they come from. Bigger is better in Texas. So I don't know, man, I think it's good to have different types of franchises and some that that love it and handle things like this, and then there there'll be other organizations that I guess the press release will suffice and maybe that's minimalist enough for for you. Mark.

I don't know. Maybe there's maybe there's a ground I'm not I'm not like, I think it's fair to note that there was an absurdity to it. Um. I'm not asking for it to be banned like we're in Communist Russia or something. It's fine, it can go on. You're right, I don't have to watch it along with thousands of out of other totally worthless shows that are out there that I don't watch. Um. I'm fine with with a couple of organizations being the way they are, and that

is the Cowboys stamp. But I think that Greg nailed that. Here's the problem. He spent like there were like thirty mentions of Super Bowl trophies and this and that, and it's like, you've been a bad team, You've underperformed, You've been a team that gets to the playoffs and never gets the job done for a quarter century. There's zero accountability.

If you're a fan of the Dallas Cowboys, and we all know a few, unless you have your head in the clouds, you'd have to be furious with this owner and the way the team has mostly been run, outside of the fact that no matter what they do, they're never punished for it. They're put on television thirty times. The record is is media. The quarterbacks go on to become better announcers than they were quarterbacks. Safe for Troy Aikman,

I'm tired of it. To Mark's point, and we will get to the football that would be great at some point. Understand it is interesting though, But to to Mark's point, they wouldn't have done that press conference for when Josh Allen signs his deal. If Josh Allen talks for one, they'll cut away after fifteen minutes. I've seen it. I've seen it. I've I've been annoyed by it. Actually when they do it too quickly. You know, if it was Lamar Jackson when he signs his deal, they'll cut away.

They're not gonna leave it on TV. But it's because people watch it and people go like it, you know, and they are they are different and they're they're similar. Now that they have this quarterback on their contract for forty million, I think it's overrated. That's like, you can't build a team around a quarterback with a lot of money. That that to me is overrated. But it doesn't mean that we all weren't right when we first guess two years ago that the Cowboys are just gonna end up

paying way more for dragging this out. This is not something we're second guessing. We set if you, if we go back and listen to the podcast two years ago, we said them dragging their feet is going to cost them more money. And the two contracts that have changed the quarterback structure the most are Kirk Cousins and Dak Prescott. And it's because they got to the franchise tag. Because because they got to the second franchise text, so they

did not self evaluate. That's been something I've been banging on this entire time we've ever had a podcast. I think it's Jerry Jones' biggest problem. He doesn't know who's worth pain or not on his own roster. And I think that it cost him a little here. I mean not nothing crazy, but if they had just paid him a couple of years ago, um, you know, they'd be paying him eight or nine million dollars less. They'd have a little more or less, you know, a little more

to spend. The contract seems okay to me. It doesn't seem I mean, it's all funny money at a certain point. But I did I didn't get the feeling when I read the news, like, oh man, this really did screw the Cowboys in the end. And a four year deal that's I think works for both sides, you know. I think about it though, and I know you just said you don't put much stock in it, but I think, um history backs it up a little bit. Is once you do sign that second contract out of your rookie deal,

it does get harder, um to build a team. It just dollars and cents. It's just he was a I believe, what was the third round pick, deck four fourth round pick. And it's fair to to wonder if Dallas already had its best chance to win a Super Bowl with Dak Prescott when he was making virtually no money, when they had that dominant offensive line and Ezekiel Elliott was at the top of his powers, and you have the opportunity to use all that extra cap space to build up

a defense to make a well rounded team. They could never do it. They had a couple good years there, um, but now they have to go about business in a different way. And and getting back to the point, and on some level you were saying Mark that with the Cowboys, it's it's all sizzle and no steak sometimes. Is it going to be different this time? If they've learned lessons, are they gonna take this salary, absorb it into their cap and be able to now um rebound off last year?

We'll see, I don't. I think one thing that's fair to say is they don't really deserve the benefit of the doubt. Uh in terms of team building, it's just the results haven't been there. I do say, I do think that the addition of Dan quinnant defensive coordinator. I know totally flamed out in Atlanta, but the coordinator world is just so different. I think that's going to be

great for them. I mean, they have needs on defense and and but all a lot of players that last year completely fell off a cliff were better in previous years, not under that horrible scheme they were in a year ago. And so if that can improve. I do again, look at this offense and how productive Dak Prescott was. I mean, he was on m v P pace when he got injured. Why can't they duplicate that? All those people, for the most part, the skilled position players, are all coming back.

He's an interesting player, DOC because you know, even on the show. We've been a little up and down because he was so good as a rookie, one of the best rookie seasons of all time by a quarterback. Not as good the next two years, but his fourth year, to me, he was so good that that that proved beyond a shadow of a doubt where he was, which is as a top you know, eight to ten quarterback, maybe even better than that. And then he started last season great too. If you could play that in your

fourth season, I mean, you're legit. But it's interesting. I think it was because he was a fourth round pick that the Cowboys trusted him ultimately a lot less than the Rams trusted Golf and the Eagles trusted Wentz. And here is Dak you know, the the last one uh standing with his team. I think that the Zeke Elliott contract is going to haunt them a hell of a lot more. And it already is than a DA one. What is how many more guaranteed money years does zekep

because that feels like the next domino here? How are they going to have cap flexibility? Um, now that they have Dack under contract to get get out of that Zeke contract, but he just signed it last summer, wasn't it right? He only has his guaranteed money through this year. So actually as even though they would have dead money to cut him or trade him, uh next year, like, they'd still save money. So he he, he needs to play well I think this year to to remain a

cowboy and keep getting that money. Where does Ezekiel Elliott fall on your free agency? One on one, it's a question. I'm gonna I'm gonna make a prediction right now next year. Al Right, before we go full skip Bayless, let's get out of this cowboys talking talk about other things in the NFL. Um that the Chiefs are making a big

