Grief is messy and I'm no maid. This is every widow thing. Hi, everybody. Welcome back to every widow thing. I'm here with the usuals Kira, Holly and Whitney. I'm Lacey. And today we have a special guest, Shelly Orashiba. Welcome and thank you for having me. We received a message on Instagram a while back from one of our listeners. They wish that we would address having a partner because this particular person didn't.
They didn't get married. They were planning on getting married, but they hadn't gotten married because there were some other things that had to take place first. So we have Shelly here today because unfortunately she has something in common with us. She lost her partner back in 2018. When I met Shelly, I was talking to the girls and we were like, yes, we should absolutely have her on the show if she'd be willing to do it. So we really appreciate you being on our show today.
Yeah. Thank you. Yes, thank you for having me and I just hope I can provide you know some some value to people in my situation. I think you will A little brief background that I know just from talking to you. Andrew sounded amazing. He was a father first and foremost to two kids. Your partner, he was a contributor to Outside magazine, which is a really cool magazine. He's an amazing athlete.
He was a cyclist and he was a book author and sounded like a really cool, deep guy from just from what I could understand and what people had said about him. So I think starting out, we could talk about maybe a fun story about how you guys met and then talk a little bit about your life together with your kids. Yeah, so it is a fun story how we met. We met on the World Wide Web.
OkCupid and I had joined. Wow, we haven't talked about that, I. Had joined OkCupid because my oldest son said this is where you get the better quality of individuals and so I said OK I'll do it. And I had no, really no luck in dating online. It's it was it had been awful. We can relate, yes. We can. I responded to Andrew and we went back and forth, you know, multiple times a day for quite a long time. On the app on the. On the app. On the app, yeah.
And at one point he comes back and he says you're you're not going to believe this. I know your son, Jordan. How? So you know, first he's Googling me. I now know. Which is kind of creepy, right? Right. But we all do it. We all do it right?
I raise guilty of that. And so he typed in my name, which is spelled with an IE, and he typed in triathlete and I came up and so he saw the last name, which is very uncommon, It's Orochiba. And he said, I know your son, you're not going to believe it, but he's actually my cycling coach and I said isn't that. Crazy. Oh, wow. That's. Crazy. Oh my God. And he went on to say. Her son, the 20 something is
this guy's that's. That's crazy that that makes me think there's a lot of talking when you're with your coach or an instructor about life and stuff. So I would think he found out a lot about your family, like he knew stuff about. About you. Family. That wasn't on OkCupid. This is true. You know, I hadn't actually thought about that, but Andrew said, you know what, if we meet and nothing happens, he never has to know.
But Jordan was right downstairs and so I ran downstairs and I asked him and firstly, is this going to compromise your coaching client relationship, right? And then secondly, should your mom go? What do you think about him? Yeah, yeah. And he said this is the funniest thing. He said Andrew never does his workouts like he's supposed to. That was a little. Tip. But I but I think he's a nice guy and you should go out on a
date with him. So. And it took several months before you actually went out with him, didn't it? Yes. Oh wow, were you just? Busy or were you just not sure? It it took a while. And no, I wasn't sure. I wasn't wasn't sure. It had been years since I dated so. But also his divorce was finalizing and I was pretty particular about like not seeing him until things were completed and that makes sense.
And so yeah, I went on my first date with him on May 1st of 2014 and he had gone to to court to sign finalize the papers earlier that day. So he wanted to celebrate what? A way to remember it I. Didn't waste my time. Exactly first. I have to.
I have to back up. I have to backtrack because I had been at this place called the Driveway and that's a place where they raced bikes, my son raced bikes and and so I was, I just had low expectations and I was sweaty and I wasn't wearing makeup and I wasn't wearing anything nice. Isn't that awesome? Yeah, I was like he's he's he's going to like me or not. And I love that he came in and he's all dressed up and, you know, wearing a nice collared shirt. And I I felt like sort of a
jerk. You guys start dating in 2014 and how long were you together? When did it get serious it? It didn't take very long. I think by about the third date we we actually went to Kerrville and we had planned some ride routes and it just it was in the summer it happened to be particularly hot and on the second day we had planned 100 mile bike ride. And one would do and. I always doing all my. So many dates like that. Hey, almost everyone, Well. I did a mirror at.
