MisSex

Misspelling with Tori spelling an iHeartRadio podcast.

Okay, so, as everyone knows, I just recently ended my eighteen year marriage, so knew me. It's my second chapter. So I thought it'd be fun to have someone who's renowned in this field, the intimacy expert herself, doctor Viviana Cole's on today to tell me. Will I ever find intimacy again? Does that mean I have to have a relationship? Do I have to get married again? Do I have to find love? Can I just be me? I just want to find me? Hi, doctor V.

Hi, Tori, how are you doing. It's so good to meet you.

It's so nice to meet you. Oh my gosh, you are beautiful.

You know it's the lighting.

I know, it's just the ring light.

Well, thanksving on. I'm really excited to be a guest.

Thank you well for this session, doctor v I'm your patient. Tea.

Oh I love that great. Okay, I'm putting the hat on. That's good, all right, perfect.

So I just recently ended an eighteen year marriage together almost twenty years, which is a huge chunk the big party of life, like a huge part of my life. Like it's hard for me to even remember anything before that? Is that normal?

Yeah, well, I'm going to be celebrating seventeen years married, so I kind of I kind of understand what you mean.

I think it's you.

Grow so much as a human and as an individual, but then you also are kind of melding with that other person, So it's hard to imagine life before then. And again that's just kind of the way that our memories were.

But especially when you.

Have such a full life, it's hard to even like extract that person from those memories.

It's true, doctor Vee. You have two kids with.

Two kids fifteen and twelve.

Yeah, wow, and a boy and a girl who's older.

The girl thankfully and I because she has helped our younger son be like really calm compared to other boys.

That's interesting. I have five kids, and two of mine, the fifteen year old girl and the eleven he's about to turn twelve year old boy, are super close. Now, like that came out of nowhere, and she gives him advice. I get all my advice from my fifteen year old.

What have things been like?

Well, how long has it been since you're like officially called equits between the two of you?

Good question, almost a year okay past June.

Okay, an anniversary, and I'm sure that that brings up, you know, a lot of feelings for you, you know, anytime.

The anniversary really no.

No, really, no feelings.

The feelings came up when it was our own anniversary, which was just recently in May.

Okay, so not in June. Sorry, but I thought you were saying that it's busy.

Was like our were separating the official okay, and how are you dealing with those feelings?

What are you doing with all of that?

It's it's freeing, May I be honest. I'm just kidding.

I love that.

I know no other way. I feel like it was over a long time ago. I didn't know how to get out of it. I feel like he felt the same way. It was codependent. We stayed for me personally. I can't on his behalf. I stayed predominantly for the kids and well he fixed you know, the light bulbs and the screws and things around the house. So just kidding, not really.

Well, so everyone knows I'm not your therapist in real life. So there's a lot that I don't know. And so if I ask certain questions and people are going to be like, how does she not know that? It's because I'm not really her therapist. But for today's episode, I love that you're kind of bringing us in because all of this is so real.

And what you said just now that.

Things were over before for me, it was it was over a way before for him, And you know, I stayed for the kids. And I'm sure that there were parts of whatever was going on that you.

Thought, can this be remedied? Can we work through this? Is it possible?

And then inevitably it sounds like you got to a place where you said life is going to be better for everyone involved if we're not in a romantic relationship together.

Is that right?

I got to a point a couple times in the relationship later on where I thought like, maybe it's better to just stay and maybe my next lifetime I'll yeah find true love or happiness.

Yeah, like taking a back seat just because that might be that could be what's best for the family, or to not rock the book.

Yeah, I can put my needs in the backseat, no problem, right.

And I was like, maybe this lifetime I was just meant to be a mom and a workhorse, and that's what's given to me. And if that's it. Then I am going to do the noble thing and just stay.

There are so many people out there feeling that right now. So how did you make that change and that switch to like, no, I need to be the main character in my own life. I need in order for me to be a better mom. I need to be there for myself.

