Saving For Kids' College w/ Abby Chao from CollegeBacker | Is a 529 Plan Right for You?

be bothered to shower and I love it. You don't have to because you are not on video. I am a podcaster face for podcasting right now. But we are talking about saving for kids college. This is a super exciting topic, one of the lesser acknowledged baby steps. I don't even remember what baby step. It is six or something. Yeah, it's it's along the line. It's up there, right so people don't think about it. So we're talking about it today, like where is the best place to save? What are

your options? How much? When should you start? And we're talking about it with Abby Chow, who is the co founder and CEO of college Backer, which is a website that you can have people donate to your kids college fund instead of give you like plastic stuff for birthdays and stuff that makes noise in the middle of the night that wakes up your kids. I don't even have kids, and I know the real life of that struggle, Like I, why do they make noise when you just step on

them or or or look at them wrong? That's your Alexa. Why did I bring this thing into my home? I thought it was gonna make my life easier and entertain me. It entertains me when it goes off. So we are super excited to have her on the first we're getting in with our sponsors. Okay. Also brought to you by the poor house, cautioning you to be wise with your money because they know what it looks like on the

other side of frivolous spending and wasteful practices. Your parents always questioned, if this is where you really want to send them? You know what, with all your mindless electricity use and over consumption of food, close that refrigerator door. The poorhouses pleading with you today to practice portion control, Turn off that faucet, say for the things you want the poorhouse because they're running out of bedrooms. Oh my gosh, what do you think, is that what your parents say

to you? Well, don't like, we're gonna, you're gonna what do you want to do? Send us to the poorhouse? You never heard that. No, No, I think it's because we grew up in the poorhouse. Because I was in the poorhouse. Do you want to send me back upstairs the poorhouse? My parents gave up, Like we are here, we already reserved our rooms, just on our way to

the poorhouse. Gonna send you to the poorhouse? Leave that, leave that fridge door open, because we're It's always related to those those trickling things, you know, gonna send me to the poorhouse. This this kid eating all my food eighteen years old, and gonna send me the poorhouse. I don't know. People say it's one of those things. Listen, okay, okay, Well, if you don't want to send your child to the poorhouse, you'd rather send them to the fraternity or sorority house

or maybe not one of those college. Yeah, send him to an off campus apartment because those are very reasonably priced, and don't send yourself to the poor house because your kids are going to college. Oh that was a better That was a better Seguey, You made it, You did it. Either way, We'll get there. That is why we have

brought on Abbey Chow. She is the co founder and CEO of college Backer, which is a really affordable and very what is the worder, I'm so pregnant, you're not gonna be able to use this her month longer like eventually you won't be pregnant anymore than what? But yeah,

use words, Oh okay, rewind. She is the co founder and CEO of college Backer, to talk about how to save for kids college and so she's going to walk us through different ways how much we should be saving and then also what college Backer does, but also if it's right for you, and maybe it's not right for you right now, but it's such a great program that most people will be able to use it, and so I'm super stoked about that. I'm very excited to open account for kai. And we've got a special offer for

Frugal Friends listeners at the end, it's free money. So listen to the whole episode if you like free money. Let's get into the interview free money. Abby, thank you so much for being our guest on the Frugal Friends podcast. Were so stoked to have you Hey, thank you so much for having me on. I'm excited to be here. Welcome. Yeah, I am super interested in college savings because I'm about to have a child that well, hopefully one day like move out of my house and maybe maybe go to college.

Maybe that's the way I get them out. So I'm very in starting already. You want to get it out of your womb and then out of your home, going, yes, one after the other. I'm not wasting any time. So this is why we're having you on right now for my selfish reasons. Most of the episodes we have are for my benefit and our listeners already know that. I know that I really am interested in jumping the gun. But like for normal people, when should you start saving

for your kids college education? That's a great question, and I have two answers. One is a really specific answer and the other one is sort of the cheesy answer. Uh. The cheesy answer, of course, is that it's never too early and it's never too late. So even before your kid has been born, um, you can start saving for college. And even if your kid is, you know, seventeen years old or eighteen years old and about to go to college or in college it's not too late to start.

