Befriending The Other Woman

Welcome back to I Do Part two.

It's your favorite real life Bessie's Yes we are still single is Thelma and Louise. But on this podcast today, we thought it would be really interesting to pivot off of our story and bring on another non celebrity gal who went through some serious heartbreak out of her marriage, navigated the dating world, and has found herself happily remarried,

She ruled the school.

I wanted to be her and I still want to be her because she has absolutely been I muse as I've watched her gracefully, go through divorce, date like a fiend, and now get remarried to the most amazing man. So Jennifer, take it away, teach us what to do and how we can live the life that you are living well, and.

Before we actually I want to interrupt before we begin.

I also know Jennifer through Louise, and I have not known her nearly as long as Louise has, but have formed a friendship with her over the last couple of years and really only know her in her life today, so don't know well, I've heard, but don't know a lot about her history. So this is going to be equally as interesting to me as it hopefully will be

Okay, first off, I just need you both to know you could give my eulogy.

Well, let's hope you're not going anywhere unbelievable. We're not doing life without you, but carry on.

All right, Okay, in a like a cliff note version. I was married young, but back then it didn't feel young. So I was married, had two kids, fully in love with my husband at the time, and after about six years marriage, ten years together, we have two kids in diapers and I wake up one day.

It's important to give some color to the age.

What age were you when you got married and how old were your babies when all this was going on.

So I was married at twenty six, I had children at twenty eight and thirty. When I woke up one day and realized the marriage was over, I had an eleven month old.

And one and a half year old, right, yes.

Yes, so I had like a two and an eleven month old.

Yeah, so that's definitely the clipnote version. Take us back a little bit.

How was your marriage so prior.

To I would say it was a healthy relationship that had its normal problems, certainly nothing that I ever saw coming. That we were you know that we were done. But when you go through a process like that throughout the next months and years, you start things start to click and you go, oh, okay, I'm reading now I understand what that was where I didn't understand to look for certain things at the time.

But what were what were some of the normal problems.

Okay, let's see.

So I have a pew, kids and diapers, and we didn't have sex enough. We I wasn't emotionally affectionate enough.

That according to him or how you felt towards him, that you weren't bringing me you know, this.

Was according to him, and why he left me, So I you know, of course all those things. It's kind of like when you're younger and someone a teacher or a family member tells you something and it sticks with you for the rest of your life. So now here I am when I find out why he's left me or his reason for why he left me, I'm now all messed up in my head because I'm like, oh, I'm not affectionate enough, I'm not emotionally available enough, we're

You kind of in la la land about it?

And we're completely surprised because everything you just said were basically kind of complaints.

He was blaming you for.

I remember speaking to one of my friends that I'm very close with and telling her that I wasn't very happy about how I was feeling. I wasn't I was not sure what I was feeling. I just knew I

It was hectic at that time.

Yeah, you don't always see yourself or your relationship, at least in the short term. With young children, maybe is the priority. And so it's hard to make sense. Is this a relationship issue or just a time of life change in our relationship?

Yeah, and I didn't.

You know, I will take credit in maybe I didn't give him the kind of attention he needed, but I didn't know I wasn't.

So you began to sense the you know, the unraveling was happening.

But you know, everything had the babies, you just bought that brand new house, and.

By the way, there was no one raveling. That's the part that was so crazy is that I literally was like I thought I was going crazy when he basically told me he was leaving, Well, he didn't.

Tell me who was leaving.

He gaslated you. He was a trainer and you.

Helped him through a relationship land what became his biggest client. Now, as listeners, do we all see where this is going?

Probably not.

So let's hear it from you, Jennifer.

So what happened? So to speak? Like how did this bomb go off?

So again, you know, I think a few months before I found out, I remember being on a trip with him and realizing that we weren't connecting. And the one thing I always knew about our relationship was we always connected. It just took a minute if we were busy with our lives. But when we would go out to a party or go out to dinner with a couple, we'd come home and like regroup to our what our night was like, even though we were experiencing the night differently.

And so we went on this trip and I.

Came home and I remember coming downstairs and saying to him, we didn't bond on this trip.

You were so distant.

Something wasn't right. I don't feel good at all. And one of the things we used to do is play rummyque and so I remember going upstairs and being sad. And then he came downstairs and he had the rummy que out on the kitchen table, like he was extending an olive branch to our conversation.

So here I was thinking, Okay, he.

