So Karen, if someone called you up right now and said, they asked me to be on the ballot for president, what would you tell them?
I would tell them, first of all, you have to think a lot about it. And if it's something you want to do, absolutely. What I would encourage them is that you have to find your support system. You can't do it alone. You have to understand who's able to really help you throughout your role in there. And if you think that you have that in place, a support system, I would absolutely tell them to go for it. If anybody was to say, should I, I would say absolutely yes.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
You are listening to WREK Atlanta, and this is Lost in the Stacks, the research library rock-and-roll radio show. I'm Charlie Bennett in the virtual studio with the whole gang-- Fred Rascoe, Wendy Hagenmaier and Marlee Givens. Each week on Lost in the Stacks, we pick a theme, and then use it to create a mix of music and library talk. Whichever you are here for, we hope you dig it.
Our show today is called All the President's support.
The library and archival sessions are guided by leaders in various professional societies at national and regional levels.
And it just so happens that one of those regional association presidents is right here working with us at Georgia Tech.
That's right. Our colleague, Karen Manning, is winding up her year as president of the Georgia Library Association, or GLA. WENDY HAGENMAIER: We'll talk to Karen about what it was like to take on the challenge of leading our state's librarian professional society and how she tackled her leadership agenda. Here's a hint. She did not do it alone.
And our songs today are about fitting a lot of work into your schedule, getting a solid base of support, and being surprised by the call to lead. When that call comes, you may have doubts, but you also may be just the leader that everyone is waiting for. So let's start about finding your way to the top. This is Room at the Top by Betty Wright, right here on Lost in the Stacks.
[MUSIC - BETTY WRIGHT, "ROOM AT THE TOP"]
Always Room at the top, always running don't you stop.
This is Lost in the Stacks. And today, our guest is Karen Manning our colleague, at the Georgia Tech Library who works in such areas as digitization, metadata application, and digital curation, as well as being the visiting program officer for BIPOC networking. And she also happens to be the 2022 president of the Georgia Library Association, the state's most prominent library professional organization. It's a huge responsibility.
So we started our conversation by asking her how she decided to put her name forward as a candidate.
Actually, I didn't decide to run. People wanted me to be in that role. When I received the phone call that did I want to be on the ballot for the vice president for GLA, which of course, this president-elect position, I actually didn't believe what I was hearing. When you're in a large association like that, you don't really know that that's something that you even want to do or would be asked to do.
So when I received the phone call, I was unable to give an answer at that point, and I needed a while to think about it. And that while turned into two weeks. I wanted to be able to weigh my current work with the additional duties of the president. I knew it was a heavy lift, and I needed some time to think about it. So I actually received a phone call about being on the ballot.
Who called you? Was it a colleague, the current president?
They have a nominations in elections committee, GLA, and there's a chair and some members of that committee. And they gather names of people through a method. And that chair of that committee was the person that gave me a phone call, asking me did I want to be on the ballot and letting me know that the roles and duties that will come with it and making sure that I understood exactly what that role would be before accepting it.
I feel like most leadership positions come from ambushes.
[LAUGHTER]
KAREN MANNING: That's a bit of what I felt because I was riding in a car, and I'm not understanding what I'm hearing, and I'm needing to focus while I'm in the car. It was a lot, and I couldn't stop thinking about it, even driving. So I don't know how I made it home because my mind was too busy on the phone call versus trying to pay attention to the road. [LAUGHS] Although, I was able to do both. Do you remember any of the pros and cons that you weighed?
Like, do you remember the things you thought about?
Absolutely. I knew that that was a huge role. I didn't want to do it, and I didn't think I was going to. That was my initial thought-- no, I can't do this. Because I was actually prioritizing my current work in the library, and I knew I had projects and other things that I thought was taking up time that I needed to devote to, and I just didn't think that, with all of the duties of the president, it was just going to be way too much.
And magically, you might say, or fortunately, some of those projects start clearing up. I got some clarity on some projects, almost immediately, and then I was able to weight a thought again about, maybe there is room for me to be able to do the presidency. And that's when I decided that it could happen because it's almost like some things got out of the way for me to be able to take on those additional duties. MARLEE GIVENS: You've been involved in GLA for a long time.
What were some of the previous leadership roles you've had in GLA? The funny thing about that is that I had already been in a leadership role. I was a second vice president, which is the membership chair. That was something that I thought it was just bypassed. OK, I've been on these executive boards for a long time, doing the division chairs and things like that, and I hadn't even paid attention that this is escalating a little bit as the second vice president.
