37th Annual Fantasy Extravaganza

Hello, and welcome to the thirty fourth Annual Around the NFL Fantasy extrava Gunza with special guests Marcus Grant and Michael f.

Florio.

Love those guys, Greg Brick By Brick Rosenthal, Roto, Pat Patrick, Darty, the Big Fish, Evan Silva. Also Mark is here and now your host and the two time League of Record champion. Should have been three if Brees halted again hurt Dan hands oh unbelievable introduction. Thank you, and welcome Yes to the thirty seventh Annual Around the NFL Fantasy Extravaganza.

It is Mark. It is that time again.

I mean the way that I was build there, which I did notice everybody got introduced. Yeah, sure, I mean I will allow that to reflect my level of effort on this show.

That's what you'd like.

We're doing this old yarn again.

It's not as sit out the segment, Sessler. You know, this is one of the only shows my son Walker listens to every years getting into his fantasy league, and you just have to drop a performative f bomb right off the top.

I tried.

I tried to introduce the boys to Hard Knocks episode two yesterday. You know, tying it back together, Jeff Ulbrick Jet's DC. It's his fault. My wife pulled the chord. After about five minutes.

He went at it.

I've yet to see the episode, but he went down that road again.

Yeah, I mean, the.

Guy's got a potty mouth. Check out the Hard Knocks podcast recap with Colleen Wolfe.

I also did look at this. Did the Rich Eisen show this morning? Wow, get it tight, beautiful coffee cut.

It's a weird way to hold something here. We'll do this and talk to Hard Knocks. So that's fun.

Were you given that or did you lift that? Did you take that?

With?

Rich?

Personally handed it? And he was he said very nice things about you.

Mark.

Well, I'm a huge fan of the show. Now he did it, I already was.

I was kidding, well, but he would love to get us on the old Eiesen show there on Roku and.

Radio and all that. It's good. But who cares about this. Let's talk about the Fantasy extrava guns.

Yes, Greg, you are again brick by Brick, not triple G, your triple B. And you've been out of the fantasy game for a while now, and yet.

For one show a year in a decade, you're all the way back. Maybe, Yeah, this is we started this podcast in twenty thirteen. I left Road a World for the NFL in twenty twelve. Of you know, having looked back until the last year or two, now that my kids are in the fantasy league, Yeah, I try to help him out a little bit. Didn't help him out enough because they drafted Son, drafted Tom Brady and Mac Jones back to back rounds one and two Battle Torpedo

Is it?

Do you feel like other fathers and mothers that are attempting to guide their young children through an initial fantasy football experience, then they've got Greg Rosenthal operating as a dad in the same league.

It feels a little inequitable to me.

Well, they finished sixth and eighth out of eight.

So, oh do you think it? Do you think, yeah, that's crazy.

Do you think Greg's name still carries clout within the industry.

Within our anybody knows the industry?

I think so.

It's sort of like a founding father, like an Abraham Lincoln type figure.

I think to most young fantasy fans, a real Lincoln.

I don't know, maybe a little, a little maybe George Washington on the Delaware.

I'm over I'm over billing Greg a little bit with that reference.

We're gonna get to the extravaganza with our first guests in just a little bit. But first, let's get caught up with some housekeeping. Uh some news that we hit and again undefeated. We tape on Monday as soon as we complete the show. Uh, sizeable nugs drop. So now we have to address it. Now hit the news.

How are they gonna put play Echel Elliott at center?

Here?

Look at this formation.

It appears that Zeke's gonna go to center.

This looks like my flag football team.

Final play looks like Barnupel Prescott over the middle of the torpret gets spoke right away and not to do with the forty nine ers back to the championship team.

Listen, I didn't big Eric Roberts back behind the glass.

He pointed out that that is the final play of Ezekiel Elliott's Cowboys career. Yeah, getting pancaked as an absurd play call, not by Zaddy by the way.

Make it clear is that he's going plays this year.

Is Kellen Moore's last place?

Got Kellen Moore fired maybe, And now he's in LA and everybod's like, oh, what a great hire playboy drew that up? Okay, before we start handing out flowers and Super Bowl rings in so far for the AFC team there. Anyway, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to get after Kellen Moore there.

But well you had to your a journalist. Anyway, Zeke, he's done with the Cowboys.

I could think it he was gonna end up back with Dallas as the safety blanket there and the things that he still does well, like pass protection seemed to be something that Cowboys would want and the durability.

But he's not.

Instead, he's with the New England Patriots assigned Zeke to a one year contract that's worth up to six million. It could be significantly less than that, of course, and it probably will.

Greg Zeke. Listen, there are metrics.

There are stats like only three point eight yards per carry that are not great.

You pop the hoods.

Some of the metrics say he's one of the least efficient rushers in football last year for his workload, and yet he's still he's a name brand. He finds the end zone, he passed, protects as I said, very well. So there are reasons to think that he could help New England in their depth at running back.

It's fine, but I can't believe they're spending four million dollars on a backup running back and aging backup running back. It could work out less, could be more for Zeke instead of having all that workload. If you give him one hundred touches, maybe it can be pretty effective as a short yarded guy. We know he's a great pass protector Ramandri Street. Stevenson definitely needed a backup. I kind

Yeah, I think so.

I mean, but I couldn't agree more with the Damien Harris aspect. The Bill Belichick, the general manager, has cobbled together a questionable collection of skilled position players on offense. I don't hate the idea of Elliott being used in short yardage situations.

I mean that will need to be the case.

He ran for two yards per carry over the last four games of last season. I don't think he's quite as shot as some people would suggest necessarily.

But I like to fit.

I think it mattered where he went, and I think that if you're gonna get good run blocking in New England, I don't if you're a Ramandre Stevenson fantasy guy, like this is not good for him.

I don't love it for him.

I don't think it's bad. I just think it doesn't help.

But I think he's a goal line maybe it could be an issue, but he might vulture a few touchdowns. I just didn't think Mark that Zeke had any juice in his legs last two year.

I actually I'm not surprised he got a job, but I like what.

He was when he got out into the open, which is rare. Yeah, and it was time to turn on the jets. He just seemed like he was lumbering rather than clearly clearly not the same player. But I just I don't hate the landing spot. I do wonder, like it's late August, we're weeks away from, you know, meaningful games, like what has Zeke Elliott been doing all offseason? Or do we trust that he's in the finest shape of his life coming off last year.

He's been up and down, and he showed up to I'm glad he brought that up about Zeke because I actually thought in each of the last two years he showed up in At the beginning of the seasons, I was like, oh, Zeke looks pretty good, he's moving well, and then within about two or three weeks he suffers a minor they say, injury, and he always plays through it. He's got to be one of the toughest players of

I'm trying to convince it light, but I'm not really slight.

Direction Mark it's mid August, not August. Feels like late August.

Not to be outdone, the New York Jets finally get it done with Dalvin Cook, the former Vikings Pro Bowl running back, a one year, wait for it, eight point six million dollar deal.

Up to eight points up up to He's been doing a lot of heavy lifting up to but I did get some details in it.

I think it's seven base yeah.

Okay, which is still juicy and sizey. And this is a move that made all the sense in the world for the Jets. And I don't worry about the money either, because it's a one year deal.

I should you.

And you could always and they they had some funny money because of the Aaron Rodgers, the outrageous decision that he took that pay cut to help the team and surprise everyone in the football world.

So the Jets had some money, Layer Aroun.

Now would they love to take some of that money and go trade for a writer left tackle. I'm sure they would, but that's They're not growing on trees at this stage. So they say, we have this money. Cook is playing hardball. Get him in the building. And I think it's so important for this team with Breese Hall not to ask or expect him to be the dude in September to let Hall, who came off the pupplace

I love the sign, I love the move.

I think, like Breecee, Hall last year was one of the more fascinating backs around and the offense went completely off a cliff when he was injured, and so you don't know exactly what you're going to get from him out of the gate. So it's an incredibly wise depth move. Dalvin Cook, another guy that people talking about like sort of declining, played through injury, like I mean, you get a you're gonna get He sounds like he's got a

So it was a bad shoulder.

He's right, Well, practice for a couple of weeks, which is another plot, but all of it.