In fact, there are studies that show that even if the college fund is less than five hundred dollars, it can make a kid three times more likely to start college and four times more likely to finish. So same for college at any point is going to be really powerful for your kid. That being said, the really specific answer is that at college backer We found that at specific events like the baby shower, the birthday, the holidays,

those are great moments to start saving for college. So if you have the baby shower coming up, instead of toys or clothes, you can ask for college savings as a gift, or at least suggested to the folks who might be coming as a gift idea. And that's an amazing way to get started. We have folks who you know, just from a single birthday party are raising a few hundred dollars for their kids college. And add that up over eighteen years plus you know, growth in the market.

That can be a really meaningful amount of money. Wow. I did not expect that answer. So this is so exciting. Love having you on Abby, not just for what you can give to us, but what answer, what answer did you expect? I honestly expected more the side of start now, start early, and of course that's great advice, but it's really freeing to hear you say it's never too late.

Like I I know a lot of people. I have friends with kids who are in high school, and they're so disappointed that they did not set money aside for their kids, and they feel like it's too late, you know, and they're so pining for I wish I would have known these things when I was twenty. I wish I would have set it aside and almost just letting it go as if well I didn't, so now it's too late.

But to hear you say if your kids seventeen or eighteen, it's still not too late, or even if they're in college, I I've never thought about that because even if they did take out loans, And maybe you're going a different direction with this, but my mind is saying, even if they took out loans, they're not going to be paying that back until six months after they're out of college.

So yeah, you kind of do still have four more years to help them along the way, which might help them to even complete college and make that investment worthwhile. So yeah, I'm really excited to hear that answer from you. Thanks for sharing that, Abbey. In the psychological aspect of even having that five hundred dollars in there, like that, it makes a child more likely to start and finish, Like, that's a cool you know my my my parents believe in me. It's not all there, but they've set this

aside for me. So okay, maybe this could be an option. Yeah, maybe I'll just put five dollars in and then be done with it, call it a day. Yeah sounds good. That's amazing. Well, Abby, how much should someone plan to save and what are the options for where to save? It's like, okay, stash it away, but like it literally in the piggy bank that says, like Sam's college fund, or like where should they be putting it? How much

should they be planning to put away? Yeah? Yeah, So the the answer on this one is going to be different for every family and also depending on what your goals are as a family. And so for that, I would encourage folks to go to a place like college backer dot com, where we do have a calculator that

can help you set those goals for yourself. So it depends on you know what kind of education you might see for your child, uh and what percentage of college you might think you'd like to save for it, because there are other resources like scholarships and financially that will

intimately be part of that picture. But once you've decided on some amount to save for college, and frankly, I'll say that for most families, the amount that you'll save often depends more on where you are in terms of a family with your budget than perhaps what those projections might be. But once you've decided on the amount to save, it is a pretty important decision to decide where to put it, and most people make the mistake of just putting it in a checking your savings account. Say that's

a great start. You know, I would much rather having you putting the money there than not saving it at all. But that leaves a lot of opportunity on the table, because, of course, when you put money into that savings account, it's not growing very quickly, and the cost of college, unfortunately, is growing quite quickly. It's expected to double again in the next ten years, and so it's really important that you put your money in a place that it will grow.

And so we often recommend a five twenty nine plans. So this is a type of account that is specifically designed for education, and it's an investment account, so your money will grow over time and it grows tax free with tax free withdrawals as well, So that's a huge benefit for you as you're saving for college. To make

sure that growth is compounding on itself. There are other options out there, you know, agma utmas, which are type of trust educational savings accounts cover dells, um, But for various reasons, we generally don't recommend those because they can have other impacts on you know, financial aid. They might have restrictions around it on income or the types of things that you can spend it on, and so that, UM.

