Persuasion vs Convincing And Why It Changes Everything with Myron Golden | Replay

Most salespeople who are terrible think that selling is convincing people to buy something they don't want to buy. Persuasion and convincing are not just not the same, they're actually opposites of each other. You want to learn how to persuade, influence and sell at the highest level. You're going to want to pay attention to the guests that I have today. Myron Golden, welcome to the show. How do I find people to sell my stuff to? That's a really terrible

question. Here's a better question. Because there are already thousands, 10s of thousands who would love to buy what I'd love to sell. How can I make myself more findable for people who already would love to buy what I already love to sell? Then selling becomes effortless. They decided they wanted to do something different. I said this is stupid. If I'm building a business and some knuckleheads going to mess up my business opportunity, I want the knucklehead to be me.

Everybody here is in sales that they want to persuade, they want influence in some way. Sure. How did you get involved in? Sales, Yeah, Kind of

incidentally, I first got involved in sales not knowing I was involved in sales. I came home for my first first year in college. I came home for the summer. I bought a car out of the Pakistan Herald in Harrisburg, PA, for $50.50 dollars, $50. Drove it around all summer. I knew it wasn't going to drive back to Indiana from Pennsylvania. OK. So a friend of mine said, hey, do you want to sell that car? Yes, I do. How much do you want for $300?

He gave me $300.00 for for a car that I bought 50 bucks for. That's that's your first sale. That was my first sales experience. Yeah. And then when I was done with college and I got married, I was looking for something to do and one of my college professors, former college professor, said, hey, do you want to make a lot of money? No. Yeah. It's like asking somebody, do you like to drink water? Right Water Brothers, No. No, yeah, I'm allergic to water, right.

Yeah, so. And I said, I said, yeah, he said while my brother-in-law just got started with his business, he's making a lot of money, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, OK, I'm open for that. He says, well, let me see if we can find a local office. And it was an office that sold insurance and investments through the company called AL Williams, which not later become Primerica. It was it was network marketing of insurance and mutual funds. And so I went to the office for

an interview. My wife and I both went for some reason, but we both went did saw their presentation. I thought, Oh my goodness, and the guy who had the office is making $10,000 a month in 1980. Five well cash. I was a lot of cash. In that like 90 the 60 random month now 70 random month right exactly. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so. So I got started than that, but I was terrible. Yeah, imagine that. I was terrible. So you're terrible. So like. Really terrible.

Not kind of. So you're suggesting you weren't born with like advanced questioning skills or investment tonality skills? Oh no, I had advanced. Like really messing up sales skills. Like I was terrible. I I did presentation after presentation presentation and literally did present gobs and gobs of presentations for a year and a half before I made my first sale. Interesting. Why is it so network marketing, it's a big industry.

We're training and I always have an issue with network marketing.

Network marketing is 1/3 interactive. She's sold in OK. And I always had an issue because when you would come into like there's no selling involved, just bring people to the meetings, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like you guys are killing your people because everything is sales and communicating 100%. So would you feel like that might be a problem in network marketing? They kind of give that mentality. So nobody learned?

Yeah, I think. I think, I think, yes, I think that that is a symptom of the problem. The problem is they're attempting to make people believe that something that's hard is easy, right? Because selling is not easy. It's just worth it. If you learn the right skills. But not learning how to sell is not easy either, right? So you just have to pick your easy and pick your heart. It is like you're going. To be a neurosurgeon, you have to learn how to operate on the

brain. It's pretty hard if you don't learn how to operate. The operator of the rain, exactly. Same thing any profession, any. Profession. So, so how did you, like, I'm assuming they didn't just go in there and give you some advanced training. You had to kind of figure this out on your own. I did, yeah. So I memorized the presentation that was in the flip chart back then because that's what we use. And it was terrible. I I, I was, I was looking for a better word, but it was

terrible. And I did the presentation, but I even though I wasn't making sales, I was still booking appointments and doing presentations and I was paying attention to the feedback I was getting. And the feedback was basically no bro. Right. And it's so interesting because you, when I got into marketing, I'm like, this is the easiest thing to sell because everybody's a prospect. Everybody wants to make more money, everybody wants to have more time, right? You just have to know how to

communicate. It's not like they're not wanting that. So what? Why are people not joining community? Lack of community. Because. Because most people who are reps in most companies that Rep anything are actually more misrepresentatives than they are representatives. That's good then. Yeah, I like that. So you just kind of figured this out. I did. How did you, how did you figure that? Did you recognize patterns? What did? You do so. So after 18 months I made my first sale. OK, you got.