Acknowledges that we weren't vibing on this trip, and he's trying to make better for it, and like, you know, make make it go away, Like let's start from here. So for me, there was no awareness of that he was having issues with me.

But was he staying out? Was he coming home late?

Like, well, I guess when you are somebody who has a day job as a trainer. He was home at night, so it was the daytime that I would have no idea to question where he was and all of that.

I think at this point, let's just rip the band aid off on that and quickly say that he started.

Having an affair with this person.

So can you tell us about how you found out kind of what happened, how the explosion happened, Because it was a shock, the babies were young. I watched all of this, so why don't you share with our listeners what happened?

So I remember, you know, not to get like I mean, I could tell you the day, and I can tell you the time, the actual time of day, and what I was doing in my kitchen when this happened. And I remember it was probably the second or third time in that process of about a month and a half that I said to him on the phone, because he was on his way to go train his client. I said, I'm not happy, and it wasn't the first time I

Right then and there, I knew my marriage was over.

And I remember saying, you need to come home and I and we need to talk about this.

And I remember him saying to me, I.

Can't right now, like there were other priorities, which to me was baffling, because how could there be anything else important other than God forbid something happens to your child. You come home after a conversation like that, And he he finished his day or his client and then came home.

Obviously it makes sense now what he was doing. But when he came home.

I kind of grilled him like is there another person? No, there's no other person, is there?

Like?

What is going on? I don't understand?

And he just told me that he wasn't happy, but you couldn't tell me why he wasn't happy. And so I can't remember exactly the chronological way it came about, but it definitely, you know, lended itself to I'm not affectionate, I'm not emotionally available, that kind of stuff.

And again it didn't line up because.

We I mean, we were celebrating our tenure together and we kept the same anniversaries or as a wedding date, so we were celebrating almost seven years of marriage, whatever the years were. So for me, I couldn't make sense of it. I mean I went so far as to like, heck the vitamins he was taking? Like is he is there something wrong? I couldn't make sense of it.

Well, because you would ask the questions, you'd ask the poignant questions, and it sounds like they weren't He didn't really answer them.

He kind of put them back on you.

That's what they all do, right, I mean, all these men get caught, they they flip it around and they say no, you didn't do this, or you didn't you know, you didn't show me the love or the affections.

They try to like deflect it. Did you did you.

Ever, like from when you found out versus you know, having a weird feeling, were you doing any like snooping or kind of searching around or obviously there was no life three sixty or anything.

Well, so remember this is two thousand and two, so we didn't have the same like texting hadn't even really happened yet, so it was different. So the only thing I could have done is waited for a bill to come in the mail for credit card, and it didn't even dawn on me to do that, so we didn't have that kind of snooping around.

However, I do remember, well, I.

Do remember seeing one credit card bill, but it was after I had already found out, so it was irrelevant. And it was flowers, and I knew they weren't for me, but at that point it was just another like, you know, pain in my heart, but I had already.

Known at that point, how did you actually find out?

So he we had friends that we shared, but most we both came to the table with you know, I came with a lot of friends, and he came with a small group of friends. And I always kept my distance from some of his friends because I knew about certain things that I just I always thought it was a little safer that, like, they were his friends. Plus I have so many friends, it was good for him

They definitely had a moment hiccup.

And while that was happening, my husband asked me if the husband could live with us, and of course we had the space, and he lived with us, and thankfully they worked out their marriage. They had a young kid in diapers at the time, and so living with us helped him get back on his feet with what he needed to do in his marriage.

So they are still together.

And what happened was for about two weeks from that day that he told me he wasn't happy, and me trying to figure out, like, is this a midlife crisis? There's not another person, he said, what is happening? What is my role in this? What can I do to make it better? He went and he stayed with a mutual family friend and I about twelve days into this nightmare, I get a phone call and it's from this couple and the husband had told the wife, and the wife

Oh, were you sucker punched?

It didn't surprise me, but it gutted me. So I don't know. I mean, I knew there was an inkling of something wasn't right with this person in him. But when he told me that there was no affair, I believed him.

I really did. I did not think he was a liar.

And you wanted to believe him, right.

We all have that kind of voice in our head where something just kind of raises the hairs on our neck. But at the same time we choose to not want to see things or we want to believe somebody's words. Because your whole life, as you knew with young it was getting blown up, you know, saying like, yeah, I mean absolutely blown up.