We often find that the five nine are actually the most flexible yet also providing the benefits of the growth

and minimizing financial aid impact as well. Yeah, I know that like the utmas and the augma's in particular, you don't have to use those for education purposes, but they do affect more so for the student, Like if you're going for a financial aid, like you could think, oh, I'm gonna put all this money in an ETMA, which EMMA is uniform gift or transferred to minors, and you could think you're doing this savvy thing, and then it comes time to fill out the fact set and your

student doesn't qualify for as many scholarships or as much financial aid because that brings up their net worth too high. Exactly. So for those types of trust, they actually automatically are converted into the student's control, often at age eighteen or one. And so what that means is it's considered a student asset because the student has control of the funds, whereas with a five twenty nine, you as the parent, actually get to maintain control. And so that means that there

is a much lower financial aid impact. And it also means that you can make sure that you know your student isn't using it for spring break or a brand new car, because Mom, I need a brand new car to get to school. Exactly. Thank you for choosing community college. Now, mama is going on vacation, yes, yes, so we do have a specific question from our Frugal Friends community group

on Facebook related to this. Generally says that she has nine thousand dollars saved in her six year olds five nine and a college savings calculator recently said that she'd have to start putting away over a thousand dollars a month for the next twelve years to afford in state tuition. Does that sound right? What are your thoughts on that? Of course, I can't speak to the specific school that she that she might be looking at, but I will say that even for in state tuition, we are seeing

projections for pretty significant increases in prices. Overall. That being said, again, families don't have to plan to save the entire tuition or the entire cost of college. There are other resources out there, of course, like scholarships and financially that can make up a portion. But particularly given our product at College Backer, we believe really strongly in the power of

gifts from friends and family. So oftentimes when you're thinking about saving for college, you think about it on your own, as if you're the only one who cares about your kid.

But that's just not true. Um. And so we've seen the power of rallying friends and family around college savings and around you know, a child's aspirations, and we find out that oftentimes grandma and grandpa really want to be part of the picture, and they want to be involved, and they can see how this is a really meaningful

way to be involved in the kid's life. That's also great if you're trying to practice some more minimalistic lifestyle, so at birthday parties, instead of just getting a lot of stuff, getting these gifts just sounds like a really, really great alternative. Totally, to be honest, half the time, I think the parents are just like, oh my god, thank god, I don't have to fill my closets more with all this stuff. Like that's half thank god. The

nine doesn't make noise or have sounds. It can be a great idea for people who want to give gifts, but it's the long term gift. It's the postponed gift of education. And I think generally's question also raises a good point that you can't or really shouldn't rely on the point one percent or even two point two percent we're seeing like with high yield savings accounts right now, because college is raising its tuition rates at way faster than the national inflation rate, which is three percent, so

that's even more than a high yield savings account. So I think that's one of the benefits of the fine is that you can't guarantee results in the market but typically they're higher than two point two percent, especially over eighteen years. Absolutely, so I think it's critical for folks to be thinking about investing their college savings. And the fact that with a five twenty nine you can do that tax free and the growth is completely tax free, just makes it all the more powerful and keeping up

with those college costs. So it's kind of similar to like a rath i ra for like education. It's almost exactly the same tax structure at least, so you're putting in post tax money and the growth is tax free. Sweet. So, like, what are the other benefits of using a five plan to save? So one big one that I alluded to is the flexibility of the five nine um. So there are some restrictions, of course, because it is designed on for education, but you can use it for a lot

of different forms of education. So you are probably all any thinking of undergraduate college, but you can also use it for graduate school. You can also use it for community college, many trade schools, even schools internationally, And the only rule there is that it has to be for a school that qualifies for federal financial student aid. So there's actually a very long list of different types of

education that your kid can pursue. It can be in state or out of state, so wherever their educational journey sort of takes them, you can support. And beyond that, it's also useful for a lot more than just tuition, So you can also spend five nine money on room and board, books, computers, other supplies. And so that means that even if your kid is brilliant and gets a full tuition scholarship, that five twenty nine savings might be

