Innovations in Accessible Mental Health Support

Can you hear me ?

Alright , we're just two Ondo people who don't know how to speak our dialect . How are you Shell ?

So this makes it really interesting for us to be here . How are you doing today ? You can't say I'm fine . You cannot say I'm fine .

So I'll say that I'm filled and I'm really really happy . Yeah , I'm awful , not happy because of the life of an entrepreneur you know what you mean , all All right .

I felt that to be depressed you had to show extreme signs . So I was also in touch with um someone I call her a coach , right and she asked questions that really do my mind and I was like , okay , you're like most I think you might be depressed . I was like , no , I'm not mad , I'm like I'm okay , I'm okay .

You can say I'm okay , right , like nah , that's you . You realize you can be depressed and also look okay , it's not written on the face . So that was a turning point for me and , um , I built that momentum . I did a survey within my oh , lord show I lost you again . Can you hear me hello ? When I looked at the reasons why it's .

It's something that we know happens , but you , you did not speak about it in mid-summer . And secondly , it was expensive . I mean , like I missed today and I got like how can I afford 100k for a session when I mean I was assuming , I think , 18 a month ?

Like it was , it was very , it was very , um , foreign to people . So I I like not like your bank apps that . Okay , like , if you want to build a mobile app for zenith bank , you can just go and copy what um sterling bank has done . So you know template .

So we had to innovate , make mistakes , they try an error and , and I mean like , for the past two years , yeah , I'm proud to say that we've helped more than 2,000 people improve their lives , and these 2,000 people have not gone to therapy for once .

For once , I believe that we are still scratching the surface because , when you look at it , 24 people would suffer from a mental health condition every year , and if you look at it , that's approximately a billion people .

So our mission is to reduce the costs , make therapy more fun , exciting and also very , very much accessible , which is why we use insurance as a form of reducing the cost of care , so I hope that answers your question .

We can see the gifts the pain gives right . So , uh , I , I really , I really wanted to , you know , have a personal , but this bloom care is blowing my mind because I'm sure , um , what , what year did you start bloom care ?

They called it , they call it Cool FM , they call it Blue Room . So I'm sure that I would really use this name someday , but I was just not sure . So , 10 years after , just had a light bulb , yeah , this is it . So we , we , we , we are just saying that room africa .

But we just didn't want to limit africa , right , because we began to see interest from india , particularly like a lot of people in india were seeking help , trying to access yeah , so just okay , rather than saying and health also is very like , it's very , very um , we want to sound like like a hospital or something .

So yeah that was very , very calm and um very easy to um remember . So that's where the idea came from .

Anyway , we actually don't accept societal patients because we don't have it . We , we have created questions that really help us select and match therapies that best suits your needs . So after that , you match with a therapist and you can either pay out of pocket or pay their insurance .

Some , most of our clients are from insurance , so we partner with axa , reliance , lidwi , tangerine . What this means is that , in the release of this insurance , don't have to be one there for therapy , because we've already done the work to collaborate with them , and after that you can schedule live sessions .

So just like what we're having right now , like this this is how it works you can have sessions via text , voice and video oh , I envy people who need talk therapy right now , like that they have blue room care .

And , you know , going to yabba , basically because of the stigma not because there's not anything wrong we have , but because of the stigma uh was quite daunting . But I did go to yabba , to be honest , and I would , I would , um , my care , my first aid care , came from there .

You know , on the first three years , okay , for the first three years , I did , um , I did get help from a neuropsychiatric hospital , yaba , and later was went to private practice uh , where have the team from Minds Foundation holding my hands all through ?

So I'm glad and I was saying to people or rather , I was saying at the book launch , because when I launched my book last year that we need to make it more accessible , we need to demystify the narratives around mental health conditions and questions , and I'm so , so , so grateful that , um , we have this .

Well , sometimes it's just talk therapy some people need , and not necessarily being diagnosed with me , and all that . So , reflecting on your own journey , yeah , um shell , what personal experiences have shaped your perspective , or mental especially ? You know your friend saying that .

You know when he says to your friend , I'm not mad , and she , you know you say you don't have to be , you don't have to look a certain way to live depressed . So can we reflect on your journey for a bit ?

