Why You Should Never Outsource Your Vision with Roy Coughlan

in just a few short hours per day . And now your hosts , serial entrepreneurs David Shomer and Ken Wilson .

A seasoned entrepreneur , podcasting coach and prolific podcast host , roy has an impressive track record , having founded 20 companies across five countries .

His entrepreneurial ventures span various industries , reflecting his adaptability and innovative spirit In the realm of podcasting , roy has established six podcasts , four of which have reached the top 0.5% globally , including the Speaking Podcast , the Awakening Podcast , the Meditation Podcast and the Learn Polish Podcast .

His fifth podcast , the Crypto Podcast , has achieved a top 1% ranking , and his latest endeavor , the Podfather , is rapidly gaining recognition as a dedicated podcasting coach . Roy has guided numerous clients in launching their own successful podcasts , helping them break into the top 10% of shows worldwide .

He also assists individuals in securing guest appearances on top-rated podcasts to promote their businesses or books . In addition to podcasting pursuits , roy is the co-founder of VA World , a company providing virtual assistant services to businesses to maximize productivity and profitability .

In today's conversation , we'll delve into Roy's entrepreneurial journey , his insights on building and scaling businesses and the transformative power of podcasting , and practical advice for those looking to fire the man and embark on their own entrepreneurial paths . Stay tuned for engaging and informative discussion with Roy Calling Roy . Welcome to the show .

Around 18 , I was buying and selling motorbikes , kind of realized , hey , you paint up a motorbike , you can sell it for a few hundred bucks extra . So it was always . Then I studied construction , economics and management and when I finished college I couldn't get a job .

So then I had to go into another course which was construction site supervision , taught myself AutoCAD , because the course was like one of these government things that you're doing foxers for the people in there and not getting paid . But the people that were the instructors were getting paid . It was like the usual corruption in a government organisation .

So there was a computer . I asked them get me an AutoCAD book . I think it was AutoCAD 12 or 11 at the time . Read it from page one to the end . And then they had kind of where you get work experience and worked with the council doing road design . But the money was brutal .

It was like 100 quid a week , you know Irish pounds at the time so you know you couldn't live on that and I started working for a mechanical contracting company and started off as doing

CAD and then just worked my way up to project manager , contracts manager , and I was with them for like eight and a half years , then with another company for about three and a half years as a regional manager , and I kind of moved to Poland and have never worked for anybody else since , just kind of doing my own thing for the last 18 years .

Now , one thing I find really interesting talking to entrepreneurs is oftentimes they do have something that started in childhood A lot of lawn mowing businesses , lemonade stands and I'm always curious to ask did you have a role model or somebody that you were looking to that got you interested in entrepreneurship , or was it something you felt like you're kind of born

with ?

You know , most of the time he was there , which had an advantage that I could go to the cinema as often as I want , but on the side he was doing photography and he was doing that since he was 20 and he was very good at it .

So he'd do weddings and my mom would put the album together so that I saw weddings and my mom would put the album together so that I saw that from you know , a young age . But there was no deals . My brother wasn't really entrepreneurial . He's worked for somebody , he's still working for somebody and you know . So you know different .

There's just the two of us .

Can you walk us through that ?

what I negotiated was 5% of above profit . I mean they knew me would demand 50% , but I thought I was doing well at that . So you know I was happy getting above the expected profits 5% .

But it worked out well because at one stage I was able to buy a car with a bonus just outright and the boss that I was dealing with for about 6 years left and I saw him being treated bad at one stage , like this is a very big company and I used to fly up to Dublin and meet the like the board would be there and at one stage it was the owner and

the director I was dealing with and he was having a conversation . I remember he put his hand up like that one as if to shut up . I remember thinking don't ever do that to me . And I could see they weren't treating him well yet he was really dedicated to his job , so he got kicked out .

The next guys in line were saying oh , we'll look after you , we'll treat you better . And when it came to commission and bonuses , they were like oh no , that was an easy say 15% that we're to make . We changed that to 20 .