And one of the things I'll say is I also come from you know, my parents now have been together over sixty two years, and yes they've had problems, and yes they've you know, I don't know everything that's happened in their marriage, but I always I came from stability of this, this, this example of two people that truly loved and liked each other, and so getting cheated on was like not in my repertoire.

I need to now bring something up because it's something you and I have now since discussed and we look at it differently.

Yes, I don't know if you know what I'm not.

I know what you're gonna say.

So when you met him train her husband, yep, Yep, he was well finishing a relationship. Yep, it was still in a relationship. And I always believe once a cheater, always a cheater. And you said, well, he younger and we were kids, and you know it's different.

It's like no, no, no, no, no, that was his pattern. That was still his pattern.

And quite frankly, when we tell our listeners what's going on now, I think it's still his pattern.

And I don't, but I hear you and agree with you what I would say, and I just as bad as it is that it's like, oh, he was with somebody when I met him. I was twenty one, and he was telling me he was not going to be with her anymore, and I said, I'm not going to be with anybody while they're with somebody. But we did form an emotional relationship in that process without things happening. But at twenty one, you don't know better.

I wasn't a comment on you, no more me identifying a potential red flag in him. That was maybe just you know, in hindsight, you say to yourself, hmm.

It makes total sense.

But I guess were you and I differ about the once a cheater, always a cheater.

Is I do believe that I did, for you.

Know, the twenty years they were together, I did believe that he really wouldn't do that. And I don't know if he did or didn't, But I do believe that as we get older and our relationships and life gets on, I do believe that affairs happen for different reasons. So you have couples, and I know some of them who they're not.

They're not sexually.

Involved with each other anymore, but they love each other, so they stay together.

For that reason.

And one of the people in the relationship doesn't want to have sex. I mean I've even said to some of the people I know, guys and girls in this situation where I'm like, if they did step out of their marriage, it wouldn't be the same version of an affair that I think what he did to.

Me at the time, there's there's you know, a lot of ways to skin skin that cat.

But so she hit the fan for you, big hit.

And what I remember watching because I think this is kind of like really heartbreaking, bad situation. But what I appreciated about you is you hit the ground running on the dating thing. Now, it was probably a reaction to the rejection and how you were feeling, and you wanted to rip that bandy down quickly, and you were like spinning and spiraling and you were literally juggling so much.

But you, I think within.

The first month on one on a date, multiple dates correct a week later.

Wait, I want to take a step back though for

I think that getting the information was an aha, not even an aha moment, but a It clarified things for me, But then it brought in a whole other level of spitch for me that I couldn't. I didn't for those two weeks, wasn't even thinking.

About so like tell us, tell us more you know about that?

Well, just now your brain is like, Okay, he's with this woman. My kids are in diapers, she's going to raise them.

Uh, you know I have to sell the house. Uh what am I going to do?

You know, my job doesn't make enough money, but I love what I do. I just now have to kick it into gear, like your life kind of last years in front of you, Like what am I going to do? And I've got two kids in diapers? And who's going to want to date? Who's going to want to date a girl with two kids and diapers?

Good point?

How old were you at the time.

Do you know thirty one okay, I is so young?

Yeah, uh, thirty one to thirty two okay.

So Louise alluded to the fact that you hit the dating scenes. So in the midst of your crazy probably you know, no, no sleeping and your mind going a mile a minute on what your life looked like. Practically speaking, it sounds like you started dating.

I started dating. I slept with somebody probably the first two weeks into this, and I remember it was so.

Bad, unlike her nun like friends Alma. Louise, Well, here's.

The thing at but but you got to remember I was with I was in relationships from like fifteen on, so I never got to like sexually experienced. I was experiencing a lot of different experiences.

And how'd you like it? I mean, were you having fun? Were you doing that and then going home and crying? Or was it like Actually, so the.

First point is the best I'm dating this guy.

Well on just interrupt were your kids going back and forth between both houses? So you had fifty percent of the time to kind of.

At the time before anything happened. It went seventy thirty because we had to go through mediation and all that before I was going to just give up more time with the kids. But I did have parents who were right up the street from me. So if it was a Thursday night and I would let the kids go to sleep, I and they, you know, be with a family member or somebody who was in my home, so

How did you meet people, because did online dating even exist?

Yeah? Yeah, the only thing that existed was Jada and Match and it was so so new. You didn't have Facebook, you didn't have any of that. So it was just Match and Jada and you couldn't verify.

You really couldn't verify people.