That I mean , that's the global , defined um meaning of mental health . So a lot of people , when , when they hear mental health , what , what occurs to them is mental illness . Them is mental illness , and that's where the issue of the other lips comes in . So it's always mental illness , the the the extreme part of mental health .

But they often forget that mental health exists on the spectrum . An example when you have um , like when you have , let's say , malaria , so I assume that my like malaria to also exist on a spectrum . You can be everybody . I believe every Nigerian has presence of malaria in their blood , everybody but you don't see everybody get sick at the same time .

That's the same thing with mental health . Everybody has mental health . However , not everybody would have mental illness it is when you're able to proactively manage all those factors that contributes to mental health .

Just as your environment , it can be biological , it can be , it can be situational , like finances , divorce , relationship , trauma , abuse anything that can really change the that can really push someone extreme . So those are really what leads to , or people , substance abuse .

Those are really what pushes people to mental illnesses and that's why you end up seeing people on the streets . So I often tell people that those , those people that you see on the streets , it's , it is a result of the failure of the health system . That's not a spiritual attack . There were not just support systems to help them manage their mental health .

So I believe that once , if there were provision of um , of um proactive care , you'd have less people in the community . You'd even have less people in the psychiatric hospitals . So just to tie this up , what I've learned is that mental health happens to everybody . Everyone has mental health , but it's even best of all has I mean Even best of us has .

No , we can't Like , like um uh , muji and Kenneth will say to me what protecting your mental health means that you understand that there is a high , understand that there is a low , and you're trying , you're found , uh , uh , a middle place where you are safe and you're trying to protect that um , so it's it . What that's ?

That's major and I think that's a major narrative that you hear mental health and the first thing that comes to people's mind is mental ill health . But I don't know what .

We don't know what we're trying to hopefully with , uh , we blue room care , we um , with the mindful intimacy , is to tell people that , look , every single day , anxiety is there , we have our stress there . How do you manage it ? How do you relate with that ? What do you have inside of you ?

What tools do you have to relate to that that it doesn't tilt you towards mental ill health ?

And and I think , if you can get this , you know this conversation is going like you said we have less people thinking that they have to go to the nearest psychiatric hospital , yaba or uh , looking down on any when anybody says mental health , okay , so so did in your , before we get into the conversation of how men's mental health is almost neglected .

Okay , in your own journey , because you did say that , the war you had our suicidal episode in your own journey towards wholeness , where there , what were the things that helped you ? What was support like ? What was community like for you ?

So it's a surprise to you that I did not actually seek therapy at that time , but I just had someone that acknowledged how I was feeling , which is really what therapy is all about , like making people feel good and listen , that you are not in this alone , you're not alone in this , rather .

So that ultimately helped me bounce back better , and that still helps me now . So people always say that , oh Moses , you're very , very busy . But that's not true , because I know that if I should isolate myself , I would suffer .

Let's hop on a call right , because life can be a lot like life can be a lot , and having such people , having such access . Just look at the data . We are more lonely than ever before yeah only the us surgeon general declared an epidemic . Like you know what that means loneliness on loneliness , an epidemic of loneliness . The data shows that it's as worse .

Loneliness is as worse as someone smoking a cigarette . That's really how loneliness is , because it's invisible , and that's why we often downplay the importance of having that support system .

So I believe that if you can really solve that crisis of loneliness and I really want people to hear this that more people doesn't mean more quality , right , if you have 1000 on instagram , they are not your friends , I'm sorry . You need friends that are actively involved in your life .

So it could be , it could be um childhood , this could be at work , at school . Anyway , I you need to always continually invest in that . You need to be vulnerable .

So , like when I hear a lot of people , a lot of young people , they don't want to be vulnerable because probably they have been hurt or they have been betrayed in the past , so they just don't want to have expectations . But building friendship is like someone coming to your car .

So you won't just allow anybody that wants to sell , anybody that comes to your car in traffic , to just talk to you . You would , you , you , you would wind out the glass a little bit . Okay , how can I help you ? Or even last myself . Okay , yes , um , yeah , like , so it's that process . So friendships are like . Friendships are like a journey .

Right , you just don't make friends instantly and you call them your friends . No , there has to be that journey and you need to know what .

Uh , what you need from this because not every , not every friendship has a future , and so that's a lot of things that we young people make is that because we've known them for 10 years , then we believe that every friendship should have a future . So so we're going to frost them .

