Why Paying off Debt is Important & Attainable

of our listeners are making. So we think that this is a trend. You know, we haven't surveyed the place, the space, but we think paying off debt is going to be another popular goal for the new a year. And and this is why we started almost probably why we started this podcast. So it's a while not right for everyone. It is a topic that we're super passionate about and we think is important and attainable. Yes, and this is a great time of year to be setting goals.

So if if you haven't already, maybe this is a reminder that it's a good time to think about it. Yeah, what do you want to focus on this year? Is it paying off debt? Great? Listen to this episode. We'll give you more motivation. Do you want it to be debt but you don't think it's right time, or you don't know what's the right time for what? Listen to this episode. It may help you figure things out so you know what your goal, your primary goal should be

moving forward. But first, this episode is brought to all of us by leveling Up. I think it's similar to a glow up or something along the lines of experiencing success or some level of a eve min Not sure. I'm elder millennial trying to make it out here in this influencer world. Either way, leveling up sounds good and we think we have a way you can level up your finances at least with the one week spending makeover. This is happening very soon January second through the sixth,

that is three. Get used to it, start getting used to say in those numbers to zero two three, we Jen and I, Jen and Jill are hosting a free one week challenge with daily live sessions in your inbox and exclusive pop up Facebook communclusive. It's going to be

inclusive in a very exclusive kind of way. The goal of this challenge is that in five days or less, you have a clear picture of your past spending, a foundation for your values based spending, and a plan to improve and implement spending that makes you happy not guilty. There will be prizes, free pdf downloads, and so much more. If you want to kick off your twenty three financial goals with a bang, or if you just want to level up, join us for the one week spending makeover

at Frugal Friends podcast dot com slash makeover. And did we say it's free? We should have it's free. It's free, al right, so as we head on, I know we still have you know, ten eleven days left of the eear depending on when you're listening to this, but it's not too early to start making those goals. And if you're in the Frugal Friends club, we have been spending all month in a goal challenge where we are thinking about our goals and more importantly, we're thinking about systems

and habits to get to those goals. So not dream boards, vision boards, we're not we're wooing it over here. We're thinking about strategies of implementation and good goal setting, and so that's kind of what we are bringing over in the replay of this episode. If you want more debt Payoff Info content stories. We have something special for you coming up in the new year. Now you're gonna talk

about it now, I'm not gonna talk about it now. Okay, Well, you kind of if you've been listening for the past few months, you kind of already know what it is. But we got plenty of it coming for you. Don't worry about it. We also have a ton of episodes on it. We've got episode to twelve, which is a rerun of our Kate from Living that debt Free life. She paid off a hundred and five thousand dollars of debt.

We've got episode one which is paying off debt and your mental health, like dealing with all of that while paying off debt with Melanie Lockert. That was a really, really great episode we played. We did at the beginning of the year, so we have a lot. Just look through the archives Frugal Friends podcast dot com slash episodes. You can just search debt you can find all of

our episodes on that. There are a ton And while we don't advocate that frugality is only good for paying off debt or reaching financial goals fast, we do realize that it is an on ramp that paying off debt is an on ramp to so many other good financial decisions. Uh, And so we advocate for it, we applaud it, and

we want to support it. And that's why we have Frugal Friends Club, That's why we do so many debt payoff stories and and yeah, and we want you to know that it's important, it's not everything, and it is attainable. And so that's where we're going. Yeah, let's get into it, alright, So let's get into this topic about debt. I think most of the people who listen to Frugal Friends have a similar view that they want to be debt free. I think that is a view that many listeners hold.

So we're gonna get to convince you that debt is bad because I feel like you already have your own reasons for knowing that, but we are going to reiterate and emphasize some of the reasons why you should get out of debt that are not just financial. So if you have been a little jaded by let's reinvigorate you and reinspire you to head down this journey that you already want to be on. And so our first article is from money Crashers and it's seventeen reasons why you

should get out of debt. What do you think about this one, Jill? Yes, I think it's a fantastic motivator. So, like you said, Jen, this isn't supposed to convince you to become debt free, because I know that most of our listeners are are already in that space and really want their debt gone, but to help motivate us in

that direction. And I like the holistic approach that they took in this article, giving headlines to different categories and listing out financial benefits, mental benefits, physical benefits, relational benefits, each supported by multiple bullet points underneath it. So I think we're not going to go through all of the reasons. It's definitely an article worth checking out, but I think big picture, there are a lot of benefits to our whole person, not just monetary, that can happen when we

become debt free. Yeah. I had a lot of flashbacks reading this because I remember when I had fifty dollars of debt and I was a single woman making thirty five thousand dollars a year before taxes, and I felt a lot of these things and now that we are debt free, I feel freedom from a lot of them, and so I think it's so important. Like a lot of people will debate should I just go gung ho paying off debt and get it all gone, or should

