Why Paying off Debt is Important & Attainable

holiday shopping? Uh, just humble, you know. Yeah, I just want to let you know it's still there guys, if you didn't know. But we're mainly talking about why paying it off is important. A lot of people with student loans that have been on pause for the year are going to start seeing those bills come back again, and we want to remind you why it's important to pay off your debt and inspire you and give you some data,

some statistics about why it is attainable. So whether you are motivated by a good word or a good statistic, we got both for you today. But first our sponsors. Yes, today's episode is brought to you by the Debt Freedom road Map. So like I said before, it is not too early to start thinking about your financial goals, especially

if one of those goals is debt freedom. So over at Modern Frugality, I have created a debt freedom roadmap to help you see where you're at on the road to debt and financial freedom, to make sure you've hit all your major landmarks prior and what various detours might look like. So if you want a little more clarity about the financial road ahead, visit modern frugality dot com slash debt free to get your free roadmap. Also brought

to you by me telling. Because you know what this podcast is, you have to pay for some advertising jail. Come on, yeah, me telling you about my dear friend Jenna Ball. That's right, she's getting a shout out because again it's half my podcast. Jenna has been a friend of mine since the tenth grade, and like any good and refined thing, she has only gotten better and cooler over the decades. She is a woman of class, character, competence, care, kindness, generosity, intelligence,

and humor so much more. You all just need to know this, and I'm telling you this because I did recently use my friendship with Jenna and an experience that we had as an example on the Boundaries episode. I did not use her name, but she listened because she's a good friend and she listens to this show, and

she realized that it was about her. And also she doesn't shrink back from anything, including making sure that our relationship is good and to let me know that she cares about her to apologize to me about the example that I had used, when really the real apology belongs to me. This is not the thing that people should know about you, Jenna. They need to know that you're

an amazing woman whose friendship I really value. And I need to remember that people actually listen to my podcast even when I give examples about my life that happened ten years ago. Anyhow, So you know that I learned about setting boundaries in relationship with Jenna in one particular area, and also she's an amazing person. To Jenna. To Jenna, Uh, if you are confused, definitely check out our setting financial boundaries with family and friends and you will put the

pieces together. She called me later and was like, Jill, was that about me? Oh my gosh, I cannot lie. Yes, it was, but I hold no grudges about this, and my goodness, Jenna you're going to get a shout out because you're an amazing friend and it's been ten years. I was just using it as an example, but yeah, that was quite something. And I learned that at least three people listen to the podcast, so your mom, my, mom, and Jenna. Yeah, so thanks Jenna. Al Right, so let's

get into this topic about debt. I think most of the people who listen to Frugal Friends have a similar view that they want to be debt free. I think that is a view that many listeners hold. So we're gonna going to convince you that debt is bad because I feel like you already have your own reasons for knowing that, but we are going to reiterate and emphasize some of the reasons why you should get out of

debt that are not just financial. So if you have been a little jaded by let's reinvigorate you and reinspire you to head down this journey that you already want to be on. And so our first article is from Money Crashers and it's seventeen reasons why you should get out of debt. What do you think about this one? Jill? Yes,

I think it's a fantastic motivator. So, like you said, Jen, this isn't supposed to convince you to become debt free, because I know that most of our listeners are are already in that space and really want their debt gone, but to help motivate us in that direction. And I like the holistic approach that they took in this article, giving headlines to different categories and listing out financial benefits, mental benefits, physical benefits, relational benefits, each supported by multiple

bullet points underneath it. So I think we're not going to go through all of the reasons. It's definitely an article worth checking out, but I think big picture, there are a lot of benefits to our whole person, not just monetary, that can happen when we become debt free. Yeah.

I had a lot of flashbacks reading this because I remember when I had fifty dollars of debt and I was a single woman making thirty five thousand dollars a year before taxes, and I felt a lot of these things, and now that we are debt free, I feel freedom from a lot of them. And so I think it's so important, Like a lot of people will debate should I just go gung ho paying off debt and get it all gone, or should I balance it with other

financial goals? And I think that decision for you really comes down to how much of these things on this list are you feeling. So if you're feeling a lot of negative mental, physical, emotional, relational things on this list, and I was, And so that's when going gung ho and pedal to the metal is more beneficial to you than any math equation that can show you you'll make more money if you invest over paying off debt whatever. So that's kind of my view on all of this stuff.

