Its called a vagina

Okay, come on, let's talk about things about me.

Let's talk about all those things that's advisory.

Welcome mom, Welcome back to Frindal Advisory, Good Mom's Bad Choices.

I'm Erica and I'm Jamila. How is your week? I have had a good week.

I'm going out of town tomorrow, so it's like so much pressure to get me and my kid prepared for that.

But other than that, I've been chilling. Yeah, because the snow. You're gonna be cold, girl, I'm excited.

I had an interesting week. I had surgery. I'm kind of high right now. We'll just start my surgery in a later episode, but currently I I'm pretty intoxicated.

Yeah, I'm under the influence. I'm drinking water.

So if I don't make sense at any point during this podcast, just blame narcotics.

I am not post surgery, but I am drinking wine, So if I say anything, just blame the wine.

So today we have our first special guest, and I'm really excited because she's one of my best friends and the reason I brought her on is because she is an expert in the topic that I want to discuss today.

Do we even like officially name this topic or.

I don't know if there's an official name, but I guess basically how to talk about sex and body parts with your toddler slash children because you have to start early, I think.

Yeah, And there is no I mean, not that I've seen lately any like how to guides. I haven't googled it or anything, but I'm sure go. I know your friend because this is gonna be really.

So because people think you don't have this talk until much later on, and it comes very early because we're human.

And thankfully I have this friend because she educated me on this when I was pregnant and I did not even think about this. But anyway, this friend has a name. I would like you guys to meet my friend, Jessica Coromo. She is an advocacy program manager at a nonprofit.

And I would like you to explain.

Yes, so too, bang, Hey girl, Hey, Hi, thanks for having me on So yeah. So, my nonprofit works with survivors of sexual assault, domestic violence, in child maltreatment, and so we are always having the conversation about kids and their bodies and how is parents we can talk about these things, right? So, I think a lot of parents think that they don't have to talk about body parts or sex.

Till much later. I don't even really remember when my mom talked about it.

For me.

I know that I had pet names for my body parts like I'm seepee and chee cheese and you know, like it was never straight up vagina.

No, in my household, it was vagina. It was badox. It was like defecate and urinate.

Really yeah, But I don't think my mom talking about sex so like she found birth control on my bed and I was like fourteen or so, it's.

Like what are those?

I'm like, huh, even when I had gotten even when I got my period, I remember like a lot of my my friends, Like I remember my one of my best friends, her mom bought her like all this pink shit and like a pink robe and like a pink stoll or maybe it was red, like to just what are they doing?

Are they bouncing the Yeah, I think they're bouncing a ball. Yeah.

I The conversation about periods and like sucks, even though we had like we labeled our private parts correctly, Like I don't feel like it was something on topic that was like openly discuss like I like I saw in my other friends homes and I thought it was like a racial thing.

It's like because I was black, like we eve didn't talk about it.

But my mom's parents were much older and more Yeah, so I think it was kind of like a more like they were just more conservative, and so she did that with me, so it wasn't much that we discussed.

Now I looked at the word pregnant as a bad word. I remember thinking the word.

Pregnant was like a bad like don't say it, yeah, which lets.

Me know, like, you know, I didn't get the education that I needed, and my mom you know, probably didn't even know.

I mean, it's just like this whole hush hush, don't talk about it thing. And like even like there was definitely not a conversation about masturbation or like anything like that, like feeling it like that was forbidden and it was bad.

It's a generational thing though, too, right Like now in society we're seeing people are more open with their bodies or open to talk about their bodies. People are open to talk about gender now that we didn't have that when we were growing up. Our parents we're just trying to get by and like figure it out, and.

Hopefully we didn't ask toim any questions, yeah, because it was really uncomfortable.

But I think parents put a lot of pressure on themselves to say, like we need to have the talk, the talk, and there is no talk to have.

It should just happen all the way on a conversation.

Yeah, and it shouldn't be scary because they're weird.

Yeah, because it's happened. It's real life.

It's natural, like eventually everybody's gonna fuck right.

Like when you like my father tried to have like the talk with me in high school and it was so but you know, that's how you got here.

That's how we got here. Like, oh, I know. But if the kids dread it, the parents dread it. Always have this.

Talk because it's been so like non communicating for so long.

It's an ongoing conversation.

If there's no talk, it's something that you're constantly educating your kids and probably yourself.

And thank god I have you as a friend.

Because there is I would be I would be out here talking about my butterfy.

I'm glad to know you, you girl, because there's a lot of I didn't realize there was so much, so many like small things that are so important, that are so easy to implement, but if you don't know to do it, then you won't.

Right.

So the talk isn't just about let's talk to your kids about sex. No, Like the talk is let's talk to your kids about their bodies, and let's not shame them about it. Let's let it be a normal conversation. So when Eric and I were talking when she was pregnant, even when Ari was a baby, I'd be like, okay, you need a teacher that this is her vagina and

It's a normal thing. That's what it's called. Yeah, that's what it's called.

And it just empowers them to know, this is my body and this is what it's called.

So if God forbid, anything ever were to.

Happen to them, they would know exactly how to say someone touched my vagina or so you know, and it's it's very clear and no one will get misconstrued as to what it is because they.

Know what the word is for that, right.

So I mean even for me, like knowing that and then putting it into practice, I have to say.

It was awkward implementing this rule. Yeah, like because I.

Mean I knew that it was the right thing to do, but because I was never taught that, like, it felt it felt awkward for me to be like, Irie, this is your vagina, say vagina.

Yeah, she's like.