But it doesn't take you into the next level. It's just a role for that year. And then the vice presidency came and I was like, OK. But I had actually chaired several divisions and committees prior to that, so those leadership roles count also. But after the second vice president, I think it was a year or two in between. And then the vice presidency came, and I was able to do that. And then, of course, you matriculate into the president. And so those are some of the roles that I have had in GLA.
So being nominated to be vice president and then president the next year is not the same as actually getting it. Did you have to campaign? Did you run unopposed? Was it just something where you just kind of fell into? Or, was there kind of a time of competition?
You don't really know who your competition will be until the ballot comes out. And so I know that my competition had also had a great deal of work and status in GLA. So I just was calm about it. If it happened, it happened. And I thought, if it didn't, it was one of those things that was meant not to because I did have those-- I was a little bit worried about it.
I was a little bit concerned about it, even though I had gotten validation that the clarity that came about the work being done and I could absolutely do it. But it became another conundrum when I saw the person who I was running against because she was pretty-- she had really a lot of status in GLA. And so I was really a little bit nervous about it, but I decided to be calm and say, if it happens, it happens.
I'm just happy to have had the opportunity that people thought enough of me to at least be in that position. And then, it happened. CHARLIE BENNETT: Did you start making plans about what you were going to do before the election, or did you just put it out of your mind and wait until you were voted in to start crafting an agenda, imagining your role? When I was vice president, I took the initiative to have monthly meetings with the president at the time.
And so I made it a point to have meetings with her consistently. I made it a point to have meetings with the administrative services liaison, who would be transitioning and I would have to get another person. So I took notes for every single process and thing that I thought would be important. I asked questions about processes and why they were and all of the inconsistencies. So I think I had a great lead in from the past-- current at the time-- but the past president.
She was really a great deal of help for me in getting-- being a mentor. And also, other past presidents were reaching out to me and giving me tips and advice on what that role would be or little things that I needed to do. I had a lot of support. And it started with me having those meetings to make sure that I was well versed and understood a lot of the processes and governance of GLA.
We'll be back with more from Karen Manning after a music set.
File this set under ub210.b3.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
You just heard "Ambush" by Nilsson. That was a song about finding yourself suddenly catapulted into a situation you did not expect.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
This is Lost in the Stacks, and we're talking to Karen Manning of the Georgia Tech Library about being the president of the Georgia Library Association, the GLA. In the last segment, we talked about how she decided to run. And we continued by asking her what she decided to do as president.
And so were you worried about continuity of what-- like, meeting with past presidents, you're hearing about what they wanted to do and what they were trying to do, but also you're bringing yourself to the position. How did you balance that?
I can tell from those conversations that there was change needed. And so I started crafting out those things that needed to be looked further into because of those inconsistencies. I questioned a lot of stuff with the president. I was like, why is this? Why is that? How come we haven't done anything about that? So that gave me a lot of matters to push into my agenda for the upcoming year, and that's exactly what I did.
And most of those things that were on my agenda have taken place, and have been implemented, and have made changes and updates. So I think having that foresight into those things helped me to create or craft out that agenda. And at the time, I'm also helping the current Vise president do the same thing so she can be in the loop and understand of all of the things to help her also think about some of the things that she might want to do in her tenure next year.
So you've got to give us an example of something that you heard about and said, why are we doing that?
One of my greatest ones, one of the first ones I think that I-- well, one of them-- there was-- speaking of the presidency, the guidelines only had public librarians or academic librarians who could be nominated for those roles. And I didn't understand that.
Why are they the only types of librarians that can have the leadership in Georgia Library Association when we have so many other types of librarians, so many other types of people who do the work for the association, whose members who've been steeped in membership for years, who take up the time to do things and volunteer, their dedicated, they're committed, so why are we just limiting it to academic and public librarians? And that was the first thing I got changed. And we changed the bylaws.
We changed the constitution. And now, we allow non-public librarians to also be nominated for those leadership roles. And that's why we had an archivist on our ballot this year. She's actually-- she has librarianship in our-- she's an archivist, but she's done both sides of the spectrum of the profession. And so she's a GLA member, has been for a while, and the nomination committee, I was really proud, and they were also to bring a different type of librarian to the ballot.
