Roe vs. Wade- A Divided Country

We have a lot of interviews lined up. A couple of particular to those interviews is with a young lady by the name of Tina Sanfy, otherwise known as a k a slossing girl who has her is to the streets and is a community activists. Another interview of note is Catherine Attorney Katherine co Vote, who wrote the book Controlling Women, What we Must do now to save reproductive freedom. She has spoken before the Supreme Court. She's an attorney and she's a I guess you could say, an activists

for reproductive rights of women. So I had the pleasure of interviewing her at the TAD Talk and I had not released that interview. I think this is probably the most important time to release this since the protests and the uproard is taking place all over this country and Katherine and her thoughts about this. I was able to interview her and some of the things that she talked

about has come to pass. So I'm gonna feature that interview on here as well as as well as people from the community also had my thoughts about Rod versus Wade A divided country, and that's gonna be my title for this episode. Roll versus Way A divided Country. Okay, I'm in the streets and I got Sloss the girl on the phone, and I need to ask you because you got your ears to the ground, you out in

the community, that's what you wrap. And I need to hear your thoughts about all these protests about the voices, Roll versus Way. I need to get you on record. I want to hear what's happening in the streets, and I want to hear what you think about it. Right, definitely, well, UM first and foremost, you know, I appreciate you UM reaching out to you know, hear my thoughts about this definite you know, tragic and backwards movement UM that we're

going as a country. So I know that the women's rights issue is definitely UM one that is a point of concern right now with you know, role versus way, um, being taken out of the Supreme Court and kind of be giving back to the states, um, to have jurisdiction

over whom they can have abortions or not. And I can't, for the life of me understand why they would want to do this, um, you know, and especially right now considering just everything that we're dealing with as a country in terms of like you know, the inflation and the high gas prices and just all of just the every day, um, day to day things that it's making you know, life hard for average Americans. And then now women have to go out here and protest um for women's rights and

autonomy over their bodies. UM. And so you know, first and foremost women people, UM, women in general, because we're talking about women should have autonomy over their bodies. That's you know, that's nothing, um, that's undeniable, that's nothing that can be disputed, you know what I'm saying. I don't really like to get into the personal you know, you know, like anti pro choice or you know, like I think

women should have choice over their body. I just can't for the life of me understand why, um, this will be happening right now. I don't talk all it, like you said, rising guys, gas prices and all any other illness is taking place, UM right why now I can. But um, I know that, UM, when they first opened up a lot of abortion clinics, the majority of was in the Black commember. Any thoughts on that, I mean, yeah, I have a lot of thoughts on that. You know.

So again it's like, you know, I try to, um, you know, not get into the you know, like the personal kind of like feelings, UM, and just kind of have a general like okay, yeah, no matter like my

personal view. I don't want to be getting into debates with people about um, you know, kind of like the genesis of planned parenthood in this country and you know, eugenics, UM and all of that, which is kind of like the foundation for what planned parenthood today is, even though it's not you know, it's definitely not like the same exact framework as when Margaret Singer was pushing planned parenthood and going to you know, black leaders and black churches

to um make planned parenthood and UM and abortions and things like that see appeal to black communities. You know that it's far from that now. But it's just it's it's hard for me, UM, as somebody that studies history and institutional racism and just white supremacy in general. I cannot not think of that when I think of and here abortions like Margaret Singer, all of that comes into play eugenics because I'm aware of that history. I'm not sure if the average person UM makes that connection or

if they even find any relevancy in that. UM. But yeah, you know, black people, black women, UM, they say, especially

in the inner city, are leading in abortion rates, you know. UM. And then if we consider all, um, you know, the ways in which black people are experiencing genocide in general, you know, whether that's through state sanction violence or UM, you know, lack of UM equitable access to healthcare or even just you know, UM income or healthy food actions like all of these things that UM effect are UM birthrates.

And you know, it's just like a lot. So I think that as black people, especially from the inner city, that we should be focusing more on creating life. You know. UM, it's black people dying in inner cities every day, you know.