I love that, Jen, That's such great advice to help figure out and suss out what is more advantageous for my whole person, again, not just monetarily, which direction should I head? For sure? So we'll start out with a few of the financial benefits. Um So for me, the first one on this list more free income. So people are always looking on how do I pinch pennies? How do I save money? Or like my budget is stretched so thin, I don't have a single extra penny, how

do I save more? And I'm like, well, what if the answer is more money? And so paying up debt instantly gives you a raise, and so that was initial why for me because I thought I wanted to be a stay at home parent. Now as a parent, I realized that's the last thing that I want, but I wanted to have that option, and I knew if I couldn't make money, I needed to be a better steward of any money that we had coming in. So I liked number three within this category, which talks about being

debt free. It creates less risk. When we are in debt, we are just one financial blow away from disaster, which is what this article talks about, that any one thing could really derail us financially. But if we are debt free, we have less risk because we're not in debt. We don't owe anything to anybody where they could collect wages or repossess your belongings, or you name it, going into foreclosure, being evicted, needing to file for bankruptcy. Those things are

heightened when we carry debt versus when we don't. And then it's also linked to your point gen of having more income, so then we have more ability to use that income to save up for those emergencies. So it's almost like a win win, like a twofold thing where not only are we at less risk when we're debt free, but then we have more money to put towards making sure we're even less at risk. Absolutely. I also like number four is being debt free gives you a better

credit score. And credit scores are so mysterious even to credit experts because there are five components to a credit score, and we won't get into it. But the most important is your payment history. Obviously, if you are making regular payments that are over the minimum and trying to pay off debt, that increases your score. But people are scared to pay off debt because they think they need like a thirty percent debt to limit ratio that's just a

max like they prefer you have zero. And also they're scared of their credit length being shortened when you close out those accounts. That's a very minimal part of the score, that's like mid level. But the second most important part is the amount of debt you have compared to your credit limit, and so the more debt you pay off, especially like student loan debt, your credit score will start

to increase. And then if you have a credit card that has no annual fee that you just keep in your closet underneath the shoes in the shoe box that you very rarely use, and you just use it to build up a credit history. Like the history length. You're going to be golden. You're gonna be fine. You will not have to worry about your credit score. And so is not that hard to get a good credit score or an excellent credit score, and paying off debt greatly

helps you in that. Yeah. I think that's really helpful advice to hear from you and to read in this article, because I think that was like a myth that I had always thought, especially if you're aimed at purchasing large items like a home or something. It's like, all right, how do I get a good credit score? And I don't know, should I pay it off of pay off my decks? How's that going to affect It's like, no, it's good to pay off your debt. Yes, yeah, And

a credit score is important. It saves you so much money in the long run. It is important. It is not something that should be worried about so much, though. Pay off the debt, get those accounts closed, and then do it little by little after that. The last one under the category of financial benefits that I do want to highlight is that being debt free can create better job prospects, and I would add at least more rewarding

job prospects. And the reasoning that they give is that if you are in debt, then oftentimes we can feel stuck to the job that we're doing and living paycheck to paycheck and not really able to do what we want with the money. But we need to just be giving it to all of our bills and the debt versus.

If we take away that pressure, if we pay off our debt and we no longer have that bill, so to speak, there is greater freedom in that ability to not have to live paycheck to paycheck potentially or feeling more reward from the job that you're working because you're able to work that job and enjoy the benefits of what you're earning financially and not just giving it away

every month or every other week. And also if you if you don't like your job regardless, then it does give you more permission and freedom to look elsewhere and not have to worry about, oh no, what's going to happen if there's a little bit of a lapse, or if I choose to take a pay cut to do something more rewarding, or if it's going to take me a little bit longer to build myself up to a

certain amount of income. So it just creates greater freedom and flexibility and the potential of finding more rewarding work when you don't put those pressures on yourself. Yeah, and I would also add that better job prospects don't always

have to mean you're settling for less money. It's estimated that if you stay in your career, in your job for five or more years, and I'm sure I'm going to miss quote this, but you could lower your total income earning potential by fifty Whereas if you are increasing either being promoted or doing job hops to places where you can increase your income by ten every three to four years, you can make a lot more money over time. But if you're not financially secure, then it's going to

make going to different jobs a lot more stressful. So you have the potential to take those risks if you are debt free and don't have to worry about that bill in case of job hop goes south. The next category is the impact that it can have on us mentally, to be dead free, and the first one listed in

this category is just that there's less stress. It is stressful to be in debt, and for some of us it's more stressful than to others, but still there's a degree of stress that comes with knowing that your money is not yours, a good portion is owed to somebody else. It is gaining interest that you also have to owe that. It just comes with so much mental space that it takes up emotional space that it takes up causing stress. And when we pay that off, we take away that

very significant stressor mm hmm, oh my gosh. I remember having like being in an apartment and sitting in my living room with my couch that I got from Salvation Army that my roommate hated, and feeling the weight of that mental load of looking at like my profile and nabbiant and seeing all of those debts and knowing how

little I made. That is every time I hear something like this, it takes me back to a very insignificant moment, but it takes me back to that moment I'm just feeling completely overwhelmed and hopeless, and so now that I don't have that like I have so many other things to be stressed about. It's so so great, I don't that's one less thing I have to be stressed about. That's a particular type of stress. When you realize that you are in debt beyond your means for repayment. That's overwhelming.