move at offensive line, a couple of big moves. They have parted ways with both of their starting tackles, former number one overall draft pick Eric Fisher veteran Mitchell Schwartz, in a moves that saves close to twenty million against the salary cap, but puts the Chiefs, the defending a f C champions, in a position where they have to rebuild their offensive line and two key spots. Greg, I know, um uh, there was predictions of a quote unquote massacre

um which you pooh pooed a little bit um. But there's no way really to tell, like whether, um, what team's intentions would have been if the salary cap was two D instead of one three. I wonder if it was if they had more bubble room if both their tackles are gone right now. Yeah, I think that's a fair question. I think there's gonna be some exceptions that a player that would that got cut this year maybe wouldn't have been in a normal year. I just didn't

think that's the exception. But Eric Fisher might be that exception. I think schwartz for them to cut him right after he had back surgery, they know a lot about his condition. He's a four time All Pro. I mean that that tells me they just don't think he can return to his previous level. And that sounds like something you would do regardless. Now, Fisher is young, a little younger, but he's coming off a late January Achilles injury, and you know he's not going to be the same all season.

So do you really keep him out? You keep him on the roster just for two maybe not in a year like this where by the way, the Chiefs I think we're you know, among the three or four worst position team heading into this period. They they it wasn't just the Saint you know, the Saints got a lot of attention. The Chiefs were in a tough spot, but they didn't have a lot of logical moves. You know, they're gonna push money around and uh I put them

on like potential surprise cuts. But I thought it'd be one or the other, Schwartz or Fisher, and for them to do it both. They only have one starter remaining from their offensive line that won the Super Bowl, and that was DuVernay Tardif my Miguel guy who sat out last year. He's the only one left off of their Super Bowl offensive line, which is crazy. That's why I

think you're still gonna see free agent lineman get paid. Um, but if you're the Chiefs, you know you're you're you have to turn around and pay people like instead of paying these two. I think it's health related on for Mitchell Schwartz too, because there's been whispers that he might retire. I mean it was during that Super Bowl run where you know, Gordon, according to any metrics you look at, he had one of the greatest playoff journeys of any

right tackle ever. He was flawless for them two seasons ago. So they idea that we're now in a place where the Chiefs have to rebuild from scratch and you gotta nail it because bottom line, I know it's a one game sample, but what happened to them, what happened to Patrick Mahomes in that entire offense with a with a compromised, banged up offensive line and neither one of those two tackles in the game. They were boring, They were not fun to watch, They were unproductive and mistake prone. Uh,

your offensive line goes away, you're in hot water. I don't care who you are against the mediocre defense and pass rush. The greatness of Mahomes is going to cover up a lot of warts. But as you can see, when the competition steps up, you're highly vulnerable. And um, that's why the Chiefs got blown out in the Super They feel more vulnerable. And you know, everyone said like they're just gonna, you know, keep soaring year after year,

and I always think it's it's really tough. Every year is different, um, and they're still going to be one of the favorites, but they do feel they're gonna go into this season feeling more vulnerable, feeling like one of the pack of four or five or seven teams instead of being the one that stands apart. People gotta stopped writing that article the week after the team wins the Super Bowl. You know, Team blank just lifted the Lombardy and there's no reason to think they won't keep winning.

It's like it's hard to retain a roster to bring in fresh talent when your draft pick is a premium and your cap is in a tough spot. You have so much great talent on your roster. Stop assuming things, all right, let's move. When's the last time a team repeated a Super Bowl champion? Greg knows? Maybe? Yeah, well your memories, oh three oh four? They break all the rules? And when what before the Pats? Who was the last repeat champion? Cowboys? Right? The Broncos, the Broncos and um

and the Seahawks. To be fair, we're a Malcolm Butler interception away that would have been back to back right and would have been Broncos fans would have absolutely killed us if you didn't correct. Well, I would one quick thing about those, because it's all you have. Broncos. Broncos team is one of the most underrated Super Bowl juggernauts around. I think they just get forgotten because there were all

these NFC dining sit around. That team was absolutely unstoppable, right, please, Mark Jets ruppen nothing in the third quarter of a f C title game. Don't bring that up. It hurts a great year though. He's right there, you were a great That was hurt. You're gonna have your close games, you know, in the playoffs here and there. But he's right, that team was. I did not do that as an

anti Jets. If we if we get past the Broncos, we have the Falcons on two week break with Bill Belichick as the d C and Bill Parcels a head coach, we walk into the La Morney. Anyway here, you would have won that game. All right, Let's move on. The Saints. They make some moves. They're always trying to get under the cap, and this year it's they're making some painful moves. Emmanuel Sanders Um he gets cut, as does so the

wide receiver, and Kwan Alexander the linebacker. Both Um heading out the door saves four million dollars by cutting Sanders thirteen million saved against the cap. Getting rid of Kwan Alexander who's making his way back from an achilles injury in December. Alexander just twenty six many um in his early thirties, and was I thought effective with them considering their QB issues with injuries this year. I'm sure he'll He'll get work. They both will. Uh, the Saints have

some work to do. They do, and neither was a surprise to me. I don't think the Saints have done anything surprising this offseason except for tag Marcus Williams that they their safety, which we'll get to, but you know that the other tags, but that that was surprising to me because that's gonna cost him ten millions shows how much they value him. Uh, it's been fun to kind

of follow. This is my idea of fun. You know, over the cap their cap space page, it's like it's like the Saints were at two hundred and seventy million dollars over the cabin. Like each day it just comes down a little more out it's down under thirty and and they haven't they haven't made a move yet. That

is surprising. One thing I have heard um from some of the you know that I that I wonder about two is just is is a Michael Tom Michael Thomas trade to me would be the one big surprise move they could make, because I'm not sure what else they're gonna do to get under the cap. Maybe it's just moving money around, but that is it would be a move that I wouldn't totally shock me. Makes a little sense.