So that's a lot of dedication, that's a lot of commitment staying there. But it is. But see, you know one of the one of the best ways to commit not having a Plan B. Burning the burning. The burning the boats? Yeah, exactly. You don't. I didn't have a Plan B. There was no I had polio as an infants. There's no professional athletic athletics in my future. You weren't going to be on the the track.

I wasn't. Going to be on the track team, wasn't going to be in the NBA, so I didn't know how to play golf. So none of that was it. So what am I going to do? I'm going to do something. And these were the only people I had ever seen in my life who were making like, real crazy significant. Major for sale What happened after that?

I just paid attention to what I did and I put took the thing that worked finally and instead of getting bored with it, I got paid with it and put it on with a repeat. I just kept doing the same thing over and over. Repetition, repetition. Once I found something that worked, I just refined it. And and where did you Start learning how to refine it? You go through trial and error. Did you learn? Somebody, I did go through a lot of trial and error and I read a lot of books.

So I, I started out I read Tom Hopkins, how to master the art of selling anything. That's where I started, right? And so, so the two things that I got from Tom Hopkins book that changed my life were #1 Learning to Love, Know and #2 was STP 20. STP stands for C20. People belly to belly every day. And so I said, OK, well I could. Those are things I can do. You can do that. You can control those things. I can. Control the I happen. To play the numbers game exactly.

So how did you go from like, OK, I know how to play the numbers game now. I got a really double down, triple down, quadruple down on my skill game. Because obviously, as you know, the numbers game is only going to get you so far because you're just one of you. That's right. How did you start to build? Like, where did you start? Like, hey, you're learning

skills. I I went to a lot of trainings, a lot of seminars, read a lot of books, and then implemented of the things that I learned or heard because I didn't really learn them, implemented the things that I heard and then learned from the responses that I got. Which couple? Books. Do you feel like because books are books, as you know, they're kind of an introduction to the thing you're wanting to?

Sure, right? You're not really mastering it from a book, but it's like intro or a couple books that kind of set you on that path of like, hey, there's more to this than what I know so far. Yeah, the greatest salesman in the world for me was really Augmentino.

Augmentino. In fact, all of Augmentino's books were really great for me. Also some cassette tapes that I had back then, The Strangest Secret by Earl Nightingale that was one of my favorites, and one by Jim Rohn called The Day That Changes Your Life. Interesting. Yeah, so I listen to those and because here what like in hindsight, I can see what happened while I was doing. I didn't know what's happening. I was just I'm going to figure this thing out. I'm.

Just kind of following what they were doing. Didn't know why you're. Doing right and so, but in hindsight I realized like the ultimate text back in selling is

mindset plus skill set plus tool set equals assets and so. It's pretty hard to fail if you have those. Three down right and what happens, I think the biggest, I think one of the biggest problems in people learning how to sell is they'll get a tool set. Like they'll get so an autoresponder or Instagram messaging bot or something and they think the tool set's going to fix their problem or they'll learn a skill set in the form of tactics, but they don't have the mindset.

And so they're saying the right thing with their mouth, but their energy is telling the truth on. Them yeah, there's cuz their tonality. It's it's the way you say it, like I was asking, you know, how are this how, how are sales people in every industry who sell the same thing at the same price points to the same prospects using the same script get completely different? Results 100. Percent. That's exactly what you said. Exactly.

And it's it's, it's, it's not just their tonality, it's how they feel when they're saying yes. It's their certainty. It's their I like to tell people you can lie with your words, but your energy always tells the truth. Yeah, it's like if a if a salesperson gets an objection, most of them like, well, they get all defensive and their face gets flustered in person and then your your prospects like there's Spidey senses or survival, part of the brain picks up on that and they're.

But if you're like how he's called the Spidey senses, if you're like relaxed and just calm, they stay calm, their nervous system stays calm, right. So how did you, I mean this, most people don't know those type of things about the brain and in getting the guard down. And I've read those books that that you have there. So there's much more deeper stuff that you've obviously learned from to learn, like how to get somebody to let their

guard down. So like the thing that impacted my life first and foremost, even in network marketing, was a mentor. Like having a mentor who understood the game at a much higher level than I did and then paying him whatever he charged. Why is that so important? Like I want everybody to pay attention to what Myron Singer. This is like key number one for you to to get where you want to go. Because they've been there, done that, got 2 T-shirts, and if they're good, they know why

they've gotten there. All mentors are not created equally, right? There are some people who are successful because they were at the right place at the right time and they had the right skill set. They didn't have the right mindset though. So they can't teach you how to have the mindset if they didn't have to develop the mindset. And so, so this meant the other reason I think it's important is because people who pay, pay attention and people who pay a little pay a little attention.