really useful for some of those other categories. Um. And lastly, in that scenario, if somebody does get a scholarship, then you can actually take the money out of the five without any penalties. So in that case, you really don't have to worry about over saving for your brilliant child. Um, it's still a great idea for you to be using

a five nine. Speaking to what you're talking about, a number of people in our Frugal Friends Facebook community group, they don't want to save in education specific accounts because they're not sure if their kids will go to college or as you mentioned, maybe they'll get scholarships. What does happen You've described a little bit of what happens if they get scholarships but if they don't go to college or any version of you know, secondary education, what happens

with a fine plan if it's not used. Yeah, so there are a few scenarios here. First of all, I would say that the five nine never expires or there are no time limits on it. So if your student, you know, wants to take a year or two between different types of education, that's totally fine. They there isn't an end date for the efficacy of a five nine.

But if you know, you do have a child who just decides that no college is not right for me, or any form of higher education is not right for me, and I'm not going to need it at all, you are allowed to transfer the five to another member of the family. So let's say that was you know, the first child. If the second child is in fact going to go to college, then you can transfer the funds to the second child. You could even transfer it to a cousin or even back to yourself if you want

to pursue further education. So that's a great option to to avoid any penalties or fees um. But if you do decide to say, go buy a car instead, um, then that is a non qualified withdrawal and then you would have to pay ten percent penalty and taxes on the gains of the account. Okay, so yeah, So just like a rapire a, anything you put into there is after tax and you can withdraw without penalty, but it's just the growth that you're paying penalty and tax on. Exactly. Cool.

I mean, I figure you can also transfer it back to yourself and then wait till your kid has a kid and you have a grand child, and then you could transfer it to them too, So that would be another option. Ye, And you would utilize the same account if you had multiple children, Is that correct, Like if you had four kids that you're saving for. No. So we actually recommend having a separate plan for each child,

and there are two reasons for that. One is to make sure that the investment profile fits for that child. So oftentimes when the child is very young, you want to be a little bit more aggressive with the investment portfolio to maximize growth, and then as your child gets older, you want to be more conservative with it so that you know the money will be there when you need

to pull it out to use it for education. The second reason has a little bit more idiosyncratic to us, is that we want to make sure that each child has their own accounts so that when the birthdays roll around and they're receiving gifts directly for that child, you know exactly where it's going and for whom it's for. That way, the first child doesn't decide they're going to an Ivy League school, and so now the last child

has to go to college. Because I am also a second child, I totally agree that is why we must have separate accounts. But you know what, if the older brother doesn't want to go, you can give me all the college savings. It's totally fine. Yeah, right, you can benefit from it, just don't steal from me exactly. So

one person can have multiple five nines then, is that correct? Yes, So as a parent, you can be the account owner of multiple five twenty nine, and in fact, the same child can also have multiple five twenty nine, where that child is the beneficiary. Cool. So if you have four kids and they all don't want to go to school, you can just take all their money, all four of them. Mommy's going on vacation, kids vacation to graduate school. Yes, of course, Hey that could be if you're doing in Hawaii,

why not? Yeah, just graduate just I mean retire instead of graduate and retire at university doesn't specify that it has to be in a place where it snows all the time and rains and it's cold. Anyhow, speaking of vacationing in fun place and all those sad things, because we know, because we're going to circle it back around to some good stuff, it's time for the bill of That's right, it's time for the best minute of your entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name

is Williams. Maybe you paid off your mortgage, maybe your car died and you're happy to not have to pay that bill anymore. Built Buffalo bills, Bill Clinton. This it's the bill of the week. Today's Bill of the week is brought to you by Zada because Zada helps you keep track of all the monetary bills so you never miss a one. And so today, Abby, we're going to invite you to share your bill of the week with us.