She would, and I'm like vagina and just I even I slip up, I still slip up because I go back to what I was taught, right, Okay, But it wasn't actually until recently when we had this conversation recently that I had to like kind of like refresh myself and re check myself to go back to Iri and be like, you know, what, what is this called again?

And she remembered, but she has gotten used to calling it something different.

I remember this story you told us last week that left a big impression on me about the a case where tell me the story?

Yeah?

Yeah, So you know, I think we talk about the importance and why and people don't Sometimes they don't get it.

They're like, well, whatever, what's.

The harm in calling it something pretty or something that I want, Like it's your flower, it's your butterfly. So we had a case where a little girl said, you know, this person touched my butterfly. Her parents knew that her butterfly was her vagina, but no one else knew that, and.

That didn't hold up in court. So unfortunately they didn't really get the justice that they.

Deserved because you can't prove to anyone that your butterfly was your vagina.

She could not say this is my vagina.

Despite the fact that she was a child and that's how she had been taught and brought up, which is the scariest shit I've ever.

Heard, exactly like I would that's very important.

Yeah, Like, if you told me that this person is gonna walk free or not get the penalty whatever, murder, death for to take my child, I'm gonna take manags. But because my daughter called it a butterfly, I'm gonna be not only upset at the justice system, upset with myself, right and I'm going to feel like I didn't protect my child, But you're also making the assumption that your child's gonna tell you, and you and you and your

And I know that this is wrong. I know this feels wrong, but not doing anything about it? Yes, baby, okay, what's wrong? Oh? Share the computers? Share the computer. Okay, she wants to work too. Sorry, guys, you know you know how it goes. Nobody shares it.

Oh and by the way, when we say close the door, it's actually a clear door. We can see our kids, so it's not like they were anyone was writing us.

Up to the parental abuse board. We can see them. It's a clear French door, and I'm watching them as we yell at them to close it. But yeah, no, exactly.

Going back to that, I mean, yeah, like if a child told her teacher like someone touched my butterfriends and the teacher's like, okay, okay, whatever.

Yeah, it's so dismissive.

And the teacher has no idea the damage that she's doing, and the child is that might be the only time she ever tries, and that's it, and that can change her life right then and there. Right she could be told by her perpetrator like you tell anyone and they're not gonna believe you, or I'm gonna hurt you.

I'm going to hurt your family.

So if that was your one shot for this child to feel like empowered and to be able to say something, you've just totally ruined that and lost that moment.

Because no one can communicate whatever she's trying to communicate.

Because just basically the.

Word she's using to dislabel her vagina.

And this goes for boys too. You need to teach your boys penis. Heck, yeah, I know, we have girls, so sometimes we discuss, you know, the daughters daughter.

It goes for first protect our sons are yes.

I mean I had I had someone who told me in her family, they only called his penis a water spout.

And I was like, uh no, but what no?

And I gave her that exact same example of like imagine he told his teacher someone touched my water spout, she'd be like okay, whatever.

Like turn off, put your water bottle away, or you know, yeah, and I mean shit.

Like, our kids are only three and I used two. Great guy, Like, by the way, some genormous ass kids. I know, they look like four. They have like normally tall children are really tall. But yeah, I'm noticing even as early as three. And you know, I don't know if you're noticing two, but they do just begin to discover their body parts and that certain things make them feel good, and they're you know, and they don't even know what that means.

So I do.

I'm now for the first time obviously, I'm this first time parent coming into like how important it is to not you know, make them feel shameful or guilt or bad for even discovering those parts because they're humans. They're coming into this body for the first time. You know, they've never been here before. I don't know what the hello, what's this?

This is nice?

So even that's like weird and awkward, but it still has to be addressed in a like loving and like embraced manner.

How do you Yeah, it's definitely about not shaming them about their body and and you know, we see this happen with kids all the time.

You know, you guys are talking about boys.

Remember, like my younger brother's on the soccer field just having their hands in their pants, you know, and they're touching their penis. But it's not about it's saying like, oh, okay, I know, like you're discovering yourself or you want to touch your penis, but we're not going to do that in the soccer field, or you know, like you you set parameters around that and you say, you know that that's fine that you want to do that, but you're gonna do that in your bedroom. You're gonna do that alone,

Sometimes they share a room, so maybe it's not your room.

Maybe it's like you're gonna do it in the power a littone time, but this is not something we do in public, and this is not something to be ashamed of. Love your body and cherish it and that's but that's your time. You can have that time, and that's okay, right.

I think that's as parents, that's a I think the number one thing I think parents especially in public because like kids told you think of and we get so awkward and embarrassed and insecure because we're so insecure and haven't been taught correctly that it's like, hey, I'm doing that because you're you're automatically embarrassed.

But that's like, that's my.

Whole one of my biggest things in parenting period, and every aspect is like fuck everybody's opinion and fuck you know, like you have to step out of that for a second because that's so socially driven to just talk about it normally, because our first reaction can be to be so snappy because we get.

A certain type of feelings.

I knew and the story about this chick was mom and she said, don't know how the kid was, Like maybe he was like eight or seven, but like he obviously just started discovering that little penis and he was pulling that shot out everywhere, like trying to touch it, like at a restaurant, Like she just kept trying to get naked, and she had to finally have the conversation and she was still humiliated.

But I guess it's just like the communication, oh my god, oh my gosh, just could end back. Hey, yes, none of that.

Okay, they're playing with an umbrella and it's open and in the health and one of them on each.

Sidey enough of that. This is not karate Ninja classes with the umbrella. Let's just watch the movie. And watched Pepa Pig put the umbrella away. I put it down no more.

Its me, thank you never never. I don't know one. Are you gonna get a power? Okay, go watch Pepa peg.