I balance it with other financial goals? And I think that decision for you really comes down to how much of these things on this list are you feeling. So if you're feeling a lot of negative mental, physical, emotional, relational things on this list, and I was, And so that's when going gung ho and pedal to the metal is more beneficial to you than any math equation that can show you you'll make more money if you invest over paying off debt whatever. So that's kind of my

view on all of this stuff. I love that, Jen, that's such great advice to help figure out and suss out what is more advantageous for my whole person, again, not just monetarily, which direction should I head? For sure? So we'll start out with a few of the financial benefits. Um So for me, the first one on this list more free income. So people are always looking on how do I pinch pennies? How do I save money? Or like my budget is stretched so thin, I don't have

a single extra penny, how do I save more? And I'm like, well, what if the answer is more money? And so paying up debt instantly gives you a raise. And so that was initial why for me because I thought I wanted to be a stay at home parent. Now as a parent, I realized that's the last thing that I want, but I wanted to have that option. And I knew if I couldn't make money, I needed to be a better steward of any money that we had coming in. So yeah, I liked number three within

this category, which talks about being debt free. It creates less risk. When we are in debt, we are just one financial blow away from disaster, which is what this article talks about, that any one thing could really derail us financially. But if we are debt free, we have less risk because we're not in debt. We don't owe anything to anybody where they could collect wages or repossess your belongings, or you name it, going into foreclosure, being evicted,

needing to file for bankruptcy. Those things are heightened when we carry debt versus when we don't. And then it's also linked to your point gen of having more income, so then we have more ability to use that income to save up for those emergencies. So it's almost like a win win, like a twofold thing, where not only are we at less risk when we're debt free, but then we have more money to put towards making sure

we're even less at risk. Absolutely. I also like number four is being debt free gives you a better credit score. And credit scores are so mysterious even to credit experts because there are five components to a credit score, and we won't get into it, but the most important is your payment history. Obviously, if you are making regular payments that are over the minimum and trying to pay off debt,

that increases your score. But people are scared to pay off debt because they think they need like a thirty percent debt to limit ratio that's just a max, like they prefer you have zero. And also they're scared of their credit length being shortened when you close out those accounts. That's a very minimal part of the score. It's like level.

But the second most important part is the amount of debt you have compared to your credit limit, and so the more debt you pay off, especially like student loan debt, your credit score will start to increase. And then if you have a credit card that has no annual feed that you just keep in your closet underneath the shoes in the shoe box that you very rarely use, and you just use it to build up a credit history like the history length. You're going to be golden. You're

gonna be fine. You will not have to worry about your credit score. And so it is not that hard to get a good credit score or an excellent credit score, and paying off debt greatly helps you in that. Yeah. I think that's really helpful advice to hear from you and to read in this article, because I think that was like a myth that I had always thought, especially if you're aimed at purchasing large items like a whole home or something. It's like, all right, how do I

get a good credit score? And I don't know, should I pay it off? Pay off my decks? How's that going to affect? It's like, No, it's good to pay off your debt. Yes, yeah, And a credit score is important. It saves you so much money in the long run. It is important. It is not something that should be worried about so much though, pay off the debt, get those accounts closed, and then do it little by little

after that. The last one under the category of financial benefits that I do want to highlight is that being debt free can create better job prospects, and I would add at least more rewarding job prospects. And the reasoning that they give is that if you are in debt, then oftentimes we can feel stuck to the job that we're doing and living paycheck to paycheck and not really able to do what we want with the money. But we need to just be giving it to all of

our bills and the debt versus. If we take away that pressure, if we pay off our debt and we no longer have that bill, so to speak, there is greater freedom and that ability to not have to live paycheck to paycheck potentially or feeling more reward from the job that you're working because you're able to work that job and enjoy the benefits of what you're earning financially and not just giving it away every month or every

other week. And also if you if you don't like your job regardless, then it does give you more permission and freedom to look elsewhere and not have to worry about, oh no, what's going to happen if there's a little bit of a lapse, or if I choose to take a pay cut to do something more rewarding, or if it's going to take me a little bit longer to

build myself up to a certain amount of income. So it just creates greater freedom and flexibility and the potential of finding more reward doing work when you don't put those pressures on yourself. Yeah, and I would also add that better job prospects don't always have to mean you're

settling for less money. It's estimated that if you stay in your career, in your job for five or more years, and I'm sure I'm going to misquote this, but you could lower your total income earning potential by fifty Whereas if you are increasing either being promoted or doing job hops to places where you can increase your income by ten every three to four years, you can make a lot more money over time. But if you're not financially secure, then it's going to make going to different jobs a

lot more stressful. So you have the potential to take those risks. If you are debt free and don't have to worry about that bill in case of job hop go south. The next category is the impact that it can have on us mentally to be dead free, and the first one listed in this category is just that there's less stress. It is stressful to be in debt, and for some of us it's more stressful than to others.