People who pay a lot pay a lot of attention, and people who pay nothing don't pay any attention at all. As you call them, the free people people. I want to talk about those those framing techniques in a minute, because those are brilliant framing techniques. Take, take me back to this mentor because I always say the the most and I, and I, I've learned this from somebody, whoever I'm quoting, just I give you the credit the most.

Like successful people learn from their mistakes, but the most successful people, the top .01%, they don't learn from their mistakes. They learn from other people. They don't make the same mistakes themselves because they're all about speed to like, I want to overcome the learning curve like next week, next month, not in five years or 20 years. Exactly. It's the ultimate. A mentor is the ultimate shortcut. It's the ultimate shortcut. And time is more valuable than money.

And So what people will do is it's like they they have, they suffer from Walmart syndrome. And I don't know if I can say that or not, but I already said it. So, So what they'll do is they'll go to this big ginormous store and waste a whole bunch of time to save $0.13. It doesn't make sense. Time is the stuff that life is made of. I would rather waste the money and save the time than waste the time and save the money. It's the cost, it's, it's, it's the frame of like, how much is

this actually costing? If you're a salesperson, how much is this costing you in lost deals every day because you haven't committed to mastering the by skills, dabbling in those skills? I love this. So you get into sales, you start doing really, really well. Then how did you get into like, you know, being on stage? Because that's it. That's a whole different sales process. And then selling to a person like in network marketing, the consumers now you're selling in

front of a huge audience. It is.

Those are different things. You have to. Learn it is and, and and there's there's so much that speakers who are good at speaking don't understand about the speaking business because they're not the same thing. They're not even almost the same guy in the same mentor who really helped me shortcut sales in general really helped me shortcut selling from the stage. So. They're an expert in sign from stage 2.

This guy was an expert. He was an expert so and his path was pretty much the same as mine. Got started network marketing and then started doing training and network marketing, then started selling from the stage. And so I got started network marketing. And if you're good at network marketing, which I was good at it, and then you also have the opportunity to train people. So I got good at training people.

And I thought because I was good at training people and I thought because I was good at selling one-on-one, that automatically make me good at selling for the stage. But that's not it. Why is that? Because they're totally different skill sets. For the same reason that riding a tricycle is not the same as riding a motorcycle. For the exact same reason.

Because now you're not like, if you're selling to consumer like you're, you're, if they have a concern or objection, you're dealing with that and you can talk with them. Let's say you're in front of an audience of 2000 people. You've got all sorts of different concerns and objections going in their brain. All these stories that they make up on why they can't get started in your thing. And so like how you going to take that out of their mind,

right? And, and, and how you take that out of their mind is by getting them to replace that story with another story, not by you attempting to replace that story with another. You're helping them and I went to school as a psychologist. So you're basically what you're doing is you're taking them out of their belief systems.

We call them frames, relief systems that they have the stories and you're reframe them into a new belief system of the new story abilities of what you know 100% for them 100%. So there's a lot of techniques that go into that talk about like, how did you get so you how did you actually get involved? Like, Hey, I'm now speaking on stage.

So so because I got tired of network marketing and I said I'm not doing this anymore because I got tired of network marketing company owners changing the compensation plan and now my income goes to crap because they decided they wanted to do something different. I said this is stupid. If I'm building a business and some knucklehead's going to mess up my business opportunity, I want the knucklehead to be me, not somebody. They just don't know.

They, they think the compound sounds good in the beginning, but they don't realize this could go happen. This could happen. What are you know? And then they're like, oh shit, we're not making any money. We're going to change it. Right. This is not like network marketers don't realize that if you are a Rep in a network marketing company, that is not your business. Right, you're 1099. You're a 1099 in somebody else's business general country.

That is your vendor. Yeah, you they are not your they're. Yeah, sure. It's not your company anyway. And so, so I got, I got out of that and a friend of mine started a network marketing company, OK. And he said, hey, if you'll come train my people, I'll pay you $20,000. I said OK, OK. Yeah, that's easy. That's an easy yes to do that, right. And so he paid me $20,000 and I went and trained his people.

And another friend of mine who had the same mentor said, hey, man, you need to have Jerry come speak at this event. I'm like, I don't need to have Jerry come speak at this event. Why wouldn't he even speak at the event? It's my event. It's not his event, but I let him talk me into it. So I was allowed to sell to the people in the, in his organization. There are only like 35 people there, but I was allowed to sell. I made an offer. I did $350.00 in sales. Jerry, my mentor, he wasn't my

mentor then. He was just a guy I bought some of his courses from. He teaches the same group and they buy $3500 worth of stuff from him. I'm like, wait, what just happened? And Jerry says, he says you're flying out of Dallas tomorrow, right? I said yeah, he said. He said come in early, I'll give you some tips on speaking. Interesting. So I go meet Jerry for

breakfast. It turns into breakfast, it turns into brunch and we're there for two hours and me and Stan and Jerry are at lunch and Jerry's breaking down the speaking business. I'm taking notes. Like I I took probably 15 pages of notes on a 2 hour lunch and we got done. Jerry says, oh, don't worry about it, I got lunch. I said, Oh no Sir, you're not going to teach me how to make $1,000,000 and buy my lunch.