I mean you're an author as well, so you under stand. I mean you have a degree. But in my own brain, I have written memoirs and in one of them, I was like, write your own happy ending, and I'm like, I can give the best advice to people, But why am I not taking it? Like I'm supposed to be the main character? Like I always joke in the horror film, I'd be the main character. Well, what about your own fucking life? Bitch? Sorry? Sorry? Can I curse in front of you? Doctor?

Yes, you may, I'm my my churs. Doctor, you can go.

I'm learning to say not sorry, not sorry.

Okay. So, yeah, you decided to write your own story and I didn't. Actually you didn't. Okay. Wait, so we're all over the place, so you knew.

Welcome to my life.

You were telling everyone, Hey, you need to make the best out of this life.

Yeah, then you can rewrite it.

I couldn't do that or you what happened was the choice made for you.

It well, you know when someone like cracks a window and then you just smash through the whole fucking glass. So that's what happened to me. And my soon to be ex husband is sober now and we're super proud of him, and he's put a lot of hard work into it. Almost a year. But it was and he's talked about this so I can talk about it. It was that one last final like blowout, like drunken blowout, screaming, ranting, and he said, I want a divorce. I'd heard that

Wow okay, So you almost saw that as an opportunity, correct, and it was something that he did so he couldn't technically like use it against you. No, Wow okay. And that's been almost a year.

You said, Yeah, is that weak of me that that's the only way I could try to find my happiness?

I think it shows a lot of strength that you kept trying for as long as you did because of all of the different external pressures and of course the internal pressures as a mom. You know, for some people they can they can keep trying forever. But it doesn't sound like you were getting anything or enough of anything to really say things could be better. So you know what, there's there's no judgment, there's no like right way to do this. It sounds like you're in a better place now.

Is maybe how's your pa? Sure?

No, definitely. You know it's hard and there's ups and downs, and there's five kids involved and we're trying to navigate it as best we can and co parent. My husband, my husband, my soon to be ex husband has a living girlfriend, so he went right into another relationship.

Are you surprised. Now.

I do wish for him though, because I love him and care about him very much. He he got married I'm his second wife when he was twenty six years old, and he went from that relationship to me and now to his current girlfriend. So I mean miscellaneous stuff in between, but relationship, and I feel for him that I'm like, gosh, I wish he would just take time. And I hate this because and tells me take time for yourself. I

I think there are a lot of like serial monogamous, serial relationship.

REI well, yeah, I think there's a lot of people who just kind of fit into that.

I think I am. Yeah, I've never dated. I always go from one relationship to another.

Well, dating stinks, so I mean the worst. I feel so badly for people who would love to be in a relationship, but the way in the platforms that are out there to meet people make it so unattractive, and then with people just.

Being lying and they're betraying, and there's so many stories of hardship out there. Like I don't blame people for just kind of taking a step back often and saying Okay, I'm just going to be single for a while. But it's not usually because they want to be it's because they kind of don't have anything to really help them to do that. I actually started like doing some very small boutique matchmaking for people, and so I hear a lot of.

Awful stories from the people who are coming to work with me. And it's true, dating stinks, and you know, but being in a bad marriage is a million times worse.

Yeah, but I'm fifty one, Like.

Are you do you feel fifty one?

Nope? Yeah, not at all.

So you haven't started dating yet or have you?

I'm going to plead the fifth on that.

Wow, Okay, Well, what I would suggest for someone, just based off of little that you've told me, I feel like what I would suggest is that you're very open about what you want your life to look like and what it actually does look like with any potential dates or partners, just because you don't want them to be googling you and seeing one version of you which is out there, and then they meet you and they're trying to get to know you and it doesn't align.

I would love for them for you to give them kind of a template of like, hey, this is what my life typically looks like, this is what I do on a regular basis, this is what I'm into, versus them doing what everybody does. And it's like you get somebody's name and you oh, okay, and they were married to this person did it and they put this whole puzzle piece together. And who you are now versus who you were when you were.

