Casey on High Fidelity

this is like worldwide synchronicity. It's the Yeah, it's the sort of like large unifying event that pretty much everyone on the planet is undergoing right now. And yeah, there there hasn't been It's been a while since we've had something on that scale. So um, you know, obviously it's it's a terrible thing, but in a way, it is

kind of like bringing people together. So that's interesting. Yeah, Nolan, I when we're doing these minis now, we asked on the on the Facebook page for positives that are coming out of this because people are experiencing positives with this time and being at home and stuff, and I told no law, said man if If. Fifty of the world comes out of this five percent better. That's a big change. Yeah, absolutely, I mean I think it's Yeah, it's it's it's focusing

people back on maybe the essentials in life a little bit. Um. Certainly we're not moving around like we used to or like you know, some of us are used to traveling all the time and being in different places and having this feeling of kind of I don't know, just just

crawling the globe a little bit. Now we're like super tightly focused on the domestic and the neighborhood and you know, just like uh, not even a one mile radius around where we are, you know, so we're like hyper local now, which is which is very interesting and um, I think I think hopefully some some positives will come out of that. Yeah.

I've seen, um, the neighborhood really coming together and sharing things and because you know, people don't want to go to store, so there's just this massive barter exchange going on all over the place with porch drops and pickups and it's, uh, it's really neat. It makes you think, like it's sad that it takes this to get people to come together like that, But hopefully that's something that sticks around. You know, Yeah, it seems like the best

in people tends to come out in these situations. So um yeah, there's there's always that that upside to it, and UM yeah, I don't know. I mean, it just feels like there's there's everything before this and everything after this, you know, and I certainly hope that. I mean, I know there's there's a lot of talk about when are things going to go back to normal? But I think I think normal will be something different, you know. I think it's going to be permanently altered and hopefully mostly

for the positive. Yep, I'm with you there, man, Um, what do you What have you been doing? You've been watching a lot of movies or TV shows? You want to talk about anything you've been watching. Let's see what have I been watching? I'm gonna have been I'm here with my girlfriend and so she's been watching like a lot of series and I'm just kind of like glomming onto that. Um and then you know, maybe later at night, after she's gone to bed, I'll like put on a

movie or something something more kind of my speed. That's you know, typically a downer, typically something you know that's that's not meant for for group consumption. UM, But I really haven't been watching too much so far. During the quarantine, UM, I watched this Russian documentary. It's well, it's about Russia. It's called Pripyatt. It's actually about Ukraine, but it's about you know, Chernobyl. UH, just because I felt like, I don't know, looking at something that somehow related a little

bit to our current uh predicament. UM. And it's a it's a it's a documentary about just the handful of people that are still living in that town prip Yot, where basically the meltdown happened, or was the closest town to the to the to the plant. UM. And the people that have come back to live there, the people that never left, the people that still work at the power plant, UM, well aware that the radiation is still everywhere, and UM have just chosen to you know, basically finished

out their lives there because they know they're gonna get sick. UM. And it's yeah, yeah right, UM. But in a way, it actually was kind of uplifting because UM, in that film, you saw that people can adapt to basically anything, and that in their own way, these people had chosen to be there and that they were happy with that choice because that was home to them and they just wanted to uh stay there and not and not go somewhere else.

So that was one thing I watched. I think I'm gonna pull up my letterbox real quick, make sure I didn't forget anything else. You know, I feel bad. I encourage people to find of me on letterbox and then I used it for like two weeks and then stopped. Yeah, I noticed that. I noticed that some you know, it sticks with some people. Yeah. I watched Train to Boussan the other day, which I hadn't seen yet. I have not seen that one. It's great, good zombie movie. Oh okay,

I didn't notice like a zombie film, zombies on a train. Okay, well I have not seen that done before. Yeah, it's sort of like walking to a sort of like World War Ze meets snow Piercer. Totally would I would definitely watch that. Yeah, very well done though, Like you think you've seen it all in zombie movies and it's such a tired genre, but they managed to put it put a nice original spin on it. Really good and very moving and it was very well developed. Uh, you know,

Korea is just putting out such great stuff. Oh it's Korean, Okay, it makes sense. Yeah. Um, looks like the only other thing I've got here on my recently watched list is uh Antonio Gaudi. It's a documentary about the the architect, Spanish architect who made those really insane eccentric buildings. Um beautiful, beautiful buildings, and it's made by a Japanese filmmaker, Teshi Ghara, who films them in in studying fashion. It reminded me

of Malick a few times. These like slow kind of pushions and beautifully kind of choreographed camera moves to kind of show the space, and um, some very interesting work with sound as well. It's it's almost no dialogue in the film. Um, the scores is really really well matched with what you're seeing. It has kind of an eerie sense. It plays a lot with silence and UM. Yeah it was. It's if if you're looking for something that's kind of non narrative. UM, I definitely recommend checking that one out.

It was. It was on my list for a long time, and I kept putting it off, putting it off because I thought six or seventy minutes about buildings might be kind of dry. But it's actually, um yeah, it's it's one of the better shot things I've looked at in a long time, so worth checking out. Awesome. I will check that out, and I want to I wanna tell the listeners. You may hear some family noise coming from upstairs.

Do you hear it a little bit? I don't hear it at all, No, but I mean it happens definitely. You might hear dogs barking here. Uh. You might hear people rummaging around in the kitchen just outside of my room or yeah, first stuff, you should know. I quarantine the family to the upstairs. Upstairs, I'm in the basement, so that's two floors away, including the dogs, because my

one dog barks at fucking everything that walks by. But for movie crush, I'm just like, you know, if there are a few puss in there, it is what it is. It's casual. It's a hangout. It is it's a hang So we're we're like, we're you know, I have my bedroom here, the kitchen slash common area is just outside. Yeah, I remember. The other bedroom is just the other side. So it's like there's really nowhere to hide in here. Um, we're all kind of living on top of each other.

But so it just obviously, yeah, that's just Paul, like your girlfriend. Yeah, yeah, to get along, um, everybody, you know, everybody. Thankfully we're on the same same wavelength as far as like, we're all pretty quiet, we're all pretty discreet, kind of like keep to ourselves and give each other's space and all that. So yeah, it's it's it's been really nice. Actually, well that's good. I mean that that can't be easy.