No , it's okay to celebrate friendships that are no longer serving , exactly because when you're not growing , it means you're either declining , so there needs to be that sense of growth , because some friends are quite exhausting , like they are always . You call them , it's always like you call them and you're exhausted .

So , like that's , like that , like I have people , like that that's . But you'll see that it's always negativity and you want to ensure that you don't . You know , I mean because all of this affects you . Like you might think it doesn't affect you , but it all builds up to your mental health , having a lot of negative people or the countries that you know .

The countries are . But let's be , let's speak positivity into our lives . The countries are bringing positive energy right . Let's , let's , let's , let's , let's . Have a lot of positivity like let's , let's , let's light each other's lights exactly people in your space . They all need you . Oh , I need to move , I need to um .

Honestly , you just end up having a poor mental health , right ? So ?

So I believe the how , especially african boys , so even even myself , like , like , like , like , I'm not also , I'm not also , um , not guilty of that .

So we were raised to believe that we're not supposed to , we're not supposed to express ourselves , and that's why , when a man checks out from , either in marriage , like , it just goes silent because , like , like , they don't have that vocabulary to express how , how they feel .

And yeah , when you say it's like most people actually come for therapy at Durham KDM , 80% of them are women . Why ? Because we , we raise women to always be expressive .

Women talk , women , which is great , but men , how we communicate , disapprove our silence or we use lethal means , and that's why you see the case of suicide more people are coming for therapy but more men are dying for suicide . So why ? Why is that ? Why is it a disparity , like , let's think about why is there disparity ?

More people , more women , are open about their mental health , but men are usually guarded . No , that I can't be vulnerable with my friends , like they think I'm weak , like how can I go for therapy , like therapy's for women , and when life gets very , very tough , tough and you don't just know how to express it .

Because god created us and created channels for a purpose . Our mouth is a channel . We need to talk things out . We know we're not built to the silence .

Now we've , we've , we've , um we've shipped men to hold back , exactly to grow in silence , and the only channel they have is to use lethal means , by use arms or and that's why you see this abuse in relationships , in marriages , or even suicide .

So I think we should just , we should just create a lot of avenues and not just saying mental health , men that are that , because that's all very cliche , but there needs to be deliberate investment in mental health . You have a lot of women conferences and I have no , I have no bias towards that .

But we also need to transfer that same level of um interest to men's health , because we're the providers . We men go through a lot .

We're going to talk about that after this conversation and in that we started , we started promoting this , um , uh , in august , yeah , and in the last two months the responses has been is a lie , or why you're a woman , why are you championing men ? Or , and the question for me , for me again , I might get pushbacks for this , but it's fine for me .

I personally believe that if we have a whole man , a man who has tools on how to deal with themselves , with how to deal with themselves and the questions he has , and he has a safe space , then the family , the woman , wouldn't need to fight so much .

But , like I said , when a man has been raised to not be and a woman is constantly raised to be , how do you then expect him to grow to become a man ? A girl is raised to be a wife . In quotes , a girl is raised to understand how to nurture .

A man isn't A boy child falls down and the parents are , they look away like a granny , you know , a girl child falls down and then everybody rushes at the girl . So we are conditioned . We are conditioned to think that . You know , yes , we're conditioned to think that men don't do this , men can't

do this . I was having a conversation there recently with a friend about miscarriages and they were talking about how , you know , how people , how it's only the woman . I said no , you can't tell me , it's only the woman who feels the pain .

My father , I am sure , did not recover from the nine miscarriages his wife had , which is my mother , and he did not know how to deal . Honestly , he did not know how to deal . You know , honestly , did you not deal ? So he had this burst of anger and then this burst of extreme empathy and love . So all moments you see him around her , he's all lovey-dovey .

You know that the next moment you wouldn't believe the same person . We just finished hugging her . So I know for a fact and I , I have only brothers , I'm an only girl , I have only brothers , I have a son .

And I know that if we empower and that's the that's if we empower a man to understand how to adequately label and channel his emotions and feelings would have a better society . We would have a better society , whether it's chauvinism , whether it's patriarchy , whatever you want to call it .

I don't engage in all those gender drama , but whatever it is we want to call it .

