A Revisit: Redefining Masculinity and Self-Care

Month . In this episode , you'll hear from two men with shared roots in the same country but now living in different circumstances One emigrating abroad and the other remaining here in Nigeria , but widely traveled . We'll dive into the unique and shared mental health challenges they face .

Are these concerns similar or are their differences driven by their experiences in their different circumstances ? Now , don't forget to register for a fight for life . Details are in the show notes and across all our social media platforms at mindfully with chimichie . Now let's dive back into this insightful conversation . Enjoy okay , mindfully to miche the podcast .

Today we're still , of course , we're still in june , the men's mental health awareness month , and let me tell you guys what I did . Uh , of course you guys know that I had a classmate , a former classmate , here on the show about two weeks ago , two weeks running , and just as the month started , I sent a question to my secondary school group .

Again , I'm sorry , guys , if you don't have roots with your secondary school I can't help you , but I do have real strong roots , roots . And I sent a message to the group .

I said I want to ask the men in the group how you would define , describe mental health or ill health and how the society can help , and that we started this amazing conversation and I said you know you slow down guys . You're coming on the show , let's go talk and let's see how we can help people .

And I'm so excited today that I have in the group oh , did I say in the group On the show today the president of the Mahalo , mahalo , mahalo , mahalo , mahalo , mahalo , mahalo Mah . Hello , hello , hello , hello , hello , hello . My name is my name is my name is .

When I say how are you , you don't say I'm fine . I'm sorry . You can't say I'm fine on the show , yeah . So think who's gonna answer first ? I'm going to answer that .

So the stability you know , mentally , mentally , physically , financially , and environmentally , environmentally , please , a lot you know , and environment doesn't mean the weather . Yeah , where you grow up , how you grow , you know what you grow up understanding . Now the illness is all those things that I've mentioned .

How , what is deficiency , you know , in that balance , how does it reach the deficiency in that balance ? Oh , one time , because illnesses doesn't just bring up one thing gets both links to another thing , links to another thing .

If you're even inclined at home with headache or body pain , you don't just go to work one day and come back with you know one one , one massive headache . No , that's it . The deficiency then , because of the headache before got from the from school . Okay , so everything alright . Oye , ma , do you need me to because I had been before God ?

And to Babashige's's points , there are several emotions , there are several things that drive our moods and our feeling on a day-to-day basis , weekly , monthly . When there is instability in those key things , I think that's when we go to sort of being in this ill health state .

So maybe , coming back to mental health , for me personally it has to do with my emotional well-being , my social well-being , sort of my psychological state . Maybe there's probably one or two more things to add , but those are the core ones .

If you peel under the surface , you then think about family , financial and all those other things , but it really comes down to socially , emotionally , psychologically . But I haven't gone on that journey yet to understand which of those , when they become unstable , triggers the ill health for me , because there are certain things that just don't trigger it .

Right , there's so many variables to our feeling , like Papashige said . So I like , for example , I like Akara . If I don't have Akara on a certain day , it doesn't lead me to go into that state , right . But if I then have a situation where there's a financial insecurity , it may then tip me . So there are certain variables .

It's just how we give weight to some over the others and until maybe I'm jumping ahead already , but until I audit and know the ones that are core to me and the ones that drive me to an ill health situation , then the journey continues .

That might not trigger you , but the day that the day it might trigger you is because you're not having Akara on Saturday because you cannot afford it . Did I get that correct ?

You know , in the lot of climate , you know when that is not . You know , kind of imagine you have children giving them that kind of meal and all of a sudden you don't give them . They'll ask you questions , especially children of this millennium , of this time .

They will ask you why are we not having a car on suspect anymore and you start explaining now what that have causes to you . The provider is a , there's a , there's a glitch , whether you like it or not , reduces your , your , your how would I put it ? If you , if you have , if you have your emotional stability at 20 ? Let me give an example . It will .

It will deduct maybe one or two or something at that point , because they're asking the question , not that you cannot afford it , maybe because you didn't bring it to that so okay , now this , this , this is going to uh , get me to that question , um with men's mental health and how it seems

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Nobody should go to me and say you know , there are different things to this . I'm sure men are provided elsewhere . You know , the wife conditioning in those times are different that the wife conditioning conditioning here . The one condition in here is almost like slavery . But you know , and if you the condition the woman , I'm sorry , you'll be explained how .