Maybe a trade to right, that's what I mean, a trade Michael Thomas trade where you get that contract off the books. He'd certainly have suitors if they wanted to do. I think he would have suitors. But there is some buzz on the streets that he's a bit of a pain in the ass on a high level. Is that somebody you want to bring in. There's proof of that a year ago too. I mean there were cuting Norris Jenkins too, Jack Rabbit, he was good, he'll get it,

he'll get a contract. He was gonna twenty four million over about that at this point or over the cap there. And so it does to your point where it's like everyone's gonna get under. But I mean they've had to cut they the Saints to me move out of like super Bowl window territory entirely. In my book, I want to see I want to see what they end up with. They always find a way, and so far they haven't.

I wouldn't be surprised if Generes Jenkins is back, Like that contract was signed with the Giants, he was not making thirteen million in any season. It reminds me a little bit of Carlos Dunlop, where like you could see him back on the same team, but just for seven or eight million or something like that. What do you have, um, Greg for the Saints? If Jamis Winston is the starter, You've got nineteen and oh, eighteen and one, seventeen and two, Like,

where do you come down? Well, that's what I'm hoping for. Or I don't really want Winston with the Patriots because I think that would go poorly, But I kind of just want to see it out of curiosity. I'm gonna go eleven and five with Jamis um but a nice playoff run, the type of you know, playoff performance. They haven't gotten enough out of their quarterbacks lately. So the upshot is Drew Brees exits and everything starts to become

productive again. You know, I'm love it. And five is technically a worse record than they've had, but yeah, in January. That's when we haven't seen it, but that's when you see that that's Jamis. I work under that assumption as well. Uh. In other news, the Buffalo Bills part ways with John Brown, their deep threat wide receiver who you know, always a

West favorite John Brown. In fact, I was just thinking how Norris Jenkins West always just referred to him as Jack Rabbit, just you know, conversationally, always referred to John Brown as smoke. Uh. And it made me think that despite the ankle injuries and injuries in general for Brown, h he could be somebody's bargain at the right phrase in free agency. Because if West believes it, and I know West would say that, um, then I believe it.

I would point to the fact that, like I know, last year he played in what nine games, but in the previous two seasons he missed to combine too, So it's not been all injuries all along. But he had the sickle cell situation and saved some seven point nine million. And I think if you look at the Bills a little bit, um like they didn't franchise tag Matt Milano, I think it's because they're gonna turn around and have to spend some money. And I look at their offensive line.

It's one area where they've got guys leaving the building and they can't just You've got Darryl Williams gone, John Fluiciana, Like you're gonna have to replace these bodies. There's a couple of playoff teams out here with with who're gonna be chasing offensive lineman? Yeah, I want. I would want my team, And if your team signs John Brown, I'd be excited. I mean with you're right about West. He saw that in him right off the bat when he was a fourth receiver in in Arizona. Uh and he

could not have been uh more on point. I think it was a difference maker. Last year when he played, he was hurt. I mean, look, he had a he had a nice playoff game. I forget which one it was. I think it was it was their divisional round win over the Browns. Like he's pure speed, he's he's he's got subtle, you know skills. He's just banged up and he's a small guy. But I would love to get him if I was another team. I'm trying to think of a contender that was missing that type of president.

How about the Ravens going back to the Ravens where he had a nice season for them before you alright, uh in other news, franchise tag, Greg, you were very concerned about the franchise tag and the timing of it and whether it would be pushed back or not. It wasn't. It went down as scheduled and a bunch of players got tagged. In A bunch of players didn't that you thought could so. Chris Godwin of the Bucks, uh, he gets the tag. Marcus Williams is Greg mentioned the Saints,

Marcus May the safety for the Jets. Among ten ten players tagged, uh not tagged, And this is a little bit more interesting obviously, because these players are hitting free agency and there's a pretty decent chance uh, they will be playing elsewhere. One Kenny Golladay with the Lions, Aaron Jones, Hunter,

Henry Matthew, jude On Shack Lawson not tagged. Golladay jumps out to me, I wanted to um start there because you really get the feeling that Jared Goff's in a lot of trouble here uh in Detroit, like a lot. And I wonder if I wonder if he um came to realize that now when he learned that Golliday wasn't come back because Keny Gali is a big time receiver

and he was injured last year. But he was a guy I think I even wrote in a faulty column over the summer last year that he was primed to join the Superstar Club, um and it just didn't work out for him. But he he's gonna be really uh talented quality player for whatever team he ends up with. And it makes me think that God is just like a Patsy being set up to fail for a team that can absorb his contract as they plan for tomorrow without him. They got these two first round picks from

the Rams. Uh, they say, you know what, We're not trying to win, so this hideous salary that goth has is not a problem for the time being. And then we're gonna go to and fourteen. We are the two we are Jags of last year, were the Jets of

last year. We're gonna get the number one pick. We're gonna be loaded up, and we're gonna be in the catbird seat like Joe Douglas is this year, and and and we're gonna roll and Jared Goff's just gonna be left holding the bag here as bag of money, but that's always gonna have So Golladay not being around most likely is very bad news for Jared Goff. There is whispers that the Dolphins and the Giants are hot on Kenny Galady. I think you diagnose the Lions situation perfectly.

It's like he there was no the Lions weren't seeking Jared Goff as a destination future quarterback. I think that there is an agreement between Dan Campbell and ownership that this is a deep rebuild. We're not gonna try to just float along as seven and nine for the next three hundred years. But cut it down to the studs

and they've acquired all these draft picks. I think that was what the move was right and there they'll get one more assuming Golladay stays healthy, um as a compensatory third round pick, you know when when he signs elsewhere. Still surprised me. Was the biggest surprise to me, just because I was told, you know that people that are had you know, people were guessing, you know, are Ian rapport kind of reported it's gonna happen. Um. So I wonder if they didn't see a trade market for him.