Least 100 miles. So anyway, you know, I'd mapped it out. I'd spend some time figuring out where all the little towns were so we could get water. Those weren't towns there. There was no water. There's no towns, it's. Just, yeah. There was one place that there was a post office box and we've been out of water for a long. Time. And so, but there's somebody washing their postal vehicle with the hose in the back of the post office. I go immediately to fill my water bottles and drink out of
the hose. And I went to hand it to Andrew and he said I I can't drink out of that. And I was like, what do you mean you can't drink out of it? But he wasn't having anything to do with it. I think he's had Giardia before. So it was a yeah, that's. Pretty. Bad. But anyway, it was air conditioned, so we lay down on the post office floor. Oh my gosh. And someone came in and and she, I I thought she was an Angel because she said are you guys OK? And Andrew was never a quiet person.
So he blurted out, we need water. And and this woman came back from her car with those huge smart water bottles. You know, usually when you face that sort of adversity, that's when people get angry. They lose their patience. And and he never did. He never did. I just remember that night and my gosh, we were so tired. But I I just looked at him and I was like, I have two choices. I can not go down this road or I'm going to go all the way down this road.
There was, you know, there was no in between. So, so I knew pretty early on you were. Really into him, Right? That's. Really. Cool. And that day kind of solidified your feelings at that moment. Absolutely Nice. So. How did the like in the dating aspect of it? I know you Co mingled families, like how did that come about? I think because parenting is so important to both of us, that we really wanted to spend time with the families together.
I think the first trip we took was that summer we went took the kids down to Padre Island in Mexico and it was it was fantastic. They got a law grade. They're close to the same ages. What were the everyone's ages, the children at that time? And so Isaac was 14. He might have been 1314. Layla was 11 or 12. Those are Andrew's kids. And then Ethan, my youngest son, was just a few months younger than Layla, so they were all
pretty close in age. And they all got along really well and it was kind of an immediate thing. Or was it it just take a while? It just no it. It was easy. It was easy and. So talk to us about you. You've met this great guy. The kids are seem to be working, gelling, doing well together. But you made an interesting decision. So we we knew that the intention was was to live together and
combine the families. But we knew that that's a big, that's a big move and you don't want to be wrong about doing something like that when you're involving the children, right. And so I think early that fall we decided to go start doing some counseling just to work through potential conflicts. And we thought by the time we came around the first of the year, we felt pretty confident about about doing that and so and so they moved in. They all moved into my home in January. Of 2015.
OK, wow. Amazing. That is, That's what it. Had been about six months ish since you met. Well, yeah, it was a little, it was a little more than that. But yeah, I I call it a year because that's how long we've been talking. Well, I met married in eight months. So, hey, you know, you know you. Actually decided not to get married, is that right? Or it had just not come. It hadn't. It wasn't. No, we talked about it. We we talked about it.
I don't think at that point we were talking about it, but I think, you know, it was definitely our intention. But by the time we were really ready to do something like that, the kids were in the midst that they're going to prom, they're graduating, they're getting their driver's licenses. And it just, you know, it wasn't our time to have the spotlight it. Wasn't theirs, Yeah.
So as we all do, we think we have plenty of time to make those choices down the line and we'll just wait and and then what happened? I guess what we want to know is we haven't told everybody what happened to Andrew, so you can talk about how many years in before that fateful day. Yeah, well, well, you know, we lived together and and there were conflicts and but we had really similar parenting styles and that's one of the things we we went through in counseling.
But we did that for a few years and we we did vacations together. You know, Andrew sold his BMW and got a minivan which is still. Driving commitment. Yeah, that is. So so. In your mind, you're really already man and wife. You're already married. It was just a legal matter that had to be taken care of, so. And we took care and. You had a legal. We took care of things. Yeah. We got an attorney and we did our, we did our wills. Well, you know, we did, you know, all the final documents
that everyone should have. But, you know, we really thought we had things secured. The kids were on my health insurance. Andrew was on my health insurance. And so yeah, we felt like we had, you know, sort of checked off all the boxes. But Andrew went for went for a bike ride. And this is what day? It's February 17th of 2018. So you're four years together at this point? Andrew went on a bike ride which he liked to do. He had this team called VOP, which people joke was very old
people riding their bike. He. Was fifty, Yeah. OK. Yeah, he He was so young, 52. Yeah, it gets younger every year to me, too. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, it was just a normal day. It was just a normal morning. That did you go with them? No. And I went with them sometimes, but they were just too fast for me. I was tired. I didn't feel like getting dropped. And you get dropped and then
you're riding your bike alone. And they do this really hard route where they go over the damn loop and it's just huge, huge hills, right? But anyway, there was a, there was a substantial group, and I didn't think anything of it. Like I started getting pictures out because we were going to hang, we had purchase frames and we were going to hang some more pictures. Well, give me a minute. That's so. Bad. This is the hard. This is hard.