Single before you're soon to be ex are very different people.

Ish. I feel like if you were a potential suitor, there's part of me that's really old fashioned, part of me that's like super like uber modern. So a potential suitor if they googled me or listen to me or listen to my podcast like they would, I feel like pretty much you get what you get. I spent so many years like trying to be a certain like cookie cutter mold and trying to be someone that everyone liked. I want it to be liked so badly, But the reality is I feel like people like me, the real me.

I think we we call it red flags because it's kind of like the whole swimming thing.

I hear you shouldn't be out there, like run away, run away.

Stay away, but like where.

Like if you're out in the ocean with the sharks.

I don't do that. I lay on the chaise lounge and have them bring me drinks.

And you're very good to do that. But I think a lot of people the reason that they go for that is because they can confuse it based off of whatever they saw at home or their early experiences with dating. They can confuse passion for red flags or red flags for passion. A lot of times people will grow up thinking jealousy is.

A sign that you really love someone, or if they're possessive and they don't want to share you with anyone else, it's because they just want you offer themselves and they just care about you so much.

It's so messed up in the real world.

Like being able to have independence and freedom allows for growth and allow us for that ability to be introspective and learn who you are as an individual, and that only enhances for the long term. Right, Like, if you want to be in a short May December romance that you wanted to just be y'all hold up in a hotel.

Room, no problem, Yeah, go for it.

But if you want something more long, you need to be able to breathe, You need to be able to grow, you need to be able to outgrow yourself sometimes.

So yeah, don't go for the red flags. And if you spot them, be curious about them and ask all of the questions.

Well, one, what if I'm the red flag? Two? Could we redefine what we know is a red flag? Why can't there be a green flag? I love green?

Well, green flags are good. Yeah, right, you can go go. Okay, Well, Tori, wait a minute, why do you say maybe you're the red flag?

M ooh, I don't know. Well you said that there's a lot of baggage that comes with me.

Okay, name three things that you would consider baggage.

Can they have heartbeats and be breathing? Of course, all my animals, I mean, they're like designer baggage, and they're beautiful and they're special and I love them and just a really messy, chaotic life. No main red flag. This is what always gets me in trouble. Like people, it's a lot to sign up for being with me, Like when we go out people recognize me. It's like it's I have to I can't act. I can't be free and live my life always the way I want to

And what's happening?

What's what's the worst that can happen if you try to not control those situations?

Ay, Google worst picture of Tory spelling, Like they want to post the nastiest photos. So I'm like, but it's out that's.

Just assume that those pictures are out there. Your top five worst pictures are like actively out there.

Don't google them people, but they're out there, So what could be what could really be? I mean, if that, for you is what you're concerned about, and the other the alternative is that you are looking at the view, or you're looking at your at your you know, your date space, or you're actually having a conversation over something. It seems like that could outweigh. I mean, the pros could outweigh the cons when it comes to that. But but you mentioned that was baggage, so I get it.

Like they would mark me heavy when it went through, like at the airport, heavy baggage.

Heavy baggage. So that's the other piece.

Everybody has some level of baggage, some weight of baggage. What are you doing to work through it? Because that's the only other thing that we can ask besides not having baggage, and who doesn't at fifty one? Right, But then on top of that, what are you doing to work through it?

Well, I mean it is what it is. People can google, they know what they know. I'm fifty one. I could cut down the animals. That was a way of self soothing through the marriage was taking on more chaos.

Like you want to love something, you want to save something.

Oh my gosh, doctor V. That's my biggest problem in life is I want to save them? Well I can't.

When you're dealing with grown adult men who don't want saving, then they're just going to see that as a liability.

They're not going to see that as a.

Strength, and unfortunately for them, they're missing out on someone.

That has ability like tax evasion or like a liability, my ability.