But still there's a degree of stress that comes with knowing that your money is not yours, a good portion is owed to somebody else, It is gaining interest that you also have to owe that. It just comes with so much mental space that it takes up emotional space that it takes up causing stress, and when we pay that off, we take away that very significant stressor mm hmm,

oh my gosh. I remember having like being in an apartment and sitting in my living room with my couch that I got from Salvation Army that my roommate hated, and feeling the weight of that mental load of looking at like my profile and nabant and seeing all of those debts and knowing how little I made. That is. Every time I hear something like this, it takes me back to a very insignificant moment, but it takes me

back to that moment. I'm just feeling completely overwhelmed and hopeless, and so now that I don't have that, like, I have so many other things to be stressed about, it's so so great I don't That's one less thing I have to be stressed about. That's a particular type of stress. When you realize that you are in debt beyond your means for repayment. That's overwhelming. It's an overwhelming pressure that causes stress and anxiety sometimes worry, which then can impact

our sleep, our thoughts throughout the day. And we'll get into this more and more, but so much then of what we're now going to be identifying even throughout this article is related to the ways stress impacts us relationally, mentally, and physically. It's all related to the stress that debt induces and a massive reason to get rid of it. Yeah. Well, that leads into number nine on the list is paying

off debt gives you better cognitive function. So in my course on cutting impulse spending, we talk a lot about how making better decisions means you make fewer impulse purchases, and that comes down to having better cognitive function, which means usually making fewer decisions during the day, YadA YadA,

But having less debt naturally improves cognitive function. So at two seventeen study published in Frontiers and Psychology points to numerous studies showing that experiencing poverty, both in real life and laboratory conditions, impaired people's attention span, working memory, and self control. So in the article says, it's a problem that feeds on itself. Obviously, you want to have less

impulse spending. You're trying to pay off debt. So it's just something that you kind of have to know at first you're gonna suck at like you have to be okay with that and say, Okay, I'm gonna suck at this right now, but I'm gonna keep trying. I'm gonna keep getting better. And then as you get better at one, the other one improves, and it just compounds on itself. And so then at the end, it says a two thou seventeen study at the University of Singapore found that

when people paid off debt, it reverses these problems. It found that participants reduced their debt, their cognitive function rose significantly, and they felt less anxious and became better our decision makers. It's so interesting that this principle works both directions that on the one hand, it can compound upon itself the stress and the way that that impacts every other aspect of our lives negatively, and conversely, when we are debt free, it can have positive impact on every aspect of our

personhood when that's no longer present. So there is hope in this, and that's the goal of what we want to walk away with is motivation and hope to become debt free. Yeah. I know people place and myself included a lot of blame on themselves for impulsive behavior and making bad financial decisions. It's like I want to do the right thing, but I always do the wrong thing. And so part of that has to do with where you are financially and the cognitive load that that takes

on you. But know that you have the power to overcome it little by little. You just can't expect yourself to be perfect right out the game, yes, because it does take a toll on us, like we're talking about, it impairs our ability to think clearly, It has negative impacts on our bodies, and so we can't expect ourselves to be fantastic at this when there's a very real stress or happening. As it relates to physical benefits becoming

debt free. Research has shown that those without debt related stressors have fewer illnesses, and the article sites a survey that was done by the Associated Press that showed people with high levels of debt related stress are more than three times as likely to suffer from things like ulcers or digestive problems than their counterparts with lower debt stress

or no debt stress. And that's just shocking to me, the ways that our physical bodies can be so connected to our financial lives and the very real reality that it can have on our bodies. That the weight and the cost of this, right, it's not just financial, the cost is physical. And then how does that, I mean speaking of compounding itself, then that creates medical bills to be caring for our bodies in the midst of these stressors.

It can feel overwhelming good. Again, I want to say, there's hope in this and it then benefits us physically to be out of debt because we don't experience that. There are fewer illnesses when we are not, when our bodies aren't trying to manage and deal with stress and anxiety and overwhelm. Yeah, I know that firsthand because I got shingles. I still can't believe this, Jen. I did so many side hustles, and I worked myself up and in two months had contracted shingles two months into our

debt payoff journey. Yeah, and I actually I'm not the only person that has stressed themselves into shingles. You know. Yes, stress takes itself out on our bodies. Although I do think that's a bit of an example of being stressed about the debt repayment process even and I think that that's a fine line that Yes, let's allow us to motivate us to get out of debt and work towards it, but let's also be careful to not put unnecessary pressures

on ourselves in the process. So, once you've bought into debt, like paying off debt and being intense about it, that's fantastic, But let's keep a pulse on this because it is also not a goal that is worth sacrificing every aspect of our personhood to achieve it as fast as possible. There's also quality of life that is necessary in the process so that there can be longevity in it, to pay it off quickly, but also to not overwhelm ourselves beyond the point of return or beyond what we can

handle in order to get at that goal. I don't sacrifice yourself on the altar of becoming debt free because process can become stressful. Yes, that was so eloquently said. Don't sacrifice yourself on the altar of becoming debt free. Absolutely no reason to do that, thanks Jim. Yeah, so I want to jump into the relationship benefits. Are you okay with that? Let's do it. Okay, so better relationships.