As a tag and trade, and they just decided, why why would we pay seventeen million dollars to a guy when we're as you mentioned, I think, Dan, you hit it on the head with Goff and the Lions when we're not really looking to win this year. I guess it doesn't make sense, but it stinks. You know, they've only drafted so many good players and I love Goladay. Uh. The Giants make so much sense to me. I mean, the Dolphins would two it really any teams, many teams

receiver with a high ceiling. I think he's twenty six years old. Uh. And by the way, do you think when Dan Campbell was talking about biting kneecaps, he was talking about Jared Goff is one of those people. You'd have to factor that in at this point that maybe one of the targets he did talk about, like completely rebuilding and it was pretty honest about and yeah, when you let the I have got a day seventh on

my list. Uh, that was a shock to me. And the other one um that really surprised me was cam Rock was Aaron Jones. By the way, I was a little surprised he's number three on my list. That they didn't just want to pay him eight million dollars. We'll see, maybe he'll return there. There's some buzz about that. But then Cam Robinson getting tagged by the Jaggars really surprised me. So I think they're the opposite of the Lions, which is I think they're gonna spend stupid money. They have

the most cap space. They just seem like they're desperate to win. Now, Urban Meyer and and Trent balkis back, and he's just gonna do whatever he wants, and he's gonna set the top of the market and he's gonna do things like franchise tag a left tackle they drafted that really hasn't been that great, but just because like,

why not spend the money there? There are people that know the Packers far better than I do, So I'm not gonna go into hard on this, but it doesn't make sense to me if you have a chance to put the tag on Aaron Jones running back, put him essentially in a one year deal for money that is in the ballpark of the best running backs in the league in terms of payment, but not at the top of the market like you do it because Aaron Rodgers is thirty eight years old, and and and you're you've

gotten close to the mountaintop of the last two years, put the best team on the field possible. Now they may be saying, we can take this money that we're not gonna pay Aaron Jones if he doesn't come back. I'm working on this. Yeah, they might, they might get him back. Maybe they maybe they bring him back and everything's fine. But if this ends with him walking out the door and they think we're just gonna reallocate those assets,

I don't know, man. I mean, that guy has been a stud and there's a reason their offense has been so um incredibly efficient in the last season, and it's it's a lot of it is obviously Rogers, but Jones gave him that balance playing with fire. I think I think they must. It tells you good things about what they think about a. J. Dillon because he's going to shift in and become a lead guy. But Jones, well, I I'm I'm just saying that this stuff happens though.

Where it's like, especially at the running back position. They they don't want to pay eight million dollars to a run back and they're and they're telling us that, but I mean, there are these suggestions that maybe Jones goes out and test the market, doesn't get the deal, he thinks um and comes back to Green Bay, and then you get him from more than one season he gown.

If he hits the open market, he's going I mean, and if you really do value Aaron Jones, put the tag on him and then try to work out a deal. And then if you can't work out a deal, he's still on your team, or maybe you trade him if you really want to go down. I don't know. Man, Again, there are people out there that know the Packers better.

But it just struck me as strange. The Bucks resigned Lavante David to a two year contract million twenty million guaranteed UM, thirty one years old, PFF their number one coverage linebacker last year. So this guy has been one of the great um defensive players in Bucks history. And now he's got a Super Bowl ring on top of it, and now he's got more security. So good for Lavante David. Gregg, is this one surprised you a little bit? Well, the

money surprised me a little bit. Another West favorite he was on that you know, I remember early two thousand and fourteen on our podcast that this is one of the great linebackers in the league. I think if if he had been on the Patriots or some other team, he you'd be talking about him as a potential Hall of Famer. Maybe he'll get there. Um. I I am looking for, though, a text that I just know will

make you happy. Dan Um from our you know friend Mike Berkowitz, you know, is a big Patriots fan, and uh, you know, I want to get this right. But the the the idea is basically he like he's basically transferred allegiances. He still loves the Patriots, but he started he's one of those guys that just started rooting for the Bucks. And he was like, it's nice to finally root for a franchise that like values their veterans and like holds onto the guys that have been you know, great in

their uniform. It's nice to you know, finally for for a franchise with loyalty of like you what a smooth I mean, he really hits the ground running as a fan to go front, I mean, right, the Patriots experienced right into this, right, and he still likes the Patriots. But that's it cracked me. Ut sounds like you like Tom Brady more than you like the Patriots. But no, I'm with h M. All right, let's see speaking of the Patriots are taking phone calls, we're hearing on to

kill Harry there underwhelming wide receiver. I believe he was a second round pick a couple of years ago. Um, and uh, what kind of market does that guy have? Greg? I mean, let's be honest here, m M. Not much. I don't know. I have to this. Why is this even like an urgent thing happening right now? Who is how many? How many teams are calling up the Patriots? I saw this report to yesterday and it's like, okay,

I thought you would have fun with it. See, sometimes they try to give you some red meat there, Dan, because it's a sign of just like it's a it's just funny when these reports come out, because to me, it's just like, hey, if I'm nakill Harry and I read the report, it's like, hey, Bill Belichick hates you.

That's what I would read it to it. It's like this first round pick that didn't work out clearly, and I just you know, think, but they're calls, so there's like there's like a line of teams out there that are like super into Nikkil Harry after what he's done over the past two seasons and a great game against the Seahawks last year. Flat lines like in like thirteen other games, and there's multiple teams you know, hitting the Patriots complex up on trying to get him. Are you

playing work for the Patriots? We have a very pres a big audience. Are you actually carry the water trying to move nkkil Harry in the trade right now? I'm laughing at it. I don't know he has struggled. He they played demere bird the Patriots of their snaps last year. I saw this while doing the that was the second highest of any free agent wide receiver. That's how bad their offense was. Jacoby Myers was by far their number

one receiver. They were desperate to have Harry do anything the last couple of years, and they drafted him over a j. Brown. That one kills because they were very they were looking for a certain type of player and they're very similar types of player, and man, did they make the wrong choice between those two? So to be clear, you're not using our platform to improve the Patriots. Uh, what do they gotta get? For a fifth round pick.