Now, what's fascinating about that is probably 10 years later, I told him my recount of that story. He said, oh, yeah, I remember that. He said if you'd let me buy lunch that day, I wouldn't have anything else to do with you because I would have realized that you were a taker and not a giver. Yeah, because how much, how much, how much money did he really give you there, right? You know, millions of dollars.

Millions upon, millions upon and so I implemented what he said and the next very next time I spoke, it was like there were like 135 people. I did $5900 in sales and it was it was off to the races after. That like, hey, there's something. To there's something to this. And then there were people in that audience because I was, I was teaching network marketers how to sell their network marketing stuff and I was selling them courses on how to

do that. And so the next time I spoke, somebody who was two people were in that audience. One person booked me for two weeks out, another person booked me for two weeks after that. I did $8800 and sales and $6600 and sales. I'm like, you mean I can go and talk about stuff I know about to people who care about it, make them an offer and get paid thousands of dollars a week? OK, sign me up for that program. This is. Kind of fun. Yeah, this is fun.

Now, so a lot of selling from stage because I want to talk about this and this this applies to you, you know, watching me here, listening to us, you know, whether you sell virtually, if you sell on the phone, if you sell in person, doesn't really matter. A lot of it is about interrupting patterns. So pattern interrupting. So what's what's maybe something that you do that's kind of unique on how you interrupt the audience's pattern.

It could be at the start metal end to like really get them to stay engaged and and curious about what's going on. So I, I think, I think one of the most important things that any salesperson can learn to do is to help the people that you're selling to do things that are in your best interest for their best interest. Exactly. And I'm going to ask you this question and you hit it right on the spot. Is is selling.

I always ask everybody and I you already, you already answered it is selling something that you do to people or selling something you do. For for people, something to do for people. Exactly. Why is that? I think a lot of sales people don't understand that yet. Well. First of all, because everybody already desires to buy stuff.

Everybody desires to buy stuff. And if you have something good and it can impact somebody's life and you sell it to them, you get a little bit of money, they get a lot lifetime transformation. Yeah. Like how could that possibly be doing something I'm doing to people like? I always say like you, who has the problems? Your prospects are you that

exactly has a problem, not you. You're the one that can solve it. So you going to start look viewing selling differently than most salespeople have 100 per view like it's adversarial you against the prospect, you're

doing it to them and that's why they play the numbers game. I I have a client and some people were going to say this is the crazy though. They must be insane. OK, Well, they're insanely rich now, but they were stuck at $1.2 million a year for three years, OK. They came into my business owner, a business owner, business owner, OK. They came into my coaching program, my $350,000 VIP day, it's 375,000, but then it was 350. I gave them within three months.

I gave the opportunity to upgrade to my $1,000,000 coaching program and they did, yeah, in less than six months, they had a $1.2 million day. Actually, they generate, they, they sold from the stage. They did $1.2 million in sales in an hour, exactly in an hour. And they did $5 million last year. Yeah, five extra. I got a million. They got four extra million. Yeah. And what are they going to get this year and then the next? Right. And they get paid on that for the rest of their life.

And I got paid. Once and see if if Myron didn't have the communication skills, the ability to help them overcome their fear, change that whatever their story was, it was holding them back, they'd still be at 1.2 million. So that is why learning how to communicate. The most important skill set you could literally have in life. I always say it like, was Elon Musk the only person that had the concept of electric cars? Unlikely he.

Just he wasn't even the first. He just knew how to communicate the best. Everybody that you that you see on TV or anybody is, they're there because they've learned how to communicate and frame their message the best. That's why communication skills are so important. So pattern erupting, let's go back to the the, the cheapo and the freepo stuff. Where, where did where did you come up with that concept? I don't even remember, actually.

Oh, you know I do. There a guy named Larry in Tampa. I heard him say something about cheapo people one time. OK, in or no, he said something about freeple people. I'm like freeple people. That's a real And then I so I just started playing. Yeah, freeple people, cheeple people, feeble people and then people, people. People and can you can you tell everybody what this is? I think that's really good because you've got this audience, you've got all these

people here watching you. They've got all these different

type of concerns and so you can't go talk to them individually and find out what their concerns are. You're up on stage and you've got a you've got a Well, eliminate those. You got to prevent those instructions and you. Defrag. But if you think about it, if you think about it, freebel people, cheaple people, people, people, feebel people and people, those are all identity shifts. They are, yeah. They're identity shifts reality. Right. So, so Freebel people, who are

they like Freebel people. I don't work with Freebel people. Freebel people who want everything for free. You want everything for free, Good, go get it from somebody else like I. But I don't want to pay. Great. You don't have to pay me and I don't have to deal with you. Everybody's. Happy, well, it's like a salesperson who's not willing to invest in their skill level. And then you ask them, well, well, what objections are you getting from your prospects? And it always comes back to.