So what will it be? So, I've got a couple of bills for you, and they're not the bills that you'd be thinking of, because I, of course live in the five twenty nine world, and five nine came into existence through bills political bills. Yeah, keep going. So of course five initially were created through bills, um, but there's actually it's actually been updated over time through additional bills

as well. UM. Right now there's a bill out there that I'm quite excited about that could potentially expand five nine to being able to use nine on student loans. And so that is not past yet, so everyone stay tuned. But hopefully that gave you one more reason to actually pay attention to five twenty nine news, because I bet you weren't paying attention before. I mean we weren't. I was, and I think I can speak for all of us, speaks for the entire community, and you might not have

been paying attention to five twenty nine years before. I'll give you one more, which is in theeen tax bill, the five were actually expanded to K twelve tuition. And so that means if you are saving for your kids and you think that your kids might go to private school or Catholic school or something like that, you can also use a five twenty nine for that purpose. That's awesome. So that also would come in handy if you were like transferring to a grandchild, because then you can just

be like straight out up. You didn't use this, so send your kid to private school. Maybe. Yeah, that's awesome, that's great, Thanks so much, Abby. Those are two really great bills and educational. Who doesn't want some education? I love it? So staying on point. If you have a bill for us, whether it's a bill in Congress or maybe a bill who's hanging out in Congress. I don't know your friend Bill who's passing bills, Please wishes they were in Congress. Send it to us over at Frugal

Friends podcast dot com slash bill. Leave us a voicemail. We love being surprised by your unique bills all the time. You should see our faces were so shocked and surprise all the time. But we never screenshot them because I was saying before we started recording, I am very pregnant and very sweaty and wearing a hat. And this is why we podcast. This is why we don't take video

on a face for podcasting right now. But what we would charge you though, if you wanted to see video, because it's extra to see Jen sweaty and pregnant, send me, send me a quarter or a dollar. That's it such a high rate. All right, now, we're at the part of the show. That's Jills probably favorite part. The best thing to bill it the week. It always follows the bill of the week and it's the lightning levening round.

So Abby, we just have a few more questions. Were super interested in college Backer, but I would really actually like to know first how you became passionate about helping people, say for college, and like, how did you get into this? Yeah, So my personal story is actually that when I was a kid, I was just randomly a big personal finance geek, and so I absorbed a ton of information and for a long time just kind of filed it away in my head and thought, oh, well, you know, this is

an interesting topic for me. But then I went on to go and work in education, and when I was doing that work, I just saw how often kids weren't able to go to the school of their dream or even shoot for the schools of their dreams because of financial barriers. And so that's when I got really interested in trying to take down some of those barriers and make sure that you know, every kid is able to shoot for for what they want. So what is college Backer?

Can you tell us a little bit about that? What makes it unique? College Backer is the easiest way to save for college with help from family and friends. So basically, if you come to college backer dot Com will very easily and very simply put you into a five plan and give you a custom link like college backer dot com, slash abbey or your kid's name that you can share so that friends and family can give directly into the college fund for a birthday or holiday or any other

event like that. Yes, that's I'm obsessed with this idea honestly, but I know that it may not be right for everyone. So, like, who are the best candidates to open a five nine

like specifically through college Backer. Yeah, so we find that our best, our best fit is with people who want a really simple, common sense solution, especially for younger families you know that are early in the savings journey and who want to get the people around them involved, you know, want to share with aunts and uncles and grandparents and

so on. Of course, you can use college backer and single player mode too and just save on your own, but we really see the benefit through sharing that personal link and getting other people involved. Yeah, and I know for us in Florida, like we have, I mean, our

five nine is actually like a prepaid college plan. So it's like not the best, but I can still even though I live in Florida, I can still open a five nine in any other state, I can open it through college backer and like benefit from the best states five nine. For me, we don't have a state tax, so I don't have to worry about that. But Jill, you are in Pennsylvania and you guys do have a