But I'm glad that you know, Paul's a good guy and you're a good guy, and I'm sure you're going that's great. So yeah, I'm glad you're not like at each other's throats or anything. No, no, not, not too much of the whole cabin fever phenomenon yet, you know, we're not we're not turning on each other yet. Well give it a few months. Let me if you guys decided to eat Paul, that'll be a short meal, okay, exactly. I need to finish up our Sofia couple of series

before you do that though, So yeah, that's right. Okay, Well I'll put it off till then. Um, so you agreed, thankfully, because you know the the usual list of movies you send out is typical Casey fair, which is to say, uh, I don't want to say downer material, but you have darker taste, not really not really upbeat, you know. I think I think realistic because I don't like stuff that's like downer for the sake of being in a downstare,

you know, that's like trying hard. But I feel like most, um, I don't know, most clear eyed views of life tend to at least integrate a lot of sadness into them along with happiness. I think, I think both coexists. But you're not a bubble gum guy. Um, But but I did request like I would love to be comfort food for the listeners right now, and you throughout high fidelity and perfect, perfect comfort food film. Yeah, I really love

that you love this movie. And it does not surprise me that you love this movie because it kind of has all the Casey elements. Um, it's got a snobbery, it's got it's got great music. Um, it's got one of the better scripts ever. I think, Yeah, I think so too, uh and a and a weirdly overlooked Stephen Frears. I think, um, yeah, it's it's unusual for a director to kind take a back seat. Uh, And I think Hornby's well, he didn't write it, but Kusak and his

friends did. But horn Hornby's original material and John Kusack, they shine so bright in this movie that Stephen Frears is really allowed, is allowed to kind of fall into the background, which is not fair because he does a great job. No, I mean, even even this time watching and I've seen this movie, you know, countless times. It's one of those you just throw on you watch, you know, I couldn't I couldn't even begin to imagine how many

times I've seen it. Um, but it's it's one of those that is deceptively simple or deceptively easy seeming, because it's also natural at all, just totally all the pieces fit together so well that you almost are not aware that there's a director working because it just seems like they turn the camera on and they're in this record

store hanging out, and it's just what it is. But you realize that, yeah, I know, somebody had to make this film, and and for it to feel so effortless is just a sign of, you know, how masterful it really is. Yeah, in the in the the lack of ego and confidence to take not a back seat, but you know, to to be okay with being almost invisible as a director. Right. Um. But you know, when you think of direction, I think a lot of people might think of just like, oh, camera shots, but there's so

much more that goes into it. The development of a character, and all these characters is Steven Treers, his fingerprints are very much on it. Um. It's not like John Cusack just waltzt in here fully formed. Um. There's a lot that goes into the formation of a character with a director and an actor. Absolutely, absolutely, I mean the control of the tone throughout the whole thing, the little the because I mean this this movie is kind of all

over the map in terms of where it goes emotionally. Um. Even though it feels it stays pretty lighthearted, but there is you know, there's there's death and grief and angst over relationships and sort of a character asking himself what is the meaning of his life? What does he want in life? Um? But it all stays in this kind of light comic register, which without feeling faults, you know, without feeling like um, it's being artificially kind of boosted

in terms of the cheeriness of it. It really earns that kind of perspective on life, and um, yeah, Freers just Um, he kind of gets out of the way a little bit, but at the same time he's very much in control. And you know, this is one of those films that when I'm watching it, I tend not to be so aware of things that directorially he's doing in terms of the camera, in terms of the editing

and so on. Um, even if this movie has a few moments that are somewhat showy, I mean it has the direct address, it has kind of like any number of stylish um elements, and structurally it moves all over the place, you know. Um, but it just it just it goes down so smoothly and so naturally that um, you can you can really lose sight of that. So

it's it's interesting too in a way. It's a difficult movie to talk about kind of because, um, there's not so many obvious things that the director is quote unquote doing that you can really clom onto. Yeah, but you're right, I mean, they're they're they utilized flashback so well in that first act, um, with all the past relationships, and that's that's really uh that's really such a great way to set this movie up. And obviously we're gonna be

talking about Nick Horne meets Novel. I assume you read it. Yes, yeah, I figured you did. I read it many many years ago, because I couldn't even remember if I read it. Yeah, it was so long ago. And then I was like, yeah, I totally read this book. I read it. I read it after having seen the movie. And it's one of those ways the movie is so impactful and so perfect of a realization of that thing that reading the book was basically like reading like an expanded screenplay or something.

It was basically just me picturing the characters and the actors from the movie, you know, in London, of course, because it's it's a different setting and um and all that, but still it's it's for me. It was less like experiencing it as a book and more just kind of like, oh, so this is the material they were working with, here's what they changed, you know. Um. It was more that it was it was really tough to to approach it

just as a work of fiction or something. Yeah, and it's cool too, It's not like England is so different than America, but just the universality of the record store snobs. And I don't remember, you know, this is wicker Park in Chicago. I don't know what. I can't remember what neighborhood it was in London. I'm sure it was some

like cool sort of you know, burgeoning hipster neighborhood. But uh, and it's it's the same as you know, I've been going to Wake Street here in Atlanta since I was, you know, fifteen years old, and I went there a few months ago, and uh, it's the exact same and

the same dude owns it. And it's the same vibe. Man, that that feeling that when you walk into a record store and you're buying, you're buying for you, but that you all also like if you leave with five albums, like I guarantee you one of those is one that you're trying to impress the record store owner a little bit with, Yes, you just want to get that that head nod at checkout or whatever, funny like, oh that's

a cool record, you know. Yeah, And it took took so many years for me to build up the confidence to uh, to be like, no, I just want to like what I like. I'm not to to impress anyone else. But so much of this movie is about that. I mean, it's part of the fabric of this film is criticism, you know, yeah, oh absolutely, Um, I think I mean in a way this film is obviously it's twenty years old now, so it's it's going to be a time

capsule in some way, shape or form. But I think even more profoundly it is a time capsule because I think it really captures an aspect of the culture, um that doesn't exist quite so much anymore, in the same way that has been changed, um, just with you know, the shift to um online streaming, to the way that we consume music now, Um, there's there's so much less of an emphasis on I find on being cool, on knowing the right bands, on on being dialed into that.

Some of that may have come with age from myself, but I really do think that, um, you know, around the early two thousand's, that was when sort of Pitchfork was really like becoming like the main I don't know, epicenter of like hip music whatever you wanna call it, the whole kind of like hipster thing. Um. And you know, if a band got like a ten point oh on Pitchfork it was like you had to hear that album.

Has one ever got the ten point oh oh yeah yeah, yeah yeah, and there there have been even um, you know, contemporary artists, not just reissues they got the ten point oh. But I mean it is something that like they only give a handful of year is that? And it's like an event when it happens, because it's like, holy shit,

what what merited? You know, the perfect score, especially if it's a new record exactly yeah, yeah, yeah, well yeah and so um and of course Pitchfork is based in Chicago, so there's there's that connection to or at least they

were before they moved to New York. But um, yeah, there used to be this this whole culture of like the the hipster kind of music snob, the person that's like into all the cool bands and finds out about like yeah that you've never heard of and and then goes deeper with like okay, like you like Green Day, but have you heard of this other band that like

influence them? And you know, here's like this obscure like indie record that kind of like influence this bigger band, and so on all that sort of like kind of music scholarship stuff the kind of one upmanship and so on. I feel like we don't have as much now because people are just like playing playlists or going on YouTube or Spotify. You know. It's just it's just kind of like I feel like, well, because you know, the big thing in this movie is physical media, right. It's it's

