MAL SPEAKS ON JOE BUDDEN PODCAST BREAK UP

Yo, yo yo.

Welcome to the Experience podcast where you have to have the experience to be on the podcast. I am your active and attractive hosts for another episode. You know, we do everybody in the culture that has a voice that does things at are high level. Today we got somebody who was instrumental in what we know to be as podcast right for our culture. We got the homeboy mab what's going on?

I'm chilling? Man, what's good? Man?

You know, just finally all tapped in with you. Man, got a chance to come down here to Atlanta, and we've been trying to make it happen for a little minute.

Finally here, Man, I love it. I love it. I need that love. Man, the game been good to me.

And again, man, y'all, y'all all in the culture that really have a voice that I thought was real from the outside, always keep confirming to me that it is real ones in the game.

So I appreciate you stopping by no question.

You know, first of all, Man, we want to get into the business side of what it is you do.

Right. Podcasting is a big arena. It's a new industry. You know.

I have a particular issue with some people that's partying in the industry building process. We need to be working. When I look at you you down here in Atlanta right now on tour. He just told me you sold eight hundred tickets. Talk to me about that.

So, you know, Rory and myself knew Rory Podcast. Shout out to my brother Rory. We just got back from London last well earlier this week almost a lord with seven hundred tickets sold out in London at the Earth Theater. Shout out to everybody in London that came out. It's a beautiful night. Love over there was amazing, had an amazing time. Yeah, man, we were just building. Man. We're

The business side of this game is off the left side of people conversation, right, And those people that do talk about the business side, I'm not sure I see them executing in the same way that they communicating, right, So When I look at y'all, I say, yo, them dudes, I look at your brand, right, y'all been able to brand it even as far as the orange that Rory used, it's a theme, yeah, right, even the red head like

How much of that is you and how much of that is Rory?

It's you know, it's pretty much both of us, are we all? You know, even on certain things on the merch side that I come up with and my partner out in LA and and G. You know, we all collab on ideas and we just throw things at the table sometimes and whatever sticks, whatever we think is dope, you know, we run with. It doesn't matter you know whose idea it was. If it's dope, it makes sense for the brand and something that we think that people were we and that they're gonna support, Like we just

Man, And it feels like that even when y'all left the Joe Budden podcasts, right, even the approach of the clip that came out when y'all was like we're looking for work, that was just even a unique approach. Even looking back at it, it's like y'all were early on the skit type of y'all might be the only people doing that in podcasting from a creative state point, I don't know. I mean, the White Boys do it like

That's something that we want to, you know, ultimately get into his TV and film and in long form sketches and things like that, just because we have so many ideas and things that we take from real life situations, which was what the the got fired skit was when we first quote unquote got fired. So we decided to take that and have some fun with it and create something that uh, you know, we thought, we think, we thought the people would like and they they loved it,

It was like that. You know, we freestyled the whole thing. None of that was written.

That was all just circumstantial, and you know, we just came up with the circumstances and we just let the camera run.

That's dope, That's super dope. Let's get into the departure of Joe butten podcast. Let's be clear, when did you come into the Joe Buden pocket? What episode was? At first it was the name was our name this podcast? Like when did you arrive on the scene?

Do you remember?

Think it was like episode seventy seven maybe okay, yeah, yeah, And so sweat equity was mentioned, right, blood sweating tears, and your departure from there was an unfortunate one.

And it was it was ugly.

It was fortunate, right, we just talked about it, you say, you know, very fortunate, right, right. You told me when I was out there smoking, you said, loan, I would have been okay with helping home.

Oh yeah, I've always That's all I've ever been. Uh, you know, I've always wanted to be somebody that helped. Like if it's somebody you know, if I fuck with you, or if I feel like, you know, I believe in what you're doing and I see your vision and I feel like I can offer some assistance, even if it's not.

I'm not.

It's not about me getting nothing financially from it all the time necessarily. I just feel like if I'm able to which I think we should do in our culture more anyway, It's like, yo, if I if I have a plug somewhere connect somewhere where I can help you elevate what you got going on and get you to a next level somewhere, why not, because I would want

Why not? It's a win win situation.

So yeah, it was all about me just you know, getting in and trying to help elevate something and bring some type of you know, energy into a situation where it made for a complete a complete circle.

And now do you have clarity because over the last couple of months, that's been shots took by you by Joe Budden just about what y'all perceived to be the truth.

You say that Joe stealing. He said that he's not stealing.

Of course you say, I'll come up that showed me the books. Do it on your platform and then made for great content.

Put it behind your paywall. Do what you will.

Let's not put listen man, you know, and I want to be very this is not you know, I don't.

I'm not.

It's no ill feelings, it's no beef, it's no you know, it's all love.

Man. You know what I'm saying.

Like I said, at one point, you know, we was all real friends, and you know so that that doesn't just go away, you know what I'm saying. So it's not a beef thing. I think that everything happened for a reason. Uh, we're very fortunately, very blessed Rory myself to land where we landed and be able to do what we're doing right now. So everything happens for a reason.

Just keep going through this bullshit with this dude.

And I'm just like, but Rory, when the truth is on your side, everything is gonna be okay, man, you know what I mean. So you know it is what it is. But yeah, I mean, the truth is the truth. And you know, we where we were taking advantage of and you know, we had money, a lot of money stolen from us and taking from us, and it's fucked up. But you know, I mean, if that's the way it had to happen for us to be in a situation where in now, in the position we're in now in our lives, and so be it.

You don't fuck around and made you, taught you how to fish.

Yeah, I mean put you in a situation now where you went and got the information.

The thing is, I always knew how to fish, right, But you know sometimes I don't mind, you know, getting on your boat and helping you, right, you know what I mean. So you know if you felt like you know, that was your boat and you know you're the big skipper, and you know what I'm saying you, it's like.

And so but in podcast and what it be in a new industry, it's like we you know, I gotta give Joe some credit in regards to he did kind of make it not easier, but y'all together you lifted less, right, And so what I'm saying is like this new industry, nobody kind of understood how to move. Fortunately, whatever deal he placed y'all in that y'all agreed on, he and what you're saying is still wouldn't stick to the deal that he had in place.

Yeah.

I think I think when we uh looking back, I think when we signed our percentage agreement with each other, I don't think that he anticipated the amount of money that was going to be offered to us. So I think once that money came into play, I think that something inside of him just wasn't comfortable. And it's crazy when you think about it, but I think something inside of him was like he wasn't comfortable seeing us get

I want to dictate what they're able to do. You understand.

And that's unfortunate, bro, because you can't win like that. Yeah, you know, And and I believe that to see you rad and Will Rory says so much about your character just from me on the outside looking in, because I see the years from you and Joe, I see you know you on the Love and Hip Hop episodes and see how far back y'all go, and it's like it gotta be principal somewhere that he's standing on because what else would make him rad with a dude that he met alone the way.

Yeah, it was just right as right and wrong as wrong. And I mean, you know, and you know the fans and the supporters and listeners they have a very short term memory. But just go back to you know, the reason why you know we didn't show up the recorders because you know, he told Rory not to cut, you know what I'm saying. And I said, whoh you he don't work for you. You can't tell him not to come in, right like, And I'm definitely not gonna record without him, right you know what I mean?

So just go back to that.

It's like, I'm that's just me though, Like if it's something wrong, then let's fix it before any of us move forward. But me and you are not going to record without our brother, our partner.

That was the deep moment I'm talking about.

That was there right there, because in my opinion, you hurt Joe because Joe felt like.

Yo, Rory, but mile straight? But why? But why is it?

But and see that's the things that people don't know behind the scenes.

It was like, but why fuck Rory, why are you why everybody ain't doing that.

Even when you look at Parks, some of the fans to say that his position is my boat.

Everything right around me look.

Good at and you know, and and Parks was you know, I've known Parks for years, good good, good person, deep deep inside he is a good person. I just think that, uh, you know, the position that he may be in and painted himself in the corner to where he don't really have enough wiggle room to really get his ship off and say what you want to say. But that's why I tweeted a few weeks I said, Parks knows right because part of me, I've known Parks for years.

Man.

For the most part, he's a good dude. I just think that he's just a little into deep on the business in and he has a lot of things tied in with Joe business wise, so he can't really really rattle that boat and shake the tree too much. But he knows man. And those guys, all of those guys over there, all those guys in the room, they know me. They've known me for at least twelve years. They know that I'm not I never did no sucking shit, no foul shit. I've never you know, done no wax shit

By the way, it's dope. You know, that's dope. Shout out to y'all.