state tax, right, thanks for rubbing an injury. But I think you're a Powerfornia, so we definitely have state taxes too. But I think your state and you can correct me if I'm wrong, wrong, Abby, But it does like it offers the state tax benefit for her in any five doesn't have to just be Pennsylvania's not. Every state does that. So definitely check to make sure if you're in a state that you can get state tax benefits from like other states five nine, because there are quite a few

that do that. And then also the few states that don't have state tax represent Yeah, so there are a couple of different scenarios. Basically, if there are scenarios like Florida where if there is no state tax, then of course you're free to choose whatever you like. Or in California where there is state income tax, but there's still no benefit for choosing my specific five twenty nine plan, so I can choose whichever. Or Jill's example where there is a state income tax benefit for investing in a

five twenty nine, but it can be any state. And then some other states like my home state of Illinois, where there is a state income tax benefit but only for the Illinois plan. And so there are a bunch of these rules that can often be confusing for many families. Um, but if you go through the college backer process, we'll just go ahead and point out to you if there is a particular state income tax deduction or benefit in your state, and then you can make the best decision

from there. So there was a state that offered an incentive for investing in their own five twenty nine, would you say, maybe like invest in that one, like kind of up to the minimum, and then you could still have like a college backer account for gifts from like friends and family and stuff exactly. So in those scenarios, it might make sense for you as the parent to be making contributions into that state plan so that you can get that tax deduction. But then for third parties.

So the gifts from family and friends usually the state income deduction it either may not apply to them or maybe they just don't care about it because it's on you know, a twenty dollar gift or something like that. And so the benefit of just getting those gifts of twenty five dollars here and there, all of a sudden you've raised a few hundred dollars is going to far outweigh the small tax deductions that you might be getting at the state level. Yeah, that's awesome. I love it

so abby. Where can people find more about college Backer and decide if it's right for them. We are really excited to actually offer a ten dollar match for all the Frugal Friends listeners. So if you go to college backer dot com slash frugal Friends and open a college fund for your kid and put in at least ten dollars, then we'll match with another ten dollar gifts from college Backer and be sort of the first people on your kids college paper team. Yeah, the first people to invest

in your child. That's so great. That's really standing behind what it is that you're all about. That's awesome, and I love the fees are super low. There's like no minimum. It's so great. Like sometimes you'll find to open a five twenty nine there's like a three thousand dollar minimum. So I love that about college Backer. And I'll also just say that you can even get started before the kid is born, so that's something that we released recently.

You can set everything up, claim your custom link for your future baby, share it at the baby shower, and then will help with the switch to the newborn beneficiary when that happens. Here that ky you have to go to college money. Mama's getting dream big. That's awesome, and then on vacation with the extra. Well, Abby, thank you so much for coming on the show and sharing all of this. I really hope that this inspires and like makes people feel safer to start saving for their kids college,

especially in five and looking more deeply into that. And yeah, and also sharing it at birthday parties and baby showers, like get that clutter out of your house. Just take the money, take the money. Seriously, this is a frugal win on so many level. College backer dot com slash frugal friends. Sign up for accounts for your children and get that ten dollar match because that's a free ten dollars that will grow over time. Thank you so much for hosting me today. Guys. That was great. Thanks Abby,

that was amazing. I learned so much. I don't have kids, I don't plan to have kids, but I still learn a lot. And I might start a five nine just for someone else's kid because it seems fun and ten dollars I might make like I could be someone else's can put ten dollars in it, I'll give it to Yeah, sounds great, we'll take it. We'll take your money for other other cool things that will take is a book club? Yes, right, we're still doing this thing. We still We're fun, we're cool,

we're hip. We do lots of stuff and one of them is a book club. So it's May. Welcome to May. We're in the middle of May. Welcome to the middle of May. Who's ever welcomed you to the middle of May? Don't you feel so welcomed into May? And we're reading this month The Soul of Money by Lynn Twist for this book club. Yes, and if you want a free copy, we are actually giving away one for every five reviews we received this month. So to enter that drawing, leave