Yeah, and when I well, the first date that I had had nothing to do with any of these apps. I in the beginning, I was being set up. And this first day, this poor guy, he was so lovely. He would if I had like something, a furniture that needed to be moved, he'd come and move it. She was so good looking, and he was younger than me, and I'm not into younger guys, but this guy. It was the first when we the first time we slept together,

You know, do you want a breakfast or whatever?

And the way I reacted to him, he looked at me and he said, wow, if that wasn't here's some eggs in a big.

Cup of get the fuck out of here.

And I was like, I'm so glad you get it, Like yeah, like I want you out, I want like nothing to do with you right now.

And there's a part of you that wants to move on, and like that's that's your right.

You know. During the day, I think I was really emotionally distraught, lived a rejection feeling all day long.

So there was kind of a duality to your life going on at this point, right, like totally all like.

A major duality that is so beyond painful. In addition to her you know, dealing with the fact of the infidelity and a rejection and having to navigate dating and still having heartbreak. There was another woman who was mothering her children in diapers, very different than a fifteen year old kid who's dealing with the stepmom. I mean, I never got over the stories you told me, like I was seeing red.

And I was always so impressed.

With how you stayed high when I would have want to ripped, I would have ripped my child off of her lap.

So you had a lot on.

Your plate that was painful, uncomfortable, unchartered territory. And I just want to compliment you, Jennifer, because you always do wow me with how you hat no genuinely the.

One thing I would say that I've learned at looking back on it and have some humility in I did with some of these guys' heads, because I would get a drink in me, see them at night and be in it, and then in the morning I'd want to

Do you feel like you did that because it was again the duality of your life where it's like you wanted the freedom and the lightness at night and then the heaviness of the day.

Or do you feel like you inherently at.

The time were kind of having trust issues with men and just weren't going to ever let yourself or let your guards down and creating a wall.

You know, I didn't have trust issues with men because I didn't. I only found myself in relationships. And this is what's interesting because this is where your I do part two comes in for you girls dating and not that you don't know this, but I I realized that all of these men that really were giving me their attention and wanting relationships, I think they wanted the relationships

You were like the dude in the relationship I was.

I was, and I didn't know it at the time. I just now when I looked back on all of those pieces of my life, I realized, Yeah, they wanted me because they couldn't have.

Me if you were unavailable. You can't fake that, you know, it's just it is or it isn't.

Yeah, So tell us about how you met your current love and how long it took, you know, just briefly, like you dated around.

I dated for like, let's see, I dated for about five years and then one day Father's Day and I was coming home from Malibi.

When I was in the back seat of my.

Parents' car, and out of nowhere, one of my parents said, oh, so and so gave your number to this guy. And I remember thinking, okay, whatever, I'll never hear from him, so it didn't matter.

And then I remember walking.

My parents dropped me off, and I came into the house and my health phone rang and I answered it and it was this guy, and I was thinking to myself, really, first of all, I had a BlackBerry, so he called me on my house phone, which I thought was wild, But then again, who gave him my number was an older person, so they're going to go with the house phone.

He's had a really good phone. And then we ran on our first.

Date well, he's a babe, and he's funny.

He's very funny, very relevant of humor, back kind of guy, full integrity, more than I've ever seen.

But it was a slow burn for you, which is an obden because this is a lesson You're always trying to teach me and to teach.

Thellman to teach other people.

Is you know, the slow burn sometimes has the staying power, and it's the integrity and all of those kind of characteristics which are so much more important than the immediate butterfly or the whatever the spark you feel or the things that you think are important that really aren't.

So talk a little bit about him, and it was it was a slat.

I remember when he.

Proposed to you, you were you had some pause.

Yeah, yeah, And I knew I didn't want to give the relationship up and if you say no, then where do you go from there? But I also knew that I wanted him in my life, and so I had to really think about that. But it was, you know, me to him that first night at dinner, he like interrogated me. He's so bad on dates.

But he was so funny. I remember going home, I remember.

Calling my mom in the car saying, yeah, there was a great date.

He's really handsome. I'll never hear from him again. And she's like, why I said, I'm too old for him, because he's ten years older than me. But at the time, you know, he could have had, you know, girls in their thirties, and that's just the real I was in my thirties, you know what I mean, girls in their twenties, and he you know, it's just a double standard. And

I'm in this.

And we always say how important laughter is.

It's my favorite thing, so important. I mean, it's like, and he.