And you know what, when I was telling you when y'all first, when it first happened, I was afraid for y'all because I was thinking, like, and I got this from b Marshall with the episode I just did with him, well, I would have put y'all in a situation to over extend, because I felt like immediately there was this thing in the market between y'all two and he was trying to battle to look like he was still in a good place, and y'all was trying to say, Yo, we're on our own.

Y'all did that shit.

I mean, we just you know again, we don't want to go fast.

We want to go right. We want to do it right.

We want to move right, and we have a vision for ourselves and what we want to look like, and we ultimately want to end up. And I think we're doing a great job of doing that. You know, we're not running out getting a guest We don't want to be too heavily guest based every week, because then you paint yourself on the corner with that when it's like, Okay, we can't get a guest, So.

Who do we you know what I mean, who do we? Who do we do now?

So we kind of want to just show people that we can create something where we we basically wear the talent and we rely on ourselves and our own personalities to uh, to push this thing forward and then pulling on you know, guests that we really have a personal relationship with that we we kind of already have some type of rapport with and you know, just do something more creative aside from just sitting down talking like we ultimately want to move into like a TV and film

For the live shows. It'd be dope to.

Let me just try to show a little just some some some versatility and what we're doing.

Right, do you think you hurt? Oh? But do you think now?

Let me ask you this, when did you start to pivot towards Rory like hold on with something ain't right, that ain't cool?

When did when was that.

You know it, Rory and myself developed a relationship naturally on the show throughout the years, but you know, in that situation, the business and things like that, it was it honestly became a thing where it was it fell into that because we were on the same side of the fight. Like we both we both were fighting for the same thing. It was like, all right, we have this, you know, this deal there.

But I felt like he would have straightened you out and not straightened Rory.

Real but even that, I wouldn't go for it.

I know it, But I felt like that's what hurt him, right when he said I remember a time when he said, I never remember I never saw saw the day.

Yeah, but he was talking about you. Yeah, he would. I'm telling you man, something about you. Yeah, stungin.

Well, you know, we have a we had a relationship for so many years, and.

The dude is a white boy. But this principal, it's all of this with me.

I don't care how long I know you, I don't care. You know, it's principal. It's integrity, is it's honor, you know what I mean. So it's like right as right, wrong is wrong, And I'm not gonna stand there and allow somebody that because I looked at it like we're a team. We all in this boat together, you know what I mean, we stay on that stage together.

So it's so many niggas that were to roll with the nigga they knew for ten fifteen years only because it's like, what do I got to lose?

Well, that's the se but that and again that's the problem with us. It is it's like this.

And I'm telling you salute from one real nigga to another one, even if everything else I the winder. Just I'm saying that. Look like from my perspective, it's principle involved in that absolutely because it's my guy right here.

I'm man.

I was with this guy when he will raggedly ragged you I'm talking about.

Man.

If you go back and say I ain't never been rad I come out of the street with some money, you understand, no cap on that, no ten on it. You go back some you say, damn home was kind of it seemed fun now over there a little bit financially, and that's cool because we all had to come from something. But y'all help lift that. How much weight do you think you lifted over there one hundred percent of the lifting with the Joe Buden Podcast up into your departure.

I mean, I think I contributed a lot. I think I lifted a lot. You go back to some of the earlier episodes. I think that's when it started to turn just because I think the personality, my personality and my relationship with Joe was so unique and so honest, and you know, I think that that helped turn it into what it became. Even if you go back to the Charlemagne episode, Charlamagne said it. He said, you know, this thing didn't really pop until marg got it.

Yeah, I got a squashit with you as Charlamagne. Man, I know you got a little he been. He done right. He doing right by me, man, Charlamagne, Listen, I know he does.

He does things behind the scenes for people that you know, our salute and I respect. I just didn't, you know, let me finish the point though, getting to that. So yeah, I just think that the relationship that we had with each other, right, because I still don't really like saying his name, but the relationship that we had with each other, I think it was so honest and so real and it was dope to see and so many people could

And he was intentional with I'll give him some credit on this. He was intentional with the consumer facing when it comes to you, right. He was intentional with saying, man, you just too cool. Man, you dress better than me. Man. He was intentional on camera with that. He's smart enough to know what he's doing when he's doing. Now, what he doesn't say says more to me about him than what he does say on camera.

Right.

So he's somebody that's intentional with doing it.

And I'll give him a little.

Credit with trying to have the consumers accept you in a way where it's like this is my cool potum. Yeah, And it even translated to someone like a Charlemagne that was like, you know what mal is that nigga too? Now even though you that nigga, he was putting something on it.

Yeah, no, and I you know, and and again it was all it made for what it became exactly like it was all part of it was a beautiful thing. I just think that ultimately, which happens a lot in our community and on our culture, ego just killed and destroyed. And it you know, it kills from within, it destroys from within. And you know that's a fight that I can't stand in front of. Ego is something that you

You know, even speaking about about the lifting thing, there was a moment. Do you remember when he got fired from Everyday Struggle?

Yeah? What was the atmosphere? Do you remember the atmosphere? Then?

Vaguely I remember, And again that's interesting because we only got his side of the story, but I vaguely remember he came in and was like, you know, we started talking about it on the show, like you know, they they wouldn't let the creators create and you know, they won't let me smoke in the bathroom and it was just a whole bunch and I was just like, okay, whatever, you know. I mean, that wasn't my business.

And you know me no understanding the information. And I want the young creators and everybody watching this if you know my brain, if you hear and you don't know my brain. Were about information, right, We're about elevation. Anything we speak about, we extract and experience from things that we can explain so people can evolve.

That's all this is about. Right.

But with the everyday struggle situation, y'all gave him a blanket. I know, you you know, let him go on his rants. He was talking and all of that, but it was a situation where he needed y'all more than he can explain in that moment. At that point, he had just had a baby. He had just had this situation where he thought he was getting further in the building and then all of a sudden he thought he had leverage. And that's something that happens with him. For some reason,

And sat down with y'all, that was home. He still had that.

And I continue to let people know that it's hard to do a podcast by yourself. It's damnar impossible. And if it was possible, I think that he would have done it by himself.

By now.

He had y'all to lean on in that moment, and in my opinion, I just wanted I wonder did y'all know how important y'all were to him in that moment for him to be able to land right there with his two homeboys comfortable way he has conversations week after week after week and be able to talk to the fans and create the narrative that he was able to create.

I mean, we thought we were pretty important, but now you listen to the things that he says now about us, we weren't that important. So you know, I mean again, man, you know, we just try to play our part. And as far as being friends in that moment, like you know, it started the whole podcasting thing for us again, it started as therapy. It was therapeutic for us to get to get together once and twice a week and just kick it and talk about shit.

You know.

But when money comes into play, man, it changes you know, so many things. It's amazing how many things and emotions just change and sway because.

Money is on the table now. But for me, it didn't.

You know, obviously I didn't care about money. It was all about just the principles and integrity. And you know, people see, oh, if it wasn't about the money, then why you keep asking to see the counting. And it's like, because we're trying to just show, like fam, we know we were being stolen from and this is why we chose to say, yo, just show the accountant.

Let's make it correct and move forward, right.

And I want people to understand that if Joe was to sue, he would expose what needs to be like that would force a discovery, yeah, which the accountant would have to come into play.

Oh yeah, I mean he know, he he he can't sue.

He can't sue us. It's impossible.

He he knows the real and the people, the people that know him know the real They know his business practices throughout the years. They know that Maul has never sat down and you know, sat on the mic and talked bad about anybody, you know what I mean. It's definitely not somebody that I looked at as a friend. Like I hate that you google my name and it come that type of shit comes up, you know.

I mean, I don't. I don't. I never wanted to be a party shit like that.

But we know that, you know, we built something that was big in the culture, and you know, it ended the way it did. But like I said, it was a fortunate situation for Rory myself because we landed and ownership and and just you know, just respect. It's so it's just so much respect, you know, like, uh, the people we work with, you know, my guy edit videographer, my boss and my boy. Like I'm not your boss man, partners. I need you just as much as you need me,

I don't.

I don't need that. Like I want everybody to feel like they could come to me. They could talk to me whenever they want. You have my number. You can call me any time of the day if you have something on your mind, if you have something creatively you want to throw on the table. It doesn't matter if you're on camera or not. If you're in this room and you're you're a part of this, this, this, this, this brain trust in this, in this you know this

You know what I mean.

Did you did you believe at the beginning that you had an ownership deal or a partnership.

No, we had a percentage agreement. Any money that came in for the podcast we split.

Was that understood from the beginning or was ownership ever thought? Did you ever think that you owned a part of it or did you always think this was a percentage based type of situation.

It was a percentage based it was it was some excuse me for not to cut you off.

Some people try to say that you guys thought that you owned some of it.