In other words , they started taking the money off the table and I've heard of so many people that that's happened , which is strange when you're making them so much money Like I was one of the top performers for making profit and they're basically getting greedy and it happens to a lot of people . So I think some people can resonate with this .

Then I went with the other company and that's something similar kind of happened there .

They were kind of like you know , nitpicking with bonuses , and what happened is I met a Polish girl and went to visit her folks in Łódź so that's the city I ended up living in and I saw an opportunity because I had three properties at that stage in Ireland and I said , oh , property is extremely cheap there .

It's like 500 euro per meter squared or something . It's like really rich .

So I started buying from then I okay , there's a , there's an opportunity here that I can start getting the foreign investors for for the property because they was at a time it was around 2004 and I started going to bni meetings , so I was still working for the company , but I cut down to three days a week and so I come out one week of the month and

eventually the relationship ended and I kind of would have lost everything because I released equity and moved , but it was like it felt good .

I mean , you were asking me I know I kind of gave you a long answer , but it's the main thing is it's like you're never free and when you're controlling yourself , and the best thing that's ever happened to me and it's years later I'm very close with my family . You know I'm like a mommy's boy . I ring my mom every day .

We're very close and even with my grandmother I used to call up every day when I was at home . But even when I moved to one I used to ring her every Sunday and she lived to like a few weeks short to 96 , but when she was dying , she got cancer . I was able to go back .

I was able to spend over a month with her and stay by the bed if I was working for somebody you're not able to do that and it's like you're in control of your own life and there's nobody actually going . Oh , you have to be here , or you know , like , say , a school run or something like that .

I mean I've got equal custody of my child and I bring him to school and then the next day I'm collecting him for school . That's the way we work , on and off . I'm one of the rare people that actually get on very well with his mother and but I block out time . I'm with him , I'm present him , I'm present and I do think .

But I know that if I was working for a corporation I wouldn't be able to do that . They wouldn't accept that . Okay , one minute , you're coming in at , say , 10 o'clock and you can work later the next day . Most of them don't want that . I think that's the most important thing is you have total freedom with your life .

I love getting those emails because I know what gift they're about to receive , and it's the feeling of freedom , it's the feeling to spend time with your kids when you want and to prioritize things that are really important to you , and so that's an outstanding , outstanding story . I'm glad you shared it .

So , as I was prepping for this interview and doing my research , one of the things that stood out to me was you've built 20 companies across multiple countries and multiple industries , and I would imagine that you've learned some key lessons about scaling businesses efficiently .

And so what are some of those lessons and how do you apply those to your current ventures ?

stage the accountants in Ireland which were auditors as well they gave me a bill and said , oh , you have this tax liability . And I went away and I bought a book called Tax Magic .

It was written by a guy from the revenue and I went through it , like my AutoCAD book , from page one to the very end , and I got my little stickers and my highlighter and I said , can I do this ? I've learned , even in Poland . I've learned that most of the accountants are just processing the numbers for you .

They don't care if you save an extra thousand a month or 10 grand or whatever . You have to look after the figures . I learned that from an early age . Don't just outsource it and think he's got it , because a lot of people they just put it into a shoebox and the shoebox you look after my account . Don't do that like watch everything you know .

Look at the VAT , if you're VAT applicable and , just like you know , do the VAT revamp , watch every single thing , because it's your money and , like I hear so many people going oh , it's tax deductible and that's why I'm buying it , because it's tax deductible .

No , it's like I tried to buy , like I was able to put my son through the company because I got the back and it became an because I don't know . I just checked with the gun . Can I do this ? So , like when you do things like that , it's brilliant . Or if you can do trips and stuff like that , it's great because you're getting money .

Or if you're buying stuff like a laptop and phone which you won't use anyway and you can , even with your house , you can put a percentage away and sometimes people don't realize you can do the same with the bills and everything . And it's just learning these different things and talk to other entrepreneurs hey , what can I do ?

And you can even go a step further and just be putting the company .