Makes me he's funny. He's funny, and that is something that like when somebody says, like, what are your favorite qualities about him? You know, everybody's always alwayways, but the funny And yes, I know he's handsome. I'm not discrediting that. And yes, what I've ended up with him if he wasn't handsome, I don't know. Maybe I wouldn't have gotten to the next steps with him. But certainly that is not what our relationship is about.

And it's been seventeen years, sixteen, sixteen years, And what I have witnessed just in being in your lives, and I know what you've also shared is his integrity has continued every day because he really and I think it's important to talk about how he really stepped up in a meaningful way as a co parent to your children.

And what really mattered to me he brought to the table.

And you always say that I think what I'm marvel at is that you obviously your first chapter was a huge, you know, a huge pivot and in your life that you never expected.

But yet you have been able to.

Go on and date and get married and.

Having been, you know, through a divorce myself, I think time is the greatest healer and everybody wants to expedite that, and you just can't to a certain extent. But what other things or advice would you give to people that are struggling kind of post divorce right now?

Like, what advice would you give to them?

And what do you think helped you, you know, remain open to finding love and dating again.

Well, I feel like even though I always felt like I was walking around with like that scarlet letter on me that I was left. I was the girl that you know here, I was at you know, a school where all the kids in kindergarten and first grade and second grade, and my kids were like everybody's parents were married. And I always felt like I had this this like this thing I was carrying with me that I walked

But I didn't present that on my dates, and.

When I was one, you never did.

But I carried it inside my core. And so for me, I am a slow learner, so it took me, I would say, just till COVID. So that's what four years ago when it finally clicked that this wasn't.

A me issue. I played a part in it of all the.

Stuff that happened through those you know, years of raising my kids with him and having to go through that very difficult process, but it wasn't a me issue. And I always thought it was. I thought I was the bad person in I wasn't handling it well. I was creating more drama than needed to be and some of it I was but I finally realized something clicked about four years ago. I saw him at a parking lot and it just dawned on me.

Oh no, this is a hymn issue.

This is who he is or was, and who he is with me, and I've allowed him to dictate how I feel about myself. And I finally woke up that day. I remember coming home going It's like I just purged all that stuff I held about me and was able to actually feel and work on me for the first time.

That must be, I mean, so freeing.

And it kind of segues, I feel like into our next topic, which you may know what that is. But in a strange turn of events, right, your ex husband recently and did his relationationship with the woman who helped facilitate.

The end of the home Wrecker.

We're going to call her the HOMEWRECKERP stop stop sorry home wrecker.

Tell us a little bit more about that and some the irony here.

I would say throughout all these you know, I call it twenty years because really I think about it was twenty years in this process of their relationship, and.

There were times where the two of us.

We always you know, we always did birthday dinners, graduations, important things we would do together.

And you always showed up with a smile on your face, and you were so mature and so gracious because you did not want your children to suffer.

And the truth is, my kids were going to pick up on stuff regardless. I mean, there's only so much we can hide from our kids, and depending on their age.

I was lucky that my kids were the age they were, so I.

Was able to navigate that a lot easier than other people we know who go through this with their kids being of a different age. So I would say that throughout the years, we were either hot and cold with each other.

There'd be times where my ex and I were fine with each other.

We're never great with each other, but we'd be fine, and then there were times when we were not fine at all. And I'm sure she had to feed off of that and navigate and was also only hearing his version of what was going on, although she was strivy to the emails and the bullshit.

That we did, but.

She was coming from his place and she needed to support him. But what I would say is I would say to you, Louise, I would say like.

Well, you know, I could see us.

Being friends if we didn't have this situation, and you'd like, out of your mind, like what, like that's not possible. But I always knew that we had. We were comfortable, awkwardly a comfortable renditions.

I says a lot.

About you, because there are many women who are in this situation that can't even be in the same room as somebody. And it's just a testament to who you are. But it's interesting because now that their relationship has ended and.

Life is full circle.

Yes, and you know your kids have obviously remained close to her because she did be you know, she was a part of you know, parenting them for twenty years. But I just find it so fascinating what is going on with the two of you if you share their listeners, because I think this is so interesting, and I think you know, for people of experiences and maybe in the throes of a situation like this, you know to see how life can change and in the most unexpected circumstances, you.

Have a new friend and a new auty.

And and I also think please bring up to everybody that like the story she was told was different than what happened.

It was different than the story he told you.

