¶ Parenting Through Generations
And it is official the season on Mindfully With Tumishe is going to be about parenting through generations , and I'm so glad that I'm starting this off with a baby boomer and my mother-in-law . So I invite you to listen to this episode with an open mind and give grace , because for sure there will be some concepts that you would not agree with .
We are trying to learn and to make better , as make ourselves better than our ancestors and upgrade of our ancestors . So please give grace as you listen . But before I let you into the conversation , I want to send a quick shout out to the host of young love , keziah vilawa . Thank you , girl .
That was good looking out , and so I present to you mrs christiana olubukola kuku , a baby boomer , talking to us about parenting through generations . Remember , you can send a text . Just check the link in the description or just interact with us on the Mindfully With Tumishe Instagram page . Enjoy Instagram page . Enjoy .
All right , welcome to Mindfully With Tunji , the podcast and today .
Okay , so last episode , ola and I were talking about parenting and we were trying to see if the season was going to be on time , and I did say that I would love to have someone special in the studio , especially someone from a generation that is not ours , and I do have a baby boomer in the studio .
Yes , I promised that I was going to have a conversation with my mother-in-law and I'm proud to say actually happy to say that she's on the other side of the mic this evening . Good evening , yes , we're recording in the evening because I have to travel to have this done . Good evening , mama .
Good evening .
How are you today ?
I'm fine .
Alright , so my mama is here and today we're going to be talking to her . Good evening , mama , good evening Okay . I'm the web form fashion beginner , so my life is a very calm moment and it's been such an honor to know you for over 20 years . Thank you for being such a great mother .
Thank you .
All right . So let's start this conversation with the biggest question that I think you and I have even talked about off the microphone , and that is what are the differences that you are seeing with parenting these days ? You're a grandma now you're seeing your children parent . You're seeing other people parent . What are the differences ?
that you've noticed , thank you . The difference with our own generation and the present one now is very , very wide , and the difference is very clear because during our own time , when we were training our children , they have that fear , although we , I cannot say it was a mistake by not drawing them closer to us then , because the fear is always there .
How will I say this to mommy ? How will I talk to daddy about this ? They have that fear , but prayerfully , if I want to use myself as an example , I make sure that I talk to my children and when they do something wrong they know what mommy will do because they initially call me .
Let's talk about this fear , mommy , for a moment , let's talk about this fear . Why did you think , why did you generation think , that fear was , you know , a good tool to raise a child's mind ?
It wasn't a good thing because we did not know then . Until now , when we look back and we say , oh , made a mistake yeah because there are a lot of things that the children will have , let us know about them and then we will have been able to guide them and train them and draw them closer to ross .
But because of the fear , the children yeah they were not open to rose , but I thank god now , now , now there are lots of different .
So let's again , let's go back . So , was it because you were also raised with fear ? Could that be the reason that you think your children feared you when you were a husband ?
Exactly . We were not exposed during our own time , it was just close mommy daddy , mommy daddy , mommy daddy .
And when you see your dad , when you see your dad , you know the lion is around . Oh yes .
So because to sit in the sitting room with your parents you dare not ? Do that during our own time during .
okay , so the experience for me is different since knowing you , because when I met you , it was in . I was in part three and booboo was in part four , five at a time . Well , I was in part it , you know , and it didn't look like there was . Yeah , that's the truth . It didn't look like I was . For me it was like oh , this home ? Because it didn't .
It was so different for me that a mother , a person from my mother's or my father's generation can actually accept that their child brings home a girlfriend and he could actually say that this is my girlfriend . So what happened ? Where did he find that courage to do different ?
Because during that time we were exposed . The education is there , moving around reading a lot of books , which our parents does not even have the advantage of doing . That , and that one really helps us to draw our children closer to us , to show love , to understand them better .
Because if you don't allow your children to know more about you , you will find it difficult to draw them closer and they will not be able to talk . If you show them love , not say that you will not correct them or you will not put them right , but you really have to show more of love to them so that it will help them .
That when the love is there , the closeness is there , the children , they , will see you as their partner .
Oh , wow .
As their partner , you know a partner . You can share things together , you can share ideas together . They will not be afraid and they will ask questions which you will give them the right answer and put them right .