Like what I would say for someone starting I think it's Delaware and the States , but , like for me , it's like look at what country is the best for you , because most of the time people set up a business , we cross their fingers and then if it takes off , then it's too late to be , and then they're trying to change it and move it Straight away .

Look at what's the best tax optimization that you can do and once you do that , then if it's working out , you're not paying a fortune and capital gains or corporation tax and stuff like that . You're keeping as much money in your pocket as you can . So that's one of the things I would say . The next one will be a count in the solicitors .

I've had over a hundred court cases . So I mentioned about all my properties . I got caught with the crash . It took a bit later . I was doing well , but everybody else fell down and I was trying to juggle the balls thinking I'd be OK and they'd come right , but it didn't . So I ended up losing the whole lot . So true that I had over 100 court cases .

And what I've learned as well is a lot of they're only billable hours . They don't really , they don't have your back , they don't really care .

I mean , there's the exception , there's a few , but what you do is you're paying attention , You're going there , you're putting all your paperwork together , you're preparing for every case that you've got , because when you're not I mean especially if you get into construction . It's just part of the game .

You're going to be in court , unfortunately , so don't let it faze you . You know , because the first few times you just panic and it's a horrible feeling and you don't know the zone that you're going into .

But what you do is start learning about it , maybe read a few books on it , talk to a few people , but when you're in there , don't just sit back and let him do all the talking , or do all the talking . Make notes .

Each time I've won and I've had some big cases each time I've won were when I passed a piece of paper and said they've just said this , they were wrong and we'd catch them out on a lie . And it flipped it because there was times where I thought this is going south and by paying attention and a lot of the times people don't do that .

So I encourage any entrepreneur don't ever outsource your legal side as well . It's your business . You're the one that's going to suffer , so pay full attention to what's going on .

There are certain topics , in particular , legal and tax , that are not the most exciting to read . I've read textbooks before Not exciting , important . They're important and you're doing the hard work to make sure that you come out on top and position yourself right , so I love that .

Now to switch topics a little bit , one of the things that I think both you and I have in common is a love of podcasts just the media form and I'd love to hear tell me about your love story with podcasts . When did you first hear one ? How did you know that this was something that you really wanted to go deep on ?

I need to expose because I saw so many people turning the total marriage breakups and everything because of kind of the corruption that happened , and I went . At the same event there was really good speakers and I hated public speaking . I mean , that's another thing now that I think is kind of important for the entrepreneur I was when I was younger .

I wouldn't go into the shop , even though I could go into a house and ask them do you want your , do you want the paper , do you want your grass cut ? That was never a problem . So it's kind of selective shyness , I suppose . And like even at 18 , going to the bar , I would give my friend the money when it was my round instead of just going on .

It was just kind of , and when I was running these big jobs in Ireland , the one part I hate it was public speaking . So at this event I said I need to become a good speaker . So I came back , joined Toastmasters , joined another Toastmasters .

Then I formed my own club and entrepreneur Toastmasters , became a coach , entered every competition , got into the final of five countries , done it . I'm a coach . Entered every competition , got into the final of five countries , done it . Done it up in my TEDx , done open comedy and went to an event where they were .

There was a guy teaching how to be a podcaster and I was like , oh , I like this . This is good for me to get my message out . But I said I think I'd be attacked with my awakening one . Let's start off with the speaking , because I've got so many people that I've met through the speaking stage and that was the first one . That was 28 , seven years ago .

The speaking podcast and kind of from there , just kind of yeah , just meditation next and , as the ones you've mentioned , at the very start , just kind of kept going and that's six now .

And they're because I mean you have a different style to everybody else . I like your style , the way that you do it , and I like the name of the show . It's unique and what will happen is you're picking up something from each one .

So you can do that way , go on a few different shows and then have a conversation , because it's just that , hey , what kind of mic are you using , what software , what platform are you on , and people will tell you no problem , and then you go okay and they'll tell you the pros and cons .