And so UM however, UM, you know, I think that the quality of life has to be improved for black people, black women for us to really um see that as uh to see life, um, to see bringing more life into the black community as something that we need to do because you know a lot of women are choosing not to have children because of financial reasons. You know. So it's like, you know, so all of that, you know, so again all of that, I just try to have

a baseline. You know, women should have autonomy over their body no matter my personal you know, viewpoints, because of my lived experiences you know, would shape your your viewpoints. Um. But yeah, just not to go into a hole still about it. But yeah, I think it's a very tricky issue, especially when you um it's I mean that's you know, it's it's divided the country, as if it's not already

divided already. You know, it's just you know, people are very very very divisive when it comes to these kind of issues right now, you know, Um, it's just only escalating and people being hurt, and rides are taking place and and protests is taking place, and you know, some people being hurt, and you know, it's one of those issues that people are really uh upset and and it's

on both sides. On boat that's the thing. People are have strong opinions on both sides of this, and so, um, I don't know where we go from here, but I don't believe abortion is going away right either way. You know. I think that the people should just be a little bit more aware of how it just seems like it just for me, it just feels like the government putting us through like mental stimulations from like all of these

social issues. It's like, you know, first with um, the Black Lives Matter, you know, and um, now with the whole abortion rights, and I feel like, um, you know, I think that our government has a lot more responsibility in terms of like manufacturing this chaos basically when they definitely ain't bringing the people together. It's their decisions more. Thank you, Tina, thank you for you know, your thoughts

on this. I'm gonna cute this up. We're gonna have it on Melik's book share bringing the World together the books, culture and communally. And you heard it lie from Tina Santi known as a Ka Slawson Girl. Last week I celebrated Black Excellence. I was present and attended the House of BT, which is part of the b ET Awards ceremonies that happen every year. I was part of the Hollywood Bowl Jazz Exhibit, which was celebrating one hundred years

of jazz at the Hollywood Bowl. In the midst of all the celebrating black excellence was this uproar and movement all across this nation. People are protesting and speaking out,

particularly woman about abortion. Now I normally don't talk about these types of issues because my platform on Malik's Bookshelf is to talk about subject matters thinking unite us, not divide us, and abortion is one of those subject matters that is divisive, and it divides the community and separates the community, and we must find a way to bridge

the gaps that cause division. So I normally started, you know, stay away from subject matters like that because I want to use Belief's Bookshelf to bring the community together and talk about things that are positive in the community. We can always talk about all the negative things that go on and plude believe it or not, it's a lot. It's a lot, and that stuff is being taught twenty four seven on cable on news. So I'm just trying

to be different. But people are taking the streets and people are protesting because of this decision that the Supreme Court just made over Row versus Way, and a lot of people say, oh, this is the end of Roll versus Way, meaning that abortions are legal, meaning that the states, you know, the federal government is the law of land. So when the Supreme Court or Congress, you know what, Congress says the laws of the land, and the Supreme Court interprets the law of the land and enforces the

law of the land. So when it comes to this abortion, there's a lot of interpretation of the Constitution and the rights of human beings. And basically this decision is allowing states to decide who has rights to decide on certain things that leads federal government is not supposed to infringe upon. So anyway, this kind of this decision, my understanding, is just basically throwing the case back to the state, the right to choose and to have abortions back to every state.

So fifty states can all of a sudden now make instead of a federal mandate or interpretation which protects people rights uh as it relates to abortion. Um, Now each state can have their own presidents, their own policies, laws, and how they mandate abortions and so UM, Personally, I don't believe abortion is going away. I don't believe that every state is going to abolish abortions. I think that each state is going to decide what's best for their

state and people. We'll move around and do what they want to do regardless. So I don't think personally, I don't think nothing's gonna change. People say, oh, this is just the beginning and this and that and that, but list, I don't think nothing's gonna change. I think there are certain states. I live in California and it's liberal, and I think that abortion is going to continue as it

always now. In terms of terms, I don't know. But as far as other states, they might be a little bit more stricter and have terms on you know, like the heartbeat, so it wants to baby or fetus or umber whatever you wanna call it as a heartbeat. Therefore, you can't have an abortion unless it is under you know, certain circumstances like maybe rape or hand or disease, you know, and things of that nature. Um, But I personally don't think it's going away. UM. I don't think this is

the end. Uh efining to think that, UM, A lot of this is political and a lot of it has to do a lot of money is involved in this, um and there's a lot of old money involved in this, and people don't like change and sudden change is can be destructive and devastating, So people taking to the streets, people of marching. But abortion has been devastated in the black community, you know, and a lot of these headlines

don't address that. It's been devastating. Um. You know, we have a lot of issues in the black community, in the black family, and abortion is one of them. And you can sugarcoat it all you want, but that's been very destructive and devastating to Black women, whether we like to hear that or not. Um, this is just one more major issue that has called the devil. Has been one of the reasons the blah Black community has been decimated and this and and been affected in an adverse way.

A lot of money, you know, has been thrown you know when they started, uh, these abortion clinics, you know eight percent of them was in the black men. They you know, it was targeting black women. I'm not making this up. Do your own research. Do your own research. Black women have been targeted for these types of policies in this country and abortion and birth control. You know, they had Euphenasia. They took a in America where they was castrating the stern as and black people because they

felt that we were genetically prone to um crime. So therefore stop them from having children. Therefore we can decrease this crime. This is the historical facts of America. So we've been targeted for sterilization and birth control is one of those mechanisms that have has has been used in order to stop the reproduction of black youth and babies and families. I'm just being real likely to leave it alone.