Maybe I don't all right in cuts news Cuts Cuts Cuts, Um guard Kevin Zeitler of the Giants of Vikings tackle Riley Reef, Titans cornerback Malcolm Butler all hit the street. Um Butler was not the biggest problem that Tennessee Secondary, but he was uh highly paid. I'm sure he'll get work. I'm not sure what the situation was is with Riley Reef. Zeitler actually graded well this year in PFF. But maybe again this comes back to the three salary cap situation

and the Giants needed that versatility. He'll find a job immediately. He's Leightlery. Well, some of these guys there, they maybe it is different this year to some degree, because it does. It certainly feels maybe it's it's also because I don't have West to help me out, but it's like it feels like I'm adding a lot of guys to this top underlist. Over and over. These guys getting cut are in the forty to seventy or eighty range. They're they're

like landing square in the middle. Riley Reef, he'll he'll get a job, he'll start. Um Kyle van Noy like he'll get a job, maybe back with you know, Malcolm Butler will but I thought it was kind of good last year. Uh, like he'll get a job. These guys are are starting players. I appreciate the theory that, like, you're gonna get a lot of free agents signing one year deals because then the cotton the cap hops back up big time next year, and if you bet on yourself,

you get a better deal next year. I still don't believe any team is cutting a guy that they really like. That's kind of my over That's my big point is that if they believed in them, they would keep them. They would just find a way. You always find a way, because you could change their salary to push it into next year. But they ultimately don't think Zeitler Butler are like difference makers. They just think they're okay, and so

then they'll cut them. Right. But when you're the Titans and you couldn't cover anybody, and now you choose to save pennies or millions, let's be fair by cutting him off your team, It's like, all right, you better have a plan and you better draft well here and things are not going to get any better. Finally, Mark asked me if Drew Brees has retired. Dan has Drew Brees retired according to your reports. That's what's happening in the

news good good segment. Let's bring it back, um all right before we go, and before we tossed to Ricky and Sarah Thomas, imagine like we're tossing to this and it's just Erica trashing the three of us to Sarah Thomas and Thomas is just like a little bit confused because she doesn't really know who we are. But Erica is just using um Thomas as a platform to share a lot of her anger about us an NFL media

in general. And we we we willfully tack it onto the show that I would I would love to listen to that, to be honest, Erica, is that what's gonna happen? We're flying blind on this, Yeah, I mean you trust me, right, Yeah, that's sort of marks fantasy, you know, just hearing people talk, you know, crazy trash on him, like just like I am a bad boy, you know, well I don't. I think you're framing that in a certain way that I

finally confirmation of my bad boy status. I think it would be cool if Erica was like dropping verbal bombs on us Sarah Thomas out of nowhere at the end of our show. It would be funny because she would she would be just like I prefer the verbal bombs to be on other people. But I you know, either way, verbal bombs are usually fun So alright, make sure you tune in at the end of this episode before we go, Uh, let's play one of our favorite little games. What you

people don't realize? Mark? Get us going. I think something that is becoming clear. But a lot of people, um not. Unlike the YouTube little Beta boys were supposed to insult each other. And that's what I'm calling you, that's what you are. And well you just not realize that. I mean, I thought it was insulting sort of just the general public, you know, listening, you know anything, not necessarily each other. Oh well, then remove that. I don't I don't think

that you're that you're that. Um we're we're not. We have to wake by the way, we have to wake up to the fact that we live in a post Steelers universe, post stealers. They are. Well, here's the thing. I don't like it at all. I think they have been for years and years, um judicious in their decisions Um excellent in many in many of their draft picks on offense specifically. But I'm looking at a team right now that last year had the second worst run blocking aid.

They could not run the ball. They were an imbalanced mess. And now you say goodbye to Marquise Pouncy. You do not get You're not gonna have Aljandro Villanueva back. That is tough to replace these guys. The offensive line is a mess, Big Ben, you now have a bigger question at quarterback than you do an answer. And I think behind offensive lines that are crumbling, that's when teams start to go south. You're in a division where two other

teams beside yourself made the playoffs last year. Both of them look better than you at the end of the year. And the Ravens and Browns and the Bengals who knocked off the Titans and beat the Steelers with Ryan Finley smiling his way to like fifty yards on the ground in a bizarre primetime game knocking off Pittsburgh. The Steelers are in hot water. They can't just assume they're gonna get four wins a year out of the state of

Ohio and all this other business. I sense that we now float into a world where the Steelers are no longer the center of the a f C east or west of New England. What did you call it? A post stealers this universe? Yeah, post society America. You know that again. And I'm all. I'm all for this ultimately because I understand as a Browns fan that the Steelers are hyper annoying because they've been an efficient franchise that

beat up on you for the longest time. But for like the rest of us that aren't his like plugged into the that division, it's kind of been post stealers for a while. They haven't even been to the a f C Championship Game in a decade, but they were also they were eleven and oh last year, and they have been a team that's constantly you just you would you would never be laughed at to make them your super Bowl team almost every year for the past twenties

someomething years. They haven't won a playoff game in four years. That's all I'm saying that they've been I guess what I'm what I'm talking about is them floating away from even that area to a darker place. I'd be NICs who would you rather see float away to a dark place. The Steelers are the Ravens. M hmm, fantasy lands. Let's start with Pittsburgh. Alright, we'll start with and it's certainly possible. The big question mark at quarterback. I like that, Greg,