Huh, And I think I think she We ran into each other several months ago and we had a conversation, and that conversation led into her calling me after the conversation, like fifteen minutes later and having a little bit more of a conversation, and then when I hung up, I had said to her, if you ever.

Want to grab a drink, I'm available.

And I think somehow within a few weeks later she may have texted me and that was my opportunity to basically ask her out for dinner.

Did you offer that as some version of a closure that you needed or were you offering it to be, you know, an ear for her to talk to.

I think as a combination, because I had already made my own closure, so I didn't need it so much, but I would have loved if I was given that at the time. And one of the things that she said to me after our first dinner, our first.

Date, how many have you had now?

I think four or five?

I mean, you're almost exclusive at this point. You're going to join our girls dinner soon. You don't want to sit her at a table with a few of us, but go on, do your kids know that you guys?

Oh?

Yeah, yeah, No, we definitely talk to the kids.

The kids are too old to not know, and they actually are very happy about it.

Does your ex husband know.

Well, I'll share that in a second. But what we've given each other is forgiveness. We've given each other a space.

To feel.

Seen and heard, and it's safe, hopefully to share the pain we've both experienced, and that very few people can experience that kind of pain.

And I think it is been healing more so for her to be able to have that.

But I also think it gives honestly, because she's heartbroken, well we assume, we assume, yeah, okay, and she loved him, And I also think if I were in her seat and I would see that the beautiful life that you created, you know, and the phoenix out of the ashes, it would give me hope that I too can experience, you know, another chapter after what happened to her, And I think that that's part of it also.

Well, and I think as a side note, do you remember a couple of weeks ago you also said, oh, we should set her up with this stuff, which I was like, wow, I mean that if that is not the kindest person I've ever met, Yes, but that's not a light note, but more seriously, when Louise said, you know, Jennifer, if that had happened to a lot of people your story, never would they have been kind or welcoming or any of those things to the X and the ex's partner.

Cancer in us and it's punishing ourselves.

And it's really easy to say, you know, oh, move on, but it's like it's when that miracle happens that you finally can let go and you realize that you're like, I'm just punishing myself and keeping myself in this folding pattern by staying angry and giving the other person and the event and all of it like more at your time. And I think you're such an example of how to do it.

And in the rear view mirror, it makes you really subscribe to rejection is redirection.

It really, it really isn't you know?

I would say It's definitely shaped me for who I am now, and I think I'm the best version of myself to date, always room for improvement. But one of the things I didn't mention was when I met my husband, he is a product of this very same situation.

So he came to.

My life and opened up my eyes what it felt like as a kid going through this.

So he helped me navigate that place. He also helped me navigate.

What it was like because one of the things that I wanted was I wanted my ex do approve.

Of me, to like me. I wanted his wife to or girlfriend to like me.

And it's the same thing as I was saying with dating.

If you want something.

So bad, you're so not attractive and you're not going to get that. And when I finally realized, when I said earlier, oh this isn't a me issue, there was nothing and I the only thing I was doing was forcing something that they didn't want with me.

But that was you trying to resolve probably the rejection piece, right like, yeah, that was still trying you to kind of get their approval and be lovable basically because you were so you heart And what you learned to do was, basically, to.

Quote mel Robbins, let them and then let me right.

Yeah, Yeah, But that took me so long. Of course it really did.

Like I said, I'm a slow learner, but when it finally clicked, I went, oh, okay, Like I wish I could take back time and like apply it then, but I just didn't have it. And Thoma, when you asked me earlier, like what kind of advice would you give in my business? I am. I am approached by women and some men, but mostly women weakly with a situation like this because some degree, whether it's about an affair or a marriage not working out, or a relationship ending.

And the best advice I would.

Give for me is, and I've said this so many times to people.

In my office, is be kind.

He You can be in a relationship and not be happy and want out, but just be kind about it. And I've said that so many people who are not in marriages that are working, and I'll say to them, just all I can offer is if you don't want to be in this marriage and your partner does, be kind about it. Because a marriage, if it's not gonna work, it's not gonna work. But how you treat somebody at the end of the.

Day you exit, it's how that is huge. And also it's not the way it looks today is not the way it necessarily looks five years, ten years, Like I guess you know so, so you always need to act with integrity kind of back to what you said.

Yeah, And one of the things on our first date or after our first date, she said to me, you deserved a different ending. And that was something that really resonated with me because it was like thank you now you like at least it.