Though, that's like, it's just like if you're the Jets, we get it. This team is going for it. And I hear people saying like there's a little bit of a dream team vibe to this. That Eagles team that fell off fell off the side of the universe like a decade ago.

I don't think though. I don't think.

So.

They've got a legit defense, they've stocked up on offense. The Aaron Rodgers generosity move allowed this to happen. If you're Joe Douglas, no brainer.

I liked it.

I think Cook has been written off too much by the cognatesz Senti because I think some of his best skills, his vision, his instincts were still there.

Last year.

He didn't quite have the same juice because he was playing through that injury or the same bit of aggression. But the same thing with Zeke that I think if he's splitting carries, you get more out of him, except he's at a much higher level than Ezekiel elliott Is as a difference maker. And more importantly, I just don't know why anyone is confident Breise Hall is going to be a difference maker this year. He's coming off a really serious injury. He's just coming off the pupp list

And also like Michael Carter and Zonovan Knight are quality backs too.

You've got depth there.

I mean, what happened last year cannot happen this year.

We should mention he has like a pending legal case based on his domestic violence issue that you can look into. The There's a lot going on there, but it's a civil lawsuit and that could be an issue that the NFL steps in at some point, or it could not, but it's possible worth noting.

For sure.

This is a summer tropoler, but Breese Hall is measured at twenty three miles per hour sprint speed, so he must be feeling good. The thing with the ACL recoveries, with running backs, especially, you just never know because sometimes a guy's not the same. For two years, Adrian Peterson came back and ran for two thousand yards. Now Peterson, Yeah, but I'm just saying, like, you never know what kind of recovery the guy has. But now they have some

Now will be a good team.

We'll see, Well, the schedule could send that sideways, but yes.

It's a good roster. It checks out that they'll win a lot of these games.

That are logic and the Jets don't always go hand in hand.

Though.

Other news mentioned the Cowboys Zeke an ex Cowboys still a Cowboy Zach Martin. They were structured the contract if their talented right guard that holdout is over. Rap Sheet reported that Martin will earn just over eighteen million in each of the final two years of his contract. Nice Rays, six time All Pro and Greg this is an offensive line that you know, and we talked about this a

Center of it.

Yeah, I don't think anyone was ever worried. This is where it's nice to get drafted by the Cowboys. They do take care of their stars, their future Hall of Fame, which he is and uh like he's one of the best players of his generation. He'll be like, you don't really think of Zach Martin, but one day we'll be watching him on on that Hall of Fame weekend. I'm trying to think if he was drafted right in front of what draft was that? Because people they booed him when when Zach Martin nobody wants to.

Take a guard Fans don't want to guard like and then a guy becomes a lynchpin of your roster and you don't feel that the same way.

Right, It's like one of those things anyway, it's not sexy, it's not.

But they got booed right when it happened.

Oh yeah, it was Johnny Manzel was from that freaking uh documentary.

That's why.

Because they wanted Johnny Manziel and instead the Cowboys chose Zach Martin.

So good job by Jerry Jones choosing Zach Martin and.

Jerry Jones he had some manziel fascination and like Jerry Jones, the GM used to get killed and there seems to be more.

There was some wisdom of plug.

That's a pretty big fork in the road moment where you draft a Hall of Famer instead of Johnny Manzi.

No, let's let's talk a little bit about the Manzeld tomorrow. Tomorrow they show.

Because there's only did it, there's a lot, there's a lot to hit there.

In other news, injury News didn't like seeing this right before we started. Buccaneers wide receiver Russell Gage his season is over after he suffered an injury at Wednesday's joint practice with the Jets. I mean it's Wednesday right now, it's still the morning as we're taping this on the West Coast, so they already know his season's over. It was a non contact injury sustained while he was back pedaling during seven on seven drills.

Uh.

This has been an issue for Mark throughout his Buccaneers career. These injuries are an issue. He took a pay cut to stay with the team and now he's out of the pan.

And I really thought last year that you know, when Tom Brady was one of the reason hype right and I really thought he was he was an underrated guy. It didn't work out, and to lose another year suddenly your career is just floating and You've got Mike Evans, who's been getting rave reviews during camp. You got Chris Godwin, but there isn't much else elt after that, David Moore. It's real thin, and it just puts more pressure on Baker Mayfield slash Kyle Trast to make this thing work.

I think people sometimes overreact too much to the surroundings. Mike Evans and Godwin are going so late in fantasy drafts. You feel for Russell Gage, who I thought was a great signing by them a year ago and it hasn't worked out. But fantasy wise, like all those targets are going to that dude, even if they're not that good of a passing team, like someone's got to get a thousand yards.

Those guys are money.

That might come up later. And finally, the news, tragic news. This really sucked. Alex Collins, the former Arkansas running back who played five seasons in the NFL, including a very memorable run with the Baltimore Ravens back in twenty seventeen. He died after his involvement in a motorcycle in Florida on Sunday night, just twenty eight years old. You talk about, like for us the Aten R we've gone into our

And to see his life end like this, it's hard to even fathom.

Yeah, I mean, reading about how it happens, incredibly tragic.

But the people that.

Played with them in the locker room, I think you kind of forget that these guys beyond just their numbers and like what they do on the field, some of them had these incredible personalities and got to where they were because of it. And he just got incredibly praised by the people that played with him. So I don't know, it's just like man like at this one stopped me in my tracks when I when I read how it.

Happened, he's really sad.

He always said, like when they would do the interviews, he had such a joyous personality. I saw that this school in Ireland where he had gone to, the Irish dance school like to like learn because it kind of became his thing, and he went over there. I think it's called Drake Irish Dance it's called He went over there and made friends with all the people at the school, really had a connection with them. They actually did like a dance this week in honor of him. They said

So rest in peace, very said Alex Colin.

Colin is dead at the age of twenty eight. All right, that's it for the news. That's what's happening. We'll be back after a break and begin the Fantasy Extravaganza.

Will be right back right Welcome back. It is time to dig it.

We promised you high level fantasy minds, so we got to start right inside the building with Marcus Grant and Michael f Florio.

Fantasy Studs welcome back. Thanks man.

I'm thinking of the music. It's like an awards show or something.

Well, you deserve it. It's a big deal. It's a big deal to have you here. It's a big deal.

We our whole thing is, we're only gonna do one fantasy show all year. We stay off your corner because you guys do it well. But if we're gonna do it, we're gonna make it count.

I love being part of the extravaganza every year.

It's a good time and I always love I love Sessler's Fantasy corner.

The whole deal. It's great. Yeah, Marca marks you older.

He's got he's got money, and he just doesn't want to be on the corner anymore.

Oh, we took a corner. As you remember, it was a violent part of town.

You were like combat helmet.

Yes, so I don't need that at this point. Like the youth, more youth like younger version of me was, you know, keen to that.

I understand, Yeah, I get it.

So in terms of like how we want to attack the conversation with you boys, we thought just talk a little ADP and uh average draft position for the uninitiated, which would be weird you got to know that certain things you got.

To know even compete in your league.

No, ADP, and we could talk about Greg what what jumped out to us? What seems weird? What feels like a good value, a bad value? Maybe I'll tee it up this way, Mike, who's your favorite kind of undervalued guy?

ADP? Right now?

Oh?

I like Quentin Johnston a whole lot.

Really.

I think that if either Keenan Allen or Mike Williams miss his time, I think this Chargers offense.

Which they will.

Yeah, And I think this Chargers' offense is going to be one of the very best in the league. Now with Kellen Moore there, I think Justin Herbert could take a huge jump.

And we went to Chargers camp weeks ago. There looks like it looks like.

A basketball team. Their receiving room and he towers over everyone so he could win downfield good after the catch.

I really like him. I like Quinston Johnston. I like I like Deontay Johnson Pittsburgh. You know he's that guy that all of us who do this love Deontay Johnson because you know, he's got the technical skills. He got a ton of targets, and then you know people who are more casual just look and say he didn't score a touchdown last year, and it's like sort of hard to argue that, but one, you can't score fewer than zero, right, So so regression positive regression has to be coming his way.

Yeah.

When I was looking at the average raft position, I never look at it until the day or two before this show, and some things just stand out to like that and like they're a great risk receivers available in that area of the draft lot. You know, Bryan Brandon Nyuk's going pretty late, Mike Williams is going pretty late.