No, no, no, no, no, we knew exactly what it was. And again that's because of the creatives. It's it's we had a contract in place before any money came into play, and we and Rory myself took a very humble percentage of very uh you know, we understood we're not you know, we don't have a name, and we weren't artists and rappers and things like that. So we took our very humble percentage and proceeded to move forward and grow it until a deal came across the table that you know,

You know, I believe.

Joe camp Pod in the same way right, I think Ish doesn't allow Joe and I have a relationship with is shut out the Ish, right, got a relationship with him over there. He reaches out to me, we speak sometimes, but I don't believe he can part in the same way.

I think.

I think Ish kind of doesn't give him the isolation type of vibe that you guys gave, right. I think you guys understand podcasts, especially the way that he podcasts, not necessarily that everything he says is gonna be the truth. Sometimes he's getting into a theatric bag and he's doing this little one too. Now, you did say that when he got into some of them conversations, you guys were sitting back like, hold on, we've been on you about some of these things that you explaining to the public.

Yeah, see it it was so many things. Like a lot of people think that that just happened. When it happened, and that was years. That was years of us trying to That was like a year and a half almost two years of us trying to get that right and

So and this is the thing, right, I'm looking at it and me just having supreme game. I'm sitting back and saying, see, sometimes you sometimes you cuss, you cuss at your mother and your girlfriend here And she said, oh my god.

Yeah, look I he talked to his mother.

Yeah, And so when you saying things like yo, I left complex because Spotify brought in a check and they didn't want to give the people on.

The show a piece of the check.

When we're the reason Spotify brought the check and then you got people on your show it's saying, hey, what's going on with the check?

Because Spotify cut a check. It's the same, it's the same thing.

Yeah, It's like, it's funny how you turn into the same people that were talking about.

But it's almost like in his brain. And that's why I got to ask him. He needs some he needs some real questions asked to him without the wiggle room.

Right. Oh, he's gonna spend.

He's gonna try to He's gonna try to spend, try to spend. He's gonna try to good he's good at spending. He gonna try to because I think he talks to you know, he has this thing where he talks to grown men, and I think he think he talking to women that he's dating. You know, you can spend a woman that you date around her, but when you're talking to real dudes, and it don't work. And that's and that's it's not gonna work with me.

So sometimes when when you know he would he would get in those modes talking about that.

I always looked at y'all.

Let's kind of speak on academics, do y'all do you think that he was feeding information to act?

Of course, man, you know, and I don't. I don't talk about that, dude, but you know, I just you know again, this this, this this media podcast thing is weird man, because these dudes will start talking about you talking crazy and you never even they don't.

You don't even know these dudes. That's what I'm like.

I'm like, who I you know what I mean, I'm not I'm not gonna get into right back and forth because.

It's like they got too much time on it here and I can't do that.

I don't do that. And it's like, you know, you I've never seen these dudes anywhere outside I don't know. And then they get online and then get on their platforms and start talking crazy and it's just like I don't even know how to do that, Like I can't because I don't know you you know what I mean. So I can't. I can't sit on here and spew that type of crazy talk when I've never even I don't even know how to do that.

It's almost like even with his situation with Rory, it's almost like he was leaving you out of it too. It's almost he was bringing you in it after a certain part. But there was a moment where it's almost like everybody was against Rory and they was trying to kind of leave ma all out. But Mal was looking for why fuck act.

With what his situation is.

But the Joe thing, you were trying to understand, why is you what's happening? And then like you said, we both on the same side creatively to try to say you already get the big piece of chicken.

Yeah, we partners. Man, You know you can't tell your partner again partners. We don't work for nobody. We wearing employees. We were business partners. We have a contract agreement, we have a percentage based agreement.

We were partners.

So it's like you tell your partner don't come, don't come to work, You at least got to consult with the other partner first, you know what I'm saying, Like if me and you and another home, you got to show together and then you text him and say you don't come into work.

Me and you supposed to have that talk before you.

You should be like, y I feel like he shouldn't come in for a couple of weeks whatever it may be.

We need to have a talk first. You can't I view you as a partner. That's why I think he didn't view y'all as partner.

Of course he didn't. It's his name is the podcast.

When he changed the name, what was y'all thinking? Then we knew what it was. That was deep, that was ego.

But that's what I'm saying. And you know what, people got to remind the tapes and go back and look at the film. It's ego. But even in the missed that we weren't tripping because we had this contract in place, and we're like, all right, it don't matter.

You can call it whatever you want.

Right this contract is in place, and whatever money comes in, this is the percentage that I get.

This is the percentage that he gets.

So you can call it whatever you want. You can dress it up however you want to dress it up. It doesn't matter to us. Whatever comes across that table. This is my cut, this is his cut, that's your cut. You understand what I'm saying, And that's how we rolled and move forward. But you know, when you start realizing that everything is starting to look like a salary. It's like, oh, yeah, I don't know salary.

Right, they keeping you at the same number.

And then okay, so I see what you saying, because he's always saying that, yo, I paid them this number even though the company didn't earn that number, but I kept that number there because I pulled money from here, there, and everywhere to keep that number. That y'all saying, now, you slick put us on a salary. It's a salary, bro, Like, come on, we're not doing that.

That's a good game salary, like I'm not and again, a good game. He tried it, that's good game. But it's like it's not gonna work with Like, I'm chill, I'm cool, laid back, notionally, I'm not stupid.

Though I didn't peep that.

I'm gonna watch you. I'm very observing. I see everything.

You know.

We just sold sixteen hundred tickets and I'm getting the same as when we sell eight hundred tickets.

That's a salary.

Home, Yeah, it's definitely what it sounds salary.

And then and then when we again, there was so many conversations of us trying to make it right because.

We knew what we had, we knew what we were building.

And you know, I remember one conversation we had and you know, he looked at me and Rory and he's outside talking and we got into it.

One day.

He was like, yeah, you know, after this contract is up, I'm gonna put you all on the salary. And me and Roy looked at each other, like, who you talking to put on a salary? But that's what he always wanted, which is what he has now. You know, you're now now and they doing more work. I mean, I love parks, man, you know, I mean I love parks, you know, And it's just you know, have you watched the show, no

Right right, and they don't usually talking now you do see it's kind of push back, like just show the numbers, listen, man, it knows like.

And that's my thing, man, you know, and I don't I don't want to, you know, I don't want to disrupt anything that got over there.

But you know, the.

People gonna see eventually, and then you know, it's just you know, it's just fucked up man, because you know, I know those guys feel like like they can't you know, kick it with me. You know they are saw ice them follow me on social media like that, Beau.

You know it's like, you know, I get it. Man, listen he being lowyer to the big home man. You know, I listen. I'm not I'm not mad at it.

Man, It's just you know, they know the real and that's the thing that you know, you know, aside from a podcast and you know now people watching you and following in social media. I'm talking about let's, you know, go back to them days in Jersey, go back to them. You know, they know me and they know him, and they know the things they've been through with him. None of them never been through nothing with me. Fucked up ship.

What make us go get our own Jersey. Man.

Oh man, it was beautiful, like you know, he he it was you know, it was a hat trick.

You know what I'm saying, Like I respect it. You know.

It's like, you know, you did what you had to do, and that was part of the story and part of the journey. Like every nothing, nothing is an accident. You know, everything has its has its meaning, everything has its purpose. So you know, I look at that now and I'm like, oh, Ship, If you don't do that.

I don't have my own jersey. Yeah. Made me go by the team. Yeah.

And like I said, I was happy setting the screen. I knew I could get thirty if I want to go get thirty. I knew I could go get there. I could go get thirty. But if you if you hot, I'm feeding you because I don't. It's no ego and play with me. Sure we get the w in the locker room. That's all I give a fuck about. I don't care about all that other shit is ego.

Ship.

I always got attention from girls, I always got respect from niggas and the streets home.

I don't.

So it's it's you know, I don't. It's like, yo, listen, we building something with a team.

Let's be a team for sure.

When you rewind the tape, like you say, the Patreon deal comes to mind. Y'all had just turned down the Spotify deal and then all of a sudden, he shows up with a Patreon deal that has some name on it that I don't even hear him, not mentioned anymore, but where he had took the podcast to Patreon. You didn't clap bet that moment. There's a there's a video going around when he you know, Rory, see Rory gave into his his his feelings in that moment just to.

Keep Rory has a better poker face. Yeah, he was like, now I'm happy for you, bro.

You know you was like yeah, because again it was so much shit going on behind the scenes.

It was done then, Oh it was for me. For me, it was done.

You know when he told Rory not to come in, and you know that bothered me.

Because it's like you was clean on how he looked at it.