Well, one thing that our listeners ought to know is that Shelly talks about like this was a tough cycling event, but you're a triathlete like you're you're as athletic as he. Yeah, we were nuts together. Yeah. So I think people ought to know that that was not unusual for you to go with him on those bike rides, but this particular day you had decided to stay back. Yes, yes.
And I got a call from one of his team mates and he said there's been an accident that he said prepare yourself because it's really bad. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. So he was changing a flat tire well off the road on 6/20, which is apparently a place we learned later where there are a lot of accidents and there have been some deaths. But, you know, people would ride by him and his teammates and they'd ask if he needed help. And he said no, no, I'll just meet you up at the water stop,
which wasn't too far ahead. And I just think about had he not done that and there would have, there would have been multiple tragedies. Yeah. And so it was just a really freak accident. There was a truck coming South that crossed over the double line. And it's a pretty high rate of speed out there, you know, because because we like to drive fast here in Texas, but people drive faster than the speed limit on that road because it's very hilly.
So a woman crossed over the center line, hit another truck head on, and then her truck proceeded to spin and tip where and there was changing his thought right off the side of the road. So nobody, none of his mates were with him. They were all ahead and. Some of them were behind. So that some people. Saw the ACT like his little blinky light and his little tail light, and then it wasn't there anymore. Like there was a father and son riding a tandem that saw it.
So he was taken to the hospital. He said, you know, they triaged him. He wasn't conscious. And so I rushed to the hospital. I happened to be relatively close because I was going into town to plan a brick for a good friend's memorial. Ironically, I called his ex-wife first because the kids were with him. And I I said, I don't know, just just let me figure out, you know, what's going on and I'll call you back. And so. But she didn't wait for me to call her back. She headed out too.
And I got into the emergency room and it was pretty empty. But there was a charge nurse there or the person that was doing the admitting. And I told her who I was there for and that it was bad and and she just wouldn't look me in the eyes. And I just knew. Yeah. And so, but the charge nurse did come back and take me into a little room. And he said that they moved him to get some imaging done. And his heart had stopped and they'd been doing CPR.
And I remember we sat for like, it was 5 minutes, 10 minutes, 20 minutes, thirty minutes. And I just said stop it. So he was hit at the base of his head. So that's where your basic functioning occurs. Yeah. And so, you know, everyone's calling everyone and pretty soon, like the the waiting room was chaos with all the kids from Saint Stephen's and their parents. And I think they actually tried to shove us off to a side room somewhere.
But it was just, it was, it was awful, you know, people were screaming and crying and I mean, there was nothing I could do. I'm so sorry. There's nothing you can do. And that's not. We are so grateful that you're willing to talk about it because it is very traumatic and especially we don't know you. But if you're not the type of person that really talks about it very often anyway, it's even more difficult. That's the hardest part, is not having anybody. It's for me, it was.
I don't know about for you that you don't have anybody who can relate to what you've been through. Well. It's very isolating. Yes, grief in itself is isolating. And I think in your circumstance you are this woman who's in love. You have a partner that you live with. You've filled out all the forms and, you know, have everything taken care of. But the term widow is reserved for a wife, so it brings into
play like what is a widow? Because in my mind you are very much a widow and to not and and I don't know. For me the title means something to me, like I tell everybody that I'm going. To listen. That's what we like. Yeah, I mean, she. Said the gar waiter, the. Oh. Yeah. Yeah, that's a title. For a while. Thankful. When you're going through something like this, it kind of explains to people in one word, right? So that you. Don't have a box like I wondered
that. Like when we go to the doctor in your case. This is why when that person wrote into Instagram, it made a lot of sense to have someone who could speak to that. Like you could tell us now after the fact, then what happens, like when you are not married and your partner but and you had a will. But like what happens then? Well, I mean it's it started basically from the very beginning.
I was. Thinking that you might say you showed up at the hospital and they wouldn't speak to you, which I think might also be a circumstance. Unless there's a durable power of attorney you have. Power of attorney when you get the paperwork, Yes. So I wouldn't. Why wouldn't that be you? If yeah, I had the durable power of attorney and so, So in a lot of instances I had the responsibility of of a a legal spouse, a legal widow. All the paperwork. Yeah. And cost? And cost. Oh, wow.