The same. Cost, It's too expensive. We can't afford it, and they buy in and it. They can't overcome those objections because they believe that story. Too Exactly. There's no way they know. Exactly. So they're they actually are in agreement ideal ideologically with that prospect. You are the objection. Exactly, 100%. So you get the free people, freeable people. And then the next is are the cheapo people, they only want stuff for cheap, right?

Like like there's a certain brand that says we sell cheap stuff cheap. I'm no, I'm sorry, we sell good stuff cheap. Sorry, like I don't, I don't want cheap stuff. I just want good stuff. Good stuff last longer. Cheap stuff is more expensive than quality stuff because you have to keep buying it. You have to keep buying it over and over and so cheapo people want everything. As long as it's cheap, I'll buy it. As long as it's cheap and then

you. We would call those type of salespeople dabblers, even dabblers. They buy a few sales books a year. They follow you on Instagram or or YouTube. I can try to free free tips. You know, they go to free event and they they say like as long as I stay in it long enough, get enough reps eventually I'll figure it out. And that's where most salespeople are. They stay average, but. Eventually, not only eventually, we figure out, eventually you'll be dead.

So you got to outrun the Eventually I'll be dead. Yeah, and nobody knows when that is exactly. That's the great part about life. OK, so you get the cheapo people and then you what's the next? Feeble people. What's that? People who are willing to pay a fee, right? And they're willing to pay $1000 to go to an event or they're willing to pay $5000 to buy a course, right? They're feeble people. And you know, they can have some transformation, but the rapid transfer, some success, they get

some success. Summers, we call those the know it all there's they tell everything about because they buy a couple courses they might start making like low 6 figures a year and then they're and. They become a copy of a cliche. They get capped because they don't. They don't, exactly. Yeah, like that. And then the highest level is people. People, those are people who are willing to pay a premium and people who are willing to pay a premium are deserving to receive

a premium. It's literally a a rite of passage. Like I, I, I like to ask this question if I'm talking to an audience or if I'm talking to a person. How would you like to have a multitude of people lined up outside your business, out the door, around the block, cash and credit card in hand, clamoring to buy whatever you'd love to sell? Would that be awesome? Yes. OK, cool. Perfect. So I'm going to tell you how you can have that. Are you ready? But I have to ask you a question

first. What does a tree have to do to bear apples? Has to grow. It has to grow. That's what people say. It has to grow. It has to have water, has to have sunlight. But you know the most important thing it has to do, it has to be an apple tree. Now, what does that mean? That means everything reproduces after its own kind, and you don't get a multitude of people lined up out the door and around the block ready to buy your stuff until you become that kind of buyer.

We don't attract the kind of buyers we want, we attract the kind of buyer we. Are yeah, that makes so much sense. So that so you're putting them in an identity frame and remember, he's not doing it to them, he's doing it for them. Because if he doesn't do this to them, they feel no need to change. And that's why they. Don't so. So let's talk about your event. What's the name of your event? NEPQ Master would be our next one. And then we have what's what's? Neuro emotional persuasion

question. That's about OK. Neuro Emotional. Our leisure events are called Sales Con Live. Sales con live so so here's what I know everybody who's come how much does how much are tickets to that event. Oh, the sales con live is still that's like 1000 bucks, 1000 bucks OK. So you have, you have and you have. Let's say you have 1000 people paid $1000 to come to Sales Con Live. They're not there because they want a chicken sandwich. Yeah, so they've already told me

what they want. All I'm doing, if I'm speaking at that event, is showing them how they can get the thing they've already told me by their presence that they desire to have. That's why when I sell them something for a premium, I'm doing something for them because they told me what they want. By being there, they provided the content. I provide the context. Because you're not going to master anything from a three day seminar. That's right. What's the saying you? Can't.

Can't teach a kid how to ride a bike? Get a seminar. From Sander OK, so I want to go back into this. This is really good. So the the the freeple people, I love that kind of stuff, that framing. Now want to make sure all all of you understand, like you can use a frame like that, but really selling from stage, selling in person, you know, selling on the phone, selling version, it doesn't matter.