Yeah, and it was like, yo, but he don't work for you, like we partners in it. And then, like I said, even if you have an issue with something Rory said or did, you should talk to me first about it and then let's let's like all sit down together, you know. And then when we had a talk that we had and you know, he said the things he said, and then you know he told me, oh, it's none of your it's none of your business, and it's none of my big I paid the taxes on.

It, and at one moment I'm sitting behind the costs.

And the other moment it ain't none of my business.

So it's like rough to deal with.

And this is what I'm saying, a lot of the listeners they lose sight of these things because you know, he's good at spending and throwing things at you, and you can't really keep up with everything he's saying.

My thing is just reminded tapes and listen. Right, let's talk about their Patreon moment.

So you're saying you didn't kind of you understood that there was a fifty two fake out.

Not only it wasn't that there was a fifty two fake out. It was Okay, here's another deal with more money coming into the show that we can and we still don't have accounting.

That's what that was.

So when he says he showed us the accounting, it's like, yeah, but you showed us an Excel spreadsheet that your accounting didn't send, your manager sent, because had your accountant sent that your account would have lost his accountant license because there was one hundred and forty some thousand dollars quote unquote mistake. I said, who We didn't even know who that company was, Like what company is that we paid this money out to? And his responsible or that was

He try to add, like this, taxes, Come.

On, man, show the taxes. See because like I said, you could you could play games, you could cook the books easy. You can't cook the book expenses. You can't do that with taxes. So you know, you know again, like I said, we're not tripping because and.

This is about the information.

The reason why, the reason why we're speaking about it is because in this space, right, they have these percentage based deals. They have these deals in place where you

I just want people to be very clear and and and business right, you know. And I want my mistakes and my situations to be somebody's learning curve and somebody's you know, elevation Like okay, I can't do that. And if you know, you and your your team or you got a crew and y'all doing business together, like you know, just just make sure everything is open on the table and everybody has access to the to the numbers and the accounting you know, where they can go in and check.

That's how it should be. That's how it should be.

Like with me and Rory, we bro we have zero money issues. Like I'm talking about zero, Like it's crazy because you know, when you're in a room with somebody and you in business with somebody, they'll sometimes make it seem like some things are so impossible and it's like stop them.

We got to talk about these companies because they do that.

It's not your listen when people start moving like that, that's a play doing that, and that's that.

Be very clear about that.

Like it's because, like I said, Rory myself now being in business with each other and having our own media company.

Like yeah, we'll fly y'all, we'll pay for this, we'll do that.

It's nothing, Bro, it's the most it's just so simple. And we we throw bullshit into the game and we create issues where there are no issues. And it's amazing to me the amount of things that we'll create and fuck up a beautiful thing. And it's like why, And then when you see the why, you like, was it worth it?

Like was that?

Like I think back to where we were headed, and he would have had if that wouldn't have happened, he would have had the one hundred men bro listen, man, that's.

If he would have been able to not only keep that and then do what he did with the girls. And because that's another thing, people that hurt him so bad. But what happened to the network? I'm just asking you what happened that hurt him so bad?

Talk to talk to the people, Talk to the talk to the ladies. Talk to the ladies, asking him what happened, Ask him what type of contracts he put on the table for them, because I don't want people to think that, you know, this is the thing where I'm trying to keep this going. Like I said, I'm kicking with you to give information about all other creators that's coming up, right, like you know, get your business right now, keep it together.

And know what it looked like you know what I sounded like when you're getting fucked. What know, when you win a percentage based contract but can't get to count, that might be something.

It's something there, it's a reason why you're not getting out of.

You, you know what I'm saying. So that's what this is about.

But but you know, I think it's just man, this shit is for me is weird. I never hear y'all speak about why y'all didn't start another podcast. Now, before we go there, let's talk about the network. Okay, the network situation. If that I think that y'all even hurts so bad as far as like image wise and and and uh far as trust and equity that people had in him and his whole just situation. You know, because he was talked, that created talking. He was rilling people up.

But see that back to the Charlamagne thing, and that's why I had an issue. And this again love Charlemagne. I think he's amazing in our culture, some amazing things. But the reason I had an issue with Charlemagne was because when Old Boy went up there to promote the show that he had on Revolt at the time, they kept talking about the podcast deal, like they just wanted to know how much the deal was just that and the third and Charlemagne said, oh, yeah, well I think

They should only be getting this amount.

Ye're like, he spoke on how much more I should be receiving. But add that to the fact that now we never got the accounting. So you see how words become powerful, especially when it becomes comes from figures in the culture that.

Have a lot. Okay, okay, I get it. So it's like, while you.

Will that you were fighting to get your real worth. It's like, Homie, I'm and you justifying that he chumping me.

I see.

You're giving validation to somebody trying to steal. And now you're putting what you think I should you putting what you think my price is on me like we're from the streets. You can't tell me what I No matter how much I buy my work from you, it don't what I sell it for it you ain't got nothing to do with you as long as so. Now how you telling somebody what you think they should be given what my cut is? And then now fast forward, I can't even get accounting, so.

I'm fighting for my real value. Now, then you tell.

A voice in the cold.

Now I don't left voice. You got a company you cutting checks? So they said, well another bout say, y'all owner should be getting this much. So I'm justified in what I'm doing.

Then I'm gonna go deeper than that. I don't know what you're saying behind closed doors. If my name come up in those rooms now.

Right, I don't know if my name they didn't know you were fighting for they man.

And that's why I'm not mad at Charlamagne. But I felt some type of way about that because it was like Nigga I'm the new dude on the block.

I get it. I'm humble. I don't you know what I'm saying. I don't. Okay, fine, but.

For you to say that, first of all, you don't never speak on what you think another man should be making.

Number one, let the girls do that, right.

Number two, it's like, I don't know if my name come up behind those doors in them buildings now in our heart and somebody say, yo, the mall dude from the from the podcast, Yo, what you think? I don't know what you're saying now.

Yo.

We think we want to give him a show. We think we think about giving them like four million. I don't give them a hundred.

Thousand, right, Yeah, that'll make you think that.

If you'll say that on Mike on the Breakfast, that'll make you.

You'll say that behind closed doors for.

Sure, that'll make you. So that's why I felt the way towards him. But you know that ship is over it, man, I'm not.

Yeah, Charlemagne does like I said, Man, I know he's disappointed in Joe.

Even when we talk about.

The next was gonna happen.

He said it when he was on.

He knew y'all was gonna happen. But he didn't know he was gonna turn on him. See, you gotta remember, Joe went and got Charlemagne too.

He proceeds. I know how Joe got his audience.

Some of that come from asks, some of that come from y'all, some of that come from Charlemagne. They all gave him access to the audience that he won't what it looks like giving anyone else access to. So when he went and got Charlemagne, you gotta remember to pull up happened? Who was there? You got Casanova. I don't hear brus say free Casanova. Respectfully, he went and got Casanova because he was into it with Takashi. You gotta rewind what's happening right when he got That's an over

This was helping your brand, bro, This was.

Helping you absolutely. And I think that Charlemagne didn't think that. Damn, he didn't start shooting at me too. He knew that he'll keep fucking with marble. Rory, you your head Gray. It's like he felt that everybody felt that you. He looked at you in a different light. He felt he felt different about.

It because our relationship was different, you know what I mean, Like it was a it was a lot of years there, and you know, he could say what do you want about it now? And you know certain things I'm hearing him say now, I know that he's that's just his way of like being all the way trying to just throw anything at the fire now. And it's like, bro, none of that is gonna stick. Cut it out, you

Yes, he's a thief. You still won't say his name, man, That that says a lot.

I will never say his name.

That says a lot. Nah. But that's I'm just you.

You hurt man. No, it's not that I'm hurt. I'm not how you won't say his name then, because I don't even want. I don't because it's not about it's about the situation. It's not about him. It's about the situation of what happened in the show and the company and everything that we had.

But it's not about him.

I don't have. It's no beef, it's none of That's.

What I'm saying. Disappointment. That was your guy. Thought you had that, Oh yeah, for sure, locked up with that nigga. So it was love then look what happened.

But that's what I'm saying. But it was only love on one side. It was love for me anytime anytime anybody you know has a relationship with me, I have a relationship with somebody like you know, you see you look around me. I got a lot of dudes that I've known since I was nine, ten eleven years old still around me to this day because I'm the same person I've been my entire life, Like I've always shown love, always shown respect, you know what I'm saying, Always kept

If he always wanted to be that guy, for sure, most rappers want to be that guy for sure.

And that's that's why I said it. And that's that's fine. I'm not gonna get in the way of what you see for yourself. If you feel like I'm in the way of that, I'll.

Step out the way, Homie. I'll let you have it.