Yeah, but. None of the compassion. Well, did you? I I imagine you had compassion with his cycling crew because those were your people, weren't they? Yeah, like they all, you know, I was getting messages and phone calls and everything the next day and I was, I was, I was a mess. But you know, people were crying and I just said open up the house. So that's what we did. I don't remember much of it. And there was a big memorial, I understand too. Did you do the planning for
that? Yeah. So we had there were several services and there was contention about that too, right? And that's contention between you and whom? Mainly Andrew's sister about what was wanted. You know, there was an argument about whether or not he'd be cremated. And I was like, well, Andrew wanted to be cremated. We talked about this and she was adamant that he wouldn't be cremated. And so all of these little riffs start start to take place by.
And you're in the middle of your grief, deep, deep grief, shock. And now you're having to have these conversations. You're not united or they don't defer to you. Is that? Yeah, correct. Yeah, I think it was one of the kids in that argument about being cremated or not being cremated that stood up and said dad wanted to be cremated and so that was the end of that. But you know, just people, people having to pull the kids to take sides and it things that should have never happened.
You seem to try to check all the boxes. Is there anything that looking back now you're like I we should have done this or this or besides getting married? You know, make sure your paperwork is in order. What would that be? So it depends on the state that you're in. Texas recognizes common law and so. Ten years or or. Is there a year that you? No, as long as you declare yourself publicly or show yourself as married.
And there was a big contention about that and retrospect, I should have gotten an attorney, but I didn't. Well, you're in. I mean, we talked about it all the time. Just all means that you have to all of a sudden take care of when you are dealing with the worst possible thing that you have ever dealt with. And it was sudden. So it's not like you had time, you know, over a long illness to talk to him about how things
would play out. No, I mean, just a few days later, we were in San Francisco at his synagogue memorial. And then there was A and then there was another synagogue service here. And then a few months later, the memorial that you talked about, which was huge, we had to wait a few months because Isaac was in Patagonia hiking at the time. Yeah. How did this, this contention between other family members or or whoever it ended up being?
Maybe his parents, his family? Did the paperwork that you filled out, did that ultimately end any arguments that? Were No. Being handled. So what should have been in place for things to have been more palatable towards someone who was not yet married? If you declare yourself as common law, and you could do this in other states to make sure you have a document that says that you know a notarized document that says that I didn't
have that. And a will wouldn't be enough and your power of attorney wouldn't be enough, right? That's crazy. Doesn't common law just say that you're cohabitating? That you share the same residents that. That you that you refer to each other as married, like you consider yourselves married. OK, which is sort of vague, right? I mean, well, it's. Crazy because you've done you're living together, you're on each other's insurance, you've got power of attorney, you've got wills.
You would think all of that would be. You would think, I mean, really, they could prove that if you're not only living together, but because they were on your insurance, that was the spam. Yeah, everything. Is were on your insurance so. For many months after after he passed Steven so. What was not in place like in for their family to realize that you're not so? Like one of the things that went on with the will was that was that there were underlying contracts that weren't taken
care of in the background. And so say for instance, I take out a life insurance policy and I put somebody else's name on it. Is is a beneficiary. It doesn't matter if you give that to us and the will that supersedes it. Yeah, the beneficiary I see, like those things weren't changed. Those things match. The will. Exactly. Exactly. So his life insurance went to his children. Or did some of it go to the ex-wife? Most of it went to his child support.
Most of it went to his sister. There's some sort of rule that if you're divorced and they're listed as a beneficiary that they will, they will wipe that clean just because you're divorced. But then if there's a secondary, that's where it goes. OK. So in the will you were supposed to get the life insurance, but then these other documents? The assets, the assets would have been in the estate, yes. OK, interesting. So. Here you are.
Were you responsible for the cost of the funeral and yet you weren't getting any money that would help offset those costs? Because funerals are expensive. The memorial was was expensive. I got reimbursed by some of it, by his executor, so and then the estate got sued for things like extra child support and other things that I'm not super Privy to, so I'd I'd hesitate to talk too much about them. But yes, there were. There were several lawsuits threatened, attorneys involved.
But you didn't have an attorney for yourself. I didn't. Well, that costs money too, to have one represent you, our and I. Wouldn't have. I would have, but it was important to me, especially since apparently the sister never liked me, which I didn't know. I wish I would have known that ahead of time. You know, we visit her, we just visited her. And over Thanksgiving, you know well. Who told you that she didn't like you? Or is it just the way you were treated after the fact that?