It's a series of frames. Like 1 frame is not typically going to help that prospect overcome the fear of change, right? As you know, every objection you get, every reason why somebody doesn't buy, comes down to the core that you're human and you have the fear of change, right? You can't see what's on the other mountainside. You have to pay 1st and then you get to see what's on the other side. So you have that little fear.

So it's helping them overcome that fear by continually taking them out of their frames or belief systems and reframing and looping. So the reframing, where did you start to develop that? Yeah, Jerry, same guy taught me how to reframe stuff and then once I once I learned some reframes from Jerry Clark. Yeah, then I started watching speakers and seeing how they reframe things. Saw the patterns. Have you ever watched Tony Robbins? I have, yeah. Good. I would.

I just went to his date with destiny a couple months ago. I and I went to like see the D frames and the reframe. That's a really good that's a good reframe. What what have you learned from Tony? The the most I've learned from Tony, Tony was from some of his early stuff, like this is like he was probably this 20's. The best stuff that I learned from Tony Robbins, I learned from this old stuff like I had it on cassette tape.

Really. Yeah. And I think my favorite Tony Robbins quote slash concept is if you want to model any form of human excellence, you have to find somebody who's really, really good at it and model 3 things. Number one, you model their belief systems #2 you model their mental syntax and #3 you model their Physiology. So you model their belief systems. You ask them what they believe about XYZ. You ask them the order in which they fire off messages in their brain.

That's a syntax. And then you learn how to hold your body in time and space like they hold their body in time and space. And I found that to be so dynamically powerful and work so well. The other thing, the second, my second favorite thing that I've ever heard Tony say is you don't get to control what happens to you. You would get to control 3, Three things. What am I going to do about it? What does this mean to me, and what am I going to do next? Those are probably my two favorite.

How you react to the thing where it happens, it separates you part. Most people react in a negative way. It's it's it's the radical he talks about like, hey, if you were abused as a child, well, you need to, you need to give them like you need to radically blame them for your success because because, because they did that to you, it actually caused you'd like something to happen. Maybe you got a chip on your

shoulder. Maybe you just, you know, when all not to say abuse is right, obviously, but whatever happened to you as a kid, like got you where you're at, right? That's how your that's how your brain thinks you're world view and maybe put that chip on your shoulder to be successful and drive. So without that, maybe you grew up in a extremely wealthy family. Maybe you wouldn't be where you're at right now or even talks about himself, you know, OK, so let's talk about where

did you. OK, so this, so the reframing techniques, I want to go back into that. So you get you get up there, you're up on stage, OK, You know, you got 1000 people there. You know, typically for, let's say you're, you're doing this for another company or even yourself, you know, like kind of what their objections are going to be. Maybe maybe kind of share a few things that you do to like maybe the top three objections on how you kind of eliminate those them from their mind.

So what would those objections be, for instance?

Let's say that they have an objection, like your objection you typically get for them is like, oh, I just don't have time to learn how to do this. Let's say that that's a time objection, OK, A lot of a lot of audiences are going to have that. Like when you're selling like training or something, I'm going to have time to learn how to do this. I'm busy. I'm learning from somebody that's not have a time. OK, so I I you're you're asking me how I'd reframe it, but not.

Because I brought strategy, OK. Because so, So what I do is people say, Myron, how do you overcome objections? I just don't get them right, Right. Exactly. I don't get objections because an objection is a question that you didn't answer in your presentation. And so it got infected and

festered into a an objection. So if somebody says I don't have time, it's because there was something in your presentation that didn't address the fact that if you don't take time to get better, you're just going to get worse over time. Yeah, right. Right. And so you're. Seeding that frame. Frame 1st and so, so, so how do I reframe that is I use an epigram like I just did, which is if you don't take time to get better, you're going to get worse over time.

So I took the concept of time and I showed both sides of that time coin. Generally speaking, when people have an objection, it's because they're only looking at one aspect of the thing that they're objecting to. They're not looking at the other aspect of it. For instance, let's say somebody says well, but I just don't want to pay that much. OK, you don't want to pay that much. Do you believe you're smart?

Yes. Do you believe 1 smart person can teach another smart person something to know how to do? Yes. If somebody's made millions and millions of dollars, if you're smart and they're smart, could they teach you how to do it? Yes. OK. So write down $1 million at the top of a piece of paper, and then write down how much you made last year subtracted from the million. Yeah, so let's say they made 200,000 last year, subtracted

from their 800 grand. So. So because you don't want to pay me $50,000 to learn how to sell better, you paid life $800,000 for not knowing? See what you just did, this is brilliant. So you took them out of price or cost based thinking and you can refrain them to results based thinking one of the result they want. Exactly. They just have this fear of change on well, I don't know if it'll work for me. I don't know how to get it

right. So what all Myron did there is he took him out of that price or cost based thinking frame and he's reframing. There's not like I'm making this up. I'm not manipulating them, just helping them become aware of something that is currently real in their experience that they're unaware of. And then I'd say, I'd say say something like, OK, so the problem is though that it didn't just cost you $800,000.