I'm not gonna argue with you. I'm not gonna battle you. I'm not gonna go to court and try to sue you and under and if you and this is another thing, rewind the tape he set out his mouth.

If we try to start the show, y'all, yeah, I remember that.

You know what I'm saying, So you gotta these are the things that you know. I'm just like, you know, the listeners and the supporters are very They lose sight of a lot of things. But it's like just rewind the tapes.

I can imagine y'all being disappointed. If you're asking for accounting, then cashp Logo pops up, then the network pops up, then Spotify.

Thing you know is already happened.

But in his mind, they only wanted to do a deal with him.

Well, I'm a partner.

He didn't feel like. He didn't feel like it was because of the podcast.

It's the same fight he was saving a complex. It's the same fight he was having with Shady and.

The slaughter House group. He asked, He asked pauling them for accounting.

So I don't understand it. I know you though you're not.

You're not gonna unders then, because it's gonna the goal post is gonna move when it has to do with him and and him having it having to show his character.

Did the network start why y'all were y'all were still there right, Yes, yeah, y'all carried the network?

The network was, y'all wasn't no show another show was?

The network is literally just his YouTube channel. No, I'm being serious, bro, The network is literally because again a lot of people didn't know.

We didn't So what about the funding of the other shows?

When he paid, you know, shout out caring he paid Karen, when he paid Mandy?

Did he paid it? Where you? Where did you think that money came from? And I know, but did he pay him? I don't know. You can stand okay, so, but but you're saying that the podcast was the network. It was the anchor.

If it's no, if there's no podcast, there's no none of the other ship.

No, for sure, it was the anchor. We definitely came to.

So this is what I'm trying to say, is you know the networking, it's just a YouTube channel, homie that was built off of the podcast. But in his mind, because he had that YouTube channel, since he had his videos up there, that's why he didn't want to pay us on the YouTube.

That's fun. We can go back. We can go back and look on YouTube.

You can literally see what videos bringing in, what money monetizing.

Yeah, and that's what makes them great.

So it's like, okay, tell you when subscribe with Spiked, it tells you all of that.

I feel like, this is your channel. You started this back in the early two thousands.

Ain't keep that over there because we know what that was bringing.

Little enough, Let's just be honest.

Starving.

Right, But once you start putting this podcast on there, we're.

Looking at a little something coming in there. Just what was the conversation about not being paid from video? So and my understanding is correctly, he only monetized. He only paid you guys to monetize the audio.

He did not pay out for the video. You didn't get nothing from YouTube. I don't know a deal like that. I've never heard of.

Of course you don't.

You don't get nothing from the video and your talent on camera, you're recording me but not getting me nothing from video. It's crazy, Joe, I gotta talk to you, but that's crazy.

All of the things that we humbly said, Okay.

When y'all asked for video money or hey, what's up with what? What was the conversations then.

His manager said, no, it's not happening. He's not paying here for that. He said, okay, no problem, humbly, ain't no problem. This is what I'm saying you how long you.

He didn't even say that money i'm giving you no counts as the video.

No, no, no, no, no, you're not getting paid from video at all.

That's wold, that's.

He's and you're monetizing it in my face. You got six cameras in my face. It is wow, and my face is still up there, and y'all, and you know, Fred Taylor, I believe got a law, a settlement of some sorts. I think he was talking about like him and b did some business to like, Yo, I need some of that for sure, I'm gonna take that down. Yeah, you know what I'm saying. He said, Well, I take that back. He said he didn't want to take it down and be probably be gonna.

Just cut the chick.

But that's you know, their relationship is probably different, and it's probably not too much ego between those two gentlemen or it's not, you know, they probably it's just they're not dealing with the type of person I would be dealing with if I tried to do that. So you know what again, but the important.

Thing was it was all for the culture and us.

Building what we were building, and Rory and myself didn't want to interrupt that.

Man, So we dealt with a lot man like that's heavy. Yeah, but this is what I'm saying.

So we got six cameras in my face, monetizing twice a week on YouTube and telling me, you're not paying me as wild.

But we did it because we saw the value and we didn't want to disrupt it because we like then we see that.

And he would always say, you gotta stop. Mm hmm.

I'll ask you what I asked, Fred, when y'all left the show? Were you trying to tank the show?

No?

See, when we left, when we left, right, I had Uh. It was because he had told Rory not to come in, and you know, I didn't like that, and then I showed up at the studio and you know, we had to talk. And then when he told me it was none of my business. To me, it was over with at that point because I can't unhear you say that, you know, And I can never sit down in the room with you and act like, excuse me, act like you didn't say that. So when I left at that point,

Da da da da da.

Let's all go to our corners and we're gonna get everything right and then we'll come back and you know, we'll we'll we'll, we'll reconvene and and move forward. Like we just take a pause. Everybody go to their corner, all right. Cool. Next thing I know, three days later, he got these two new dudes recording episode. And I'm like, we just had a talk at your crib and you said we're gonna take some a week off and get

Cool.

And then when we were supposed to get we end up going back and we did two episodes. And in that time of that two episodes, we only did that because we were being told that the accounting was being done and was on the way, and that Friday was supposed to be when the accounting was going to be sent. And then when that Friday came, his manager reached out and was like, yeah, he said that that is the accounting and that he's not sending nothing else. It's literally

That's crazy. That's wow. So so niggas is crazy. So but this is what I'm saying.

But then but then you got yourrrrrr, your manager in the room when we don't show up and you yelling at Rory's fired and all this. I hear his manager told me, I told you you was paying the more than they was more than you.

Supposed to be.

Yeah, who because we went and got a motherfucking a multimillion dollar deal. Serious ex So who was he overpaying?

Right?

Because he said that he was being more generous than he should have been.

And all of that. I remember that. Yeah, how does he know? And he not a partner and you don't know or is he a partner too? The manager?

Yeah, he's he know what he he know what he's taking. He know he know the money that's being stolen.

He knows that. Bring the paperwork.

We don't have to do none of this again.

Right right? Right? Should account? I would shoulder. I would show he can't. Yeah, he can't.

I will, I would show it he can't.

That's why I never heard you speak about why y'all didn't start a podcast, why y'all were there or spin off for speak to some of those narratives that people say, Yo, they didn't create the value outside of sitting on camera with him.

We didn't.

Because I'm looking at it.

Yeah, especially when y'all I'm talking about why y'all were there, but in my opinion, I would say with damn they they were fighting for the money from what they were doing. I don't see how you can create something while you're still saying, hold up, I ain't properly paid for.

Yeah.

See that's the thing again, people don't. I don't know how clear we you know, we talked about this a few times, right just for like the creators. If you have a you're starting to show with your homies in a basement, you know it ain't no no money involved, no nothing, and y'all building something, and y'all look up one day and y'all got a fucking audience and people tuning in, and you know now, you know, people are starting to reach out and things like that.

You see it now.

Now it's becoming a business, and y'all have a contract with each other and say, okay, this is the percentage that we're gonna split. This is how we're gonna bust it whatever bag comes. This is how we busting it down.

Right now, when the.

Bag comes and you don't see the numbers that's coming in, and you don't see what's being paid in and paid out, you don't know what if you get in your like it's like home hold on. Before any of this became a thing, we had this contract. But again you're talking to somebody that has said that they don't honor contract.

Right, and then I've seen when you said it back to him, and then he didn't receive that the same way.

Of course he can't.

Because anything if you tell somebody like listen, this is something that you said, and then now you're moving like this is something you said and they know that, the people gonn look at you like, oh, that's fucked up. Of course you're gonna try to act like you never said that. It's like, bro, I'm not I would never sit him live about anybody. You're on camera saying that before.

You stand what I'm saying.

So it's a it's a lesson learned, and you know, to other creatives out there, you know, just be careful man, because you.

Know, no know what it sounds like, you know know what it looked like, you know what it feels like.

You know what I'm saying.

And the more important, something don't feel right.

It's something not right right.

And when I when I when I look at it and think about y'all, sometimes I say to myself, that was one of the best shows ever to be.

Created, man, And it was that podcast was.

So chemistry, the depth of it, the time y'all put in it, Man to just evolve it amazing.

It was amazing.

Bro.

We have some great, great, great times man, last great ship. But you know, unfortunately, like we've seen time and Tom always Bro, you know that money come into play.

Man and break the pool balls.

Man, it just it's you know, but that's it's a deeper thing with us when it comes to money and things like that. It's just something that we can't get past. Like we just always feel like we got to do each other dirty or do each other wrong when when when money come in, because you know, for some of us we've never had. But but to me it's the opposite, Like I I can't do you dirty behind something I never had, because it's like I don't.

I never had it.

I'm not missing that shit.

I never had it, right.