Do people not realize? I feel like I have already been talking about this, so maybe you did realize you ignoramus is you know, if you've been paying attention to the show. But if not, maybe people wouldn't realize. The salary cap still overrated. I'm not. You know, there's been like some victory laps I've been noticing on Twitter by like, you know, it's like a tough week for the salary cap is a myth, guys. It's like, show me the players, so it's on my radar. No, I mean that they're

saying that, I don't. I stand by it. Show me the players that were like incredibly valuable, that the player that the teams wanted to keep. And I'll show you, guys, where you restructure their contract and you move it into the future, and you do these ghost years that the Saints love doing and everyone every team is doing now where you sign these phony contracts and you push it

into the future when that money is being made. One of the reasons a lot of these guys you know are getting cut is because uh and ignoramus may not realize this either. I think your dollar is going to go further in this market, and it is a one year, a one year thing. And I think the teams, either intentionally or not, like the Jets, the Patriots, the Jaguars, the Colts, there's you know, there's five that have more

money ultimately in cap space than they really need. They're in a great spot because I think your money is

going to go further in this market. So even a team like the Titans um who cut Malcolm Butler, or some other teams or that you know that are closer to the cap, they still want or the Bills were another example for me, they still want to get as much room as they can because I think they see a year where there are a lot of veterans out there that they could get for four or five million at a lower cost than they wouldn't a normal your

like mark set in those one year contracts. So you still you still want to get that that money this year and it is a different year that it helps, but teams aren't cutting players they want, that's my point. All Their thing on the cap that annoys me is that when you go to over the Cap and you look at the list, there's always two or three UM total trash bag operations that have way more cap space than everyone else. They don't spend money, they don't know

how to spend it. They're always in the green and or the black I guess you would say in a financial term, and they're not good. It's like, I'd rather be one of these teams that dances around the cap year after year and you're in the a f C R NFC title game at the same time. Right, there's been too much cap space the last few years, and so that that changes. This year that will be different. But next year it'll it'll shoot you know, it'll shoot right back up. Um, all right, mine will be uh.

Kind of circling back to the beginning of the show, let's start with hearing from Dak Prescott at his press press conference this week. It's my plan is UM get a parade in Dallas. I mean, obviously, as a competitor, you watch and you watch people seller and you watch people do what you want to do. Um, Uh, there's not too many more things that lights a fire under you than somebody having what you want. As a competitor.

You watch and you watch people celebrating, you watch people do what you want to do, fire to it, and you throw on there that I was holding my leg and didn't even have a chance to be out there while guys were doing what was taken away from me. I'm just excited to get out there and show you what this team is gonna do. And um, the next big press conference we have is is hopefully in another year after after that big parade. So there you go.

So Dak is talking about Super Bowl parades and uh, what you simpleton's out there, Uh don't realize is that

you're getting sucked in again. It's gonna happen, and it's not gonna happen to me, but it's gonna happen to you because Dac does this contract and you hear all the flowery talk coming out of Jaral World, and uh, he's healthy, Dac, and that's gonna be you know, built on And then you're gonna hear, uh, they're gonna sign a couple of buzzy free agent stallas and then they're gonna go and get the guy that everybody um said they wanted in the draft, and then they're going to

get the training camp and a Segiel Elliott is gonna be in the quote best shape of his life close quote. And all of a sudden, you're gonna think the Cowboys are going to the playoffs. That's what you're gonna do. I'm not gonna do it. In fact, in fact, Ricky hit my missive music. I gotta hold myself accountable because this is I've been I've gotten this so many years wrong. I Dan Hansas, the Old Zeuser a k a. Big

Daddy Rich aka the New Old Blue Eyes. Well, not, under any circumstances picked the Dallas Cowboys to win the NFC East. This is a binding agreement that ensures the involved parties. The aforementioned Knew Old Blue Eyes has entered into an agreement and is expected to fulfill the obligations underset agreement even if the Eagles, Giants, and Washington football team all have a pretty decent chance to suck but close missile. Wait a minute, what was the nickname you

gave yourself after Daddy Rich? Um? Where's Daddy Rich from? Daddy Rich? Was when I was exploring a nickname years ago, that was what West had thrown out there, because that was Chuck Dalley's nickname with the Old Pistons teams um the new Old blue Eyes. That's just something that's been out there. It's percolating, and I guess it's snuck its way into this. I mean, if you give yourself like multiple, you know, complimentary nicknames, is that like past third person,

that's like sixth person. You're you're you're so far past it. I mean that's mostly contract language. I've just in the process of buying a house and when you're signing the

final paperwork. They actually tracked down every name that's ever been involved in a credit report, and I found some some strange like when I would sign up for like Rolling Stone magazine or something, and I used a dummy name all of a sudden that was on this contract for my house, and I was like, Wow, Okay, that's weird, So daddy rich though you've not used anything, what were

You're like Ron Mexico or something. At some point, and I don't know when this happened, I signed up as Dan Houston for something, which is the last name Abano is real is given last name Paul Houston. I don't know when I did it. I don't know what it was for, but it showed up on this contract paperwork for this massive, biggest transaction of my life. Dan Dan's, Dan's the guy he already has fake names for when he's so famous he has to go to hotels under

like an assumed identity. Hey, if you're gonna put that contract down there, and you know you were like, okay, I'm not going to pick them to win the division, big big deal NFL dot Com picking. You could still even put him in the playoffs if you wanted. How about you just you know, put a sandwich up right now. Then then they're not even going to make the playoff. I'll take you on that. If you do, sure I

will too. Well, I guess, I mean that's doubling the thing that does concern that would be called super like true conviction. Yeah, we were now that you really meant this, well, the contract said number one. But I you know, the thing that the Eagles, Giants and Washington potentially sucking, but that that is very much on my radar with this. But I'm just working under the assumption that the Cowboys are going to trip over themselves again. But I don't

feel confident. I'm just this is basically protecting myself from getting sucked into what's about to happen over the next three months, which is Cowboys hype ceaseless uh couch within a division that's not very good. So I'm not gonna take that wager. But I'm also not gonna pick the Cowboys when that I would just say that, if you're the listener right now, we went out a little soft here. I mean, if anything, you take the sandwich and you and you show Yes, this is exactly how I feel.