Oh my goodness, very empowered children.

She just tried to jump me. She was like, that's my umbrella. I know. I was going through a phase of toughness. Now they're talking about us.

But you understand, does some ship But yeah, I mean I could see how that could be. You know, it's fair react reactionary?

Is that a word? Like a fair reaction? You you? I like it understood, you know.

I mean I know for me, like even my mom, because I will say that I think some of it is generational, and you know, the conservativeness of the past and how we talk about sex, like Irie discovering her her body parts and like when she would take her diaper off, she would like open up her legs and touch herself and not in any sort of sexual way, but just be like discovering.

Look what would I have? What is this?

My mom would be kind of like she would come to me and be like, Erica, is ire getting touched or like it's everything Okay, that's not normal, And I'm like, if, no, it is normal, Mom, She just discovering her body. And please don't do that because I'm trying to teach her something different because I don't want her to feel like

Right.

But I understand because even me, I've had to check myself into coming like like really genuinely feeling that way because my first reaction is the same as my mother because that's what I was taught.

Yeah, and you know, and that's not a bad thing either.

If you know, if you think or you want to ask, you can ask to your kids, does anyone ever touched your vagina?

Okay? I'm okay, Okay, they want you anyway. No, it's true.

I mean I think it's trying to find that balance and Erica's mom was not wrong, I either being like has.

Anyone touched education?

There are different things that can be indications, but yes, and just no need to jump to conclusions because the truth is there is going to be a period when they're constantly discovering nihit about their bodies because.

It's new, right right, Well, yeah, I lost my turn of thought.

I was gonna say any type of friction, you know, like there is a you know, adverse react.

I mean, is that the right road of the first reaction?

There's you know, there's a pleasure of the They're gonna discover that and it's gonna be like okay. And so I think it's about having that conversation before you're in the grocery store instead of being like stop touching your vagina, to like remember what we talked about.

Do that.

So you've already had that conversation. I didn't know that was like a window door. They know they.

Okay, the strawberries are cut, so they're fine.

I mean, but you were talking about sort of signs and things to look for, and there are a couple of things.

So one.

We often say like, well, when's the age you can talk to your kids about sex. So I think it's really important if however old your child is, say they see a movie or something they say like, you know, when can you know my daughter saw in a movie like what like sex?

And she asked what sex is? Or she heard that word.

It's really important before you go on like this huge long lecture to be like, well, what do you think about it? And then listen to what they say first, because maybe like oh, maybe it's when a boy and girl kiss each other, Like okay, that's fine, But it's about giving them as much.

Information as you're comfortable with.

So some families believe, you know, sex happens when after you're married or after you've been in a long term loving relationship, and that's fine, that's those are your rules and your house rules.

So it's about explaining whatever you feel comfortable with, but not lying.

So like fuck the stork, we're not saying like the stork came, or we're not saying, you know, it just came from an imaginary land.

Because once they realize.

The truth and they realize like they've been lied to by their parents, they're gonna be like, well, I've been lying to my whole life.

That is what else did you, like right, exactly exactly, So try.

To be it's truthful and honest. But when we're talking about like what are signs, say with child sexual abuse, say like, all you've ever told your child was, well, you know what you're two, and sex is if you want to know, it's like kissing your you know. And then they say, well, actually it's a when a penis enters a vagina and you have never told them that.

That's something you need to explore.

So if they have sex knowledge, that's a lot greater than whatever for their age or what you've told them.

You need to ask some questions like who told you that? Where to learn that from?

But not in a scary way like no, like no I told you that? Yeah, like oh really, honey, where did you learn that? And I deep down inside your blood is boiling and you're looking at whose number your goal?

Well, like when you were saying, like who am I going to kill with this?

That's the biggest thing we say, too is and it's the hardest thing to say, but it's like sometimes your kids will be playing with other kids and they're like, oh, yeah, so when so and so like brought me to his bedroom or and it's about controlling yourself and controlling your facial reaction because if it gets uh huh and exactly how Erica just said.

Like oh okay, like what what do you mean? What happened? Instead of being like who touched you?

Like I had like in my experience, like my mom was so afraid of that.

It was like drilled and it.

Was like Jessica coming to my room, Okay, has anyone touched you vagina?

I'm like, no, they have, and it was like are you sure?

Like god, and I hated having that conversation, but if it's a normal conversation that you're hearing, like okay, touch your vagina.

You know, okay whatever?

Yeah.

I think even you had mentioned the other day, like just wanted like say your daughter comes home from school or your toddler comes home to school, and just make it casual like okay, so how was school? Did anyone touch your vagina today?

Oh? Cool?

Let's go make lunch, like make it as casual as it sounds so strange, but yes, baby, Okay, one second, go sit down, I'll make you some more.

Okay, I'm coming the.

Disappointment, I know, but just making it just as casual as that. You know, it sounds so weird. It even sounds weird to me saying it, but it makes sense.

Yeah, the vagina talk shouldn't be I mean, or the penis talk should be.

Often yeah, right, but it's because it's it's more so about your reaction. If it's more so about like, actually, mommy, yes, someone did touch by vagina and instead of like crying.

Or making it because once you cry.

Or do that, you make it about you, and then your child is gonna want to protect you.

I'm like, what's wrong. I shouldn't have said that while.

We're crying, and now all these things are happening because I said that.

Just because the attitude and energy surrounding the conversation.

Yeah, and so definitely try to control your facial expressions and control your temper. And we often say, you know, but reassure them you're gonna do something about it. So I was talking to my cowork about this because I knew I was coming onto this podcast, and I was like, there's just so much to.

Talk about, like what do you do?