Yeah, before we throw it to the experts on this, like he's never played before, sure, but I'm just curious, like if you look at who are the other guys running backs that hit the came into the league, like Adrian Peterson flashes in my mind as an example, Greg, that was during your brick by brick era.

Was he a guy that was going top five overall?

I mean, I feel like if you're adp as a rookie who's never played before is top ten, you're pretty unique already.

Also, like Clyde Edwards Hilaria, we just did this. I mean, I trust he's going around where Clyde Edwards Hiliro was going.

That's kind of what I mean. Maybe that's part of it.

A lot of people I was burned in his rookie season, Like maybe people are jumpy about that.

I think I think it's a little bit of you know, I'll say this, people are less scared to draft rookies in the first round now than they were a few years ago. Like I remember when Zeke came out and everybody was like, you know, and a lot of people analysts were like, hey, he's a first round pick, and a lot of pushback was he's never before. But you know, we've seen Zeke do it, We've seen Saquon do it, we've seen Christian McCaffrey do it, and so I think

But like, what what to your point? What was like Zeke Specks the year.

I guess he was good in year three two, But like, is it right off the bat he's getting two thousand.

Years the back end? You know?

Sticking with running backs here that you know two guys that scare the hell out of me personally, Josh Jacobs and Jonathan Taylor. And I'm looking here at a fantasy football calculator. They're they're going twenty four to twenty five average, man.

I wouldn't.

I don't know if I want anything to do with guys that have that much stake around them. And Taylor also has the ankle stuff that maybe you're still concerned about surprise where they are or does that seem about right?

I think it seems about right. Late second, early third round is where you get them. Look, there's risk obviously tied to them, but they're the kind of like league winning type picks. Because if you could get Jonathan Taylor or Josh Jacobs and they end up being there week one and they have their normal type of season, those are guys that were gonna be late first early, like going around where Bijon and Saquon and those guys were going.

That's what I'm saying.

With Bijon, like Echeler, we've seen it, but what are the odds he's actually got to be that good again this year?

I don't think it's And here's the one last thing on this, but when you look, if you don't go for the Josh Jacobs, Jonathan Taylor big swing there. If they're available, you know the guys that you're going after that according to the list I'm looking at here, it's like Nauji Harris, it's like, Okay, Joe Mixon, Travis etn I like him more than another's, Brice Haw his injury issues, and now Dalvin Cook.

So it's like, if the next name is, oh, Jamiir Gibbs, that's who you want. Okay, go on top of the fourth round.

Jamiir Gibbs is sort of like arbitrage Bjeon Robinson, right. I think that's how people are sort of injured about it. That he has a great skill set, He's in an offense that was great last year. DeAndre Swift leaving has sort of opened up an opportunity. But you don't have to pay that first round draft price. You can wait until the third, maybe fourth round, and Jamior Gibbs is still sitting.

Yeah, but what Yeah, I get it.

It's fine.

Fourth round, but one of them is like one of the greatest running back prospects of all time.

That's all I'm just saying. Sometimes when it seems obvious, it is obvious.

How do you deal with when speaking of rookies, Because I look at the tight end position number one, You've got a limited amount of like premiere tight ends. You can't sleep on that round after round. You might have to go really early if you want to get one of these guys. But I feel like rookie tight ends they can be pumped up, but you really don't get the production sometimes from that position until year two or three. But then you hear about the buzz around Dalton Kincaid,

I love them both. I do a those I'll say this.

I am also not averse to taking Travis Kelce in the first round just because set it and forget it.

I don't need that headache.

But if I'm waiting, Kincaid and Laporter are two guys that I'm traveling a lot this year.

Kelsey's going we top six or seven.

Yeah, I mean he's maybe even tough. I see him at four in someplaces. Yeah.

I literally part of me with Kinkaid, I will admit, part of me, you know, still has emotional scars watching him run over USC last year when you have like eleven d catches against them in like the regular season. But I think he's great. I think he's gonna get a lot of opportunity. And Sam Laporta a talented guy.

Cautionary tale. I did it two years in a row because I was so high on him. You want to talk about guy coming out of college, seeing his potential all time prospect, Kyle Pitts, and he's going at the top of the seventh round. So finally the fantasy world's like, we gotta pump the brakes here, and of course their offense there. I was gonna run the ball out with Beijon there and the quarterback situation, where are Kyle Pitts friendly.

Shot are we gonna do it?

Is it smart to get him around early and hope that it finally pops here?

I think so coming into two drafts, I want one of the top seven tight ends this year, and my top favorite targets are Kelsey in the first, Darren Waller,

That's why like Kelsey at fifth seems insane to me, because it's like he's never been taken close to that high. And yes, he's coming off one of his best seasons. He's thirty four years. Like, don't take anyone in the season that they're going way higher than they've ever gone before. You mentioned you wanted a top seven tight end. So just for our listeners, Andrews is going around round three,

That's good.

Waller and got her in the round six area feels tasty to me. God Her, I feel like every every year, I feel like he's going to have a career year, and every year he does. And I and what you hear out of Philadelphia, I think he's just going to be a huge part of that offense.

Yeah, I love Waller this year. I'm still in on Kyle Pitts. I would say this with Kelsey. Part of the reason you're seeing it is because there was no greater single player advantage in Fantasy.

Right that was last last I Look, That's what I'm saying.

A wise man once told me don't draft last year's best team, So that's something to keep it.

I have a personal question. I think people are familiar with the app cameo, where you can, you know, provide videos and birthday messages to people. But it comes to a feat and it's to get access to people like yourself. Michael Florio is charging twenty five dollars for a personal video. Well that seems reasonable, Marcus. I just wanted to, like to get a comunist. You're charging fifty dollars. Well, yeah, what's happening here? Well, you know, what are you providing the U not providing?

You take what the market will give you.

Right, scary question, fair, Marcus, You've been here at the NFL in fantasy for a while.

This is twenty.

Eleven, okay, in Florio is a little bit more of a nuke. No, I know.

I had to see. I was like, no one's gonna pay fifty dollars.

Your stock is on the rise, though there's Mike's value.

Should I make it like twenty thirty? From an ADP standpoint, I think I think.

You bump it?

Look I will I was that I I sort of went with the recommendations of the cameo brain Trust.

They were like, yeah, like what is Beetlejuice charge for his cameo? Like, well, let's get some other like celebrities out there figure it out.

I think the juice is still with us.

All I know is I heard that uh Dean Norris Hank from Breaking Back is charging around.

Two hundred bucks for cameos.

Apparently the guy who plays Kevin from the Office makes like that's his living now.

He's the most lucrative. Yeah, he wants like millions of dollars. Here would be my the way I would do it.

Do it like you're putting a house on the market, right, so you said it high, and then if you have to quietly go to your real estate broke and be like, all right.

Take it down, then you do it. You're not gonna depress your value. Maybe I've had to already do that once.

All right on.

One guy, pay you twenty dollars, let me send you a video.

Yeah, the equivalent I feel like of Mike Florio on cameo being a bargain at twenty five bucks. I think after I looked at all these ADP's and some seemed insane to me. When you go through a whole offseason and not see anything. The one that was by far the most insane is that Damian Pierce of the Texans is going at the end of the fifth or sixth round.

Me that this Cily is the roof is the Jordan?

Yeah, I mean it doesn't. I don't get it, but that, like it's insane. He would be behind Madison, Kenneth Walker, and Miles Like all of it seems insane to me. Go draft Damien Pierce. Agree or disagree, I know I love Dan.

I will say this, I want to keep him at that ADP because I think it's a bargain. But I think I think there's a general fear of the Texans offense, Like if you look, there are no Texans really getting draft.

Ain't no Texans on my team. And I think the other part is, but.

They have a good line. It's kind of sneaky. They have a good line, and it can't be worse than last year. He was great last year.

Right, But I think the knock ons that he doesn't really well, that he doesn't catch the ball, but they seem to be working that into the arsenal this year too.

My only concern with him is that it's a first year OC and he comes from San Francisco who always like to rotate their run. Even Christian McCaffrey, we were like, why is this guy not playing ninety percent of the snaps anymore? Okay, they signed Devin Singletary. I'm a little bit concerned if he'll eat into the workload.