That's just how much it cost you last year and the year before that and the year before that and the year before that and the year before that. Here's the question I have for you. Would you rather pay life again, $800,000 this year for not knowing? Or would you rather pay me so you can learn and you don't have to live in the land of not knowing it's costing?

You more in reality, which is more expensive exactly and then in their brain they're like it's way more expensive if they don't pay exactly and so all he's doing is reframe them out of what you're thinking and that's what you want to do with your prospects. It doesn't matter if you sell windows or life insurance or if you sell you know or security to Bank of exactly. It's all the same.

Thing it's all the same, different side beans and they have belief systems that you have to take them out and you're doing it for them, not to them. To them. That is a massive difference. I love that. OK. And that was your. What would you call that frame that you use is that you're like, I know you well. It's it's, it's, it's the price versus cost frame. I like that. Yeah, right. It's or the price versus worth frame. Poor people know how much everything cost. Rich people know how much

everything's worth. That's the difference. If you want to be rich, start asking better questions. I like How much is it worth? How much is it worth? All right, a couple of other questions here. What would what what would you say is the key principle behind your approach? Let's get into the entrepreneur step. What is the key principle behind your approach to business coaching that maybe would set you apart from just a lot of the wannabes out there that sell

business coaching? Yeah. So I think I think the two biggest things are, one, I sell from a biblical perspective. And so if I want to be great at sales, I have to sell to serve the people. Do I pay for them? That's right. Do it for them. I have to sell to serve the people, not sell so the people can serve me, right? And #2 is, and I teach this to people, love your clients so much that you would never sell them anything that would do them harm. And so.

This is really cute. Yeah, it is it. And and by the way, loving people is a funk you can't fake. Yeah, I agree. And I, I hate the old saying that, oh, they're so good, they can sell ice to an Eskimo. No, I'm not going to sell ice to an Eskimo. I'm going to sell them a coat, I'm going to sell them warmer gloves, I'm going to sell them a better shelter. Like that's what Myron's talking about. You're selling them what they need based on the problems.

You help them. Find I I, I I like to say it like this. Don't use the money, don't use the people and love the money. Use the money and love the people and take it to its ultimate extreme and use the money to love the people. Exactly, and that's where you start to that's where God blesses you were you learn these skills, you know, you have way more abundance because you're doing it for the right reasons. 100%.

OK, so I love that. So maybe give us a mistake that you made early on in your entrepreneurial journey that maybe I learned a lot from this mistake. But man, if I would have not done that, you know? Greatest sales mistake I think people make is trying to get people to buy. Tell us what you mean. OK, so people do things for their own reasons, not yours. Most sales people who are terrible think that selling is convincing people to buy something they don't want to buy. Exactly.

Persuasion and convincing are not just not the same, they're actually opposites of each other. Convincing is when I attempt to get you to do something I desire you to do for my reasons. Persuasion is when I help you make a decision you already desire to make for your own reasons. You're doing it for them. And people say to people say, well, Myron, how do I find people to sell my stuff to? If you ask the wrong question,

you cannot get the right answer. That's right, right? And so that's a really terrible question. How do I find people to sell my stuff to? Here's a better question, because there are already thousands, 10s of thousands, millions, maybe 10s of millions of people in the world who would love to buy what I'd love to sell. How can I make myself more findable for people who already would love to buy what I'd already love to sell? Then selling becomes effortless.

Yes, you still have to have skill. Yes, you still have to understand how to help them, like unpack their old identity, But they already desire to the transformation. They're just looking for someone who can empower them to make the decision. Well, like I always say, you know, Tony Robbins says a version of this. I like to take it a step

further. In order to influence at the highest level, you have to get that person or people to feel like you understand them, their needs, their fears, their desires, even, you know, their ones. All of that, all of it without buying into their story. That's the unique balance, right? Because they've already done that. They've already bought into these limiting beliefs. So if you buy into the limiting beliefs like they don't have time for this, OK, get back to me next month.

We don't have the money for this. OK, well, when you get the money, get back. See, you're just buying into their story and you offer them zero value, right? Because the problem stay the same and nothing ever changes them because you're buying to their. Story right, They sold. You exactly. Most of it is if you view like you said that selling something you're doing to them.

So when a salesperson sells to you and you give them all this resistance assistance and all this stuff, you're going to do the set, you're getting the same stuff from your prospects on because you don't understand what selling actually is 100%. Once you, once you really started to master that concept, because that's, that's commitment to master. I only, only the masters would even know what we just talked about, right? It's a, it's a different level. What, what happened in your business?