It's an overwhelming pressure that causes stress and anxiety sometimes worry, which then can impact our sleep, our thoughts throughout the day. And we'll get into this more and more. But so much then of what we're now going to be identifying even throughout this article is related to the ways stress impacts us relationally, mentally, and physically, all related to the stress that debt induces and a massive reason to get

rid of it. Yeah, well, that leads into number nine on the list is paying off debt gives you better cognitive function. So in my course on cutting impulse spending, we talk a lot about how making better decisions means you make fewer impulse purchases, and that comes down to having better cognitive function, which means usually making fewer decisions during the day, YadA YadA. But having less debt naturally

improves cognitive function. So at two thousand seventeen study published in Frontiers and Psychology points to numerous studies showing that experiencing poverty, both in real life and laboratory conditions, impaired people's attention span, working memory, and self control. So in the article says, it's a problem that feeds on itself. Obviously, you want to have less impulse spending. You're trying to

pay off debt. So it's just something that you kind of have to know at first you're going to suck at like you have to be okay with that and say, Okay, I'm gonna suck at this right now, but I'm gonna keep trying. I'm gonna keep getting better. And then as you get better at one, the other one improves, and it just compounds on itself. And so then at the end, it says a two thousand seventeen study at the University of Singapore found that when people paid off debt, it

reverses these problems. It found that participants reduce their debt, their cognitive function rose significantly, and they felt less anxious

and became better decision makers. It's so interesting that this principle works both directions, that on the one hand, it can compound upon itself the stress and the way that that impacts every other aspect of our lives negatively, and conversely, when we are debt free, it can have positive impact on every aspect of our personhood when that's no longer present. So there is hope in this, and that's the goal of what we want to walk away with is motivation

and hope to become debt free. Yeah. I know people place and myself included a lot of blame on themselves for impulsive behavior and making bad financial decisions. It's like, I want to do the right thing, but I always do the wrong thing, And so part of that has to do with where you are financially and the cognitive load that that takes on you. But know that you

have the power to overcome it little by little. You just can't expect yourself to be perfect right out the game, yes, because it does take a toll on us, like we're talking about, it impairs our ability to think clearly, It has negative impacts on our bodies, and so we can't expect ourselves to be fantastic at this when there's a

very real stress or happening. As it relates to physical benefits becoming debt free, research has shown that those without debt related stressors have fewer illnesses, and the article sites a survey that was done by the Associated Press that showed people with high levels of debt related stress are more than three times as likely to suffer from things like ulcers or digestive problems than their counterparts with lower

debt stress or no debt stress. And that's just shocking to me, the ways that our physical bodies can be so connected to our financial lives and the very real reality that it can have on our bodies that the weight and the cost of the right it's not just financial, the cost is physical. And then how does that, I mean, speaking of compounding itself, then that creates medical bills to be caring for our bodies in the midst of these stressors.

It can feel overwhelming, But again I want to say, there's hope in this, and it then benefits us physically to be out of debt because we don't experience that. There are fewer illnesses when we are not, when our bodies aren't trying to manage and deal with stress and anxiety and overwhelm. Yeah, I know that firsthand because I got shingles. I still can't believe this Jen, I did so many side hustles, and I worked myself up and within two months had contracted shingles two months into our

debt payoff journey. Yeah, and I actually I'm not the only person that has stressed themselves into shingles, So you know, yes, stress takes itself on our bodies. Although I do think that's a bit of an example of being stressed about the debt repayment process even and I think that that's a fine line that yes, let's allow this to motivate us to get out of debt and work towards it, but let's also be careful to not put unnecessary pressures

on ourselves in the process. So once you've bought into debt, like paying off debt and being intense about it, that's fantastic, But let's keep a pulse on this because it is also not a goal that is worth sacrificing every aspect of our personhood to achieve it as fast as possible. There's also quality of life that is necessary in the process so that there can be longevity in it to pay it off quickly, but also to not overwhelm ourselves beyond the point of return or beyond what we can

handle in order to get at that goal. I don't sacrifice yourself on the altar of becoming debt free because process can become stressful. Yes, that was so eloquently said. Don't sacrifice yourself on the altar of becoming debt free. Absolutely no reason to do that, Thanks Jim. Yeah, so I want to jump into the relationship benefits. Are you okay with that? Let's do it. Okay, so better relationships. This is something I did not realize what happened during