So if you're for the casual like newer fantasy person and you're sitting there and you know these guys, but you know you're dealing with someone like Alvin Kamara or Jamison Williams, you're dealing with early season suspensions just they just go undrafted or you grab them late, Like what do you do with Alvin Kamara.

I love both of those players, like Jamison Williams is one of my most drafted receivers, Alvin Kamara from running backs because I don't care about the first three weeks of the season. For Alvin Kamara, I can get by. There's no buyers, injuries haven't piled up yet, so it's easy to set here, especially when you could plan for it. So for me, I just want my team and it's optimal shape. Come to fantasy playoffs, and I think Jamison Williams and Alvin Kamara could be league winners if they hit.

I love that move.

I remember winning a league once with when I had I grabbed Tom Brady during his the flake Gate suspension earlier than maybe others thought, and then you just stash him and before you know it, it's October or whatever, and some of these suspensions tall and then it's like it's like the baseball GM who tries to play cad an angry fan base about oh, when this guy comes back, it will be about It's like trading for a big time kind of is that way?

Aaron Judge comment here is that what this is.

I got some rage Ran Cashman, but that's fine. But I love doing that move. I get guys that are out of the picture and then when they show up, you're like, oh my god, no.

One hundred percent. Like I'm people were drafting Kamara anyway. They were sort of, you know, being a little bit cautious, and I think he was going around like round eight and in the moment we found out what the suspension was, people were willing to Yeah, people were willing to reach a couple.

Of rounds higher, but no, no doubt to buy it.

But I'd say in the short term, you know, if you're willing to go get Jamal Williams, say in round ten or eleven, you know the first three weeks there's a big opportunity for him there.

And have faith in your ability to just fill that spot for three weeks. He can the third or four round player. It's like a study I read and talk about this with my kids, Like one of the things you can most easily predict scientifically among kids, like who's going to be happier in life or have more successes, Like if you're the type of person when you have as a kid something in front of you, and you can wait until tomorrow to actually have it, like if you or if you have to have it right now?

I want it right now. I want to I could wait on fantasy players, not chocolate.

Do you have any like wide receivers before we let you go, just Eddie that you think are a nice value mid, early, late, whatever you want.

I keep saying that rumors of Tyler Lockett's fantasy demise are greatly exaggerated, you know, when the moment they drafted Jackson Smith and Jig but everybody's like, oh, it's over for Tyler Lockett, And I'm like, have we forgotten that he's actually outperformed Dk Metcalf the last couple of years. He has been the better of the two receivers. And I think that the Seahawks sort of going all in on Geno Smith's suggests they want to throw the football more.

Who needs that? I love Tyler Lockett as well.

But one area that I love it for receivers is like that late third early fourth round because chrissel Lave's early third round. But like the Lave, Calvin Ridley, Amari Cooper are three receivers that I want on as many teams as I can get.

They all go in that range, So I just try to target.

Whichever one that seems like incredible values.

Throat two others out there, I'd go crazy, yeah big.

Going early fifth round Terry McLaurin and Christian Wattson two guys I will if they're sitting there for me at the top of the fifth round, I'm all over both of those guys.

Absolutely.

McLaurin just he's sort of the new Alan Robinson, Like he's that guy that I just if I could wish one thing, I would just wish for him to actually get like a really good quarterback. But he's somehow figured out how to process.

Yeah, he's he gets his and imagine if how could play. We shall see before we say goodbye to our friends in the NFL media fantasy realm.

Do you want to share some of the reporting that we've heard.

So, Yeah, I heard, I heard a little whisper. Just you know, you've probably heard this too many times. Michael left Florio, But you share a name with my old boss Mike Florio, who was a prominent position in the in the industry.

Did not know he was your old bass until recently.

Yeah, I worked there for three years. It was like right below Mike if writes a memoir that he's going to do like three three chapters on the memoir him, I just heard whispers that he wasn't happy. There's another Mike Florio on the scene, which it makes sense that there's another you're Mike Florio, then there's another Mike Florio that arrives and that this has caused some consternation in

Yeah, he apparently he doesn't like me very much, or or my name, which I'm like, we have the same name, you would we do the same thing.

We have a lot in common.

It's not your personality, Thoments, it's the it's the overlap.

This can't be true. It's on his radar. Yeah.

I was shocked when I heard I was even on his radar. I was like, oh I because it was like a year or two ago. I was like, oh, I didn't even think.

Did you add the F because of him?

Yeah?

They they want you to change your name.

I didn't want to go by a name that I is not my name, because then I wouldn't respond to.

It, Like if you were like you are him, Yeah, you're Mike Floria. So I was. But the funniest thing is a lot of people think he's my dad.

Right, So I get you.

He talks about his kid all the time. He has he has one son, and he talks about him all the time. And he's old enough that he's he's not quite his old d but I think he's in his twenties.

So okay.

But when we would get emails from you when you were in research way back when, like I was like, that's got to probably be Mike Florio's son, right, like he's in football. He's stuck in on the concept.

Investigator was like, it's got to be a son. Yeah, No, my dad's name is Frank. He does not work in sports at all. Home.

What would the option be not go by Mike. I think that's ridiculous. Otherly, you're younger, and I think you've got a chance. You're you're going to take over.

Somebody has used to.

Pass the name Torch to me there. They wanted me to go by Frank because and I was like, no, that's my dad. That's that's what I can't Frank.

But you're getting you're getting dinged. You said for like you go and pro footballs.

You're mentioned. Maybe that's it. He's getting a lot of.

Question For years, I would get like mentions the people being like how are you reporting on this?

And I'm like, I am not reporting.

For a while, Cynthia Frielan was asking me to send all of those tweets to her, and she would just tell people like no, it's it's not him.

But but just to put a bow on this one.

P F p F T.

Florio hasn't reached out to NFL. Florio one on one.

I've never spoken. You should have some kind of say okay something.

Michael Florio, thank you very much. Marcus Grant, thank you very much. Check out the guy's content on NFL dot Com, on NFL Network, on NFL Plus.

These guys will win you titles.

The NFL Fantasy Pod, all of it bang a lot of content.

I guess if you just go to the app right like it, supposedly, everything's going to be in there at some point.

That's what they tell us.

Allegedly, we just just prop us up like Mannekins, will do what we need to do, put us in the right silos.

Point me at a camera and microphone, and I'll just talk for a few minutes.

All right, boys, thank you, It's it.

All right.

We are back. Our next heavy hitter.

Covers the NFL in the Fantasy World for NBC Sports. Many know him as Rodo Pat His mother knows him as Patrick Darth.

What's up, Bud? Not much.

I feel like I'm watching highlights of Super Bowl twelve and eleven thirty Central on your network.

I love it.

As I've said on this on this special before, Roto Pad holds a special place in my heart.

Frist of all a mensch, just a good guy.

But also the only fantasy column I read every week is his Rotal World column when he goes through each matchup and and it has helped me win titles. So I got to bring that to the audience and again, sincerely, thank you sir for all your help through the years.

It's my pleasure and I have to give you thanks. You gave me one of the only compliments that's ever really stuck with me.

I think it was you.

I don't remember, as you were in Mark Hopes, but you praised my thought strangeness. You were talking about my writing style, and you praised my thought strangeness, and that's like exactly what I go for.

Okay, well, I think praises It sounds like something Mark would say.

We've talked about roto Pats.

But when you can tell on Rotor World like, oh that's his blurb, right, it's not any it's clearly his because he's gone down an avenue of snarkiness, slash, a little bit left of center, take in its loud. It makes it the site all that more enjoyable. I'm glad to see waiting to see how you rebrand Rotor World. For the fourteenth time.

You know, an off season from.

Now, you're still doing blurbs though, right, are you out of the game.

You're in the blurb I'm not all the way out.

I'm less in the game than I used to be, but I'm still blurbing.

Like that was that was the moves when I when I was there, I tried to set the framework at some point, maybe you get off the blurbs because it's it's like a gristmill, you know, you got to get off the blurbs point.

You do ten to fifteen blurbs per I've missed the last part of that.

Like hours is what I aim for. But is right, Blurbing is the most difficult first world job.