the record store. You have to go to a place where they have the music, and you have to buy the music, um and it comes on on a physical disc. And so it manifests itself as these physical collections in in houses and so on, uh and apartments where it is like you know, as as we see can be a form of like autobiography looking at somebody's collection and feeling like you know so much about that person just

by what records they have and so on. That's one of the that is that's one of the great moments of the movie when Yes, he's reorganized and reorganizing and Dick comes over and it's such a thing. Dick is just like, oh, like he's going to cancel his plans to help him, and he immediately dismisses. He's like, well, it's it's not alphabetical because that is now rudimentary based thing into yeah, and when he says autobiographical, he's just

fucking blown away. He just takes a moment he's like wow, okay, yeah, but but I mean that that that impults. I feel like, um, it's hard to feel the same way about like, you know, files in your iTunes collection or or just like the stuff that you've got favorited on on your streaming after whatever. They're there. Yeah, it's just there. I mean, even um, you know, my my era was was largely the CD era, and and even that, you know, people people would, um,

some people obviously like the more hip story. People would be more into vinyl. And you know, with vinyl you get like the larger artwork, you get the gatefold, like the liner notes are bigger, um, and it's sort of like invites you to kind of you know, look at it while you're listening to it and have this kind of tactile experience. Of course you've got to flip the record every few songs and so on, so like all that.

You know, the way that we consume music has has really changed a lot, um, even even in terms of like listening on like a phone or something while you're on the go, having like earbuds, in on the Train or whatever. Um, Yeah, the way we consume music has really really changed a ton in the last twenty years, and it feels like this movie is like a time capsule of that period, like five minutes before all that changed,

you know. Yeah, it is sort of at the tail end. Um. Although I will say, go into any record store now, because I started buying vinyl again a couple of years ago, and it's, uh, it is at time capsule. You're right back there and flipping through those records. It's just like pure joy and oh it's the best, so much fun. And John like, this came out when I was twenty and years old, so I was kind of right there at his age. It was the perfect movie for me.

And so there were things that happened in the movie love relationship wise that kind of mirrored some things that I had gone through. So I really felt like and and I know a lot of people feel a lot of ownership stake in this film, and I certainly did. Oh yeah, I I one percent could identify with aspects of you know, the three male kind of record store clerks, the archetypes. Yeah, the archetypes exactly, because they really are

kind of boiled done to archetypes. You have sort of you know, the Jack Black, the kind of boisterous, opinionated guy who's going to throw you out of the record store for asking for the wrong Stevie Wonder record or whatever, right, but also play walking on Sunshine exactly. Yeah, he has like a kind of um, I don't know, he's he's willing to be I don't know what the word would be, sentimental, a corny or you know, he's he's open on his terms exactly exactly. And if if you happen to fall

outside those terms, then you're like enemy number one. You know, you can't be trusted because your case is bad. Um, they have you know, the yes he oh man, I mean every scene. Um, he just he just kind of dominates when he's when he's in there. He's just such a such a familiar kind of guy. It feels like we all have known that guy. Um, the Todd Loiso character. Um, the kind of I that's a one thousand percent a type of guy that that I've met many many times

at shows and so on. Um, you know, Quieter has got the messenger bag. He's like, he says um a lot, and and you can tell when he's saying, um, he's not even saying it because you can't think of the next thing he's gonna say. It's like a tick where he's like he's trying to kind of, I don't know, smooth it or or or make himself a little bit more approachable or something. Yeah, this guy, he um, in my mind, he marries Anna, Like that's who this Shray is.

He he marries he marries his first girlfriend, and you kind of get the sense that Anna is that first girlfriend, which his his sort of sweet demure sensibilities makes it so effective. Later on when he's the one that goes craziest in the fantasy sequence the air conditioning and he knocks those looks like chicklets out of his mouth with the phone. It's such a great scene. I love that, and I just want to say that. The actor Todd Loizo, also a film director, made a great, great Philip Stie

Moore Hoffman film called Love Liza. Have you seen that one? Yeah? Yeah, I loved I loved loved that movie. Um, he's he's popped up in little small roles in a lot of movies. Uh. He was in Snakes on a Plane. Weirdly enough. Yeah, he was in Jerry McGuire. I think he played the maybe the baby sitter or something in a couple of scenes. But it has a really important scene where he kind of counsels Jerry and um, yeah, he doesn't pop up much, but I think he's really good. Yeah, and um, I

don't know that that love lives of film. It's it's too bad that it doesn't seem like he's made. He's directed a few other films, but nothing in that same register. I don't think. Um, that was a real downer. It's a downer. It's a downer. But you know, great, great

Jim or Rook score to that film. I didn't know that. Yeah, and Jim more Rourke is is kind of You can see one of his records and in high fidelity, Um, there's you know, there's there's like references in the background until like Drag City, the label that he was on for a lot of them. Yeah. So, um, I had that pavement poster by the way, oh, the one in the apartment. Yeah, it's so it's like hated so heavily

because it's right by the entrance, right the door. Yeah, every every time he comes in, you're looking at that pavement poster. Yeah, I always wanted that thing, and um, Emily got me a rock poster book, like just a huge thing and it was in there, man. And you know they're perforated as you can tear them ount and frame them. So that's actually behind me in my band room,

right here on the wall. Oh it's fantastic. Yeah, yeah, just the I mean it's again physical, physical objects, you know, and the stories we tell ourselves about them, and the and the significance to have in our lives and everything. Um is is such a big part of what this movie is about the comfort of the tactile, the physical, you know, not the virtual. Yeah, and these guys who uh obsessively make lists like lists are a big part

of this. That was a big part of Hornby's novel obviously, um and you know it's sort of that's the framework of the film is the list of the girlfriends. And it's such a clever, great way to start it, uh. In that first act when he goes through this list, um,

he's he's obsessively ranking things. That first girlfriend a relationship lasted for six hours, the two hours after school before the Rockford files three days in this rock Fred files and then he gets his you know, he goes through each one of these girls, meeting them later in life, and it's he's absolving himself. But it sort of occurs to you as you're watching this film that he is he's not redeemed until the very end. He's just a

narcissistic prick. Sort of. That's one thing that that really stuck out to me watching at this time versus like when I was twenty years younger, and you know, I could I could maybe, I don't know, I didn't. I didn't see as much of I didn't see his flaws as much because I was still very much in that same mindset as a watching a little bit older, as you're like, wow, there's not much uh yeah, and you know, like when especially when, um, what's her name? The you know,

his the main the main girlfriend. Yeah, how do you pronounce her name? Any idea? Laura Is is the movie character, but I don't know how he pronounced that. Even I think is sort of sort of in the neighborhood. She's been around a lot. She was so good in this and then just kind of I know she's done a lot of stuff, but nothing is high profile. Is this I feel like, Yeah, she was in a large von Trier film, UM about six years after this came out, UM called The Boss of It All, which was one

of his like lesser scene kind of movies. UM. But yeah, I I have not seen her in very much else and UM, her performance in this is great. I do feel like there there are a few scenes where maybe there's a few line readings that feel maybe a little stiff, but there's something about her just her presence feels so natural and so grounded and so right for the character that she's playing. UM that is sort of like it's weird because in a way, the movie is about settling

in a certain sense. It's about compromise. It's about you know, growing up and being realistic about um relationships and not just wanting this like male fantasy that doesn't really exist in the real world. As he says near the end, you know, the reason that the fantasy is so appealing is because it doesn't exist, and it can't exist, and it's it's basically a byproduct of not knowing that person

very well. Yet you can project only good things onto them and fill in all the blanks, and then when you get to know a person they're they're a three dimensional, rounded person with flaws and everything, and that fantasy goes away when he talks about you know, like the underwear.