our debt payoff journey. And at first it was I don't know. It was kind of like the death of one person but allowed somebody else to emerge from the ashes. That's so dramatic. But the article says like being in debt stirs up like negative emotions and those can fill spill over into your relationships. I didn't realize that as much, but I realized that. So debt kept me from doing

things with my friends. The anxiety about debt. Like I remember my friends were going to Disney sometime, and not even to the park, but just like went around Disney to support one of our friends that was doing a half marathon there. And I came at the last minute I went, but like all day, I struggled with should I go, should I spend the money? And that was when I was not even trying to pay off debt,

so it affected me. Then I wasn't cognitive of it, but I was so scared to pay off debt because I thought stuff like that was going to happen, and it did. But I actually so I shed these friends that only wanted to do things that cost money, and then I found friends. I was forced to find friends that wanted to spend time with me and get to know me versus just do activities and go get drinks.

And so I came out of it with really great friends, really really good relationships, and of much more quality than previous ones. Very interesting. You really brought that full circle,

even though it felt dramatic at first. That was with it though, Yeah and yeah related to better relationships, they just kind of suss out the specific types of relationships that could see improvement, like a stronger marriage or being a better parent, or being able to help others because you're able to turn more outward with your focus, with your finances, with your time and energy because you don't have debt taking up a lot of that, and I

just want to highlight the marriage piece. I think that if you are doing this together with a spouse, the step payoff journey, even though there are for sure bumps and even land mines in the road throughout this process, if you do it and go through this together, you will come out stronger on the other side, more unified, more understanding of one another, an incredible feeling of accomplishment, which will bond you greater to one another, which then

sets the stage for other goals that you can set as a couple. So my goodness, Yes, just even overcoming something, whether it's debt or anything else with a partner is incredible for that relationship. And this is one of the things that can be super helpful as you relate to one another. So I just affirm all of these pieces. And I think when we can learn to manage stress, whether it's debt related or otherwise, than yeah, we are

we're better for our relationships thrive. As a results, we experience better mental health, emotional health, understanding of ourself, all of these things. So I think relating to debt stress, learning to manage it while we're in the midst of it, and also just paying it off and getting rid of

that stressor is fantastic. Yes, absolutely so. Now that you know why it's important to pay off debt, our next article is meant to inspire you, to let you know that this is mathematically and mentally attainable for you to do this, because I think my biggest barrier before I started paying off debt was that I just didn't think it was possible. I had a lot of limiting mindset, like limiting beliefs, which we're going to talk about limiting

beliefs next week. But I thought it wasn't possible mathematically, and so for some people it's not going to be I had fifty dollars of debt and I was making thirty dollars as a single person. Like yes, Like I understand if you're in that situation, it's gonna be hard. But I wanted to give you some inspirational stories that we featured here on the show, and then also some statistics that may make you feel better about your financial situation.

I don't know. They're definitely not meant to scare you. We're not using scared tactics on the show, but we have had a lot of people on Frugal friends share their debt free stories from all walks of life. So Jill, push of them, do you stand out in your mind? Yeah, honestly, the debt payoffs that stand out to me are the ones where people pay off a lot of money on

a small income. So we've got an episode it was back in our archives at this point, but Sarah paid off over thirty thou dollars of debt as a single person, and so for her that was incredible given her life circumstances. Yeah, I have a list here of most of our debt payoff stories, not all of them, but if you want to write this down, this will also be in our show notes with links to these episodes. But we've got episode fourteen where Amanda her and her husband paid off

six figures of debt living in California. We've got episode eighteen where Allison and her family paid off six figures of debt on two teacher salaries. We got episode thirty five where Merrily and her family paid off another six figures of debt on a single income. And they did not do it super fast. I think it took them like six or seven years. So they were one of those stories where yeah, it took a little while. We're a family of four on a single income, and they

still did it. And I love to see merrily she's easy budget on Instagram and now she posts like she gets her eyebrows done, and she gets her nails done, and she gets like all these things she values now she like does them, which is so fun to see because it freed up income for her. We've got Chris Browning from Popcorn Finance. He lives in like l A in the l A area. He and his wife paid off their debt. We got Debt Kick and Mom Angela her family paid off debt. She's got a great YouTube channel.