On the planet.

Like it's just like there the definition of a first world problem job where you're just reading Twitter all day. But there's something about it that is so grueling and soul runs.

It was fun, fun, you just robbing souls.

No, I enjoyed it. It was like it really was the framework and it.

Was it was fun. Employee totally different.

It was great to work with the pat back in the day. And I'm glad that you're still there. You know, it's like many people we're gonna have. Evan Silvan have gone on to do other great things, but you are the connection still for me personally, so that's important.

That's between my era and now.

I signed in Atlanta brave style contract where they got me under for one hundred years at the age of twenty two.

So can I ask you about some a news item that just popped by the way this week at least, which was Richardson? Where are you at on Anthony Richardson? Where he should be in fantasy drafts? Because now that you know we's start in Week one, that kind of takes I don't know where he's settling in average draft position. I would be extremely intrigued to have him on my team. I'm kind of not worried about where he's getting taken.

Well, you asked him, so he was a guy who was gonna talk about.

We're one of like the loose question we threw around, maybe come up here is who am I worried about? And I'm just a little worried about Anthony Richardson, who, depending on who you ask, could be a huge ADP value or it could be a huge ADP reach.

He's like the QB ten or eleven.

And it's just because of Justin Fields, because of Jalen Hurts, because of Josh Allen, because of Lamar Jackson. I think fantasy managers have kind of become conditioned to think, well, he's a quarterback who can run, like guaranteed top ten fantasy season, and like kind of the belief that like these insane dual threat seasons grow on trees when you know they just don't. Like, we didn't get that from Justin Fields as a rookie. We kind of got it

We don't really know.

I think Jonathan Taylor will be out there Week one. There's just so much moving parts for a prospect who is so inexperienced, you know, barely basically played one season of college football. He is is My colleague Kyle de Worschick always says he's Dereck Henry in a quarterback's body. That will help with the rushing, of course, and the

Out and everyone's laughing at me. But he is someone I'm worried about for this season.

That's fair that you need like a little bit of rushing. I mean a little bit of passing, because Josh Allen actually did run quite well as a rookie, but you're right, his passing was so forgettable that he didn't really matter. I guess I figure if you could draft another quarterback with him.

That's Was there anything more predictable than Anthony Richardson being named starter as soon as humanly possible?

Again, now, it seems that the.

Fingerprints from ownership are all over this, to the point where the headline on ESPN dot Com is like Richardson shock to be named starting quarterback. It's like they we didn't need to go down that route. We're gonna focus on quarterbacks here with roto Pat. I famously am in a two quarterback league, as you know, Pat, and so quarterbacks win leagues for us, We'll have multiple quarterbacks coming off the board in the first round in our league.

It's not like that obviously in the majority of leagues.

You brought up Lamar Jackson, he's going top five in the quarterback game.

Still, where are you at with him?

Are you buying in on all the talk? You know, he's freshly paid, he's got more weapons. Are we gonna get get MVP level? Lamar back is do you feel safe making that pick in twenty twenty three?

I do?

And you know, some of it is kind of narrative based, like as.

You mentioned with the contract, he finally paid, like as if that magically changes everything. But it did seem like, and I'm not saying this at all is a judgment on the player. It seemed like last year, if he had been paid, he probably maybe could have come back for the final game or two of the season. That is pure speculation. It was the albatross hanging over the

By the end.

I mean, Lamar talked about opposing defenses like literally calling out the plays just seemed like something that needed to be refreshed in fantasy. We wanted it to be something refreshed with something more pass heavy, because in fantasy, it's like, even if the Ravens become a more passing oriented offense, it's not like.

The running's ever gonna go away. For Lamar Jackson.

It's not like his signature attribute it's suddenly just going to disappear. He's going to scramble, there's going to be design runs, there's going to be like game breaking plays, and it's finally pairing that with something not only more passing oriented, but something passing oriented.

With actual receivers. Last year, I looked.

Up with Lamar his final full game, his receiver trio was Deshaun Jackson, Devin Duverne, and Tamarcus Robinson.

Just a very very hard.

Way to make a living and real life and in fantasy football kind of does everything has changed.

I wouldn't rush back either that with that trio.

No, no, And it's it's some of its narrative base, but it's a narrative that makes sense. And I do think we are finally getting like a return to glorya Lamar Jackson Season four years after he won the MVP.

I for people that are maybe newer to Fantasy, I think you know, when I was young, I always wanted to go quarterback early because it's like it's all you know, quarterbacks are your heroes and all this stuff. It throws me a little bit with the way that you have some of these duelst guys like Ramandre Stevenson right now has a higher ADP than Jalen Hurts, Kyle Pitts over

That's why I should have two QB leagues because QB's run the NFL. Why would you have fantasy not have them have the value that they deserve.

All right, I'll shut up.

No, it's an extremely good rant. And yeah, near like the end.

Of like the Brady Breeze Roethlisberger, like Philip Rivers era. It had become like comical where it's the most important position in global sports and like, yeah, I'm not even going to draft a quarterback. You know, I'll wait till September. Third oh, I had Kirk Cousins.

On the waiver wire.

Like it became like, you know, like a staring contest basically who could be like the hardest drafter in the league and never taking a quarterback?

But the dual threats exactly yeah, wait sure he just left his quarterback spot.

Blankell season went oh and thirteen, but I really admire his character. But the like this crop of dual threats and finally, like the turnover of talent at the time, like this, the infusion of young pocket passing talent and Patrick Mahomes Joe Burrow, it really like reinvigorated the quarterback position. It's a savvier drafting public now, so it's harder to get late on quarterback. It used to be like you could just get like someone like the next Jalen Hurts

Or Yeah, it really I think the game changed, like five, five or six guys, seven guys are going in the

Now I have the top one or two tiers I feel like are more separated than they are at some point in like fantasy history. So there is like a big difference between like the top six or seven quarterbacks. But that being said, it's still like it still goes twenty twenty two deep, right.

Like Rock He's just going thirteenth a quarterback to us going eleventh, I mean Dak like.

Russell Wilson's like going like QB twenty depending on where you're playing, like who could be a pretty obvious bounce back, but the better, the better supporting cast than Sean Payton. So I think the high like the top one or two tiers, there's a bigger separation than there is sometimes, but it's still the deepest position in fantasy. And if you don't want to use that earlier on Capitol, you're gonna be able to stream. It's a little more work, but you're still gonna be able to.

Do wear are you on?

Like what would be your approach be to Deshaun Watson? Do you look at the overall career or do you look like the disaster from last season?

Do you just stay away entirely?

It is weird.

I mean some of like these guys, even when they're still like prime age where it's still twenty seven to twenty eight, missing a season does something strange to an athlete. But I'm still I'm viewing it basically as this is the real follow up to his twenty two twenty where the last time we saw Deshaun Watson play full football season he played in an MVP level. The supporting cast didn't get like infinitely better, but it got better like he has another deep threat and Cedric Tillman. They have

Let me ask you this because you talked about in these names that popped up ready pocket passers. You know, guys like Cousins Rogers at this point, although he does have mobility, but he's older, Derek Carr, same type of situation.

Stafford.

Certainly, these are guys that, if they're healthy, you could kind of lock him in to give you nice production. But does it make more sense too if you're gonna wait that long for those type of guys to go. Pick Daniel Jones instead with the old life hack that you're getting the rushing even if the upside is a passer is least where do you come down to that you take in a locked and loaded pocket guy or a more rangey type player who might not be as good.

Probably go for the rangey at least the first because the pocket guy is always going to be there on the waiver wire. And like you mentioned Daniel Jones, who had a career year and still did not get in the top twelve at quarterback last year, you could go like much crazier and like the crazy guy this year is Sam Howell and likes he especially named the starter I can't even remember, but.

Not official official, but basically the.

Guy with some running juice, the guy who has two really good young receivers.

Pretty good overall.

So I mean, I'm just saying to Greg, maybe one of your frustrations is fantasy.

It doesn't matter if you're good in real life.

I have a difference, no frustration.

I think I think you're I think that's a great late QB two if you don't want to bother to take your second quarterback until the very end. If you're in a one quarterback league. Howell was chucking people in college. I think he can throw the ball a little bit. Like to me, he's a perfect late guy. It's funny how little respect Daniel Jones gets. I mean I looked at it.