This is something I did not realize what happened during our debt payoff journey, And at first it was I don't know. It was kind of like the death of one person but allowed somebody else to emerge from the ashes. That's so dramatic. But the article says like being in debt stirs up like negative emotions and those can fill spill over into your relationships. I didn't realize that as much, but I realized that so debt kept me from doing

things with my friends. The anxiety about debt, Like I remember my friends were going to Disney sometime and not even to the park, but just like went around Disney to support one of our friends that was doing half marathon there and I came at the last minute. I went, but like all day, I struggled with should I go, should I spend the money? And that was when I was not even trying to pay off debt, so it

affected me then. I wasn't cognitive of it, but I was so scared to pay off debt because I thought stuff like that was going to happen, and it did. But I actually so I shed these friends that only wanted to do things that cost money, and then I found friends. I was forced to find friends that wanted to spend time with me and get to know me

versus just do activities and go get drinks. And so I came out of it with really great friends, really really good relationships, and much more quality than previous ones. Very interesting. You really brought that full circle, even though it felt dramatic at first. That was with it though

Yeah and yeah related to better relationships. They just kind of suss out the specific types of relationships that could see improvement, like a stronger marriage or being a better parent or being able to help others because you're able to turn more outward with your focus, with your finances, with your time and energy because you don't have debt taking up a lot of that. And I just want

to highlight the marriage piece. I think that if you are doing this together with a spouse, the step payoff journey, even though there are for sure bumps and even land mines in the road throughout this process, if you do it and go through this together, you will come out stronger on the other side, more unified, more understanding of one another, an incredible feeling of accomplishment, which will bond you greater to one another, which then sets the stage

for other goals that you can set as a couple. So my goodness, Yes, just even overcoming something, whether it's debt or anything else with a partner is incredible for that relationship. And this is one of the things that can be super helpful as you relate to one another. So I just affirm all of these pieces, and I think when we can learn to manage stress, whether it's debt related or otherwise, than yeah, we are we're better

for our relationships thrive. As a result, we experience better mental health, emotional health, understanding, of ourself all of these things. So I think relating to debt stress, learning to manage it while we're in the midst of it, and also just paying it off and getting rid of that stress

or is fantastic. Yes, absolutely so. Now that you know why it's important to pay off debt, our next article is meant to inspire you, to let you know that this is mathematically and mentally attainable for you to do this, because I think my biggest barrier before I started paying off debt was that I just didn't think it was possible. I had a lot of limiting mindset, like limiting beliefs, which we're going to talk about limiting beliefs next week.

But I thought it wasn't possible mathematically, and so for some people it's not going to be I had fifty dollars of debt and I was making thirty dollars as a single person. Like yes, Like I understand if you're in that situation, it's gonna be hard. But I wanted to give you some inspirational stories that we featured here on the show, and then also some statistics that may make you feel better about your financial situation. I don't know they're definitely not meant to scare you. We're not

using scared tactics on the show. But we have had a lot of people on Frugal Friends share their debt free stories from all walks of life. So Jill push of them, do you stand out in your mind? Yeah? Honestly, the debt payoffs that stand out to me are the ones where people pay off a lot of money on a small income. So we've got an episode it was back in our archives at this point, but Sarah paid off over thirty thousand dollars of debt as a single person,

and so for her that was incredible given her life circumstances. Yeah, I have a list here of most of our debt payoff stories, not all of them, but if you want to write this down, this will also be in our show notes with links to these episodes. But we've got episode fourteen where Amanda her and her husband paid off six figures of debt living in California. We've got episode eighteen where Allison and her family paid off six figures

of debt on two teacher salaries. We got episode thirty five where Merrily and her family paid off another six figures of debt on a single income and they did not do it super fast. I think it took them like six or seven years. So they were one of those stories where, yeah, it took a little while, we're a family of four on a single income, and they

still did it. And I love to see Merrily she's easy budget on Instagram and now she posts like she gets her eyebrows done, and she gets her nails done, and she gets like all these things she values now she like does them, which is so fun to see because it freed up income for her. We've got Chris Browning from Popcorn Finance. He lives in like l A in the l A area. He and his wife paid off their debt. We got Debt Kick and Mom Angela her family paid off debt. She's got a great YouTube channel.