So you can , if you're doing it yourself , what I said to some people like some they'll do it kind of for branding and they'll get out , but there's others they might think I'm sure who'd be listening to my show , and what I say is you can have a specific kind of niche that your business is and interview the people that are your best potential clients and

instead of a cold call where you're trying to actually get in contact with them , can say hey , I've got this podcast I'd love to interview . And then you've got a very warmly and you can have your like , I've got my form . My form is saying hey , are you interested in doing a podcast tour ? Do you want a virtual assistance ? Do you want this ?

Do you want that ? So many people say yes , I'm never selling , I never have to do paid marketing . People are coming in and they're actually doing it , so you can do that as well and that way it doesn't matter how many is listening , because you could actually have got a client that could be 100K to you .

With a podcast , you leave it kind of feeling like you just had a cup of coffee with somebody and you talked for an hour and you're friends , and after a sales call , it's very transactional and it's using that using a podcast as a sales strategy to interview people that could be great clients I think is outstanding and , honestly , something that I've never thought

about and so , okay , okay , that's awesome . So let's talk about monetizing podcasts and content creation . It's probably one of the biggest questions that I get is do you make money with your podcast ? And so I'm interested for people that do have shows . What would be some of the first steps that they would need to take to start monetizing ?

They're still going and it's lovely to see but so many people

. They come in , they expect , they look at the big boys and they expect big checks to start rolling in . They do three shows , they're gone . They do 10 shows , that's it and they're thrown in the towel , which is a shame to see . So there's affiliates . Affiliates can work very well .

I mean , I've had a few affiliates that paid monthly checks come in and you can be very lucky . But the thing as well is and I'm going to kind of show both sides there's sometimes people . It's great when you've got a unique code that people can use and then it's tracked and you know the check comes in .

So there's some that I've done that and it works very good . You know straight away . There's been but there's been others that I'm fairly positive . They got sales and I was like I got nothing and I was like what's going on ? And they reach out and they're oh , I mischecked that . And then they go yeah , we're team is looking at it , and then they just go .

So it's just so you have to be careful as well . And the other thing is like I mean , sometimes you can have a guest on and if your audience is after building , just have it just for that . So talking to the person , and it's very interesting and you know where to market it .

You can have just the affiliate just for that and you can actually do very well because some , some affiliates can pay like 500 bucks , a couple of pennies . You know it depends on what they're doing . So it's not just small little 10 buck care and 50 quid error . So you can actually do very well . The other thing is sponsorship .

You can , you know , like when you've got numbers on your website page , people can come in and they can start sponsoring your show . So there's a lot of different ways to do it . You kind of have to see what your niche is , how you're going to make some money , but I honestly think the best way is your own business .

If you're a coach or whatever you're doing , your own business is the best way and make sure you're actually letting people , because what happens is people get to like you . They go I like your style and I've just left my job because of you , and then you're offering a service and they kind of feel like I can trust this guy and that's the way it works .

So I think that's the best way of making money . There's so many different ways of doing it , but I think that's the best way is to make a few good .

And so at what point , or at what number of downloads , or what number of listeners or YouTube subscribers , or whatever that may be , should somebody start looking at monetization , at reaching out to those sponsors to get that initial sponsorship ?

Yeah , if you want to advertise on them numbers , you'll be paying probably half a million , but they're not giving you that , they're giving you time . I worked out it seems like it's like 0.05 . You know it's really small . There's an increase but there's likes to rumble . And there's also ones like , say , spotify and different ones .

When you're in America , a lot of them they work . So it works per click . So you can get kind of 10 to 40 bucks for inserts . So inserting at the start , mid and at the end and you can make money like that as well . So that's that adds up to give you some some funding . But it's kind of .

I think it's more about understanding what would be good for a company Like . I just released one on my Podfather one and the guy from LinkedIn was helping , you know , discussing the different things , and he said , oh , for the Polish one . The Polish airline is ideal for them and I was like I like great . So that's the plan .

I'm going to actually start to reach out to them and go , hey , we can do an episode of Happy as the Link , so I'll be doing that . So when you realise , okay , we've got a niche , like for you , you know there's different niches that you can go and go , all right .