I will quote never respect right.

I looked at his QBR like QBR over the decades, and Daniel Jones's QBR rushing value, which was about the same as Alan and Hurts last year, was comparable to like Michael Vick's best seasons as a runner.

Like, that's the level of production you were getting.

So if you get anything out of him passing and you didn't get much last year, uh, that's.

Actually not a maybe a bad value.

Play either, And if something is maybe repeat who though, who's your favorite of all these guys, who are your favorite QB targets?

The guy I'm ending up with the most again and guaranteeing I will be hurt again is justin Herbert. Because everyone knows real football fantasy, you don't hit your wag into the Chargers because every year they will have the best roster in the NFL. They don't have the best

Was one of those things were seeing like the number got bigger every week.

But he Drew Brees thing. I remember that a couple It.

Gets the point where he had more cracked ribs than any humans.

Everything available, Yeah, but the Charge.

They swapped out Joe Lombardi for Kellen Moore.

They added another first round receiver in Quentin Johnson, who some people think will be a bust.

Uh. I mean the.

Chargers of Lucy with the football, but I mean he was already almost knocking on the Mahomes tier two years ago and he still was like halfway there, even playing hurt all your last season. Kellen Moore has been so

I want to ask you quickly about another rookie, Bryce Young.

I'm seeing.

I get these aren't these aren't sexy names, but he is adped above. Can you Pickett rock Party? I mean, can I like Rock Party? Jimmy g Like, I get these are not guys who are gonna go after early, but I mean what we've seen from the Panthers so far, their offensive line and everything else, Like, I don't think I'm drafting Bryce Young necessarily high at all.

No, And I did an article. You could question the worth of this article. I ranked all thirty two of like the offensive environments, because a good tiebreaker if you can't decide between like player A or player B, like I don't know any difference between these players, is the overall offensive environment. I did rank the Panthers thirty two because,

But it might not be that bad.

But the Panthers, when I think of like fantasy points, I do view the Panthers as like a dead last unit in the entire NFL and such Bryce Young is not on any of my draft.

Last thing for you, sir, and thank you again, and check out roto pat Over on NBC Sports. Herbert's kind of your guy. You keep coming back to him and drafts. Who's like, you're not on my team guy, Like doesn't matter what the draft circumstances are. Every draft's different, Like you end up never drafting this guy. Is it Daniel Jones based on these comments? Or is another quarterback that you just don't want anything to do with even though some people or maybe higher on the player.

There's no one, truly.

I am kind of a classic, like the ADP's right, I'll be honest, like the it's weird, it's the real life stuff makes it a little hard to draft Deshaun Watson.

But no, I mean justin.

Fields, the RLS real life stuff makes it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, justin Yeah, you don't have to draft creeps on your fantasy team.

You absolutely can make decisions about that.

It's it's fine, you said it.

No mean, I'm not drafting Josh Allen a lot, I'll say where I do. I wonder.

I feel like we're getting like this board with Bills hype, and that's leading them to be undervalued. Yeah, and like the real NFL and fantasy, but I do sort of feel like maybe the Allen thing has already peaked and that they're gonna get serious about trying to protect him more this year, which good for him in real life, not good in fantasy.

Well, he didn't run nearly as much people kind of forget in his second and third seasons he was more around four to five hundred yards, and then the last two seasons actually cranked way back up where he was, you know, incredibly effective rusher, and it sounds like they're gonna maybe dial it back. You're right, but he does throw for thirty five touchdowns every year, and a tonny.

The Bills have like an offensive identity crisis, I feel like, and they have like an unsettled skill course still where it's like, is Dalton k and Kaid like the number two passing game weapon that seems like maybe not a good situation, like if he's your number two and it's.

Either him or Gabe Davis.

But I just like since that identity crisis from the bills down the stretch last year, and I don't really know what they've done to fix it, Like the backfield didn't get markedly better, the skill corps did not get markedly better. And it just all comes down to like Josh Allen like Man of Steel, and that works until it doesn't. And I am worried that they're going to finally start dialing that back against like Greg said, they kicked it up to I would argue unsustainable levels the past two years.

Roto Pat, you've said it all. Thank you, my friend. I look forward to reading you throughout the upcoming campaign.

Stay healthy, kid, I look.

Forward to listening. Thank you so much for having.

Me gave me.

Yeah.

I love that guy, great writer like that. I'm glad he remembered that comment. Who said it or me right? I've always enjoyed his writing. I enjoy any writing that has a little humor to it. He that just drops those little singers in that you just don't read often, especially in this world.

Great tweeter, I mean, especially what other world would you be re in my like fantasy?

Oh all, it could be a very dry literally earth like. There's not a lot of writing happening elsewhere as far as we know.

How do you know?

Bo Greg certainly doesn't believe there is. I think there could be.

It came up with Tucker Kama Ross on Monday, and it just came up again, and in general, Deshaun Watson is just an interesting conversation as we are now hitting this twenty twenty three season. We talked about twenty twenty what he was, How did he this is what Ross made the point, how did he perform like a superstar

Here is the Texans.

The last game of the season twenty twenty, Brandon Cooks Kiki Kute forgot about him.

He's got cut.

Actually, Darren Fells at tight end. David Johnson was still there at running back with Duke Johnson backing him up. That's a mess you had learning Mee Tunsel the anchor at left tackle, a young tunsl the Brown setup is better and we'll see.

But he's right too.

I thought Rhodopet made the point like sometimes these guys disappear and the magic is just gone. So and then to the Greg of it all, like do you want to creep on your team? I, you know, if it puts money in my pocket?

I don't know. Like when I I'm sorry to be have no scruples, Greg, No.

I don't. I don't mean that.

It's the same thing as like if you're a Jets fan, maybe you want you don't want Patriots on your fantasy team, or maybe you don't care about I don't think one way or is wrong or the other. But if you're like me and you just want guys that you want to root for, and for instance, you don't like the Jets, you don't feel like drafted him like you don't have to, it's all like most of it is.

Well, you're a smart man, Greg, you right to use like personal biases, And I know Watson's a whole other category, but that's the way.

It's such a small person, you're narrowing your but like by like an infinitesimal amount, Like what would really take to like if you have five or six players in the league that you just I have a million of those biases where you just kind of like some players more than the others, and you take guys that you like because it's not gonna be any or less.

At The one annoying thing about fantasy is when I'm sitting there watching twelve games at once and I'm rooting for six teams, I can't stand because of some guy attending. I get what you're saying, Like, if you want to be cutthroat, you don't worry about any of that stuff. But I feel like the roster has energy, and like there's a there's a player I don't like. It's giving me weird feelings about my own fantasy team. It's my fantasy, it's my fantasy point I have, regardless on whether he's

Like, so it's like if Watson, for instance, has a big it might be annoying to you that he has a big year, But it's not gonna change either way whether or not he's on your team.

I mean, my point is, like the idea of being cutthroat or not, or like trying to remove all biases, it's not gonna change your chances of winning your league or not much either way. We all have a million different biases that go into all of these sorts of decisions. And oh, by the way, fantasy football, and this is why I like it on some level, is almost mostly lucky.

It's mostly luck.

The most important thing that goes into fantasy by far is luck, and you're trying to work on the other thirty percent twenty percent that's not luck. And just have fun doing it. It's it's a fun activity. But you don't have to put you know, you don't have to go too crazy. If you don't like Deshaun Watson bury him.

Sure, I'm with you. I just you.

You're an analytical mind, Greg and you don't believe in momentum. And now you're saying you could eliminate all these different players just because you don't like them. It does slightly affect your chances over someone that has a completely broad view of who's the best of all.

Bet I guess, and I'm thinking of Wes two when we do this episode. Like the way we looked at Fantasy was taking guys with huge ceilings, guys you wanted, and in the end, like I guess, we were a little different than Pat who says that the right ADP had take almost anyone. There probably was a group of like fifty players that those who were gonna be my list. It's kind of how the Patriots do NFL drafts. Like I have guys I truly believe are going to be

That's how the Patriots run their drafts.