So you had some ideas of things that you knew needed to happen, some agenda priorities that you needed to set. When you started your term as president, what presented itself as totally unexpected or something that you didn't think that you would have to deal with but it turned into something that needed to be on your agenda?
One of the things that is still is problematic is that when your first duty is to have a meeting, a midwinter meeting. You've only been in that position for three weeks, maybe four at the most, maybe four, and you're expected to pull off a whole half day or two-- well, now it's two half days or one of meetings. You have no idea that that was supposed to be your duty, which is that's a fallacy.
I only found out that I had to do the midwinter meeting probably in October, and it's in January, late January, early February. That caught me by surprise because I had no idea how to pull that together. But thank goodness, I have colleagues at Georgia Tech, who helped me with that process and we pulled it off without a hitch. But if I had not had that resources or those resources, I don't really know how I would have managed that any better.
So that's, to me, a fallacy that the incoming president should not have that particular duty on their plate and that it should be allocated to some other committee or somebody to already have that in place. So that was unexpected.
[LAUGHS]
Sort of a hazing to get you started.
[LAUGHS] My initiation, right, into the association as the presidency. You're right; that's exactly what we can look at it as.
I'm really curious. I mean, I'm glad that you had colleagues here where you work to lean on, but it sounds like you felt very alone and cast off within the organization. Is that how it felt to you?
That's a good synopsis of it because I did. I didn't have a clue what to do. I was panicking, actually, you might say, because I had to review-- I reviewed past agendas to see what is needed for this meeting, how do you set it up. And then, it was virtual. We used to have them in person, which may have been easy to find a place, maybe not. I mean, how do you find a place in a couple of weeks to have a meeting for hundreds of people?
But thank goodness, it's virtual, and I was able to-- something that I did differently that had not happened is I had all of the new chairs, which is another issue because you have new people all new people coming in at the beginning of the year. And most people don't have a clue what to do. And so when you're saying hold a meeting for your committee, hold a meeting for your division, how am I supposed to do that?
And so it was just that whole thing of trying to get people to understand how to pull off this meeting. And so what I did was just had each person have their own meeting within the virtual environment. But again, I could think about it like that because that was meaningful to me to know that that's-- we're capable of doing something like that.
But the next thing was the other people didn't know how to do it, so there was that extra layer of getting them onboarded to some of the processes and things that we needed to do. So I did because it's like, other than the colleagues there, really, it would have been a one-person episode, and that's not good for an incoming president.
So apart from the logistical challenges, you're the new president and you have all these logistical and workflow challenges getting all these meetings set up and making sure all the new committee people are in their roles, there's also the larger direction that the organization needs to take. And obviously, you come in with some ideas with your own agenda, do you also pick up some of that agenda from what your members are telling you?
The members, their voices are loud.
[LAUGHTER]
They will let you know exactly what it is, or what they want, or what they would like to see. For instance, with the meetings in the divisions, the complaint that comes every conference, every meeting, oh, everything is together. I can't go to this one or I can't go to that one. It's like, everyone, that's the norm for when you're setting up sessions. You're not going to be able to go, but they never let it go. They're not quite happy that they can't attend this or they can't attend that.
So they let you know about stuff like that, even though it's sensible that that can't happen. So you also get that feedback about something that may not have gone quite right. So yeah, their voices, they let you know about what it is and how they want them. But you have to also listen to the constructive stuff to improve on things. And that happens also. So there are suggestions about how to improve on things, even in those meetings or how to build out agendas for meetings, and so that helps.
WENDY HAGENMAIER: We'll be back with more from Karen Manning, 2022 GLA president on the left side of the hour.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Hi, this is Wayne Clough, president emeritus of Georgia Tech and secretary emeritus of the Smithsonian Institution, and you are listening to "Lost in the Stacks" from WREK Atlanta.
Today's show is called "All the President's Support." As our guest Karen Manning tells us, leadership brings challenges, challenges that are best met with an infrastructure of support. During our interview, we asked Karen to tell us about a time when she and her team accomplished something she was especially proud of.
When we pulled off this year's conference with the theme, you belong because we're better together, and so many people showed up. But I was so happy, and I was the proud president of these members who came, they enjoyed, they learned, they collaborated. It was very inspiring for me. So I was happy to see that all of the work that went into that planning, that it made a difference and that we pulled it off.