But we're hedging bets. Yeah, well, that's how do we measure hype Knew the new Old Blue Eyes. He just he measures everything. It's just it's and I don't want to go all in. I just wanted to keep it. It has a very like mission accomplished vibe to it where it's just like way to go, Brownie. Um, all right, that's it. We'll be back Monday again. The um NFL Network Show is back. Watch the NFL Network Show. Give us a chance to set your DVRs if that's a thing that you do find it somehow and watch it

it's it's gonna be fun. We're gonna have some guests and we're gonna talk about free agency and all sorts of things and have fun doing it. Um, so check that out and um that's it. How great weekend everybody. And remember now it is time to throw it to Ricky Hollywood, who may be slaughtering us in the upcoming segment, A sit down or virtual sit down with Sarah Thomas, the first female officials in the NFL. Girl Power Let it Rip. Ricky Okay joining me now is trailblazing NFL

referee Sarah Thomas. Sarah is the league's first full time female official. She's been officiating NFL games for six seasons now, right, Sarah Right, I just finished my sixth season. It's crazy, I know, and the most recent of which culminated with her working as the down judge and Super Bowl fifty five. Sarah, First of all, thank you for joining us. Second, I have to ask, does your head hurt from shattering the glass ceiling? Um? You know, I like to say I

shattered the grass ceiling. So it's a little softer, yes, because we're on a turf, I guess, but no, I just um, I don't. I don't even think of it that way, right, but I know that it is a milestone for so many young girls that are aspiring to do something that they don't have to say, can girls do that anymore? Because uh semen is believing it and they can go do it. So, Sarah, you're a basketball

player in college and a good one. Do you think being an athlete or former athlete should be a requirement for a career and you know, being a referee. I don't know necessarily a requirement to be an official, but I definitely can say that it helped me and um my mindset. Just being a former athlete and the coaches and the teammates is kind of like the same thing

in the world of officiating. We have our supervisors, are are coaches, and we have our teammates, which we call crew and so it's just being able to go through that constructive criticism and applying it or your successes that's great, but knowing that you get to share it with other crewmates or teammates. But it's just those trying times as a former athlete that you just have to dig deep when you don't think you can run another suicide and you just have to find that strength to keep going.

Is a lot like the mentality I have out there on the field. So I don't know necessarily a requirement, but I can tell you it definitely has helped me. I mean, you've got to be super athletic, though, I mean you what is a preparation for a game. Yeah, it's uh, you know, during the off season, but there really is no off season with NFL officials are really even college officials, but it's, um, you know, that lifestyle of maintaining some type of strength and conditioning, if you will.

And the older I get, I just wanted to where I don't um, I stay in shape enough to where I don't injure myself, right um. And yeah, you've you've got to be mobile and to go through agility drills at the beginning of the season. But at some point you get on up an age and all that athletic ability.

I mean, I know that the mindsets there, But I'm gonna be throwing out the first pitch at my son's game this this Saturday, and Meridian and like cool and I'm like going, yeah, but it's been a long time since I've actually thrown a baseball from the mound to that. Uh yeah, when you get in your feutis and sixties, I think the athletic ability just goes away. I think it's more of like maintaining, uh, to where you don't

get hurt. So for the picking for the Super Bowl, the process was it like, uh, I gotta get my forty time down if if I want to make this game? Or how does that? How what did that process happen? Now? I mean, yes, you've got to be able to move, Okay, you know we've got to be able to move, be in position, and be focused out there on the field. But those fort yard sprints really don't mean anything because you know, we can't keep up with the players out there on the field. We just I'm out there on

the sideline. I'm hoping that the defensive team will come up and slow down the running back to where I catch up. Give me, give me a little relief there. But we uh were graded. Every game in the NFL is graded, really, yes, and so you start out, let's say with a hundred, and you can only go down

from there. So it's like you want to make sure you're correct and if you throw something that's incorrect, Uh, that hurts your chances of playoffs, and the the ranking from number one to number two is a very very small percentage, so it's um, yeah, so every every game is graded for every official. Wow, okay, I did. I had no idea that that didn't happened. That's cool. Do you have a Twitter? Do you see what people are talking about when when the officials are happening during during

the game. Yes, so I do have a Twitter, but it's it's kind of secretive. But I've started to like tweet stuff about my kids because they're My oldest is the middle infielder, just having the time of his life at Meridian Nice, and I have a junior that is uh six five catching and is a switch hitter. So I'm starting to kind of want to tweet stuff about them. But as far as the stuff that's on Twitter or any of the social media outlets, it doesn't bother me.

It's kind of comical if you people sit behind a computer screen or on a phone and they feel as if they're God and they're experts about everything, but I don't see them out there applying themselves, you know. So it's just it's funny. Are there any specific calls you've made at any point in your career that really stick with you, for better or for worse. I would say there are calls that you make that you know it impacted the game, and you want those to be in

a very positive way. And then the ones that you sit back and it's that one play that just eats at you or keeps you up at night. I would be lying if I said that they're they're not those, but you just have to say, you know, put it to bed. There was a play my rookie year that I called a fourth time out and there's only three per half and it's just wanted to crawl underneath the turf.