How can she think to support the man ? Whoa .

But let's not go to that thing is when your condition from you know , you see that this is what you're doing and what you're meant to do , it is already a button .

So the button comes from first of your condition to provide for your family that you're coming from which is your brother , your sister , your father , your , your sister , your father , your mother , your sister and maybe extended family in some cases . Ok , let's not go there get that button until you can pass through this first button .

So when you provide for your family , then you now move to your extended family . Now , in all this you're not taking care of yourself . In all this you're not taking care of yourself , because naturally you should take care of yourself . So you move to extended family . Then you will not have scale of preference . So your own family .

Maybe you choose to get married or not . Then you now take care or you choose to , you know , have a child and you now take care of your child , then you've not taken the burden of your associates . So your , your , your , your wives associated , so your wives . Marian siblings , you know , it's the same thing that you're taking on this side .

So I just made the assumption that that's the norm , right , and I think , to all intents and purposes , as Shagun set out , it still is the norm and the societal expectation in Nigeria , definitely .

However , where I find myself today or where I've been for the last 20 odd years , it's different , right , but the difference and how it plays on the individual are two things , because we're still talking about mental health here , right . So in this , in this climate , in this western world , it's different . It it really depends .

We use the term roles what role are you playing in the family ? A woman could be a breadwinner in that family . She may have assumed that role because of her job , because of her job , because of her career , and this society is actually okay with that .

However , where the issue then becomes , where it becomes a problem , is where you've had this upbringing from a Nigerian environment that you're the provider and then you come into a society that defines things based on roles and you can't be the provider .

Yeah , I'm providing me going into the kitchen to do what to , to pick up the child at 2 am , why I've provided now let me go to sleep . But you don't find yourself in a different society where , yeah , just providing , okay , providing OK , fine , that's a role you play , but the family system needs more than that .

So that then you need to understand that , as an individual that's grown up somewhere else , how you moderate for that to just balance out your mental health .

Very funny , and Sheggs knows mental illness is anything that affects the balance of everything that he said . But then we go to how to help and he says first understand that it exists for me and in this client we're not allowed to go through the emotions , but just do so in the doing . Support us , care for us , not sex food , because that is default .

But you know that we're made to do and in the doing we carry baggages figuratively . So just help us to make the weight lighter . Shegun , that was what you said . Yeah , that's what I said .

That also affects the mental health and that's not just for men . Of course that's the right thing . But you see what she just mentioned roles , roles , when you know you're carrying , but if you have somebody to help you to in that role , it makes sense , you know , it helps with your mental health .

If the condition you , you know , provide and continue to provide and someone is dead , you know , you know it's a reunion of commandos here and we have Coco here .

You know , in the climb , where we are . Yeah , in Africa and Nigeria . Yes , this is your next possibility . No , you have to pay this , they don't come back . I say well done but true , very true yeah , I'm sure you to do it , but in another client nobody's asking you to do it yes , I agreed you can do it , you choose to do it .

Now , the one that you are made to do is when you are in your own family , on your own relationship . That one now , if you understand rules , oh , the rules , like what I've tried to do in my own family , you know , I'll tell my madam um this . How far now for this ?

You know , I don't want to mention , yeah , a project , yeah , because there's no specific thing . You know , we just it can be anything , it can be anything . How fast ? You tell me , okay , what do you have ? I say what do you think ? Because it's , it's the dance . It's the dance .

Yeah , because I know that , yes , conditioning , now my conditioning is still there , because I don't want to shift the conditioning , I don't want to shift what she's meant to do Because , know , I don't want to shift the condition and I don't want to shift you know what she's meant to do , because not fully .

Well , also , we should be , we should be , we should be balanced .

That's probably a complex question . But there was something Baba Shiger said which is the expectation in Nigeria is the man , is the provider . So looking from the outside in you , I may think , actually that's cleaner , the roads are cleaner , there is no complexity , there's no ambiguity . This thing is clean .