For instance, He's like, I used to think women just wore amazing underwear all the time, and then you live with one and you realize like, oh no, there's like granny panties, and they only wear their best underwear on the night they think they might have exactly exactly you. You kind of you become aware of, um of like

femininity as a kind of performance in a way. Um that that that when you're young, you just kind of think maybe women are naturally that kind of beautiful and perfect looking, because you know dat up you know the problem of of growing up as a young boy and learning about not really learning about women, but thinking you're learning about women by watching television and movies and and looking at Playboy magazines in the woods and stuff like that.

Like none of that ship does did any of us any favors as far as the reality of like, no, women are human beings just like us, and the narcissism of a man. It's this movie just nails it so perfectly to be like, well, you know, you should always just be wearing lingerie around the house or something. It's just like it really just nails the mail point of

view and how wrong that is in so many ways. Yeah, and it's it's fascinating because he is a more self aware kind of character, um in a certain sense, because he's talking about himself, he's reflecting on his life. He's um, but it's all about him. But it's all about him.

It's very narcissistic. And even to the extent that he is self aware, where he can say like I am an asshole or something, Um, there's still a deeper layer of unawareness that still persists even as he thinks of himself as like a more highly evolved kind of male, because he's not you know, like a dumb jock or something like like we would like we would say, especially you know, a stabby hipster would say about other types

of people. It's like, oh no, no, no, no, I'm I'm a thinker, I read books, I watch an interesting films, right yeah yeah yeah yeah, and um, you know they it's easy to flatter yourself and think that you are um. Yeah, this this kind of like highly evolved being or something. But it just goes to show that that that sort of um, yeah, that that really kind of male perspective just persists no matter no matter where you are, kind

of in that hierarchy. Yeah, and they even say it, you know, in that one great line he says that we, you know, we kind of figured out that you are what you like, not what you are like. Um. But that's so not true. And that's that's part of his problem as a character, I think, is that everything is reduced like he he reduces each of his excess to these archetypes. There was the pretty nice girl prude. There

was the sensitive girl who was rejected Lily Taylor. There's Charlie the uh, you know, the sexy world the uh and Katherine say to Jones, is so good in this. She's like the the one that got away or the one where he was quote unquote dating outside his Yeah. Yeah, but he realizes that she's an asshole. She's shallow and superficial, but he is too. Yet he sees her flaw not his own. She's so good in this though she has so many great little lines. There's that one small moment.

This movie has so many little small moments that you can almost not notice. But when he flashes back to her and and first of all, I love all the old versions of Cusack. It says so much about the character, Like he's the clash punk in the scene, he's this

emo guy in the scene. But when they're when when they're hanging out and she goes and she sort of straddles him in that big, huge, crowded room and he kisses her and she just goes, kiss my neck and he does he obeys, and that's such a like a little small moment, But that is that is that that that woman? Yeah, he's kissing her and she's like, no, kiss me here, Like she's sort of in charge, you know. Oh yeah, she has all the power in that in

that relationship. And you know, as as as the movie show is, like the whole time he's with her for a couple of years, he's he's worried that he's going to be found out in any moment. He feels like an imposter. You know, he feels like he's not at ease because he just has the sense that he doesn't deserve it or um, you know, he's not cool enough, he's not on her level, and that sooner or later she's going to realize that, and she kind of does you know that's that when she ultimately gives him the

reasons marking up. Yeah, Marco so perfect too. He just seemed, uh, he just seemed more sunny, you know. He just seemed a little high maintenance and and you know, um, she's she's dead on um. I love Another one little detail character detail that I loved was, and it comes into play a few times, is John Cusack jumping over the counter instead of walking around. And he even does it.

He does it a couple of times in the movie where or in the record store where the you know, it's four ft away to walk around the thing, but he leaps over the thing and then he does it. I never noticed this until today. I just finished watching it. He at the very um end when Laura's dad dies, he goes to the funeral. He leaves in the rain, a lot of good rain scenes, and he goes to the bus bench and he jumps over the bus bench.

The fence he hops while he hops the bench and sits down, and then he helps the fence to lay down in the flower bed. But it's such a funny little character thing that was obviously very purposeful. You know, that's funny. Yeah, that's like his move, that's like his thing he does when he wants to like can like action something. Yeah. Yeah, And it's funny too when he does in the record store, like at least the first

time he does it. He like each ship, you know, he like he falls over the calendar and like because he's trying to turn off Katrina in the ways I think that Jack Black has put on um. So Lisa Boni comes in. She does a great job as the Muse, and I think it's I haven't seen the TV show yet, but I think it's super cool that she plays that character. I think I'm going to give it a shot. Ifford,

it's good. But um, all these guys are so submitten with Lisa Bone and uh, you know, I obsessively look at when we've talked about this before, at the movie clock as far as the screenwriting paradigm of first plot point, second plot point, and it always falls at like thirty minutes. So I was watching it today and Lisa Boni Bone comes in at twenty three minutes, which is a little early, and I thought that's a little bit early, But that's

a red herring. That is not the plot point The plot point is at thirty one minute, and that's when you learn about Ian. Interesting. Interesting, that's totally it, man, because that's what spends his list about is just she's there to serve as sort of a temporary muse. But Ian the revelation that Ian what fucking the dreaded I And yeah, that's the plot point. And then right after that he finishes top top five really quickly, right after

that kind of ceiling that first act thread. Yeah, and of course he he he leaves Charlie out of the list because he's like, I'm I'm not ready for that one yet. Yeah, that's right, that's right. Yeah. Um, but but you know with with Charlie, it's like he's you know, he says, um, he kind of he holds her picture up, and then he says, but I'm not ready for that

one yet. And then she actually contacts him a little later in the film and it kind of restarts that sort of visiting all the ex's sequence over again, which is interesting structurally. It is that you kind of introduced this top five list and then very quick you're skipping one.

And then also there's the thing where he names like the kind of inconsequential relationship is number five, but he has to admit to himself like, Okay, I actually just put that one in there because I wanted to keep you, Laura, out of the top five. But now I have to admit I'm I'm broken, and yes, you you made the top five. Yeah. Well, he has that great um part early on when she first breaks up with him, and the movie starting out with a breakup is really pretty ingenious.