So there's people that actually help the transition of that as well , from going from an employee to self-employed and just see who it works with , and they mightn't really look at the numbers .

They could say , all right , look at every person that signs up , you're getting X amount , and just kind of think , and sometimes we get complacent with with the business or the back , just can't see step backs , can't . Like I keep learning . I'll do a different course , I'll get that one .

Not so long ago on monetization , I probably know all of this there was just one thing in it of about 15 , but it's just keep track the whole time and look at the different things and like rumble and you know you can make money for putting it up . So , like you have your interview and most people , they think of YouTube , they don't think of the Rumble .

Rumble pays as well and that could cover your Zoom costs or your Palindly costs or something like that and get them things covered first . And also you can ask for a donation . I mean the Polish one . The Polish one , I mean I ask for donations . Sometimes you get a hundred bucks coming in from somebody , but the best one is Blind Boy .

He's an Irish podcaster . He does audio only and when he's on stage he actually does tours . He wears a plastic bag over his head because he said he wants to go to the shop with nobody knowing who he is and every episode he says you can a donation . It's a model based on soundness so you don't have to pay .

The people that can afford to pay cover the people that don't . It's always going to be free for everyone and he does that and he's got something like 5 . Last time I looked a few years ago he had like 5,000 monthly people paying to his thing . But you have to keep asking . I found that I don't do that .

I Kind of just kind of doing my own thing now and I have to VA and everything . But I found that when you ask if you're consistent with it , people kind of accept . And it's not to be ashamed , because I mean , you know the amount of work that goes into it . It's not a case you just wing it , have a conversation .

That's it Like you're preparing before the conversation , you're having the interview and then you're doing the editing and then the marketing is a lot from it . You say , hey , if you could buy me a coffee or something like that once a month , if you met me , would you buy me a coffee or a beer or something like that ?

And people , they think nothing is sending five bucks . But if every single listener sent you five bucks , you'd be like , okay , this is good absolutely , absolutely .

You do need to get creative and you have a lot of great tips in there for getting that ball rolling .

I said , look , it's a six-month wait , but you can pay me if you want to jump the queue and if you want shorts , because , like I do shorts with the virtual assistants , if you want shorts you pay this amount . And there's a lot of people who take that up , because

when you get to a certain level , there's people like there's some platforms and it's kind of it's okay , you can check all their details , but there's others . There's people reaching out to you , there's agents reaching out to you . I get hundreds of pitches and there's a high percentage won't .

But you just send them the hey because of this and tell them what you're doing , don't just say , hey , it's whatever the cost you want . Even if you start off at 30 bucks or 50 bucks , you can say , look , because of this , I just want to help towards my cost because of the marketing , because of this , and most people will say , yeah , fair enough enough .

Because you see some people , one , one guy , so he's charging 10 bucks . I've seen some for 50 . There's others charged like , like john dumas , the entrepreneurs on fire , he's charging three and a half grand for people to come in . And there's others like because I help people go on and we look at this and it's like , is it worth it ?

Because some are like seven grand , ten grand , so you can get really high level . And if you're reinvesting , you know like mr beast would be a perfect example of reinvesting in the business you're reinvesting . You know , like Mr Beast would be a perfect example of reinvesting in the business . He keeps reinvesting and it keeps feeding him .

So if you're making money , you don't just say , oh , I'm going to go ahead and go on a lot to holders and everything . If you put it into the market and your numbers will go up , which in turn allows you to increase your price .

So one of the things that you had mentioned when you were talking about business owners using podcasting as a media form for advertising was going on a podcast tour , and this is something that I you know .

Certainly , getting on shows like , if you ask enough people , they're going to some people are going to say yes , and , and so I think the opportunity to get on shows is it's somewhat easy , Right , and however , once you're on those shows , and getting the maximum return on investment is something that I think a lot of business owners should be thinking about is is

you know at the end of the podcast , it would be helpful for the listeners to know who you are , what you're , why you're credible and and what your services that you're selling , and and so for people , what advice would you give for people that are going on a podcast tour to maximize their return on invested time ?