us a review on iTunes or Stitcher. Screenshot the review and send it to Frugal Friends Podcasts at gmail dot com. And so we'll select one winner for every five reviews at the end of the month. And if you want to know an example of a helpful review, this one comes from Brooke Craven. It is five stars. It's not necessary, but it's help help It's helpful for me to know that it's five stars. And so she says or he says,

awesome podcast. Jen and Jill, hosts of the Frugal Friends podcast, Thanks for clarifying that highlights all aspects of money investing and more. In this can't miss podcast, the host an expert guests offer insightful advice and information that is helpful to anyone that listens. Brooke, thank you for single handedly claiming us a can't miss podcast. It sounds like that sounds like movie critics like, and this can't miss it sounds so legit. It sounds more legit than I'm making

it sound. But thank you. That was a helpful review. It is one that would potentially lead you to winning a free book. So do that, do that and keep doing that. But you've got a screenshot your review and email it to us. Yeah, that's how you enter to win as screenshotting it and emailing it to us. This was a really great episode. I know, maybe not relevant for every single listener, but if you've got nieces, nephews, close friends, kids, this is a really great way to

show your care. It's very unique gift, and like I've been saying this whole episode, is way better than plastic stuff and things that make noises and sounds for birthdays and baby showers. It will be the gift that keeps on giving when you invest in their education and then they get educated, and then they turn around and get a good job, and then they pay for your vacations and dinner and they keep you out of the poorhouse.

Bringing it full circle, Jen, you say you're pregnant, and I do believe you, but sometimes you are so on point with these things. I know I have my moments. Um, thank you for listening to this episode. We hope you loved it. We'll be back next week. I might have a baby, but you won't know that because we prerecorded the episode. You'll you'll know it if you're a friend on our Frugal Friends Facebook group, which you should be join.

That thing is a private group, so you do have to like get inducted in and it's a great induction with g I f pictures flying and you you'll feel so welcomed and you can ask us all the questions and you can post all the answers and do it and then you'll know when Jen has her baby. Yes, so join our Frugal Friends community on Facebook. We'll see you later. SHEA. Frugal Friends is produced, edited and mixed by Eric Sirian. I'm staring like I'm face to face

with like a bunch of infant pajamas. It doesn't make me so excited, like someday I'm gonna wrap little guy in this. There's gonna be a real person filling that thing, and then you're gonna bite him. Nope. But I did see a five week old the other day and I was like, it's too small. Can't, can't do it. You're not going to think that when it's coming out chill by. I don't want to berthe one of those I mean taking care of it. Too tiny, I can't. It is

a little overwhelming how fragile they are. But then they get chunky and you just want to get all the pressure of the cuteness just goes to your jaw and it just you can't sounds to handle it. It sounds painful, or like I pull in my my lips and I bite the insides of my lips. Actually, every time I go to see my sister, she has four children, so I have all of those nieces and nephews. And I

realized that I do this. I pull in my lips and I bite them because I have the I have cute aggression and I don't know what else to do with it. And I'm just like and so I literally it's a real thing. And and so I wear away some of the skin on the inside of my mouth, and I'm what's happening to me every time I come to Ohio, what's this? What's this thing? And I realize it's because I'm biting, Like all all of my desire to like bite their chubby little legs goes right to

my lips. Mind you, I will never actually bite them or harm them. They're just so cute. I don't know what to do with it. Eric is shaking his head at me because he's insert of himself into this conversation. Guys, I just think, oh, this shoke shute. Oh, I can't even I'll wait until your baby's three months and then I'll come out there and I'll like grab his little legs. Okay, listen, there are people who understand this. Do you not get that?

Do you not experience it? You don't want to like just stink your teeth in to your own self because they're so cute. No, I'm gonna, I'm gonna. I'm gonna stop recording now. The people who get it really get it, and the people who don't think that the rest of us are crazy. But it's a real thing, and don't put me in prison. Okay, bye, oh yeah, yeah,