But when he finally goes to the window and screams out, if you really wanted to hurt me, you should have gotten to me sooner. And there's so many lines in this movie that I'm just like, oh my god, to write a line like that just is It's a movie just chock full of perfect, perfect lines, and it's it's very true. I think, Um. One of the things about maturing is that you know when a relationship does end.

When I've had breakups, when I've been you know, a little bit older, it's still it's still really hard, it's still pretty devastating, but at the same time, you have more perspective on it, and there's there's less of like a sense of the world ending, I get than when you're like a teenager or in your twenties and the teenage stuff, like yeah, losing that first girlfriend is just you think it's you're never going to get over it, you know, exactly exactly, and so there's a there's a

there's kind of a sadness in a way of getting to be older and the same thing happens and you kind of realize like, yeah, it sucks, but I'll get through it in life will go on, you know, in a way that's that's more evolved, that's more um, more developed,

more mature. At the same time, it's kind of like, yeah, but I kind of wish it would still hurt the way it did, because that means on the flip side, it's that much more intense as well, I don't know well, and also means you're I don't know, maybe you feel more alive when you're exactly the most dead emotionally or something. H Yeah, it's it's like you you're you're you have

less experience, so everything is still more new. So like, um, it's like, uh, I don't know, when you're a little kid and you like skin your knee for the first time, it's like agony. You know, you've never known pain before, and you're like, what is this? I this is the worst, you know, Yeah, and you get to be a little older and it's just like, yeah, okay, banged up any

no big deal, you know. Yeah. Um. I think another interesting thing the movie structurally is a little odd in the um like what you were talking about, where it places certain things, um plot points, and you don't learn until I guess it's about halfway through the movie, after you've learned of Ian and you're like, oh my god, she's betrayed him with this this fucking world music guy. Uh. Then Tim Robbins, by the way, he's in the movie for two minutes and fifty seconds and it's so impactful.

Oh man, Yeah, it feels like he's in it for way more than that does. Every second he's on screen, it is just hilarious. But um, you learn of the four transgressions he admits to uh, and the way they shot that scene is great because he's admitting two through the fourth wall to the to the viewer in real time as Laura is telling Liz Joan Cusack, who's always

great about the four transgressions. After you've spent this entire first first act setting him up as a victim, which works perfectly because that's what the narcissists would do, is lead to lead everyone to believe that he had his heartbroken and he was just nothing but always there for her. You didn't tell people that he cheated on her and that she was never his fault, but it is all his fault. Yeah, yeah, and he does, he does, thankfully.

I mean, he gets that perspective by going through this exercise of you know, going back and kind which is narcissistic in and of itself, right, right, And it's the kind of thing where maybe obviously probably should be accomplished just by therapy or you know, just thinking reflecting back

on your life and having some perspective on it. But I mean it's great to see it illustrated in this way, and for the film, obviously it's more cinematic to uh actually have those encounters in person and to see him kind of realized that, um, you know, in the case of his his first girlfriend, it's like, oh, she literally married the next guy that she kissed on the bench, right, So that part's funny. He feels better, uh, And I love that scene. I think that's um John Travolta's mom

or no, no, no, no. Travolta's mom plays Laura's mom. Okay, but yeah. This lady's like, no, you weren't the first boyfriend, and he's like, oh no, I really was. I was first. He's like, no, you really weren't. But his narcissism is never more fully on display than the second girlfriend, the quote unquote prude who reveals that he kind of ruined her and she was basically raped and and had and probably still has a bad relationship with sex because of

the pressure he put on her. And it's a heavy scene and she leaves and immediately afterward he feels happy and absolved, and it's just yeah, yeah, yeah he in that moment, his reaction is just kind of like, great, that's another one I have to worry about. It wasn't about me. I was, you know, And of course it was all about him. It was all his fault, it was all his doing, it was all his sort of

immaturity at that age. To kind of that's sort of superficial single minor emphasis on like sex over just the relationship as a whole, where sex would have come sooner or later ratually anyway, but he just had this sort of like um as most guys do, or many guys do anyway, Um, this kind of like single minded focus on just like I want to have sex, I don't want to be a virgin. Um, you're you're not a

man until you do. Um. Uh just just this kind of like one dimensional view of everything, like are you doing it or are you not doing it? Because that's everything you hear and yeah, you know, you're a little kid.

You don't know, you don't know what the fund is going on, So you're just going off of these cues that you pick up from pop culture and media and then other boys on the playground who hears things from their older brothers, and none of it's correct and all the you know, all the music that he's listening to. Where it just I mean that is kind of the

where where it's all headed. Um, So yeah, it's it's And I feel like even even culturally, I feel like we've maybe turned a corner from that a little bit since even twenty years ago. So you know, hopefully, I think boys these days are growing up with a little bit more of a well rounded view of things. But well, you know, mothers and fathers teaching their exactly better than yeah,

we were taught right perhaps right. It's it's that's sort of like it's a it's a generational shift where um, yeah, people are becoming a little bit more aware of that stuff. And yeah, and hopefully it will it will make for I don't know, healthier, healthier sort of attitudes towards these things from an earlier age, so that you don't have to get into your late twenties to figure some of

that out, you know. Yeah. Then he goes to Lily Taylor, um, and uh has a chance to sleep with her, probably, but he has that great line, another one of those great I don't know if it was Nick Hornby. He probably reworked it to fit the American version, but he says it'd be like sleeping with Tallya Shire and Rocky if you're not Rocky. Yes, yes, so specific, so specific and funny. It was really good. Um, and I also

thought it was interesting and again just pure narcissism. The only thing he cares about, and the one question that he asks Laura is if the sex is better with Ian right still so wrapped up in his own performance and his own manhood, and it's just it's so pitiful,

you know, And it makes her laugh. She's like, seriously, that's what you're worried about, Like not you know the relationship that we built over how many years it's been and um, and and the sort of deeper question of like I don't want to be with you anymore that should have sealed the deal. Yeah, yeah, yeah, she's you know, if there's if there's a critique to be made of the movie, I guess it's that she gets back together

with him. Yeah, she gets back together with him, that she ultimately forgives him that, you know, because he he really doesn't Um. I mean he he does. He does have some more insight, you know, he gains him in sight, but he's still work in progress very much. And um, in a way, he's kind of rewarded at the end for for bad behavior in terms of sort of pseudo

stalking her even after the breakup has happened. You know, he does not certainly does not respect boundaries, and and he keeps pushing, pushing, pushing until it's really just her father dying. That kind of creates that window of opening where she knows that this Ian guy is not going to be the one. He's not who she wants in that time of crisis, and you know, her big relationship is this guy that has already kind of been you know,

hounding her and so on. So it kind of just it's almost like a moment of weakness for her that she gets back with him. And they even they even acknowledged that he's like, you know what, it's too easy, too or too hard to not be with you or something like what was right. It's just like it's it's it's it's it's returning to something comfortable and familiar, you know, when when she is really looking for that having lost

her dad. So um. Yeah, in in a way, the movie um is kind of Yeah, like I said, he's he's being rewarded for behavior that he probably should not have been rewarded for and um, and in a way, he doesn't fully maybe learn the lesson, um that he might have otherwise if he had just lost her permanently. Yeah. Although I will say why that sequence works with the funeral is because, um, he doesn't go in there with that in mind. He doesn't. He's not the one thinking, hey,