He's to fill out the form and what I tell them , even when I say please don't fill out the form , let the guests that I say that is one that you asked me to come on the show to fill out the form , and the reason being is they're going doing a podcast tour and they get somebody that fills out the exact same thing , cut and paste , cut and paste , cut

and paste . So they end up getting similar interviews , just with different podcasters , and if you're creating shorts , you don't have much new content , whereas when I've got my form , sometimes they'll say something and I pick up on that and I just go on a tangent and I get a brilliant interview .

Or I'll ask them what's your best video that I should be watching ? You know , if they have a book , I ask them to send me the book I used to buy the book , that . And if they have a book , I ask them to send me the book . I used to buy the book . That's another little tip for you .

I was like what am I buying a book when they're coming on my show ? I said I don't like digital . You send me the book , because I read a hundred books a year . I was like give me the book , and so that helps as well .

One topic I wanted to definitely touch on is virtual assistants , and you've mentioned them a couple of times today , and you also are the co-founder of VA World , which is helping businesses connect with virtual assistants , and so , for people that don't have a virtual assistant , what would be some of the first steps that they would need to take to get one , and

why do entrepreneurs need them ?

I set up a recruitment because there was a lot of Polish coming across , so I had a recruitment license and I was positioning a lot of people in the construction world . So I kind of realized , hey , this is a nice business model .

When I was doing the podcasting I eventually kind of said , well , I need a bit of help here and I go to Fiverr , fiverrcom and you get somebody trying to explain things , or they'd start off the first month . And then there was Upwork and Upwork seemed better because , like you were getting screenshots .

I was like , okay , this is good , I can see what they're doing . And then I was looking and I was like it just looks like they're on Facebook on , say , the bullish one . It's like most of the screenshots look the same . I think they're on another computer and they're just making it look . Every time I do that myself .

I was saying , okay , I'm doing it better . So I then said , okay , let's do this in a way , and it's usually like packages .

So a lot of times people think , when they're getting a virtual assistant , that you need to pay somebody X amount per hour and a full time , and isn't that , like you can get somebody , like for you know , a couple of hours a week , and what you should do is do the stuff that sucks the time out of you and you don't like ?

So , for example , I've done the shorts , I'm posting the shorts and they do very well because , like , you set up the expectation Like don't just assume somebody's getting into your head when you're planning it . And we do like packages from , like , say , 99 bucks or say , 300 bucks .

We're doing a lot of stuff for that , because that way you know exactly what you're getting , instead of being spending hours tracking and watching are they doing what they're supposed to ?

Because you know we've already agreed , this is what we're doing and you know , okay , grand , and so that way I kind of I set it up in a way that I feel I would like it . And the other thing is passwords . So we've got the office and my partner has the passwords for all the different things , but the team don't .

They're just working on the computers that are doing it , because we've never been compromised and I know that a lot of people they want to look after because some you can have editor access and things like that and others you need a bit more to do it properly .

But it's like we're just making sure that your information is safe and someone's not going to start deleting stuff , because that can happen . You can fall out with somebody that's working on Fiverr or any of these different places , and they can . Just because they've got the hump and you fell out , they just delete stuff . So you don't want that .

So you just make sure that your stuff is protected and that's the way we do it . And usually it's actually clients that work with me . I can help them to make their life easier . That's okay . How can we do it ? So even I don't even upload the stuff and send it to them . I . I put on my video , I edit every all my . I've done over 1500 .

I edit myself . And the reason I do it myself is because I understand the conversation and I know what's a good point for a short and stuff like that . So I'm listening and , plus , I enjoy listening again as well , because when you're having the conversation you're fully present .

But then when you listen like I listen now , when this goes out as well , like anytime I'm a guest I listen and I go it's different , it's a different experience . And I make the notes , notes , I put the timestamps and as I upload it , then they just use , click , grab , take it and it's just .