And then Kate from Debt Free Life. She's an attorney. She paid off over six figures of debt. And that was episode. So people from all walks of life, all incomes, all living and financial situations, all time frames, all are capable of paying off debt, whether you're married, single, kids, no kids, whatever, Like there's a story for you. I know, we've got other stories in the archives where we've got one she paid off debt inn or forties, all kinds

of things. Yeah, I think that the biggest variable in this is how much time it's going to take. Yes, it's not a matter of how old you are, how much money you make. These are all factors, certainly how much debt you have. I think it's not a matter of if I can do it, it's just when. How long will it take? Based on the amount of money I make, the amount of debt I'm in, maybe my age,

other financial responsibilities. It's possible regardless of what those factors are for you, it's just time is going to be the question to answer. How much time will it take? Yeah, So this article is from debt dot com and it's just personal finance statistics, and so we want to read some of them for you that will hopefully encourage you or put some perspective on what is average, what's median,

and what is feasibly attainable. So the first one that I want to point out is in two thousand and sixteen, the average household earned seventy four thousand dollars and the average expenditures were fifty seven thousands, So that leaves around seventeen thousand and free cash flow for the average household. So the median income take home pay, which is more accurate, is sixty thousand, but that still leaves everyone, the average

American with over eleven thousand in free cash flow every year. Obviously, there are variables of where you live and what your circumstances are and how many kids you have and all of that, but yes, talking about on average what this

looks like and what we might have access to. And I think the point in looking at some of these statistics is to say a lot of our barriers to doing this or to be even making this a realistic goal for ourselves is I just I don't have enough money or I'm not going to be able to I don't make a lot. And then to say, well, let's look at what the average American makes and whether or not it's possible if income is actually a good reason to say that I can't do this. And I think

our argument is, no, it's not a good reason. We can based on what the median salary is or take home cash, this could be possible. Again, might take a while, but it's possible. Yeah, I know, fifty seven thousands in average expenditures is high for us. I mean we live in Florida, which is a lower cost of living state typically, but we live in a higher cost of living city. For our state, and we without being on any particular financial goal. I think we keep it under fifty for sure.

So it definitely varies, but this is attainable, this is feasible. Yeah, it is quite an interesting site because you can click on your state or various states and kind of see the statistics for what is the average amount of credit card debt, the average amount of student loan debt, the average amount of people who are filing for bankruptcy in that year, and so, yeah, it could be a motivator in either direction, whether you realize, oh, I actually carry

more debt than the average, or I carry less debt. I think either way it can be an encourage or and a and a motivator if statistics again are helpful for you. I know statistics are helpful for me more than like motivational speeches. So that's why. And the site is debt dot com slash statistics very easy if you are not driving, you can just pull it up on your phone and see. But yeah, the numbers motivate me. Yeah, if I'm over, I want to be average, you know.

And speaking of holidays, they talk about some of the statistics there. Since we are smack dab in the middle of holidays that the average Americans spends about one thousand fifty dollars on holiday decorations, food, gifts, shipping costs all that and two eighteen study from Magnifying Money reported that most Americans borrowed, or the average Americans borrowed about twelve

hundred dollars to fund the holidays. So that's a significant amount of money just to go to holiday spending, like a one time a year, this amount of money going there, and I think they can beg the question of, well, what if we did scale back in that regard to put some of that money to debt pay off. And again, that wouldn't be for the rest of your life, it would be for the season that we are in debt to be able to get created of and maybe trim a little here and there to get us closer to

that goal more quickly. I know, and I know a lot of people are like, how could somebody spend a thousand dollars on the holidays, But like easily, very easily. Yeah. Think about every candle you buy that you see on sale around the holidays, the extra food, whether you're taking it to a pot luck or maybe you're hosting someone or maybe you just want those like pumpkin things or those peppermint things, gifts you're buying for coworkers that you

don't care about. Things on Amazon, like those Every little thing adds up. Yeah, decorations, little things to have an outfit for a holiday party. Yeah, everyone's like, I gotta have it new every year. But like the matching pajama pajama. Oh my word, the pajamas. What a trap. Those pajamas are frick and they're too hot to actually wear. I mean, I guess you live in Florida. Yeah, but they are too much. So family photos, those photo shoots about the highways.

It adds up, and you will realize that if you are budgeting and tracking your spending. So another statistic on this list is that a gallop Pole found that only one third of Americans maintain a household budget and only thirty percent have a long term financial plan that includes savings and investment goals. So if you have this, you're in the minority. Well done, right, But let's not land there people. Right, You are most likely to budget if you make at least seventy five tho dollars per year,

which means the people that need it. Most people with lower incomes, the majority are not budgeting, And I would venture to say, I mean, at least when I didn't do it, is because I was scared of what I was going to see, so I didn't want to be confronted with that. But it's like this will edge sword. If you don't do it, you're going to spend a thousand dollars on the holidays, and then if you do, you get confronted with the fact that you spent a

thousand dollars on the holidays. So it's like you still have to do it, though, so that you can maybe next year spend eight hundred and then next year six and so on and so on, instead of going in the other direction. Yes, we all need a budget, every last one of us, in some way, shape or form

something to keep us on track. But especially if we've got a significant financial goal, like becoming debt free, it is all the more important so that you can even identify where do I have room to cut and what am I spending on things, and how do I put more money towards this? And I think ultimately too, we cannot always blame low income as our reason for financial hardship.