I have an opening here. She's weak, she's sad. They played that just right, because that would have been that would have been too much for that character exactly would have been unforgivable. But he um, and this is the situation that mirrored my life. That exact fucking thing happened to me. I hadn't had an ex girlfriend, a sort of recent ex girlfriend whose grandmother died, and uh, she got together with me one and because she wanted to

forget and just feel something else. And I thought like, hey, are we back together? We were not back together, but this happens sort of. I think this movie came out three years after that happened. So I was just like, oh my god, like, this is my life on screen that happens in real life. It's amazing. Yeah. Uh and then he goes, uh, well you get that great music queue when um, you learned that she hasn't had sex with Ray with we are the Champions, yes, which is

so funny. I mean it's again, it's such a such a I don't know, a kind of hilariously male thing to be that obsessed with, like because I mean she you know, there's that whole the whole discussion about the word yet um where she says, you know, well I haven't I haven't done it with him yet. All Right, everyone you hear a kazoo. It's because we have another little visit from my daughter Ruby. Do you want to say hi at least to everyone? Hi? What have you

been doing today? Hi? Rube in what plane? Go high and seek? Play and go hide and seek? All right, kiddo, you need to give me some a little bit more time. I'm almost done. Hey, you can't stay in here, I know you want to. So that happened with Noel as well. She popped in for a little business. I'm just leaving those small windows in um. And actually, speaking of windows, nice transition, Emily wanted me to mention that we always talk about her watching movies because she loves the apartment

of the house or whatever. And she said, oh, make sure you mentioned Marita sells window room. She's like, it's one of her favorite things in any movie. Ever is this loft that she constructed these window walls out of these old windows. And so she wanted me to mention that, yeah, I I we uh, I was watching with my girlfriend. We we both kind of like notice that, yeah the

other night. Yeah. So Marita sal serves as the perfect kind of like I said at earlier Temporary muse Um, she is I don't even think she qualifies quite as a red herring. No, but I would argue that the red herring is Natasha Gregson Wagner at the end, Yes, who is this super cute music journalist and he makes her this mixtape and she serves as ultimately what is a sort of his final test. Yeah, exactly. She's like the because she in that in that sort of like,

you know, less mature male mindset. She is that sort of manic pixie dream girl, like the perfect male fantasy of like the girl who was into all the same cool bands that you are, and like you can just spend hours talking about records and films and you know, um, obviously she's super cute and but also has this kind of like of deferential quality to him, which needs yeah, which he needs. He needs to kind of like even though they they know a lot of the same music

and so on, she even writes about it. Um, you know, he still needs to feel like the one who was like the expert expert, you know, so that he can kind of like be, oh, I'll make you a mixtape and I'll like show you these bands that maybe you don't know about. Narcissistic still and She's like, oh, I would love that. And you know, by the way, do you know she's Nettalie Wood's daughter. Yeah, I didn't know that. Yeah, it's very interesting. Um, she hasn't been in a ton

of stuff over the year. She's been She was in that really good movie with Heather Graham and Robert Downey Jr. About like The Threesome, Remember I saw it way back when. And she's been in a couple of other things. But she's she seems to be a little choosier maybe with what she writes to do. Yeah. Um, So jumping back the the big question finally gets asked by Liz, and I think it's one of the most pivotal points in the movie is when she says, why do you even

want to get back together with her so badly? And he has no answer and they kind of cut it at the right time, and that's when it all comes into full view as a viewer that like, is it her or is it his ego that has been wounded? And is it just that is it just about saving face? Is it just about like recovering something that was taken from him? You know, um, so that he can feel like he's back in control or that you know, he's

he's kind of right it or wrong or something. But ultimately, yeah, is it Is it a question of him actually wanting to be in that relationship or not. That's something that he has to figure out, and ultimately he realizes, yes, I do, like I want to turn this corner. I want to kind of you know, move on to a different phase of life where I'm not just preoccupied twenty four hours of the day with like breakups and xs and what's wrong with me? And why does no one

like me? And and all that stuff. Yeah, and that that line that serves this sort of the second plot point, which spends us into the third act, because that's when he finally starts to explore a little bit about what he loved about her, not just how being with her made him feel. So it's sort of the first time he's not completely superficial and shallow. It's the first little peak that you're actually going to get a character arc,

which is much later in movies than usual. I think, sure, yeah, you're you're kind of um, you're trusting that the viewer is going to stick with the character long enough to um to finally come around and have some some some change, some development, some some insight, which is which is interesting. It's it's not so much like a three act like heroes journey kind of thing. He kind of all the insight happens right there at the end to kind of have this has this like Eureka moment where where it

all clicks into place a little bit. Yeah. They had that great scene with um when she is in his apartment when he gets home and she's reading the top five job dream jobs, which are hysterical because they're so specific and so like, not just I want to write

for a rolling Stone. It's like I want to write for Rolling Stone for these three years during a certain time period, which is well in the past, which is basically you know, he's he's made like three of his five dream jobs are impossible, that they will never happen, you know, says well, you don't want to be King of France exactly exactly. It's such a good It's it's very funny because I mean it's it just shows a kind of, um, I don't know, self sabotaging, self defeating behavior,

of of a certain kind of personality. Um that that he would define his goals as things that are just on their face, never going to be achievable. You know, it says everything about him. Yeah, yeah, that he's never Um, I don't know. I mean it's like he says at one point, I think, um, it was easier in a way to uh, to not try, because to tries to risk failure. And so by by not trying and by just kind of like persisting in this like purgatory state, this sort of in between limbo. Um, he was quote

unquote keeping his options open. But that's nothing. Yeah, you know, that's not living a life basically. Yeah, he's a guy who lives in a fantasy world. Uh, you know, he's the fantasy of these women, the fantasy of these jobs, instead of the reality which he rocks him into, which is and she even says, so she's like, what about record store owner, like you kind of have a dream job. Uh. And then you know it sets up that great that that final sort of redemption that he decides to put

something into the world. He invents this record label sort of on the spot, which is out of character for him to put himself out there like that. And um, that the way they organized at all. That's right before the funeral stuff, which is interesting because he kind of has that redemptive moment. Then they spend that right into the funeral when he sleeps with her in the car. Yeah,