So when you do me dirty for some shit that you never had, it's weird, super weird.

Say, nigga, we.

Never even had that type of money, Like, why would you do your man dirty for that type of money when you never had it? So it's like, nigga, what does it matter? You was able to survive thisislan without that type of money, understand, so to do.

It's just weird. Man.

And then, like I said, I've seen how things look when now on this side, when you know business is.

Done, you're more happy now.

Oh my god, it's you know what me and Rory are doing, man, is again we were moving at our own pace, were creating at our own pace, were doing business at our own pace.

Man, it's beautiful, man.

And you know, traveling the world doing these shows and getting out here touching the people and having these one on one conversations with people that tune in and support weekly it's humbling, man. You know, it's humbling to go to the UK and people that that's a big move. Yeah, man, I mean, you know how long.

Y'all been on y'all loan not even that long.

To be a septemberated year.

What yeah, one year, one year and you in London And that's fucking dope, man.

I mean, man, if these other podcast niggas don't salute that, I salute that.

But that's why I'm sitting here with you for sure. You know, a lot of niggas don't fuck with me, man, I think because they you know, people don't fuck with you when they see everything that they're not.

In you, right, and they intimidated me.

It's like, you know when they hear me talk and say, oh, you know these niggas suckers that they know I'm talking to them, but I don't know that because I don't know how exactly. So you know a lot of niggas don't you know, they don't they don't speak to me, and they don't you know what they talk crazy about

Uh.

You know, we're having a lot of fun with this ship, man. And I promise we got so much ship that we're putting together, man, and that we were gready to jump into. Man. And it's it's gonna be you know. We the people see it though, They see what we're carving out, and they see the lane we were going into for sure. And you know, we we have the we have the right people supporting us. We got the right people behind us.

You know, we got the right We got the right people behind them. Sure, how strong is their brotherhood between you and mam? Did that make y'all strong? I'm sorry you and Rory? How strong is that brotherhood between you and Rory? Did that make y'all strong?

Going through that? Oh? Yeah absolutely? Man.

You know it's like I said, Rory and not myself. Now, we just sometimes we don't even have to talk. We'll look at each other. We just know what it is on top. Yeah, like, oh man, here we go with this shit. But more importantly, we just we just know what we ain't going for, you know, no holes, just like we not even entertaining that.

You know, when I look back at it too, I want the young creators to pay attention to this is a very important situation. You guys operated in a certain way, holding on to information that you didn't have account that money was coming in at some point of time, and even if it had stopped coming in, there's logos popping up, there's Patreon, but there's certain things happening, and we're still waiting on accounting from a couple of years ago.

And so that led to frustration.

But you guys operated with that information as best as you know how. And everybody talks about y'all and how y'all acting on camera and maybe our wordiness enthused as they thought you should have been, or involved as they thought you should have been, But nobody ever talks about how Joe responded to when y'all had the conversation with Parks about something ain't going right. I think Parks when it said something which Joe responded in a way that.

Was oh, that's when he told Rory, you have to come in. This is a problem. Now.

As the boss, how you handle that information is very important, right, you don't come emotional like that as the boss.

But the emotion was there because see what it ultimately was. We were in the studio and you know, Rory and myself were like thereafter Homie had left and the staff started talking to us because they weren't comfortable talking to him because whenever they talked to him about things that's bothering up or you know, money or being paid or things like that, it's always meant with anger and yelling and.

Things like that.

With us, they know the energy is different, so they decided to start having a conversation with us and and and and voicing some of their discrepancies. So we was like, oh, we're like, oh shit, we didn't even know that that was happening, Like all right, Will.

And then you know.

Parks being who you know, he's friends with Homies manager, and you know, he decided to after that meeting to call him and tell him, hey, some of the guys are not happy. And I guess Homie felt like that was Rory's dealing but it wasn't right. So when he told Rory not to come in, it was based off because he felt like Rory had started a meeting, and he didn't. We was just there and we left the studio late and the guys decided to kick it with us about the situation.

They felt a way about it.

It's not our fault that they're comfortable talking to us about these things.

Right, and he and see people never said, Yo, Joe, you ow overreacted to getting information that your people are unhappy. As the boss, nigga, what you think I'm supposed to do with my family?

Come tell me they unhappy?

But you know why, because he felt like he wasn't in the room so he couldn't spend narratives and dance when people start saying what they're unhappy about. He felt like, no, I need to be in there, because he.

Said, he felt it was cowardly.

He don't understand it, don't no matter what you your family unhappy. So at this point, as the boss, as the father, as the head that you say you is, you're supposed to take that situation and comb through it and not come back and say.

You only only that's nervous energy. Somebody start acting like that, and you know, found the gold.

Nig I thought I stayed that's.

What That's all. It's nervous energy.

It's like, oh shit, and that start confirming to you, like, oh, I'm from where I know what this means and you won't show me. Of course, man, I'm putting two intwo thegether.

So not only do not only are we not we know we getting fucked, but now even the.

Staff I feel like they getting fucked.

Oh yeah, we know what this is. And and that's why for me, it was whack for Parks to take that stance, because Parks knows and I've said that on two Parks he's he's had and and and that bothered me because when when we had our meeting outside at Park's crib, he pulled Parks outside and he asks Parks, he said, yo, do me and you have any money issues or business issues? And Parks said no, without putting Park's business out there, that's a lie of known Parks.

So you say he's.

Into deep and I understand it, and I'm not mad.

We don't he but do you think he got the talent that you and Road ricat.

Though as far as personality, yeah, I don't know.

I don't know if that's do you think I'll rephrase the question.

Because he's played off camera so long, does he have the ability to pivot in the way that y'all did because y'all faces were so recognizable by.

Being on camera for five years. I have a hun it was.

I think that Parks is. I think that he's super talented. He's super he's super smart when it comes to music. He's like a super nerd, right, And I say that respectfully. You know, he he's a hip hop head, very talented. I don't know if I don't know if he wants to be a personality. I think that his passion more so is in the music mixing, uh, you know, playing,

Congrats.

I didn't you know, I didn't speak to them since that day and I haven't spoken with anybody over there, So congrats to him. And again I want to be very clear, it's no beef with anybody, you know what I mean. Life is amazing life is beautiful, My car is beautiful.

You you selling that ship? Yeah, I mean we you.

Know, it's it's who I am, man.

It's I mean, you can teach how to fish in there you went and got the information.

Yeah, and that's why I'm here.

Most importantly, man, I want creatives to know, like you're gonna run in the roadblocks, it's always gonna be some ship in the game that's gonna you know, tell you yo, fuck this ship, just you know, walk away?

Nah?

Yeah, how to identify some of these ship.

Just I'm just telling you what to watch out for, what to be careful for. It's gonna happen. I don't care how long you feel like Homies was homies and this, that and the third. When you know you you want to know who your friends are. Put some money on the table.

Man, it's gonna expose it everything.

It's gonna expose it every time. And then you're gonna see what somebody think about you. You're gonna see how much they feel you worth. You know what I mean. You it's it's you know, go to the bathroom. Youre gonna come back. That pile won't look a little.

You're gonna put something in pocket. It's just it's crazy, man.

It's like, you know, you start seeing it like that, I thought these was the homies and you know that's life. That's a that's just a life lesson. That's why I said, you know, it's it's no, it's no, it's no, it's no hard feelings.

No one ever see y'all make it up. Nah, it's over with. Yeah, I'm cut from a different type of texture too. Yeah.

And then like I said, he started saying too much after that, where it was like, you know, homie, we know you stole money, Like you can start trying to create these narratives all you want, and we don't have no resume.

And you coddled coddle to me.

You coddled me.

Niggas you crazy like niggas that know me, you know, you know what's funny, like people that really know us.

And then they heard that, they was like, oh, yeah, he just he gonna do anything but just tell he's gonna start saying anything but.

The truth at this point.

And that's why I'm just like, you know, you coddled me, Like all right, man, Like if that's the that's.

What's the nature of the relationship. When did jaill? Like what what is he? What? What makes him even say that?

I guess because like I was, you know, the house that he was renting he needed help, well, well yeah, I mean he needed help on He always had roommates and things like that, which is not you know.

It's not a bad thing, but it's it's it's rough to identify that as you know, coddling somebody, if that's what that means.

In his and in his mind. I feel like he felt like I had to live with him, like I was homeless or something.

I don't know.

I don't know what type of story he's trying to create to justify his uh him stealing and or him doing whatever he did. I don't know. I don't really care. But the facts are the facts, and he know what the facts are. Like Homie cut it out, like you know, it was never that you know, wasn't that. You know me very well. I was never without anything. If I want something, I had it or I would go get it.