And you know, statistically we always tell our kids like stranger danger, beware of strangers, and that's really not the case.

Usually ninety percent of the time.

They're going to be sexually assaulted or molested by someone that they know, someone really really close to them, who misuses that trust. And so she had a situation where there was like this really rambunctious boy and she's like, you know, I really don't think it was child sexual abuse. I think he was just really rambunctious and he was coming up and he was trying to mess with her

Well, why were you there? Why you go to retire?

You know just about that you were acknowledging what you're telling us.

I believe you. I'm so sorry this happened to like We're going to do something about it.

Yeah, that's so important because I think a lot of times as parents we get caught up in the details that don't matter. We already know every little aspect of what happened, except what it really doesn't matter.

What matters is.

Kind of like how to be resolving the action and what happened and moving forward.

Yeah, I mean think about as adults now, like think about the slut walk the amber Rose has.

It's all around body.

Shaming and victim blaming, and we need to get away from this culture where we're asking girls, why are you wearing that?

That's why I got raped? Why are you drunk? That's how you got raped? And we start with kids.

Right, you start like, well, why are you playing with that little boy when you shouldn't have?

Because socially there's this weird nature around it, like.

It's there's a like I think mostly for I mean obviously like for women, there's like a guilt and a shame place. And that's why this is my other question because this is really like a difficult place for me because I am a very empowered and naked woman, like a naturalist.

So I do like to be naked, and I.

And low key like before I mean not before, I mean and after I have a kid.

I had a kid, Like if you come to my house.

And you're my friend, you're likely to have to see me naked because if you come to my house, this is I want to wear only my panties. And I don't care how you feel about it, and if you feel some type of way about it.

That's your fault because yeah, oh well go home. You know.

I feel like I despise the rhetoric that women's bodies are these sexual like temples of desire only like we do so much like we birth children, like guys have tits, we have tits. We have a little more fatty tissue we feed kids, you know, Like this whole double standard really irritates the shit out of me. And because I or, if you want to be naked, then you're slutty. You want attention, Like I don't know how much chits to

Yes, I would be talking a lot.

But then having a daughter, I realized, like I want her to be empowered, I want her to be lanking.

She's like, man, let's get naked.

We have a naked dance, Like she wants to rubber chest against mine and like skin to skin and then we're having fun.

And we want to dance naked.

But then I realized that there has to be a fine line between like her understanding, like it's okay to be naked and have fun and people should respect your body and that's how it's supposed to be. But unfortunately, there are a lot of fucking creeps and I can't kill them all and know exactly who's who, because there are so many stories I've heard that are so fucking scary, like grandfathers making grandchildren and I've heard fathers, stepfathers uncles, friends, and these are.

All just from like my close circle of friends.

You know, I've heard horrible stories that I know have affected many people unto their adulthood.

And it's like, how do you protect your kid and also.

Empower them from you know, like not having the wrong body image, but also.

You know, like where's that balance? How do you make that balance?

Yeah, and I think it's finding whatever your boundaries are. So maybe get the conversation that you're gonna have with Luna is gonna be like, Okay, this is Mommy and Luna time, right, that's when we do this a choice. So right now, you know, as an adult, you're making the choice for yourself, but you're also making the choice for her, like this is going to be our style, right naked when she gets older or even now, she's at a time where.

She can decide if she wants to get naked or not.

And so to let her know, I'm in I'm empowering you to if you want to take your clothes off when it's just us, that's fine, but that's just our thing. And you know when other people come over, we don't do that.

That's our special thing.

Yeah, because I notice myself getting.

Irritated, not irritated, but annoy because like, like I mean grandparents in general obviously older than us, but even my dad, even on her dad's parents' side, like why are you naked?

Where are your clothes? Like this whole like it's bad to be naked, and I'm like, chill out, everybody, Like, first of all, this is all family. We're in the crib. It's hot, you know.

But then so and I want to be able to approach that without them feeling like I'm completely crazy.

But at the same time, like.

I do, like there's nothing wrong with our bodies and everybody else is crazy. So it's like trying to raise a European style child.

No, I totally get that, but I think also like I'm hyper sensitive to it because of my work.

I can't trust anybody, can I think you absolutely can't trust anyone unless they fucking personally. I mean even this can I'm sure there's stories that contradict this. Unless they raise you personally through your whole life and didn't do anything weird there, then they can raise your kid.

But even there's stories that go both ways on that, you know.

Yeah, So I would err on the side of caution and be like, you know what, we're gonna have our naked parties when it's just us and that's it. And you know, when we have company in our home, it's close time, right.

Right.

I think another topic that I I feel like I want to be the hippie mother about it, but there's still.

That conservative, protective person in me.

Not even protective because I know, like like if she's say, like, my daughter is safe between me and her father, you know, but what do you think about children of the opposite sex being naked around their parents? Like the little boy being naked, the little boy seeing his mother naked until he's eleven, right, or the little girls seeing her naked father nake, her father naked till she's ten twelve, Like you know, like I know Iri has been around her father naked.

I mean she's seen her father naked. Yeah, you know that's not weird. I mean, well, you're saying, but for how long? How long? What's acceptable? When at one point is it weird? Yeah?

I think dad stopped doing that recently, Like it was like, okay, we're not shying.

I mean the hippie and me wants to be like, well, sociding it's on the body and there is no time limit. But then the other top part of me is like, well, do I want to see my dad naked right now?

Hell? No? Right? Like, did I want to see my dad naked when I was twelve? Hell no? Now twelve.

I do remember being like four or five and like my days take baths with like with me, And then I remember when you started putting on like swimming trunks.