And maybe maybe it's not the small A little Bill Belichick over here there you go, Yes, Bill wasn't against me. Take the guys, problematic guys, I Antonio Brown, take the guys you like is the point. Take the guys that you really believe.

Don't worry about it about Antonio Brown on our podcast, I will not forget that ever wild you guys were going at it, he would questioned your integrity with very it got personal.

It's very upset that the Patriots who are bringing in I miss that man.

All right, let's let's get on the boat. Let's go fishing, and you know what we're looking for. Uh okay, I'm gonna show my lack of outdoorsman, because I was gonna say, we're looking for big game.

But that's more if you're hunting, that would be a land based animal.

Eric, do you know, like if you're looking for something in the sea that's like a big catch.

Is there some type of esoteric terminology.

Fishing the line fishing rod? I think they call it a catch.

Okay, all right, let's throw it out there, the nis lore.

I'm not an outdoor as many of other guys.

For some reason, I thought you might be.

All right, I'm throwing it out there. Throw I got my line out. Oh I got a nibble. Mark me from behind by my hit.

Yes I will.

I'm rusting against me and then pull back. I'm latching onto you.

Thrust again. Oh it happening. Rust pull, I got a big one on the line. Get him in the boat.

It's heaven Silva, former brick by brickman at Rotal World and now doing his thing with his fancy man established the run background.

Evan Silva, the big Fish. What's up, buddy, Welcome back.

I'm doing really well. How are you guys? Doing?

Very good but great? There?

I like Beard, you look summer, Evan, this is this is Silva time of year.

That's the thing.

Failed this season.

It's busy during the season, but I feel like mid August to late August is when, uh, this is when Silva, you know, pays for all those Taylor Swift tickets for his daughter, which, by the.

Way, life changer. I used to listening to like rap and like Creden's Clearwater Revival, and now I don't even listen to that stuff anymore. It's all t.

Swift, Silva. Because I was at the Swift concert in LA. You're there, and because you're a man's man, you're a burly guy. Like are you letting yourself go and letting the music wash over you? Are you more like dad mode just letting it repel off you while you check your phone.

I mean, there's definitely a sense of you know, it's awesome because my daughter loves it and she knows all the words, and you know it's it's a way for us to connect. But I mean, I genuinely like Taylor Swift's music at this point.

So good for you. Yeah.

Now we have Evan on as we do every year, the Big Fish to talk about sleepers and busts, and this is I think this is one of the things that really define the real fantasy head, the guy that can nail these year after year, get us going with one of your favorite sleepers right now in fantasy drafts in twenty twenty three.

And this is perfect timing because I literally just released my Sleepers and bust article on establisherun dot com, Boom and the last Night and it just got published.

So I'll go subscribe people. This is him and Adam Levittaian two of the best yep at.

Established a run on Twitter, established the Run dot com on the Internet, first sleeper tank bigsby camp I mean rave reviews. He already got a snapped with the first team offense in the Jaguars preseason opener. The Jaguars were not pleased with Travis etn in short yardage and goal line situations last year. He's one of the least efficient runners in scoring position in the league. Tank Bigsby was

Now we're not allowed to do that as NFL employees, but you know we are sponsored. You know the company is at various times, so that that's a good one.

I I love that because.

Bigsby, Uh, sometimes you just assume that whatever role Etn had a year ago as a role that he's gonna have this year.

It's like Bigsby's a third round pick.

They like him, and his name is Tank and he actually looks like a tank versus Tank Dell, which is confusing that his name is Tank.

Can I just here's what my pushback would be, or am I concern that maybe Tank is the new flavor in that room that the coaching staff likes. But atn who I do think has upset, but he's also a first round pick in twenty twenty one. I know Orba Meyer's history and all that, but like, are they gonna fade Etn enough this season where Tank's gonna get enough work to be a guy that you want in your lineup in the fantasy realm?

That is the concern. I think Travis Etn is probably going to have a real solid season. It's just I think he's at risk of losing high value touch, high value touches to Tank Bigsbie. I mean, you want your running back scoring touchdowns and catching passes, and I think that there is some danger that Travis Etn faces. He risks losing a lot of that work to Tank. To Tank Bigsbie.

Now Evan.

A couple of years ago on this you Know Annual episode, you and Greg got into it over Sam Darnold, a memorable verbal tussle and I and I kind of One thing I love about you is when you get on board with someone, it reminds me of West. There's an element of stubborn, like I'm not listening to anyone else, So who who's someone out there that maybe let's go negative a bust that you're like I can't believe that

And hopefully Greg disagrees with Evan's take. Here we go.

Well, I'm worried about Jonathan Taylor, Okay, just about the fallout with ownership. I think that they probably will end up patching that up before week one, but i think it's a concern that he's still having problems with his ankle, which he aggravated several He suffered a high ankle spraining. He really suffered multiple high ankle sprains last year. And I'm also worried about the complexion of the Indianapolis offense

I wish I could push back and we could recreate that, but you can't.

You can't force it.

I'm actually glad you brought that up because when we talked with Marcus and Mike Florio earlier, Josh Jacobs and Taylor were brought up kind of in tandem as these two guys around late second round that they both have their issues, and to me, Jacobs is such a safer bet just because of what his role is going to be, the type of player he is, the receiver that he is, and my confidence that he'll be back playing, whereas Taylor,

Though.

I feel like we got to do this every year because you are the big fish and you love to talk about the big dog, and I do want to hear your other sleeper more sleepers than bus. But I am just curious where are you at with the big dog Dereck Henry, because he's still getting taken like he's the big dog Derrick Henry, I know, and I'm.

Real worried about him. I mean he's starting I mean the mileage is really getting up there. He's twenty nine. Now you go back to Alabama. This dude had massive workloads in college and now he's, what you know, seven eight years into his NFL career, He's getting older. I'm really worried about the Titans offensive line. I mean our offensive line analyst Brandon Thorn ranked him is the worst

Ye.

So, and Derrick Henry has never caught a ton of passes, So I'm worried about him. I would have him on a bus list.

Yeah. Two things.

We had Ross Tucker talking offensive line earlier this week. He had them at number thirty two and of his offensive line rankings. And Treylon Burks got carted off the field at Titans joint practice today and Titans practice and We don't know what his situation is. That would not make the passing game any more scary if you took out that second year player.

So yeah, a lot to be nervous about.

Give us some other positives you got, you got some more sleepers.

Maybe, maybe, Yeah, we can talk about Marvin Mims. You know, j Hamler is out in definitely, Tim Patrick is out for the season. I think Marvin Mims is gonna be a lock for three receiver sets playing opposite Courtland Sutton with Jerry Judy in the slot. Marvin Mims, I think, is a player that Sean Payton very much envisioned, like Brandon Cooks, who he drafted in the first round with the Saints back in twenty fourteen. Marvin Mims can really

Tight end feels especially dicey right now in the fantasy realm. We know Kelsey's locked and loaded Andrews and then it gets a little weird. I mean, you got t J. Hockinson is going high in drafts. George Kittle. We love George Kittle, but is he a fantasy guy you can count on. Waller's had injury issues the last two years.

I think that if we're talking about the rookies this year, Luke Mutsgrave and Sam Laporta are going to be every down players right away. It's hard for rookie tight ends to make immediate impacts. I mean this is you know historically it's difficult because a tight end has to learn to be not just a tight end but also a receiver and also an offensive lineman because they got to be able to block to stay on the field. I

I want to ask you more of a Phillis sophical question, because there are definitely fantasy people out there that, yeah, they'll watch the games on Sunday and there's eighteen televisions and stuff, but that's the end of the film watching. I know that you are a dogged film watcher, and a lot of sleepers and bus we don't even know about them today, like six seven, eight weeks into the season, the complexion has changed and guys are coming up out of nowhere, and your draft is in tatters and you're

I would say that it's helpful to watch football. I would say that from a fantasy football standpoint, watching film can actually send you in the wrong direction at times, because you just get infatuated with a player's explosiveness or you know, if a guy looks good and you know,

Right.