I would like to. I wonder if there were alternate versions where things were sort of because you could rearrange this movie a little bit, Oh, should still have it be tell the same story and be successful. Yeah, that that is a very interesting question, whether there was any restructuring in the edit, because, like you said, you could you could kind of piece this puzzle together quite differently if you wanted to, with a little bit of voiceover, rewrites,

re shoots, whatever, um, you could. You could completely change the structure. So I wonder how much of that was there in the script and how much of that was found, um, you know, in in the process of cutting the film together. But I would not be surprised if if you know, some pieces here and they're moved around. Yeah. I think more so than other films, it has a little bit

of flexibility with how you could structure it. It's very nonlinear, and you know, he can he can kind of jump forward in back in time, and we can even revisit something that we've already seen earlier in the film where he gives us more information about something. UM. Yeah, it's it's very very interesting. I mean the film is like, UM on one thing I did I did pick up

on watching some of the the extras for this. UM. They talked about how in the initial you know, few drafts of the screenplay, all the stuff that was direct addressed was just written his vo He didn't want to do it. I don't think right right, and so you know, pretty quickly they came around to the idea that no, actually we should probably do direct address because these are some of the most compelling moments in the film in terms of what he's actually saying. There's a lot and

there's so much of it. Yeah, like what would you do, I mean, what would you even show like him just you know, in the record store and some v O or something. It just wouldn't feel right. So because the movie in a way, I mean it's it's it's very much from his perspective. It's all coming from his head,

you know, it's the way he thinks. So he sees the world as the way he organizes events, you know, So you have to have his his sort of um, you have to have his character basically in control of the movie for it to work, I think, yeah, And the fourth wall thing is, um, it's such a tough thing to pull off well, and it's been done. It's certainly been done before. Um Ferris Bueller comes to mind,

and other films that that heavily used it. Um, this, this may use it more heavily than any movie, maybe Alfie, which also worked well. I think, But um, it's a tough thing to pull off. And I get why a Q sack is. I get why an actor period is reticent to go there because it has done so seldomly um so well as this, But I think careers kind

of talked him into it. Yeah, it's like it's like, um, I mean, it's it's the thing that we're taught to not do in screenwriting or in filmmaking, which is, you know, you don't just come out and tell the audience something. You're supposed to show it in some way. So if you just have the guy talking to camera and kind of explaining how he feels or what happened in his life or so on, there's a big risk that it's going to feel too literal or too just unimaginative, not dynamic.

But if you notice when when those scenes are happening, they always like it's almost a sort of reality outside reality, where for instance, he's like walking around Chicago and you don't really get the sense that there's like a lot of life happening around him. It's kind of the streets are empty. Um, it's almost a sort of dream state or something, um, where you can tell you're you're more sort of within the realm of his mind a little bit than just a guy walking down a real street

or something. And that kind of offsets the tone. And I mean, yeah, and I love the kind of play where even within a scene things will happen. He kind of turns to camera and sort of you know, adds another layer to it. Again, these are, like you said, these are things that we see in other works, but um,

there's something about the way it's done here. Maybe it's think about the just like the the quality that that Cusack has as an actor, as a presence on screen, as somebody that we want to root for, that we can relate to. You know, he's every man in a lot of ways. Yeah, he's the ever man, but he can also convey like thoughtfulness and intelligence and um, relatability and in all that in a way that, um, I don't think most actors would would be able to achieve

with the same material. Yeah, it's interesting you were talking about them, and this is what always happens with the fourth wall is is we're meant to believe that everything around him is suspended and you're addressing camera. But um, they do something I haven't really seen much and at the very end, and I never noticed it until today. Uh, at the very end, he's doing one of his monologues and Laura hears it and she says she references and she I can't remember what the line was, but she

asked him. She's like, what did you just say about something? And it's sort of a very interesting, little cheekey clever thing because they don't he doesn't look back at this screen and be like, what they cheat us here? Um, but it's interesting that they chose to do that at all. And I'm I'm kind of wondering why it's it's really because they never it's not like a payoff or anything.

It's just a just a little nod or something. Maybe it means maybe it means that she can finally hear him right, And maybe it's saying something about the care or that he's let he's let her in. Yeah, maybe that's what he's he's given her. I mean he now kind of shares that that internal world with another person in a way, whereas before it was something that he kind of kept. Ye, that's it. I'd be curious to hear about that. You know, Cusack is this is one

of the three films he's been road showing. Um, yeah, last year. The past couple of years he's gone on tour and depending on what city or in he'll do say anything high fidelity or gross point blank and then

screen it and do a Q and A afterward. And some of the movie crushers have been to these and they said it's a lot of fun to go to but um, it's you know, I love John Cusack as an actor, but he's one of those that is has such a reputation outside of the industry as a jerk that like, yeah, it's hard for me to get past that now. Yeah, but he's been in some of my favorite movies and he's played some of my favorite characters.

You know. I mean, maybe maybe it's one of the things where he's able to kind of turned it on connect with the camera connect with an audience in that way, and then you know his if if that is true about his personality outside of of of movies, I mean, it's it's it's one of those things. It's it's the craft of an actor to create this feeling of friend friendliness or familiarity or someone that you feel like you

already know or that certainly you would want to know. Um, any of the stuff about him, not really, No, you know, I I do, UM, you know, I've I've followed his Twitter for a long time and he's he's very very act to von there. Yeah, super political, very liberal, you know,

outspoken politically and um. But but I mean, you know, my impression from from him online anyway is that he's at least in the online forum, he's very like accessible and down to earth, and you know, he's always replying to people and kind of like um, retweeting stuff, and I mean he seems very conversational. Some people approach social media as more of like a one sided kind of thing where they're just shooting stuff out and like banking on their celebrity for people to see it or whatever,

and not really having a conversation. But he seems to really engage with people, even if he has his his perspective that he's not really deviating from. Let's say, um, I don't know in online anyway, he doesn't. He doesn't come off that way to me. But I mean people come off differently online than they do in real life, So that's not a big surprise. Yeah. I mean it's up to you whether or not you want to go

down this rabbit hole. Um, but if you there are some stories out there that are so crazy you think like can this be true? Yeah? Yeah, Like I talked about this on the show with No before. Crazy stuff like uh, being in a luxury box at a cub's game and like throwing chicken wings at people that piste him off, and like just this just look up John