That was one of the things that is a huge duty of the president is to make sure that conference comes off well. And so I was really happy about that. So that was probably one of the most proudest moments of my presidency. And it's thanks to all of those dedicated people, the conference committee, who did the work.
File the set under bj1533.f8e5.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
That was "Friends" by Bette Midler. And we started our set with "Lean On Me" by Bill Withers, songs about needing support.
This is Lost in the Stacks, and we're back with Karen Manning, 2022 president of the Georgia Library Association.
So you mentioned a policy that you were able to change, something you were able to say, oh, we're going to change how we handle this thing. And then a lot of logistics and even being sort of the end of the line for the complaints and feedback. Were you able to get into ideological agenda items? Were you able to think about, where is the organization going? What does it value? What's it going to do?
Because I've got to say, for me, from the sound of it, I would just I would kind of collapse under the whole, I got to handle another conference question, I got to do another meeting. I'll let other people figure stuff out.
Well, there was going into it another foundational matter, and that was we constructed-- the past president and myself constructed a strategic plan. So I also had that foundation, and in that strategic plan, we had the themes, partnerships, collaboration, inclusion, accessibility. So I knew that I had to focus on those themes also because it was turned over to me to do some implementation. So I did have some foundational things to begin to work with.
And based on that and pushing that out to the membership, I was able to-- people was able to put their feedback into those processes, and what that would look like, and what they wanted under those particulars. And we actually had some success out of the strategic plan implementation. We were able to-- the black caucus group made sure that they created a travel grant.
The advocacy committee that's very, very robust, they merged with the trustees and friends to become a division together, where more work can be done in a more collective way. And accessibility was something that was really, really dear to me also. And that's because I know that our content and our website was not up to standards. And so getting some of that work done-- and there were people who just, they had their hands in, and they wanted to.
And then if they had things to say or wanted to suggest how to do something or to add to it, we did.
I'm wondering if there's something that you wanted to accomplish that you weren't able to or you knew it would maybe not happen this year, but it's still something that you want to do.
Two things, and that was to-- the EDI, we also had an equity, diversity, and inclusion task force. That was also part of the mentoring under the partnerships. And it was part of the strategic plan also. And they just came up with a mentorship program that they're trying to push out now. I missed the opportunity to present it at the last executive board. But I would have liked to have seen that program come to fruition. And unfortunately, that's not going to happen this year.
And the other thing was to get those virtual meetings when a meeting turned over to a committee and not the president. So those were two things that was really dear to my heart, to try to move those two things forth.
So as Georgia Library Association president, you also have your usual full-time job. It's not like you're taking a leave of absence. How do you balance working at the Georgia Tech Library full time along with managing the statewide library association?
It is a challenge. It is a great challenge. At the beginning, as I mentioned, I [INAUDIBLE] some projects that got completed, and I had some room to fulfill most of these duties. But what I wasn't expecting is that all of the issues came with being a president. That took a great deal of my time about advocacy issues, legislative issues, unhappy members, discord within the different groups. So there was all of those things that I hadn't anticipated and took up a great-- writing a GLQ article.
You have to write an article every quarter. And just those little things that I hadn't thought would have to take place, and they begin to take up a great deal of my time. And so I was spending a lot of time at nighttime doing my day job. [LAUGHS] Well, actually, I was doing both. I was trying to do the day job while I was in daytime, and then I would just, at night, I was up at night doing a combination of all of that. So yeah, it took up a good amount of time. It was a challenge.
Is there a part of you that's relieved that now you're just back as you're leaving your position, you're just back to your day job?
It's a definite relief. I am ready to pass the baton. I am happy that I was here through this endeavor. And each presidency is different. The next one may not have as many political or legislative issues. It may not have all of the inconsistencies because I believe-- and so does my team members-- that we left the association in a better place. So I'm happy on that note.
So how do you feel about it? And I mean, really, you're a person who's been in this position. How do you feel now that you've done it, that you're-- what do you do next? How has it changed you?
It has actually been a career changer and a professional development booster for me. The relationships and the partnerships that I've made just being in this role because people know who you are by your contact information, I mean the ALA chapter leadership stuff, these external types of relationships that I found with the other agencies, the white paper that I'm working on with the Georgia Council.