But there's a different, different battle cries, and it's when it's not all the same, it's not all the same. So um, when it comes to this abortion, it's a real divisive issue that devised people that don't bring I don't think that people who ever don't see uh this on the same page. I just think you have to

get to the point of respect one another's position. I don't know ultimately what's going to become with all these protests and all this outrage, um, but I know that and the abortion ain't going away, and I think that, you know, let cool heads prevail now I'm gonna take it to the streets and I'm gonna ask the community. I'm gonna ask them their thoughts on this subject matter of abortion and see what the streets I have to say.

Malika is in the streets asking more people about the protests and Row versus Wade and what their thoughts of aut abortion. How you doing, man, good, good goods. Please speak to my artists about your thoughts on these protests

and abortion and go versus Way. Well, I mean I actually, um, it's interesting to see it happened, but um, just looking for results actually, you know, that's all I'm well on that meets the people halfway, you know, like, um, hopefully they can resolve it in a way that meets what the people want are wanting. What's your thoughts are? Do you agree with the Supreme Court decision? Um, they say reversing wrote versus Way, that's what they're saying. Um, well yeah,

but uh in terms of abortion, I don't know. I kind of it's up to the person really yeah, And so basically what you're saying is us up to the persons. Is your body your choice right? Exactly? Your body your choice exactly? Well, thank you many appreciate your few words. Thank you ever blessed day. Thank you. You're welcome my podcast and Malik's bookshelf bringing the world together with books,

culture and community. I want to ask your thoughts, my brother, about all the protests vote versus way and you know what the streets staying about the community, and what's your thoughts. Well, I don't really know too much about what the streets are saying, but my thoughts. I mean, a woman should have a right to you know, a boy baby, if that's what she chooses to do. I mean, so you do consider the baby right? Uh? Not really? Ok Maybe after so many weeks then I would consider it a baby.

But if if you're talking about the first few weeks or a month, you know, don't a full baby because it's not fully developed yet. So how would you consider to be a baby? Okay, what you consider the life? O mm hmm, that is a good question. Um. Well, like I said, depending on the time, I think after that, So you support abortion up to a certain time, right, Okay? Right? Okay, after a certain time, then you know, then you you

got reservations, right, right? And then also you gotta look at all the things that could happen to a woman Rabe and says all of that. I mean, how can you tell a woman to carry that child? You know what I'm saying, Then that's that's and then if she do carry the child, then that's a that's a baby that she's going to neglect, because that's gonna be a constant reminder or what happened to her. And we got a whole lot of trauma exactly. So you don't need

we don't need need more than we already have. So there have to be some just scratching and some exceptions, you know, so, but we don't. You don't think it's going away, do you? No? Man? It's you know, I'm you know, uh, I'm you know, it's crazy. I'm I'm I'm in law. I'm a federal law enforcement officer and a veteran, So it's crazy. Man. I'm kind of ashamed in this country. I'm ashamed of just what's going on. How people are us as black people being treated women,

you know, anybody other than white, right right? And it's two nations here exactly. And you know, I know they always say the Constitution was for every man, but we've been on the shoulder all the time, all the time, and I see it. I think I see it more than me being in law. For us, I see it how the court system is. I mean just its it's bad.

It's bad. Yeah. Yeah, And you heard the first hand from someone that's on the inside speaking about the disparity, the discrimination, the oppression, and so what what's are there's some solutions for us, my brother, Um, I think first we have to respect each other first, you know what I'm saying. Before you can, before you can change anything,

you got to be respect. If I respect that man, he respect me, then we can come to the table and sit down and talk and we can talk as men and say this is what I don't like about you, and this is what you don't like about me. But if we can respect each other, then we can come and sit down and say that we ain't gotta be you know. It's kind of like you know, you you throw a rocket, hide your hand. You know, it's it's a lot of that going on. You know what I'm saying.