Cusack crazy behavior. Yeah. Yeah, there are a ton of them, and there's so many that you've got to think, like this has got to be grounded in some truth here where there's smoke, there's fire kind of unless like everyone just got together and decided they wanted to ruin John Kissak. Yeah, I mean there's there are those there are those people that they hear stories about that there they're super difficult to work with or you know, off camera they're they're

a nightmare and so on. Um, yeah, I don't know what to uh what to think, you know, yeah, you know it's it's um with with Cusack. I think, um, even even looking at some of these behind the scenes interviews and stuff, UM, there's there's a certain kind of UM, I don't know, Prick leanus to it. Um that that you can get. You can get just a sense of that. UM would would give me pause to like want to meet him and like, you know, hang out in person or something. I would Um, it would definitely be sort

of a be careful what you wish for sort of thing. Um, maybe maybe it's better to just stick with what what he's able to create on screen, you know, don't do it casey. Uh. Then you get to the end of the film, that great record release party scene is just pure joy. Everyone gets their moment um. You have Dick and Anna, you get this great moment with with Rob

deejaying like back in his element. He's produced this thing. Um. Jack Black gets to shine and he gets to showcase that great voice, and everyone's just like I'm like, you know, especially Rob is just like, oh my god, he can actually do this he actually has a two new talent, so it's really kind of a great way to end

the film. Um. And the last thing you see is the only selfless act in the entire film from him, is in the final sixty seconds when he is making that tape for Laura and he says, I'm making things that I think she would like and not just what I think would be cool to expose her too. And like his ultimate redemption comes in the last forty five seconds of this movie. It's interesting, Yeah, he's he's he's finally gotten out of that frame of like taste, um

and an opinion. Uh. It's funny what he what he says at the very beginning of the film, practically to to Jack Black, he's like, how can it be wrong to express an opinion? You know, when when he's saying, uh, well that guy's opinion is wrong or whatever, you know,

the guy had shitty taste. Um. It takes him that long to to really internalize that lesson and and just realize, like people can like what they like, you know, and and if you really are this like musical guru that you hold yourself up as you ought to be able to um recognize what somebody else is into and and and craft something that will really work for them as opposed to just trying to bend them to your own,

you know, idiosyncratic kind of taste. So again, it's it's it's him like expanding that circle of of awareness and and um, yeah, just be becoming like a real partner as opposed to this kind of like closed off, narcissistic, selfish guy. Yeah. What do you think? I guess guess the big question um here at the end is where where Robin Laura in five years? I mean, I think they're in it for the long haul. Personally, I guess

I'm kind of an optimist that way. But yeah, I feel like, um, I feel like things are gonna they're gonna work out for for them. I think, um, you know, she she kind of she kind of laughed at him when when he does the proposal. But I feel like, at the same time, like, um, that that is where they're headed. Um. I think I think the label could could, uh could kind of take off maybe, you know, Um he's just uh, he's sort of like um coming into his own a little bit. By the end of the film.

I think I think he's um, he's finally um, putting into the world stuff that was just bouncing around in his head for all those years, and um, you know, coupled with a with a new kind of self awareness that um, that's gonna make him, um, you know, a formidable kind of person in that in that world. All right, I can I can buy the optimism. Where where do you have a slightly more I don't know, down to earth pests still? I mean, there's there's two ways it goes.

You know, he's either uh, in his like let's say it's now, it's twenty years on. He's either in his late forties early fifties, owns that record shop that is hurting because of new media of course, single and sleeping with young girls that are not fulfilling him emotionally, uh, and only put out that one EP twenty years ago. Or he's mere read with Laura. He has a cool

little indie label. The record shop is being run by Barry and Dick that he still owns and they live in like a suburb of Chicago with a couple of cool and he realizes that it's not settling to do that. Yeah, that he's that he's he's yeah, exactly, he's come to realize that that's not, um somehow losing in the game of life. That is, that is what it looks like to mature and to become a grown up in a

relationship and have a family and all that. Um, yeah, I can I can totally see the more pessimistic version as well. And it's hard to say which which is the true which of the two would be the outcome here, because it really relies on information we don't quite have. Well, I think one is uh. I think the previous version is perhaps alcoholic and uh and headed towards lung cancer as well. Like the first version is not a happy

version of his life. The second one, Yeah, he quit smoking and he has children and like that's that's called growing up. That's what people should aspire to do. There is no nobility and being the cool single fifty year old who who's after a twenty two year old girl that comes into his record store. That's not cool. It's a sad thing. I mean, you know, going to shows

around Atlanta. Um, I don't go to shows as much anymore, but when I was like, you know, eighteen, high school in college, that kind of thing, Um, you would definitely see like the quote unquote the old guy at shows. You know that the Yeah, well, I mean yeah, maybe so, maybe so. But I mean I don't think you were. I don't think you were necessarily putting out the same

kind of the wrong kind of old guy energy. Let's say. No, I'd like to think of putting up great old guy energy, the the guy, the guy who who is is fifty going on twenty kind of thing. Um that that is an uncomfortable energy to to be around. You know, yeah, exactly exactly. You want to you want to go upward. You don't want to go backward. Um, you want to

you want to advance, not regrets. But yeah, I mean that that is that is a type that that I observed and and I guess probably made some kind of impression on me, Like, um, that's that's not where you want to be. Like this, Sadly, youth and and and and coolness and and and all that has something of an expiration date, even though I do think they are. There are certainly figures that I look to who have like advanced into their older age and have remained relevant

and cool and everything. Um, I don't know that Sadly, like the first name that came into my head just then was thirsted more. But I mean that didn't work out so great, um so. But I mean in terms of somebody that is like, you know, still like collecting like obscure tapes into like his whatever, his fifties and and and still being excited about new music and everything. Um, there are there are people who manage that trick and who don't just kind of become frozen in like what

was cool years ago. And that's that's the trap that I try to escape from. And it's not the easiest thing either because, um, whether it's whether it's a film or or an album or whatever. Um, if something is like twenty or thirty years old and I haven't heard of it, my interest is peaked like automatically. I'm like, oh, it came out like ninety one. That could be good, you know, Whereas something from I'm kind of like, I don't know what what is this? You know? Um, you

kind of I don't know. You You risk becoming fixed in place. Sometimes I think it's a natural, um characteristic of aging. But um, I don't know, something something to be navigated carefully, because you also don't want to be like I said, the old guy who's just trying to

hang on to being cool being young. Yeah, casey, I think in closing here, there is nothing cooler than getting to the age where, um, you're confident in what you like and what you love and what you don't like and who you love and you don't judge what other people love and like. And uh, that's a great place to end up at. And that's where I eventually ended up. It took me a while, but because I struggle with that stuff too, but that's where I feel like I

am now absolutely thing. Yeah, it's it's a it's a sign of maturity. Like we said, Um, there's there's more important stuff in the world than liking the right records or movies or as as much as that stuff is great, but um yeah, it really is more what you are like than what you like. Per se. Absolutely all right, man, good stuff. That was a good chat. Yeah, yeah, I enjoyed it. This was fun. This Uh, this felt like actually getting out of the house in the soul fashion.

But um yeah, I mean I've not had too many other extended conversations with people outside these four walls for quite some time, so this was great. Why do you think Adam and I talked about Magnolia for two hours. Well because it's a three hour movie. It's a fucking masterpiece. But other than that, this is fun. Man. We both need this and it was great scene in your face and talking to you as always my friend, and uh, let's get it together again for a couple of weeks

from now, because absolutely you know where I'll be. I'll be here as as well. I and I need it. I I definitely need these conversations. All right, good job, and thanks to everyone for listening, and uh, we will see you in your ear holes next week. Movie Crushes produced, edited, and engineered by Ramsey unt here in our home studio at Pont City Market, Atlanta, Georgia. For I Heart Radio.

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