It's just these wonderful, wonderful relationships that has been built because of this role that I probably would never have. I am proud to say that I've left my legacy, and it wasn't just something that I wanted to do for status, but it was something that was dear to my heart also. Because school librarians are-- I'm partial to school librarians, always have been-- and then the accessibility issue. So I left two grants that's going to be continuing through a foundation for school librarians.
It's called "Adopt A School Librarian" and an accessibility grant for people to attend the conference that may have issues and for us to provide the necessary equipment and technologies that we need to have people to attend the conference who have accessibility issues. So that's my path forward as far as my legacy and wanting to leave for the Georgia Library Association.
Karen Manning, outgoing president of the Georgia Library Association and also our colleague here at Georgia Tech. Thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you all for having me. Have a great day.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
File this set under z732.g4g42.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
You just heard "Waiting Room" by Fugazi. And before that, "Midnight to Six Man" by The Pretty Things. Those were songs about trying to function properly and get work done at any time of day or night.
Yeah, because function is the key.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Today's show is all about leadership, with the outgoing president of the Georgia Library Association Karen Manning. I want to ask the show team, have you ever been the leader of something outside your immediate work responsibilities, like a professional body, a committee, a volunteer group, or something like that? What was it, and what did you learn?
WENDY HAGENMAIER: So I had the honor of serving as president of the Society of Georgia Archivists several years ago, which is another really awesome professional organization, state-wide professional organization here in Georgia, like GLA.
And it was just amazing to learn about-- meet archivists from across the state, learn about collections from across the state, and I think just really gain a lot of respect for how our profession is powered by volunteer time, by dedication to the mission, and by people's actual, just, joy about collaborating with each other. It was really awesome to witness that firsthand. How about you, Marlee?
I think it was my first search committee here at the library, and my first experience being on a search committee was being the chair of the search committee. And I do have to give a shout out to Wendy because Wendy passed along all of her documentation that she had previously used. So I mean, I've really learned the value of taking advantage of the support around me. And I also learned that I really like managing search committees.
It's my favorite kind of project management because, usually, someone ends up with the job at the end. And what about Fred?
Yeah, I have to agree. If Wendy has ever done anything, she'll have loads of documentation associated with it. You can always count on that. So my experience was, as a president of an SLA, Special Library Association regional chapter back in 2008, 2009, something like that, most of the chapter meetings that we had had to do with whether to change the name of the chapter. It was from the Tennessee Valley Chapter to the Southern Appalachian Chapter, or it might have been the other way around.
I can't even remember now.
Very important meetings, Fred, huh?
I learned that a lot of the work effort of an organization is applied towards keeping the organization going. That was my takeaway. CHARLIE BENNETT: OK, well, you all have had some real responsibilities and run things, but I am a real, "if nominated, I will not run; if elected, I will not serve" kind of person. So I'll just tell you about a time when I ended up in charge of the grounds cleanup of an elementary school, a volunteer thing.
And I learned a huge lesson, which is the best way for things to get done is for you to define the things that need to be done. If you say, well, let's go ahead and clean this up, nothing happens. But if you say, will you please pick up trash around the perimeter, will you please wipe down the signs, and will you please take that pressure washer far away from me, then things actually get done. Roll the credits.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MARLEE GIVENS: Lost in the Stacks is a collaboration between WREK Atlanta and the Georgia Tech Library.
Cha Ch Cha.
[LAUGHS] Georgia Tech, cha cha cha. Written and produced by Charlie Bennett, Fred Rascoe, Marlee Givens, and Wendy Hagenmaier.
Today's show was edited and assembled by Fred, just before he mentally checked out for the Thanksgiving holiday.
Bye, Fred. Legal counsel and a renewed subscription to the Georgia Library Quarterly were provided by the Burrus Intellectual Property Law Group in Atlanta, Georgia.
Special Thanks to Karen for being on the show and for being a great president of GLA. And thanks, as always, to each and every one of you for listening.
Find us online at lostinthestacks.org, and you can subscribe to our podcast pretty much anywhere you get your audio fix.
Next week's show is a rerun. We'll be back with a new show after that.
It's time for our last song today. The leaves are falling off the trees, days are getting shorter, and Karen Manning's year as president of the GLA is coming to a close. So as the sun sets on her great year as president, let's close with a song about sunsets and reflections. This is "Melting of the Sun" by Saint Vincent. Have a great weekend, everybody.
Fred, I don't know if that's actually about the sun.
[MUSIC - SAINT VINCENT, "MELTING OF THE SUN"]