And then Kate from Debt Free Life. She's an attorney. She paid off over six figures of debt. And that was episode. So people from all walks of life, all incomes, all living and financial situations, all time frames, all are capable of paying off debt, whether you're married, single, kids, no kids, whatever, Like there's a story for you. I know. We've got other stories in the archives. Where we got one she paid off debt in her forties, all kinds

of things. Yeah, I think that the biggest variable in this is how much time it's going to take. Yes, it's not a matter of how old you are, how much money you make. These are all factors, certainly how much debt you have. I think it's not a matter of if I can do it, it's just when how long will it take? Based on the amount of money I make, the amount of debt I'm in, maybe my age, other financial responsibilities. It's possible regardless of what those factors

are for you. It's just time is going to be the question to answer, how much time will it take? Yeah. So this article is from debt dot com and it's just personal finance statistics, and so we want to read some of them for you that will hopefully encourage you or put some perspective on what is average, what's median, and what is feasibly attainable. So the first one that I want to point out is in two thousand and sixteen, the average household earned seventy four thousand dollars and the

average expenditures were fifty seven thousands. So that leaves around seventeen thousand and free cash flow for the average household. So the median income take home pay, which is more accurate, is sixty thousand, but that still leaves everyone, the average

American with over eleven thousand in free cash flow every year. Obviously, there are very evovments of where you live and what your circumstances are and how many kids you have and all of that, but yes, talking about on average what this looks like and what we might have access to.

And I think the point in looking at some of these statistics is to say a lot of our barriers to doing this, or to be even making this a realistic goal for ourselves is I just I don't have enough money or I'm not going to be able to I don't make a lot. And then to say, well, let's look at what the average American makes and whether or not it's possible. If income is actually a good reason to say that I can't do this, And I think our argument is, no, it's not a good reason.

We can. Based on what the median salary is or take home cash, this could be possible. Again, might take a while, but it's possible. Yeah, I know, fifty seven thousands in average spenditures is high for ast. I mean we live in Florida, which is a lower cost of living state typically, but we live in a higher cost of living city for our state. And we without being on any particular financial goal, I think we keep it under fifty for sure. So it definitely varies, but this

is attainable, this is feasible. Yeah, it is quite an interesting site because you can click on your state or various states and kind of see the statistics for what is the average amount of credit card debt, the average amount of student loan debt, the average amount of people who are filing for bankruptcy in that year, and so yeah, it could be a motivator in either direction, whether you realize, oh, I actually carry more debt than the average, or I

carry less debt. I think either way it can be an encourager and and a motivator if statistics again are helpful for you, I know, doesistance are helpful for me more than like motivational speeches. So that's why. And the site is debt dot com. Slash statistics very easy if you are not driving, you can just pull it up on your phone and see. But yeah, the numbers motivate me. Yeah, if I'm over, I want to be average, you know.

And speaking of holidays, they talk about some of the statistics there, since we are smack dab in the middle of holidays, that the average Americans spends about one thousand fifty dollars on holiday decorations, food, gifts, shipping costs, all that. And two eighteen study from Magnifying Money reported that most Americans borrowed, or the average Americans borrowed about twelve hundred

dollars to fund the holidays. So that's a significant amount of money just to go to holiday spending, like one time a year, this amount of money going there, and I think they can beg the question of, well, what if we did scale back in that regard to put some of that money to debt payoff. And again, that wouldn't be for the rest of your life, it would be for the season that we are in debt to be able to get creative and maybe trim a little here and there to get us closer to that goal

more quickly. I know, and I know a lot of people are like, how could somebody spend a thousand dollars on the holidays, but like easily, very easily, Yeah, think about every candle you buy that you see on sail around the holidays. The extra food, whether you're taking it to a pot luck or maybe you're hosting someone, or maybe you just want those like pumpkin things or those peppermint things, gifts you're buying for coworkers that you don't

care about. Things on Amazon like those. Every little thing adds up. Yeah, decorations, little things to have an outfit for a holiday party. Yeah, everyone's like, I gotta have it new every year. But the matching pajama pajama Oh my word, the pajamas. What a trap. Those pajamas are frick and they're too hot to actually wear. I mean, I guess you live in Florida. Yeah, but they are too much. So family photos, those photo shoots about the hiways. It adds up and you will realize that if you

are budgeting and tracking your spending. So another statistic on this list is that a gallop Pole found that only one third of Americans maintain a household budget and only thirty have a long term financial plan that includes savings and investment goals. So if you have this, you're in the minority. Well done, right, But let's not land there people. Right, you are most likely to budget if you make at least seventy five dollars per year, which means the people

that need it, most people with lower income MS. The majority are not budgeting. And I would venture to say, I mean at least when I didn't do it because I was scared of what I was going to see, so I didn't want to be confronted with that. But it's like this double edged sword. If you don't do it, you're going to spend a thousand dollars on the holidays, and then if you do, you get confronted with the fact that you spent a thousand dollars on the holidays.