It's it's kind of the the yeah in the end, because one of the things is that I believed in too, is like you still want to bet on good players once you're confident. Like we had mentioned the Bucks receivers this year not as good a situation, but there's still really good players Like to me, there could be value there. I mentioned Damian Pierce as a guy like to me, I feel confident he's a really good player. And I

Well, Bryce Hall was to win Offensive Rookie of the Year. Yeah, and then each ecl and his meniscus on October twenty third, and man, the signals coming from the Jets. You know, they were connected to Jamir Gibbs, they were connected to Jamal Williams. They wound up signing Dalvin Cook to a deal that was I mean, that's starter money in the NFL. And it makes me wonder if Aaron Rodgers was like, if he's the one pulling the strings there, because remember he took that pay cut, and he like, look, I

Yeah.

I mean, as a Jets fin, I want to go up and get him high, but I would much rather let someone else take a swing on him early and if he fell and people really down, then maybe I grab him and stash him for a bit.

I'm with you real quick. Just cycling back to tight ends.

You mentioned some of those rookies because this is the position group that gives me a lot of stress, as I had Kyle Pitts last year, for instance, and that just drove me mad. Who's the veteran of that group post Kelsey Andrews that you're feeling good about. Who's the guy that you might you're fading when you do your drafts.

I have really not been getting very much Kyle Pitts because of the concerns about the passing volume. Is Desmond Ritter really any good?

You know?

I mean, I feel like Kyle Pitts, look, he had over a thousand yards. Is a rookie tight end, all right, He's super talented. It's just are the targets going to be there for him at the end of the day. We just had Jimmy Kempski, longtime Eagles beat writer, on the Establisher Run podcast, and he was talking up Dallas Goddard and Dallas Goddard that he's just been He used the word uncoverable in training camp. Dallas Goddard has never

I think sometimes, you know, there's so much focus on the early parts of the draft and your wide receiver two and everything, and a lot of times it's won when with like the sixth or seventh receiver you take, you can just use as your third receiver way more consistently than you expect to go into the season.

I'm just gonna throw some names at you.

I don't know if anywhere on your sleeper list, but just some interesting late receiver names.

You tell me if you like anyone or don't like them.

I'm gonna go Michael Thomas, Elijah Moore, Bateman sky Moore, and.

Let's throw in obj.

You just pick one or two out of those who stands out either as a good or a bad guy.

Well, I was actually gonna bring up sky Moore because it looks like he is locked into two receiver sets right now.

I like him low rookie.

Season, but man, who's coming out of Western Michigan, and it's not uncommon for Andy Reid to slow play rookies. You know, think about the quarterback in Kansas City. I think I think sky Moore is gonna jump right into that Juju Smith Schuster role. Juju Smith Shooter had over nine hundred yards last year, and I think the sky Moore, there's a chance that sky Moore is like more talented

Do you have when you're scanning the league and maybe this isn't for the star players, but teams that you won't touch if there's a certain environment or an offensive scheme that you don't like, where you just say nope, I'm gonna If it's all things being equal, I'm ignoring tm X.

I can't believe that the Steelers brought back Matt Canada as their offensive coordinator.

I mean, blame Canada the season.

I just like took, you know, like a month off and like just slept and then when I woke up, I was like, Canada is still the Steelers offensive coordinator.

That's the worst case scenario. First tesler to ask that question. He's riding the Steelers hard this summer, so now he's noivose.

Well we'll see, you know, well we will see.

Wow.

You don't want to get in Silva's crossairs if you're like a bad oc. Silva can get the fangs out sometimes, especially if it's late at night and the players, you know, he values them and he says they're.

Good or not.

But if there's like an oc in Silva's crossairs, he will put he will put them underground verbally on the written page. And Matt Canada sounds like that guy this year, like.

It's trouble.

All right.

Last one for me. The Niners have all sorts of skill players. I'm kind of bringing up things that are bringing me stress. Uh deebo iyuk cmc kittle, any of those guys that kind of bust is strong, especially in that offense. But guys you're staying away from, or guys that you think Caul like's getting a lot of pop from, maybe finally becoming a number one.

Like, where are you coming down? With these Niner skill players?

I like them all. I mean, their offense is going to be really good again. The problem though, is that because there are so many dudes there that are really good at football, you're just you're gonna have to live with the ups and downs. They're gonna be boom or bust on a weekly basis. Debo's gonna have monster games and then he's gonna have games where it's four catches for thirty four yards. You know, George Kittle is famous

Though.

Wait to me, though, Deebo is such an obvious I think by low guy just that's so one of the best ways to play fantasy is just like talented guys who have already established that they can have a high level of production, take them off a bad year period. If you just just just do that, you'll probably do pretty well. Because he was going and probably I don't remember, but rounds two or three last year and now five or six.

It's pretty simple. Just take that guy.

He and he also sounds like he kind of knows he blew it last year and is very much ready.

Yeah, and now he looks like an absolute beast. I mean there have been videos all over the internet. I mean he's cut up this year, he's been boxing.

He looks like a stud He would be on my list of guys that I would be trying to get in any big draft of me.

Have you ever in your life you're a your last one for Evan, big dude, you know out in the in the the the taverns, in the bars of America. Have you ever been into a verbal or physical fight over fantasy football with someone?

Great question, that's that's how you close it.

No, No, not not not over fan football?

How about about something I actually don't believe. I don't know if that that kind of looked like the guy that was lying. Silva, You've said it all. We thank you so much.

Established the run follow Evan, uh doing great work over there since its inception what like five years ago?

Yeah yeah, look at Getting your Business.

Off Right podcast. I listened to it every week.

Thank you, big fish, Evan, Thank you all right? Two things? Uh? One about Evan? Wait?

Did I do the thing though at the Combine press conference where it's one more question and I took it somewhere that's not going to add.

That everybody just groaned for their feature. He's working on his own feature.

I was curious.

I actually want to know if you had some.

Evan's the only one of the reasons I like Evan is like, it doesn't matter how ridiculous your intro is or anything you say to Evan, Like if we do a thirty seven second ramp up where I'm saying we're literally fishing for him and pulling them into a boat as Mark is behind grinding into my buttocks, He's not gonna smile. He's just like there is just he's a fish, Like he's just like staring back right at you, and

And I've never seen a man in more pain.

It was like he just shot in the stomach with a shotgun and then he's back on the field in three where.

Well, there's like a FIFA soccer element to his game.

There's a mental there's a yes, there's a mental capacity.

You're taking a hit when you watch him.

I recommend just enjoying Deebo Samuel fantasy player from Afar, not in real time. That's my final advice. Anybody else have a Finn thought as we wrap things up.

No, I think I think you handled it.

I I think doing your draft a little closer to the season is nice.

You don't get you don't get in trouble.

But I'm glad we're getting this episode out a little earlier. I know you're drafting this weekend day, it's starting to crank up. This next weekend, the weekend after the following week is is when it most happens. But I do think the idea, you know, that it's supposed to be fun. You know, you want to take it seriously, but you want to take you want to take guys you like that's it's all saying, it's your leam. You're gonna have to live with this guy, these guys, I'll your family.

I don't care who it is you're producing.

Now it gets a little thorny if we're talking about d W again. Little thorny if he's on your real team, because then it gets a little messy my fantasy team. I can divorce myself from basically anything. I would draft OJ in nineteen seventy four. I don't care he's on my You didn't know what was going to happen back then.

Well that's a good point.

But in your league, because I know it's your friends and you're a guy friends, but like you're in a league employee who's bathed in you know, football data left and right. Do they ever sort of look at you and say not fair? You should have a different job.

If you I catch heat for that. That's part of the fun. Do you win the league or league? I'm always in the playoffs. I've made multiple deep runs, I have titles. Yeah, it would be bad if I was bombing in that league, I'd get killed for it. So I'm representative to what I should be considering the amount of hours we put into it, Well, you should be winning them. But again it's annoying because I look, this

Yeah, but we should stop baby broadcasts.

Yes, that reminds me of the the NBC Sports Last Road or World Draft we would do every year and everyone was going off my damn rankings.

I can't do anything. I'm getting boxed out on all the guys I want.

It would be quite just to do it one year, like totally go opposit all your takes on the public sector, just to kill your draft.

That would be a move.

All right, Thank you everybody, Thank you again to all our guests that make the fantasy extravagance.

That give me my music.

Florio Brands, Darty Silva. I mean that's a murderer's roll and we thank them all. Good luck in your drafts until Thursday.

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