Wow , all right guys . Did you hear that you know work with the children and they are partners ? Okay , so you have three boys first . Oh sure , sure . You have three boys first .
Three boys .
And okay , of course , the first is my husband , bumi . Everybody knows that and he's quite calm and I know that both of you are very , very , very close , oh sure . Yeah , you know , I know both of you are very , very close . But you know , sometimes , bumi , sometimes women are talking and I'm asking were you ever beating ?
And he's telling me that you used to beat him . I'm like I can't , I cannot relate with that . Did you ever beat the boys ?
I do , I do and I don't just beat them . Anyhow , I make sure that when they are in their bedroom , once I open the door , they will know that something is going to happen and whoever that needs to behave , I will just go straight to the person on the bed because I make sure , since they are boys , they are in the same room together .
So I will talk in the evening . Yes , in the morning you did this , you did that , and this is a punishment that I'm going to give you . I will punish by beating and then talk to her later . Then she will say mommy , I'm sorry and I know they will not repeat .
Wow , okay , bumi is different from the two . Bumi is different from the two . Bumi is different from the two . Let's leave Bumi , let's leave Bumi . But it gives me an idea . It gives me some understanding Into how Bumi is Parenting , because I don't come from a home when we talk . We don't come from a home where we talk , you know we don't talk .
You know you're committing offence . There's never an explanation , you know . So it used to frustrate me , mommy . It used to frustrate me when we have a disagreement or the children did something and then Bumi saying no , let's talk , talk . You know . But of course that has changed and I am grateful to you for that . Now you have a daughter , just one .
Oh yeah , you have my absolutely beautiful , our sister-in-law , and and I knew and I know that you have three boys for the longest time , for more than eight years , yeah , how did that change the dynamics in your parenting style ?
Yeah , thank you . I have to study . I've seen some of my friends . Some of them they have girls , girls . I've learned a little bit about them because you know , you tell you you are having a gift she's going to be a tomboy . Actually , I really appreciate what Bony does .
Really .
Yes , because of the way that I treated Bony . Bony drew the daughter closer to him and my daughter , in fact , really enjoyed it compared to the others other two , because they just see her . This is a girl . Mummy will love her more than them . But Bumi does not even look at that . Bumi sees himself as the firstborn that he has to take care of .
Ah , and up till now they are still very close . What my daughter cannot tell me , we it with the born me , the brother .
¶ Navigating Social Norms and Family Values
Okay , so let's go to social norms then , because the truth is , the way I got into this family , it is not normal in other homes . I'm telling you guys that .
I'm telling you guys for free , right , um , like I said earlier , um , it was easy for my boyfriend that now my husband to come introduce um me to you , and I remember that , the first fresh friendship ring , that when we got me , you got that ring and you know you have to get that ring .
Okay , now , how did you manage the fact that social norms you know we are your reverse and and how did that not clash with the things that obviously you decided that you were going to do in Japan ?
Thank you . You know I'm from a Christian background . Okay , I learned this how to show love from my parents . Wow , because my parents . They showed love to their daughter-in-law and some of them I thought they were my sisters Until much , much later . The way they strike their hand of love to me , I thought they were my sister .
Then my mom even pulled them together to her yes to her . They discussed they would talk more than the husband then and that was then and that was what I learned .
For everyone listening . My mother realized the last one .
Oh yes , my mother realized the last one .
So she saw everything and all that . So let's talk about . You know when culture crashes , when culture and personal values clashes . How did you navigate that ?
Let me talk from my experience . Yes , please , because when I got married , all my in-laws they would be saying you know , uncle , auntie , but in my own family then no auntie no brother , no sister . Yes , so they will just even say you don't have to call them by name . But then they call me .
Being the last born , they took me as their own sister and they call me by name and that's what I carry . I didn't even know that . Then you got married , Married yes , transfer it , it works with some . But some took it seriously with me and they have to call my husband now that tell ah , you don't do this in in our house .
Even his own late brother used to call brother , I used to call him uncle and the wife . I'm the wife . Now we say oh man , how did that , how was that for you ? I felt so bad because the way we were doing , the way I was brought up was different .
Okay , so let me flip that for you . Mommy , I remember that , you know , of course . I come from , where your husband's family , my father-in-law's family , comes from . Everybody is auntie , everybody is uncle you know , and I remember the first day .