Like something they want to avoid. But you know, it's part of your makeup to want to be a nurture and to want to save again. That might be something to work on, is letting go of you don't need to save everyone. Maybe the person that needs saving right now at this time of life is you and the people around you who love you want you to give yourself that attention and to hold yourself and to be there for yourself because they want to see you happy ultimately and to thrive beyond all of this.

Okay, can we move on to intimacy.

Let's do it, but not the intimacy view, but let's talk about it.

I'm like cool, let's skirt around it. Can you tell me the difference between Actually, we've talked about love, we've talked about passion. Where does infatuation stand with all this? So there's something called new really relationship energy and honeymoon period.

That honeymoon period, but even more like short term than that, is this thing where every part of your body and all of the chemicals and all that are just going towards your partnership, especially sexually, and that does tend to go away. Passion tends to dive in brain that just doesn't experience it to that same extent, And a lot of people really struggle with that transition, so they'll either break up at that point or they'll go into something that is like really dissatisfying.

But infatuation, I think what it does is it helps you.

To focus in a world where it's really hard to focus on one person. It's really hard to give one person a lot of attention. It's almost like a little bit of like imprinting, right, Like when you first get your newest member of the family and four legged one and you're just like, oh my gosh, and we need you know.

All the focuses are what are little rovers needs? Right? Did they have this did they have? How are they doing with the other dogs? And they like stand out.

There like they've got that magnifying glass and they've got the spotlight on them. That doesn't always last, right, And not that you stop caring, but you stop caring to that degree. So I'm a big fan of just accepting that new relationship energy is there as a gift to give you kind of blinders to that one person. But I'm not a fan of what most happens to most people, which is that as that new relationship energy starts to fade away, they don't get ready for the next phase.

Do you feel like then it would be better to connect with someone emotionally mentally and the bonus is that you're physically attracted to them, because that part might fade away, but the other won't.

So I wish that it was as easy as saying, connect with somebody emotionally, the physical will come.

That's not usually the case.

We have to be working on both of them in tandem and know that you're probably going to end up being with somebody who feels the opposite of you. Most people have one personic relationship where they need the emotions to be there in order to want the physical, and then they're with someone who needs the physical in order for the emotions to show up. So just know that that's probably the case and accept it, and I just know that to be fact, and you'll be in a much better place.

That's like opposite attract.

I don't know that it's opposites attract.

It's more like neat opposite needs attract.

Opposite needs tend to attract. Yeah, opposite needs to tend to attract.

But the problem is it can feel very almost like a lot of people feel very judgmental, or they feel sour towards the other person if.

They think differently. You know, I don't know if you've ever experienced us with friends or even with partners, where somebody who seems to always want the physical, we tend to like we tend to kind of knock them aside or knock them down by telling them like, oh that you're so juvenile, like you know, gosh, you're all about sex, Like what's really important is what's happening between us on the inside. But to them, that is not the truth to them.

Their truth is I need the physical and it gives me, It makes me bond it to you, it makes me you know. It's like the four intimacy styles my book, bonding, release, giving, and responsive.

Those bonding people sorry through it again, bonding.

Bonding, release, being and responsive. And people who are bonding, what they need from a relationship, from an intimate relationship is they need to experience physical interaction in order to feel the bonding that comes from it. And so for them, not having sex or having sex very rarely means they feel disconnected emotionally from their partner, so it's super important to them. And then with release, people who are predominantly released will feel like, oh my gosh, I need sex

I want like it's how I can get through tough times in my life. And then to attribute it to their partner, it's like, oh, thank you for giving me that.

Now giving they need that, They need.

To be able to give pleasure and have their partner associate them with that pleasure. It's almost like a badge of honor. It feels, oh, I can just do this for.

You all day. They feel so at ease and at home with giving pleasure now responsives, they tend to be the ones that are least least liked, but they're probably the most out there responsive. They tend to not think about sex on a regular basis. It's usually just in response to their partner saying they'd like it. They enjoy it, they're up for it.