But I believe this is a personal belief , and I've seen it with my son , I've seen it with my brothers and I've seen it with my husband too that if we give a man , if we give a man , if you allow a man a space where he's psychologically safe to to express , he's fine really . So this is the question .

Shill , I don't know why I'm calling you shill , you know , but I know your name is shill moses , but I prefer shill , don't mind me , I'm very pan-african like that . So how do you think we can navigate this pressure on men ? Yeah , how do you think we can navigate this pressure on men ? How do you think we can navigate it ?

were conditioned to always care , always be outspoken , which is great , and you're raising a man differently and you expect there should be balance , right , but that often doesn't happen .

Because if conditioning man to be um , to be unexpressive of his emotions and and um , once the , the wife begins to be overly expressive and the man communicate because men are women communicates differently . Yeah , I don't know if you've read that book . Uh , women are from um I never read it .

But maybe a bit more logical Like , okay , but you said this on X Y , z . So when you have that mismatch of logic and emotions , they are bound to be , they're bound to be friction , but it's until we understand how to communicate in our languages , in our , in our own um , understanding . That's really what creates that fullness .

So now to answer your question , I don't think a lot of men are aware about themselves , so it I . I think it begins also with self-awareness who am I as a man ? What is your identity ? Like what ?

Good man , I mean , we're in a condition , that marriage , which is great at a very young age . But men , we often ignore men . Okay , like , we're permissible , we do things . Okay . Yeah , don't worry , he's a man , he's a man , he's a man , he's a man .

So we end up collecting junk from different places , from social media , from family X , from family Y , and that's why there's chaos in our lives , because there is no deliberate intentionality in our lives .

So I believe self-awareness is key Knowing , really understanding what being a man is like , and also because a lot of men don't have role models , so it is very difficult hello .

So when you don't have that role model , like I said , you can't .

So and that's why there is there is pilots do use maps to go from legal stop general is pilots do use maps to go from legal stop general .

So so for men , if , if , if , if , if we do not create systems , those structures for them to be , and yeah , and , and also deliberately uproots that wrong ideology that they don't have to be expressive , they don't have to cry , they don't have to do that , because they end up collecting these wrong ideologies and expressing them in very lethal means .

So I believe that if parents , if care leaders , if teachers , even the society at large , can be very much intentional , the same way intention out , in , in the like , in the girl child , I believe we have a balanced society , because you cannot really end up pouring to somebody foreign to girls and leaving boys empty do deal .

What hello so so when you see that there's a void , we often fill it with maybe drug abuse and and and that . So self-awareness is actually what I would say like to begin with . And that's so . Self-awareness is actually what I would say Like to begin with . We understand in yourself your self-identity . Okay .

So I'll say that really having um a very strong support system , like family , friends , um , yeah , and but more importantly also like having a purpose , because if you have a purpose that really keeps you awake at night , then it really helps you . Um , okay , yeah , you matter and without you , like , something cannot happen .

Like you get , so I , I , so I will , yeah , so I would say that , uh , I think men should have very , very , very much intentional support systems and but those support system because they'll be mostly men , so they so , like I said initially , there just needs to be that unpacking of the stigma surrounding men's I'll die , it's , it's okay to , to be depressed ,

it's okay to be sad and , um , you , the best which just manages is to talk about it is to be open . That okay , alpha or more like like I'm going through xyz , and because they are men , they are , they are able to relate more appropriately than the other gender .

So I think , um , beginning those small , small talks , all those small small conversations , that , okay , being vulnerable around your men , like around you guys recently I think I've been doing that a lot and that just brings a lot of calm that , okay , I'm not the only one going through this .

So , yes , yes , I don't want to go through this and we don't go to the go on sweet and and go and go on tomato , because that's what's happening . Yeah , yeah , when we don't have it was supposed to say just sweet and yeah .

So I would say that really having that ability or capability in improving ability online , and not just through therapy but also through self-guided tools like journaling , we have other tools aside from psychotherapy . We have psychoeducation , we have guided classes , we have resources that can really help someone manage their mental health .

So , as we talk , journaling , everyday reflection , meditation can also help you prioritize your mental health on a day-to-day basis I truly feel seen .

You know , um , we're also creating a space for men to have conversations with themselves and I , I can't wait for it . I just really can't wait for it . But registration has been awesome .