I can never forget the first day that I stepped into this house and I was going to greet Femi , that's Bumi's little German brother and I said Kasa , you did not allow it to end . You did not allow it to end , you know . And you said who is the oldest here ? In my head ? I was like , okay , and I go home .
And I told my mom and I was like , wait , you know you go , and we laughed about , but it was . It was also a culture shock for me and I must say that it was even though I knew that I didn't like it . But I didn't see any family , any of my family that you know allowed for that camaraderie to happen within their family .
So let's move on to you being a mother-in-law . That's once . You've been a mother-in-law , uh .
I remember you saying to me once , uh , that you chose , that you told yourself though you said a little bit of it at the beginning of this conversation , but I remember that practically that you said that you chose and told yourself that your daughter-in-law and your son-in-law will be your children . What made you make that decision ?
Because that's what my parents did during their own time . And that's what I see at home . Even my brother's wife . I call them auntie , even by the time they have their first child . I still say auntie to most of them , and they are sitting as their own sister too , and that's what I brought into my family into the Kukun family and it's a large family .
It's a large family and you and I , you're also from a large family , I'm from a small family . But my biggest Okay , you're also from a large family , I'm from a small family , you're also from a large family , you're you know .
But you know , my biggest question now is when I had the re-ferrula , did you know for sure that I was going through personal depression , or you just knew something was wrong and you let it protect me ? What happened ? I've been meaning to ask this question for the last 16 years , so I'm asking what happened ? Did you ?
go for shock . Thank you , and we thank God for everything during that time . I knew that there was something going on .
I'm not anything that happens . So for me to say that shouldn't happen . Gubi came into where we're recording this .
I knew there was something going on . Prayerfully I was praying to God and I said , does she want me to come , or does she or not ? But I was just praying . So in the night then I heard that revelation that she's a nice girl . But this has a problem . You just have to put data . Take her as your first daughter .
Yes .
And that's what brought your mom and myself together . Yes , at least .
Don't go crying now . Don't cry now , please don't .
To be praying . I just remember mommy now and we were praying and if you could remember , you know mommy will come in the morning . Yes , and if you could remember , you know mommy will come in the morning , when I was there , and she will not leave until evening time .
We'll discuss , we'll pray together and I know , and when she's not around , if any visitor comes , I will not allow them to disturb you .
Oh yeah , I know that . I know that . I remember that clearly . I will not allow them to disturb you . Oh yeah , I know that , I know that word . I remember that clearly .
I will not allow them to disturb you , and I said you need to rest . Once God has spoken to me , this dream was someday over . This change is not going to be the last . You were not born . Who are these ? And that has been my .
Thank you very much . Do you have any regrets as a parent ?
I don't . I don't . There is always challenges in life . Things cannot be going on smoothly . If you are a Christian , there will be ups and downs , but once you hold on to your faith and you know how to pray , it will not last .
Mama CAC . It will not last so let's talk about with the boys , because they're going to be , because you have she has four boys and a girl , right , so with the boys , or what ? Is there any memorable ?
Do you have any memorable memory with the boys , experience that you want to share , maybe just one or two with the boys or with something else totally beautiful , that makes you enjoy motherhood ?
yeah , there are a lot for me has been my prayer partner , very close to me , very close to me . I could remember that , hey , I wish this boy would have been a girl . Oh Then , because the way she took care of me and I've been praying for him .
Oh my , but my strength is going higher .
Oh my , and I've been praying for him Ever since that she will get a good wife , and which I'm thanking God for now .
They say I have a good wife .
Which I'm thanking God . Nobody is 100% perfect , which I'm thanking God . Nobody is 100% perfect . But when you score 98 , points .
it's still a good match and I take it
¶ Parenting Advice and Family Dynamics
. I take it Okay . So when raising your sons , are there things you wish you had told them ? You want to share those things you wish you had told them as a kid .
You know I'm not regretting it now , but I thank God that True Prayer God is working . What I would have even informed them after I talked about it earlier , that having a wife , this is the way you should treat your wife . This is the way you should do even to your in-laws your other in-laws .
But that thing I just felt that they must have seen it from me . They must have seen this from me , what I did not even talk .