But to be fair and I think Shigeru picked this up , there is . I could be wrong , maybe things have changed . I don't live there daily , but , shaygu , please tell me , is there a level of appreciation for providing , because in certain situations it's probably just taken as a given and the man .

You then have that where it's taken as a given , and you then have this society and we'll come on to this , I believe , to Michelle where you can't speak up about your ill health .

hear this out .

The social aspect is just something that comes off that , because once the mental state is one kind , you're not going to want to just bother with social or just the social aspect . So I don't know how else to define them . That's how I feel it , and the mind is so complex and they're so unique to everyone that to begin unraveling we need weeks of conversation .

So , in terms of the help I mentioned them there , I think men are just brought up not to talk about these things . To be honest , uh , discussing it is a kind of weakness . And also , if you look at society right , most times women say I want a strong man , I want a man that's commanding .

When you're having conversations about your fears , your doubts , your concerns , your anxiety , your depression , so the thing no balance , which is why most times men kind of go the end , which is why I use the word stoic you're stoic to a fault .

Um , sometimes obviously men feel comfortable speaking to other men that are receptive and non-judgmental about these things and one thing I've learnt , just generally . They say people are not prone to talk and be open when you don't make eye contact Very minor . I'm shy , so imagine you're going for a walk with someone and both of you are looking into two things .

You'll probably get more out of them than I try staring them , especially with men , so I don't give you a TI feed to you can quote me for some more , but in terms of podcasting I'm very , very shy , to be sure you know me . I'm shy , I'm a very shy person so whatever .

We can't take that away from the Adamic nature of world , of the world and men . Women also want a vulnerable man , but I'm not sure most women can navigate a sensitive man . I stand to be corrected , so you guys will not correct me that day . So in your experiences , I don't know how many girlfriends you guys have had let's not open our .

That's the conditioning , yeah , but you see , at that point that woman's mind are not maybe not conditioned that much because they might be fellow classmates , you know , just living , managing themselves . But you see the conditioning from asking is that guy a provider ? No , you cannot marry somebody . You know that's what they are saying .

Now , what they are conditioning that woman I'm not holding folks for anybody is to not , is to do that if that man cannot do it , he is not a man .

Yes , women are conditioned to see . Each man must be a provider from the get-go . If he doesn't provide , ask . I don't want to talk about this generation . Ask them . They will say no , I cannot marry a man that doesn't get it ?

So let's take let's take drugs .

But just listening to all of this I know your question was about sensitivity , but I'm thinking back to shagun's comment around the provider and , interestingly , as men on your podcast , we've gone back to that word because that is the core for us .

That is the main thing that if that thing rocks , it affects our mental health , given the environment both shagwa and I have been brought up in . Yes , I'm in a different place , but I still am anchoring to my upbringing .

Right , and if you take it back 100 years ago , right , even especially for an evil man , the man has to be a provider , like you're not taking my daughter home if you don't have a yam in your barn . You're not taking my daughter home if you don't have an ubi , you don't have a hut , you don't have a house , you don't have a farm .

So this thing runs deep and this is how we've been programmed . So I think in terms of I'll come on to sensitivity , but in terms of mental health and imbalance , not being a provider is a chronic one , especially in the economic condition that I find myself , like I said in my country here , different .

But if you come to sensitivity , I think if I'm trying to be fair and maybe I'm dancing around the subject , but if I'm trying to be fair I think a woman can deal with a sensitive guy , but sensitivity at the right time .

The role I play in my own personal household is also to be a provider , to be a support system for my wife , and there are times where she needs me to be that support system . So I can't be sensitive all the time . Maybe I'm being extreme here , do you get me ? Yeah , you're correct , I just can't be sensitive all the time . Yes , I can show weakness .

I can talk about my fears , my doubts . I need to have a partner that I can do that with . But my dad wants me to be strong at certain points , at certain crucial points .

Maybe then I'm going to show the sensitivity , because if I keep not turning up at those times that matter for her and this will be homework for you ladies , to go and define those times that matter for you If I keep being sensitive at those times and not being that shoulder to cry on , then there's a problem .

I don't go negative sensitivity my wife , I go just man up , chin up , you know for her . But you see the thing , why I said maybe there's no timing , you understand , because why I said that was they want to define the time .

