James Dooley: So if I am a new business and I want to generate more inquiries, um maybe I've got a sales team that currently they're not closing as many deals as they probably should be, what would you recommend?
Guest: So there's many different ways in marketing advertising that you can generate more business and more leads for you for whatever your business is. It's a difficult question to answer because if you was doing let's say if you was a locksmith and it's emergency niche, generally people are Googling, so you I need to do PPC which is probably the best one for locksmiths or SEO, right, okay, but the reason why Facebook ads wouldn't work is because that's kind of disruptive marketing and it's not like you're going to catch someone exactly. They're going to be scrolling as they're just been locked out of the house or locked out of your car. So for certain industries like locksmith, I'd say it would be um it would be PPC number one and SEO number number two. People are digging deeper, let's say it was for an SEO agency and they wanted more inquiries, they would they would bypass PPC and they'd want to try to get someone who's ranking number one for SEO agency in that local area. So it could be like SEO agency Liverpool and the ones that are ranking to the top would get those type of inquiries. So I would say organic SEO in that remake. If it was mortgages, believe it or not, then places like Facebook ads work really well because you're starting nurturing them and educating them about mortgage rates going up and down and you've almost sparking a bit of scarcity like mortgage rates might be going up in two weeks. Now they don't know that they're going to be looking to get a remortgage of the property until they see that you've disrupted them and now they're going actually I might need to sort this remortgage out. They didn't know. So what you've done is you've educated them. So there's different ways. I mean on that you could be doing it with Twitter ads LinkedIn ads Facebook ads Instagram ads or YouTube ads. All them platforms work pretty well. Yeah, majority of niches though, what starts to happen, the good bit of ranking with regards to organic SEO is that these times where someone might educate them on Facebook ads but at the 11th hour sometimes they start googling best mortgage brokers locally. So I we always kind of come back to we want to try to make certain we rank him well websites organically within Google or Bing search as best we can or if we need to educate and ranking videos in YouTube. So there's lots of different ways you can actually generate leads for businesses wherever in the world that you are, whether it's local or whether you work nationwide. You need to start understanding all right, what's my demographic of client? Are they urgent? Do they need to buy today or do you need to nurture them? And sometimes it's important to see whether you do need to educate them and it could would be a six-month process before the start to actually order from yourself.
James Dooley: Yeah, definitely. And then what would you say the pros and cons of each different avenue is? So let's start off with SEO. Um, what's the pros and what's the cons?
Guest: So the pros and cons of SEO, if they if they're doing it in her, if they're trying to let's say employ an SEO agency right, the pros are that long term if you can get those rankings, I think it's the most economical way if they use a good SEO agency, it's the most economical way longterm because they getting long-term rankings, yeah. Where the next question I'm presuming you're going to say, let's say is PPC. PPC is you're paying per click but the minute you stop paying for that click it's gone. Everything that you've spent previously has gone where SEO is a long-term investment and once you've got those rankings, those rankings could stay for many many years, yeah. So th those like it's a it's a more of a upfront investment but longterm you're getting a lot more out of it where PPC is short term. It's probably you're going to generate more leads short term but in the long term you're not. So it's how quickly do you need to get those inquiries? If you need them today, PPC. If you're thinking longterm, what's the best method from financially investing, I would say SEO, yeah. But do you see where I've repeated myself saying only if you've got a good SEO agency? Now no disrespects to SEO agencies out there, but I would say 90% of them are terrible because a lot of people that are good at SEO would be ranking their own websites, would be doing affiliate marketing, would be doing display ads, yeah. So a lot of the so agencies are like fake it before you make it.
James Dooley: Then how, let's say for example, let's take a step back. You decide to do SEO. You you want to go down the SEO route. How would you pick a good SEO agency? That's a great question.
Guest: And the truth of the matter is, I would certainly run a mile from if someone started showing me that they've won a load of awards being honest with you, because a lot of awards are bought and they stick it straight on the homepage going oh we've just won best SEO agency in Northampton, our best SEO agency in Bristol and it's just like whoever's paid for the biggest tables won that award, yeah. Generally speaking, so for me it comes down to case studies, pro proving what they've done with other websites, and then ideally what I would want to do is pick up the phone and ring that client who wars that website and say did Kazra Das, who's an SEO agency that was if yourself had done it, was he the reason why you got that growth? And see what they say because if if I was the client and I was paying you a lot of money and you did give get me a lot of results, I would shout and scream you from the rooftops. I would say oh yeah, Kasri Dash is an unbelievable SEO. I really highly recommend him, yeah. But if you've not done that good of a job, that client might turn around and say well he did a bit of link building for me but actually my in house's team did majority of the work. I might go oh so he's only done a little bit of the work and I still needed in those team, yeah. I he made it out as if he's done everything.
James Dooley: So then let's say you have picked out your SEO agency, would you recommend doing a blended mix? So look maybe a little bit of your your spend on SEO, um a little bit bit of your spend on Facebook ads and also maybe a little bit of PPC as well?