They just post all the different shots and I tell them exactly , and then I just do weekly calls , exactly , okay , check this , this , this and this and same for the different clients .

So what I would say is start doing the things that you you hate , because if is start doing the things that you hate , because if you can outsource stuff that doesn't cost you that much but you can spend your time , whether you're coaching or whatever your business is , and make more money , and look at it like that , and you know , you don't have , like most

people say , I can't afford to have somebody to hire to bring in . Well , that's why your VA is brilliant for you , because you can do it with a small amount of money and if it starts benefiting and increasing your numbers , you go OK , now I can get the next level , which in turn brings in more customers .

You get more clients , you're making way more money and it's a win-win situation for everybody . So it's kind of the way we've done it no-transcript . So , like you know , there's clients that come in and they're actually recommending , and we even do a commission as well for the people that come in .

If you recommend somebody , we give you a bonus and stuff like that , because if you're telling people we're not making nothing , but we know how long they last for , and by doing that then it's kind of keeps the wheels oiled .

One of the things that I think I know I've run into when managing VAs is the expectation that they know what I want , and I think that just the communication piece is so critical , and so for people that are getting , say , their first VA , what would you say is the most effective way to communicate what you want and to ensure a good finished product on whatever

that task may be ?

So , for example , if someone's doing the editing of it , you show them how to do it the first time because you have a system , you have a way of doing things .

Everybody has their own way of doing things , even if they're specializing in editing , and you can just say , look , this is the way I do it , this is the way I want this , and then you know if you're getting it exactly as you want . And the best thing is , like we found , like I'm even contactable . So sometimes there is things that can go wrong .

I mean , that's normal , but the trick is to have open communication and , like we have like managers overseeing it as well . So even for the post , you don't want to post with a typo or something . So we're watching everything . Yeah , this stuff can slip through the cracks and you know if they're going . Hey , I thought I was expecting this .

So we're contactable by phone and WhatsApp and sending messages and yeah , if there's anything , we address it immediately . It's not a case of , you know , you're waiting a week or a month and then you have a monthly conversation . It's like , no , if there's something that is coming up , you do .

But what I would say for those thinking of hiring a virtual assistant just spend the time to actually what you really want them to do , instead of just winging it and just kind of go , yeah , just do this , do that , you really take the time , and then you can kind of add to it . Go , can you do this as well ? Can you schedule , can you organize ?

You know my holidays and they can do anything you want . Bookkeeping , the whole lot , everything is doable . Website , the whole changes , adding courses to it , content to content creation no problem at all . But just take the time to plan how you're going to do it and then you have the conversation .

You will find out exactly what you need and then it's created and you just make sure that you're happy and if there's any issues , just communicate it and we make sure that it's addressed immediately . Okay .

And what I found is I said I have to read it again , I have to read it again . I was finding I didn't have time . I got the audio and it was just as good because I was able to listen to it . But then I got

my youngest child is 11 . My youngest child is 11 . And I said you need to listen to this and he actually enjoyed it . So get the whole family involved , because when you're an entrepreneur , don't think you're on your own . If you've got children , hey , can you do a bit of marketing for me ? Get help . And I think that book it should be on everyone's list .

I love it , I love it . What are your hobbies ? I'm always doing something like I like to go to the gym now but say I bought my son . We used to go playing pool , so we bought a pool table . So , playing pool , we like to play pool . I like going to the I mean the cinema because of my dad .

There's like a 4D kind of cinema here where the chairs shake , there's water , another kind of . We make sure we try to do that once , once a week , and I suppose , traveling as well . So for anybody that's an entrepreneur , what happens is you tend to be working and putting off . Reward yourself , make sure that you go .

Okay , I'm putting X 10% away towards my holiday fund . So me and my son , we love theme parks and we just we tried to go on a holiday with that as a theme park and go to theme parks . So you're having the holiday and the teen park .

I'm constantly reading books , I'm constantly looking at things , have your circle of friends , so it's all the mindset .