So you might just help with explaining and defining that time okay so if , for example um , maybe I'll give you a clear scenario , um , maybe I'll give you a clear scenario you are not in the house and there's a fire incident , they call you and say there's fire , you don't start shouting at them , madam . So what did you do that caused the fire ?

That's very , very sensitive . Some men will do it , though Not for anybody . At that point in time is for me , my default action is I'm on the way . You call someone or you know , as if they put out is everybody safe , move everybody out of that . You know I am moving to the supportive part , the sensitive in quote . You know being there , protective of that .

You know I am moving to the supportive part , the sensitive in quote . You know being there , protective . Do you understand ? Now you see , that thing about timing , that people now say eh , eh , maybe you should have just said I'm on my way , no action .

The person might not be your answer , but you need to find a solution to that , all right , so I'm going to ask both of you a question , and um dreads um , because you you've experienced both sides . I , I would . I want you to answer first , and then um shags , would you know , give us the niger , or what I'm saying .

Okay , so let's talk about modeling and mentoring that you guys talked , that you started this conversation with in the first place , where you talked about conditioning . You know that , because that's basically what modeling and mentorship is . All right . So I have a question about that .

Did any of of you , either of you , have such conversations with your fathers or the authority figures ? And we'll take a moment , just a moment . I don't think we're going to take a minute , but a moment to pay homage to Dress that . All right , it's no longer with us . Oh , chuck's father too , he's dead . Jack's father too , he's dead .

My father too , he's dead . But we need to pay special homage . We need to dredge that . Yes , we do .

I'm sure nobody has put it the way I put it and I'm sure he doesn't even know that we know this deep . Yeah , the question was going to be it's for him , him to talk For me .

We were in school when we were all hurt and we had a couple of I think the Odaches also lost their parents in that crash in 1992 . If you are in Nigeria and you are older than 45 , you know about that crash in 1992 . And Mr Jma wasn't there .

There didn't need to be even my boyfriend at the time , so they were all close at the time and I can't , I can't remember how you actually walk through that time with Adora . And Adora hi , if you're listening At the time . So it leads me back to the modeling thing .

Okay , so before he transitioned , how he transitioned and all of that , how did that affect and impact on you as a man , as a father , as a husband ? Oh , as a husband , as a man , a man , a husband and then a father . And then I'll ask um , shaking that too yeah , no , thank , uh , thank you guys .

The way I coin it is that the mediums are in the vessel through which you came into being , so very important , regardless of their age . The phrase I use for my dad's passing is there was a ripple or there was a tear in the fabric of my existence , right ?

So these words I can use now because I've had a lot of therapy around this stuff and I can say that openly because it did impact me . When it happened .

I was a child , right , and so you don't know the consequences of not having the mentoring Timmy Shea , you're talking about not having the guidance , the anchors or my north star at the moment in terms of being a provider or trying to be a provider , or how I behave as a dad and a husband is from observations . So observing is actually quite important .

It speaks more volume than the talking . So I saw my dad's actions , right . I saw mom doing her best as well , but dad was in the military , like I said , so a roof over our head was provided , certain things were given . So in my head there's a crystallization of the fact that he's a provider . Right , so all good .

But as I then went on my own journey to key points in my life when I needed to have that conversation , like when I I got married , oh yeah , it would be nice to talk about . Talk to my dad about not how you deal with a woman , but how you manage conflicts .

So those are the bits where I think I then went on my journey and we'll come on to this in terms of men not speaking out . I'll be honest , it still took me a while before I spoke out , but when I did , I found the right person to have these conversations with and we went on a dissecting mission .

When I did , I found the right person to have these conversations with and we went on a dissecting mission , Like we took it way back to yeah , so that's been my own journey .

I would have loved for him to be here , you know , to talk through this thing because I think I understand it . You know that they were conditioned and it was worse the condition . It was worse in the time we are now being enlightened because we choose to . I think we even have , um , we have a little bit of control , control over our control .

So there was seven itself the only thing I did , which is what to him I said , because I saw him do all right myself , like I was telling you my dad was eternal . But yet he was there In fact he was doing so much for all that To me , I'm suffering now .