So it's like you still have to do it though, so that you can maybe next year spend eight hundred and then next year six and so on and so on, instead of going in the other direction. Yes, we all need a budget, every last one of us, in some way,

shape or form something to keep us on track. But especially if we've got a significant financial goal like becoming debt free, it is all the more important so that you can even identify where do I have room to cut and what am I spending on things, and how do I put more money towards this, and I think ultimately too. We cannot always blame low income as our

reason for financial hardship. Sometimes that is the reality. And Jen, you and I have both made less than forty thousand dollars a year, which is considered to be the poverty line. But of people at least in the States are at that point facing financial hardship and making less than forty thousand dollars a year. So unless we fall into that category, we really cannot blame our income as the reason for

not becoming debt free or getting at financial goals. Yeah. So, on this survey of people that said they were facing financial hardship, one in ten of them earn more than a hundred thousand dollars a year, and twenty eight percent of these people earned fifty to thousand dollars a year, So we did even mention this on this article. The average amount of debt on American holds increases as their income creases. So you might think, oh, if I made more money than I could pay off debt. Now, if

you made more money, you'd probably have more debt. Is what the statistics say, and a lot of it is consumer debt. So we won't just talk about student loans, because yes, high income earners typically have more student loans, but it's consumer debt as well. Yeah, I think that this is a helpful thing to even realize, all right, where is the poverty line? How are we defining that in the States, and what does that mean? And some

of us might be there, right. I know that we've got listeners from a variety of backgrounds and finding themselves in a variety of situations. And so if you are below the poverty line, then okay, allow this to inform you for where you're at, and engage with our community and your own personal like local community to find resources to help you not remain in that place. If this is a goal of yours to rise above that poverty line,

to be debt free. Also, especially if this is an actual reason for you to be in debt, all the more reason to say, okay, what can be done to get out of debt. So certainly don't use poverty as an excuse for being in debt. If you are not in poverty, and if you are in poverty, then there are resources. Take advantage of the free things in your community. Some of the resources that are available even just knowledge wise within the Frugal Friends community, within other financial communities

as well, there is still hope. We don't want to say, Okay, if you're above the poverty line, then then great, don't use it as an excuse. But even if you're below the poverty line, there's still hope to increase your earning potential to still be able to get at some of the financial goals. And we want to be a community

that helps to support you in doing so. Yes, absolutely, And we also want to be a community that supports you in other ways, like by improving your spirits and giving you what you want, yes, and giving you the bill that we that's right, it's time for the best minute of your entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name is William. Maybe you paid off your mortgage, Maybe your car died and you're happy to not have to pay that bill anymore. That's built Buffalo bills. Bill Clinton,

this is the bill of the week. Hi, I would like to nominate my uncle Billy for the Bills Week and also my cousin Bill Um. And also I'm from Rhode Island. So about your Williams. Thank you? Heyo short and sweet Smarrow has that I like Rhode Island, and I think part of what I like Rhode Island is because I can say the word arrogancet, like the beer whoa right because I went there once. Good job, thank you, thank you. Way to make that Bill of the Week

about you, Jim. Is also about smartest family and her state pride, little est state, biggest heart is what I say. So good thanks for nominating. Not only did you nominate, but you got it Smara the Bill of the week. Congratulations. If you want to submit your Bill of the week about your family, about your state, really about anything, you

know that there's really no limitations. Visit for Cool Friends podcast dot com slash bill, leave us the bill, will listen to it and try not to make it about us. But no promises, no promises. Now when I'm around and now it's time for lightning. Mm hmm. It's here. You know it whether you like the intro or not. So today Jill and I are going to share our turning points. So why paying off debt became important to us and the moment we realized it was possible because those were

definitely two different points, so amazing. You go first and all right, So I already told you guys, my debt was a super a mental and emotional burden for me. It was a real source of depression. And I do not struggle with depression to quickly. I wouldn't even say I struggle with anxiety, though I have had bouts where anxiety has given me seizures, so I guess I can't say that anymore. But so much so I compartmentalized and

I hid from my debt. So it was always a negative thing in my life, which made it important, but it didn't become important to me to pay it off until it was important to my fiance. And basically it was like, hey, you agreed to marry me, and now I'm going to pay off my debt. And I was like why m hmmm. And we were still in that like newly engaged phase, so I was like, okay, anything you want to do, but I'm not really interested. And so that was the moment it became important to me.

And then you may have heard the story. I've shared it before, but the way he got me on board was just talking about like, Okay, what do you see for our future and what do you want? And he got me to the place where I was thinking beyond debt because in my mind it was so overwhelming. All I can see was debt and I couldn't see beyond it so powerful, and he encouraged me to just theoretically

dream beyond it. And so when I did that, that was when I said, Okay, this is also something that I want to do because I would actually like to see this version of my life that I've dreamt. I like that, Yeah, not just debt free for the sake of debt free, but putting more reason behind it. I think that's a helpful motivator too. For me. I don't think that there's ever been a time that I have felt comfortable owing people something that goes beyond finances. I'm

not saying it's a good thing. You're a giver, so I get that you were. You were a giver, not a oh people. It needs to be definitely fair, if not skewed in the other direction. So and I also feel like debt kind of happened to me. It's probably how most people feel, too, like to wake up one day and realize, yeah, this is real. I never had a credit card. I think maybe I opened one in college, but I didn't even know like how to use it, Like I don't know. I think this is something good

that I should do. Mostly I just had a debit card, so spending money that I didn't have wasn't quite a thing or an option that I even knew was available. Trust me, if I knew it was AVAILABLEY might have done it. But realizing and getting that final bill after I graduated college, I think, like, that's when it really hit me. All those years of just like signing the financial aid package and it's like, oh, yeah, yeah, but this will probably just like go away somehow. I don't know.