Sometimes that is the reality. And Jen, you and I have both made less than forty thou dollars a year, which is considered to be the poverty line, but of people at least in the States are at that point facing financial hardship and making less than forty tho dollars a year. So unless we fall into that category, we really cannot blame our income as the reason for not

becoming debt free or getting at financial goals. Yeah, so, on this survey of people that said they were facing financial hardship, one in ten of them earn more than a hundred thousand dollars a year, and twenty eight percent of these people earned fifty to thousand dollars a year, so we didn't even mention this on this article. The average amount of debt on American holds increases as their income creases, so you might think, oh, if I made

more money than I could pay off debt. Now, if you made more money, you'd probably have more debt, is what the statistics say, and a lot of it is consumer debt. So we won't just talk about student loans, because yes, high income earners typically have more student loans, but it's consumer debt as well. Yeah, I think that this is a helpful thing to even realize, all right, where is the poverty line? How are we defining that in the States, and what does that mean? And some

of us might be there right. I know that we've got listeners from a variety of backgrounds and finding themselves in a variety of situations. And so if you are below the poverty line, then okay, allow this to inform you for where you're at, and engage with our community and your own personal like local community to find resources to help you not remain in that place. If this is a goal of yours to rise above that poverty line,

to be debt free. Also, especially sally, if this is an actual reason for you to be in debt, all the more reason to say, okay, what can be done to get out of debt. So certainly don't use poverty as an excuse for being in debt. If you are not in poverty, and if you are in poverty, then there are resources. Take advantage of the free things in your community, some of the resources that are available, even just knowledge wise within the Frugal Friends community, within other

financial communities as well. There is still hope. We don't want to say, Okay, if you're above the poverty line, then then great, don't use it as an excuse. But even if you're below the poverty line, there's still hope to increase your earning potential, to still be able to get at some of these financial goals. And we want to be a community that helps to support you in doing so. Yes, absolutely, And we also want to be a community that supports you in other ways by improving

your spirits and giving you what you want. Yes, and giving you that's right. It's time for the best minute of your entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name is William. Maybe you paid off your mortgage. Maybe your car died and you're happy to not have to pay that bill anymore. That build buffalo bills. Bill Clinton, this is the bill of the week. Hi, I would like to nominate my uncle Billy for the Bill of the week, and also my cousin Bill Um. And also

I'm from Rhode Island, so boto Williams. Thank you, heyo, short and sweet tomorrows that I like Rhode Island. And I think part of what I like Rhode Island is because I can say the word narraganset like the beer. Whoa right because I went there once. Good job, thank you, thank you. Way to make that Bill of the week about you, Jen is also about smartest family and her state pride, little ist state, biggest heart is what I say. So good thanks for nominating. Not only did you nominate,

but you got it still of the week. Congratulations. If you want to submit your Bill of the week about your family, about your state, really about anything, you know that there's really no limitations. Visit for Cool Friends podcast dot com slash bill. Leave us a bill, will listen to it and try not to make it about us. But no promises, no promises. Now when I'm around and now it's time for lightning. Mm hmm. It's here. You

know it, whether you like the intro or not. So today Jill and I are going to share our turning points. So why paying off debt became important to us and the moment we realized it was possible because those were definitely two different points, So amazing you go first and all right, so I already told you guys, my debt was a super a mental and emotional burden for me. It was a real source of depression. And I do

not struggle with depression. Typically, I wouldn't even say I struggle with anxiety, though I have had bouts where anxiety has given me seizures, so I guess I can't say that anymore. But so much so I compartmentalized and I hid from my debt. So it was always a negative thing in my life, which made it important, But it didn't become important to me to pay it off until it was important to my fiance. And basically it was like, hey, you agreed to marry me, and now I'm going to

pay off my debt. And I was like why m hmmm. And we were still in that like newly engaged phase, so I was like, okay, anything you want to do, but I'm not really interested. And so that was the moment it became important to me. And then you may have heard the story. I've shared it before, but the way he got me on board was just talking about like, Okay, what do you see for our future and what do you want? He got me to the place where I was thinking beyond debt because in my mind it was

so overwhelming. All I can see was debt and I couldn't see beyond it. So powerful, and he encouraged me to just theoretically dream beyond it. And so when I did that, that was when I said, Okay, this is also something that I want to do because I would actually like to see this version of my life that I've dreamt. I like that. Yeah, not just debt free for the sake of debt free, but putting more reason behind it. I think that's a helpful motivator too. For me.