Guest: I would, yeah. I'd say that um traffic diversity is important. Um I'd definitely be making certain if I'm doing SEO, I I would be getting my retargeting pixel from Facebook and Instagram and YouTube put on the website so that when someone's clicked onto your website, if they've not inquired, you then basically following them around to try to get them back to come to the site. It's actually a good SEO factor as well because return visitors through to your site is good. But sometimes they might not be ready yet to buy and if you can nurture him along the way in certain industries and be showing him case stories on the Facebook ads and stuff like that, they might just come back and then they're a much stronger candidate then because they've seen a lot more of your kind of information, videos, pictures, everything that you've done online. They're a lot more further down the pear have ready to buy, are ready to hire you for your services, yeah. So I would say yes, definitely do all of them. You you have actually got another option if you are looking to generate more leads for your business of doing a lead generation company, MH. So on a paper lead model.
James Dooley: So on a paper lead model, that would say I would even say paper lead model is le less risky than PPC because you're only paying for the lead, you're not paying just for a click.
Guest: That click might not convert into into a lead. So a paper lead model you're paying for leads, which is less risky than PPC and even even less, even more less risky for SEO because SEO you've got to try and find a great SEO agency to get you the rankings, otherwise you don't get the clicks, yeah. If you don't get the click, you definitely don't get the leads. So when you're doing a paper lead model, that is much less risky. However, like, and I don't mean to kind of talk badly of let say SEO agencies or lead generation companies, a lot of lead generation companies, from businesses that we speak to, resell that same lead to five different companies right? So you've only got a one in five chance of winning the job right? They don't really care to a certain degree. They just want volume of inquiries because they get paid 50 pound per lead. So it's 250 pound because they're selling it 5 times per lead. They just want volume of earning 250 pound. A lot of these lead generation people are being dealt via salese, and the sales people only make commission when they sell the leads. But for those who do like a rank and rent model, that we guarantee a return on investment and the only pay on conversion, we've now got to dig deeper and make certain that our lead generation model gets the client to return on investment because if the client doesn't get a return on investment, we don't get paid, yeah. And that makes us want to dive deeper into, when we're talking about plumbing, what services within plumbing is it that you do? A good example, this morning we had someone come to us and we declined him as a client because all what they wanted was boiler replacement leads, right? As we declined him, for some reason he want even more wanted to work with us. It's one of them when you turn away a girl and they come back and they want you even more. Trea your mean keep them keen and all that. But we genuinely declined them because they they had very little budget and it's it's a competitive market and we said do you know what? I don't feel your expectations are right for the budget that you want for boiler replacement. As we started to speak to him, that also did repairs and servicing, and what we were saying was it's much cheaper for us to generate the leads for repairs and servicing which can lead to replacing gaber. We can generate a lot more volume of that. Yes, the repairs and the servicing is maybe less profit, but if they did go, if one in 10 turn into a replacement where they make good profit, it's worth doing. And then they was say oh yeah we do servicing and repairs like the only sports us about replacement, and now we've end up saying right okay, well we might be able to work with you on um repairs and servicing. And then they started going down the route of oh we also do oil boilers and LPG boilers, and I thought well that's very different to your just the electric combi boilers which everyone's marketing for. So could we then build the specific site for LPG gas boilers and oil boilers? And that's when then we're digging deep, and we we're making certain we're doing everything we can to try to get the client to make a return on investment. So it's not just about a consistent flow of inquiries. It's about a consistent flow of quality inquiries that's hitting the business's inbox that I feel is important.
James Dooley: So then let's say you have got a consistent flow of inquiries, whether it's through SEO or through the ranking rs or through PPC. You starting to get let's say five leads a day. What are you doing afterwards? So what are you setting KPIs in place? What's what turnaround times is your sales team getting on the calls? Like what would what would you recommend in that scenario?
Guest: I want to make certain if any if any customer I'm sending leads through to, that they're ringing those leads ASAP. There's a there's an interesting um study that's out there that if once you get an inquiry, if you don't ring or respond to that inquiry within three minutes, you've got a 50% less likely chance of capturing that client. Now that is very niche dependent, but I want them to be making certain some some questions I'm asking is do they have a sales team? Do they have an office? Because if I'm sending it to a plumber that's actually the engineer that's out on site and he's not responding till the weekend, he's not working my leads well enough. So for that reason, I'm like sorry, you're not the right fit for us. So make certainly responding quickly is very very very important and it massively improves their KPIs of conversion. So that's probably the biggest one us making certain that we're sending real time leads, so the minute someone inquires it goes straight into their inbox and I'm wanting them at the fastest possible time possible them getting back to that client, yeah. So very very quickly.
James Dooley: So that's been all the questions um regarding the ranking r. Um anything else that you want to add?
Guest: Just really that businesses become, they don't they don't work with the end end in go like the end vision of they're wanting to make profit and then working backwards from there. And how can they make the most profit? A lot of them are just thinking a lot of like business consultants tell them because of their revenue, they need to be spending x amount of money on advertising our marketing or lead generation. But they should be setting KPIs them themselves and make it certain is what you're spending currently on SEO on PPC or on paper lead? Is that making you a return on investment? And if you don't know that, you shouldn't be spending the money. You need to know those KPIs. You need to know those numbers right. If you go to Dragon's Den, you don't have them numbers, they kick you out. You need to be making certain that you understanding how much it's costing you for the SEO for the traffic and how much it's costing you per lead, what your conversion rate is against that lead and what your profit is. And if you're making profit, keep doing it. If you're not, you need to quickly turn it off and start understanding maybe I need a better lead generation company or maybe you need a better SEO agency or maybe you need someone who's better at running the PPC.
James Dooley: All right, yeah, makes sense. Perfect. Good speaking to you. Cheers.
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