But you you learn from You learn from those, and you just have to have short term memory because if you're still thinking about it the next Sunday you work. It's kind of like playing sports. If you make an you better clear your head because the ball is coming right back at you. Yeah. I was umpiring for um one of my brother's little league games, like fifteen years ago, and I was on first base and it was a

really tight game. It's little league in New England, like didn't mean anything, and I remember saying out, but I did the safe sign and the parents on the side. You would have thought that I made the biggest mistake of my entire you know, career, and that was the last time I did it. So I think there's something in you that is definitely better better than me. Let's just put it that way. I don't know. Somebody asked me one time, I go, how do you get prepared

for like the players and the coaches? And I go little league football, flag football and little league like it's the pee wee league, the fans and the coaches. It's nuts. Yeah, so I can how brutal it was when you did that. Oh yeah, no, I still still don't sleep at night

because of the fifteen years later. Do you have to feel like you ever have to sort of talk more smack or sort of not you know, hide your femininity, but also sort of like show these boys, you know, these men, these huge football players and coaches like you mean business. Never never, absolutely never. I just I've learned this through probably athletics, that I've got approved to myself that I belong because it starts with me. But maybe

talk more smack. I mean, I just I'm I like to have a good time out there, and I take it back to when I was playing. I hated the officials, and truth be told, hated me. So I just don't want to be recognized. If you will all, I want to do my job and have a good time while I'm doing it. That's awesome. What plans do you think we could put in place in order to make officiating and coaching careers more commonplace for women and young girls.

I believe that the NFL is doing that. I think you're seeing a lot more of course, females and various roles within the NFL. And it's funny when the NFL does something the other conferences in colleges and it just kind of trinkles down and it's just letting them get in at a grassroots level. Start coaching your peewee, your son's team, or your brother's team, just and working your way up. And I truly believe when they're seeing more

women out there, more women will get involved. Absolutely. Um, do you have a favorite call or signal or hand signal? Because these are these are so fun to watch. Yeah, I just want to make sure I get it right. I definitely don't want to call pass interference and give the hand signal for holding kind of like the the out and the safe. Uh, it's the unusual ones that we don't call to often that you go, oh gosh, what is it, you know, when I'm giving my preliminary

something like that, But no, it's whatever. So I'm not known some gestures you can't do out there, you know that you would like to do. Absolutely well, this is well above my pay grade, and I mean everything is, but I couldn't help but think there are some official hand signals that could use a more modern upgrade. And I have a few ideas in mind to kind of liven things up. Do you mind if I run them by you run the bat? Okay, So this first one

I don't believe has its own specific signal yet. It's the fumble, Sarah, And I think I'm thinking the best way to illustrate a fumble is by making a total yike's face and like shifting your eyes back and forth and then just kind of shrugging anxiously like like this um,

just like a big whoops moment. Thoughts suggestions like this is a team effort, Sarah, I'm totally open to your So the funny thing is, we don't do a signal during a fumble that we do throw a bing bag, okay, and that's kind of like oops, I guess if you throw it, you know, Yeah, so this bumble okay, good, So next time I'll be looking to see if you know you're doing this out on the field. Um. The next one is delay of games, so if you of course know the current signal like this, well, no offense.

But that doesn't make any sense at all. So here's what I propose. You tap your wrists repeatedly like your cartoon way too in line, and just go ahead and throwing an eye roll or smirk for a good measure, like yeah, like the back judge does the delay of games. So I'll pitch it to the back judges and say, hey, I think we should consider this. Okay. That's that's all I'm asking for, just to get just to get an introduction. That's that's awesome. So now this one coincidentally also doesn't

add up for me, Sarah. It's the personal foul, and I mean, like, what is that? I think we totally scrap it and instead act out that Denzel Washington like thank God gift, you know, the one where he puts his hand on his heart and takes a side of relief. Um, that feels personal, like any feedback there. I mean, it's more expressive when we when we call it in the signal. I thought you were gonna say, it's more like punching or something. You Yeah, yeah, they did the business. I

think there was an official that said at one time. Okay, so do you think Washington to ploup for him? That's good. I think that's good. Yeah. So if you wouldn't mind taking these up the ranks, um, I'm happy to to pitch these at at you know, in a meeting or whatever, if you think that they're worthwhile. Well, like you, there are a lot of other people that are way about my pay grade, so I'll to them that have more pool I guess if you will. But yeah, I can

talk to somebody. Okay, great, that's that's awesome, Thank you so much. Um. All right, Sarah, before I let you go, I want to play a game we play with all our celebrity official guests. It's called good Call, Bad Call, And I'm going to read through some statements, some some football related, some not so much, rapid fire style, and you tell me if each is a good call or a bad call. Alright, signing Beyonce to a lifetime Super Bowl halftime show contract. That's a great call. She is.

She's bad to the bone because she could have people in front of her, so others, you know, I mean yeah yeah. Putting olives in a nacho dish meant for a group good call. Bad call, bad call, bad call. Wearing vertical stripes very slimming. Yeah, good call. Good call. Listening to Murder mystery podcasts before you go to sleep. Yeah, bad call. Screaming at the refs at a youth sporting event. M. Bad call. Doing the gritty t D dance after making

a solid point in a business meeting. Oh yeah, definitely, good call. Absolutely YEA. Proposing to a significant other at a football stadium, M bad god right, starting an email with the words it's nice to e meet you. Bad call. Doing a TikTok dance on your opponent's logo. M M. I'll be politically correct here. Bad call. Yes, parting your hair on the side a k A. The side part. Yeah yeah, good call me too. Rhythmically challenged coaches doing locker room dances with the team. Oh, good call. Eating

an entire sheet cake minutes ahead of kickoff. Bad call. Celebrating a victory by smashing your body into tables. That call stupid. Rebooting sex in the City without Samantha, Oh, terrible call. Terrible Playing catch with the Lombardi Trophy on a boat. I played the fifth Going on vacation by yourself A good call asking a woman who works for the NFL, But do you actually like football? Bad call?

All right, last question before I let you go um practice all those new hand signals that I already taught you. Do you have a secret handshake with the other women in the NFL? And can I be included? I don't currently, but now you've got my wheel spinning, So maybe we'll come up with one and you'll be the first one that I'll do it with. How about that? That's perfect? And I'll be looking, you know, next season for you and once in a while if you do this, I'm

gonna be like, that's a Ricky Hollywood shout out. That's exactly right, Sarah. Thank you so much and congrats on all your six us. It's been so amazing to watch Ah. Thanks for having me