Like once you really started like, man, I'm getting this down because it's I'm still doing this stuff. Yeah, I'm and I'm still I'm. I'm. I learn every day, bro. Never let a day go by where I don't want someone I didn't know the day before. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. What changed is like money became the byproduct of excellence instead of it becoming the pursuit. Yeah. So that's true. How did you get into that mindset though? People don't just happen to get there. Like what caused you?

Like what? What happened there to get you into that mindset? Desiring to become the best version of myself. Which doesn't mean Myron being better than Jeremy or better than Russell or better than Tony. Just me. Me means me being the best version of me. Sure. I don't have any competition. I'm the first, the one and only the greatest of all times. Myron. Freddie Golden, who has ever

lived. Yeah. And that is the right attitude because think about your favorite, you know, maybe your NBA basketball started like LeBron James or Michael Jordan or your favorite, you know, so. We said that in reversal to Michael Jordan and LeBron, and I'm just kidding. No, I, I, I did that for, I did that for the, I did that for the people watching. I did that for LeBron Pans. I love LeBron, but I'm I'm a I'm a loyal MJ guy. I grew up, you know, MJMJM is

the man in high school. So like it, it doesn't matter. Serena Williams, you know, Elon Musk, Warren Buffett, Yeah. You're the the most successful doctors and most successful attorneys. They every, every, they all share one thing in common. And this man just told you it's the commitment to mastery because they know that that training is not something you did in the past. Training is something you do every, every single day.

So if you're not training every single day, you're you're just going to go, you're just going to go backwards. Never stay. There's no standing still. There's no standing still. You're going forward or backwards. You're growing or dying. 100 percent, 100%. So that is where commitment to mastery actually comes in. OK. Couple last questions as we wrap this up. I wanted to go back to commitment to mastery.

So, you know, I, I believe this is one of the industries we're trained, you know, this coaching consulting industry. And we see a lot of people just, you know, it's like they have success in something for like a year and they're like, I'm going to start my own thing selling this. How do you feel about some of that? Because I feel like sometimes people don't really have the skill level. Or the knowledge, I think one of

their own thing, yeah. One of the biggest mistakes, yeah, employees ever make is thinking that because they're good at doing a job, they think that they're going to be good at running that type of business. And they are totally different animals, totally different. They're not even, they're not even the same neighborhood. And so I believe that's one of the biggest mistakes that people like ever make. Nobody's great at everything, but everybody's great at

something. And I believe that if everybody stayed in their lane, everybody could feel great about the work they do and how they show up to serve other people in the world. And here's the thing, people can buy your all your training, they can go through all of it and they can go start their own thing competing against you think you know, the one thing they cannot buy is your experience and your wisdom because they don't have the experience and wisdom themself.

They will never be 5% of what right do with clients because they don't understand why they're doing it. And that takes experience, wisdom that takes longer. I had an 18 year sales career at the top of my game before I even start my own sales training company and I see people sell for one year and like, I'm a sales trainer now.

I'm like, dude, if I would have done that after one year, right, you wouldn't know who I am. Was like, I wouldn't have the experience and knowledge to be able to to do this in every industry. It just takes time. It takes. It takes time. Time, like the purpose of time is becoming. The formula for success is B do have. The platform for success is time, space and matter. The purpose of time is being. The purpose of space is doing. The purpose of matter is having B do have.

B do have. That's a really good frame as well. Myron, that was a great interview. We're going to do this more often here. Where can people learn about what you do about, you know, learning how to speak? And so from stage, because I always say that you can be a great speaker, People can stand up and give you like an an

applause. The people vote based on their dollars 100% and if they're buying your stuff from stage compared to just giving you a round of applause, because giving you a round of applause, you help them a little bit, they're not going to retain 97% of that within 30 days, right?

So you've got to get into your. You've got to sell them a course, a coaching program, a mastermind that they can go study for the next year, 2 years, three years, so they can take the time to become the person who can do that. They're. Not going to do that in a two or three days or an hour and a half because I know it's training. So where can they go to to learn more about what you do and and

get? Like if they go to myrongolden.com, pretty much they can find anything they need to know about our coaching programs, about our challenges, about our books, whatever. Go to myrongolden.com, we'll let Myron golden.com, we'll put that in the show notes. And if you have questions, if you're like, hey, how do I learn how to frame for what I sell? I sell solar SAS or life

insurance or whatever you sell. The easiest way to get a hold of me is simply to text me. So I'm going to give you the number 480637 2944. Myself and a few of our sales trainers lock ourself in a room, but an hour a day and we actually answer your text messages. Myron, it's been a pleasure. Great interview. Fantastic.