Even Alana was talking about this and she was like, I would get so mad. She's like, after like five, I'm like, why are you wearing those trunks? Like kitt naked? We're getting in the bathtub. So there was like you still remember.

They kids don't really understand, because I do remember being like, why are you gonna wear your swimming drunks?

You're so weird? Right, but you don't know.

But also, oh, this is really creepy and weird. But I read it in a psychology book.

That men can't control their arousals.

No, not that that's also true like after a certain age, like yeah, like a twelve, I guess like a fully developed or almost going through purebretty young woman shouldn't sit in her father's laugh because like in their anatomy, like just this the pure skim of a skin and like cause their.

Dicks to get hard.

And I have nothing to do with it, with with how they're feeling, and it maybe even make them feel awkward. But there's this I don't know what philosopher whatever this was, but there's like this.

Whole it's like a pretty famous one. Not you're talking.

About the Oedipus complex, but yeah, yeah, you probably know better than me. No, you know, it's like we're at a certain age and they're they're babies and maybe like four or three, they you go through this phase where you are in love with their campus it sucks, yes, and it's a pretty extreme like philosophy, like you want to marry your mother, you want to kill your father.

It's like almost how it All kids go through it.

Yeah, and I do remember this is a very strange story of tell and I'm probably gonna get judged, but I just remember I never even asked my dad about this.

I had to be like four, and I remember like he was leaving and I tried.

He was giving me a kisso mine. I try to like slip my tongue. He's like, oh no.

No, no, no, no, don't do that. No, like her mom, only, that's totally normal.

You're not gonna get judge for that.

That buying some shit, you know, like I try to cuss my time, like what the hell are you doing?

Like, what the fuck are you talking about? That? No? That okay, So don't.

Flip tongue, ind uth mouth, don't ask mom, what the hell are you negative? But it's true, like that's a part of our human nature that we're testing social shit out and we're trying to figure out what's okay for us and what's not.

So I mean, well you.

Think about that like that very I mean, and we're totally talking about like in a heterosexual world because that's all we know right now, you know, But that was totally normal. I Mean, my mom says she remembers when I went through that phase and I asked her. I was like, Mommy, can I just please marry Pop? I love him so much. I want to get married to him. And she's like, she's going through this's in love with her dad right now.

I'm not going to take it personally.

No, And it's because kids they go through it and they love their parent of the opposite sex. So so much and they say it into phase and they grow out of it.

It's nothing to feel weird about.

It is like our initial like That's why we're so affected by our parents and our love for our parents as adults, because that's literally the first experience of love of the opposite sex that we ever have.

That's our first impression of like love.

That's why like you I have daddy issues or mommy issuanes because sometimes they have be issues.

Can I have apple? Yes? Baby? Oh my god?

Our children are very needy this episode.

I think they're Kidi and John.

One moment please, Oh, but you guys are talking about like what age can you see your parent of the opposite sex naked?

And I think you know, baby is they have no idea they're showering. They don't know.

I think once they start questioning, and once they start realizing what that is, then it's probably not appropriate to shower together anymore.

So we often say like four or five, so because they can identify it, it's no longer appropriate. Well because they're just sort of asking questions like what's that? What you know? And they think, but isn't that.

The whole point of like like you want like being able to answer the question and make it.

Isn't it more awkward to take it away suddenly than to I think.

The question would be like, you know, if the rules in our home aren't you know, protect my body, and I do this when I'm alone, and the question is like, well, why is daddy naked when we're in the shower, Then you're.

Like, okay, well, what is daddy naked when we're in the shower. Maybe we shouldn't do that anymore.

I think as much as you teach your children this is what a vagina and penis is, they really don't understand what that is until they're like four or.

Five and they realize like, oh, I get it.

That's your penis and that's your private part, and this is my vagina and this is my private part. So I think once they start making that distinction, then it can be like okay, then you can have your private time with that. You don't have to be all together. Once they're asking questions about it, I think is when you're like, Okay, we.

Shouldn't do that.

Yeah. I mean I remember growing up my mom being very open and naked all the time. It was me and her for most of my childhood, and my brother wasn't born until I was thirteen, so it was just me and my mom. She was a single parent, and so being seeing another female body wasn't unnormal to me, So I never really had to like kind of like identify or figure out the other side of that, like as far as with the father, but now with Irine and her father, I mean, I guess it's a choice

It was very casual. She was, she's she's not even three yet, you know what I mean.

So but like I said, like the hippie and me wants to be like, oh, it doesn't matter, but then it does to a certain extent, it does matter to me. I don't know, there's a lot of people out here that are listening that maybe have different views, And if you do, please like I want to know what your perspective is, Like, what what is it that like do you and your husband or your partner. Do you still show body parts to your child or expose yourself when changing or showering with your child?

And how old is that child? What age does it stop? Does it stop? Because I remember you mentioning, like it's just like a like in Europe.

People like, yeah, right, yeah, so we think, like you know, we are very conservative in the US. This is we're all about our privacy. In Europe, you have nude beaches, you see people who are nude on the use or television, and so it's a little bit more accepted there.

But at the same time, like we're not in Europe.

And so as a result, I feel like the sexual assault rates very much much lower in Europe too, Like, isn't it because it's so restricted here, It's almost like people are less like exposed, so they're more it's more of like a forbidden food.

Not really, I wouldn't say so, Like sexual assault is not like a crime of passion.

It's a crime of power and control. So like I.

Like I want to physically be powerful and take control over you. It's not because I want to have sex so badly and I want to have sex with you. It's more of like I, you are powerless in this situation and.

I want to have the power over you. Yeah, so that's like irrelevant.