I don't think that there's ever been a time that I have felt comfortable owing people something that goes beyond finances. I'm not saying it's a good thing. You're a giver, so I get that you were. You were a giver, not an oh people. It needs to be definitely fair, if not skewed in the other direction. Yeah. So, and I also feel like debt kind of happened to me. It's probably how most people feel, too, like to wake up one day and realize, yeah, this is real. I

never had a credit card. I think maybe I opened one in college, but I didn't even know like how to use it. Just like I don't know, I think this is something good that I should do. Mostly I just had a debit card, so spending money that I didn't have wasn't quite a thing or an option that I even knew was available, and trust me, if I knew it was available, I might have done it. But realizing and getting that a final bill after I graduated college,

I think, like, that's when it really hit me. All those years of just like signing the financial aid package and it's like, oh, yeah, yeah, but this will probably just like go away somehow. I don't know. I don't know how my nineteen year old brain really processed what

was going to happen to me at one. But when I finally got it, I was like, all right, and now you have six months before it starts gaining interest and then you actually do need to start paying us this money until all of this money has been paid, And that was my moment of realizing this is real, this is all real. It's not just this number on a piece of paper that I signed a way that allows me to keep going to college. This is real money I have to pay back and I am not

gonna lie. I was really angry, to be polite about it, It was really angry when I had to pay back the loans I took out. Part of it is that I felt like I didn't fully know what I was getting into because they present it to you like it's a financial aid package credit or not. It's money that you owe. So I was I angry about that, and then I was angry about the fact that they make it seem like a good loan. Oh, this is like

a good loan. No, it's still gains interest, like you still owe interest on it, and a real decent amount of interest even though they're trying to make it. I'm getting angry again. You can tell who, all right, Not even am Scott would give an eighteen year old a payday loan that big. Yes, right, so there's your measurement. You can't even go to the bad part of town and get that much money. Like, moving on, moving on.

So so I think, yeah, that was my pivot point where I think, honestly, anger is a decent motivator for me. It got me angry and I was like, well, I gotta get rid of this. But I was also really overwhelmed because at that point I had my bachelor's and social work and I was stepping into a job where they were going to pay me twenty six thousand dollars a year, and my loans were more than that. So

that was overwhelming. So I knew that I wanted to pay it off, and I knew that it was real money, and I just resigned myself to the fact that this is just going to take me forever, This is going to linger over me for forever. And I did feel quite overwhelmed by it. Yeah, man, I get angry as while thinking about it. I get so angry, still angry about it. It's predatory. I think the student loan industry is editory. Okay, So when did I realize it was

possible pay off? Well, I don't think I realized it was possible. I think I was hopeful, And I think all you need at first is hope. That's it. You don't need anything more, you don't need math. All you need is hope. And then because you're gonna suck at first, and the math's not going to work out, but as you get better, then the math will start to work out. And that is when I realized that we could do it.

We got married, Travis didn't have a job. I was making probably maybe for d K and that what they call that, but love for sure, Um, I was so skinny. It was the best. And then we started making more money, and we and we started controlling our spending and budgeting and the math. What we thought was going to take us five years ended up taking us less than two because the math started working in our favor the better we got. But I didn't see that until we were

like in it, like several months in it. Yeah. Yeah, Sometimes you just have to start with that little bit of hope and put one foot in front of the other. I think it was similar for me. I started immediately right I had a job. I needed to start paying back this loan. I chose to do as much as I could. I did not do the minimum payment, but even you know, so twenty six dollars a year, I

was not making much, but I did choose. I looked at what our other expenses were and what we're the maximum amount that I can do and also not shoot ourselves in the foot. So I paid more than what what we had to pay every month. But still I knew this is going to take me a really long time. But I think I started to see the reality to being debt free and the light at the end of

the tunnel nowhere near the middle. But when I start to make more money and I realized oh, life isn't always going to be me earning twenty six dollars a year. That in this debt payoff journey, I can gain a skill set, I can get raises, I can switch jobs. I can make more money and pay off more debt and be more financially free in this process. And I think that really spurred me on and gave me an even greater injection of hope in that process to realize, oh,