That's all that I do wow because people nice movie , uh , when there was this bullying thing that was yeah going around thing . That was , yeah , going around . I just should go back for plan . I sat down me my dad , I don't look at me , say , daddy , don't worry , I'll never be me .

We know now what I give them if they know that they have their father , it's clear . But I'm trying to make them understand what a father is is much more than that , means A father , a friend , a confidant , a gist partner and a play partner . Oh nice , in fact my wife says it If you ask . She loves her children more than me .

Yeah sorry , she says it's not irregular .

But if you see all the gadgets on the surface of this edge . You have laptop but not a mobile phone .

Very , very important is , I think , now that I'm older maybe it's a story I've told myself , but I feel it strongly that I was loved , like like my dad loved me , loved my dad loved Chima , loved us all I was loved and that gives me so much energy , regardless of the absence , right , regardless of the lack of time , which I'll come on to , because these

officers dad comes home , sleeps , goes to mess . We don't see him .

Officers , mess if you're a military guy , so I didn't get to spend enough time with him , and maybe it's a Nigerian thing , but one beautiful thing about the UK , or the sort of group or the people I associate myself with or people I observe , is they spend a lot of time with their children , maybe to a fault , but it's beautiful .

Yeah , they go for their plays , they go for football , even when their children are at university . They go every other sunday to have breakfast with them , even if they live in a different town , and to me say I know you do this with your kids , so I see your pictures . So that's amazing .

So I would say the love , the unconditional love , the , the amazement when you see your children , the bewilderment , that excitement . Just show them . They've got your attention , they've got your love . So that was similar . What was different and maybe it's just because of the time , I'm not criticizing my father at all is I wish I could spend more time with him .

I remember I always have this memory of in the military , when you're a major and you're about to be promoted to a lieutenant colonel , you go to Kaduna Jaji for training . My mom sent me to stay with my dad for a week , a whole week . It was just me and the man and I carry that thing like a treasure , like in my mind right . So time , so important .

He was my father , you know , school in the UK did not want to be doing like . He wanted to try to do like let me use the word that just entered my mouth a eukaryote .

But I'll never forget , you know that's why he said memories and he said why are you charging me this ? I can't do this . I used to do this when I was going to UK . He says my soldiers that's what he used to call me and my brother . We now went to the team to buy iron rod . This is Nigeria , it's not UK that you go to targets .

We went to where they said iron rod dirty . We bought iron rod , brought it home , we caught it . We caught it and we did buggering when we went to that thing . They called him that is . That was dirty the way he dropped that thing . He picked it up again . Told us to get out . Left Came downstairs .

He didn't speak to anybody and went into our store Because my dad is an engineer . He went into the store . When he came out of the store , there were fools over there .

The first that I'm extremely aware of was when we lost my younger brother in 2004 . I was a Macaulay serving and when I got back and it was during camp so I couldn't leave camp so after camp , after I secured everything and everything , I got back For the one week I stayed at home . My dad would kneel by Yano's bed and cry .

You know he would cry , he would cry , he would like he would cry . The second was when I was oh , I'll say three . The second was when I was in labor and he heard that my for my first year , that he heard that my for my first child and he heard that my labor had been truncated , uh , for about two hours . And then my mother .

He sent my mother to come pray for me . But my mother said , when she got back , she saw my mother . He saw my father , he saw my mother in his adamic nature and he was telling god , take me , leave my child me , leave my child , take me , leave my child . The third was when his wife died .

When I told him , oh , your wife is gone , I saw light in his eyes . He didn't cry at the general hospital but when we got home he held my hand and gave a feral scream . You know , imagine a jaguar hurt and you know it would give a feral . It was a . He didn't , it was not correct , it was a scream and he held my head to his chest and it has .

You know , looking at my father , I have only brothers , I'm an only girl and I have a son . It's , it's what , it is what drives me to want to feed , uh , to , to want to lead a , a campaign that allows , that gives permission for mentally to to to feel , I think . I explained .

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They had the example like son , is there something I've done that maybe you couldn't tell me ? And the father said maybe we didn't really spend quality time together Every time that I needed to speak with you , you always shut me off Do you know the reaction of the father I needed to speak with .