Like you know, I think if y'all wanted to tank the show, like if y'all wasn't really trying to like make it work, that y'all wouldn't even done that Patreon like show up over that at all because, in my opinion, and I said this when I was speaking to Beat Marshall, one of the biggest tricks or one of the biggest coincidence coincidences I'll say in podcasting, is Joe Budden was able to transfer that audience before y'all left, right, He was able to take all of that interest that he had,

Maybe? Two? One? Uh?

I think the deal was signed in January. In the February March is when we left.

Did he did you know about the deal before he announced that? How?

How long did what did you guys know about the deal before he announced?

Uh?

Maybe a couple of weeks and didn't even that deal. Like I don't even know. I'm I remember he came in and was talking about something he was paying us in crypto or something like that, and then come to find out the deal we were we were supposed to get. I think more than that, Bro, I'm telling you, it's so much shit that I'm more than positive that we were old. But you know, I got people that call every week. You know why you ain't, why you ain't soon,

And you know what, Like I said, I pointed out their principal move you made.

That's say, that's say a lot.

Yeah, man, like I don't want to sit in no courtroom.

And and man, I stopped fucking with my famous home boy. Who would have who would have kicked the white boy out the car kept me in the car. I stopped fucking with him because he wasn't keeping it solid about the situation. That man, come on and if Joe k argue with that, bro. That's that says something, bro.

And that's what I'm saying. He knows me. He I'm the same dude that sat in the cell because you had pills in the car. I sat in to sell with you for a weekend.

Come on, man, I never I don't pop pills. Come on your behalf. Man. I sat there with you. I was, I was sitting the screen, man, I was.

I was always that guy like I don't. I don't because I know. See, you know what it is when you know who you are and you secure within yourself, comfortable, you comfortable, and not only that, you know that if I really start getting my ship off in here, these niggas gonna get upset.

I can get thirty easy.

They gonna they gonna get mad, they gonna get mad. It's like, now you know, I set the screen. But then it's like, you know, when I start getting my ship off, you look like you set in the screen, but you really pushing it. It's like you're really coming out, you really pushing that nigga yourself.

I'm still getting off, but it's like you ain't.

Really as I'm still I'm still knocking them down.

Like, so, you know, you gotta be very and that's to these creatives. Man, you gotta be very careful of how much you show and when you show it, because when people see what you really got, they'll close them doors.

Man.

Sure, And that's what that's what I find. Like, even with somebody like Joe. I know, everybody around Joe and all them people they say, you know, man, I'm I'm gonna tell you, man.

We're gonna get I'm like, yo, I don't.

I don't see him shed light on anything that he doesn't benefit from, right, So I don't see him shed And even I tell you what I heard him say one time, he said he went to a dinner with a creator and the creator asks him how do I get ads?

And he said, you want me to tell you how to get ads?

And I to spend all my life doing this and you want me to just pass you the information. And I'm like, yeah, that's what the big homies supposed to do, right. So what happens is that's what I'm saying, And it hurts. It hurts the young creators because he talked so much creator talk.

You see what I'm saying right now?

You know, I think I think, you know, you know, like I said, he has this unique I'll give him this. He has this unique ability to take his friends and or do a podcast amongst his friends that translates good on camera.

I'm not sure if everyone can do that, right.

I think that what he what he's doing now is different than what he did then. I think that when I look at the show that he has now, if you said you don't watch it at all, no, damn, I was gonna ask you, uh, do you do you even think that them dudes are good at pard?

Do you think?

I mean, I know those dudes, I know, I know, I is you know, he's he's in tune with a lot of the music, a lot of the new music that's out here with the young the younger generation. He's always been at that dude. He's always been the music dude that just listen to everybody.

Just because you know music, don't mean you can pond.

No, that's that's true.

But it's is A.

He's a he's a he's a he's a smart guy. He's a he's well spoken, he's articulate.

You know.

But I think I think that what he's trying to do is recreate the fact that there's a lot of years, there a lot of history amongst them, so that trying to reach that, which is which is important in podcasts and having the chemistry, having a real relationship with people that helps. I just think that I just think that they are kind of like I know Is more than anybody's looking at him a little funny, you know what I mean.

I don't he don't do to him.

I give him that, Oh yeah, because it's just he's he's he's very strong, opinionated.

He's an opinionated guy.

But I think more importantly, I think that you know, Is has a history with him as well.

Where's like, I'm watching you.

I'm watching you like I know because if you if you did it, if you did it to Mall, you definitely do it. But you're gonna try to do it with me, and it's going to happen. A zebra, a zebra can't change the stripes. Man, a player can't change his game and the knife and you know what I mean, it's just a matter of I think the only reason why it hasn't happened yet it'll be too obvious, you know what I mean. So it's goning it's gonna drag out a little longer because it'll be too obvious at this point.

But it's gonna happen. It's gonna happen.

I'm already I'm already hearing things, you know what I mean, I'm already hearing what he was trying to pay those guys to go on to.

I'm already here. What happened to that? That too?

Would have wait, I don't know, man, tool wouldn't have fuck away. I know that about tickets. They send me my money back.

Yeah, I don't know, man, you know, like I said, I don't I don't know what's going on over there. You know, it's Rory and Maul for over here.

I'm coming to the show tomorrow too. Man, pull up. We're gonna have fun.

Man, listen. That's the that's the beauty about this thing. Man. We uh, we just were moving around and we were trying to just like I said, you know you you DM me. I've been watching you. I've been seeing what you do. I love your episode with a Little Baby. That's a show that I you know, I'm super proud of it. I came out here when he shot the video with Saint John. Yeah, for Trap, and I told the homies back in New York, I said, said that niggas official. Man, I like the little baby move. I say,

He always on the right side of man. You know, it's family. You know.

He put me in the hell of a position, you know, to roll out that album with me a number one album in the world at the time. It is like reaching and giving me that look. It's like, man, look you that ship you doing. We got to turn that up. And what's been happening here is the coach is doing that and that's so important.

Man. It's like, damn, I he's so now. You know.

I always tell I always tell baby like I'm in debt with them for that, just on the strength of they could have win anywhere in the world.

Man, dude, can go anywhere in the world.

Man, Not only did they do that, they called me and said, put that motherfucker out first, like days before we even start doing media. You know what I'm saying, All of that so important.

You know what I'm saying. I'm like, damn man, these are.

Some real such See that goes back to what I'm saying. People are trying to make it seem like that's impossible, hard to do.

Na.

This is coming from the dude that got the number.

One hour, you know what I'm saying, and he giving you that look and said put it out first. I wanted that to be the first look. You see how simple that is. But when somebody want.

To do it, they gonna do it. They're gonna do it right.

That's why we'll get the companies and we'll get off all of that, just get into business and companies and shit. That's why some of these companies they try to say certain things like you'd be like, yo, you got to have a budget, like we need some money. But some of these companies, you know, they'll want to participate and not really have act like they don't have a budget. Were a company can't find no money, Well, we didn't know, listen, if this was Jay Z in front of you, a

We'll get you some ads right now. Fuck yours.

I already gotten money and I'll reach out to the companies myself exactly right, because we have reach with each other. A company can't get in touch with you in the way that I did. A company couldn't get the little baby interview. A company can't get bag meet Mill, company can't get Fred Taylor, Brandon Marshall. You know, Andrew showed Charlemagne who up Wilo Like, no company is involved in that. So we got to see the value from the company

Yeah, do y'all have the value that y'all want? With Serious?

Do you do they understand y'all vision as well as the design people that work with y'all.

I think they do. I think that was why we went with Serious. You know, we sat with our agent and the relationship was there, and then they understood what we wanted to do, and and the one thing that they said they loved the fact that, you know, what we were building. They wanted to just be a part of it and they wanted to help enhance it in any way that they could. So that was why we chose to go with Serious, because they just understood what we were doing.

And they just believed in us, the US.

Do you do you for people like at who called cap on the ten million dollar number?

What what do you say to that? I never I don't know that dude. Yeah, well, what did you say to the ten million dollar number? Was that even a number? Y'all? Put?

Where did they get that number from? So that announced number or reported number? Someone?

No?

I think I think what happened was, uh, my brother Bigs, he had he posted a tweet when we we had a photo shooting in interview, we did went out and the picture we were smiling, we were laughing, and I think bigs his thing was, this is what a fresh ten million dollars look like? Big yeah, So you know they that that kind of is what people started running with, but it's not. It's not far from that though, right shut out. That's all selling tickets.

They can cap on line. They can act like we're talking about who gets some tickets?

So I mean we talked about who could just come.

Outside exactly period, fox some tickets. Okay, you even go to the store with this podcast, And that's why.