You know that hid in hand, unseen hand in me. I got three sons, so I try to tell my sons, you know, be careful out here. You know what I'm saying, I mean, I understand, we got right, but be careful, be careful, be careful. I think that's well said. I think that's a solution. Be careful. And I appreciate your thoughts, brother,

thank you. So this episode, I'm gonna be talking to the community about all these protests about ro versus way, their thoughts and so for I got a couple of people in front of me and one name cap one name April. So hey, how you doing good? Good good good? So Hey, tell me your thoughts about all these protests and your thoughts about abortion. UM. I think that even though it doesn't directly affect California, because we still remain

with our own um, with our own laws. UM, I think that it's still very like dangerous to ban it nationwide because there's a lot of women that it would affect, mainly like poor like lower income communities. I feel like that is really affecting them more. And I feel like, um, I feel like we're putting women's lives at risk by banning it because now they won't be able to safely get abortions. And I feel like they're still going to find ways to be able to get one anyways. If

they really needed it. Okay, now what you think about um, I I agree with her just because, um, I don't think it's fair that like a generation that's not really affected by it anymore is making decisions on like young women's bodies, um, you know nowadays and stuff. So you believe that women should have the right to choose, I think they should have the right. Yeah, do you get shider that when you become pregnant, um, that is actually

a baby. Um. I think that it really it's different for everyone because some women, you know, like they really really really want a baby, so they're trying to them as soon as they get pregnant, like that's a baby. To other women, it's not the same way. Like some women are not able to fully carry a baby healthy, determined. That puts their life and like the child's life at risk. Um. Also, I don't think that everyone can like financially or like

emotionally support a child. And I don't think we should force women in these situations to carry out a pregnancy, especially like I said before, like lower income communities a lot of times, like younger girls, poor girls, they cannot afford to get an abortion, or they cannot afford to get a child, I'll have a child. So we're risking their lives by taking away their right to choose. Well,

you heard it from the streets. Thank you, appreciate you heard it live coming to you Malik's bookshelf bringing a world together with books, culture and community. Thank you. Well. I just ran into another author here at the tag Woman and she is will in to do an interview with me. Her name is Katherine Colbart, the author of Patrolling Women, What we Must Do Now to say reproductive freedom? And that is an interesting title. And I'm not gonna guess, I'm gonna ask you to die right into. How did

you come up with that title? And what is this book all about? So the book is about the fact that, unfortunately, the Supreme Court is likely to overall ROW or so decimate its meaning that abortion will be banned in over

half the states in this country. UM. It is a very very problematic event because while in the days before ROW, women with means always were able to obtain abortions, today there's already difficulties for low income women, for UH teenagers, for disabled women, for women in rural areas to get access to primary healthcare and reproductive healthcare. Including abortion, and so uh, if the Court does as I expect and overrules row, about twenty states are going to ban abortion.

Abortion is going to be banned from Georgia all the way west to Texas, from Idaho all the way south to Arizona will be up to the states to the side. And that's a big problem unless we take action now. If there's something that people can do, absolutely two things especially first and foremost, we need to build a badass social justice movement. We've learned from Black Lives Matter and from the marriage equality movement that making noise makes a difference.

And the coalition as Queen we want to we need to make sure that we can come together with our allies and fight for the things that are important. And making noise, even in small ways, can make a difference, particularly if they're's creative noise and it draws media attention. But equally important is that we need to become involved

in electoral politics. We need to ensure that the five hundred thousand elected offices from school boards to town councils, to state legislatures to Congress are controlled by people who are champions for reproductive health, so that all women will be able to have and make these important decisions free of government. Important is just what the book talks about.

Absolutely solution what people can do to Galwana. We have twenty about fifty eight different policy alternatives, but most important, we're talking about how we save women's lives, how we get politically active, and how like our sisters in Ireland and Argentina and Poland, we build a movement for change. So real quick, what would be the implications if grow

versus way it's overturned. Well, the implications are most dangerous for women's health because women who live in states which ban abortion will be forced to travel hundreds of bials to get appropriate healthcare, risking their lives and health. They also could take medication abortion which would be available over the gray in the black market, but they could subject themselves to criminal prosecution were doing so. Uh and uh.

Some women will be forced to carry their pregnancies to term and they as they did in the days before row. So none of the implications are good ones. Uh and uh. It means that if we're going to protect the rights not just to choose abortion, but to make decisions about our families, to decide when to become pregnant and to have the social supports necessary to raise children. Advocacy and assurance. That's what I did. I spent twenty years of my

career representing women in need of reproductive healthcare. I argued two abortion cases in the U. S. Supreme Court, including the most case, which was widely credited with saving and I started the Center for Reproductive Rights with with Ally so I I feel very passionately about this and politics is the way to go. If the states control this question, we got to take back the states. Very well, said oh, I appreciate this interview. I think this would be informed

in enlightening. Let the streets No Malik bookshelw just heard it from Katherine Cobo, the author of Controlling Woman. What we must do now to say reproductive freedom. Thank you, thank you, thanks for listening to Melik's bookshelf with topics on the sholf our books, culture and community. Be sure to subscribe and leave me a review. Check out my Instagram at Milik Books. See you next time,