That was hard .

the question again , define it clearly what do you think does not allow men to talk about mental health issues ?

I can't remember what it was , I think it was one man takes his life every minute . Yes , yes , 60 every hour , something like that . So mental health such a big deal . Speaking up is a difficult thing . It's difficult because of the conditioning . The conditioning is , if you speak up , you'll seem to be weak .

And if you then look at the stereotypes or the generalization , if we watch most war movies , be it medieval or be it current wars , when the leader , a man , most times stands on the podium to speak to address people , portrays strength , stoicism , no chink , absolutely 100% , oozing of strength . And then you get a following . I see men , even those that follow .

I see men conditioned in that way that for you to lead your household , given the culture , for you to lead your household like , for example , if I'm focusing on Niger to lead your household you have to be a symbol of strength , and to be a symbol of strength , there's no weakness . Speak about what your emotions , seriously .

No , that almost brings you down a notch , or that's the perception that brings you down a notch from this pedestal . Yeah , so that is the biggest challenge .

However , I would counter that and say , okay , yes , yes , speak up , but you choose how you speak and how you heal because in the healing , gives you clarity and direction to actually lead properly yeah word I have to say we're going to end with .

So the first question personal reflections One how was your understanding of mental health evolved over the years ? The second question is what advice would you give to someone who is struggling with their mental health ?

I'll be honest , um , and I go back and I tell it like a story in terms of my journey , and people that have changed their place of abode will know this . I mentioned it in the recording . There was trauma leaving nigeria to move to a different country .

Even if I'm being chased or even if I'm looking for greener pastures , there's always trauma in that there's trauma losing a dad , there's trauma losing a brother and most of these things we don't talk about , right .

You carry all of these things on your journey until the body actually says I can't do it anymore and the mind says I can't do it anymore and you get these warning signs and for me , I did get those signs .

And in that getting the signs and the signals , there was then a reluctance to go speak to someone because of my conditioning in having those conversation , in exploring those conversation to gain a better understanding of why these things are happening to me , why I'm feeling a certain way , has taken me on a crazy journey of understanding and I'm still on that journey

. I probably have got 50 percent the way there , because not only is it to do with my loss of sibling and dad and nigerian environment , there is also a cultural element which we haven't even dissected on this podcast .

Like the way ebos , the expectation of an evil man is different from the expectation of a Yoruba man and some of those expectations are warped and , I would say , have issues with them . But it actually favours the society . So this is a whole different podcast that's a whole different conversation .

Just put the fact that you are existing In any fact , that you're existing in any client . There are things that will bring you down and when those things happen , if you don't want to accept that , it will happen to you or it exists . You're not as crazy .

To another thing with each one to another thing village tradition , village people , now most times the only person that can bring you out from any mental healing any yourself wow because this is the wonderful thing about the universe . I don't want to mention anything . Go ahead , it's . A and B Complete .

Once you look at it , you get help , you get help , you get everything . Once you know and you agree anything . Once you know that this is the problem , you start to give it more solution . Identify the things that are important to you , acting not from the outsides , outsides past , from the inside .

Remember , from the beginning I said when you grow , you are conditioned to take care of your immediate family , which is your siblings and all that , and you now move , you now take care of the immediate family that you are .

Yeah there is no point that you are conditioned to take care of yourself , no point that you're conditioned to take care of yourself , no point . That's why the woman is the one that will come and take care of you there's no point did you hear that , dreds ?

Let your wife sit down with you sometimes and take the drink . When you are emotional . At those times that Oyeba mentioned , you can be , you know , but nobody . In all the conditioning that they give in africa , the only thing you do is you just keep on duplicating .

When you get married , you're still not taking care of yourself , so you take care of other people what ? to yourself . Take care of the white summit . What do you want to take care of yourself when you die ?

You say you don't eat , that you do not control the family . He said you do not control the family . You , man , control the family . You don't want to off him .

That one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one , that one that one , that one , that one I didn't like Remembering this table .

NLP everybody does this to understand that it's a method for you to dialogue with somebody . Don't see somebody from the front and say I don't like this person . That method probably be that , we don't know , we just decide so you don't like him again it doesn't start from mental .