While they're having it, they're having a good time, and they're probably thinking, gosh, we should do that more often. But as soon as the sexual experience is over, they kind of reset to not thinking about sex. And so a lot of them can be misconstrued as not having desire and having low desire, but that's not true.

They just don't have at present all the time. And yeah, it's great. You can take the quiz online.

It's four intimacy styles quidz dot com and it'll tell you what percentage of each And my hope is that to round out your intimacy style, you experience about twenty five percent of each as often as possible.

Ooh amazing, I can't wait to take it. One last question and maybe this isn't the case. I feel like in life life Females are conditioned to think if a man responds to them sexually, and it should be like, WHI isn't he want to make out with me? Why isn't you want to kiss me? Why does he want to have sex with me all the time? Or it. We're conditioned to feel like, oh, he doesn't want me. I'm not desirable, He's not attracted to me. Why is that tory?

That is exactly what I'm teaching a masterclass on on June tenth at twelve thirty.

It's online spree. You've got to check it out.

A lot of people think that that is only something that women experience, that if their partners aren't showing interest in them, it's like, what's wrong with my partner? A lot of men they need that in long term relationships. If they're in a a monogamous relationship, they also need that attention from their partners. But like you said, women aren't socialized to give that. We're socialized to receive it. We're socialized to pursue it.

And you're right, a lot of people take it very personally when their partners aren't showing that they're sexually interested. I call that pillow talk. Outside of the bedroom.

I want everyone to be showing their partner that they're sexually interested in them. Of course, it has to be appropriate for the setting, but it needs to happen or else it can feel like you're an on and off switch when it comes to sex.

Or I can feel like your partners, you know, come ons are coming out of nowhere.

Or I can feel like you're going from cold to hot and that's just not sexy me.

Is that weird that I'd prefer to be connected mentally and stimulated that way as opposed to not prefer but like that would be my ideal rather than physically. Like I feel like that's great, we should connect my partner and I physically, But that's not my top priority, never was, except I always grew up thinking, you know, female is sexy. Men are supposed to you know, we're supposed to be like giggly and gurly and like show off for assets and they want to yes, So it's.

Not weird at all.

It's actually you know, like I said, there are just as many people who feel the way that you do as there are that need the physical to get there.

But what's more important.

I think having been seeing clients for the best twenty years plus is to know and to be aware of the fact that if you're not showing your partner that you're sexually interested in, then then something's missing and it can't just happen through sex. You cannot just show someone that you think they're sexually interested or interesting through sex. Like that's just not going to be for a long term committed relationship. It's just not going to work out well.

And I'm like, I got you.

Do you believe truly that monogamy is natural?

I do not. I do not.

I think it's incredibly difficult and if and I feel like in our world it just gets more and more challenging. And that's why I think it's so important to honor different ways that people experience love and connection and all of that, but we're still typically in an area of the world that believes in monogamy as being, you know,

If you're going to stay together.

Can the pillows be satin? Because I don't want to increase this in my face in the hair definitely frizzes it out.

Yeah.

I feel like in I don't know, twenty years, thirty years, like monogamy is going to be an archaic word that we're like, oh, yeah, I think that's something cute. I've dated.

But a lot of people, and I see them in my office a lot too, they don't know how to have those conversations. And I would suggest that you do it with a professional and that you ask because you don't know what you don't know, and it can be very hurtful if you don't kind of do it the right way versus just being like, let's try it.

It's like with anal sex you can't just try anal sex. You have to prepare your body in order for it to go.

Well, you have to go. And you just opened up a whole can of worms. Because I could talk about that all day. So everyone, check out doctor V's Masterclass June.

Tenth at twelve thirty Central and you can sign up for free. It's a live online class.

I'll be there at pillow talkmasterclass dot com.

You are amazing. I could talk to you all day, uh so, and one day can we have that that anal conversation?

Absolutely, Tori, we can have that anal conversation whenever you want.

H