I don't know how my nineteen year old brain really processed what is going to happen to me at one, But when I finally got it, I was like, all right, and now you have six months before it starts gaining interest and then you actually do need to start paying us this money until all of this money has been paid. And that was my moment of realizing this is real, This is all real. It's not just this number on a piece of paper that I signed a way that

allows me to keep going to college. This is real money I have to pay back and I am not gonna lie. I was really angry to be polite about it. I was really angry when I had to pay back the loans I took out. Part of it is that I felt like I didn't fully know what I was getting into because they presented to you like it's a financial aid package or not. It's money that you owe. So I was I angry about that, And then I was angry about the fact that they make it seem

like a good loan. Oh, this is like a good loan. No, it's still gains interest, like you still owe interest on it, and a real decent amount of interest even though they're trying to make it. I'm getting angry again. You can tell who all right, Not even am Scott would give an eighteen year old a payday loan that big. Yes, right, so so there's your measurement. You can't even go to the bad part of town and get that much money, like,

moving on, moving on. So so I think, yeah, that was my pivot point where I think, honestly, anger is a decent motivator for me. It got me angry and I was like, well, I got to get rid of this. But I was also really overwhelmed because at that point I had my bachelor's and social work, and I was stepping into a job where they were going to pay me twenty six thousand dollars a year and my loans

were more than that, So that was overwhelming. So I knew that I wanted to pay it off, and I knew that it was real money, and I just resigned myself to the fact that this is just going to take me forever. This is going to linger over me for forever. And I did feel quite overwhelmed by it. Yeah, man, I get angry as well thinking about it. I get so angry, still angry about it. It's predatory. I think the student loan industry is predatory. Okay, So when did

I realize it was possible to pay off? Well, I don't think I realized it was possible. I think I was hopeful, And I think all you need at first is hope. That's it. You don't need anything more, you don't need math. All you need is hope. And then because you're gonna suck at first and the math's not gonna work out, but as you get better, then the math will start to work out. And that is when I realized that we could do it. We got married, Travis didn't have a job. I was making probably maybe

for d k at that awful love. Isn't that what they call that? But love for sure, Um, I was so skinny. It was the best. And then we started making more money, and we and we started controlling our spending and budgeting and the math. What we thought was going to take us five years ended up taking us less than two because the math started working in our favor the better we got. But I didn't see that

until we were like in it, like several months in it. Yeah. Yeah, sometimes you just have to start with that little bit of hope and put one foot in front of the other. I think it was similar for me. I started immediately right I had a job. I needed to start paying back this loan. I chose to do as much as I could. I did not do the minimum payment, but even you know, so twenty six dollars a year, I

was not making much, but I did choose. I looked at what our other expenses were and what we're the maximum amount that I can do and also not shoot ourselves in the foot. So I paid more than what what we had to pay every month. But still I knew this is going to take me a really long time, but I think I started to see the reality to being debt free and the light at the end of

the tunnel nowhere near the middle. But when I started to make more money and I realized, oh, life isn't always going to be me earning twenty six tho dollars a year, that in this debt payoff journey, I can gain a skill set, I can get raises, I can switch jobs, I can make more money and pay off more debt and be more financially free in this process. And I think that really spurred me on and gave me an even greater injection of hope in that process

to realize, oh, I'm not stuck. This isn't a static, stagnant process where I'm only going to ever be able to pay so much off. There are possibilities in this. In that way, it almost gamified it for me, where I had these little benchmarks of oh, okay, if I just got a little bit of a race, which means I can increase the amount that I put towards my debt, and then oh, I just got a bonus or somebody just gave me a birthday gif to run it, And I was motivated to put the majority of that to

my debt. And I have not regretted it. I have not looked back on the fact that like five birthdays in a row, any money that came in from any avenue went straight to my debt and GOLLI am I grateful. Yeah, And there's and it's stuff like there's financial stuff you don't learn until you're on that journey, or at least for me, I didn't learn until I was on the journey to pay off debt. And like, if you wait until you're in a quote unquote better financial situation, then

you miss out on all of those lessons. And like, yes, you're making slower process in the beginning, but you're learning more. You have more time to learn, so that when you get to that better financial situation, you're already so ahead and you can do so much more with the more that you have. Yep. And I remember when you paid off your debt, you were at my house free and I became Yeah, I became debt free in goodness before the pandemic struck. And yes, but before the blessing that