Maybe when you make a contact you don't really plan on the person , because that is certainly when they don't even contact , you don't even talk to the person , because that is the way they don't give you the chance for men to be deliberate .

No see , I might talk to that and say to be mad , don't be mad , don't be to get manhood the way the way it is gone there get manhood .

The don't be mad , don't get mad the podcast even just I get up yeah but I don't know , yes , you were not careful you know , when they don't break that , nobody ever talking about in mind , nobody do anything very different from mine .

That's why they say the six , seven , which is all in for , let us know , can't and will have it it's a topic it's something to say you are not mentally stable . Go check , don't be insult . Don't be stupid , don't be insult , don't be insult .

You , you guys , have a shot , no problem I've been looking at the time but yeah , yes , you said so you so you , okay ?

It's two men how can men take action to support their own mental health , or mental ill health , and the people around them ? And I ask you because I know you and and this is I'm not trying to break confidence but I know that you are actively , actively working to evolve mentally .

So , um , what pointers are you going to give to the listeners on how to support their own mental health and the people around them ?

Yes , there may still be stigma that exists but honestly , the outcome of having this conversation but honestly , the outcome of having this conversation , the outcome of really understanding yourself and making yourself stronger for you and your family , outweighs any ridicule in quotes you might receive for speaking out , and I can testify to that .

Speak up , find a professional , get the help , start the conversations , and then you will see that it would help you to go on a fantastic healing journey and actually help you become the person you're meant to be . Because we as men I know we've talked about providing , maybe in that ninja setting it's actually not a burden most times , it's a privilege .

We enjoy it , it's part of our programming . We enjoy it . What , then , makes it even more beautiful is to get the support around it , to get the understanding around it , because that's just our sort of calling . So I'll say two things . Normally , I'd normally say three things , but actually maybe I'll do three . The first one is self-care , self-love .

Second one , speak to a professional . Third one , and I think Nigerians do this very well , very , very well , and I'm almost here in the UK looking envious that you guys always check in , catch up with friends , have that social downtime . We don't have it in the UK .

If I'm organizing a barbecue , it has to be three months in advance and I have to allow for that . 30% of the people won't come on the day . I can't just come to knock on Baba Shigeru's door on a Friday night and say , guy , what you did do , make a good chop at the soup for Connor . No , I have to text , organise , pull , find dates , arrange time .

But in Nigeria this is done beautifully . Just continue to maintain that social cohesion . So self-love , speak to professionals , be social .

There's nothing that will reduce you from being a man .

You know I was looking through . You know I wrote um some uh appreci appreciate some posts last year and it just occurred to me that both of you were the people that I mentioned in the post . You that you read the book and you said that you said the book was supposed to be A living book and this guy has been hounding me for a second book .

You know what you get a second book . And , of course , dreads has been such an amazing friend and all of us have been together since we were what 11 . So so , so good , so , so good . Thank you guys . Um , love yourself , love your neighbor , love your country . Above all of this , love God is the essence of your being .

Share this podcast with someone that you believe needs it and let's love our men . All right , love your boys too . Love your boys . Love your men , help them understand . Ask them what love means to them . Okay , do you love them the way you think they want to be loved ?

Ask them what love means to them , how they want to be loved , and it will be more , it will be smoother . I believe you know , okay , so , uh , don't think that all men Want this . Not old men want hugs and the default , as Shegu said , that's small , my wife just asked me which foot do you want me to buy for you ?

And that was the conversation With Oyema and Shegwa , and I hope that you are more convinced To attend a fight , are more convinced to attend a fight for life , and that a fight for life is imperative for such a time as this in history November the 23rd , 2024 , at the Rembrandt Hotel .

Register to attend today for yourself , your friends and for the ladies listening . Attend today for yourself , your friends and for the ladies listening . Get this as a gift for your man , the man that you love or the man that you love , as in your father , your brothers and all of that man that you love .

Until next time , love yourself , love your neighbor , love your country . Above all of this , love God . He is the essence of your being . I am a lot to me . She or Lada or Coco , stay curious . No-transcript .