She told me feel. That way. Oh wow, that's horrible. Yeah, yeah. So you don't have a relationship with her, I assume now? No. So where? Where? Does his family live? Are they? In the Bay Area. Oh, OK. But the kids you have a relationship with? And that's why I didn't hire an attorney because there was all this contention and it would be, it would have been important to Andrew for me maintain a relationship with the children. Yes, sure.
Yeah. Well, that speaks volumes too about your the true relationship that was going on in that household, that they, even after their father's death, still have a relationship with you. Yeah. Yeah, so did they go back with their mom full time? They never they never I, I yeah, I had to clean out the rooms, pack their boxes for. So it's more than, I mean the loss of your partner, but this whole family and life just like ours was completely. Yeah.
Torn apart. And like your kids and his kids were by then like siblings sounded. Like the the two boys were super close. They used to go riding bikes, they used to go mountain biking together, so. And one of them's really big into music. Your son is really big into music. And what did? Wasn't that some sort of bonding between the kids, too? Yeah, they were. They were all musical. Yeah, absolutely. They never saw each other again. So the kids, we've seen them. OK, we've.
Seen them? They just didn't. They never came back to the house. They never came back to the house. But. You didn't have much tension with his ex-wife, though. Not at the time, no. Not at the time. So it was more the sister that kind of came into play right after, yeah. But things sour. I was trying to call the shop with the X afterwards so so that that made it hard.
So everyone's kind of spiraling in their own grief and not really thinking about what Andrew would have wanted, and you are the only person that is trying to maintain that. I felt like that, you know, especially early on, you know, but when we did the memorial, Madeline, his ex and I, we worked together to do the planning. You know, we we didn't have any contention. It wasn't until later on. So I don't know if the the sister I think got to got to his house.
That was 2000. 17/18/2018. And now how? How are you doing or how is what is your life look like and how is Andrew still a part of it? Well, I I finally got rid of his bikes. I finally donated those. But I just did that last month. Yeah. You know, I had a hard time touching anything in the house. Yeah. There's no. Timeline for any of that? And you know, people say, well that's not healthy and I was like, this is what I need. What do they know? What do they know?
Do it, I've found. Because, yeah, I mean, there's things I still haven't been able to, but like, I would do it like in little bits and pieces. You know, you break it down and you do what you can and you fall apart. You donate the bikes, you fall apart for a few days and then you don't do anything for a while like you've done that piece and then you move on and then when you're ready, you'll do another little piece. And if you kept his bikes forever? Who cares?
That's fine if it brings you comfort. Well it wasn't it's important to me. You know I I'm like OK you know how is he just going to go to
the best use right. Like how can I make something make lemonade out of lemons let's and so and so I think I got really stuck on that and and I was having a hard time like what's the perfect place and sure you know I. Have to say something that I saw the other day because we just became friends recently and then we just friended each other on Facebook and literally like 2 down because I'm like, oh, I'd love to know more about her because we just met.
I love the little bags of treats that you created. You'll have to tell them that story. I just thought, this speaks to your heart, and I love that because it's not been easy for you. But you found some way to channel goodness even though things have been really hard for you. So tell him about that. Try, you know, because. Because that's really sort of incompatible with grief. But I really tried to do that and tried to have gratitude.
And so it was Thanksgiving and the kids weren't coming home and I was just sad. I was just sad and so and I had a little, like, meltdown over, like all of Andrew's, like socks. He had just had gazillions of them and man and all his stuff sometimes. Yeah, because because I've got to clean it all out, but which isn't, which isn't really right either. But I decided to to make some bags for the homeless.
I had some Mandarin oranges that I was never going to eat the whole 5 LB bag of. Nobody ever used the whole 5000. Exactly. We had the leftover Halloween candy and then I was like, if it's going to get cold, I was putting socks in these bags. Yeah, and they were cute and they were individually little inspirational. With little nice notes on. Them and I like, what a beautiful way to take something so hard and do something for someone else. That's really it has to help a
little bit. It does help. It really does help a lot. We did this when the kids were the kids were younger and I remember, you know, my youngest was just learning how to spell, but he he, he wrote on the outside of the bag. This is the inspirational thing. We will pray PROEI. I hope not. Oh dear, that's so cute. I'm a big believer in our people are still close to us and trying to help us navigate and support us and sending us signs or or feelings.