was and we say that right, like less risk. Yeah, I was able to walk into the pandemic with a whole lot less stress on me because I didn't have that debt payment. I didn't know what was coming. Oh goodness, I'm so grateful for that piece. It was a hardship in other ways, but I didn't have that additional piece on my shoulders. I'm so grateful. Yes, yes, it hasn't worn off either. We're going to be coming up on a year of being debt free and man, yeah, still

so thrilled. The thrill of it has not gone away. Riding that wave. I truly believe that feeling is available for everyone if you want it. It's a for you, and we're carrying you on every stage of life you're in because you can increase your income, you can cut out expenses, you can get better and better and get to that financial place that you want to be. It is possible, and so I hope that this episode was the motivation you need, an inspiration you need to either

start that journey or keep fighting for it. I hope that you enjoyed that episode the second time around as much as so many people did when we played it the first time around. Nothing like serving up some leftover. Sometimes after it marinates, it gets even better. I think that's this one. And it's interesting for me even thinking about my views on debt now. I mean, we were debt free when we recorded this episode, but I would say I've even experienced shifts since then in I think

how I think about debt and approach to it. I think I'm becoming less and less this kind of shame attached to it or super averse to it forever and always, and kind of more like radical middle understanding of sometimes it can serve us financially to take on a loan for something if done intentionally in wisdom and as a stepping stone for something else. So yeah, it's it's cool to see the different ways of approaching the way we

can shift and change, and the flexibility for that. But also at the end of the day, it still is a fantastic aim for any one of us. Yeah, And I still remember talking in the Lightning Round how my debt was a mental and emotional burden and while maybe mathematically it could have made more sense to do some other things at the same time we were paying off the debt, it was really worth it for us to maintain that focus and get that off. And maybe if I had realized the scope of choices that I had,

I would have made different decisions, but I didn't. And that's why we're here today with the show, UH, to share those to share you know what's could be right for you, what may not be right for you, and let you decide not a one size fits ang. Yeah yeah, So thank you so much for listening. I mentioned at the beginning we have the Frugal Friends Club, which is a private community for listeners who are trying to pay

off debt. So we have money challenges every month. We're introducing like many courses and videos of our expert interviews so that you can learn this gills to get ahead with money and also keep the motivation and accountability that's so crucial when you're in a debt payoff journey that's going to last you more than like three weeks. So this is the goal of for Girl Friends Club, and so we want to congratulate one of our members for

a big one. This is Brittany. Brittany actually leads our open accountability group every month and she says, I have been saving the past six months so I could do a lumps on payment for my car insurance. Usually when I pay my insurance. I have to use my checking account, but I was able to use my credit card on this one. I was already saving money, so I have the money to pay it off. But now I'm getting cash back on this big payment I was already making.

And girl, that's just that's just stash it stack in rewards, sting, savings, hacking. Well done that you anticipated this expense, you do see it coming. It's not an emergency expense. You know what's happening. You were able to save ahead of time and then utilize the tools and resources you have to make it really advantageous and something kind of fun to make a lumpsome payment and excited to see what you do with some of that cash back. Yes, absolutely so congrats Brittany.

If you have made it your goal to pay off debt in the new year, then please please please check out the Frugal Friends Club. We have a lot of fun in there. There's a lot of great resources on not just saving money. Actually very little on saving money. That's all in the free stuff, but we have resources on side hustling, investing, increasing your income, negotiating, so a lot of the peripheral stuff that's going to help in the long run. So Frugal Friends podcast dot com slash

club see what We've got coming up for you? See you next time. Frugal Friends is produced by Air Exeriality gen Jill. Is there any type of purchase or circumstance where you could see yourself reasonably going like taking on

debt for it? Yeah? Car? Yeah, yeah, when we the next car we get, we'll definitely take on a loan for not a huge loan um, but there are other places where we want to allocate the savings we have, and so we have really good credit sour rates would be really low, and depending on how low those rates are would be like how much we take out. But but yeah, we fully planned to. I fully planned to. Travis does not yet know that we fully planned to.

Travis plans to ride a unicycle round Travis. Travis thinks it's two thousand twelve, and so he keeps showing me like cars from two thousand three and two thousand six, and I'm like, this isn't bad, but it's not good. Yeah, so yeah, it's a twenty year old vehicle. At this point, I think I can still have that in my mind. Anything over two thousand's like born within the two thousand's feels like, yeah, that's newer. I remember it's almost And I realized that the prices of cars have gone up.

But I don't think he's he's maybe hasn't had a car payment in fifteen years. It's been like it's been like seven or eight for me, but it's been much

longer for him, and it's a hurdle. And yeah, and so I realized the price of cars have gone way up from the last time we purchased, and so and honestly, if didn't have renovations and other things where we wanted to put our money, then we would pay cash for sure, um, like we have done in the past, but we didn't have a bunch of things we were trying to pay for and not. You know, it's much better to take out a car loan than it is to put those things on a credit card or personal loan. So that's

kind of the deal. But I'm trying to avoid the car purchase as long as possible, So that's right, Matt, stay tuned.