Was like the end in aha moment you needed that. It was her version of an apology. So before we close, I do have an important question as somebody who is in a very day to day, uh you know, situations with Ethelman myself.

So you are.

Somebody who dated, successfully, tried on a lot, has been in a really happy marriage. What advice would would you give to us so that we too can get to your kind of final destination?

What are we doing wrong?

Like share with our listeners as somebody who's you know, basically stepped through that sliding door and we're still we're still where we are, Like help help us.

I think it's less about what you're doing wrong. I think I feel two different things with Louise.

I feel this is good.

Brace yourself up. I know you're comes the attack on Louise, and.

I've said this to you, you need to give something more time. I don't think you need to give something time that doesn't feel good from the get go. But when you are, you know you've met somebody that makes you feel excited and looking forward to going on that next date and that next date, and when you're with them, you come back feeling really good. And when you're not

And stuff more gray, not black or white, like you have to decide am I going?

Am I going ahead with this? Or am I break?

Yeah?

Like, just be in it enough that you know that you know, you really know that person intimately, not sexually, but intimately before you know if they're right or wrong for you unless there's.

No feeling, I got it.

It's just hard because the opportunity of having dinners with Felma and Jennifer like we'll be doing in one hour, is just it really lights me up.

I have to say, it's a very it's a very hard expel. And what advice would you give me?

I know what's my advice?

Okay, So your advice is.

I have noticed as we've gotten closer that you you really could care less about putting yourself together and going out. You'd rather put yourself together to go out with the girls, And you'd rather you have a date and him cancel, and.

You're happy about it.

You are so true.

That is not going.

To get you out there meeting mister wonderful who gets to appreciate you.

Now, I told you my brothers always said they are not going to find you in your home near your pajamas.

Yeah. And by the way, I mean like that last date. I was just so happy you went on it for forty minutes.

It was fifty eight minutes. Guys, it was fifty eight minutes.

Tell them when I said to you, so just quickly and then we'll close up. So she had a date last week, and we don't want to We want to leave them wanting more. So we were going to cap it at an hour five thirty, and then I was going to swoop it again her at six thirty, and then we were going to go hit a vault.

Wait, let me first say, do you know what? Louise initially said, Okay, well, just keep your seats at the bar, tell him you're ending the date, and I'll just take his seat. And I was like, oh god, I am a lot of things, but I am not tone deaf. I am not going to tell him to get up so somebody could take his seat. I'm like, I'm going to go out the back door or the front door, and you're going to swing by and pick me up.

But when I well I had said to her, was I said, look, I'm going to check in mid date and if you want to continue the date, you could. We don't have to have dinner that night. So I text her and I'm like, Yo, should I get in the car. She goes, yeah, I'll be ready in five minutes.

I was like, what traffic and she goes, all, i'll pick you up because no, I'll walk across the street. Our seats at the bar and she was perched there and when I walked in, I felt like the prombling her face lit up.

You were so happy to see And.

I got totally buzzed that night, because like I was giddy when I met Luise. It was like I nursed a drink with him and then I was like, oh my night can begin.

Yes, I definitely.

So you see what you're connecting the dots here.

I am thanks.

I want you to get giddy when you see your girlfriends, but I want you to make an effort to just not a date a week, but just don't just set your standards of like I'm gonna show up, I hit the data week.

I I am all for the data week.

I understand. And by the way, kudos to you that you guys can find that and do it. I mean it's hard when two dates this week.

I'm very propsed to burn, but you know two days well, I just have to tell you, Jennifer, thank you so much honestly for coming on and sharing your story.

It's it's very nice when somebody is willing to be vulnerable. And thanks for sharing your journey and telling everyone our listeners what you've been through. And hopefully it serves to be inspirational for people who are going through it right now and kind of a lesson that even if you have a traumatic experience, you still can find your part two.

Yeah, and I just just one more thing to add if you guys, as our listeners, enjoyed participating in Jennifer's you Know story film, and I have a lot of people with a lot of stories that would love to come on and share.

So, oh, there's so many people with these kinds of stories.

We have a big crew people, so if this resonates with our listeners, let us know.

But the people who you know again, they're going through it, but they also have a light at the end of the tunnel. So if you are struggling with post divorce, we would love to help you. Apparently I'm not be the right person as I've just been given the advice, but please call or email us, follow us on socials, and all of the information will be in the show notes, so make sure to rate and review this podcast. I do Part two, an iHeartRadio podcast where falling in love is the main objective.