Yeah , we didn't have that conversation , yeah , so I just believe that maybe they have seen the home because my home was a perfect home then that people were even using us as an example , including my children , and I made sure that my children , I know all their friends , just to know how they behave .
But one thing that I did not even tell them when they were growing up , getting to the stage of getting married , I mean the two ID , I just believe . I yes , you would mean if they will follow after , but I will have him talk more or cancel them more day .
So let's talk about it . Is there anything you wish you had spoken with her , any conversation you wish you had with her ?
Yes , I do the little time . You know , if not for the crisis we had , then I would have even talked to her more . But seeing those things , even our family friends , they would just say , eh , if she must not see more about this , they would invite her to their home to come and spend a few days with them .
So during that time I don't want her to be bitter .
So you were not protecting her because of what eventually happened .
Yes , exactly . But when he gets to the university I made sure that I was trying to draw . I tried to draw her more closer . It would have been better for me to do that at the early stage , when he was already in the university , because he had seen some people . He even mentioned it in one day that he went to that weekend with the holiday list .
Because they were christian , their dad was a pastor . They would ask that to come for weekend the children they are girls access to come for weekend . The children , their girls , come for weekend in the in their house and or any other weekend . They will have the girls to come to our own house too .
But I just felt we learn and see more of their parents More .
Yes . So if you're wondering what she's talking about , the crisis , I think so . You're Nigerian . You understand when a monogamous home turns to a polygamous home and , like she said , it was sort of perfect home .
I heard when I came to ITER , I heard so much about this family , like , yes , that she said there was the cuckoos were the only rules of um at the time . So that's what she's referring to and that is that season . You know that she felt that she lost some sort of connection with her daughter .
Okay , so of course , this is different than your experience , okay , as a parent and the way you live with the children . It's different than most people your age . If you were going to speak , if you had a chance now to speak to people your age who you know for sure didn't do right by their children and they are still alive , what would you say to them ?
Thank you what I would do , because I have both experience from my parents and from my own family too . I would be able to guide them , to tell them the right thing to do and how to go about it .
It because , during my crisis , I had another revelation that God said what you are passing through , god wants to make you to be a counselor , and which I'm still doing up till now .
Both young and old , I do counsel them how to manage their home , how to treat their children and how to draw them closer to them and then be open to their children and to the glory of God . They are listening . Even some . When I said let me use my experience , they said , hey , mommy , they are listening . Even some .
When I said let me use my experience , they say , hey , mommy , and the way you are looking and you have passed through all these stages , and I say , yes , but I have got that guy .
Alright , so what ? I have two more questions . I think , what do you think Is the place ? Because I know you guys Talk a lot in this house , you guys have a lot of conversations in this house , alright , so what do you think Is the place of Conversations With your children ? Is it necessary , is it important ?
Oh yeah , it's not in the sitting room , it's not in the dining . Invite them to your bedroom , leave them free . If they can sit down on the bed edge with you , fine , and if you have a stretcher , let them sit down and then face them . Not one will be at the back , one will be at the right .
No , no , yeah , sit down and talk , and I think that's , that's all , I don't know .
okay , it is Okay . So one more question If you had to do it again , will you beat your children ?
I will beat in love . What's that ?
What's beating in love ? In love because what is beating in love , mommy , because you don't have to stay there . Yeah , what explain to me how you beat in love . How would I be somebody in love ?
after beating . Then after a while , maybe in the morning or if you don't have time that night you pull the child to your side . I'm not a wicked mother . I'm trying to train you to guide you . What you did was wrong . This is how you should do it . This is how you should do it . This is how you should do it next time . Don't do it .
But you don't allow us to touch your grandchildren . What I have that pressure on my elbows . So if , yeah , yeah , you say we shouldn't beat the grandchildren , but you say now that you beat your children in love , how does you love your grandchildren ? We love our children .
But you beat them , madam , I don't beat them , I don't beat them .
I beat them . I beat Mujola Oluwa last year , mujola Oluwa .
She come to me crying and I just throw that money at him .
No , it's a conversation with her . I've not beaten Jola Oluwa since .