I'm not stuck. This isn't a static, stagnant process where I'm only going to ever be able to pay so much off. There are possibilities in this think In that way, it almost gamified it for me, where I had these little benchmarks of oh, okay, if I just got a little bit of a race, which means I can increase the amount that I put towards my debt, and then I just got a bonus or somebody just gave me a birthday after and I was motivated to put the majority of that to my debt. And I have not

regretted it. I have not looked back on the fact that, like five birthdays in a row, any money that came in from any avenue went straight to my debt and golly am I grateful? Yeah, And there's and it's stuff like there's financial stuff you don't learn until you're on that journey, or at least for me, I didn't learn until I was on the journey to pay off debt. And like, if you wait until you're in a quote unquote better financial situation, then you miss out on all

of those lessons. And like, yes, you're making slower process in the beginning, but you're learning more. You have more time to learn so that when you get to that better financial situation, you're already so ahead and you can do so much more with the more that you have. Yep. And I remember when you paid off your debt, you were at my how was and I became Yeah, I became debt free in goodness before the pandemic struck and before the blessing that was. And we say that right,

like less risk. Yeah, I was able to walk into the pandemic with a whole lot less stress on me because I didn't have that debt payment. I didn't know what was coming. Oh goodness, I'm so grateful for that piece. It was a hardship in other ways, but I didn't have that additional piece on my shoulders. I'm so grateful. Yes, yes, it hasn't worn off either. We're going to be coming up on a year of being debt free and man, yeah, still so thrilled. The thrill of it has not gone away.

Riding that wave. I truly believe that feeling is available for everyone if you want it. It's a bit for you, and we're carrying you on whatever stage of life you're in because you can increase your income, you can cut out expenses, you can get better and better and get

to that financial place that you want to be. It is possible, and so I hope that this episode was the motivation you need and inspiration you need to either start that journey or keep fighting for it and get involved in with a community who's going to help you. We are one of those communities. Get involved with them locally as well. But yeah, hang out with us on the Frugal Friends community group on Facebook and be motivated by one another. It's super helpful to have a team

cheering you on in the process. Absolutely hang out with us Frugal Friends podcast dot com slash group, and thank you so much for listening and leaving reviews. The reviews help people find us and know that we are a legitimate podcast with helpful information, not just two Valley girls chatting. So stay you this week. To Megan from Toronto, Canada, she says, money conversations you wish you had with your friends.

It happens to be five stars. She says, Jen and Jill are the friends you wish you had in real life to talk money with. I tune in every Friday to hang out with these ladies. They're always having a fresh perspective on personal finance content, but know how to keep it real. I also love that Jill and I are both social workers. There are not a lot of others in our field willing to talk about finances. Love

from Toronto, Canada, Love right back at you. Yeah, social workers can do this thing of becoming debt free to We also want to thank our friends who share these episodes on social media. So when you share the latest episode and tag us on Facebook or Instagram, we add you to our monthly drawing. So for every five tags and reviews we get each month, we give away a

copy of the Frugal Friends workbook. So keep leaving us reviews on iTunes and Stitcher, sending those screenshots to Frugal Friends podcast us at gmail dot com and don't forget to tag us on social We do see it. See you next Week by Frugal Friends is produced, edited and mixed by Eric Syria. So last week, not last week when you're listening to this, but last week and we're recording this. Um, I had a COVID scare. I was exposed.

UM pretty directly, I am. I was negative. I spent the whole week quarantining and it was very surprised I was negative. I didn't have any symptoms, but it was a week spent at home with my with my son and with your thoughts and what did you choose to do? How did you handle like a full on quarantine? Oh so boring. We watched a lot of octonuts, and if you are a parent with a young toddler, octonuts is everything,

like they're the best. I would steal away at nap time to get some work done, but other than that, it was eating Halloween candy. Yeah sounds productive. Yeah, you learn a lot about sea creatures so much. Yeah, asked me about sea creatures. All I can tell you a lot about it, so don't really, but yes, I don't know. I dropped you off a care package. Enjoy beverages together, but separate. Jill. Let me guys, this episode may have been brought to you by Jenna, but it's also brought

to you by Jill, who is the sweetest person ever. Um. Jill brought me a care package. And and also our friend Jessica, who was she was positive and that's who I came in contact with, UM. So she was also quarantining, but she had she could only stay in one room of her house because she was two weeks away from her wedding and her fiance was negative. So so they were just trying to keep every everyone who wasn't positive al Um. And so we were actually face timing when

you dropped off the care package. That's so amazing. And I was sitting right by the door in the window and did not see you come in, like come to the door and dropping so bizarre, just like a tiny little like fairy Yeah, present, fairy l Um. It was everything that I needed. And you are a beautiful soul. Oh well, gosh, I'll have to pay you for that shout out later. Um. It was fun for me. It is better to give than to receive. You are a

great gifter. UM blessed by you for sure, so thankful for your friendship and looking forward to when we can spend time in person. Yes.