I wouldn't say that sexual assault is lower in Europe. I really don't know the statistics on that, but.

It's just so rampant in general.

I mean, I would say if it were a lower then maybe they're having more respect for women's rights and then respecting them more as powerful figures rather than it be like a sexual thing.

You know.

What I've what I was thinking is what about like same sex couples, Like how does that work? Like you know what I mean, like to like two men that have a daughter, you know, how does that work?

Do they? Like I would say, to bathe her until she can bathe herself. Like maybe it's.

Not, but they don't have to be making for them, but they can bathe her without, you know.

And I'm just curious if there's anybody out there that's the same sex relationship. I'm just curious, Like that's such an interesting thing that I don't feel like many people talk about, you know, like the rules of that, Like I mean, I mean, like we say rules, but you know, just the process, yeah, yeah, or even the conversation, like they may not even be a boundary because I'm sure there's families that it's not a big feel like super really committed hippies that don't us.

Authentic valley girl hippie. I'm not a first class and be a hippie. They starve trail mix in first class.

But yeah, I mean, I'm always I try to be super non judgmental, but I guess like that's our human like generally we judge, but I do. I would like to know someone else to perspective, because hey, maybe we'll be you know, persuaded to think otherwise.

Right right, I mean, whatever happens in your home is totally fine, but I think you also have to think about because we're not this hippie European society. Your child also has to live in society as it is now, and they.

Have to go to school in society. So you have.

To make these rules and say, okay.

But this is where we live reality.

The reality is this, and they have to live in that reality.

You know, he was crazy as hi kiya.

And she told me like a munch her when I was much younger than she got.

Married and she's like she's like hell, yeah, I'm gonna get married. She was pregnant.

She's like, I'm gonna leave the kids at home, and I'm gonna pretend like I left, and I'm gonna watch how my husband interacts with those kids.

And this is at this point she'd been married like five years something like this. Oh, not like left her husband, but like let them know.

She's She's like, I will pretend like I leave the house, and I don't monitor.

How you're interact with our kids. I don't give a fuck if you are my husband. I don't give a fuck who you are. I don't trust anybody.

She's like, you cannot trust anyone. And I used to really think she was crazy and had trust major trust issues. But the truth is is you can't trust anyone, and you have to like you can't.

I heard her story about this woman.

She had been married for ten years, she had a baby, the baby was nine months old. She was serving through her husband's of ten years computer and found child born oh yeah.

And was sick.

Yeah, and you know they ended up going to like therapy, and obviously she didn't get past that. But and she like as a reason the stressed cause or get breast cancer because it was just such a heavy burden.

But and she's like, none of his.

Friends that they had known collectively or hate known for him personally, had ever suspected anything like that. But like when it comes to sex, I mean not even sex, but just comes to people, there's some weird fucking shit.

Well people that are sick, and there are people that are perpetrators and do this.

I mean, we had a case where it was same.

It was like a nine month old, like a baby, like he was still in diapers and this mom just felt like something's up and she's like, I don't know, like your dad. She was telling her husband like, your dad is giving me this weird feeling. And he was getting pissed, like what do you mean this is my dad. She's like, I don't know, like your grandpa, right, yeah, yeah, the paternal grandpa.

Your dad's giving me a weird feeling. And he was getting pissed, like what are you talking about my dad?

She's like, your dad always wants to change the baby's diaper, is always like the first weak I'll go, I'll go. And so it causes big like they're about to divorce, and so what they did but talk about their privilege, but they got they were able to get like one of those like hidden cameras and a bear, and she put the hidden camera in the baby's nursery and the grandpa, yeah, was molesting the nine month old.

And so she was like she knew.

And that's like a whole other conversation that we talk about, Like when you talk to your kids about their body, it's always teaching them to go with their gut. So because yeah, and so really fostering that in kids, like go with your gut. We especially, I think a lot of women do this and who grow up in close families.

They don't want their kids to be rude.

So they're always like, you know, we get to this family party, go hugging kiss everyone, and if your child doesn't want you, then you embarrassed and you're like, don't be rude, right, and you sort of force them to go.

Hugging kiss everyone. And we're teaching our kids to not trust their gut. And so if they don't want to hug and kiss, okay, that's okay. Maybe you're rule with then you have to say hi and wait to everyone and that's okay. But no, you don't need to physically go hug and kiss everyone, and those are signs too. If you if you're a child, you justly has no problem doing that. But there's one person that they don't

Give them a hug, give Papa hug, give you know, this person a hug, and I need to start doing that. Is that real f or maybe it's a way. Yeah, I don't want to say hi today, and who cares if sorry, they don't want to say hi.

It goes back the giving zero fucks about anybody else's opinion, because that's important.

Yeah, no, one hundred percent. I think that's really important. I think there was something else be like you wanted to touch on as far as you got a family friend, I remember, oh.

Oh, well, this is more to like empowering, like just the conversation to your kid around like their body. I had a friend, I'll hear my dad's friend. She has a daughter, careful whose daughter? I think she was like fourteen, like a freshman in high school, and she was like adamant that she wouldn't let She was like the nicest, sweetest, oh my god, sweetest child, like innocent, fourteen year old, and she don't want her to get a two piece for the summer. Oh right, And I said, because she did.

Not anybody's fault.

But I just was telling her, like, be careful what you say, because at the end of.