I wouldn't even lie , you know , because when we started , um , when we started back in august to promote this , I was like , okay , I'm main going to , will they be , will they be willing , especially since it's been championed by lady . But I'm surprised at the response . I'm not even like I'm surprised . That response is interesting .

So if you had one message to a man struggling with the anxiety which is what the economic situation is making prevalent now , if you had one message for that man that's listening right now and feeling isolated , what would you be saying to him ?

And when you isolate yourself , you in fact that's really how mental health illness starts . You begin to you . It's in faces . So there is this early signs . You ignore them . Maybe it's burnout , depression . You ignore them and it begins to build , build , build as it builds up . The next thing is isolate yourself .

Or let me just um , stop reaching out to people and this is so cute to other men when , when someone who is always active stops saying anything , it's a cute checkup on them . So actually see yourself . And when we do that , you just have a lot of negativity , the negative thought oh , I'm not enough .

I think there's somewhere better that I could be , so having that social connection that is strong and intentional . And I would say this because of social media , we are no more connecting to each other when we're not performing . So you see a lot of people on social media . We are all sharing our wins , which is great .

I mean it is wonderful that we are being positive , but that's just's . That's just probably like one ten percent of our lives , like we have . Like we have like a lot of people don't like this showing the backstory . Okay , how did I get here ? Um , as I was driving to the , a very rough delivery mind hit my bumper . Do you understand ?

So , um being able being able to have that realization that there is , there is life outside of um , online online , I mean it's , it's . It's important you have online friends , but no , you need to .

You need to have real life conversations , real life Hangouts , go out to your friends , go out your family , spend time and um not necessarily just pouring into online online . Everything's online . Online meetings are online . You're checking your friends , checking up your friends are online . I mean , like that's that , is that ? Like that is .

That is the recipe for depression . If everything you're doing is only virtual , it's a recipe .

Yeah , stand strong , honestly , like I've been through a lot of things , a lot of things and um , I'm just really grateful that I have that resilience to always bounce back better .

For me it's a book , and that book is um , the four agreements by don miguel ruiz , and the four agreements are be impeccable with your words . Do not take anything personally . Do not make assumptions . Always do your best , and that has been my , my personal pledge , you know , and it has helped me shape . You know it helped me shape .

You know it helped me shape the way I think , the way I connect with myself and indeed the way I connect with other people . I understand it make . That book made me understand that , no matter how a person is upset about what it is that I said , you know , because it landed wrongly .

It landed wrongly because it probably , you know it probably took a wound that they were trying to , they're trying to hide , and you know it has just helped me manage my expectations with people . It's helped me manage my expectations with myself also . So you go , what's one book book , a podcast or a song ?

You talked about your song , so a book , yeah , that has impacted me light .

So I think that would be a book that I would recommend to everybody that is trying to , because , if you actually look at the bigger picture , mental health is really how we deal with the stresses of life yes , the stresses of life , yes , and how how can we do that is by having those social systems right .

So I think we should have did a very good job in defining spread , because the general matter is that we , we , we all have very high expectations of our friend , very high , but which can be dangerous . You don't have such expectations for normal people and when you have exclusive , that they have to be perfect .

They cannot , they cannot , they cannot , they cannot be flawed . I think that's what really leads to flawed . I think that's what really leads to like leads to say , isolation , right . So you know , as an example , so I currently have a friend , I mean for over 10 years and we had a very , very and we used for over 6 months .

Just a little misunderstanding and we used for over 6 months . So if we , if we , those , those that are closest to you , even hurts most . But having that tolerance that okay , having that clear expectation that , yes , this person will disappoint me but okay , but I , I still choose them regardless . There is a future and there's friendship and there is growth .

So you don't expect someone to be all perfect and nothing .

What would you change ?

Treat mental health care just like physical health , something to be regular cared of , so that we can prevent crisis and also build stronger communities thank you so much for this one and thank you for taking time out to be on mindfully with to me shade this week .

And as we run this off , I need to say a big thank you to Anita of Inkem Creatives for connecting Mindfully Wutumishe with Blue Room Care , for connecting mindfully with blue room care until next time as we continue our conversations around men's mental health in preparation for a fight for life .

Love yourself , love your neighbor , love God he is the essence of your being . Thanks for watching .