Do you have any moments like that where you feel Andrew is near you? You know, I was really upset because a lot for a long time afterward, like, I would go right on the trail. Like, look at like, where are you, Andrew? Sometimes, sometimes talking out loud to myself, where are you? But I think I was just too much in a in a state of loss to even recognize it.
But yeah, I I certainly do. And I feel closest to him when we're outside, when we're hiking or you know, doing some of the things that we love to do together. So I gave his sister a third of his ashes, his ex-wife a third of his ashes. I kept a third of his ashes and and I made these little jars. It's got a little picture on him. It looks like a little party favor, but I I take, they take the little jar with me. And so when we go someplace that we love, that's.
A great idea, yeah. That we love to go or someplace he would have been. Right. Yeah. Is that with your kids? Like, how are your kids? What was their journey like? Because it wasn't like their dad, right. But they kind of, yeah, Adopted him as your son. Said it was something the musician's son. I wish I could remember what it was, but he said that's how I want to keep living because apparently Andrew was like a super positive, never met a stranger type and that was a
little daunting for you. Social for me? Because you're a little more introverted. I definitely am. Do you remember what? Quote I'm talking about. I'm going to have to look that up. That's bugging me now, but I thought, wow, that's the name of the podcast right there because it was so beautiful and I think he wrote some songs during that time frame, didn't he? Yeah, yeah, He's a music composition major, so he'll graduate this year.
But you know, especially Ethan, because he stayed, he lived at home, and I used to have a job where I traveled several nights a week for work, and so he'd spend the evenings with Andrew alone. Even when the kids weren't there, they were really close. It's just hard for you about them, what they're missing as well as you, right?
And not acknowledged, right. I was barely keeping myself together, you know, I was a mess and I had to go back to work, you know, his counselor at school had to call. And this was weeks afterwards. And and she said, I think, I think Ethan's grievy. He hadn't stopped to recognize, you know how much he lost. Right. Because you know, and he's. Also like watching, he's going through so much pain and that has had to be so hard.
Oh, I'm sure. Yeah, I I will tell you when we went to the the memorial at the synagogue, because you have to have it really quickly afterwards, by the Jewish tradition, I was, I was a mess and my my son came and, you know, got all the tickets and took care of the EB Airbnb. My older son took care of everything because I just wasn't capable, you know, I've. I was still carrying all the cards he he gave me around, so yeah.
What you just said is so true. The acknowledgement part, you're you didn't have I said compassion earlier, but that was wrong. It's this acknowledgement of your loss, the acknowledgement of your children's loss. And I would think in a perfect world that you would be receiving that from his family because they knew who you were to him. And they were too busy fighting about who I was. And the thing about it is, is all it really matters is who you were to his thoughts, not
theirs. Absolutely. Well, you're definitely not alone, because the person who wrote in, and all of us read it that she apparently it was not easy after the death of her partner as well. How? How has your healing been? Because in a way, I feel like part of my healing came from getting that acknowledgement. So how are you finding healing? So I guess I was able to sort of separate the people who said I wasn't from the people who who did acknowledge it.
I still check the widow box. If there's a widow box I'm checking, yeah. Yeah. Check it. And you have you still are friends with all of the cycling buddies, I assume? Yes, just a matter of fact, Andrew had done a big gravel ride in Idaho with one of his best friends from middle school and the year after I went and did the bike ride. That's. Very cool. But it's really hard too because that community is screaming as well and so, so every time you show up you're a reminder of
that. And these are people that don't have to be in my position on a day-to-day basis, right? I think it may be hard to be around because because everyone has, you know, felt so much loss. Right. No, I do feel that the even with us, like the people who even my husband's parents, they weren't living with him every day. They weren't sitting in that house after he died. Not that they weren't thinking about their loss, they were, but it was a little bit.
They got a little reprieve. Not being in that world. Every single. Day in the middle of. It exactly in the same house, and the same bed, and the same cars, and the same and and and the same. Socks. Yeah, the same socks. You don't get, you don't get time off from that, right? Right. You don't. Well, I just am so grateful that you came in today. This is something that people don't consider. This is going to help other people who haven't experienced
that tragedy. But if, heaven forbid, they do, they'll be better prepared. I hope that's a take away that that you know have yourself stuff in order because and and check it and double check it and. Enjoy your life together and have all those fun adventures. Absolutely. I think I'm going to go on 100 mile bike ride. I think, I think I'll. Watch you I'll cheer you on the. I've been fire. Thanks again, Shelly. Really. Really. Thank. You so much for having me. I really appreciate you.