The day, here's my whole thing. Like even when I was I'm super nude, so it's talking for me to judge. But maybe even when I was breastfeeding, my best friend said something to me. So I don't even know if we mentioned that she's gonna listen to keep bitch. She says something to me that was so offensive to me, and she said, you know, I don't have a problem with you breastfeeding in public, but you know, you got to consider other people. Other people are pervs, and you're

Weird ass eyes. No, so we can't try. You know, I don't want to. I don't want to pay No, no, no, no, no, you guys. Okay, you guys gotta go play out here. You no, go back and love her. You can take that out there, Okay, take the sword out there. Bye, it's too loud.

Go on, babe, Okay, No, you're right.

And also, I mean you know, I mean, I mean.

Like so even like so that's what the mom was saying, Like, you know, she has on those boobs, She's not gonna be wearing no two pieces in front of these men. But my biggest thing is who are these like Obviously we've we've brushed up on that, we don't know everybody's emma,

Like, oh, there's men around, put some.

Clothes on, which is true, but also what men are giving you weird vibes that you are in such close proximity with, you.

Know, so yeah, yes, well twofold one, like that's not sexual. Breastfeeding, it's not weird, and so many people are doing it, and more power to you this whole like free the nip movement, right, hey, like let's let's not make breastfeeding this thing to be ashamed of. And if you want to breastfeed in public, fine, but I'm off that tangent. I'm your best friends is fine with this whole issue about you know.

Sorry not to interduct. If you don't have a child and you never breastfed, then you just don't understand. So that probably has a lot to do with it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think also with.

You know, this whole thing about like you can't wear this bikini, or you have to wear.

This one piece.

I'm sorry with these kids, you guys should see that they are like silent motioning, yelling, like doing the like counter three.

In silence your brother. My kid always writes to eat. My kid goes like food food, I want rasber.

I think with the whole bathing soup conversation, I think you're right, it's finding that balance and I don't want to shame you.

This is your body, love your body.

You want to wear two peeres wear you're fourteen years old, for everybody else is wearing two people or.

It's finding that compromise, like, hey, you know what, you want to wear two piece with your friends, let's do it. Can we wear one piece at the family party like a tankini?

Right?

I think it's being able to have that conversation with your daughter and not just restricting it.

But if you know, looking so strange and everybody's like, how do you feel you know?

Right? Right? Do you feel embarrassed? Or do you feel like good about it? That's a that's a good I like that. Do you feel good? Do you feel confident? Why do you not feel good? You look good? Or like right? Okay, Well, if you don't feel good, then don't wear it, and it's it's hard to have to fit. I didn't have answers for so many of these questions.

Because you no one knows your child better than you, and so whatever conversations you have, you have to have, and you have to find what works for your family right and you have. It's about having that open communication. I think we all want that.

A lot of us didn't have good relationships with our moms. Growing up.

In high school, we were demons. I mean, I went to high school with Aerka.

We were I am immortal.

I am so scared about like the twelve thirteen fourteen, like twelve twelve through eighteen.

Literally I was a fucking demon, right and you just know every.

Fucking thing are so hot.

In the pants. Oh my god, even I did so much. Now that I look back, I'm like, oh my god, you so many fucking perves.

Oh my god.

So Erica and I met when we were eleven playing soccer, and we've always been We were in sports together and went to high school together. In retrospect, and we talk about our high school experience playing soccer. We had some pervy ass coaches that our parents trusted and you don't know you trust you with these people, and like, actually my soccer coach was getting us wasted taking us to concerts.

And you know, and he was He's so cool, was eating his trade.

Yeah, so we're talking about like we were at that age where we're like, fuck our parents. We were not close then, and now as you get out of that. I mean once I got to college and I was like I'm alone and money, you know, right, I missed my mom And so you have this phase where you're really close, you have this open relationship that you fucking hate each other in high school, and then you go you really missed them.

And so it's this balance.

That you're gonna have to find with your kids, knowing that that's gonna come, never gonna happen.

I'm never for life. I'm so thankful Lena miss the scorpio. Like I couldn't be like a cancer with a scorpio. I'm a scorpio child. I know you're my poor mother, my poor labra mom. Oh my god, drove her. I did I know I drew my parents insane, Like, well, I reas a Taurus, so she doesn't give me a run for my money. But I feel like I understand her. I feel like we have an understanding, Like we understand are.

Like crazy, ye are like crazy stubbornness, like independence are respects because hopefully, I like, I love watching her be independent and like learn things and like kind of go in and out of her little attitudes where I see my mom watch this happen with her, and she's like losing.

She's like, oh, she should not be doing that.

And I'm like, see, that's what you tried to do with me, and I rebelled, And that's exactly why I'm not going to do that with Irene.

Not that my mom did a.

Bad job at all, Right, It's just like that was there was no stopping me once I made a decision.

Right. You know, it's good to empower your kids. It's definitely great.

It's finding that balance, So you don't want to be super super strict parents for your kids are just gonna be like, well f off, I'm I'm gonna go party.

And we already know.

Those you know, those girls whose parents were super super strict and they happened to be the sluttiest girls in school, and not not to shame them or anything, but it was because they didn't have the opportunity to explore themselves.

So this is how it was coming out. But even also if like the way I was taught about.

You know, from the very beginning about body parts and sex, I think it really kind of uh explains the story of how I was as a teenager. And I was very secretive, and I didn't feel comfortable talking to my mom about anything sexual that I was interested in, because everything was like a secret.

Or like not naughty, or like you don't do that, ladies don't do this.

And Jude, because of that, I didn't want to tell her anything when I lost my virginity, like I did not tell her when I.

Thought about getting birth control.

I did not tell her when you know, all just did it all these firsts that And then I had friends who had relationships with their parents were that was the first person they told, right, they couldn't wait to tell their mom, right, and their mom probably died inside.

But I still listen, you're right, You're right.