Because I'll call him . Don't worry , always listen to your mommy . Whatever your mommy says , yes , yes To the best , to the best , and he will just wipe his face and then that's all . But not beating . Boom , boom , boom , boom . After 10 minutes , boom , boom , boom , boom . It's not the best . It's not the best once in a while .
Once in a while , they should be beating .
Yes , you're correct , but it depends on the age . As soon as they are 10 , there's no need in beating . Talk to them more , pray with them more , and that's what I believe we should do so you hear Papa Fede , boma Don't , and that's what I believe we should do .
So you heard don't . Bitch . Bitch in love , he should say , but once they're 10 , you should talk with them more . So if someone is listening now and I'm going to tap into your counselling if somebody is listening now and of course , from how we've had the conversation , people will know that we have an I'm going to tap into your counselling .
Somebody's listening now and of course , from how we've had the conversation , people will know that we had an absolutely wonderful relationship . But somebody's listening now and they're not in good terms with their mother-in-law . That is projecting on their children and their family . What would you be saying to them ?
Yeah , thank you . Background is different . Anybody that has problems with her mother-in-law now you just have to look at the health , pray for a change and the change doesn't come . The change will come when you keep on praying and you don't have to argue with your mother-in-law . Don't argue , your mother-in-law don't argue .
Take her as your mom , maybe when there is any disagreement after a while you can go to her mommy .
I'm sorry , this is how I feel this thing should be . Mommy , I think you'll be Mommy . I think you think everybody's like you . I'm just saying I'm just saying I think you think everybody's like you . What is the approachable ?
You will make her .
I will make her approachable .
How ? By showing love , by talking more , see right .
So you see , guys , I now belong to a family where they talk Like can you see , Everybody has to talk . You have to talk , all right . So , before we go and thank you so much for staying late to have this conversation with me of course there are cultural values and the personal values that I said earlier .
What would you be saying to people my age who are raising children and are having difficulty balancing what life looks like now ? And you know , you just said now , yeah , I can beat in love , you don't know when to not beat in love , and all that .
So what would you be saying and that's what you have said to me , because I know that you still say something but what would you say to people who are raising children , who are just having children , who are ? What would you say to them ?
yeah , thank you . When your children have been growing , like what you said , if your husband said this boy or girl did something wrong , you just have to join in and talk , talk with the child , and because children , they are very clever .
Once they know that if daddy says something , mommy will say differently , they will try , they will always pull themselves to your side and there will not be cooperation between the older .
So , in other words , there should be family values and , no matter what , father and mother should keep the family values . So this is one question I want to ask you when the home has crisis , like you said , you know , what should the parents be doing ?
Because at that point , the parents and the children are at the mercy of , like you said , in-laws family and all that . What should they do if there's crisis of the home , you know , like the one that you experienced ?
There is no perfect home . If I want to use my experience , just make sure that you give your children good , badness and don't let them show hatred , bitterness to anybody , because once that one is there , to clear it from their mind would be very , very difficult . It would take a long time . And don't discuss your in-laws with your family .
Your family , yes to with your children , whether they are bad . Don't show it to the children .
Protect the child's , you know , says aspire to time , you know , since as far as time , yes , mm , mm , word Word . Thank you for coming on . Mindful it's a Mission . Well , I brought myself here to record Mindful it's a Mission . It's not in the studio , this is in the family dining room and we just had to cook for her . I can't make it .
I made it out for her .
Just to make me .
Well , thank you so much , mommy , for being such a wonderful gift to the summit . So our series on parenting is going to run and we've just spoken to a bit of work and I'm going to get Jen access into the studio Of course , I can't get a silent Jen into the studio and we'll look at parenting also from the lenses of the children that have been raised .
Like I said in two episodes ago , a choice to parent is a choice to die to self . A choice to parent is a choice to die to self . All right , so remember that you can connect with us . Just send us a text message , or you could also go to our Instagram page . That will be in the show notes .
Send a text , tell us what you think and what you think we should do better and what questions you want us to ask during this series . Alright , thank you so much for constantly staying with Mindfully
¶ Love and Self-Identity
. Tumishe . I am Uluwatu Tumishe . Love yourself , love your neighbour , love your country above all others . Love God . He is the essence of your being . I'm almost tempted to say that my name is Uluwatu Tumishe . I can just be like . I can just be like this . Alright , until next time , stay curious , and so on .