I'm just like, you know, I'm still trying to figure out what this online ship is, right, because it's a weird area. I don't play this game, so you know, when dudes starts, I'm like, is he for real?

Is like is it really on?

If I see him? Is it just for something playing right? Because I don't know and ain't nobody else playing right.

So you know, dudes like that when he's talking and you know, he said things and I'm just like, I don't know this, dude, I don't so I don't know what this is about him calling cap on the ten million. Okay, I can confirm that it's definitely not far from that at all.

And his part is a snooze fist. I'll say that it's a.

But his but see, And this is another thing where you got to look out for. Like, I like what you do because you sit down with the right people, right, and you had the right conversations. You know, dudes like him, he's just he's a fan. He just want to be affiliated in a round, right whoever he think is cool because he's not right.

So you know, you say the same thing Rich Homie Kwong said. He was like, I kind of went up with a minute. It was like, I know, we got a big platform, so I go through that.

Yeah, but I mean a big platform.

You know McDonald McDonald's a big brand that ain't good food though, so it's like.

Just readily available.

It's just yeah, it's just like that don't mean that's good for you.

And you know, I always talk about them guys being the first people to do it.

It ain't that they were chosen. They were just here first.

They just had a camera first, had understanding the YouTube first, and so the they're familiar to people. These guys don't have any context to anything. They don't have any real equity in the culture.

What what what is what? What through a lot of these dudes, What are they bringing?

What are they doing? What game? You're getting? What you're pulling from it?

And it's and again, I just don't I don't like when you know, motherfuckers sit down and bring a lot of negative ship right mix, right, because we come from that, man, and that ain't nothing to play with, that ain't nothing to try to you know, throw fuel on that fire because you know, it's you know, it's just not it's not something that I want to even try to entertain because it's just I know what that is, you know

You going fine, it's like bro, you.

But see if there's an old saying that people who never take war always want to get it going. See, they ain't never had to deal with the results of that exact, they ain't never had to lay in that bed, so they instantly want to how man Like I was just seeing they put rappers against each other, and it's just it be so much shit.

I'd be like, yo, they can go to war man.

Yeah, you at the house and playing.

Game Twitch ten hours a day. I don't understand it.

And that's why I can't. I can't support that.

Now.

I'm happy that a black man is able to, you know, make a living and support his family, support it.

So but at what.

Costs, right, and get around some niggas to get some game because you bullshit and you done had all this audience, ain't done nothing with it.

This man said they had a podcast a year.

Granted they had a brand moving into it, but they on tour already been in the UK probably the sold x amount of shirts, this amount of product, on this amount of people on Patreon like it's it's shit happened to here? You is with an audience. Ain't done nothing with it this seven year, just sitting there on Twitch drunk.

And still ain't and still can't come up as a.

Party in the industry building process. This is a new industry. Billionaires would be created, these niggas getting drunk, right, I don't even get it. Bro speaking of that, look at Yay, let's talk about that Yae. To me, it seemed like like I just tell you, he trying to break the chain. Yeah, Now how far did he go for that? How much did he risk for that?

Is? Can he come back from that? See?

The thing is, and what I don't think Kanye, excuse me, ya, I don't think what YA factored in is that black people we are so unorganized, We are so organized, and I don't think that enough of us are gonna back Yay and support Yay.

Right, you know, but he's kind of been all over the place with his message too.

Yeah, he's been a little all over because you know, I think Kanye has this thing where he's I think that he you know, I've always said it. I don't think he's a mean spirited person. I don't think he's

Yeah, you know, I look at it like this, Right, we all need to be held accountable for things.

If we cross the line or do something.

Yeah, that's man shit, Yeah that manshit. But at the same time, the universe is perfect. So while they're canceling Kanye for being Antisemitican saying things that he shouldn't have said in the eyes of those people that been through those things were on the other side saying, but on Twitter they the word nigga usage is up five thousand percent and it ain't nobody in the uproar right, So

It ain't no intend on that if it's.

Up five thousand percent with no records over there. But him saying I'm going death, which is a trick word. If you ask me, you ain't got no bitiness saying that word, what the fuck is defense readiness? How you going to be defending and ready? It just seemed like a I don't even use that word. So him going into trick bag with the word, or knowing what he was doing with the word, it says to me he offended them with that. But they using on Twitter and

But I think that's I think the important thing with Yay is that he's starting a common conversation about things that are happening, things that are going on, and I think that.

You know.

Sometimes again, when people don't want to address the issue, they'll play semantics with words and hold on to certain words and move the focus. All right, I understand that, But the focus of what he's saying addressing is this. I understand he may have said some things that offended

Because y'all said, so man, and that's so crazy, because you say this what I noticed about Kanye and it makes me really be like, wow, he still ain't panicked in the eyes of our public. Every time he come out in public. It's still because poker faith. He knows something, you know, right, he knows something we don't, right, And so I said, damn, hold on, he ain't panicking and he stood on status. He would come around us. I'm the richest black man, I'm the richest. I'm the richest.

But I also understood that he would stand on status with us.

But then when he talked to Piers Morgan, he would clarify, I only got one hundred and twenty million in the bank. So he understood what he was doing when he when he was braggadocious and stood on their status. But by him not panicing says he has a plan. I don't know the plan. I think he's trying to break the chain, but I'm not understanding. Even speaking of deals, Adidas is saying that they're going to sell his shoe and not pay him. He says in the contract he's still supposed

Because they can. But see, this is what I'm saying is, you know, bigger conversations to have. And that's what I think the ultimate thing of him doing all of this is just to start having these conversations about control and who has the control and who has the power, and

And Faarakham made a good point said, yo, when they say you're big and and you really ain't.

You don't even see that money.

They give you a whole bunch of money you don't you can't touch, so they can't take it like that, right, they can just press the button and then you three hundred million, they can just take it.

That ship is wow, man, it's wicked. Man. We really think about it.

Some, it's some's some it's you know again that's you know, that's that's a little further up the pole that we ain't there yet. But I coming, oh, no, for sure, and and I and I love the fact that just these conversations and start because why not let you know, and and again, you know, people don't want to have certain conversations because certain truths shall be revealed, right, you know. But when you're on the.

Side of the truth, you want to have those conversations.

You want to say, Yo, let's have them on your camera, your camera, let's have in front of your people, on your side.

Of the street.

Let's have it, and then let's make it right.

Right, and let's grab the information out of it, because we are leading.

Yeah, we lead, and let's learn from it. Like I understand, I'm leading.

That's why when I had these conversations, I have them from that perspective because I know I was on the other side when he was saying Spotify one, I'm like screaming at the screen like them niggas want to be paid.

Like like I say, you could be screaming at.

Your mother about something and your girlfriend say, ain't no way, I'm.

Marrying him, right, he'll treat he. Yeah, you see what I'm saying.

So when you say fuck a contract and I'm sitting next to you can't get accounting.

It's saying, damn, fuck a contract. I know it ain't meant for me, but it apply to me.

It applies to me because I'm in it. Yeah, Like I like I said, you know, it's nothing is by accident.

Man.

Everything is uh, everything has its beautiful purpose, you know what I mean? So I just you know, I learned from everything. Everything is a learning a learning process for me.

I love learning.

I love getting new information, you know, and I just like applying it and moving forward and just growing and watching myself.

What do I look like a year from now? Man? Y'all winning, y'all show winning.

We were building, man, We we more importantly, we just we just growing man as men were growing as a as a I me and our families, you know what I mean? You know, just doing things we never thought we would do. You know, I never thought that people would be waiting for me in London, you know what I mean.

Like I'm a fucking I'm a nigga holl uptown New York man.

Like yeah, Like, I just you know, it's it's a it's a humbling experience, man, a beautiful experience. But you know, it's just it's just part of what I always knew, you know what I mean as far as like just staying solid, uh, you know, standing on principals, standing on morals, being a being a good person. And that's gonna resonate with somebody somewhere, you know what I mean. And it may not turn into you know, a hundred million views.

Happy, man. You want, Yeah, you want, I'm happy. Man. I appreciate you coming back, man.

I appreciate you reaching out.

Man.

You know, I'm glad we finally got got a chance to connect. Love what you're doing. Brothers. You know, anytime you need anything from me, my platform is your platform, and you know, just keep doing what you're doing, because it's important to have real individuals in this space and in this culture that are doing and saying the right things but also standing on it, you know what I mean. So when I see see brothers like yourself doing things like that, you know I'm gonna pull up no matter.

Like, Yeah, Man, whenever, whenever, Man, you know, I'm dead, whenever y'all the show You're.

Coming out them all, Man, We're gonna have some fun to moll ship fun.

I appreciate you coming out, man. Experienced podcast, do something with that game.

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