I mean it's also a cultural thing, right, and we make fun of this all the time.

We were like why moms, they like right down for the get down.

But I don't understand how white because that wouldn't come out differently.

But there's something to learn from the white mombs, right, like Okay, oh wow, maybe I don't want to be as open and talk about my sexual partners with my mom, but maybe I want to have the conversation of like, oh, you're the about having sex, Like as much as I hate this, like and as much as I really really want you to wait, or I want to make sure that you're in a healthy relationship if this is what you want to do, like, let's look at your options.

Right when I told my mom I had sexually cried.

I mean especially he hasn't know your friend so hard cried I would, but right she cried.

And then I felt ashamed. But again that's what I've been talking about this whole time. I felt a shame. It made it about her because you're like, oh shit.

And I don't blame you, mom, I know, Mom, trust me.

If if you're listening to this, if I when I when iri, or if oh god, you're gonna lose it. But I just like, yeah, it did make me feel like, oh, well, I'm never telling you anything again.

Testing the waters.

But then you have no idea how you're going to react or how your mom's going to react. And I can say now, like I can be talk all this like, oh I want my daughter to be in the thing, but when it comes down to it, who knows how I'll react. I'm working now, taking the steps now to try to train myself to like, because you know me, just like my facial reaction. I'm really bad fat like you're talking about earlier, like being able to like train

Train for it.

When I when like you know, like deep seated emotions are involved, it's really it's really difficult.

But yes, you're right, I should be able to do that.

But you know, like people kids are having sex a lot younger. So what if at twelve thirteen years old.

Your daughters are like, I want to have sex. I'm ready. That's really hard. We expect like, oh, absolutely fucking not.

I And you're gonna I'm going to give you a PowerPoint for.

This be happening and I'll be coming to my office. It was very pleasant. So that's my whole point.

It's like it's so easy to say, like we're gonna do this, but your kids surprise you every day, I'm sure, and they're gonna surprise you with that like God forbid or you know, it's something that you don't expect and you're gonna have to sort of deal with that and maybe your role is well, you know what, actually, no, we're not gonna look at that. Like our role in our home is that you're you make sure you love someone.

And so it's.

About asking those questions because that's scary.

It's scary. I mean even like when I started.

My period, Like literally the first thing my mom told me when I started my period was now you can have babies.

That's that's like, that's fear.

Well, she's putting fear in me, like those type of things, like she thought that putting fear in me is like but if it just like I don't know, she did the best she could and I know what I might have said the same exact thing.

You know, you don't know what you're gonna say that exactly. I don't. I don't.

But but those those little things that you think you're making the right choices, you just don't know.

You never know, because as parents, you make split.

Decisions, like you make decisions in a split second sometimes and you don't realize how those.

Decisions can affect your child.

Like years from now, it might be something that you made that decision quickly and you never thought about it again. But that thing, that decision stuck with that child, Yeah, for the rest of their life.

That was a defining moment for them, right.

I think it's about being putting dads on the same page too. I mean, my parents obviously did not have that conversation about my period and.

I got my period and it was just my dad home and I was like, oh, that's so good.

I was like, I got my period and the only thing he's like, call your mother at work right now. But also when we have this conversation about talking to your heads about their bodies, making sure dads are gonna get with it, Yeah.

They're going the same page as you.

Because I I'll snap the dad real quick, like no, no, no, don't get on her about homeping.

She just knowsou me, so I'll say that. Yeah, I mean because like, don't make her feel guilty or ashamed. So he's on the same page because you know, especially when you're co parenting, you have to be in alignment. So there's not these confused mixed messages too.

Right, there's never gonna be perfect alignment. No, there's not.

But you're saying, like, hey, at my house, this is the rule, Like I would appreciate if we can have stability, and this is what we do. Like if at my house we're gonna call it a vagina, please call it a vagina at your house, you know.

And this is why.

Yeah, and this is why we're gonna send this link to our baby.

Daddies on anything else is encrypted locked? Why can't I click on anything else? I know for you, not for your ears. Thank you so much for coming to to us. I feel so much smarter now.

Yeah, I feel smarter too, And I hope that you guys listening got some good tips empowering information.

Yeah, from our dear friend Jessica Romo.

She'll be back with her expertise because she is our expert on everything.

I found our friend expert. She does everything. Well.

I guess that concludes today's sex education.

Sex education.

If you guys have any comments questions for Jessica, we can.

Relay the messages. If you dem us expert in the subject line.

You guys may feel so you're like our smartest friend. If you have any questions for this expert, No, seriously, if you do.

Because she has lots of answers and she likes to talk, she can cancels at our small feet.

So yeah, again, you can find us at Good Mom's Bad Underscore, Bad Choices.

You can DM us there. You can also email us.

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Our Twitter is good Underscore Bad Moms BAM. Okay, so follow us on Twitter. We'll tweet, we'll tweet back at you.

We're gonna start tweeting this week. This is a lot of outlets, guys, give us a break. There's a lot of work. We're also like raising humans too, trying not to fust them up. All right, guys, well and make you avoid to stop me, because I.

Ain't gonna stop it now, don't stop on.

The radio and radio show anything.

Go.

Let's tell it like it is and how it could be, how it was, and of course how it should be.

Those who thinks thirty to have a choice.

Turn the radio wall. Will that stop us? Then?

Damn?

All right?

Then come on, Ben, Let's talk about sex, baby being, Let's talk about again a winn avenue.

Let's talk about all of the.

Things after bad man.

Maybe, let's talk about saying. Let's talk about.

Sex, a little bit of little meta, let's talk about let's talk about sin.

How does it trying to make any man's life